Will life in prison do this either? Not a fan of him getting the death penalty but there has to be a better argument than it doesn't change what happened or will happen in the future.
The death penalty accomplishes nothing and wastes time and money in the courts. Life in Supermax would've been a more appropriate punishment. Let him think about what he did for the next ~60 years instead of giving him a quick escape.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
RE: its understandable to not want capital punishment Â
but he needs to answer for his crimes against his fellow man even if he's sorry. Him and his brother carried out a mass casualty surprise attack.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was. All for free of course, he could sleep in a box and eat gruel with an RTLS based poison injector on his leg should he stray too far. Then he can decide when he dies.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was. All for free of course, he could sleep in a box and eat gruel with an RTLS based poison injector on his leg should he stray too far. Then he can decide when he dies.
I wouldn't want him touching me, if I were a patient.
the way 8 year old Martin Richard succombed to his injuries. Along with seeing a pic of his body which had been torn apart, and shown his bloody tattered clothing in court. He was targeted by this guy for being that young, as well.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Once he's executed, there is zero risk of him: 1) escaping and commiting more crimes or 2) his release being used as a bargaining chip to exchange for some TBD reason. I couldn't care less if it deters anyone else.
Too bad it isn't happening in a several weeks rather than in several years.
RE: RE: its understandable to not want capital punishment Â
but he needs to answer for his crimes against his fellow man even if he's sorry. Him and his brother carried out a mass casualty surprise attack.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was. All for free of course, he could sleep in a box and eat gruel with an RTLS based poison injector on his leg should he stray too far. Then he can decide when he dies.
What's the point? We are trying to reform someone who did something like this? He's a grown man, he knows whats right and wrong. They deliberately wanted to kill/maim as many people as possible. Even if he's reformed, he needs to answer for what he did.
unless he asks for his body to be cremated. (Yes, I realize his brother wasn't convicted of anything, but in general I don't think fantastically notorious criminals have been denied burial in this country).
with the death penalty as long as it's 100% proven.
Even 1 incorrectly executed person is too many.
But cases like this and the Cheshire home invasion, and Oklahoma City, the only regret I have is the victims families are not the ones to conduct the execution.
but oddly enough I believe every victim's family members from the Boston bombing and the victims who survived all (I believe 100%) supported life vs death.
So, while we who support the death penalty in this case all have our reasons it doesn't seem that the victims or family of the victims view death as justice.
but in this case, I agree with the notion that life in prison would've been worse.
23 hours a day in solitary confinement for the next 60 years? If I'm him, I'm taking 5-10 years on death row and a swift execution (and made out a martyr) in a heartbeat. Not to mention the family of the youngest victim requested life for him as to not drag out the process.
In spite of all that, he's getting what he ultimately deserves, which is the end of his natural life.
So, while we who support the death penalty in this case all have our reasons it doesn't seem that the victims or family of the victims view death as justice.
While that's true, there's nothing which can be done to him which would truly be justice.
Over.
likely closer to 75 years.
Appeal, then a seroies of last minute appeals heard/heard-denied, then a governmental stay, in-between will be all the public protests on his behalf,including, if they are still in business after the UVA lawsuit, the Rolling Stone mag having him on their hot 100 or something, etc.
Isn't the average about 18 years on 'death row'?
Although I'd be happy if it was tonight at midnight.
that had he stayed on the course he was on he would be graduating 40 miles from where he is today as I type this. Today is Umass-Dartmouth grad ceremony.
RE: I was just reading how the Jurors sobbed when they were told... Â
the way 8 year old Martin Richard succombed to his injuries. Along with seeing a pic of his body which had been torn apart, and shown his bloody tattered clothing in court. He was targeted by this guy for being that young, as well.
They can't kill him fast enough for me.
Yup, why should this POS be allowed to live when his victims are dead?
So, while we who support the death penalty in this case all have our reasons it doesn't seem that the victims or family of the victims view death as justice.
While that's true, there's nothing which can be done to him which would truly be justice.
