2012 draft grade

and seems to have left the tuba behind.

In comment 12273022 Pitt G-man Dan said:

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In comment 12273018 BSIMatt said: Quote: That's a little over the top. If you are going to quote me and comment on said quote I would appreciate that you don't leave out a key word. "good" second contract

Sorry, I missed the word good.

a bust. After two seasons he was no longer a starter, or an effective contributor to the team. Even in those two seasons, whether it was Coughlin's reluctance to rely on him or whatever, he wasn't established as the primary running back.

It takes plenty of players with talent a few years to turn it on; for a RB example, it took Marshawn Lynch a few years before he became Beast Mode.

But still, outside of a somewhat unknown in Wilson, and Randle, not a good draft.

it takes some players many years to develop, but if they don't contribute as starters after a few years, and are now completely out of the league, regardless of why, then in my book it's a bust.

Play GM for a moment... If you are drafting now, and Wilson is avail in round 1, but through the power of magic you had knowledge that after 2 seasons he would suffer a career ending injury, would you pick him?

got an NFC player of the week and made the pro-bowl as a kick returner. That's not a bust. That's an explosive guy who would have done wonders in the new O, but his neck injury wouldn't allow it. It was bad luck.

Day 3 of the 2012 Draft was especially bad for the Giants, but there's generally more luck than skill involved there anyway. I'm not going to kill anyone for a sixth-round pick who's still in the league - albeit in Oakland - or for a fifth-round pick that was traded out of necessity. (Ironically, that fifth-rounder became George Iloka, a player the Giants could certainly have used last year.) The other three guys - Robinson, Mosley and Kuhn - are still around. IMO, they weren't horrible picks; all have seen their development slowed by injuries, and at this point their ceiling appears to be "quality depth."

Day One looks really weak at this point. Wilson is a partial Mulligan. Randle is maddening. Hosley is a mess. Keep in mind, though: the 2011 Giants won a Super Bowl with a roster that was thin and declining. That left them picking last, when they easily could have picked in the 10-15 range if Miles Austin hadn't lost a ball in the lights. (Romo's throw wasn't actually that bad.) Rueben Randle is pretty good for the 63rd pick. Even the two fourth-rounders are OK, considering they were selected at 127 and 131.

is a great microcosm of the Giants '08 to '13 drafting.

- Some rank bad luck (Wilson)

- when they do hit they don't hit pro-bowl big (Randle)

- a poor premium selection (Hosley)

- inability to find above replacement level starters on day three

- too many skill positions, too few OL

It summarises things nicely.

Maybe you all have different definitions of the word bust but ultimately Wilson did not even come close to living up to the value of the pick. Could he have? Yes. Did he? No. He was the best KR in the league that one year. He showed promise but his fumbles and his injury hampered his career. So, call it what you want but a first round pick should produce more.

I'm glad Wilson called it a career. You see too many athletes hang on too long where it could lead to a horribly painful life after football or even death.

6th rounder who started a few games in Oakland last year which is more than can be said about former Giant Boothe who also was there.

Gonna blame McCants failure with Giants on the coaching staff who couldn't develop him. Same with Brewer and Mosley. Those guys apparently were better than McCants on cut down day but also apparently stagnated and regressed under our coaches.

So maybe it's all not bad drafts. We just got guys who can't coach up the OL.

The rest of the draft, with the exception of Randle, was God-awful. And even Randle has had his share of 'WTF?' moments.

Hosley...Ugh.

It was just a crap year in general. Aside from Luck, Kuechly, Hilton, Jeffrey and Bobby Wagner, there really isn't anything to write home about.

I remember really wanting Cordy Glenn to be a Giant that year.

Same with Randle and Kuhn. The rest - F.

alone a star. He would have be a nice luxury as an outstanding KO returner and maybe a weapon in certain packages. He couldn't block in pass pro, and worse, he couldn't understand the playbook (per his position coach Jerrold Ingram). Cordy Glenn or another OL would have been a better option

Wilson may not be a bust but he was close. He was more athlete and was drafted way too high for a 3rd down back who couldn't block at all.

but if Randle walks after this year that draft is an F.

were hideous. Thankfully the last two in 2013 & 2014 look pretty strong. Now we need this one to be a third straight home run

Wilson was a bust or not because your just being nice based on his career-ending injury.

