Good Offseason Overview Article by Jordan Raanan

but does that mean John Jerry stays starting at G? If so I really need to find a new hobby for fall sundays...

draft is really going to say a lot about how the Giants view their OL.

Reese is going to have the opportunity to take Colllins or Peat in all likelihood. His non OL options will probably include Shelton, Dupree, Goldman, Ray, and Armstead.

It will be interesting to see what he does.

I hope this means they plan on fixing it in the draft.

Who do we have backing up Richburgh if he gets hurt? The lack of quality depth on the line is just as scary as the current holes in this line.

I'm really tired of seeing our QB forced to play with one hand tied behind his back.

sidelined for the entire year with a bad toe, and has a significant injury history prior to coming here. counting on him to be a full time healthy starter is beyond foolish, IMO.

The guys who were in demand are already gone. What's left are the next tier, which presumably a higher draft pick (figure Rds 1-3) could step in and do the job in a similar manner. So why commit to an FA now, when you could wait until you see how the draft shakes out?

Jerry's a back-up who was pressed into service last year..

know who is or is not on the Giants radar in free agency nor the draft.

"There isn't a single player under contract for 2016 at over $4 million that they can't cut ties with, if they so please."

Another 6-10ish season will mean an entirely new look (front office, coaching staff, players) in 2016.

Win now, indeed.

In comment 12210071 Pork Chop said:

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"There isn't a single player under contract for 2016 at over $4 million that they can't cut ties with, if they so please." Another 6-10ish season will mean an entirely new look (front office, coaching staff, players) in 2016. Win now, indeed.

Thanks for pointing that out and all those who think the Giants don't have cap space I hope remember this. The Giants cap position is very healthy b/c very few dollars are tied up. They have the cash to add many and can still blow up the remaining if with very little dead money if this fails.

Jerry Reese knows his job is safe.

that got fired within a decade of being at the helm of 2 World Championships? 2017 will be 10 years.

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A third "new" starter would be nice, but it's not entirely necessary. Coach Tom Coughlin noted the line did a nice job pass protecting last season.

But he sure they're not looking at any other FA OL. Doesn't quite add up but we'll see.

....2015 is Coughlin's last stand for certain and if the front office is allowed to continue with more of the same we're looking at a consistent loser that we haven't seen since the 70's.

In comment 12210046 English Alaister said:

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but does that mean John Jerry stays starting at G? If so I really need to find a new hobby for fall sundays...

Not sure how many times it needs to be said- Jerry was, and still is a backup. He was forced to start.

And for the dopey "We have no depth/ who is ourbackups?"

Depth isn't a real thing. You can't have 5 All-Pro starters, and 5 Pro-Bowl backups.

Enough already.

In comment 12210110 Emlen'sGremlins said:

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....2015 is Coughlin's last stand for certain and if the front office is allowed to continue with more of the same we're looking at a consistent loser that we haven't seen since the 70's.

And her comes the "They were bad in the 70's." schtick...

I'm sure the "Wellington Mara sucks!" can't be far behind.

You have to go back to the dark decade of the 70's.

In comment 12210062 Big Blue '56 said:

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Jerry's a back-up who was pressed into service last year..

It's true Jerry wasn't good last year but he wasn't a backup. He started 32 straight games for the Dolphins before he came to the Giants and was coming off surgery last year. No one has been pushing for another FA OL more than me but he could surprise.

....have been associated with this shit show at the end of their careers.

You old coach potato who would probably start crying if you got bitched slapped, who are you to make judgments in athletes being soft you pussiy?

could you be any more dramatic?

the giants have only had two losing seasons in a row. they were 9-7 in 2012.

knows about soft he hasn't gotten hard in at least a decade

that I was thinking of is the fact that the Giants currently have two lineman on their second contracts, Beatty and Schwartz. They probably feel that it is more effective cap wise to groom another draftee into a starter to save cap space for the near future. Next year there are at least building block three players (Prince, Eli, and JPP with perhaps Randle depending on circumstances) coming up for renewal. After that you should maintain room for Hankins and Pugh second contracts.

Of course you could go with a short-term starter to fill in now but then you still need to invest in a long-term solution in the very near future. So why not do it now...

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And for the dopey "We have no depth/ who is ourbackups?" Depth isn't a real thing. You can't have 5 All-Pro starters, and 5 Pro-Bowl backups.

I don't think you understand what depth means. It doesn't mean 5 pro-bowl backups. It means having guys come off the bench who will not embarrass you.

You are dopey.

round 1 - if a playmaker they like falls, they'll take them (pass rusher, wide receiver, possibly even CB) if not, then their favorite OL (Scherff, Collins, Peat). I'd say it's more likely there's a playmaker they like over the OL available.
"we had _____ rated as 1 of the top 5 guys on our board, think he's just a natural playmaker with rare talents"

round 2 - same as rd 1, though they target an OL, just like Richburg last year (Tomlinson makes a lot of sense in that capacity, and so do Fisher, Flowers, Humphries, Cann, Erving, Clemmings, etc.)
"we had _____ rated right up there with the top OL in the draft, we think he can come in and contribute right away like Richburg"

Obviously round 3+ is impossible to project and very much depends on rounds 1 & 2. But that said, if they haven't picked a potential starting OL by round 3 it likely means they got 2 players they think have a chance of being big time playmakers right away. And they may still have a shot at a rookie contributor like Marpet, D. Williams, etc.