I'm not sure, you might be right, but that's for the families of the victims and surviving victims to decide. Isn't it? Maybe they viewed life in prison as justice.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
I saw an interview with one of the survivors who only said something like "I'm not losing any sleep if he gets the death penalty" so I'm not sure it's 100% opposed.
Muslims in there will make him a hero. We don't do justice anymore. There is zero room for any appeals but the scum bag lawyers will milk this case for years. No question of guilt. No question of intent. This won't deter other scum I know but he doesn't deserve one more day of air.
Almost 4 years to the day of his conviction. (rot in hell).
Dead in under 5...and while I oppose the death penalty for its errors and application, have no issues here. Though having him lose his mind doing 60 years in Florence had some appeal as well.
To be forgotten on this thread is this fk handed out a death sentence and carried it out the same day...ON THE VICTIMS! They should throw his ass in pig shit before they stick the needle in.
Yes, I get it, he killed innocents - something he is far from. One some level he certainly deserves to die, and maybe worse than that, deserves to be tortured and severely punished before being killed. There is a certain logic and feeling of "justice" to that which I get....I really do.
But I do feel that we as a society should be above that....and there's little doubt based on history that we'll look back on the death penalty as the barbaric practice that it is - like so much of the world does already.
seems the most appropriate method of carrying out the sentence Â
who wished he was going to Supermax in Florence, Colorado.
It's not that I don't agree he deserves to die (he does). For me it just seems too easy for him. He is young, on average he's got roughly 60 years to go. That is a long time to be completely isolated from society, looking out of a 12 inch slit in a window. It's torture by isolation, which would surely break this little pu$$y.
I saw an interview with one of the survivors who only said something like "I'm not losing any sleep if he gets the death penalty" so I'm not sure it's 100% opposed.
I'm sure you're right, I was listening to interviews with Richards' father and the other deceased victims families.
Again, not my views, but just what I heard in interviews with the survivors. So maybe not 100%
Most of the time I respect the victims right to privacy and don't even want to know, but the Richards were public in their opposition and they felt like they wanted the memory/legacy of their son to be one of mercy and not death/vengeance (my paraphrasing).
RE: seems the most appropriate method of carrying out the sentence Â
Life in a Supermax prison is worse than the death penalty. Put him in the general population or solitary. It doesn't matter. Fucker will be miserable and lucky if he lasts for another 65 years or more like that.
No chance of parole. No Senior Week. No prom. No family life. Just life as a piece of shit in jail.
was in prison 6 or 7 years before being put to death, why do you think this guy won't be executed? Massachusetts? More High profile?
I think he'll eventually be put to death.
Why should it take 6 to 7 years. That's the issue. Some guys wait 20. If there's reason for appeal fone but what the fuck took 7 years for McVeigh? Heck he decided not to fight it or it could have gone on for twice that easily
What if the execution was carried out within six months or a year? All appeals exhausted, execution was just and proper, but not years down the line...
He won't grow old(er) in jail and the punishment is basically immediate. Would this be a harsher penalty than 60+ years in the hole?
21 year old executed vs 80 year old dying of natural causes maybe
the next time I would like to hear his name is when they announce his death. No Charles Manson cult following news. Just that he has been executed, he does not deserve 1 more minute of our time
Yes, I get it, he killed innocents - something he is far from. One some level he certainly deserves to die, and maybe worse than that, deserves to be tortured and severely punished before being killed. There is a certain logic and feeling of "justice" to that which I get....I really do.
But I do feel that we as a society should be above that....and there's little doubt based on history that we'll look back on the death penalty as the barbaric practice that it is - like so much of the world does already.
The difference is that he was given every right under the law and received a fair trial with a good defense. That is how we are above it.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Same.
It’s been much the same here. I think the turning point for me was when faced with the hypothetical ‘Would I be willing to be the one to throw the switch?’. And I’m not willing, and therefore in good conscience I can’t expect someone else to do it.
RE: McVeigh was executed more quickly because he consented to die Â
He fired his lawyers and withdrew his opposition to his execution. He wanted to become a martyr.
He was a fucking idiot in every way. Romanticized his crime and his death. Fucking baby-murdering loser.