Maybe he could have "made some hay" in this new offense, but the fact is when he played...Wilson struggled holding onto the ball, pass protecting and played in an offense that didn't fit him. The coaching staff had no confidence in him other than KO returns.

Overall that was an awful draft. I go with a big fat D.

3 was too high for hoseme

wups

Set an all-time record as most successful KR in Giants history.

If he had remained healthy he might have found a bigger role on O. Pretty sure he started the game he got hurt in.

IMO that's enough for the 32nd pick in his rookie year and makes the pick a success.

Chris Borland had a one year career. Success or bust?

1 guy was forced to retire.at the end of this season there might be 0 on the 2016 roster, but to give it a D for now?

But stop with the negative comments about Wilson..He CANNOT be rated in that draft..That's plain stupid imo!

Randle was a good, not great pick..It could be great if he continues what he did last year..Overall, rather bad

The answer is a resounding no. Yes, Wilson was hurt and forced to retire early. Whether you label him a 'bust' or not is not really important. I also think it is ridiculous to say it was a great pick because he could have been a great player. The fact of the matter is he played very little and is now out of the league. In hindsight (which is the purpose of this thread) it was not a pick that helped the Giants improve.

The only guy on that list who became a useful contributor is Randle. I don't see how anyone could say this draft was anything other disappointing. Whether you want to blame JR for Wilson is up to interpretation, but the fact of the matter is the draft itself was poor.

Was a dynamic contributor rookie year, WOULD HAVE BEEN a great player - the offense was still adjusting to his unique skillset. David Wilson was not a straight ahead grind it out back.

If he stayed healthy, there is no doubt in my mind he would be the #1 back heading into this season.

The rest of the draft - Randle could still work out. This season is make-or-break for he and Hosley both. And Kuhn was well worth the late pick.

it is unacceptable

In comment 12273163 Big Blue '56 said:

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But stop with the negative comments about Wilson..He CANNOT be rated in that draft..That's plain stupid imo! Randle was a good, not great pick..It could be great if he continues what he did last year..Overall, rather bad

"I've lost Big Blue '56. I've lost middle America."

I can't thnk of a worse one.

half of us wanted the trenches, in particular a guard, or some, a safety that year.

if you 'had to' grab a 'skills player' it might have been one who had a blocking or pass protecting dimension, such as a TE or a bigger running back.

some, as always, wanted a linebacker.

a small, fast running back was an obvious reversion to form or trend in a bad way from the moment it was made.

I have to remind myself to stop being so positive post draft, but you can see the pre-draft threads from 2012 if you have time and inclination.

I'd guess Randle has performed as well or better than the average player picked at his spot.

Wilson is obviously the biggest swing factor but it's impossible to give him a full evaluation because his career was cut short due to some really shitty luck. However, he was a legit home run threat and elite kick returner. He showed enough promise in the NFL to give Reese the benefit of the doubt, IMO.

The rest of that draft is frightening to look at.

Wilson - F injury or not, the Giants got next to nothing out of a 1st round pick
Randle - B+, solid #2 WR and yes he will get a good contract from someone. My guess is in the $6-8M per year range for 3-4 years.
Hosley - F nagging injuries and horrible when he has played
Robinson - F he's been buried behind mediocre TE talent his entire time here.
Mosley - F unimpressive when he has played and another guy consistently beat out on the depth chart by subpar talent
McCants - F doesn't matter what he's done in Oakland. He produced nothing for the Giants
Kuhn - B+ really only a 4th DT, but factoring in his draft position, that's actually solid value

Not exactly a great draft by the Giants. But not exactly a great draft, period. Any time a team picks last, obviously it won't be a great draft class. But look at the next 5-10 picks drafted right after the Giants in each round. Even with hindsight, could you say they really had an opportunity to do much better?? There was nothing there.

Wilson was bad luck, you can't grade him. 5/7 picks are still on the team. One retired due to injury, the other has started at OT for the Raiders. Even with hindsight, it would hard to improve by redrafting with what was available.