...in the draft for FA. 2011 was mostly Accorsi's draft and FA picks. So I am not optimistic going forward.

you have to think having a healthy RT in Pugh and a more stout C in Richburg will help him tremendously.

If you're not going to watch the Giants because John Jerry is your RG - well - good riddance i guess.

Reese and co obviously feel that last season was an anomaly with regards to the injuries on the offensive line. That unit was the single most injured unit in football. It's a miracle the offense wasn't worse and Eli wasn't hit more often.

Give it time to play out a bit. That said, many signs are pointing to the Giants addressing the OLine at #9.

And the Giants do not address the O line in the draft (as the article suggests as a possibility) then who are our starting guards?

But I think the likelihood of them coming away from the draft with a prospect that's at minimum the level of a Laken Tomlinson (or Richburg as a prospect) is extremely unlikely.

Last year Brandon Linder was picked by JAX in the 3rd round, not a single draft publication had him in the top 100, and he graded out as the top offensive player on their team, starting every game (PFF). Pats picked Bryan Stork in round 4 and he started most of the season, and overall their pass blocking actually graded out worse than ours. I am all for building up a young and talented OL, but I believe they're part of the way there with Pugh, Richburg, Beatty. Schwartz needs to stay healthy and they need to protect themselves by adding another guy who has starter talent, but I'm confident they will.

In comment 12210115 BillT said:

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In comment 12210062 Big Blue '56 said: Quote: Jerry's a back-up who was pressed into service last year.. It's true Jerry wasn't good last year but he wasn't a backup. He started 32 straight games for the Dolphins before he came to the Giants and was coming off surgery last year. No one has been pushing for another FA OL more than me but he could surprise.

Bill, I hear ya..Let me re-phrase: Jerry was brought in last year to be a back-up..

In comment 12210144 Eric on Li said:

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round 1 - if a playmaker they like falls, they'll take them (pass rusher, wide receiver, possibly even CB) if not, then their favorite OL (Scherff, Collins, Peat). I'd say it's more likely there's a playmaker they like over the OL available. "we had _____ rated as 1 of the top 5 guys on our board, think he's just a natural playmaker with rare talents" round 2 - same as rd 1, though they target an OL, just like Richburg last year (Tomlinson makes a lot of sense in that capacity, and so do Fisher, Flowers, Humphries, Cann, Erving, Clemmings, etc.) "we had _____ rated right up there with the top OL in the draft, we think he can come in and contribute right away like Richburg" Obviously round 3+ is impossible to project and very much depends on rounds 1 & 2. But that said, if they haven't picked a potential starting OL by round 3 it likely means they got 2 players they think have a chance of being big time playmakers right away. And they may still have a shot at a rookie contributor like Marpet, D. Williams, etc.

I think you're spot on about Rounds 1 and 2. I can hear JR saying that stuff right now. Worked pretty well for us last year, so why break trend?

Tomlinson is likely a second round pick, so here is the million dollar question: are the Giants better off taking a potential elite offensive line prospect in the first round or selecting a potential elite play maker like Amari Cooper in the first and Tomlinson in round two? I tend to lean toward the second line of thinking for two reasons. First, Tomlinson fills an immediate need on the offensive line and his strengths are the Giants' biggest weaknesses. Second, almost all Super Bowl winning teams aren't perfect everywhere, but are dominant in a couple of areas. Tomlinson makes the offensive line better, and the combination of him and Cooper could make the offense elite. The combined impact of Cooper and Tomlinson is far greater than that of Brandon Scherff and a middle round wide receiver. You could also substitute Cooper for a potential elite pass rusher like Dante Fowler or Vic Beasley, and the same theory would hold true.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 12210141 jbeintherockies said:

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Quote: And for the dopey "We have no depth/ who is ourbackups?" Depth isn't a real thing. You can't have 5 All-Pro starters, and 5 Pro-Bowl backups. I don't think you understand what depth means. It doesn't mean 5 pro-bowl backups. It means having guys come off the bench who will not embarrass you. You are dopey.

No...I understand what depth means. But guys get hurt, and backups are backups for a reason...They aren't consistent, otherwise- They wouldn't be backups.

John Jerry has starting experience. He's a fine backup. Yet, folks want backups that are studs.

Guys need to stay healthy at some point. You think Jerry Reese signs and/or drafts a guy, then plans on him getting hurt???

The "WE HAVE NO DEPTH" people here don't get it. I'm not sure what you expect.

Show me this team with depth. Give me an actual example, instead of bitching and moaning.

