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NFT: More Lois Lerner emails found

Joe in Knoxville : 2/27/2015 10:24 am


Of which this is one of them is there any doubt that this lady needs to go to federal pen to live out the rest of her days.

Not trying to be political in this thread but a corrupt IRS is a problem for everybody depending on who is in office at the time. I hope this proves that a move to a fair tax and repeal of the 16th amendment is hopefully in our futures.
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Life in prison  
schabadoo : 2/27/2015 10:46 am : link
That'll do it, send a message.

What that message is, I have no idea.
Umm. What exactly does that prove?  
x meadowlander : 2/27/2015 10:47 am : link
It's an acknowledgement of a peculiarity, not a smoking gun.

FWIW, I've had 3 external hard drives die on me over the last 4 years, plus one laptop PC and a Creative Zen music player. After the first one I learned and started backing EVERYTHING up, and started working primarily off shared drives at work, which are also backed up.

Crap breaks. ALL THE TIME.

IRS thing got blown way out of proportion, has been thoroughly debunked. As has Benghazi. As has Fast and Furious. A waste of time. Why don't you guys focus on the real scandals? NSA???
NSA is no scandal  
GiantNatty : 2/27/2015 10:56 am : link
You want me to believe that Google and Yahoo can scan my emails FOR CONTENT TO ADVERTISE TO ME, but the federal government can't TO PROTECT ME?

Please.
I can believe the hard drives crashed, it's possible  
buford : 2/27/2015 11:01 am : link
although not likely. But that there was no taped back up? Ridiculous. Everyone and anyone who got up there and lied about it should be prosecuted.
If  
Big Al : 2/27/2015 11:02 am : link
You don't want to see anything, just close your eyes and you see nothing. Just yell the phony talking point of "phony scandals" to cut off discussion.

In any case, this thread should be deleted because it will do no good for anyone here and it is ultra political.

...  
26.2 : 2/27/2015 11:09 am : link
this thing is a personal nightmare for me. My gf is a lawyer in EO for the IRS and has had meetings with DOJ, congress and will be deposed next month all about this crap. she's not in trouble or anything, but it stresses her out.
x  
old man : 2/27/2015 11:24 am : link
YOU ARE SPECIAL.
This scandal  
averagejoe : 2/27/2015 11:25 am : link
has already been flushed down the memory hole. The peasants are not supposed to question the state. Big Brother should be allowed to target whatever groups they like.
x and his kind are hilarious  
LG in NYC : 2/27/2015 11:36 am : link
Anything that reflects bad on "their guys" is Fox News/RW propaganda and not worthy of our attention... but let's spend 2 weeks parsing the words of some republican politician to see if we can make a scandal for MSNBC.

RE: LG and his kind are hilarious  
Cam in MO : 2/27/2015 11:42 am : link
In comment 12155409 LG in NYC said:
Quote:
Anything that reflects bad on "their guys" is MSNBC/LW propaganda and not worthy of our attention... but let's spend 2 weeks parsing the words of some democrat politician to see if we can make a scandal for Fox.



Works both ways.


No comment on this particular scandal, though. I'm much too concerned with the color of a dress I saw on Facebook.




RE: Umm. What exactly does that prove?  
njm : 2/27/2015 11:56 am : link
In comment 12155325 x meadowlander said:
Quote:

IRS thing got blown way out of proportion, has been thoroughly debunked.


If this was nothing and thoroughly debunked ("not a smidgen of corruption") then why did Lois Lerner have to plant the question at that conference to let the cat out of the bag just before the IG did?

Have you ever seen the movie "The Hunt for Red October"? Remember the line, ironically uttered by Fred Thompson, regarding the speculation of what Rameus was going top do with the Red October? "Son, a Russian doesn't take a dump without a plan." Well when Jay Carney stood up in the West Wing and said that this was nothing but the work of some low level of employees, half a million tax accountants and 100,000 tax attorneys looked up from their desks and said "Son, a low level IRS employee doesn't take a dump without a supervisor's approval."

What should have taken place in the investigations would have started with the low level employees in Cincinnati who should have been granted immunity and been compelled to testify. Work up the chain from there to wherever it stopped. But God's gift to Democrats, Darryl Issa, decided he wanted to begin with the Oval Office and work his way down. The result is obfuscation, delay, and coverup and a disorganized investigation.
Billery or whoever runs is going to face an unprecedented number  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:14 pm : link
of questions and issues.

