Not sure what happened to him this year as he didn't see a whole lot of snaps, but he sure looked poised for a breakout after the 2013 season. Still young and has great size to stop the run.
Potentially sort of a DL version of Ron Stone: a project coming out of college, and never really found a role with his previous team.
Laugh if you like, but he'd add beef to the DT rotation, which we need. I think we'll get more out of Hankins with a bigger body next to him on some snaps.
"Would be a very good signing for you guys. He's a fantastic NT who just happens to be stuck behind a stacked Jet DL. Dude deserves a chance to start."
However, as we know, these type don't always pan out in the NFL. If after a couple years they are let go its usually a signal that they couldn't make the jump in competition.
be a huge upgrade over Mike Patterson and Marcus Kuhn.
agreed. Although, it would be no guarantee that makes the team, don't you think? Or if you think that he definitely makes the team....this move may eliminate DT in the 1st or 2nd round of the draft.
Potentially sort of a DL version of Ron Stone: a project coming out of college, and never really found a role with his previous team.
Laugh if you like, but he'd add beef to the DT rotation, which we need. I think we'll get more out of Hankins with a bigger body next to him on some snaps.
Like the analogy. Guy caught in the numbers game that might be alot more effective given more snaps.
lets get him. I'm with Joey, love them big DTs. Spags is going to be playing smaller guys inside on passing down anyways - lets make sure we can shut down the run on first and second downs.
the need at DT is as big as the need at safety. I like Jenkins as the wild card DT who can go after the QB. We need a solid young plugger next to Hankins. I'd love it.
Then go get a decent safety that can at least provide some competition and depth. Done. Draft a pass rusher early, something this draft is chock full of and we would have the makings of a nice DL with a lot of young ascending talent.
I like Jenkins BUT we need a big plugger next to Hankins. I'm not in love with the prospects of Jenkins being the starter with no real talent behind him other than Bromley.
if it wasn't for you, KWALL, SemiPro, Still a Sam Huff fan et al, I would be even more nuts than I am reading the gloom and doom under the guise of being objective, on this board..
I've been saying this stuff for years..Must be my deodorant..
if it wasn't for you, KWALL, SemiPro, Still a Sam Huff fan et al, I would be even more nuts than I am reading the gloom and doom under the guise of being objective, on this board..
I've been saying this stuff for years..Must be my deodorant..
This is a 6-10 which hasn't been good in three years. How exactly is doom and gloom not realistic?
regarding the draft you can now check the 'big DL player' box and go after the different -types- of defensive ends and tackles (the upside dupree type and the 'can also play inside as well as be a solid even scary force on end type)
and regarding the defensive play book, you can have many more options for line play- a) play him at the 1, allowing hank or someone excelling, to go to the 3, if a classic look is best
or b) play him at the 0, allowing for the variations, such as 5-1-5 with a zero player
and even go for the nutty 'modified '46', which would call for some beef inside with 3dts, as well as 3 true ends.
all of which, as a rotational player, will wear and tear on him less than a Jets 3/4 would, all having more opps as it were.
Kendrick could become an excellent player for the team that drafts him in a few years. He has the talent and the size, so there is no reason for him not to be successful. If Kendrick accepts coaching from a head coach that's smart enough to push the right buttons, this kid could easily become a Pro Bowl player. Get on this kid's wrong side and he will close shut like a hatch on a submarine door. Nothing will get in and nothing will go out. This kid strikes me as being as temperamental as a high paid chef in a fancy New York Restaurant. You can see it when he plays. He plays with emotion, pride and a little chip on his shoulder. He needs a family atmosphere around him to survive. Some kids are like that. Some don't want to be lumped in with the other kids. Some kids want to take care of the other kids. This kid is the type of kid that Wade Phillips seems to get the best out of; Kendrick is his type of player.
RE: I've been saying a lot of truthful stuff since 2012
if it wasn't for you, KWALL, SemiPro, Still a Sam Huff fan et al, I would be even more nuts than I am reading the gloom and doom under the guise of being objective, on this board..
I've been saying this stuff for years..Must be my deodorant..
This is a 6-10 which hasn't been good in three years. How exactly is doom and gloom not realistic?
KWALL has beautifully pointed out the whys and the wherefores..I am not going to repeat TO YOU for at least the 5th time within a year WHY it's not realistic..Do not ask me again if you're not going to take in my responses..So go back through the archives if you want to see for yourself
RE: RE: I've been saying a lot of truthful stuff since 2012
even if we sign him, great, I would trade down twice if the opportunities present themselves, and get 2 guards and 2 defensive ends and 2 safeties - early
there would still be room for a smaller, say, 280lbs DE/DT tweener as well, as a situational move around the line player
Very strong vs the run. 4th rounder in 2011. Fresh legs having played limited snaps. Some upside but unlikely to be 'special'. Has no impact on what we do with the #9 pick imo.
Very strong vs the run. 4th rounder in 2011. Fresh legs having played limited snaps. Some upside but unlikely to be 'special'. Has no impact on what we do with the #9 pick imo.
I disagree... This is exactly the type of player we need lining up next to Hankins. He is very stout and strong against the run. I think he would be a 2 down run stuffing DT for us.
so probably don't catch Jets games much. He would be a big plus but I thought the Jets were bringing him back to keep that DL unit intact as of last week. Hope he isn't using the Giants to set his price for the Jets.
That he can't be special, I took as he couldn't start and that he would merely be depth. Also that it wouldn't affect pick 9 I took as Shelton would still an option. If I miss understood then my mistake.
I hope you're right. He was playing behind very good talent on the Jets D-line. That could have kept his game reps down. That is a bit of a projection though based on his resume to date. I hope we get him signed and he thrives.
Jets DL is sick. Ellis didn't see many reps from what I've read. Still got in on some run downs and made a few plays. In Spags defense, he will see limited reps also because there is Jenkins and Bromley sneaking up in rotation to help rush the passer.
I would like this move. It may or may not stop them from taking someone like Shelton early or a big DT at all but it helps the DL rotation out that is sorely needed. DE, S, OG, and WR is also necessary.
RE: You think he's poised to be an above average starter for us?
I hope you're right. He was playing behind very good talent on the Jets D-line. That could have kept his game reps down. That is a bit of a projection though based on his resume to date. I hope we get him signed and he thrives.
To clarify I see him as an above average run stuffing DT which we need bad. I think he improves our teams run Def from day one. I don't think he is a complete DT that will go to pro bowls as he won't have the stats for it and won't get pressure as some that knife through the line. I do think he will take up blockers and push pockets though. A hard working run stuffer making things happen... Yes that is what I see and I think that is what we need on this line.