In comment 12210239 drkenneth said:

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In comment 12210141 jbeintherockies said: Quote: The "WE HAVE NO DEPTH" people here don't get it. I'm not sure what you expect. Show me this team with depth. Give me an actual example, instead of bitching and moaning.

Go look at the 2007-2010 teams. Competency was coming off the bench. Boothe and Koates were better than anything coming off this bench. Boothe was actually than Jerry is. Teams across the league have competency coming off the bench whereas there is literally nothing coming this Giants bench. I liked Eric Herman coming out of college but he hasn't developed and none of the remaining look good at all.

largely bc we ran an offense with a much higher percentage of short drop/quick throw passes

im hoping for a rebuilt line to help our running game...we had some good games early when Jennings ran wild, but couldnbt consistently control game tempo by running the ball

with Richburg and a healthy Schwartz we could be better at guard...but that assumes our guys stay healthy, which is pretty much guaranteed not to happen...

He was set to be the starter, got hurt, couldn't get back on the field when he got healthy. Something is wrong with this picture. From Penthouse to Outhouse with nothing to explain that I remember reading

In comment 12210062 Big Blue '56 said:

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Jerry's a back-up who was pressed into service last year..

Which considering the injury history with this team, and wouldn't be surprised it continued, means he could likely wind up as starter. hopefully not.

Schwartz will actually stay healthy. He doesn't exactly have a glowing record of health.

While the pass protection is a concern, the run blocking is a bigger one. Trotting out the same group that underachieved last year is risky. Who'd have thought we would miss Kevin Boothe.

Guys get hurt..What do you want to do about that? Believe it or not, luck factors in. Guys like Diehl, O'Hara, Suebert.

I just keep hearing: We need a guy, but if that guy gets hurt, we need a guy....

Guys need to play well and stay healthy. Reese can only control so much.

these injuries hurt us. Age, degradation of talent, and injury impacted our original 5. We missed on draft picks too so that hurt us.

Our OL is the focus and it should be especially since even with the system change, certain Coughlin philosophies, are still observed such as balance. We also seem to want to run the ball in short yardage situations.

I am curious to see what we do in the draft because of this.

we trotted out Richburgh at Center & Schwartz at Guard last year? I must of missed the rich burgh Center stuff and a faint memory of Schwartz playing Guard. What is a 40% change? no big deal I guess

Marpet a Div III Combine star is suddenly a plug and play starter? Ty Sambrailo? Who are these 3rd round OL starters? Tre Jackosn or Cedric Ogbuehi are longhsots to last until #74...

There are no 'starters' available in this range imo. Get the O-lineman we need by #40.

^

Jerry is a starting OG.

If you are all cool with not changing that in the draft then keep taking those happy pills!

In comment 12210058 nicky43 said:

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I hope this means they plan on fixing it in the draft. Who do we have backing up Richburgh if he gets hurt? The lack of quality depth on the line is just as scary as the current holes in this line. I'm really tired of seeing our QB forced to play with one hand tied behind his back.

Jones and they can pick-up a body for camp if he isn't capable. If Schwartz is healthy, Richburg, Pugh and Beatty will also start. They can pick a Guard rd 3 or 4, they obviously kept Herman for a reason, Jerry will probably lose the starter position to either Herman or another acquisition whether it is a rookie or FA. Intriguing thought is the 2nd inexperienced OT we grabbed in FA, Bamiro. If he lives up to his physical attributes, he might play ROT and Pugh moves to LOG! Just saying, it isn't as bad as you are making out!

When Snee retired and Schwartz went down, the middle of the line was very weak. Jerry was not the worst lineman last year. Obviously both Walton and Richburg were overmatched (possibly partly because both were undersized). Pugh didn't play well for most of the year. Hopefully, Pugh was held back by injuries and Richburg plays better than Walton.

Jerry came with a reputation as a solid pass blocker and poor run blocker. That's about the way he played. But don't you think the fact that having Walton and Richburg on one side and Pugh on the other hurt his performance as well? If Jerry starts this year(and I don't think he will unless someone is injured or the Giants fail to pick a starting O-lineman) he will play better because the guys next to him will play better.

gets hijacked with the same fucking crap from the same fucking people. WAHHHH OUR OL SUCKS WAHHHHH REESE WAHHHHHHH!!

Fucking shut up already.

In comment 12210866 djm said:

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gets hijacked with the same fucking crap from the same fucking people. WAHHHH OUR OL SUCKS WAHHHHH REESE WAHHHHHHH!! Fucking shut up already.

Unfortunately for the rest of us, this is their "Serenity Now!" therapy so don't expect them to change anytime soon.

In comment 12210725 English Alaister said:

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Jerry is a starting OG. If you are all cool with not changing that in the draft then keep taking those happy pills!

Does the season start in March? Or, do you want to wait for the draft? Or does that not work for you either?

Stated the giants don't necessarily need an additional OL. That is what my posts made reference to. If that is the case then what we have now is what we see opening day.

Obviously I don't expect that is the case. Clear now Doc?

There really is nothing like BBI to destroy one's faith in the medical profession.