They would be better off with a real outsider, actually, I will suggest we should hope that both parties should run true outside the beltway types.

Its going to be ugly.
There is such a multitude of scandals  
Mr. Nickels : 2/27/2015 12:14 pm : link
during this administration that something as huge as this stays relatively incognito.
for now,  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:19 pm : link
obviously, any inside the beltway democrat will have to take heat for this and a broad number of issues that will re-surface with a vengeance during the election.

ditto inside the beltway republicans, unless they had an outsider voting record.

and I dont mean the stupid keystone pipeline bullshit, that is just drunk house speaker lack of strategy....putting that on top of the agenda.

not against it really...but...it is not what one would focus on right now.
RE: Umm. What exactly does that prove?  
santacruzom : 2/27/2015 12:23 pm : link
In comment 12155325 x meadowlander said:
Quote:
It's an acknowledgement of a peculiarity, not a smoking gun.

FWIW, I've had 3 external hard drives die on me over the last 4 years, plus one laptop PC and a Creative Zen music player. After the first one I learned and started backing EVERYTHING up, and started working primarily off shared drives at work, which are also backed up.

Crap breaks. ALL THE TIME.

IRS thing got blown way out of proportion, has been thoroughly debunked. As has Benghazi. As has Fast and Furious. A waste of time. Why don't you guys focus on the real scandals? NSA???


Yeah, as someone who's worked in IT and did his share of desktop support and server administration, I agree that this isn't necessarily a smoking gun.

God, I used to hate it when users would have, say, their hard drive crash 3 days after I replaced their monitor and actually draw some flimsy, uneducated correlation between the two.
If I wanted to prove something against the author of that email,  
schnitzie : 2/27/2015 12:23 pm : link
that would not be the email to do it, as it's ambiguous.

The author could be anticipating that something unlikely and coincidental is going to trigger a clusterfuck of questions and accusations, or the author could be making an admission.

It is by no means a smoking gun or conclusive proof of anything *because* it is ambiguous and open to interpretation.

The Blue-Dress-White-Dress analogy is spot on.


but why would they even be talking about it????  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:25 pm : link
??? its not an exec level issue if it was just tech.
Let's face it  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:29 pm : link
either party...or any ideology should be totally free of ANY IRS oversight.

If it was al-queda or nazis, the FBI and Homeland Security comes into play, as well they should.

anything short of that level is sacrosanct. for either perceived 'side'

My question was always  
weeg in the bronx : 2/27/2015 12:30 pm : link
All emails stored on local harddrives only?
My question on her emails is, email usually is a 2-party or more  
Bill L : 2/27/2015 12:32 pm : link
affair. Even if hers were lost innocently (I doubt it, but suppose it's true), wouldn't the other people have send/receive copies?
This is completely unrelated, but  
Bill L : 2/27/2015 12:34 pm : link
Governor dickwad here just put in a new policy where all of our emails (sent and received) are automatically wiped after 90 days. So much for FOIA. It's a big pain in the ass for all of us and no rationale other than his usual whimsy was given. For me, it sucks because I'm losing so much correspondence, data, protocols, addresses, etc. Just a clusterfuck here.
Weeg, no...  
Beer Man : 2/27/2015 12:35 pm : link
I believe the emails would live on the mail server and sync up to the laptop.
obviously the law itself should be simplified  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:36 pm : link
and any and all parties in office are to blame that it is not so.

The right to organize to put forward a political view is a very high order right.

This is a very basic, simple, American tenant.

'what they fought for'
RE: If I wanted to prove something against the author of that email,  
njm : 2/27/2015 12:39 pm : link
In comment 12155503 schnitzie said:
Quote:
that would not be the email to do it, as it's ambiguous.

The author could be anticipating that something unlikely and coincidental is going to trigger a clusterfuck of questions and accusations, or the author could be making an admission.

It is by no means a smoking gun or conclusive proof of anything *because* it is ambiguous and open to interpretation.

The Blue-Dress-White-Dress analogy is spot on.



While certainly not dispositive, I think you have to view this in the context of the author planting a question at the conference in what appears to be an attempt at damage control in front of an IG report. I'll reiterate my comment above that this investigation should have started at the bottom and worked it's way up 2-3 years ago. I'm not sure that's possible at this point.
nothing to see here  
bbfanva : 2/27/2015 12:40 pm : link
you racist, anti-government, anti-woman, teabagging homophobes.

signed,
The same people that just took over your healthcare and the internet..


