they are considering will actually encourage the 2 point conversion because the ball is only spotted at the 15 if you go for 1 point. Otherwise, ball is still spotted at the 2 yardline.
Why should the defense know what is happening? Soon we are going to have to declare if an offense is going for it on fourth down. Part of the game is the element of surprise and having teams adjust on the fly. Look at what the Pats did last year when they went with an unbalanced line against the Ravens. Yes, this is a small part but still stupid imo. Is a 32 yard extra point that much more difficult than a 19 yard extra point?
more exciting or interesting is hopeless. Just eliminate it. Every team gets a free point after a TD unless they choose to go for 2. Bonus - it speeds up the game by eliminating untimed plays.
That first sentence is the point. Why does every play have to be "exciting"? Should they take away the victory formation? That's not exciting but that team earned that right. Should baseball take away the throw to first base? Should they take away an intentional walk? Those are not exciting plays. Should we stop icing in hockey? Should a team not be allowed to get the puck to the other end of the ice on a penalty? That's not exciting.
similar to Rugby. Attempt the conversion from as close or as far as you like (but no closer than say 1 or 2 yd line), but the ball is spotted straight back from the point the ball crossed the goal line. Probably have to allow 5-10 yards from sideline to allow team to line up.
If you score at or near the sideline, you have a tough angle to kick from, so no longer a gimme. Two point conversion is more of a consideration. Score between the hashes, you can line up close so fake is still a consideration.
when you have the product at it's peak do you want to hasten its decline by tinkering? Unless its a safety issue, leave the game alone. Just my opinion.
As if this was a problem. Game is fucked up in a million ways due to Goodell's meddling. Now this. He is completely incompetent.
Do you think Roger Goodell can just arbitrarily change any rule he wants to? Are you that stupid? Did you miss the part where it says that 75% of the owners - you remember the owners, don't you? They pay Goodell's salary - have to approve the measure?
But I agree that this isn't the best solution to the extra point being too automatic. Narrower goalposts and/or a crossbar across the top of the goal would both make field goals and extra points more difficult.
If you really want to make extra points more interesting, make the player who scored the TD make the kick. That would probably encourage a lot more 2-point conversion tries, which would be less automatic, and therefore more interesting, than the PAT. I'd be okay with that.
I think a change is necessary, but only one very simple one makes sense to me: eliminate the 1 point kick option and leave the 2 point conversion from the 2 yard line.
Total scoring will be about the same, but instead of 1200+ nearly automatic (I think 5 extra point kicks failed in 2014 or 2013), you'll now have 1150+ more exciting plays (I think 50 to 70 two point conversions were attempted in 2014 or 2013).
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
RE: I think it really changes the game in a bad way.
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
Therein lies the ridiculousness of it. How does that improve overall product? Force teams to throw?
Eliminate the extra point and make everyone go for two if you really want added excitement. This is just assbackwards.
RE: I think it really changes the game in a bad way.
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
Mathematically makes it more correct to go for 2 everytime
Not sure narrowing the posts is an option since it arbitrarily reduces scoring, not their end game. And I'd guess the PAT isn't much different in that case (likely a small PAT% decrease, but does 99+% go much under 95% if that?)
I like the 1yd line / TC idea but wonder how much that changes teams going for 2 across the league. It would a little in the numbers but given the old school adage "never take points off the board," I'm not sure coaches jump at that many more 2pt attempts (Maybe NE given Brady's sneak success, but does TC / NYG change much for ex?). Tho it's way better than the 15yd line idea
Make 1 pt attempts drop kick only. That's a great way to bring back a lost art, and keep true to the history of the game. Certainly, Drop Kicks (especially in bad weather) are not automatic!
Those 4-5 percentage points are bigger than you think
A lot of the NFL is slow to adapt, but this is basically the first step in phasing out kickers for the PAT. Wouldn't mind it if there were a reicpricol move for the 2pter, but this skews things much more in favor of going for two everytime unless game conditions dictate otherwise. It'll start with a few teams always going for two (probably the pats being one), then the rest of the NFL will fall in line.
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
So you have to declare and there is no possibility of deception?
but does that mean coaches use it? Still close to 100% 1pt vs a 2pt which guessing is at best 60-70%, for top offenses. You're right tho, it'll be a slow evolution if it happens
The one tweak for discussion sake - PAT from the 3yd allowing the fake for 2pt with higher risk. Or set up for 2pt from the 1yd (could go up to 2yd)
Either way almost every suggestion here is better than the 15yd IMO including leaving it as is
RE: Mathematically makes it more correct to go for 2 everytime
And it's not really that close anymore. FYI, almost regardless of the team, it was damn close before.
I think this could make the 2 point conversion attempt the standard and the 15 yard PAT the choice at the end of the game if all you need is one point for the win.
RE: RE: RE: I think it really changes the game in a bad way.
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
How many fake PATs have seen in the NFL in your lifetime?