I just used him as an example, maybe a poor one, but I can't think of any high profile death sentences that were simply rubber stamped while the perp lived out their life on death row.
average is 15 years and that's probably what this POS will serve before being executed.
Yes, I get it, he killed innocents - something he is far from. One some level he certainly deserves to die, and maybe worse than that, deserves to be tortured and severely punished before being killed. There is a certain logic and feeling of "justice" to that which I get....I really do.
But I do feel that we as a society should be above that....and there's little doubt based on history that we'll look back on the death penalty as the barbaric practice that it is - like so much of the world does already.
The difference is that he was given every right under the law and received a fair trial with a good defense. That is how we are above it.
Well said buford, and I agree. Still, I can't shake the idea that we are making a decision to terminate someone's life. He deserves it, I'm just not sure that shouldn't be above our pay grade.
but he needs to answer for his crimes against his fellow man even if he's sorry. Him and his brother carried out a mass casualty surprise attack.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was. All for free of course, he could sleep in a box and eat gruel with an RTLS based poison injector on his leg should he stray too far. Then he can decide when he dies.
What's the point? We are trying to reform someone who did something like this? He's a grown man, he knows whats right and wrong. They deliberately wanted to kill/maim as many people as possible. Even if he's reformed, he needs to answer for what he did.
Putting him in supermax for life isn't about reform. It's punishment, and perhaps the worst punishment that can be levied. Given the choice between supermax with no possibility of parole and death, I'd opt for death.
That's simply argument by cliche. McVeigh died, there was no orgy of violence in the wake of his execution. You don't think that Tsarnaev's survival, if he clung to jihadism, could not have inspired others just as readily as his execution might? I have moral and practical qualms about the death penalty, but pidgen Gandhi isn't really among them.
We can't even get the death penalty right with unlimited times for appeals. We still fuck it up. We have no business imposing the death penalty period. Not executing people makes us a civilized society. It makes us better than the murderers we punish.
Life in prison is a terrible punishment. It sucks. And the Supermax Federal Prisons are beyond secure. They're so secure the prisoners go insane from the isolation.
The only reason why people want to kill this guy is vengeance, and that is an immoral rationalization.
There are ethical and even rational arguments in favor of the DP... Â
for instance, once executed an inmate can no longer be the subject of lawsuits championed by idealistic attorneys convinced that the isolation you highlight is cruel and unusual punishment and that Mr. Tsarnaev should count among his constitutional rights the ability to communicate to his adoring fans his hateful message.
There's nothing ethical about foreclosing law suits Â
to seek to stop inhumane treatment of captive prisoners. Sorry to have frustrated your lust for blood, but you're not making any sense now.
The rest of the Western civilization has figured out that the death penalty is barbaric. We only underscore our own brutality and lack of civilization by continuing to impose it.
RE: There are ethical and even rational arguments in favor of the DP... Â
for instance, once executed an inmate can no longer be the subject of lawsuits championed by idealistic attorneys convinced that the isolation you highlight is cruel and unusual punishment and that Mr. Tsarnaev should count among his constitutional rights the ability to communicate to his adoring fans his hateful message.
Nice post.
RE: There's nothing ethical about foreclosing law suits Â
to seek to stop inhumane treatment of captive prisoners. Sorry to have frustrated your lust for blood, but you're not making any sense now.
The rest of the Western civilization has figured out that the death penalty is barbaric. We only underscore our own brutality and lack of civilization by continuing to impose it.
While my post was tongue in cheek, there are plenty of people in this country who are loathe to take their cues as to what is or isn't barbaric from the tastes of a vocal strata of northeast liberals.
For instance, Virginia's threshold for grand larceny... Â
is $200. That is absurdly low. Everyone acknowledges it is absurdly low. But the delegates from various corners of God's Country refuse to be browbeaten into raising it to something rational by the slings and arrows of legal academics.
RE: glowrider -- How about we deal with the question in reality? Â
We can't even get the death penalty right with unlimited times for appeals. We still fuck it up. We have no business imposing the death penalty period. Not executing people makes us a civilized society. It makes us better than the murderers we punish.
