| The Justice Department reports that its investigation into law enforcement in Ferguson, Mo., found that the police and courts meted out illegal and unduly harsh treatment, particularly to black people. One of the reports released Wednesday, "Investigation of the Ferguson Police Department," says the mistreatment is due to discrimination, and a primary focus on maximizing city revenue through citations, not to keeping the peace. |
| Ferguson's Municipal Court, which is actually run by the chief of police, is part of the city's revenue-raising machinery, the report found, with court officials routinely levying excessive fines and fees, and violating people's rights. |
| Black people in Ferguson regularly report racial epithets being used against them by police officers, but a search of city e-mail accounts by the Justice Department also showed many racist remarks casually traded by police supervisors and court officials. |
| The Justice Department also found that officers regularly exceed their authority and mistreat people. |
If you think this isn't status quo anywhere besides some backward part of Missouri, don't know what to tell you.
The Ferguson Police Department: The Justice Department Report, Annotated - (
New Window )
You realize what you are saying is far worse. Basically they allow abuse of black people because they don't want to cause a rift with white cops...come on now...It couldn't be seeing dead kids on a weekly basis...nah its a blue code...come on..
What an idiot.
1) I didn't even say that, I was just pointing out how you can't look though any other's worldviews.
2) How often are blacks victims of police brutality at the hands of black cops vs white cops?
3) I don't really think it takes much, if any, of a stretch of the imagination to realize that cops will cover for other cops.
4) All black communities have "dead kids on a weekly basis"? Is this what you think of black people? That there communities have "dead kids on a weekly basis?" You think every single city that has a problem with racial bias in the police force is due to the police seeing "dead kids on a weekly basis"
That is so fucking telling right there...
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Racism and abuse by cops represents a very small amount of the issue effecting black progress yet receives most of the attention.
That's because virtually everything else from equal opportunity to unemployment/workplace inequality to voter disenfranchisement is virtually ignored by all but the most progressive outlets.
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Racism and abuse by cops represents a very small amount of the issue effecting black progress yet receives most of the attention.
Yes, and this is wrong on so many levels. The fact that you stand by this means you've never had to deal with anything comparable. You're trying to marginalize a massive problem. It's funny that you highlight this as one of the fundamental tenants of your argument because it's so off base and detached from the real world.
What about commuties where there are a high % of black cops? Is it still the white racist cops causing the problem?
The above sentence shows you clearly really have no idea what you're talking about. Some of them don't just 'allow' it, but partake in it themselves.
Yeah... this is my last post to you PA. I should've stopped a long time ago, like some suggested, but for some strange reason I actually felt sorry for you and wanted to get a better understanding of why you think the way you do. But it's clear to me now that you've never experienced any real racism (except for the examples told to you by your black friends) and therefore are speaking about something you have no clue about. Absolutely none. There have been movies and documentaries made about the very topic (the peer pressure of becoming a part of a police force) you laugh at above... and yet YOU laugh at the notion and think it's unbelievable because you don't want to believe that it's a common occurrence within police departments.
Whatever... every one is right... it's not worth having this 'discussion' with you anymore. Good luck and peace be with you.
You realize what you are saying is far worse. Basically they allow abuse of black people because they don't want to cause a rift with white cops...come on now...It couldn't be seeing dead kids on a weekly basis...nah its a blue code...come on..
Funny how most of your arguments against me are strawmen
We are all the same. Black, white, brown
Racism and abuse by cops represents a very small amount of the issue effecting black progress yet receives most of the attention.
The real issue is black on black crime, drug laws and use, incarceration rates, babies having babies.
Racism is born out of fear. As long as black represent a vast % per capita of violent crime, and black men have criminals records at a rate of 1/3 there will be continued fear resulting in racism.
Cops are not naturally racist but become conditioned by working in black communities where the crime is. This is also evidenced by the same behavior being perpetuated by black cops. It is not a blue thing as Tbone noted but a conditioned thing.
I believe that solutions should include providing a path to a clean record and education for non violent offenders. Fix drug laws. Education and discouragement or de-incentivize babies having babies.