Well its a start I guess. Is it just me, or are they Gmen stuck in neutral or are they doing things in reverse order? I always thought you prioritize things by order of importance. I understand the need for a younger D lineman but I think our secondary and Offensive line are a huge priority. How does bringing in yet ANOTHER backup going to improve this team. I feel like the GMEN are shopping on EBay for bargains or guys that really no one wants. This has been one of the biggest head scratching off seasons ever by the Giants front office. Hope Jerry is alot smarter that he and a lot of people on here think he is....
Well its a start I guess. Is it just me, or are they Gmen stuck in neutral or are they doing things in reverse order? I always thought you prioritize things by order of importance. I understand the need for a younger D lineman but I think our secondary and Offensive line are a huge priority. How does bringing in yet ANOTHER backup going to improve this team. I feel like the GMEN are shopping on EBay for bargains or guys that really no one wants. This has been one of the biggest head scratching off seasons ever by the Giants front office. Hope Jerry is alot smarter that he and a lot of people on here think he is....
Well its a start I guess. Is it just me, or are they Gmen stuck in neutral or are they doing things in reverse order? I always thought you prioritize things by order of importance. I understand the need for a younger D lineman but I think our secondary and Offensive line are a huge priority. How does bringing in yet ANOTHER backup going to improve this team. I feel like the GMEN are shopping on EBay for bargains or guys that really no one wants. This has been one of the biggest head scratching off seasons ever by the Giants front office. Hope Jerry is alot smarter that he and a lot of people on here think he is....
Sheesh, you're an idiot
Why am I an Idiot? You think its such a great idea to sign all these unproven players to these contracts?
1.) Shane Vareen: Great reciever but one dimensional, very little hope of him ever being anything other than a 3rd down back/ receiver.
2.) JT Thomas: Played on an abysmal Jaguars team who were pounded on defense and yeah he had 80 tackles. LB's are going to get alot of tackles when your down big every game and the other team is killing the clock.
3.) Jonathon Casillias: 5 year veteran who has never started a full NFL season, never put up any gawdy numbers and his biggest accomplishment was being a bench player for the super bowl champion Pats.
4.) John Jerry: Need I say more, just awful.
5.) Marshall Newhouse: A tackle who lost his starting job twice in Green Bay and Cincinnati.
6.) Dwayne Harris: Kick returner signed to a big paycheck coming off an off season where he struggled and not a very consistent receiver when on the field.
So yes, Apparently I am an idiot for stating the obvious we've spent a ton of money improving depth and zilch on a solid starter at any area of need on this team.
------------That is all--------------------------------
I wonder what kind of money he would command. I don't mind paying a bit for a young buck.
Not a known name to be sure. Can't imagine he'll command a ton of money, but if the Giants brought him in, it's because they know what kind of money he wants and are okay with it.
The Giants want to stop the run and now they are actually talking
Keeping the middle all clogged up and keeping the inside LBs clean, this guy is as good as it gets.
He is caught in a salary cap allocation problem with the Jets who can only pay so many star DL starters, and Harrison is a RFA while Ellis is a UFA.
If he had not had a nagging back issue in 2012 - he would have been the starting NT, not Damon Harrison. I believe that he plays stronger than DH, although DH makes plays that show better phone booth area quickness.
RE: If you want a player in his prime who is as good as it gets
Keeping the middle all clogged up and keeping the inside LBs clean, this guy is as good as it gets.
He is caught in a salary cap allocation problem with the Jets who can only pay so many star DL starters, and Harrison is a RFA while Ellis is a UFA.
If he had not had a nagging back issue in 2012 - he would have been the starting NT, not Damon Harrison. I believe that he plays stronger than DH, although DH makes plays that show better phone booth area quickness.
Big Hank and Ellis Island
thatd be near 700 pounds in the middle.
and he would be a big upgrade at DT. He is young, huge, and talented which is the exact kind of free agent signings I love. He would not only stuff the run but keep the OL off of the LB's which would free them up to make plays. Honestly if he is signed I expect him to get more playing time than Jenkins.
taking up a ton of space in the middle, collapsing the pocket and stuffing the run. The guy has almost no miles on him and doesn't have a history of injury. He was playing DE in a 3-4 shading to the middle depending on down and distance and was playing as part of a very talented and very crowded defensive line.
He's got a good motor, good explosiveness for a huge guy and you've got to think a little extra motivation after being buried by the Jets.
Explain to me again why this would be a bad or "subpar" signing for the Giants?
taking up a ton of space in the middle, collapsing the pocket and stuffing the run. The guy has almost no miles on him and doesn't have a history of injury. He was playing DE in a 3-4 shading to the middle depending on down and distance and was playing as part of a very talented and very crowded defensive line.
He's got a good motor, good explosiveness for a huge guy and you've got to think a little extra motivation after being buried by the Jets.
Explain to me again why this would be a bad or "subpar" signing for the Giants?
In the same way a Vereen, Harris and JT Thomas signings were/are subpar
understand why the Jets can't resign him given their DL, but why isn't anyone else considering him? Why is he still available? Is it his weight? I've seen him play a number of times. He is a good player, but if so, shouldn't there be more interest in him from other teams?
taking up a ton of space in the middle, collapsing the pocket and stuffing the run. The guy has almost no miles on him and doesn't have a history of injury. He was playing DE in a 3-4 shading to the middle depending on down and distance and was playing as part of a very talented and very crowded defensive line.
He's got a good motor, good explosiveness for a huge guy and you've got to think a little extra motivation after being buried by the Jets.
Explain to me again why this would be a bad or "subpar" signing for the Giants?
1. Because he's not Ndomakong Suh. Any UFA DT we sign not named Suh is subpar, never mind the cost.
2. Because Jerry Reese sucks, and unless he signs exactly whom I want - at the price I'm willing to pay - he should be fired.
3. Because our O-Line sucks, and we shouldn't be wasting our time with rotational DTs when future Hall-of-Famer Joe Barksdale is still available.
when you have little to spend, and not much to pick from on the market. He's been in a strong system, give him a shot to make an impact parked next to Hankins.
The negativity, pessimistic attitudes on this site. This guy is huge, and according to my Jest friend, a good athlete. He looks scary, that's for sure. They don't have a safety....waaaaaaaaaaaaaaa...they don't have a Guard...geez.don't they have 8 draft choices? If they sign this DT, I'll be pleased. They are going to have a pretty good run defense, and will probably pick a pass rushing DE or LB in the draft. :)
If we really want him, he won't leave the building..
We need some big bodies out there. The fact that he's still young, and that he'll probably do well under Spag's coaching, is a big plus!