Is that beyond the fist pick, the prior draft was not any better:
Prince Amukamara

Marvin Austin

Jerrel Jernigan

James Brewer

Greg Jones

Tyler Sash

Jacquian Williams

Da'Rel Scott


The good news is that the '13, '14, and '15 drafts were/should be stronger. There is potential for the nucleus of this team to emerge from those drafts, but the jury is still out on many of them. What we need more than anything is for the remaining players from those classes to step up.

before are the evidence that whoever was picking our personnel in the draft and FA did a lousy job. Thought it should have been blamed on Reese and Ross since it falls into their job descriptions, but who knows. The Giants chose not to make any changes (except change coordinators) regardless. So here we are at the bottom of the league.The last two years seemed to be better. We will see what happens this year and hope for the best going forward.

Injuries are unfortunate but they are part of the game.

I give the draft a D because Randle is still suiting up and he will have a BIG year. He was 21 when drafted, as I recall, so he was young and had to learn.

D. Wilson was a great KO returner and had some nice plays as a RB but injuries took him down. His overall production was a C- over 3 years.

TE Robinson has done nothing to date but II honestly believe he will have his "coming out" party in year #4 where he'll catch 50-650-4 as he gets to work the deep middle with some success and his blocking is better than Donnell's. He'll see the field over Fells.

OL Mosley will have one last chance to stick. There is a reason we are weak on the OL and it is due to poor drafting and injuries since 2012. Maybe Mosley, year #4, finally sticks BUT I doubt he sticks as a starter.

So I give the draft a D or even D- should my above positive takes not happen. F's are for when you totally have no starters from a draft.

2013 is looking like a B to me.
2014 came out strong, B+ but could grow into an A if we have starters in OBJ, Richburg, Bromley, Williams, Kennard. A+ is if we get two probowl starters in one draft. I like Richburg's potential to probowl due to his instincts, smarts.

Great post.

Second only behind the steelers rankin, USA today had the following to say after the draft

"2. New York Giants: GM Jerry Reese had five selections in the first four rounds and seemed to masterfully adhere to his penchant for taking the best player while simultaneously addressing need with all five choices. Don't be surprised to see first-round RB David Wilson leave a much bigger footprint in 2012 than Ahmad Bradshaw."

NEW YORK GIANTS: The defending Super Bowl champions, who didn't pick until No. 32, did about all they could have been expected to do: They filled a couple of their biggest needs and added seven players who all have a great chance to make the final roster.

Looking for a running back in the first round to replace the departed Brandon Jacobs and share the load with Ahmad Bradshaw, the Giants took Virginia Tech's productive David Wilson. Their second-round pick, wide receiver Rueben Randle, was projected to go in the first round by many. He is a nice replacement for free-agent loss Mario Manningham.

Of the rest of the picks, the one with the best chance to shine is third- rounder Jayron Hosley. The ex-Virginia Tech cornerback dropped because he failed a drug test at the NFL Scouting Combine. If his off-field problems are in the past, he could be a steal. When you have a championship roster, though, you are afforded the luxury of taking a risk or two.

Champs get even better: The Giants added strong talent by just picking the top player on the board. Adding LSU receiver Rueben Randle with the last pick in the second round gives the Super Bowl champions a great third receiver to put on the field with Hakeem Nicks and Victor Cruz. Jayron Hosley's off-field issues and lack of size (5-10, 178) caused some teams to stay away, but the Virginia Tech corner's feisty playing style and a solid locker room made him worth investing the penultimate Friday night pick

Automatically an F grade.

Kiper also has one other thing to say that I believe is on the mark. "There's a ton of projection left in this draft, but we may look back in a couple years and say it looks a lot better than it does today," he wrote.

I believe that to be correct. Wilson, Rueben Randle and Jayron Hosley all flashed potential and should be much better a couple of seasons down the road. Adrien Robinson never had a chance to contribute, and both Brandon Mosley and markus Kuhn ended up on IR.

The general theory is that it takes three years to accurately assess a draft class. Like Kiper, I believe when we get to that three-year mark with this class it could end up looking like very impressive work by GM Jerry Reese and the Giants' scouting department.