The continued murder of kids in inner cites represents an issue yet no one talks about it, protests, starts threads here but the hint of a white cop killing an innocent kid starts riots shows a misplacement of rage.
I'm not agreeing with you! LOL!
I give up.
hahahaha.
I'm sorry, what part of my "argument" is invalid? That institutional bias throughout our policing and law enforcement establishments has a disastrous affect on the progress of minority communities, particular black communities?
That's common fucking sense, not an argument. It takes a special kind of ostrich to have his head in the sand so far to not realize how evident and obvious the above statement is.
Please, why don't you outline how the above is "invalid". Don't deflect, don't try and change the issue - just tell me how police and legal bias against a particular group of society does not have a profound negative impact on said group.
Yeah, that kind of has an affect on incarceration rates.
Disastrous effect? Really? It is this that is causing black to commit so much violent crime against other blacks?
Do you even know or can you describe any details to your statement?
Not gangs, guns, drugs, ??????????
Ask anyone that has worked in these communities and they will laugh at you.
Yet another instance of changing what people say to fit the bigot narrative. I said you're an obvious fringer who makes Republicans look bad.
Face it, folks, this is one evil fucker. We'll hear about him some day soon, and not in a good way.
"It wasn't us who raped your culture and put you in a deep hole to start out in this country, it was our grandpas and their grandpas and their grandpas, so just get over it and stop blaming us and look in the mirror for where you are today"... that's your argument.
1600-1860= Slavery aka the absolute worst aspect in this country's history
1860-1970= black people are "free" but treated like absolute garbage
So black people dealt with sub-human treatment for 350-400 years in this country. And just because the last 20 or so years when there was an improvement in black/white relations, you think black people should just go "everything's cool now, it's not your fault we're here"?
You don't seem to understand what the root of the problem is when it comes to black people. You think yesterday doesn't count because it's today. Racial tensions are always going to be there in this country, but as time goes on I think it will continue to improve (like it has been). I think technology and talking over the internet instead of in person will help lessen the importance of skin color. It'll get better but it's always going to be there because you can't ignore the past.
I never did this. I said that it is a much smaller problem facing the community then black on black violent crime, drug laws, etc....
You keep changing what I said to make it sound extreme because you are 100% wrong and the only way to win the argument is to re characterize what I said...which makes you pathetic
My overall thoughts here
We are all the same. Black, white, brown
Racism and abuse by cops represents a very small amount of the issue effecting black progress yet receives most of the attention.
The real issue is black on black crime, drug laws and use, incarceration rates, babies having babies.
Racism is born out of fear. As long as black represent a vast % per capita of violent crime, and black men have criminals records at a rate of 1/3 there will be continued fear resulting in racism.
Cops are not naturally racist but become conditioned by working in black communities where the crime is. This is also evidenced by the same behavior being perpetuated by black cops. It is not a blue thing as Tbone noted but a conditioned thing.
I believe that solutions should include providing a path to a clean record and education for non violent offenders. Fix drug laws. Education and discouragement or de-incentivize babies having babies.
The continued murder of kids in inner cites represents an issue yet no one talks about it, protests, starts threads here but the hint of a white cop killing an innocent kid starts riots shows a misplacement of rage.
The real issue is actually why those are issues.
I also noted how most people in America, white people have no connection to slavery in their families. So how could slavery make white people racist....careful answering that question....
Funny how some one could be so appalled yet completely not be able to read what was written
However you will lose the majority of America and myself if you blame white racist cops as a significant cause of these issues.
I don't think you're completely wrong. There are issues in the black community that only black people can solve. But the root of all these issues always come back to the same thing. Institutionalized Racism that this country was founded on.
The protests occur because the institution that is supposed to be protecting society as a whole is targeting a segment of our country and has a disproportionate amount of violence surrounded by dubious circumstances with dubious investigations.
The police are supposed to protect the citizens of the country. That is what is being protested against.
You want a protest for people to say that criminals are bad? Is this protest supposed to deter criminals? Because with the protests aimed at the government, the idea is to initiate reform within the government.
Also, are you trying to imply that people can only focus on one thing at a time?