Life in prison is a terrible punishment. It sucks. And the Supermax Federal Prisons are beyond secure. They're so secure the prisoners go insane from the isolation.
The only reason why people want to kill this guy is vengeance, and that is an immoral rationalization.
One could argue life in prison is just as vengeful (or more) than execution.
We could do an experiment though and know for sure. Put him in supermax and give him a razor blade or a rope. See what he chooses.. Maybe it's the only way to know?
I'm just not sure as a practical matter that the DP has much of a deterrent effect AS APPLIED. Public executions, near in time to convictions, arguably forced would-be criminals to confront the possible consequence of their actions. Sanitized, sterile, largely private executions intuitively fail to provide that example. There are a variety of reasons that we should not undertake executions in this manner, but without them "deterrence" as a factor is more imagined than real.
I'm 47 I spent a long time grappling with the morality Â
of the death penalty. About 10-15 years ago I decided I just couldn't endorse it for a few reasons.
1. I don't feel it's humane for our society to put people to death in this manner. What makes us better than the criminal?
2. Too many mistakes are made. With DNA proving all the time these days that innocent people were incarcerated I just can't accept the possibility that we are putting prisoners to death by accident. If you mistakenly convict someone and throw them into jail you can always let them out. You can't however bring them back from the dead.
I fully understand that there are those that disagree with me. I just don't feel you make exceptions. Sure this guy is a heinous criminal who appears to show not one drop of remorse. I'm perfectly fine letting him rot away in prison hopefully ignored by the media(I know fat chance).
Breakfast, lunch and dinner of Olive Garden food.... Â
We can't even get the death penalty right with unlimited times for appeals. We still fuck it up. We have no business imposing the death penalty period. Not executing people makes us a civilized society. It makes us better than the murderers we punish.
Life in prison is a terrible punishment. It sucks. And the Supermax Federal Prisons are beyond secure. They're so secure the prisoners go insane from the isolation.
The only reason why people want to kill this guy is vengeance, and that is an immoral rationalization.
Isn't a lifetime of torture MUCH worse than a quick, painless execution? Serious question.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
Same here, until I read a piece many years ago in which two psychiatrists interviewed a whole number of death row inmates and found that 99% of them had severe brain injuries from birth, from a fall, if dropped as a baby, and a whole other list of head traumas. Many of these injuries were to the parts of the brain that governed impulse control, emotional reactions, etc.
Add to that prosecutorial malfeasance, where highly ambitious D.A.'s are willing to cut evidence corners and, in many cases that we're discovering almost weekly, fabricate evidence. Plus bad police work and just plain bad, unconscionable detectives.
With all that, I can't in good conscience be in favor of the death penalty.
But I'm torn about these kind of murders, influenced as they seem to be by radical religionists. Is zealotry a mental disorder? Just don't know. I DO know that, to me, there is little, if any, moral repugnance to plain, unadulterated vengeance.
RE: RE: its understandable to not want capital punishment Â
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was.
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
Add to that prosecutorial malfeasance, where highly ambitious D.A.'s are willing to cut evidence corners and, in many cases that we're discovering almost weekly, fabricate evidence. Plus bad police work and just plain bad, unconscionable detectives.
This is more perception than reality. The DNA exoneration phenomenon is petering out and so the recent "exonerees" have been more about eyewitnesses (usually coconspirators) recanting, generally when they are beyond the reach of the law. For instance, if you turned on your buddies to spare yourself the DP and are now doing life, what incentive do you now have to stick to your prior story? There was one such celebrated case in Virginia a couple years ago involving a Brady nondisclosure (one that the prosecutor seems not to have known about) and a recanting witness, but none of that diminishes the fact that the evidence against the man who was freed was still quite damning even without them.
I get your point. And I don't know the stats for, say, prosecutorial and police misconduct in a potential death penalty trial.