Make it happen JR.!
understand why the Jets can't resign him given their DL, but why isn't anyone else considering him? Why is he still available? Is it his weight? I've seen him play a number of times. He is a good player, but if so, shouldn't there be more interest in him from other teams?
Just as of last week, Jets were putting out that Ellis and Harrison were both going to get re-signed. Teams aren't looking to be used to bump salaries. I'm still unsure if Ellis has any interest in moving on. Costello (Jets beat writer) was claiming that both would be brought back on WFAN. This was prior to both the Revis and Cromartie deals though.
many of the fans on this board have turned into something we've always mocked - Redskins fans pre-Snyder.
Now that Snyder went on spending sprees to grab bigtime free agents and we watched for years as they were the "offseason champs" - many of the fans here seem to want the same - that "offseason champs" title - before a fucking game has been played.
People are clammoring for every bigtime FA to be signed. When the Giants miss out the reactions are absurd - all without knowing what went on behind the scenes.
It's becoming ridiculous. Just settle down a bit and let the experts do their jobs.
As a general rule it's always solid to allow the moves to play out a bit. Let these guys hit the field and we'll see what's what. If they're terrible - fine - have at it. If they work out - fine - have at it.
I'm not sitting here saying these are great moves or terrible moves. I'm just saying - let it play out a bit. Have some faith.
(that said, i'm a bit concerned about the Safety position)
(that said, i'm a bit concerned about the Safety position)
Let it play out a bit..
Not sure if you're being a smartass or not. But my main concern stems from the fact that they haven't tangibly addressed the position and the stock is getting very thin.
The other positions have been met with some results - i'm willing to accept these wholeheartedly at this point - and as you said, let it play out.
I hate drafting for need and think it's a recipe for disappointment - particularly when you don't have that veteran stalwart to apprentice the kid. And to see the Giants in a position where they need a 2 or 3 at one of the Safety positions at that point in the process concerns me.
RE: If we really want him, he won't leave the building..
....he does have other visits lined up and I don't think he will come too cheap because big men in the middle of a defense are tough to find.
Just to temper expectations a little:
-Might be better suited for a 3-4 nose tackle
-Was essentially handed a starting job for the Jets and lost it to Damon Harrison
-Has been in trouble including jail time in the past
Even with all that in mind, this would be a great signing if it were to happen.
(that said, i'm a bit concerned about the Safety position)
Let it play out a bit..
Not sure if you're being a smartass or not. But my main concern stems from the fact that they haven't tangibly addressed the position and the stock is getting very thin.
The other positions have been met with some results - i'm willing to accept these wholeheartedly at this point - and as you said, let it play out.
I hate drafting for need and think it's a recipe for disappointment - particularly when you don't have that veteran stalwart to apprentice the kid. And to see the Giants in a position where they need a 2 or 3 at one of the Safety positions at that point in the process concerns me.
Mever a smartass with you..Just Playin'.. Should have put smiley
That the Giants let a player leave without signing if they really want him.
The advantage right now is they are not behind anyone else and that he is there.
Vereen - B+
Does pass protection according to the pundits and specializes in catch from the RB spot. Similar to Jennings, which is very good. It will be much more likely that the team can implement a system without injury interruptions. Building the passing route tree from short to long.
Harris - B+
You now need someone to go over the middle, take a beating, and / or receive in the short to medium of the route tree - to help rationalize the offense by making the whole playbook available, helping the #1 and #2 wrs. Helps also with special teams, which is a big need.
Ellis- this I would give a A.
We got run on far too much last season. Having a big DT would also help on draft day, because there is -no way- they will ignore run D as a need. Having a big type DT might even give you a touch more flexibility in what -types- of DE's you draft...a touch, remember, if the big zero player goes down those little mini DE's will not be as effective, once again, aaaaand we do have one mini already in Moore, Demontre. However, with the 'interesting case/type' DE's? this opens that up a smidge.
he's there this afternoon, tonight, and tomorrow, they want him---period.
They don't need to take a couple of hours to show him the complex, and that's a long visit for a 'we want your name, fame, or talent and can give you a bajillion $$$, just sign here'. And he knows their $$$ limits and they know his price, so they are close enough already, just a question of the price.
Arrow up on getting him; they blow this, they blow.
Cruz? Something tells me that is the last thing they want to do with Cruz at this point. I wonder if the Giants still view Cruz's contract the same way they did two years ago.
That the Giants let a player leave without signing if they really want him.
The advantage right now is they are not behind anyone else and that he is there.
Agreed. If the Giants want him and they and his agent have already agreed on the parameters of a contract, I'd expect him to sign with us. Here's hoping, as we sure need DT help, particularly against the run.
Gotta keep his weight down but he could really have a major impact. He's big, but he can move pretty well. Played in a 3-4, more athletic than you'd think - he will fit in a 4-3 scheme. In a 4-3, he'll be a nightmare blocking assignment. Just gotta keep the weight down.
That the Giants let a player leave without signing if they really want him.
The advantage right now is they are not behind anyone else and that he is there.
Agreed. If the Giants want him and they and his agent have already agreed on the parameters of a contract, I'd expect him to sign with us. Here's hoping, as we sure need DT help, particularly against the run.
A quality run stopping DT would definitely be an upgrade on the defense.
First, an Ellis signing, should it happen, is going to be an example of how free agency works when it's working well. Most of the best values are guys who have been backups during their first contract and want out. They're prospects someone else developed, but haven't had a full shot at starting yet. Martellus Bennett, great example. We fans love to focus on the big names and established stars, but that's not where the real gold is.
Second, free agency is better for improving specific spots and roles, and addressing need, than the draft. Draft picks are crapshoots, and you don't know who's going to be available when you draft. Very hard to fill holes. With free agency, you can target guys for specific roles. The Giants need a run stuffer to play alongside Hankins. Ellis can do that. They need to generally upgrade the DT position. Ellis can push Patterson and/or Kuhn down the depth chart, and push one of them all the way off the roster.
Third, since almost all of the guys active on any given game day will play, either on offense, defense, specials or some combination of the three, it's worthwhile to upgrade the backups and special teamers. Get better guys on the field and the team should get better.
Fourth, when a team has gone 7-9 and 6-10 over the last two seasons, it's more than a top veteran away from being a contender. The Giants have a lot of holes to fill. We can blame Reese for that -- Of course; who else would be to blame? -- but the bottom line is that's what they're facing. They have to bring in a bunch of guys to fill holes. So that's what they're doing. That eats up cap space they might otherwise use to sign a star. But there it is.
