Per Over the Cap, we have 89.5 mil committed to salary, leaving 60.5 mil available on their estimated 150 mil cap.
Sounds great, except.....
we only have 42 players under contract, including 10-15 camp fodder/bottom rung players.
we have 2 defensive ends, with JPP not in the fold.
we have 2 safeties
one entire side of CB depth chart (per BBI) is missing, including Prince.
At least the starters on OL are signed, including Jerry, but only 2 behind them.
At WR we have Odell and Cruz. everyone else are bottom feeders.
No TE on the roster
All set at HB/FB, but Nassib is the QB.
there are 2 draft classes not included yet, so that means a decent chunk of players expected to be on the roster aren't accounted for.
Still,that leaves several high priced players to be signed (JPP, Prince, Eli, Randle/replacement), and a lot of roster spots to be filled.
Are we really rolling in the dough? Or do we have a lot of money and even more paychecks yet to cut?
caveat: I may have missed a few of the expected roster spots. the bottom third of OTC list were a lot of names I didn't recognize.
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Even assuming only 5 of 7 draft picks in each of 2015/2016 make the roster, you're probably only looking at an additional $10-12M in cap space for those 10 players. Which would leave ~$50M for the last 3 roster spots (Eli, JPP, Prince?). Granted there are some other guys they'd like to push off the roster, but they should still have plenty of money to work with.
They need to continue to build the foundation (cheaply) via the draft.
Young talents on the Giants tend to reach their potential more often than not. They will need to be re-signed sooner than later.
They need to continue to build the foundation (cheaply) via the draft.
Yes and no. I assume Eli will be extended at some point, but if they intend to let JPP play 2015 on the franchise tag and then walk, they'll have a ton of extra space to spend on a flashy UFA (or 2) next offseason. Ditto Prince.
Conversely, if they sign JPP to a long term deal, it'll likely lower his 2015 cap hit and if they get some injury luck during the season, they'll probably have a decent chunk of cap carry-over for next offseason to help offset the likely higher 2016 salary for JPP.
Is he that valuable? Could we get a solid DE for $8M per?
Is he that valuable? Could we get a solid DE for $8M per?
Define "solid DE" and then we can at least discuss if two "solid" DEs are equal to JPP + cheaper options.
I don't think JPP is on the Watt/Suh level, but I think he's in the tier of DL players right behind those 2. To me, too much emphasis is on his sack numbers and how he appeared to pad his stats against crappy competition. But, IMO, I think his stat "padding" had as much to do with getting better play from the rest of his line mates (excluding Big Hank who was solid all year). Kiwi was invisible the first 10 games and even if JPP did get pressure, it was far too easy for the QB to simply slide up or to the right in the pocket and avoid him. But once Moore started seeing more snaps and Kennard started providing a rush off the edge, those lanes disappeared and suddenly JPP started generating sacks.
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The 2015 UFAs apparently ate at least $20M in projected cap space for 2016, to demonstrate how quickly the space disappears. NYG will have plenty of money to build the roster, but it's a myth they'll be out in UFA dropping loads on multiple premium positions next Winter.
They need to continue to build the foundation (cheaply) via the draft.
Yes and no. I assume Eli will be extended at some point, but if they intend to let JPP play 2015 on the franchise tag and then walk, they'll have a ton of extra space to spend on a flashy UFA (or 2) next offseason. Ditto Prince.
Conversely, if they sign JPP to a long term deal, it'll likely lower his 2015 cap hit and if they get some injury luck during the season, they'll probably have a decent chunk of cap carry-over for next offseason to help offset the likely higher 2016 salary for JPP.
Sure, but that's a bit different than the assumption of retaining our own and adding multiple big ticket players. Ultimately, the DE will be tough to come by unless it's the draft, as teams tend to not let them go for nothing in return. Etc.
The point is, as I see it, NYG isn't likely to walk into UFA next March with a ton, let's say $30M+ or $40M+, as many were indicating.
They have $60M in projected space now. Let's assume Eli's deal is structured like Big Ben's putting his cap # for the 1st year of the deal (2016) at $17M.
JPP reaches a long term deal prior to the 2015 season structured like Watt's. This lowers his 2015 cap # from ~$15M to ~$5M, but puts his 2016 cap # ~$14M. Let's assume half of the $10M in 2015 cap savings is then realized in carryover. That makes the impact on the 2016 cap due to JPP re-signing $9M.
Prince signs a deal similar to DRC with a $3M cap hit in 2016.
So "new" money towards the 2016 cap from these 3 deals = $17M + $9M + $3M = $29M. That leaves ~$30M in cap space for the Giants next offseason. And outside of those 3 players, they don't have any high priority FAs to re-sign next offseason. So they should be able to make at least 2-3 "splash" moves if they wanted, especially since most big signings have manageable cap hits year 1 (e.g. Suh only counts $6.1M against the 2015 cap).
$30 million for JPP, Eli and Prince will appear less as others are either cut or a Beatty is asked to take a pay cut or Cruz gets a pay cut for not returning to form. With the Cap increasing approx. $10 million it could appear the surplus is only $20 million of that $30 million increase (that is, until other dollars are subtracted and it goes up OVERALL).
I don't think the issue is so much year 1 of contracts (typically), but subsequent years when the salary escalates rapidly. So, sure you could fit in 3 mega contracts in 2016 (say JPP, Eli, Prince) with ease. 2017 is when you start feeling the effect.
Also agree with JonC that IF we can get a couple of decent draft classes, we'll be in good shape. If last year's class doesn't do better than 2012's, not to mention this year's, we're going to continue being mediocre or worse.
Why would you assume Beatty and/or Cruz will be asked to take a pay cut before they even play a down this year?
Assuming they resign Eli, he will be in the first (most cap friendly) year of his contract, so the Giants will have plenty of flexibility to deal with JPP, Prince and/or replacements for same, and still go after a couple of major signings. If they don't resign Eli they will be in full rebuild mode and have plenty of cap space.
In the NFL, if you do sign a star player long term to BIG money (see Cruz) you better hope he produces and stays healthy. So far, that luck didn't meet out for us BUT I'm hoping Cruz does bounce back this year.
Your tag is important if you need it and we did this year for JPP. Eli isn't going anywhere next year and again we have a tag for him if God forbid things play out like that. And if Eli sucks it up and the team folds under TC and SPAGS I suspect a total housecleaning and a new regime may want a new QB, coaches so not having Eli under contract may be a plus.
The cap is in the eye of the beholder and some "luck" of health, me thinsk!
agree. we've had one for a while. we've also supposedly had this kick ass head coach, and a top tier GM. And yet, we've been getting lackluster results for quite a while. So, I agree that if we keep on tanking, some housecleaning is in order. However, a new coach is not going to give a dominant, franchise QB the boot simply because it's a new regime. Maybe if there's a hot prospect riding the pine or in the draft, but not simply because there's a regime change.
Disagree that the cap is a myth. You can play a lot of games with it, but it's a cold hard reality that players you'd like to keep are lost because of it.
Glover : 4/7/2015 10:14 pm : link : reply
franchising JPP. His health is not a sure thing and he would command more than 15 million guaranteed in any deal he would get this season. Let him determine his worth this season, if he stays healthy and dominates, the Giants may have to let him go, or if they don't feel the need to "respect" him in the Giants way, they can franchise him again.
Are the Giants going anywhere this year? No, so you are paying a guy 15M for what? It's like having a new car in front of a run down house....
Then Franchise him for 18M the next season? Insanity......
If a fair deal can't be made, I think you have to trade him......get something....you are not going to get 2 #1's for him....