My larger point, though, is the damage in the brains of many death row inmates. I'm not talking about neurotic or psychopathic behavior (although that can often be caused by long term brain damage) but to actual damage to the inmates brain that could have been caused by many things from bad birth, to fetal alcohol/drug syndrome, and all sorts of head trauma throughout a life.
I can't see executing people like this for a crime, although on another level, it could be argued that execution might be more merciful than a life with the burden of those injuries.
Despite my new found concern about death penalties, as for the Boston bastid, wipe him out. His was a political, military crime. He's no different from a soldier on the field of battle whom you would righteously shoot in the head if he were firing at you. Killing him would be, in my opinion, righteous.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was.
I like this.
I personally don't know how this will make him learn that what he did was wrong. Do you honestly think that having to see a munch of maimed/wounded service members from conflicts in ME will somehow make him realize how his deeds were inhumane and wrong when he didn't show remorse for killing and wounding innocent civilians? I mean the whole motive behind the attack in the first place was to payback the U.S. for its role in the conflicts against Muslims as he perceived them.
Having him work at a VA hospital will be like giving him his jihad porn each and every day. I'm sure he has nothing but contempt for those recuperating at any VA hospitals and will relish his daily views of the suffering.
You take away someone's life, everything they have and will ever have, you should forfeit the same. In a case like this, I believe in the punishment for punishment's sake. He had his due process, which is a hell of a lot more than he afforded his victims. Now let him pay with his life.
Certain types of criminals enjoy a level of celebrity behind bars. I don't think Dzoey will qualify. I would actually love to see him spend the rest of his life looking over his shoulder wondering which one of his fellow inmates was going to shiv him in the kidneys.
A death sentence will allow him to spend 10-15 in relative security and comfort, perhaps much longer than he would last in the general population. Think Jeffery Dahmer.
He could opt for protective custody but I beleive many who select that option change their minds fairly quickly for whatever reasons (mostly sheer boredom).
Will never happen.
We'll certainly miss out on all his contributions to society by seeing him go so early.
Will life in prison do this either? Not a fan of him getting the death penalty but there has to be a better argument than it doesn't change what happened or will happen in the future.
They'll probably appeal on denial in change of venue. Maybe argue the strategy to admit guilt was outrageously flawed?
Will he bother appealing beyond what's mandatory? He's looking for martyrdom...
I think he'll eventually be put to death.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was. All for free of course, he could sleep in a box and eat gruel with an RTLS based poison injector on his leg should he stray too far. Then he can decide when he dies.
I wouldn't want him touching me, if I were a patient.
They can't kill him fast enough for me.
Quote:
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Same.
Quote:
In comment 12288298 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Same.
Third.
Gravesites of martyrs a pilgrimage destination.
Too bad it isn't happening in a several weeks rather than in several years.
Quote:
but he needs to answer for his crimes against his fellow man even if he's sorry. Him and his brother carried out a mass casualty surprise attack.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was. All for free of course, he could sleep in a box and eat gruel with an RTLS based poison injector on his leg should he stray too far. Then he can decide when he dies.
What's the point? We are trying to reform someone who did something like this? He's a grown man, he knows whats right and wrong. They deliberately wanted to kill/maim as many people as possible. Even if he's reformed, he needs to answer for what he did.
Even 1 incorrectly executed person is too many.
But cases like this and the Cheshire home invasion, and Oklahoma City, the only regret I have is the victims families are not the ones to conduct the execution.
but oddly enough I believe every victim's family members from the Boston bombing and the victims who survived all (I believe 100%) supported life vs death.
So, while we who support the death penalty in this case all have our reasons it doesn't seem that the victims or family of the victims view death as justice.
23 hours a day in solitary confinement for the next 60 years? If I'm him, I'm taking 5-10 years on death row and a swift execution (and made out a martyr) in a heartbeat. Not to mention the family of the youngest victim requested life for him as to not drag out the process.
In spite of all that, he's getting what he ultimately deserves, which is the end of his natural life.
While that's true, there's nothing which can be done to him which would truly be justice.
likely closer to 75 years.