RE: A few thoughts for the people getting flamed above.
First, an Ellis signing, should it happen, is going to be an example of how free agency works when it's working well. Most of the best values are guys who have been backups during their first contract and want out. They're prospects someone else developed, but haven't had a full shot at starting yet. Martellus Bennett, great example. We fans love to focus on the big names and established stars, but that's not where the real gold is.
Second, free agency is better for improving specific spots and roles, and addressing need, than the draft. Draft picks are crapshoots, and you don't know who's going to be available when you draft. Very hard to fill holes. With free agency, you can target guys for specific roles. The Giants need a run stuffer to play alongside Hankins. Ellis can do that. They need to generally upgrade the DT position. Ellis can push Patterson and/or Kuhn down the depth chart, and push one of them all the way off the roster.
Third, since almost all of the guys active on any given game day will play, either on offense, defense, specials or some combination of the three, it's worthwhile to upgrade the backups and special teamers. Get better guys on the field and the team should get better.
Fourth, when a team has gone 7-9 and 6-10 over the last two seasons, it's more than a top veteran away from being a contender. The Giants have a lot of holes to fill. We can blame Reese for that -- Of course; who else would be to blame? -- but the bottom line is that's what they're facing. They have to bring in a bunch of guys to fill holes. So that's what they're doing. That eats up cap space they might otherwise use to sign a star. But there it is.
A great post. But I do blame the roster on Reese, and I am pissed because we are wasting great years for Eli, who has already delivered twice, so he is a given, despite the moronic views of some. Reese's bad drafts are causing this, and it's like a domino effect, you have to sign a lot of players when your later round draft picks have not developed, and that is a huge problem under Reese. I have not killed the guy until this year, because we are still swimming against the tide. He needs to hit a home run on this draft, or this is really going to get ugly.
According to PFF. Rated #3 in 2013. Dropped off a little last year, but still better then anybody we have not named Hankins.
To the person who said he was benched for Damon Harrison. That isn't a bad thing. PFF has him as the best run stopping NT in football. Kenrick Ellis - ( New Window )
that pay dividends once the season rolls around. This isn't a playmaker, he won't show up big in the stat column, but he'll do the dirty work like keeping the LBers clean and occupying blockers so that the playmakers like JPP and Hankins can do their thing.
A three man rotation of Hankins, Jenkins, and Ellis would be a solid, versatile trio that you can move around and do a few different things with. I hope they can get him.
Ellis would instantly make all the existing parts better on that D.
I believe you meant squashes, but after further thought, "scotches" is probably better and more original. A little whiskey to seal the deal reminds me of the teacher who wished to show his class the evils of alcohol.
His demonstration started with a bottle of water and a bottle of whiskey. He dipped an earthworm into the bottle of whiskey, and the worm shriveled up and died. He dipped another earthworm into the bottle of water and worm kept squirming around unharmed. He asked the class what they learned from this demonstration.
Little Johnny raised his hand and said, "I know, I know!"
The teacher asked Johnny, "Okay what did you learn?"
Little Johnny replied, "If you drink lots of whiskey, you'll never get worms."
But what this joke portrays so well is how difficult it is to communicate effectively, whether in speech or in writing. We often think we've done a wonderful job explaining ourselves, and yet, someone else takes what we meant in a completely different direction than that intended.
btw, here is Mirriam Webster on the verb, to scotch:
scotch
transitive verb \ˈskch\
Definition of SCOTCH
1
archaic : cut, gash, score; also : wound <we have scotched the snake, not killed it Shakespeare>
2
: to put an end to <scotched rumors of a military takeover>
Ellis may have other visits scheduled, but I think he really wants to stay in N.Y. I'm sure the thought of uprooting his family plays into his decision. If the parameters are set, then it's probably just a difference of guaranteed $. I bet we see a deal reached today.
hankins looks like a NT but is actually most effective at 3T. The team looking for a beefcake to eat blocks in the middle and allow hankins to work upfield
One advantage a 4/3 should have over a 3/4 is more flexibility in how you deploy the linesmen - all the way across.
What you don't want to do is have an upside player like Hank -always- at the 1, and / or only have -one- player that can play the 1.
they would be in for a heck of a lot of wear and tear.
You can plug a player like Ellis in anywhere in the interior for short stretches, and let him take longer stretches at the 1 and or even the 0, and let Hank go to the 3...and even (hank) take a few reps at the End in certain situations.
or go with a more 0 centered look with Ellis in the middle and Hank and JPP at the "3/4 end" spots with additional 'end players ' of some kind out at the (5?..9?)
to give us a lot of flexibility in the draft, if we fix DT now. Spagnuolo must have input on moves like this as well. He sees whats our roster and what we need to get it on track. As has been noted this will free up Hankins as a pass rusher up the middle . Which would be huge for our whole defense.
You get about 10 snaps a game, body is light on wear and tear, but still plays. With the defensive improvements the Jets made in the secondary, you gotta think a guy like this is thinking to himself, "I'm gonna get a lot of sacks this year, even if I do only get 10 snaps a game."
You get about 10 snaps a game, body is light on wear and tear, but still plays. With the defensive improvements the Jets made in the secondary, you gotta think a guy like this is thinking to himself, "I'm gonna get a lot of sacks this year, even if I do only get 10 snaps a game."
Yes, if you're a competitor, you want to start, not play 10 snaps a game.
because we are going to do something revolutionary on the line, he will be part of it, he will get free on the line in a way big players are rarely allowed to, that will jet his marketing and future salary potential into another level, he gets a ring, and the J.E.T.S still will suck moose balls, being the J.e.t.s jets jets ets.
If you are expecting a really dominant big guy, you may be disappointed. He played more before Harrison got there for sure. Not really sure if that's an indictment of his play, probably more that Harrison is a pretty damn good 3-4 NT.
From my perspective he never really stood out in any games I've seen him play. Basically he did not play "big" for a big guy IMO, he doesn't seem to play with as much power as you would think he should. He can get locked up with one guy and not really beat the one-on-one blocks. That said I have not seen him pushed back on roller skates either, and as a clogging DT next to Hankins, that may really be interesting. There is really not a huge sample size though.
Upside to me is really good, he is HUGE and you hope maybe that he is going to get better/stronger in the right system and more playing time. I can definitely see him starting day one with Hankins, and being a really solid rotational guy on our defensive line, especially against the run.
You get about 10 snaps a game, body is light on wear and tear, but still plays. With the defensive improvements the Jets made in the secondary, you gotta think a guy like this is thinking to himself, "I'm gonna get a lot of sacks this year, even if I do only get 10 snaps a game."
