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Would you have given up either pick 5, 6 or 7 for Collins??

GameFaceRadio : 5/8/2015 11:27 am
If you were the GM of the Giants?? Not if you were Reese and what he would do. Not what T.C. would do.

A simple or no will suffice. Trying to get a beat on what the consensus is here. Feel free to elaborate if you feel the need.

He was my number 1 guy for the Giants regardless if Scherff was on the board or not. Seeing as how our 5th, 6th and 7th picks have sucked for the past five years, I might have traded them all for him.

Point being, I feel the FO had a shot here and missed out. Got to take a chance like Jerrah every now and again. He was not a suspect as the L.A. police said. My feeling is that he annoyed the local authorities by saying, "I'm going to the Combine and I'll talk to y'all later."

The authorities then leaked the story to the press which forced him back to L.A. while, simultaneously, tanking his draft stock.

Just my take. We should have taken the flyer, IMO.
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simple.  
Cam in MO : 5/8/2015 11:29 am : link
...
agreed  
Peter in Atl : 5/8/2015 11:31 am : link
simple
No  
Mike from Ohio : 5/8/2015 11:32 am : link
He said he wouldn't sign and just re-enter the draft next year. No reason to believe that. Ironically their only shot to get him this year was likely not drafting him and hoping for the best as a FA.
Sorry  
Mike from Ohio : 5/8/2015 11:32 am : link
no reason NOT to believe that.
Collins  
shocktheworld : 5/8/2015 11:34 am : link
may have waited for next years draft if he was picked, that is actually the only way he could've done that. That is why teams didn't pull the trigger, plus if he did have a part in the double homicide no one wants that on their head.

With that being said, 1000% percent YES the Giants should've pull the trigger with the 7th rounder, especially now that the fucking Cowboys get a free 1st rounder...
Agreed  
Wuphat : 5/8/2015 11:34 am : link
Simple
no more threads about  
Floyd The Barber : 5/8/2015 11:34 am : link
La'El what woulda,coulda,shoulda do ... I've calmed down, and my love for him has now shifted to hate ... I suggest all those who were in favor of him, do the same ... It makes getting over it, a lot easier ...
ya  
shocktheworld : 5/8/2015 11:34 am : link
What Mike said....haha
Simple.  
BrettNYG10 : 5/8/2015 11:37 am : link
.
he wanted ...  
Floyd The Barber : 5/8/2015 11:38 am : link
to be a Cowboy ... f'ing hate him
RE: no more threads about  
Randy in CT : 5/8/2015 11:38 am : link
In comment 12277401 Floyd The Barber said:
Quote:
La'El what woulda,coulda,shoulda do ... I've calmed down, and my love for him has now shifted to hate ... I suggest all those who were in favor of him, do the same ... It makes getting over it, a lot easier ...
See, Floyd's over it so everyone else calm down!!
Simple but only if I thought he'd end up with the Cowboys  
nicky43 : 5/8/2015 11:39 am : link
and that means SIMPLE because you had to know they would end up with this guy!
I am going to go with "or"  
figgy2989 : 5/8/2015 11:43 am : link
Simple and no just doesn't make sense.
I personally would have taken him in the 7th round instead of Hart.  
Victor in CT : 5/8/2015 11:44 am : link
Hart in all likelihood will struggle to make the roster, so what would be the difference if Collins was unable to report?

I understand why, though, in today's media environment that nobody did.
This Is a No Brainer  
Bernie : 5/8/2015 11:45 am : link
and I said it going into the draft. If NYG liked him as a possible 1st and were comfortable that he truly was not a suspect, then they should use a 7th, even if it was nothing more than to block the competition from getting him. They could deal with the contract issues after the fact.
Simple  
Big Blue '56 : 5/8/2015 11:46 am : link
.
He said  
charlito : 5/8/2015 11:46 am : link
He had his choice of all 32 teams. He chose the Cowgirls. Let it go. Giants will win it's 5th Superbowl this football season. Then everyone who hates Reese will love him again. Can't wait! ....Can't wait!
of course you would  
djm : 5/8/2015 11:46 am : link
if you knew Collins wasn't going to be toxic.