Appeal, then a seroies of last minute appeals heard/heard-denied, then a governmental stay, in-between will be all the public protests on his behalf,including, if they are still in business after the UVA lawsuit, the Rolling Stone mag having him on their hot 100 or something, etc.
Isn't the average about 18 years on 'death row'?
Although I'd be happy if it was tonight at midnight.
They can't kill him fast enough for me.
Yup, why should this POS be allowed to live when his victims are dead?
Quote:
So, while we who support the death penalty in this case all have our reasons it doesn't seem that the victims or family of the victims view death as justice.
While that's true, there's nothing which can be done to him which would truly be justice.
I'm not sure, you might be right, but that's for the families of the victims and surviving victims to decide. Isn't it? Maybe they viewed life in prison as justice.
Quote:
In comment 12288311 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 12288298 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Same.
Third.
Fourth
Quote:
In comment 12288326 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
In comment 12288311 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 12288298 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Same.
Third.
Fourth
Fifth
Muslims in there will make him a hero. We don't do justice anymore. There is zero room for any appeals but the scum bag lawyers will milk this case for years. No question of guilt. No question of intent. This won't deter other scum I know but he doesn't deserve one more day of air.
Dead in under 5...and while I oppose the death penalty for its errors and application, have no issues here. Though having him lose his mind doing 60 years in Florence had some appeal as well.
Yes, I get it, he killed innocents - something he is far from. One some level he certainly deserves to die, and maybe worse than that, deserves to be tortured and severely punished before being killed. There is a certain logic and feeling of "justice" to that which I get....I really do.
But I do feel that we as a society should be above that....and there's little doubt based on history that we'll look back on the death penalty as the barbaric practice that it is - like so much of the world does already.
It's not that I don't agree he deserves to die (he does). For me it just seems too easy for him. He is young, on average he's got roughly 60 years to go. That is a long time to be completely isolated from society, looking out of a 12 inch slit in a window. It's torture by isolation, which would surely break this little pu$$y.
I'm sure you're right, I was listening to interviews with Richards' father and the other deceased victims families.
Again, not my views, but just what I heard in interviews with the survivors. So maybe not 100%
Most of the time I respect the victims right to privacy and don't even want to know, but the Richards were public in their opposition and they felt like they wanted the memory/legacy of their son to be one of mercy and not death/vengeance (my paraphrasing).
Give Whitey Bulger temporary parole. Over/under? 10 minutes
I'm very much torn on the death penalty but the law is the law and that's that. If he dies....he dies.
No chance of parole. No Senior Week. No prom. No family life. Just life as a piece of shit in jail.
Tesla is absolutely right.
I think he'll eventually be put to death.
Why should it take 6 to 7 years. That's the issue. Some guys wait 20. If there's reason for appeal fone but what the fuck took 7 years for McVeigh? Heck he decided not to fight it or it could have gone on for twice that easily
I highlighted that McVeigh was executed in 6 or 7 years, Rob in NYC corrected me and said 5.
That was my point, that his sentence isn't being rubber stamped.
the average death row inmate (2010 stats) waited 15 years from sentence to execution.
And no, I'm not saying that's what it should be, i'm citing a statistic.
No, it won't bring back the dead, but as Captain Kirk once said, "They may rest easier."
That's good enough for me.
He was a fucking idiot in every way. Romanticized his crime and his death. Fucking baby-murdering loser.
He won't grow old(er) in jail and the punishment is basically immediate. Would this be a harsher penalty than 60+ years in the hole?
21 year old executed vs 80 year old dying of natural causes maybe
Let him shag mortar shells
Yes, I get it, he killed innocents - something he is far from. One some level he certainly deserves to die, and maybe worse than that, deserves to be tortured and severely punished before being killed. There is a certain logic and feeling of "justice" to that which I get....I really do.
But I do feel that we as a society should be above that....and there's little doubt based on history that we'll look back on the death penalty as the barbaric practice that it is - like so much of the world does already.
The difference is that he was given every right under the law and received a fair trial with a good defense. That is how we are above it.
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In comment 12288298 Joey in VA said:
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Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
I'm much more conflicted about capital punishment in general than I used to be because of the many questionable cases in which it is probable that the condemned was innocent. I've come to believe that its application should be severely limited and restricted.