Yes, if you're a competitor, you want to start, not play 10 snaps a game.
Exactly. It's like backup QB being the best job in the game...sure, but these guys are the best of the best, they want in there.
On a side note: If a DT could play either, I would think they would rather play in a 4-3. Seems like they'd take more wear and tear at the nose - not that either is an easy lift.
has to be the expectation for both parties. That'd be a decent rotation - him, Hank, Jenkins, and Bromley - and you never know they may find something in the draft.
I do not see how the first pick in the draft isn't an edge rusher... I don't buy the BPA hype... JR has shown a history of plugging needs early and often... There are a few exceptions, of course, but it's pretty evident...
Not bashing JR... Just my thoughts...
RE: Given the NYG history and the current roster, notably depth at DE
I do not see how the first pick in the draft isn't an edge rusher... I don't buy the BPA hype... JR has shown a history of plugging needs early and often... There are a few exceptions, of course, but it's pretty evident...
Not bashing JR... Just my thoughts...
There's just not many 4-3 prototype DE's which will go that high. Most pass rushers coming out these days seem to be lighter 3-4 OLB types or tweeners. Reese seems intrigued by the idea of a rushing DE/OLB tweener and had drafted a couple of them (Sintim, Tracy) and he also tried to sign Schofield O'Brien so I suppose even the guys more suited to OLB aren't out of the question.
I dont see why people see Need and BPA as exclusive
I do not see how the first pick in the draft isn't an edge rusher... I don't buy the BPA hype... JR has shown a history of plugging needs early and often... There are a few exceptions, of course, but it's pretty evident...
Not bashing JR... Just my thoughts...
BPA vs Need is for the fans to argue. It's likely that when they're on the clock there are 3-4 (or more, depending on the round) guys with comparable grades. So they probably look at these guys (which would all fit the "BPA" mold) and say, which one fits our biggest need or which one fills a premium position? And the answer is the guy they take.
I agree. Picking that high makes your value positions of QB, LT, DE, CB or WR more likely. We won't go QB, not sure there is a LT in the group worth the 9th pick. That leaves pass rusher, WR or CB. I would go pass rusher. I think one of Ray, Beasley or Gregory will be available. I would prefer Beasley.
I agree. Picking that high makes your value positions of QB, LT, DE, CB or WR more likely. We won't go QB, not sure there is a LT in the group worth the 9th pick. That leaves pass rusher, WR or CB. I would go pass rusher. I think one of Ray, Beasley or Gregory will be available. I would prefer Beasley.
This is my thought as well.. Im trying to look at Gregory more.. I think he is the player that slides a little..
I agree. Picking that high makes your value positions of QB, LT, DE, CB or WR more likely. We won't go QB, not sure there is a LT in the group worth the 9th pick. That leaves pass rusher, WR or CB. I would go pass rusher. I think one of Ray, Beasley or Gregory will be available. I would prefer Beasley.
This is my thought as well.. Im trying to look at Gregory more.. I think he is the player that slides a little..
Just saw some Gregory highlights. Guy is awful slender. I think it was pro day at Nebraska and there isn't much to him. I'd be wary of a guy that thin.
I agree. Picking that high makes your value positions of QB, LT, DE, CB or WR more likely. We won't go QB, not sure there is a LT in the group worth the 9th pick. That leaves pass rusher, WR or CB. I would go pass rusher. I think one of Ray, Beasley or Gregory will be available. I would prefer Beasley.
This is my thought as well.. Im trying to look at Gregory more.. I think he is the player that slides a little..
Just saw some Gregory highlights. Guy is awful slender. I think it was pro day at Nebraska and there isn't much to him. I'd be wary of a guy that thin.
He is about 235... He should be able to add 10-15 lbs to his frame.. I am looking at him because he could possibly be there.. Beasley was 225 and is now 246 and just as explosive..
Could turn out to be a good signing maybe I really don't know much about him since he plays for the guys across town. This contract could be all about the guaranteed money since he seems to be a very limited role guy. He is a big guy but I'm not that sold on a Hankins and Ellis starting team in certain roles yes but not sure this about a depth behind Hankins.
He is about 235... He should be able to add 10-15 lbs to his frame.. I am looking at him because he could possibly be there.. Beasley was 225 and is now 246 and just as explosive..
So even at 245/250 makes him lighter than D. Moore and people complain that Moore is too light.
Not sure where that 225 for Beasely came from, maybe freshman year stats, but doubtful he put on 20+ lbs in the two months before the combine and was still able to put up those numbers. More likely he was close to that weight last season.
Laugh if you like, but he'd add beef to the DT rotation, which we need. I think we'll get more out of Hankins with a bigger body next to him on some snaps.
Stats - ( New Window )
Get it done Jerry.
350 pounder.
Also, may eliminate DT consideration for the #9 pick.
I'm sold, make it happen. Looks like Shaun Rogers.
agreed. Although, it would be no guarantee that makes the team, don't you think? Or if you think that he definitely makes the team....this move may eliminate DT in the 1st or 2nd round of the draft.
Laugh if you like, but he'd add beef to the DT rotation, which we need. I think we'll get more out of Hankins with a bigger body next to him on some snaps.
Like the analogy. Guy caught in the numbers game that might be alot more effective given more snaps.
Agreed...we have had a few in the last several years but it seems our big run stuffers always came here at the end of their career. Ellis is only 27.
Then go get a decent safety that can at least provide some competition and depth. Done. Draft a pass rusher early, something this draft is chock full of and we would have the makings of a nice DL with a lot of young ascending talent.
We need another DT badly.
I've been saying this stuff for years..Must be my deodorant..
I've been saying this stuff for years..Must be my deodorant..
This is a 6-10 which hasn't been good in three years. How exactly is doom and gloom not realistic?
regarding the draft you can now check the 'big DL player' box and go after the different -types- of defensive ends and tackles (the upside dupree type and the 'can also play inside as well as be a solid even scary force on end type)
and regarding the defensive play book, you can have many more options for line play- a) play him at the 1, allowing hank or someone excelling, to go to the 3, if a classic look is best
or b) play him at the 0, allowing for the variations, such as 5-1-5 with a zero player
and even go for the nutty 'modified '46', which would call for some beef inside with 3dts, as well as 3 true ends.
all of which, as a rotational player, will wear and tear on him less than a Jets 3/4 would, all having more opps as it were.
Jon you are the bellwether of realism on this board.
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if it wasn't for you, KWALL, SemiPro, Still a Sam Huff fan et al, I would be even more nuts than I am reading the gloom and doom under the guise of being objective, on this board..
I've been saying this stuff for years..Must be my deodorant..