I don't think some of you realize how much shit these owners have to put up with if PR goes south. 32 teams didn't draft this kid.

Dallas simply doesn't give a fuck. They don't care about bad PR or signing low character guys...every other team does, more or less.

and dallas didn't get an extra first rounder  
djm : 5/8/2015 11:48 am : link
Collins was not drafted. He was a highly touted prospect that went undrafted due to legal issues. That's not a first rounder that's a player who dropped. There's a difference.

I totally concur.  
GameFaceRadio : 5/8/2015 11:48 am : link
-Mike Brown-
Sure, but what's the point?  
FranknWeezer : 5/8/2015 11:50 am : link
Aren't there 31 other teams asking themselves the exact same question? Water under the bridge now.
It is unfortunate though  
Mike from Ohio : 5/8/2015 11:50 am : link
that they did miss out on this once-in-a-generation talent. Now Dallas will win the next five superbowls while we (and the other 30 teams not in Dallas) bide our time waiting for the next chance to draft a transformative player like Collins.
I'd give a 7th  
giants#1 : 5/8/2015 11:52 am : link
for you to stop posting
I don't think I would've pulled the trigger.  
j_rud : 5/8/2015 11:55 am : link
Even for a seventh. To me it's not about the pick or dating a woman who was murdered. Saying you will refuse to sign with any team after a certain round says a lot to me. It's like a kid saying he's taking his ball and going home if he doesn't get what he wants. That's not an attitude I would want in the locker room.
RE: I'd give a 7th  
Chris in Philly : 5/8/2015 11:55 am : link
In comment 12277476 giants#1 said:
Quote:
for you to stop posting


Haha...
Haha. "gotta take a chance like Jerry"  
BeerFridge : 5/8/2015 12:00 pm : link
fuck this cowboy fan.
RE: I don't think I would've pulled the trigger.  
giants#1 : 5/8/2015 12:05 pm : link
In comment 12277485 j_rud said:
Quote:
Even for a seventh. To me it's not about the pick or dating a woman who was murdered. Saying you will refuse to sign with any team after a certain round says a lot to me. It's like a kid saying he's taking his ball and going home if he doesn't get what he wants. That's not an attitude I would want in the locker room.


Make no mistake, that decision was all about money. A 4th rounder I believe will get around $2.7M over 4 years with the ability to renegotiate after 3 seasons. An UDFA gets $1.6M over 3 seasons with the ability to renegotiate after 2 years.

If you're a typical 4-7th rounder who's going to be fighting for a roster spot, the extra $1M is likely worth it. For a 1st round talent that likely thinks he can be at worst a long time starter, he wants to hit FA as soon as possible. Even if he becomes nothing more than a "solid" starting OG, he'll easily make up that extra $1M.

And joining the Dallas OL is going to make his job a lot easier which will make him look better.
I would have used the 7th we got from Denver  
Beer Man : 5/8/2015 12:05 pm : link
on him, but that was already spent. Given that no team gambled with a pick. I wonder if the owners all agreed not to pick him. Even Jerry Jones didn't waste a late round pick on him, and he is the dark lord of owners
Yes. They should have used a 7th on him  
KWALL2 : 5/8/2015 12:09 pm : link
After the draft all of the teams (including Giants) were scrambling to get him. I'm amazed one of these teams did not use a late pick on the guy.

If he never plays in the NFL so what. The chances of getting a contributor from round 7 are very low. Giants should have done it.
Yes  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 5/8/2015 12:11 pm : link
I think most people here were hoping they would do so at the time.
RE: he wanted ...  
Johnny Boy : 5/8/2015 12:13 pm : link
In comment 12277420 Floyd The Barber said:
Quote:
to be a Cowboy ... f'ing hate him


Me too...they now have a team full of criminals.
maybe teams actually called his agent  
giants#1 : 5/8/2015 12:14 pm : link
and his agent was adamant that Collins would sit out the year if drafted late. The quickest way for him to make up for the money he lost is to hit FA as soon as possible, which means he needed to go undrafted.
RE: Haha.  
GameFaceRadio : 5/8/2015 12:16 pm : link
In comment 12277491 BeerFridge said:
Quote:
fuck this cowboy fan.