In a case like this, though? When there's absolutely no question of guilt and the crime was so heinous? No qualms whatsoever. Off the fucker.
Same.
It’s been much the same here. I think the turning point for me was when faced with the hypothetical ‘Would I be willing to be the one to throw the switch?’. And I’m not willing, and therefore in good conscience I can’t expect someone else to do it.
He was a fucking idiot in every way. Romanticized his crime and his death. Fucking baby-murdering loser.
I just used him as an example, maybe a poor one, but I can't think of any high profile death sentences that were simply rubber stamped while the perp lived out their life on death row.
average is 15 years and that's probably what this POS will serve before being executed.
He's a soldier, who killed innocent civilians.
He was not remorseful. Had he gotten away with it, he may well have done it again. At the least he would have been willing to.
Again, this is great news.
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to show how strongly we condemn killing people.
Yes, I get it, he killed innocents - something he is far from. One some level he certainly deserves to die, and maybe worse than that, deserves to be tortured and severely punished before being killed. There is a certain logic and feeling of "justice" to that which I get....I really do.
But I do feel that we as a society should be above that....and there's little doubt based on history that we'll look back on the death penalty as the barbaric practice that it is - like so much of the world does already.
The difference is that he was given every right under the law and received a fair trial with a good defense. That is how we are above it.
Well said buford, and I agree. Still, I can't shake the idea that we are making a decision to terminate someone's life. He deserves it, I'm just not sure that shouldn't be above our pay grade.
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In comment 12288305 sshin05 said:
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but he needs to answer for his crimes against his fellow man even if he's sorry. Him and his brother carried out a mass casualty surprise attack.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was. All for free of course, he could sleep in a box and eat gruel with an RTLS based poison injector on his leg should he stray too far. Then he can decide when he dies.
What's the point? We are trying to reform someone who did something like this? He's a grown man, he knows whats right and wrong. They deliberately wanted to kill/maim as many people as possible. Even if he's reformed, he needs to answer for what he did.
Putting him in supermax for life isn't about reform. It's punishment, and perhaps the worst punishment that can be levied. Given the choice between supermax with no possibility of parole and death, I'd opt for death.
That's simply argument by cliche. McVeigh died, there was no orgy of violence in the wake of his execution. You don't think that Tsarnaev's survival, if he clung to jihadism, could not have inspired others just as readily as his execution might? I have moral and practical qualms about the death penalty, but pidgen Gandhi isn't really among them.
Life in prison is a terrible punishment. It sucks. And the Supermax Federal Prisons are beyond secure. They're so secure the prisoners go insane from the isolation.
The only reason why people want to kill this guy is vengeance, and that is an immoral rationalization.
The rest of the Western civilization has figured out that the death penalty is barbaric. We only underscore our own brutality and lack of civilization by continuing to impose it.
Nice post.
The rest of the Western civilization has figured out that the death penalty is barbaric. We only underscore our own brutality and lack of civilization by continuing to impose it.
While my post was tongue in cheek, there are plenty of people in this country who are loathe to take their cues as to what is or isn't barbaric from the tastes of a vocal strata of northeast liberals.
Life in prison is a terrible punishment. It sucks. And the Supermax Federal Prisons are beyond secure. They're so secure the prisoners go insane from the isolation.
The only reason why people want to kill this guy is vengeance, and that is an immoral rationalization.
One could argue life in prison is just as vengeful (or more) than execution.
1. I don't feel it's humane for our society to put people to death in this manner. What makes us better than the criminal?
2. Too many mistakes are made. With DNA proving all the time these days that innocent people were incarcerated I just can't accept the possibility that we are putting prisoners to death by accident. If you mistakenly convict someone and throw them into jail you can always let them out. You can't however bring them back from the dead.
I fully understand that there are those that disagree with me. I just don't feel you make exceptions. Sure this guy is a heinous criminal who appears to show not one drop of remorse. I'm perfectly fine letting him rot away in prison hopefully ignored by the media(I know fat chance).