This is a 6-10 which hasn't been good in three years. How exactly is doom and gloom not realistic?
KWALL has beautifully pointed out the whys and the wherefores..I am not going to repeat TO YOU for at least the 5th time within a year WHY it's not realistic..Do not ask me again if you're not going to take in my responses..So go back through the archives if you want to see for yourself
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but I'm not among the objective, I imagine. Need me some Blue Colored Glasses ...
Jon you are the bellwether of realism on this board.
Reb, Thanks I appreciate that.
there would still be room for a smaller, say, 280lbs DE/DT tweener as well, as a situational move around the line player
I disagree... This is exactly the type of player we need lining up next to Hankins. He is very stout and strong against the run. I think he would be a 2 down run stuffing DT for us.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58yLXsy90-0#t=158
That he can't be special, I took as he couldn't start and that he would merely be depth. Also that it wouldn't affect pick 9 I took as Shelton would still an option. If I miss understood then my mistake.
Hey, Jon, why the modesty? Reb is spot on, no arguments. To boot, you're a virtual or a quasi asshat, or an asshat on the qt.
I'd give him the Babu Bhatt treatment - ( New Window )
I would like this move. It may or may not stop them from taking someone like Shelton early or a big DT at all but it helps the DL rotation out that is sorely needed. DE, S, OG, and WR is also necessary.
To clarify I see him as an above average run stuffing DT which we need bad. I think he improves our teams run Def from day one. I don't think he is a complete DT that will go to pro bowls as he won't have the stats for it and won't get pressure as some that knife through the line. I do think he will take up blockers and push pockets though. A hard working run stuffer making things happen... Yes that is what I see and I think that is what we need on this line.
Sheesh, you're an idiot
I think he will be able to collapse the pocket and stuff the run.....in a 4-3. The DE and Lb'ers will love him
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Well its a start I guess. Is it just me, or are they Gmen stuck in neutral or are they doing things in reverse order? I always thought you prioritize things by order of importance. I understand the need for a younger D lineman but I think our secondary and Offensive line are a huge priority. How does bringing in yet ANOTHER backup going to improve this team. I feel like the GMEN are shopping on EBay for bargains or guys that really no one wants. This has been one of the biggest head scratching off seasons ever by the Giants front office. Hope Jerry is alot smarter that he and a lot of people on here think he is....
Sheesh, you're an idiot
Why am I an Idiot? You think its such a great idea to sign all these unproven players to these contracts?
1.) Shane Vareen: Great reciever but one dimensional, very little hope of him ever being anything other than a 3rd down back/ receiver.
2.) JT Thomas: Played on an abysmal Jaguars team who were pounded on defense and yeah he had 80 tackles. LB's are going to get alot of tackles when your down big every game and the other team is killing the clock.
3.) Jonathon Casillias: 5 year veteran who has never started a full NFL season, never put up any gawdy numbers and his biggest accomplishment was being a bench player for the super bowl champion Pats.
4.) John Jerry: Need I say more, just awful.
5.) Marshall Newhouse: A tackle who lost his starting job twice in Green Bay and Cincinnati.
6.) Dwayne Harris: Kick returner signed to a big paycheck coming off an off season where he struggled and not a very consistent receiver when on the field.
So yes, Apparently I am an idiot for stating the obvious we've spent a ton of money improving depth and zilch on a solid starter at any area of need on this team.
------------That is all--------------------------------
Thought Patterson wasn't too bad. I like him as a rotational player
Not a known name to be sure. Can't imagine he'll command a ton of money, but if the Giants brought him in, it's because they know what kind of money he wants and are okay with it.
He is caught in a salary cap allocation problem with the Jets who can only pay so many star DL starters, and Harrison is a RFA while Ellis is a UFA.
If he had not had a nagging back issue in 2012 - he would have been the starting NT, not Damon Harrison. I believe that he plays stronger than DH, although DH makes plays that show better phone booth area quickness.
He is caught in a salary cap allocation problem with the Jets who can only pay so many star DL starters, and Harrison is a RFA while Ellis is a UFA.
If he had not had a nagging back issue in 2012 - he would have been the starting NT, not Damon Harrison. I believe that he plays stronger than DH, although DH makes plays that show better phone booth area quickness.
Big Hank and Ellis Island
thatd be near 700 pounds in the middle.
Let me have men about me that are fat;
Sleek-headed men, and such as sleep o' nights.
-- Caesar in VA.
Yep. Sub in Jenkins or Ayers.
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and would be a fantastic signing for us. He's not a pass rusher though so you'd need to sub him out on obvious passing downs
Yep. Sub in Jenkins or Ayers.
Or Bromley
He's got a good motor, good explosiveness for a huge guy and you've got to think a little extra motivation after being buried by the Jets.
Explain to me again why this would be a bad or "subpar" signing for the Giants?
He's got a good motor, good explosiveness for a huge guy and you've got to think a little extra motivation after being buried by the Jets.
Explain to me again why this would be a bad or "subpar" signing for the Giants?
In the same way a Vereen, Harris and JT Thomas signings were/are subpar
Forgot about the weed. That's why teams are skittish.
He's got a good motor, good explosiveness for a huge guy and you've got to think a little extra motivation after being buried by the Jets.
Explain to me again why this would be a bad or "subpar" signing for the Giants?
1. Because he's not Ndomakong Suh. Any UFA DT we sign not named Suh is subpar, never mind the cost.
2. Because Jerry Reese sucks, and unless he signs exactly whom I want - at the price I'm willing to pay - he should be fired.
3. Because our O-Line sucks, and we shouldn't be wasting our time with rotational DTs when future Hall-of-Famer Joe Barksdale is still available.
Btw, who's his Agent?
Make it happen JR.!
Just as of last week, Jets were putting out that Ellis and Harrison were both going to get re-signed. Teams aren't looking to be used to bump salaries. I'm still unsure if Ellis has any interest in moving on. Costello (Jets beat writer) was claiming that both would be brought back on WFAN. This was prior to both the Revis and Cromartie deals though.
Now that Snyder went on spending sprees to grab bigtime free agents and we watched for years as they were the "offseason champs" - many of the fans here seem to want the same - that "offseason champs" title - before a fucking game has been played.
People are clammoring for every bigtime FA to be signed. When the Giants miss out the reactions are absurd - all without knowing what went on behind the scenes.
It's becoming ridiculous. Just settle down a bit and let the experts do their jobs.
As a general rule it's always solid to allow the moves to play out a bit. Let these guys hit the field and we'll see what's what. If they're terrible - fine - have at it. If they work out - fine - have at it.
