at people saying they wouldnt trade for Durant...this team hasnt won shit and your going to say no to a trade for the 3rd best player in the NBA? You can only pray that a player in this draft is half the player Durant is...
To answer the question why would OKC trade him, it is probably because he told them he is not resigning, same thing Melo did..
Doesnt mean they do not want him anymore, Denver still wanted Melo but he wasnt resigning so they were forced to trade him...
i know his numbers look great from the first game, but it was all jump shots. As i was watching i was like man he is having a great game, but its all long distance shooting and if they werent falling he would be having a horrible game. And thats exactly what happened in the second game. He needs to attack the basket more. A guy like him should dominate inside and out in college and i feel like as the season went on he become more and more of a jump shooter.
i know his numbers look great from the first game, but it was all jump shots. As i was watching i was like man he is having a great game, but its all long distance shooting and if they werent falling he would be having a horrible game. And thats exactly what happened in the second game. He needs to attack the basket more. A guy like him should dominate inside and out in college and i feel like as the season went on he become more and more of a jump shooter.
Yeah my biggest issue with him is he didn't look like he could get past his defender... and that's in college.
i know his numbers look great from the first game, but it was all jump shots. As i was watching i was like man he is having a great game, but its all long distance shooting and if they werent falling he would be having a horrible game. And thats exactly what happened in the second game. He needs to attack the basket more. A guy like him should dominate inside and out in college and i feel like as the season went on he become more and more of a jump shooter.
One thing i noticed he had trouble getting to the rim against a more athletic defender...he is mehtodical in his moves, he is not going to wow you with speed and athleticism, he has great handles but he is not going by a lot of people...
He plays against Westbrook, Irving, Curry, Paul...he is going to be taken to school
saw Wall mentioned in that piece but from what little I've seen of Mudiay his big time athleticism seems less "quicks" and more Marbury style. I remember Marbury once had this sick reverse alley-oop.
he would get hacked and the ref would never call anything becuase he wouldnt flinch...he had a quick first step and a great crossover and once he got into the lane he was a fantastic finisher...one of a few guys to average 20 and 8 for his career up until his last couple of years in the league which brought down his career averages....
Speaking of Marbury, won another Championship in China, i believe thats 3 in 4 years, another former Knick is on that team as well, Randolph Morris.
Mudiay-- discussion of his 2 games back in Chinese playoffs, w. tape
Linked. Mudiay played two games back-to-back in the playoffs, after not playing for most of the season. The write-up suggests that the overall impression was as good as could have been expected for a 19-y.o. playing overseas.
He certainly is more athletic than Russel, albeit a much weaker shooter, at least so far. If that is fixable, he will be outstanding. Link - ( New Window )
To answer the question why would OKC trade him, it is probably because he told them he is not resigning, same thing Melo did..
Doesnt mean they do not want him anymore, Denver still wanted Melo but he wasnt resigning so they were forced to trade him...
Totally totally different scenario. Oklahoma can win a title if everyone is healthy next year. Denver wasn't winning shit so dealing him was a no-brainer. If you are Oklahoma you absolutely take the same shot Cleveland did Lebron's last year hoping a deep title run changes his mind. Sorry big with foot problems? 26 or not I'm not trading a top 3 pick for him. This is the make we have made for almost 2 decades now leaping at the shiny and ignoring the warts.
To answer the question why would OKC trade him, it is probably because he told them he is not resigning, same thing Melo did..
Doesnt mean they do not want him anymore, Denver still wanted Melo but he wasnt resigning so they were forced to trade him...
Totally totally different scenario. Oklahoma can win a title if everyone is healthy next year. Denver wasn't winning shit so dealing him was a no-brainer. If you are Oklahoma you absolutely take the same shot Cleveland did Lebron's last year hoping a deep title run changes his mind. Sorry big with foot problems? 26 or not I'm not trading a top 3 pick for him. This is the make we have made for almost 2 decades now leaping at the shiny and ignoring the warts.
When have the Knicks ever had a chance at a player like Durant? if OKC says ok 1st pick for Durant there is no way in hell you pass that up...
I am sorry Durant just isnt some shiny new toy, we are talking about a player that changes the Knicks for the next 10 years...
He is 30, he is 26 you do not say no to trade for a Durant...