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
So you have to declare and there is no possibility of deception?
RE: RE: RE: I think it really changes the game in a bad way.
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
So you have to declare and there is no possibility of deception?
How many fake PATs have you seen in the NFL in your lifetime? 2-3?
this really puts into focus the sorry state of the American attention span.
Let me get this straight, so we have to change the game because the PAT is not "exciting" enough? Then every Sunday you will continue to watch hours of brain-cell-killing commercials while drooling into your beer? Does that sum it up?
...for many reasons all mentioned on here already. Mostly though it eliminates the option of a fake. The fact that few are run are besides the point. Now the D can go after the kicker on a harder field goal with no reason at all to stay honest in case of a fake. Because even if run at 15 yards out there is plenty of time to recover. Rarely is there anyone with much speed on the kick unit, while the block unit has a lot of speed.
The only change to the PAT I have ever been supportive of was the suggestion of having the player who scored the TD have to kick it. I think that might actually be fun to watch. Hankins recovers a fumble in the end zone and then is kicking the PAT? Or they can go for 2.
It totally eliminates the surprise two point conversion.
I can't remember a single solitary time I've watched a pro football game and a surprise two-point conversion occurred. I don't watch every game, but I sure as hell watch a lot of football. Can't recall one.
Not that it was ever that common in the first place, but why can't you call a surprise 2 point conversion from the 15?
How many times did you see a surprise two point conversion? Maybe on a missed snap or something, but typically they either go for two, or they don't.
If you score at or near the sideline, you have a tough angle to kick from, so no longer a gimme. Two point conversion is more of a consideration. Score between the hashes, you can line up close so fake is still a consideration.
2. Blindfold the holder
3. Have the kicker at Dizzy Izzy before lining up
Is there really any fan backlash over the extra point basically being automatic?
Do you think Roger Goodell can just arbitrarily change any rule he wants to? Are you that stupid? Did you miss the part where it says that 75% of the owners - you remember the owners, don't you? They pay Goodell's salary - have to approve the measure?
If you really want to make extra points more interesting, make the player who scored the TD make the kick. That would probably encourage a lot more 2-point conversion tries, which would be less automatic, and therefore more interesting, than the PAT. I'd be okay with that.
For extra point move it to the 1. TC said tha
Total scoring will be about the same, but instead of 1200+ nearly automatic (I think 5 extra point kicks failed in 2014 or 2013), you'll now have 1150+ more exciting plays (I think 50 to 70 two point conversions were attempted in 2014 or 2013).
Goodell will ruin this game yet.
Therein lies the ridiculousness of it. How does that improve overall product? Force teams to throw?
Eliminate the extra point and make everyone go for two if you really want added excitement. This is just assbackwards.
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
I like the 1yd line / TC idea but wonder how much that changes teams going for 2 across the league. It would a little in the numbers but given the old school adage "never take points off the board," I'm not sure coaches jump at that many more 2pt attempts (Maybe NE given Brady's sneak success, but does TC / NYG change much for ex?). Tho it's way better than the 15yd line idea
Quote:
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
So you have to declare and there is no possibility of deception?
The one tweak for discussion sake - PAT from the 3yd allowing the fake for 2pt with higher risk. Or set up for 2pt from the 1yd (could go up to 2yd)
Either way almost every suggestion here is better than the 15yd IMO including leaving it as is
Quote:
In comment 12290342 Del Shofner said:
Quote:
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
How many fake PATs have seen in the NFL in your lifetime?
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
So you have to declare and there is no possibility of deception?
Quote:
In comment 12290342 Del Shofner said:
Quote:
Yes, the 1-point kick is automatic, but late in the game depending on the score the ability to convert the 2-point play becomes crucial. And now that is going to have to be from the 15 yard line?
No - PATs would be from the 15. 2 point conversations will be from the 2.
So you have to declare and there is no possibility of deception?
How many fake PATs have you seen in the NFL in your lifetime? 2-3?
Let me get this straight, so we have to change the game because the PAT is not "exciting" enough? Then every Sunday you will continue to watch hours of brain-cell-killing commercials while drooling into your beer? Does that sum it up?
It is a valid point. You say the PAT is "a waste of time". Removing it is only going to get us to the commercial faster.
The only change to the PAT I have ever been supportive of was the suggestion of having the player who scored the TD have to kick it. I think that might actually be fun to watch. Hankins recovers a fumble in the end zone and then is kicking the PAT? Or they can go for 2.
If something HAD to be done, I would've gone with the idea of all TDs being worth 7 points and you no longer have to kick the EP.
Decisions to go for 2 would either give you 8 points if successful or 6 points if unsuccessful.
I can't remember a single solitary time I've watched a pro football game and a surprise two-point conversion occurred. I don't watch every game, but I sure as hell watch a lot of football. Can't recall one.
The only rule changes I agree with, is for the safety of the players.....
Now, if we can only get rid of the designated hitter, the world will be a better place....