NFT: 100 year anniversary of the Armenian Genocide

referred to it as a Genocide?

Maybe Reagan?

Turkey gets that indulgence and plenty of others because of its strategic significance. Unfortunate.

Belichick wore on his label a Armenian flag pin.

At least according to Turkey.
Or is it 100 years of convenient memory loss?
Didn't Hitler say who remembers the Armenians
while annihilating 6M Jews?
I guess whoever said if we don't remember history we are doomed to repeat it was right.

On the presidential note, Turkey hasn't been an ally for decades and held the genocide hostage against those bases, and has growingly made our presence there more challenging for our troops.
Obama needs to keep his promise of 2008 to the Armenian voting block, recognize the genocide, and tell Turkey to,,, well, use your imagination.

but you'd rather they be a lukewarm ally than overtly hostile. There are other allies into whose arms we could drive them.

and also a Centenary:
Last night did anyone catch BBC, I think starting 11 PM EDT, which broadcast
a full half hour without any breaks the Centenary memorial service of those who
fell at Gallipoli? Most memorable were the remarks of the New Zealand and Aus-
tralian PMs, who give voice to what matters in the Anglo Saxon and Western
traditions far, far better than anyone in the US can. It was very moving as dawn
broke over the thousands and thousands in attendance, on the very shores of
the Dardanelles where that disastrous campaign unfolded, yet another example
of incompetent execution of strategy by British military leaders, chief among which
was one Winston Churchill, though he had much help. The ANZAC forces, from
half a world away, took particularly heavy casualties in a fight on behalf of their
Commonwealth. It also brought to mind the ever-so-poignant and moving "Breaker
Morant", probably mentioned here before. Turkish governmental and military figures also participated, and reps of all nations laid wreaths at the foot of the memorial wall.

relations, pragmatism almost always overcomes truth.

In comment 12248444 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

but you'd rather they be a lukewarm ally than overtly hostile. There are other allies into whose arms we could drive them.

Yes, Turkey was our ally when we sent them 30 billion dollars in wepaonshipments from 1995-1999. Why? Well the wepaons were used for what the Turkish government itself called "state terror." They were referring to their massive repression against the Kurds. tens of thousnads killed, millions of refuggees entire kurdish villages destroyed.

You people are unbelievable. You act as if Turkey holds power over the US and we must not mention genocide because if we do they will get mad at us.

Turkey has 1/1000th our military budget. We spend more on arms then virtually the rest of the world combined. When you include NATO into that picture it is clear that there is no military threat to the US in the world.

If one actually reads our internal documents as they get realized something very apparent hits you. The word security is virtually never mentioned. Our government polices are not based on security. They are based on the internally stated desire to control the world by force and the threat of force.

There are no Saudi Arabian military bases in new Jersey. No, its our muilitary bases all over world.

Real politik is not about security its about control. 'Hitler wasn't protecting German when he started the second world war. Nor was England protecting England when they imperialized half the world.

Big powers seek to control as much as they can. It is a fact of history. Today, the US is the big power so we are able to control most of it. Though as we see, the blowback against American imperalism is real and its weakening our own country.

The Indians could't fight back so they were destroyed. But yeah, Turkey is so imposing that we cant acknowledge that they comitted a horrible genocide. Oh no they might ally with Russia. Oh no.

Give me a break. All you guys is discuss politics with the slant of rooting for a home football team.

Dunedin, still waiting. You accused me of copy and pasting off of websites. I suggest you either provide evidence or man up and admit your allegation was a simple matter of evading substantive topics of which you are not my peer.

BTW, the New York Times seleteced an online comment I wrote to them as their pick of the day. Its posted on NYT website under steve from ny, in the article about inaccuracy of drones in yesterdays paper.

Beat out about 800 other people.

But yeah, NYT or bbi mob mentality country homerists?

Joke.

You refuse to learn anything beyond what you want to see and think. We have a number of people with real world experience and academic experience in many topics you seem to spout off on. However, you have your mind already made up and are just shouting from the top of the mountain, for what reason? I'm not sure. In my opinion, you seem like a young guy, who lives a very boring life, who tries to find deeper meaning in his own mind about his boring life based on some weird ideology rather than actually doing something about this boring life of yours. Being the loudest town idiot about something you have limited understanding of (whenever anything that gives you an opportunity to see evils in the U.S.) doesn't make you actually right on anything.

Seriously, what's your deal? Are you actually interested in learning something about the world from those who actually have experience in these fields? Or are you just trying to trick yourself into making your ho-hum life seem a bit more exciting as some self-taught international/defense/security expert?

brownstain got published in the Times! Yeah!!!!