I'm not sitting here saying these are great moves or terrible moves. I'm just saying - let it play out a bit. Have some faith.
(that said, i'm a bit concerned about the Safety position)
Let it play out a bit..
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(that said, i'm a bit concerned about the Safety position)
Let it play out a bit..
Not sure if you're being a smartass or not. But my main concern stems from the fact that they haven't tangibly addressed the position and the stock is getting very thin.
The other positions have been met with some results - i'm willing to accept these wholeheartedly at this point - and as you said, let it play out.
I hate drafting for need and think it's a recipe for disappointment - particularly when you don't have that veteran stalwart to apprentice the kid. And to see the Giants in a position where they need a 2 or 3 at one of the Safety positions at that point in the process concerns me.
Btw, who's his Agent?
Don't know if still with him, Howard Shatsky
Ellis could start here.
Kenrick Ellis' meeting with #Giants scheduled for this afternoon/evening into tomorrow. He also has other potential visits lined up.
With Dallas and apparently Philly looking to focus on the road and to deal with Seattle's bruising ground game, Ellis or someone like him is a must.
Just to temper expectations a little:
-Might be better suited for a 3-4 nose tackle
-Was essentially handed a starting job for the Jets and lost it to Damon Harrison
-Has been in trouble including jail time in the past
Even with all that in mind, this would be a great signing if it were to happen.
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(that said, i'm a bit concerned about the Safety position)
Let it play out a bit..
Not sure if you're being a smartass or not. But my main concern stems from the fact that they haven't tangibly addressed the position and the stock is getting very thin.
The other positions have been met with some results - i'm willing to accept these wholeheartedly at this point - and as you said, let it play out.
I hate drafting for need and think it's a recipe for disappointment - particularly when you don't have that veteran stalwart to apprentice the kid. And to see the Giants in a position where they need a 2 or 3 at one of the Safety positions at that point in the process concerns me.
Mever a smartass with you..Just Playin'.. Should have put smiley
The advantage right now is they are not behind anyone else and that he is there.
Even if you were I would never hold it against you Fiddy6.
Does pass protection according to the pundits and specializes in catch from the RB spot. Similar to Jennings, which is very good. It will be much more likely that the team can implement a system without injury interruptions. Building the passing route tree from short to long.
Harris - B+
You now need someone to go over the middle, take a beating, and / or receive in the short to medium of the route tree - to help rationalize the offense by making the whole playbook available, helping the #1 and #2 wrs. Helps also with special teams, which is a big need.
Ellis- this I would give a A.
We got run on far too much last season. Having a big DT would also help on draft day, because there is -no way- they will ignore run D as a need. Having a big type DT might even give you a touch more flexibility in what -types- of DE's you draft...a touch, remember, if the big zero player goes down those little mini DE's will not be as effective, once again, aaaaand we do have one mini already in Moore, Demontre. However, with the 'interesting case/type' DE's? this opens that up a smidge.
They don't need to take a couple of hours to show him the complex, and that's a long visit for a 'we want your name, fame, or talent and can give you a bajillion $$$, just sign here'. And he knows their $$$ limits and they know his price, so they are close enough already, just a question of the price.
Arrow up on getting him; they blow this, they blow.
Cruz? Something tells me that is the last thing they want to do with Cruz at this point. I wonder if the Giants still view Cruz's contract the same way they did two years ago.
The advantage right now is they are not behind anyone else and that he is there.
Agreed. If the Giants want him and they and his agent have already agreed on the parameters of a contract, I'd expect him to sign with us. Here's hoping, as we sure need DT help, particularly against the run.
Two things: They have enough money to do this without touching any current contracts. It's not like this guy is a six million a year player.
Secondly, Cruz just signed his deal. With so much money left, the Giants would hurt themselves by 'restructuring' it now.
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That the Giants let a player leave without signing if they really want him.
The advantage right now is they are not behind anyone else and that he is there.
Agreed. If the Giants want him and they and his agent have already agreed on the parameters of a contract, I'd expect him to sign with us. Here's hoping, as we sure need DT help, particularly against the run.
A quality run stopping DT would definitely be an upgrade on the defense.
Second, free agency is better for improving specific spots and roles, and addressing need, than the draft. Draft picks are crapshoots, and you don't know who's going to be available when you draft. Very hard to fill holes. With free agency, you can target guys for specific roles. The Giants need a run stuffer to play alongside Hankins. Ellis can do that. They need to generally upgrade the DT position. Ellis can push Patterson and/or Kuhn down the depth chart, and push one of them all the way off the roster.
Third, since almost all of the guys active on any given game day will play, either on offense, defense, specials or some combination of the three, it's worthwhile to upgrade the backups and special teamers. Get better guys on the field and the team should get better.
Fourth, when a team has gone 7-9 and 6-10 over the last two seasons, it's more than a top veteran away from being a contender. The Giants have a lot of holes to fill. We can blame Reese for that -- Of course; who else would be to blame? -- but the bottom line is that's what they're facing. They have to bring in a bunch of guys to fill holes. So that's what they're doing. That eats up cap space they might otherwise use to sign a star. But there it is.
Second, free agency is better for improving specific spots and roles, and addressing need, than the draft. Draft picks are crapshoots, and you don't know who's going to be available when you draft. Very hard to fill holes. With free agency, you can target guys for specific roles. The Giants need a run stuffer to play alongside Hankins. Ellis can do that. They need to generally upgrade the DT position. Ellis can push Patterson and/or Kuhn down the depth chart, and push one of them all the way off the roster.
Third, since almost all of the guys active on any given game day will play, either on offense, defense, specials or some combination of the three, it's worthwhile to upgrade the backups and special teamers. Get better guys on the field and the team should get better.
Fourth, when a team has gone 7-9 and 6-10 over the last two seasons, it's more than a top veteran away from being a contender. The Giants have a lot of holes to fill. We can blame Reese for that -- Of course; who else would be to blame? -- but the bottom line is that's what they're facing. They have to bring in a bunch of guys to fill holes. So that's what they're doing. That eats up cap space they might otherwise use to sign a star. But there it is.
Great post
To the person who said he was benched for Damon Harrison. That isn't a bad thing. PFF has him as the best run stopping NT in football.
Kenrick Ellis - ( New Window )
A three man rotation of Hankins, Jenkins, and Ellis would be a solid, versatile trio that you can move around and do a few different things with. I hope they can get him.
Many here seem to see an Ellis signing as a potentially very valuable, impact move. And, if it doesn't come to pass....?
His demonstration started with a bottle of water and a bottle of whiskey. He dipped an earthworm into the bottle of whiskey, and the worm shriveled up and died. He dipped another earthworm into the bottle of water and worm kept squirming around unharmed. He asked the class what they learned from this demonstration.