If it leaks that Phil could of traded for Durant and he passed he will be killed for it..
with the crowd about KD's foot. It seems crazy to say that but a foot injury with a guy his size is always problematic. Add that to the fact we have Melo coming off knee surgery... IDK. On the surface it's a no brainer but the long term health of his foot has to be a concern for a team that has made trades for and/or signed injured players in the past (McDyess, Amar'e).
I dont trade the #1 pick for one year of Durant. He'd have to commit to extending. And given the sullen relationship he and Westbrook have with the OKC media, I wouldnt trust him to resign w/o a pre-commitment.
Also, I dont know why anyone is signing up for him give his foot problems. For all we know, his career is effectively in a new, lesser chapter.
Lebron is consistently dinged the past few seasons, Davis is injury prone. Every player has warts. How many superstars are traded somewhere for one year and bolt? Dwight Howard is the only recent example I can come up with and he was an anomaly and DESPISED Kobe (vice versa)
I assume Kevin Love is a goner in Clev unless the situation changes dramatically.
How many superstars have been traded without a commitment to staying for at least 2 seasons? Chris Paul opted in. Melo forced his way to NY specifically. KG was a trade-and-extend. I dont really want to track down the Gasol and Ray Allen trades. What were the other superstar trades of recent vintage?
Re your other point: I dont really want to argue about medical stuff. I assume that this hypothetical trade would be contingent on a physical.
I dont trade the #1 pick for one year of Durant. He'd have to commit to extending. And given the sullen relationship he and Westbrook have with the OKC media, I wouldnt trust him to resign w/o a pre-commitment.
Also, I dont know why anyone is signing up for him give his foot problems. For all we know, his career is effectively in a new, lesser chapter.
Lebron is consistently dinged the past few seasons, Davis is injury prone. Every player has warts. How many superstars are traded somewhere for one year and bolt? Dwight Howard is the only recent example I can come up with and he was an anomaly and DESPISED Kobe (vice versa)
I assume Kevin Love is a goner in Clev unless the situation changes dramatically.
How many superstars have been traded without a commitment to staying for at least 2 seasons? Chris Paul opted in. Melo forced his way to NY specifically. KG was a trade-and-extend. I dont really want to track down the Gasol and Ray Allen trades. What were the other superstar trades of recent vintage?
Re your other point: I dont really want to argue about medical stuff. I assume that this hypothetical trade would be contingent on a physical.
and foot injuries are something you're probably better off staying away from.
You'd probably have to take Durant if they were willing to trade him for the top pick, but chances are it would blow up in our faces somehow. Either by injury or him leaving anyways.
vs. Durant's foot blowing up in our face/him walking after a year and make your decision based on that. I could see a solid argument either way. Me? I'd rather gamble on the top pick + Melo+ a free agent or two
no one worth getting in trade for the pick would be making less than $10 million or so more than the pick, so you are giving up the pick plus $10+ in cap room.
I have said this before but will repeat: That is remarkably risky for the Kicks specifically, because it would only leave room for three quality players. One of those three goes down, and the team is a train wreck again. If they keep the pick, at least they would have 4 players worth having in the starting lineup, and the opportunity to complete the set next year when the cap jumps. There really is a chance that the Knicks will have a very high-quality starting 5, across the board, if they don't trade the pick. Less of a chance if they do.
but Bill Simmons' latest trade value rankings placed Durant 6th.
Davis
LeBron
Curry
Westrbook
Harden
How many other players would you seriously take over Durant for the future?
Even with his foot injury risk, Durant has so much value in this league because of his historic scoring ability.
The Knicks franchise has been screwed by injuries so much so I get why you guys want to play it safe. But in a vacuum, there's no question that Durant still holds more value than the #1 pick in this draft.
All this hypothetical Knicks having a #1 pick talk
Said in some interview that he believed/believes the 2014 Draft was getting overhyped and that he actually thinks this one is stronger both at the top and throughout. Depending on who declares of course.