In comment 12273329 Shecky said:

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Kiper also has one other thing to say that I believe is on the mark. "There's a ton of projection left in this draft, but we may look back in a couple years and say it looks a lot better than it does today," he wrote. I believe that to be correct. Wilson, Rueben Randle and Jayron Hosley all flashed potential and should be much better a couple of seasons down the road. Adrien Robinson never had a chance to contribute, and both Brandon Mosley and markus Kuhn ended up on IR. The general theory is that it takes three years to accurately assess a draft class. Like Kiper, I believe when we get to that three-year mark with this class it could end up looking like very impressive work by GM Jerry Reese and the Giants' scouting department.

Say what?

Robinson has had every chance in the world to contribute. He isn't good enough to beat out street free agents and cast offs.

Hosley has just been terrible and evidently is too stupid to know when a drug test is even when told about it ahead of time.

For two reasons:

1) A first rounder should be an immediate contributor, which David Wilson was not.

2) A draft pick, especially a first rounder, should have an impact of more than 1.5 years no matter how many records they set.

Those forgiving it saying that he got hurt are missing the boat IMO. Teams don't go into the draft thinking about how they'll have guys for a year or two. That makes the Wilson pick a bust. Similarly, Borland is a bust of a pick for the 49ers.

Why else do teams across all sports extensively pour over medical records? Doesn't make sense if we consider a good pick a guy that plays a a year and a half and a good special teamer.

Personally I define a bust based on the risk vs reward of the pick. Based on all KNOWN information about a player. Can anyone predict Wilsons injury? Or Borland retiring? Absolutely not. Trading multiple draft years to move up for RGIII a mistake - that's an argument I can understand. Drafting Justin Blackmon, again I can understand that one.

Want to kill Wilson a waste of a pick. A disappointment. Didn't fulfil his promise. Sure. I'd agree. Calling a player a bust for something completely out of anyone's control - I disagree.

In comment 12273399 Shecky said:

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Personally I define a bust based on the risk vs reward of the pick. Based on all KNOWN information about a player. Can anyone predict Wilsons injury? Or Borland retiring? Absolutely not. Trading multiple draft years to move up for RGIII a mistake - that's an argument I can understand. Drafting Justin Blackmon, again I can understand that one. Want to kill Wilson a waste of a pick. A disappointment. Didn't fulfil his promise. Sure. I'd agree. Calling a player a bust for something completely out of anyone's control - I disagree.

I'm sorry, your premise makes little sense. If a bust is a bust based on KNOWN information, how is anyone a bust? How would you judge, say, Ryan Leaf? Or how would you know that guys with first round talent get fat and lazy after the money starts coming in?

Wilson had not proven anything as a RB yet so he was still a ?
Randle has been solid.

The rest was just spectacularly bad.

who have expectations for Jayron Hosely. I wanted this guy to succeed big time, but everytime he steps on the field he is lost.

I think some here are confusing evaluating the draft in hindsight with whether or not to blame Reese and Ross for the picks.

When I look back on a draft, I ask myself "did this draft help build the nucleus of a winner?" Can anyone look at this draft and answer that with a "yes", or even a "sort of?"

Did Reese know Wilson would be hurt and retire early? No, and he had no way to know that. But that doesn't make the draft any better, it just means he is not fully to blame for why it did not yield any key pieces.

In comment 12273115 Mr Brightside said:

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were hideous. Thankfully the last two in 2013 & 2014 look pretty strong. Now we need this one to be a third straight home run

Don't forget about 2010. That was terrible also

Mitch Petrus over Kam Chancellor smfh!!!!!

he was the 32nd pick, which makes him one pick away from a second rounder......

Did we need a RB? Yes.....

But we needed to replenish an aging/injured OL....in the last 7 seasons prior to 2012, we had only drafted one OLman, Beatty...

What good is a RB if there is no one to open holes for him?

While Wilson had speed, the Giants should have known he was not an every down type of back.....that he couldn't retain a playbook? That he was not a good blocker? do you use a 1st round pick on someone like that? Could easily get someone from a later round?

And the fact is, this was a week draft for RB's, and we used a first rounder on one.....in fact, the best RB of the draft was Alfred Morris, who virtually, everyone passed on....

The OL was neglected for too long....

Definitely, 2011 and 2012, were not building blocks for the future...