Little Johnny raised his hand and said, "I know, I know!"
The teacher asked Johnny, "Okay what did you learn?"
Little Johnny replied, "If you drink lots of whiskey, you'll never get worms."
Some of you have seen Damon Harrison play. Would you suggest a player at far less than 100% had much of a chance of beating off a challenge from him.
I know - he should have just sucked it up and done the impossible like is done on television and the movies while the inspirational music plays.
scotch
transitive verb \ˈskch\
Definition of SCOTCH
1
archaic : cut, gash, score; also : wound <we have scotched the snake, not killed it Shakespeare>
2
: to put an end to <scotched rumors of a military takeover>
Given what they've signed the other UFAs for, Ellis is probably a $3-4M per year deal.
One advantage a 4/3 should have over a 3/4 is more flexibility in how you deploy the linesmen - all the way across.
What you don't want to do is have an upside player like Hank -always- at the 1, and / or only have -one- player that can play the 1.
they would be in for a heck of a lot of wear and tear.
You can plug a player like Ellis in anywhere in the interior for short stretches, and let him take longer stretches at the 1 and or even the 0, and let Hank go to the 3...and even (hank) take a few reps at the End in certain situations.
or go with a more 0 centered look with Ellis in the middle and Hank and JPP at the "3/4 end" spots with additional 'end players ' of some kind out at the (5?..9?)
You get about 10 snaps a game, body is light on wear and tear, but still plays. With the defensive improvements the Jets made in the secondary, you gotta think a guy like this is thinking to himself, "I'm gonna get a lot of sacks this year, even if I do only get 10 snaps a game."
then
1) put Demontre Moore on the roster as a 'linebacker' (5th defensive linesman here in this case, IR beason or someone) and
2) draft 3 more defensive linesmen, including two somewhat different defensive ends, high
You get about 10 snaps a game, body is light on wear and tear, but still plays. With the defensive improvements the Jets made in the secondary, you gotta think a guy like this is thinking to himself, "I'm gonna get a lot of sacks this year, even if I do only get 10 snaps a game."
Yes, if you're a competitor, you want to start, not play 10 snaps a game.
If you are expecting a really dominant big guy, you may be disappointed. He played more before Harrison got there for sure. Not really sure if that's an indictment of his play, probably more that Harrison is a pretty damn good 3-4 NT.
From my perspective he never really stood out in any games I've seen him play. Basically he did not play "big" for a big guy IMO, he doesn't seem to play with as much power as you would think he should. He can get locked up with one guy and not really beat the one-on-one blocks. That said I have not seen him pushed back on roller skates either, and as a clogging DT next to Hankins, that may really be interesting. There is really not a huge sample size though.
Upside to me is really good, he is HUGE and you hope maybe that he is going to get better/stronger in the right system and more playing time. I can definitely see him starting day one with Hankins, and being a really solid rotational guy on our defensive line, especially against the run.
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would you want to leave?
You get about 10 snaps a game, body is light on wear and tear, but still plays. With the defensive improvements the Jets made in the secondary, you gotta think a guy like this is thinking to himself, "I'm gonna get a lot of sacks this year, even if I do only get 10 snaps a game."
Yes, if you're a competitor, you want to start, not play 10 snaps a game.
Exactly. It's like backup QB being the best job in the game...sure, but these guys are the best of the best, they want in there.
10 snaps a game....cmon now.
On a side note: If a DT could play either, I would think they would rather play in a 4-3. Seems like they'd take more wear and tear at the nose - not that either is an easy lift.
Well, he's a 3 technique guy, so I don't think the signing, if it occurs, takes him out of the running.
But my bet is on an OL right now, unless we sign a starting OG in FA.
You do not sign Ellis for stats. You sign him to routinely occupy 2 OL.
Not bashing JR... Just my thoughts...
Not bashing JR... Just my thoughts...
There's just not many 4-3 prototype DE's which will go that high. Most pass rushers coming out these days seem to be lighter 3-4 OLB types or tweeners. Reese seems intrigued by the idea of a rushing DE/OLB tweener and had drafted a couple of them (Sintim, Tracy) and he also tried to sign Schofield O'Brien so I suppose even the guys more suited to OLB aren't out of the question.
Not bashing JR... Just my thoughts...
BPA vs Need is for the fans to argue. It's likely that when they're on the clock there are 3-4 (or more, depending on the round) guys with comparable grades. So they probably look at these guys (which would all fit the "BPA" mold) and say, which one fits our biggest need or which one fills a premium position? And the answer is the guy they take.
Ellis leaves without a contract.
Ellis had three pepperoni slices and a large coke.
TC had a sicilian and a cream soda
Reese accidentally ordered Chinese food since he's allegedly incompetent
This is my thought as well.. Im trying to look at Gregory more.. I think he is the player that slides a little..
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I agree. Picking that high makes your value positions of QB, LT, DE, CB or WR more likely. We won't go QB, not sure there is a LT in the group worth the 9th pick. That leaves pass rusher, WR or CB. I would go pass rusher. I think one of Ray, Beasley or Gregory will be available. I would prefer Beasley.
This is my thought as well.. Im trying to look at Gregory more.. I think he is the player that slides a little..
Just saw some Gregory highlights. Guy is awful slender. I think it was pro day at Nebraska and there isn't much to him. I'd be wary of a guy that thin.
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In comment 12190404 Rjanyg said:
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I agree. Picking that high makes your value positions of QB, LT, DE, CB or WR more likely. We won't go QB, not sure there is a LT in the group worth the 9th pick. That leaves pass rusher, WR or CB. I would go pass rusher. I think one of Ray, Beasley or Gregory will be available. I would prefer Beasley.
This is my thought as well.. Im trying to look at Gregory more.. I think he is the player that slides a little..
Just saw some Gregory highlights. Guy is awful slender. I think it was pro day at Nebraska and there isn't much to him. I'd be wary of a guy that thin.
He is about 235... He should be able to add 10-15 lbs to his frame.. I am looking at him because he could possibly be there.. Beasley was 225 and is now 246 and just as explosive..
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He is about 235... He should be able to add 10-15 lbs to his frame.. I am looking at him because he could possibly be there.. Beasley was 225 and is now 246 and just as explosive..
So even at 245/250 makes him lighter than D. Moore and people complain that Moore is too light.
Not sure where that 225 for Beasely came from, maybe freshman year stats, but doubtful he put on 20+ lbs in the two months before the combine and was still able to put up those numbers. More likely he was close to that weight last season.