Have the Giants Improved If Flowers Can Step Right In At LT?

I posted the other day that in a weird way, longer term, this is probably a blessing in disguise. We don't "lose a year" on Beatty IF (and this is the big "if") the intention was always to replace Beatty. I don't know if that is true or not.

What the Giants really need is one of the lesser known players to take a major step forward and surprise.

Charlie Casserly thinks the Giants should start Pugh at left tackle and Flowers at right tackle.

I'm going to be curious to see who starts where just at tackle, let alone guard.

I don't think so for a couple of reasons. One, no matter where you stick him, it still leaves a gaping hole at either RT or LG. Two, every indication was that he is a prototypical RT right now and will likely never be a prototypical LT. So, it doesn't necessarily make them better, as opposed to plugging a hole temporarily.

I would rather see him at RT, where he was drafted to play from day 1. I would prefer to see Richburg at OC, where he was drafted to play and is best suited to play. I would like to see Pugh at LG or LT. He was a decent RT when he was healthy and he played mostly on the left side at Syracuse, so LT may be a better fit. Or, if he ends up at OG, I would at least prefer it to be on his more natural left side. I would prefer to see a healthy Scwartz at RG, which seems to be his best position. So, they either need a LT or LG any way you slice it. I don't know who the best options are for either of those positions. But, you have to open camp with at least 3 positions shored up in Richburg, Schwartz, and Flowers from OC to RT.

Now either Jerry/Jones or some other quantity known or unknown will play there. It's a longshot that player will be an upgrade over what we had there last season. Jerry stinks and who the Hell knows what a CFL rookie or some other under the radar asset will provide. Expect the Giants to be watching cutdowns like a hawk for someone they feel can solidify the OG position.

I think it's a lot easier for this line to swallow replacing a guard than a Tackle -- If you can play lets say:

Flowers, Jerry, Weston, Schwartz, Pugh

for instance -- and that group can gel -- you might have the power game and zone blocking scheme the Giants prefer/ and sandwich the Vets

was the best player on the OL. I fail to see how we're better. We were better with Richburg moving to Center, BEatty at LT and adding Flowers at RT

In comment 12298041 Eric from BBI said:

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Charlie Casserly thinks the Giants should start Pugh at left tackle and Flowers at right tackle. I'm going to be curious to see who starts where just at tackle, let alone guard.

I agree with this

Pugh will now be at a tackle spot instead of solidifying the interior. John Jerry is now very important. He was a back up before the injury.

In comment 12298045 Matt M. said:

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I don't think so for a couple of reasons. One, no matter where you stick him, it still leaves a gaping hole at either RT or LG. Two, every indication was that he is a prototypical RT right now and will likely never be a prototypical LT. So, it doesn't necessarily make them better, as opposed to plugging a hole temporarily. I would rather see him at RT, where he was drafted to play from day 1. I would prefer to see Richburg at OC, where he was drafted to play and is best suited to play. I would like to see Pugh at LG or LT. He was a decent RT when he was healthy and he played mostly on the left side at Syracuse, so LT may be a better fit. Or, if he ends up at OG, I would at least prefer it to be on his more natural left side. I would prefer to see a healthy Scwartz at RG, which seems to be his best position. So, they either need a LT or LG any way you slice it. I don't know who the best options are for either of those positions. But, you have to open camp with at least 3 positions shored up in Richburg, Schwartz, and Flowers from OC to RT.

Matt - they are obviously going to test both Pugh and Flowers at both tackle spots -- but I think Pugh is a better Right Tackle than Left Tackle -- he's already had a decent year there -- it would be much better if Flowers could handle the left side in my opinion - that would give you three lineman in their best positions as I printed above - Weston, Schwartz and Pugh on the right side - and a potentially dynamic battlecruiser on the Left side swallowing up the other end

Hey I can dream can't I

In comment 12298053 gidiefor said:

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I think it's a lot easier for this line to swallow replacing a guard than a Tackle -- If you can play lets say: Flowers, Jerry, Weston, Schwartz, Pugh for instance -- and that group can gel -- you might have the power game and zone blocking scheme the Giants prefer/ and sandwich the Vets

That left side protecting Elis blindside scares me

In comment 12298069 Tony-in-Wichita said:

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In comment 12298053 gidiefor said: Quote: I think it's a lot easier for this line to swallow replacing a guard than a Tackle -- If you can play lets say: Flowers, Jerry, Weston, Schwartz, Pugh for instance -- and that group can gel -- you might have the power game and zone blocking scheme the Giants prefer/ and sandwich the Vets That left side protecting Elis blindside scares me

Tony -- I know, I know --- but what if he can?

That's the question

Beatty may have been the most consistent lineman on this team last year, but he's also one of the reasons why this team was "soft" up front. He's not a very physical player.

The assumption is that Pugh and Richburg will become much better this year, and Schwartz will be on the field. So Beatty probably wouldn't have been the best player this year.

Secondly, I would not automatically assume Jerry is a starter. I've been harsh on Jerry not because of physical breakdowns but mental ones. He could still start and do an adequate job. But I wouldn't count out other lineman on this roster.

There must be a guy on your mind

I would prefer Schwartz play LG next to the talented rookie

In comment 12298073 Eric from BBI said:

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Beatty may have been the most consistent lineman on this team last year, but he's also one of the reasons why this team was "soft" up front. He's not a very physical player. The assumption is that Pugh and Richburg will become much better this year, and Schwartz will be on the field. So Beatty probably wouldn't have been the best player this year. Secondly, I would not automatically assume Jerry is a starter. I've been harsh on Jerry not because of physical breakdowns but mental ones. He could still start and do an adequate job. But I wouldn't count out other lineman on this roster.

good point about him being soft. Its always scary when the o line isnt set but got to have faith in internal improvement.