.  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:44 pm : link
RE: This is completely unrelated, but  
Cam in MO : 2/27/2015 12:45 pm : link
In comment 12155540 Bill L said:
Quote:
Governor dickwad here just put in a new policy where all of our emails (sent and received) are automatically wiped after 90 days. So much for FOIA. It's a big pain in the ass for all of us and no rationale other than his usual whimsy was given. For me, it sucks because I'm losing so much correspondence, data, protocols, addresses, etc. Just a clusterfuck here.


I don't think that's particularly unique.

90 days has been our corporate policy for at least 15 years.


Really?  
Bill L : 2/27/2015 12:47 pm : link
People are fairly upset here.
obviously corporate transparency level norms have nothing  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:49 pm : link
to do with public agency transparency norms.

for very obvious reasons
Certain types of business have to keep  
buford : 2/27/2015 12:50 pm : link
emails for years. We keep ours for 7 (backed up, not on our personal computers) because we are in finance.
What does a hard drive crashing have to do with anything?  
ZogZerg : 2/27/2015 12:50 pm : link
Government e-mail is typically on a network. And e-mail is typically stored on a server and backed up to other servers. Hard drive crashing should have no impact on whether an e-mail message is "lost".

.  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 12:52 pm : link
corporations = privately owned or shareholder owned and nobody has to buy the product or service.

the state = owned by all the people, and the people have little to no choice in what it does through law, they / we must obey.

law = having totally different standards for each is a very basic concept at the heart of our nation and its highest laws
RE: My question was always  
fireitup77 : 2/27/2015 12:56 pm : link
In comment 12155528 weeg in the bronx said:
Quote:
All emails stored on local harddrives only?


No. The emails would also be on the email server. That is unless they also deleted her user mailbox on the server. And even if they deleted the mailbox on the server the email would be on the backup tapes. Typically these backups happen nightly. And at most places there are multiple backup tapes are they are rotated so you can go back in time. Apparently the IG has found hundreds of tapes. It's pretty hard to believe that they couldn't recreate these emails with in a couple of hours. From an IT prospective it makes no logical sense.
RE: What does a hard drive crashing have to do with anything?  
buford : 2/27/2015 12:58 pm : link
In comment 12155586 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
Government e-mail is typically on a network. And e-mail is typically stored on a server and backed up to other servers. Hard drive crashing should have no impact on whether an e-mail message is "lost".


And why congress did not subpoena these storage servers immediately is beyond me. Nobody that knew anything about email or works in a damn office knew this was bull.
insiders  
idiotsavant : 2/27/2015 1:00 pm : link
outsiders
Nice to know  
Metnut : 2/27/2015 1:02 pm : link
that congress is having hearings on phony-scandals like this and is trying to repeal obamacare every week instead of... you know... funding homeland security or trying to fix our decaying infrastructure. I'm sure those < 100 full-time jobs that the keystone pipeline was an honest attempt to get people working.
I'm sure there's no reason why the IRS commissioner lied under oath  
Greg from LI : 2/27/2015 1:03 pm : link
about the existence of backup tapes. Tapes which the IG investigator found in all of two weeks.
RE: This is completely unrelated, but  
BMac : 2/27/2015 1:08 pm : link
In comment 12155540 Bill L said:
Quote:
Governor dickwad here just put in a new policy where all of our emails (sent and received) are automatically wiped after 90 days. So much for FOIA. It's a big pain in the ass for all of us and no rationale other than his usual whimsy was given. For me, it sucks because I'm losing so much correspondence, data, protocols, addresses, etc. Just a clusterfuck here.


Why not periodically export the files to a .pst and then store it?
RE: RE: This is completely unrelated, but  
Bill L : 2/27/2015 1:19 pm : link
In comment 12155641 BMac said:
Quote:
In comment 12155540 Bill L said:


Quote:


Governor dickwad here just put in a new policy where all of our emails (sent and received) are automatically wiped after 90 days. So much for FOIA. It's a big pain in the ass for all of us and no rationale other than his usual whimsy was given. For me, it sucks because I'm losing so much correspondence, data, protocols, addresses, etc. Just a clusterfuck here.



Why not periodically export the files to a .pst and then store it?


We're trying workarounds including filters etc. Now everyone is scrambling to move years worth of messages into folders that won't be purged.
What does a harddrive crashing have to do with anything?  
SomeFan : 2/27/2015 1:20 pm : link
And why is she worried about the incredible coincidence of crashing in same week? Why does it matter who believes it they crashed in the same week?