Finally, you keep clinging to this DEAD KIDS ON A WEEKLY BASIS concept, completely ignoring the fact that this sort of bias and these types of incidents happen outside of the most dangerous crime ridden areas. I mean just a couple weeks ago, an old Indian man who did not speak English was body slammed to the ground and was partially paralyzed after being handcuffed. The police report was not consistent with what the dashcam showed as well.
I know it's tangentially related because the victim isn't black, and this is simply the first example that popped into my mind, but the main takeaway here is that these types of incidents and biases don't occur exclusively in Robocop-esque crime ridden projects/areas.
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ow you can say "incarceration rates" are a problem, but absolve a biased police force or court system of any blame.
I never did this. I said that it is a much smaller problem facing the community then black on black violent crime, drug laws, etc....
You keep changing what I said to make it sound extreme because you are 100% wrong and the only way to win the argument is to re characterize what I said...which makes you pathetic
haha, what? I'm 100% wrong?
What the fuck am I 100% wrong about? Do you even know what you're arguing against?
You're trying to tell me that a legal and law enforcement system that is bias against a group of people is not a big problem. I'm telling you it is.
Do you have any quantifiable argument to highlight exactly how this isn't a "big" problem?
We all are familiar with folks privledged or not on many metrics who fall prey to the glass half empty rationale for not being all they could be....does not take much to look to family and history and partial examples and conclude that the odds are so stacked that day to day recklessness is all that is available to them.
Do they have the responsibility to overcome by dint of trying? Of course.
But having responsibility and seeing the path and having the goals, work habits and optimism and discipline and will power (habits learned inside families) are all different things
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That institutional bias throughout our policing and law enforcement establishments has a disastrous affect on the progress of minority communities, particular black communities?
Disastrous effect? Really? It is this that is causing black to commit so much violent crime against other blacks?
Do you even know or can you describe any details to your statement?
Man, this is really really hard to believe. I'm at a loss for words.
You really need someone to explain how a police force and legal system that unfairly targets a segment of society has horrendous affects for the targeted segment?
Like, what? I don't know. Put on your big boy pants and your thinking cap and brainstorm.
Not gangs, guns, drugs, ??????????
Ask anyone that has worked in these communities and they will laugh at you.
Again, skirting over the fact that
1)this is not exclusive to high crime areas
2) there can be more than one problem
3) institutional racism perpetuates these problems, which only serves to further justify the institutional racism. Again, it's a circle. You can't pick a starting point out of a circle.
The big difference is that you think this systemic biases aren't a big deal. I think they're a huge deal that should never be tolerated under any circumstances. It's a huge part of the problem and a huge piece of the puzzle.
Did you ever stop to think how simply stomping out the mentality that the police and legal system do not treat blacks as fairly as whites would have an impact on community attitudes and crime?
..
except most do...no lets blame slavery and rolling PTSD....These problems exist in poor white and hispanic neighborhoods too...is it rolling PTSD there too?
An impact sure. Isn't going to happen though....do you know why? Because cops seeing dead kids and gang violence every day conditions them. It is why there are black cops just as bad as the white ones. But if you mention that, it is just the blue code of silence...
always ignoring the elephant in the room of massive violence and death in these neighborhoods. Until that stops the rest will not...or cops will simply stop going into these neighborhoods which happens.
It raises a good question. When neighborhoods get so bad that cops will simply avoid them, is it still a racist cop, institutional racism that is causing the issue?
Wow. You're being intentionally obtuse. Over and over again I've said that these problems perpetuate eachother. Draw a fucking circle out and look at it.
But trying to contend that systemic bias is not a huge piece of the problem is ridiculous.
And drop your RACIST WHITE COPS11 shtick. In any society, a police force and legal system that is unfair against a segment of the population will have profoundly negative effects. You can boil it down to white vs black, but it doesn't matter if it's the Prawns from District 9. It's an obvious truth to any civilized society.
It's not really a hyperbole, and it's not really hard to understand.
Why don't you go ahead and read that DOJ report on Ferguson, and think about how you would feel if you were a black person living in Ferguson. That's a good starting point for you.
In fact (and it's amazing this even needs to be asked): did you even read the article on the DOJ report from the OP?