Right, so now im a Cowboys fan because im tired if the Giant 'Boy Scout' philosophy? I want to win games. Plain and simple. I wanted Burfict and Bruce Irvin. I want to win. Period. That makes me a Pukes fan?

Ok. Sure. Idiot.
undrafted means quickest route to more money  
JonC : 5/8/2015 12:17 pm : link
and he picks the team he wants to sign with. Win-win. He doesn't end up playing in BUF or CLE.

Listen, we're talking about a very good OL prospect, but one that might well wind up at OG in the NFL. We're not talking about an elite prospect, and the Giants got one of the two OTs they wanted, one of the very best players in the entire draft on their board.

I think  
YANKEE28 : 5/8/2015 12:22 pm : link
the smartest move would have been to trade down in the 5th to get an extra 7th. There was no risk of not getting Thompson.

With the extra pick in the 7th, you take La'El Collins. (it has cost you absolutely nothing-since you still get Thompson in the 5th and your draft is identical, with the only addition being Collins)

You get Tisch involved. One of his Hollywood buddies gets Collins to do a documentary on the past 2 weeks of his life (especially after a killer is arrested).

Collins is paid for the documentary an amount at least equal to what he lost in signing.
RE: RE: he wanted ...  
GameFaceRadio : 5/8/2015 12:28 pm : link
In comment 12277517 Johnny Boy said:
Quote:
In comment 12277420 Floyd The Barber said:


Quote:


to be a Cowboy ... f'ing hate him



Me too...they now have a team full of criminals.


So now he's a criminal? This thread has now devolved into the typical BBI hypocrisy.
RE: RE: Haha.  
BeerFridge : 5/8/2015 12:28 pm : link
In comment 12277525 GameFaceRadio said:
Quote:
In comment 12277491 BeerFridge said:


Quote:


fuck this cowboy fan.



Right, so now im a Cowboys fan because im tired if the Giant 'Boy Scout' philosophy? I want to win games. Plain and simple. I wanted Burfict and Bruce Irvin. I want to win. Period. That makes me a Pukes fan?

Ok. Sure. Idiot.


The entire league passed on Burfict in the draft. So, yeah, you're a super genius for nailing that one. One in a row! And I have no idea what you're on about with Bruce Irvin who was drafted something like 20 picks before the Giants picked.

There's no way to know whether Collins would have re-entered the draft. He had that leverage if a team spent the pick. He had to play if they didn't. All the teams passed on him. That's because it's not baseball where you can spend your bonus pool signing other guys if one decides not to sign.

And Jerrah hasn't won shit. Jerry has.
NGT! This has nothing to with Jints football!  
213374 : 5/8/2015 12:28 pm : link
.
RE: I think  
GameFaceRadio : 5/8/2015 12:31 pm : link
In comment 12277541 YANKEE28 said:
Quote:
the smartest move would have been to trade down in the 5th to get an extra 7th. There was no risk of not getting Thompson.

With the extra pick in the 7th, you take La'El Collins. (it has cost you absolutely nothing-since you still get Thompson in the 5th and your draft is identical, with the only addition being Collins)

You get Tisch involved. One of his Hollywood buddies gets Collins to do a documentary on the past 2 weeks of his life (especially after a killer is arrested).

Collins is paid for the documentary an amount at least equal to what he lost in signing.


Or Davis. Exactly. Something creative an outside the box rather than the standard ' get the good guy, team captain' rhetoric.

We haven't seen the playoff in 4 years. Time to change the MO.
RE: RE: RE: Haha.  
GameFaceRadio : 5/8/2015 12:33 pm : link
In comment 12277552 BeerFridge said:
Quote:
In comment 12277525 GameFaceRadio said:


Quote:


In comment 12277491 BeerFridge said:


Quote:


fuck this cowboy fan.



Right, so now im a Cowboys fan because im tired if the Giant 'Boy Scout' philosophy? I want to win games. Plain and simple. I wanted Burfict and Bruce Irvin. I want to win. Period. That makes me a Pukes fan?

Ok. Sure. Idiot.