He also said that it's hard to predict the future but based on the international scene and the HS Seniors that the 2016 class does not look good at all.
as far as the top, I'd rank them like this as prospects
Wiggins
Towns
Okafor
Parker
Russell
Embiid (due to the foot injury... if healthy, he'd be #1)
Exum/Mudiay
I think the top of the draft last year vs. this year is probably a slight edge to this year due to Embiid's injury. But if Embiid was healthy, I don't think there's much of a debate that he was a better prospect than either Towns or Okafor imo. And Wiggins was the kind of special athlete from the wing position we hadn't seen in a while, he would be the likely #1 pick this year as well.
Parker was a stud but I wouldn't have taken him over Towns/Okafor.
I loved Exum last year, but Mudiay's got more explosiveness as an athlete. Tough to compare them with the others since their international guys.
wasnt even drafted last year. Or at least the guy who should win. There is no doubt the best rookie in this year's class is going to snubbed and Wiggins will win.
Payton/Oladipo are both so good. Oladipo is a guy that I just loved and Payton had some really good qualities. I was so happy to see them get to pair up down in Orlando.
In a few years those two are going to be picking apart the Eastern Conference.
He desperately needs a jump shot. But if he develops that, oh boy.
Shame that Orlando chose Aaron Gordon who sucks. Haven't really seen much of him at the NBA level, but I didn't like him at all as a prospect. Someone like Julius Randle would have been such a better pick IMO. I like the idea of Payton, Oladipo, Harris, Randle, and Vucevic a lot more than Aaron Gordon.
Because I saw a stat where when he plays over 30 minutes a game... he is averaging over 22 points and 10 boards a game.
Mirotic has played at a higher level than Wiggins this year. He has been excellent.
Easy to blame Thibbs, and you've definitely seen a lot more Bulls basketball than me. But Mirotic has only had 4 games over 30 minutes before this month. So wouldn't that statistic lead you to believe that Mirotic is just finally hitting his stride into being a consistent contributor as a rookie?
"he's such a good athlete, he'll figure it out somehow" picks. Bigtime hit or miss.
Dep, those types of stats aren't useful. The reason he played 30+ mins in those games is because he was playing well. He's not getting those stats because of the extra minutes. He's getting those extra minutes because of his performance in those games.
Mirotic is having a sick month. But over the course of the season Wiggins has been more impressive.
Orlando is another place I'd love to see WCS. I get a similar vibe from WCS that I got from Oladipo. Defense, toughness, smart, winner. I'd love to see those two anchor a defense together. And he'd really help cover for Vucevic's defense.
has been because Taj Gibson got hurt. When all their bigs have been healthy, Niko was the 4th big. And everyone knows how Thibs likes defense so Taj/Noah were/are his closers. Throw in the year Gasol is having, and minutes were limited to Mirotic.
But once Gibson got hurt. Throw in the injuries to Rose/Butler.... Mirotic's role had no choice but to expand. And he has been flat out awesome. Sure I am a bit of a homer, but I really believe he is an all-star type player. His defense is actually much better than I thought too.
All I hope for is every Bull to come back healthy. Because Mirotic has played a bit of the three this year. So even if he doesnt start, he will get some time at the 3/4 come playoff time.
I understand that Wiggins will win it, but I think Mirotic is going to be a household name soon. Osi also had a good one in Payton, he has really stepped it up.
believe it or not, I am going to support Harden make 1st team all-NBA even though I dont think he will. Its idiotic that htey have 2 guards and 3 bigs make the team.
The 5 best players in the NBA probably have never been more clear in history. Curry, Harden, Westbrook, Lebron, Davis. All 5 of them should be on the first team. But I truly believe it will go like this:
1st team:
Curry, Westbrook, James, Davis, Cousins
2nd team:
Harden, Paul, Griffin, Gasol, Gasol
3rd Team:
Wall, Irving, then I dont have the slightest clue. All the SFs got hurt this year. Maybe Butler can slide in there.
I believe he was 6 months or so removed from knee surgery. And then he came to NY and got hurt over and over again.
To answer the question why would OKC trade him, it is probably because he told them he is not resigning, same thing Melo did..
Doesnt mean they do not want him anymore, Denver still wanted Melo but he wasnt resigning so they were forced to trade him...
Yeah my biggest issue with him is he didn't look like he could get past his defender... and that's in college.
One thing i noticed he had trouble getting to the rim against a more athletic defender...he is mehtodical in his moves, he is not going to wow you with speed and athleticism, he has great handles but he is not going by a lot of people...