A punishment that fits the crime and will most assuredly force him to swallow his own tongue in due time.
Life in prison is a terrible punishment. It sucks. And the Supermax Federal Prisons are beyond secure. They're so secure the prisoners go insane from the isolation.
The only reason why people want to kill this guy is vengeance, and that is an immoral rationalization.
Same here, until I read a piece many years ago in which two psychiatrists interviewed a whole number of death row inmates and found that 99% of them had severe brain injuries from birth, from a fall, if dropped as a baby, and a whole other list of head traumas. Many of these injuries were to the parts of the brain that governed impulse control, emotional reactions, etc.
Add to that prosecutorial malfeasance, where highly ambitious D.A.'s are willing to cut evidence corners and, in many cases that we're discovering almost weekly, fabricate evidence. Plus bad police work and just plain bad, unconscionable detectives.
With all that, I can't in good conscience be in favor of the death penalty.
But I'm torn about these kind of murders, influenced as they seem to be by radical religionists. Is zealotry a mental disorder? Just don't know. I DO know that, to me, there is little, if any, moral repugnance to plain, unadulterated vengeance.
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was.
I like this.
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Woefully soft in my old age, I used to be 100% pro death penalty, but I just don't think that's right anymore.
Add to that prosecutorial malfeasance, where highly ambitious D.A.'s are willing to cut evidence corners and, in many cases that we're discovering almost weekly, fabricate evidence. Plus bad police work and just plain bad, unconscionable detectives.
This is more perception than reality. The DNA exoneration phenomenon is petering out and so the recent "exonerees" have been more about eyewitnesses (usually coconspirators) recanting, generally when they are beyond the reach of the law. For instance, if you turned on your buddies to spare yourself the DP and are now doing life, what incentive do you now have to stick to your prior story? There was one such celebrated case in Virginia a couple years ago involving a Brady nondisclosure (one that the prosecutor seems not to have known about) and a recanting witness, but none of that diminishes the fact that the evidence against the man who was freed was still quite damning even without them.
My larger point, though, is the damage in the brains of many death row inmates. I'm not talking about neurotic or psychopathic behavior (although that can often be caused by long term brain damage) but to actual damage to the inmates brain that could have been caused by many things from bad birth, to fetal alcohol/drug syndrome, and all sorts of head trauma throughout a life.
I can't see executing people like this for a crime, although on another level, it could be argued that execution might be more merciful than a life with the burden of those injuries.
Despite my new found concern about death penalties, as for the Boston bastid, wipe him out. His was a political, military crime. He's no different from a soldier on the field of battle whom you would righteously shoot in the head if he were firing at you. Killing him would be, in my opinion, righteous.
Well, that's the big swamp, isn't it!? It's where all the big disputes are. Don't know how you get around that.
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In comment 12288305 sshin05 said:
I'd put him to work at a VA hospital working with amputees for the rest of his life. Let him see first hand the type of person he was trying to kill maim and force him to help them and learn how wrong he truly was.
I like this.
I personally don't know how this will make him learn that what he did was wrong. Do you honestly think that having to see a munch of maimed/wounded service members from conflicts in ME will somehow make him realize how his deeds were inhumane and wrong when he didn't show remorse for killing and wounding innocent civilians? I mean the whole motive behind the attack in the first place was to payback the U.S. for its role in the conflicts against Muslims as he perceived them.
Having him work at a VA hospital will be like giving him his jihad porn each and every day. I'm sure he has nothing but contempt for those recuperating at any VA hospitals and will relish his daily views of the suffering.
Certain types of criminals enjoy a level of celebrity behind bars. I don't think Dzoey will qualify. I would actually love to see him spend the rest of his life looking over his shoulder wondering which one of his fellow inmates was going to shiv him in the kidneys.
A death sentence will allow him to spend 10-15 in relative security and comfort, perhaps much longer than he would last in the general population. Think Jeffery Dahmer.
He could opt for protective custody but I beleive many who select that option change their minds fairly quickly for whatever reasons (mostly sheer boredom).