The entire league passed on Burfict in the draft. So, yeah, you're a super genius for nailing that one. One in a row! And I have no idea what you're on about with Bruce Irvin who was drafted something like 20 picks before the Giants picked.

There's no way to know whether Collins would have re-entered the draft. He had that leverage if a team spent the pick. He had to play if they didn't. All the teams passed on him. That's because it's not baseball where you can spend your bonus pool signing other guys if one decides not to sign.

And Jerrah hasn't won shit. Jerry has.


So because the league passed, I missed?? Ok......
Jerrah hasn't won shit. Jerry has.  
GameFaceRadio : 5/8/2015 12:36 pm : link
Ummmm, WTF are you talking bout, Willis?
Interesting, original topic...  
Britt in VA : 5/8/2015 12:38 pm : link
Can't believe nobody has brought this up yet.
RE: Jerrah hasn't won shit. Jerry has.  
BeerFridge : 5/8/2015 12:42 pm : link
In comment 12277569 GameFaceRadio said:
Quote:
Ummmm, WTF are you talking bout, Willis?


The sum total of the last twenty years or so years as GM is one playoff win against the Lions. Jerry is a two time Super Bowl champ in half the time
Did the Giants try to sign him as a FA?  
KWALL2 : 5/8/2015 12:46 pm : link
If they did there really is no excuse for not using a late round pick on the player.

That is true for every team as they are kicking themselves in the ass right now while Dallas added a first round player to their team.
And if they used a 7th round draft pick  
Mike from Ohio : 5/8/2015 12:51 pm : link
and Collins decided not to play and re-enter the draft, there would be just as many threads about "why not wait until FA and then just sign him? they gave him a pass to sit out!"

If he had decided to sign with the Giants the front office would be lauded. All 32 teams rolled the dice on this kid and they all came up craps, except the Cowboys. Nobody messed this up.
Mike  
JonC : 5/8/2015 12:59 pm : link
well said.
....  
BrettNYG10 : 5/8/2015 1:06 pm : link
Mike, I thought it would be worth the risk. It seemed obvious that Collins' team mishandled things (understandable given the unprecedented situation) and that he didn't really know what to do. I fully support the team taking on certain risks - including when they draft guys who have fallen due to injury concerns. If he walked after being a 7th round pick, so be it - but I doubt he'd follow through on that threat. It was a smart risk to take, IMO.

Perhaps Goodell said not to draft him behind closed doors. I'll never know. But my criticisms here are applicable to all teams. I'm over it - hopefully our line's good enough this year!
I find myself agreeing with Mike from Ohio  
gidiefor : Mod : 5/8/2015 1:14 pm : link
very lucid
RE: ....  
giants#1 : 5/8/2015 1:16 pm : link
In comment 12277618 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
Mike, I thought it would be worth the risk. It seemed obvious that Collins' team mishandled things (understandable given the unprecedented situation) and that he didn't really know what to do. I fully support the team taking on certain risks - including when they draft guys who have fallen due to injury concerns. If he walked after being a 7th round pick, so be it - but I doubt he'd follow through on that threat. It was a smart risk to take, IMO.

Perhaps Goodell said not to draft him behind closed doors. I'll never know. But my criticisms here are applicable to all teams. I'm over it - hopefully our line's good enough this year!


Did they really mishandle things though? Unless he's a total bust, he'll make more money this way then if he was drafted even in the 4th round, let alone the 7th. Hart is tied up for an extra season and only received an additional $700k.

Hell, John Jerry just signed a 2 year, $3.3M deal. So all Collins has to do is perform as well as Jerry and he comes out ahead as a UDFA compared to a 4th-7th round pick.

I'd argue his agent knew exactly what he was doing when he threatened to sit a year if Collins was drafted Day 3.
....  
BrettNYG10 : 5/8/2015 1:18 pm : link
Fair point, giants.

My 'mishandling' comment assumes that he wanted to be drafted - I guess if you fall out of the second or third round the alternative of having your pick of teams to go to could be preferable for a prospect of his caliber. Perhaps if his camp didn't make so much noise he would have been drafted in the fourth or fifth?
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