He plays against Westbrook, Irving, Curry, Paul...he is going to be taken to school
Speaking of Marbury, won another Championship in China, i believe thats 3 in 4 years, another former Knick is on that team as well, Randolph Morris.
He certainly is more athletic than Russel, albeit a much weaker shooter, at least so far. If that is fixable, he will be outstanding.
Link - ( New Window )
To answer the question why would OKC trade him, it is probably because he told them he is not resigning, same thing Melo did..
Doesnt mean they do not want him anymore, Denver still wanted Melo but he wasnt resigning so they were forced to trade him...
Totally totally different scenario. Oklahoma can win a title if everyone is healthy next year. Denver wasn't winning shit so dealing him was a no-brainer. If you are Oklahoma you absolutely take the same shot Cleveland did Lebron's last year hoping a deep title run changes his mind. Sorry big with foot problems? 26 or not I'm not trading a top 3 pick for him. This is the make we have made for almost 2 decades now leaping at the shiny and ignoring the warts.
Quote:
To answer the question why would OKC trade him, it is probably because he told them he is not resigning, same thing Melo did..
Doesnt mean they do not want him anymore, Denver still wanted Melo but he wasnt resigning so they were forced to trade him...
Totally totally different scenario. Oklahoma can win a title if everyone is healthy next year. Denver wasn't winning shit so dealing him was a no-brainer. If you are Oklahoma you absolutely take the same shot Cleveland did Lebron's last year hoping a deep title run changes his mind. Sorry big with foot problems? 26 or not I'm not trading a top 3 pick for him. This is the make we have made for almost 2 decades now leaping at the shiny and ignoring the warts.
When have the Knicks ever had a chance at a player like Durant? if OKC says ok 1st pick for Durant there is no way in hell you pass that up...
I am sorry Durant just isnt some shiny new toy, we are talking about a player that changes the Knicks for the next 10 years...
He is 30, he is 26 you do not say no to trade for a Durant...
If it leaks that Phil could of traded for Durant and he passed he will be killed for it..
You pair him with Melo and you got makings of a contender and you say no, why? for the hope a 1st pick gets to that level in 5 years?
Quote:
I dont trade the #1 pick for one year of Durant. He'd have to commit to extending. And given the sullen relationship he and Westbrook have with the OKC media, I wouldnt trust him to resign w/o a pre-commitment.
Also, I dont know why anyone is signing up for him give his foot problems. For all we know, his career is effectively in a new, lesser chapter.
Lebron is consistently dinged the past few seasons, Davis is injury prone. Every player has warts. How many superstars are traded somewhere for one year and bolt? Dwight Howard is the only recent example I can come up with and he was an anomaly and DESPISED Kobe (vice versa)
I assume Kevin Love is a goner in Clev unless the situation changes dramatically.
How many superstars have been traded without a commitment to staying for at least 2 seasons? Chris Paul opted in. Melo forced his way to NY specifically. KG was a trade-and-extend. I dont really want to track down the Gasol and Ray Allen trades. What were the other superstar trades of recent vintage?
Re your other point: I dont really want to argue about medical stuff. I assume that this hypothetical trade would be contingent on a physical.
Quote:
In comment 12198582 Deej said:
Quote:
I dont trade the #1 pick for one year of Durant. He'd have to commit to extending. And given the sullen relationship he and Westbrook have with the OKC media, I wouldnt trust him to resign w/o a pre-commitment.
Also, I dont know why anyone is signing up for him give his foot problems. For all we know, his career is effectively in a new, lesser chapter.
Lebron is consistently dinged the past few seasons, Davis is injury prone. Every player has warts. How many superstars are traded somewhere for one year and bolt? Dwight Howard is the only recent example I can come up with and he was an anomaly and DESPISED Kobe (vice versa)
I assume Kevin Love is a goner in Clev unless the situation changes dramatically.
How many superstars have been traded without a commitment to staying for at least 2 seasons? Chris Paul opted in. Melo forced his way to NY specifically. KG was a trade-and-extend. I dont really want to track down the Gasol and Ray Allen trades. What were the other superstar trades of recent vintage?
Re your other point: I dont really want to argue about medical stuff. I assume that this hypothetical trade would be contingent on a physical.
Dwight Howard has to be the most glaring...