.

on behalf of America.
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In comment 12248817 RC02XX said:

Quote:

You refuse to learn anything beyond what you want to see and think. We have a number of people with real world experience and academic experience in many topics you seem to spout off on. However, you have your mind already made up and are just shouting from the top of the mountain, for what reason? I'm not sure. In my opinion, you seem like a young guy, who lives a very boring life, who tries to find deeper meaning in his own mind about his boring life based on some weird ideology rather than actually doing something about this boring life of yours. Being the loudest town idiot about something you have limited understanding of (whenever anything that gives you an opportunity to see evils in the U.S.) doesn't make you actually right on anything. Seriously, what's your deal? Are you actually interested in learning something about the world from those who actually have experience in these fields? Or are you just trying to trick yourself into making your ho-hum life seem a bit more exciting as some self-taught international/defense/security expert?

Honestly, work on that "slap through the screen" button. You'd become a millionaire.

Turkey has much to atone for.

In comment 12248831 yatqb said:

Quote:

.

Not when they're couched on very transparent motives of constantly blaming the great evils, the U.S. and its allies. And when most are based on these "official" documents that he hasn't provided to support his interpretations of events. And when your argument is that your comment was singled out by a NYT or any other newspaper, your aim is more that of being proven right than to actually further a constructive discussion where you learn as much as you teach.

an imperialist nation which has backed demonic dictators throughout the years to support our business interests. Our history in South and Central America needs no documentation from me to illustrate that point.

I recall being a boy in 5th grade who so admired our country and specifically our Constitution and Bill of Rights, the principles I felt made us superior to any other nation. When The Ugly American novel appeared in the late '50s I was shocked and dismayed, since our Nation's principles were seemingly so ideal. Yet, when I began to recognize the type of horrific regimes we propped up in the interests of corporate profits and imperialist influence I felt ashamed...as I feel all of us should if we profess to believe in the ideals our country professes to support.

Are we Americans a people who care merely about our own standards of living, or do we truly believe in "liberty and justice for all" (the American ideal that we purport to want to export throughout the world) and therefore have the moral courage to be repulsed by what I would say are the despicable choices we have made to keep "order" in countries that hold economic potential for us? One can't have it both ways, at least as I see it.

And I wish Barack would say as much, but I understand we gotta keep Turkey happy & saying it's genocide will piss them off.

What do we gain by appeasing Turkey and refusing to acknowledge something horrific?

And what is the cost of not appeasing them?

Have not always backed the right kind of people in the international conflicts. However, that doesn't mean that the U.S. is the root of all evils in the world. The U.S. having had negative and positive impact in the world aren't mutually exclusive. Actually we've done more good for the world than we have done evil to the world, but don't tell that to brownstone and his cliffs notes version of our defense and security policies.

Everyday, decision makers make terribly difficult decisions based on limited and conflicting information in the world of ambiguous politics. To think that the world is so clearly black and white, good and evil is not only being naive but also showing one's lack of understanding and appreciation of the intricacies of the world.

+1
Fucking Civilians.

In comment 12249189 RC02XX said:

Quote:

Have not always backed the right kind of people in the international conflicts. However, that doesn't mean that the U.S. is the root of all evils in the world. The U.S. having had negative and positive impact in the world aren't mutually exclusive. Actually we've done more good for the world than we have done evil to the world, but don't tell that to brownstone and his cliffs notes version of our defense and security policies. Everyday, decision makers make terribly difficult decisions based on limited and conflicting information in the world of ambiguous politics. To think that the world is so clearly black and white, good and evil is not only being naive but also showing one's lack of understanding and appreciation of the intricacies of the world.

Ronnie, I didn't talk about international conflicts. I talked about propping up the most despicable dictatorships for profits.

I'm not in any way saying that every action we've taken internationally has been despicable, but that we've often acted in our country's economic and political self-interest without any consideration of moral imperatives.

as a relic of the cold war but they are not our friend, especially under Erdogan.

Don't have a dog in the fight one way or another.
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the comments.

In comment 12250317 ctc in ftmyers said:

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the comments.

It's a fucking snow job, not really worth watching/reading. It's basically Turkey's official position on the subject. Blaming the Allies is just fucking stupid, their army basically tore up what the Allies had in mind for Anatolia after the war and the Allies didn't have the wherewithal to press the issue. And that's fine, but the fact that the Allies didn't reinitiate hostilities does not make them responsible for what the Turks did and didn't do to the Armenians or to the Greeks after the Armistice.

understand completely.

Got this off of an acquaintances web site who I know through bird dogs and racing pigeons.

Just thought a little out of America input would stress how attitudes runs in the world.