Bullshit! My gross oversimplification is correct!
If I don't post to you Film...don't post or use what I posted. Your goal is to drain your feeling you got a bad hand in your old neighborhood. Ok...you did. Its your hand to rise beyond the personal wound without attaching rage to people on the internet talking with each other. Same as I explained years ago. So for us same rules for us as before Film.
We root for the Giants. You have a good heart. you ran a business and employed people and did good work for clients. Bravo. But You let wounds overwhelm you in ways I cant engage.
Take care
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Did you ever stop to think how simply stomping out the mentality that the police and legal system do not treat blacks as fairly as whites would have an impact on community attitudes and crime?
An impact sure. Isn't going to happen though....do you know why? Because cops seeing dead kids and gang violence every day conditions them. It is why there are black cops just as bad as the white ones. But if you mention that, it is just the blue code of silence...
always ignoring the elephant in the room of massive violence and death in these neighborhoods. Until that stops the rest will not...or cops will simply stop going into these neighborhoods which happens.
It raises a good question. When neighborhoods get so bad that cops will simply avoid them, is it still a racist cop, institutional racism that is causing the issue?
So why does this happen in low crime, suburban neighborhoods as well? Is Ferguson a particularly dangerous community? Is Ferguson equivalent to Brownsville or the South Bronx in the late 80s?
Second your posting on this thread has been well below your usual abilities. I think you are out of your element here.
My old neighborhood? Interesting attempt at some sort of analysis there but I am fine. I grew up in a mixed neighborhood which helped to give some perspective on life I suppose but it is hardly driving any of my thought process here. I have traveled the world since I left the bronx at 16, ...25 years ago...and had a nice life...
One which anyone could probably attain actually.
My overall thoughts here
We are all the same. Black, white, brown
Racism and abuse by cops represents a very small amount of the issue effecting black progress yet receives most of the attention.
The real issue is black on black crime, drug laws and use, incarceration rates, babies having babies.
Racism is born out of fear. As long as black represent a vast % per capita of violent crime, and black men have criminals records at a rate of 1/3 there will be continued fear resulting in racism.
Cops are not naturally racist but become conditioned by working in black communities where the crime is. This is also evidenced by the same behavior being perpetuated by black cops. It is not a blue thing as Tbone noted but a conditioned thing.
I believe that solutions should include providing a path to a clean record and education for non violent offenders. Fix drug laws. Education and discouragement or de-incentivize babies having babies.
The continued murder of kids in inner cites represents an issue yet no one talks about it, protests, starts threads here but the hint of a white cop killing an innocent kid starts riots shows a misplacement of rage.
like Film...your presence on a thread makes it hard to discuss a subject. Like him when you were on a thread it was hard to even defend a legitimate conservative viewpoint or discuss any legitimate viewpoint. Same experience for posters. If you landed on a thread...it was destroyed.
There was or is or is elsewhere sites created just for you. Please use them. or not.
there is enough out there for folks to do what we should have done much earlier with Film...just ignore him no matter what he uses to keep it going.
Here is my overall position and none of you have the balls to address it...why? Because you know I am right
My overall thoughts here
We are all the same. Black, white, brown
Racism and abuse by cops represents a very small amount of the issue effecting black progress yet receives most of the attention.
The real issue is black on black crime, drug laws and use, incarceration rates, babies having babies.
Racism is born out of fear. As long as black represent a vast % per capita of violent crime, and black men have criminals records at a rate of 1/3 there will be continued fear resulting in racism.
Cops are not naturally racist but become conditioned by working in black communities where the crime is. This is also evidenced by the same behavior being perpetuated by black cops. It is not a blue thing as Tbone noted but a conditioned thing.
I believe that solutions should include providing a path to a clean record and education for non violent offenders. Fix drug laws. Education and discouragement or de-incentivize babies having babies.
The continued murder of kids in inner cites represents an issue yet no one talks about it, protests, starts threads here but the hint of a white cop killing an innocent kid starts riots shows a misplacement of rage.
Nah it must be me. You guys can't even discuss the Mets or Knicks let alone the Giants without the standard vitriol.....nah must be me....
You want to know why donations are down? I just told you.