You'd probably have to take Durant if they were willing to trade him for the top pick, but chances are it would blow up in our faces somehow. Either by injury or him leaving anyways.
But i dont know i wouldhave trouble passing on that trade...
Sucks that we've reached this point with Durant though. Disgusts me that injuries might take his true potential away from us.
The problem is can you name one big man who had foot injuries that got better over time and not worse?
The problem is can you name one big man who had foot injuries that got better over time and not worse?
Bingo. I'm not sure I would trade the pick for anyone who would reasonably be available anyway.
I have said this before but will repeat: That is remarkably risky for the Kicks specifically, because it would only leave room for three quality players. One of those three goes down, and the team is a train wreck again. If they keep the pick, at least they would have 4 players worth having in the starting lineup, and the opportunity to complete the set next year when the cap jumps. There really is a chance that the Knicks will have a very high-quality starting 5, across the board, if they don't trade the pick. Less of a chance if they do.
The problem is can you name one big man who had foot injuries that got better over time and not worse?
Big Z is the only guy who comes to mind, and that took 4 years. He was also 22 when he got hurt.
Davis
LeBron
Curry
Westrbook
Harden
How many other players would you seriously take over Durant for the future?
Even with his foot injury risk, Durant has so much value in this league because of his historic scoring ability.
The Knicks franchise has been screwed by injuries so much so I get why you guys want to play it safe. But in a vacuum, there's no question that Durant still holds more value than the #1 pick in this draft.
He also said that it's hard to predict the future but based on the international scene and the HS Seniors that the 2016 class does not look good at all.
Towns
Okafor
Parker
Russell
Embiid (due to the foot injury... if healthy, he'd be #1)
Exum/Mudiay
I think the top of the draft last year vs. this year is probably a slight edge to this year due to Embiid's injury. But if Embiid was healthy, I don't think there's much of a debate that he was a better prospect than either Towns or Okafor imo. And Wiggins was the kind of special athlete from the wing position we hadn't seen in a while, he would be the likely #1 pick this year as well.
Parker was a stud but I wouldn't have taken him over Towns/Okafor.
I loved Exum last year, but Mudiay's got more explosiveness as an athlete. Tough to compare them with the others since their international guys.
In a few years those two are going to be picking apart the Eastern Conference.
Shame that Orlando chose Aaron Gordon who sucks. Haven't really seen much of him at the NBA level, but I didn't like him at all as a prospect. Someone like Julius Randle would have been such a better pick IMO. I like the idea of Payton, Oladipo, Harris, Randle, and Vucevic a lot more than Aaron Gordon.
Mirotic has played at a higher level than Wiggins this year. He has been excellent.
Mirotic has played at a higher level than Wiggins this year. He has been excellent.
Easy to blame Thibbs, and you've definitely seen a lot more Bulls basketball than me. But Mirotic has only had 4 games over 30 minutes before this month. So wouldn't that statistic lead you to believe that Mirotic is just finally hitting his stride into being a consistent contributor as a rookie?
Dep, those types of stats aren't useful. The reason he played 30+ mins in those games is because he was playing well. He's not getting those stats because of the extra minutes. He's getting those extra minutes because of his performance in those games.
Mirotic is having a sick month. But over the course of the season Wiggins has been more impressive.
But once Gibson got hurt. Throw in the injuries to Rose/Butler.... Mirotic's role had no choice but to expand. And he has been flat out awesome. Sure I am a bit of a homer, but I really believe he is an all-star type player. His defense is actually much better than I thought too.
All I hope for is every Bull to come back healthy. Because Mirotic has played a bit of the three this year. So even if he doesnt start, he will get some time at the 3/4 come playoff time.
I understand that Wiggins will win it, but I think Mirotic is going to be a household name soon. Osi also had a good one in Payton, he has really stepped it up.
The 5 best players in the NBA probably have never been more clear in history. Curry, Harden, Westbrook, Lebron, Davis. All 5 of them should be on the first team. But I truly believe it will go like this:
1st team:
Curry, Westbrook, James, Davis, Cousins
2nd team:
Harden, Paul, Griffin, Gasol, Gasol
3rd Team:
Wall, Irving, then I dont have the slightest clue. All the SFs got hurt this year. Maybe Butler can slide in there.