It is embarrassing that some of you dopes question why this email is relevant with regard to a high-level government official who was held in contempt. If only the press went after this with a Watergate-like fury
' If only the press went after this with a Watergate-like fury'  
schabadoo : 2/27/2015 1:29 pm : link
Isn't there like six different investigations into this? Seems like a lot.

RE: ' If only the press went after this with a Watergate-like fury'  
Bill L : 2/27/2015 1:30 pm : link
In comment 12155696 schabadoo said:
Quote:
Isn't there like six different investigations into this? Seems like a lot.


He said "the press".

In that respect, it's a where's waldo type of thing
Ha!  
LG in NYC : 2/27/2015 1:39 pm : link
Never mind Watergate... If only the press went after this like they did Guiliani's comments against Obama... or even the Brian Williams thing...

But the MSM doesn't really do stories that could upset the Dem apple cart, do they?
Press coverage is on an entirely different scale  
njm : 2/27/2015 1:48 pm : link
Possibly due at least partially to the inept manner in which the current investigations have been conducted.

But PBS provided live coverage of every hour of the Senate Watergate Committee's hearings. You can probably equate that to CSPAN to day. However, in addition, the (then) 3 major networks for the first week all provided live daily gavel to gavel coverage. After the first week they alternated live coverage. And this was before the discovery of the "smoking gun". Unheard of.


Link - ( New Window )
Spying on political adversaries  
Mr. Nickels : 2/27/2015 1:51 pm : link
in hotel...impeach and disgraced forever..

Spying/intimidating political adversaries EVERYWHERE using the IRS NSA FBI = phony scandals.

Some get more worked up over "Bridgegate".
RE: x and his kind are hilarious  
x meadowlander : 2/27/2015 1:55 pm : link
In comment 12155409 LG in NYC said:
Quote:
Anything that reflects bad on "their guys" is Fox News/RW propaganda and not worthy of our attention... but let's spend 2 weeks parsing the words of some republican politician to see if we can make a scandal for MSNBC.


Who are "My Guys" exactly? I'd love to know. I don't blindly accept talking points, I come to my own conclusions. I've criticized this President, I've criticized many of the Democratic politicians, I've criticized Liberal pundits. There is plenty to complain about.

But distractions like the aforementioned phony scandals are just that, distractions. How many hearings and independent investigations on Benghazi now?

Sorry, the initial post was flat out lame.

As is trying to draw conclusions about my political beliefs without even knowing me.

RE: RE: x and his kind are hilarious  
njm : 2/27/2015 2:13 pm : link
In comment 12155752 x meadowlander said:
Quote:
In comment 12155409 LG in NYC said:


Quote:


Anything that reflects bad on "their guys" is Fox News/RW propaganda and not worthy of our attention... but let's spend 2 weeks parsing the words of some republican politician to see if we can make a scandal for MSNBC.




Who are "My Guys" exactly? I'd love to know. I don't blindly accept talking points, I come to my own conclusions. I've criticized this President, I've criticized many of the Democratic politicians, I've criticized Liberal pundits. There is plenty to complain about.

But distractions like the aforementioned phony scandals are just that, distractions. How many hearings and independent investigations on Benghazi now?

Sorry, the initial post was flat out lame.

As is trying to draw conclusions about my political beliefs without even knowing me.


I don't see how you can define this as a phony scandal given the planted question by Lerner that initiated it.
RE: RE: ' If only the press went after this with a Watergate-like fury'  
schabadoo : 2/27/2015 2:14 pm : link
In comment 12155699 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 12155696 schabadoo said:


Quote:


Isn't there like six different investigations into this? Seems like a lot.




He said "the press".

In that respect, it's a where's waldo type of thing


Yeah but that doesn't make sense as you're getting more press here than the Watergate investigation did. Two young reporters followed that story while everyone else ignored it.

Convict your Liddy and McCord and I'm sure you'll get a ton of press.
'Spying/intimidating political adversaries EVERYWHERE'  
schabadoo : 2/27/2015 2:21 pm : link
I'm not sure the hysteria that comes with every supposed scandal helps bring any attention to it. The never-ending birth certificate investigation, for example...it seems to turn into white noise.
RE: There is such a multitude of scandals  
montanagiant : 2/27/2015 2:25 pm : link
In comment 12155482 Mr. Nickels said:
Quote:
during this administration that something as huge as this stays relatively incognito.

What scandals are you talking about? What exactly have they been proven to be doing wrong in this vast quantity of scandals you mention?
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