Makes for a likely shaky start to the year. At least there is some youth on the line now

Richburg at c and Schwartz at rg Pugh either stays at rt or moves to lg and a strong possibility that our 5th starting oline is not on our team yet ie. Jake long or Kevin Boothe

Pugh and Flowers as the tackles doesn't terrify me to be completely honest. Pugh has been developing nicely and Flowers has all the tools, I think he's going to step in and be a solid starter from day one, be it at LT or RT. You never want to lose your starting LT and moving Pugh inside would've been the optimal situation, but I really think they're going to be alright there.

I am however worried about that one G spot. I can't see John Jerry being a reliable starter for 16 games after his performance last season. Again, like Eric said, it would be outstanding if one of the younger guys can step up and surprise. I think Brett Jones is the wildcard. He obviously wasn't playing against the same caliber of competition in the CFL. But his track record is impressive. He was the CFL rookie of the year and followed that up by being named the leagues top offensive lineman in his second season. Scouting reports say he's "very physical and finishes plays". The same report praises his footwork and movement, saying he's "got natural knee bend, good feet, sits really well in his stance, punches well, he's aggressive." It sounds like he has all the tools to be a quality G, but how he'll handle the transition is still obviously up in the air.

In an article I recently read Jones stated he's had his eye on the NFL since entering the CFL. He earned all the accolades an OL could in just two years there. He said all he wants is an opportunity. Well, a golden one has just been laid at his feet. All that stands between him and his dream is a middling veteran who is best suited to a back up/depth role. If he can adjust to the game, he has all the tools to do it. Hopefully he's the young guy to step up. After the injury I think it's the best case scenario. Again, it's all about the adjustment, and if he can make it I think they're going to be alright.

Pugh-Jones-Richburg-Schwartz-Flowers
Pugh-Schwartz-Richburg-Jones-Flowers
Flowers-Schwartz-Richburg-Jones-Pugh
Flowers-Jones-Richburg-Schwartz-Pugh

Hopefully one of those options is the opening day OL. I think the key now is keeping Jerry off the field. Walton may have been the weakest link, but Jerry wasn't far behind. If anyone is going to unseat him I think Jones has the best shot, and I really think that's the best case scenario.

Coughlin hands Flowers the job w/o making him win it.

For several reasons, this is the starting lineup bar injury:

Pugh-Flowers-Richburg-(Jones/Jerry)-Schwartz-

yes.

We'll have to see how it plays out. Its going to be another topsy-turvy preseason and first 1/3 of the regular season.

In comment 12298080 Tony-in-Wichita said:

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There must be a guy on your mind

I didn't mean to come accross as rude, I meant to ask who you had in mind to overtake that open guard spot..

guesswork. We will have to wait until OTA's , mini camps and training camp to get a clue. Personally, I like j_ruds option 1. Watched the tape on Jones and was impressed and I feel Pugh will be a good LT, but who knows.

last year before getting hurt.

more than barely adequate. o lines need coordination, time together, and growth not just athletic ability. a new center who,has to call the signals, a ? mark at left tackle etc etc.

not a scenario that's at all promising

I'm sure they weren't expecting him to be called on for duty at LT right away. Pugh gives the Giants the luxury of still sticking with grooming Flowers and using his power and athleticism at RT which was a problem position last season just as much as any other position.

Mosley and Hart shouldn't be overlook for duty at RG allowing Schwartz to move back to LG. I agree with Eric, the assumption that Jerry is automatically the next man up could be something that has to shake out.

This OL is very young as well as a lot of positions on this team.

''
Pugh may be a better LT than RT
PatersonPlank : 6:05 pm : link : reply

We'll have to see how it plays out. Its going to be another topsy-turvy preseason and first 1/3 of the regular season.''

Have no idea...could be a guy like Bamiro. I think Sean Donnelly probably needs a year in an NFL weight program, but he's a big guy with good feet. Hart probably the same, but who knows? We also know very little about Cleary and Gettis.

Could this be the year that Mosley or Newhouse put it together?

Dave Deihl was a 5th round draft pick who became a starter in his rookie year -- it can happen that a rookie or rookies become starters on the Oline -- Weston and Pugh were also

I've heard legendary stories about his mean streak. This is his year to prove he has worth in the NFL


Good point Gidie.. Hopefully they found another diamond in the rough

I believe he was a guard in college but I could be wrong about that.

I think the Giants always wanted to try Pugh at LT, and worked him at LG his rookie year until he was forced to move to RT.

It's time to try Pugh at LT and go with the original plan for Flowers which is to try him at RT or LG.

Flowers is a prototype RT. He may eventually be able to be a NFL quality LT but it's all about this year first.

In comment 12298958 Ivan15 said:

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I believe he was a guard in college but I could be wrong about that. I think the Giants always wanted to try Pugh at LT, and worked him at LG his rookie year until he was forced to move to RT. It's time to try Pugh at LT and go with the original plan for Flowers which is to try him at RT or LG. Flowers is a prototype RT. He may eventually be able to be a NFL quality LT but it's all about this year first.

Ivan Pugh started at RT in his rookie year - I don't understand your point - the fact is that there have been 3 rookies that have started on the Offensive Line in recent memory

In comment 12298041 Eric from BBI said:

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Charlie Casserly thinks the Giants should start Pugh at left tackle and Flowers at right tackle.

I agree Pugh was a left tackle in college and I believe his body type and footwork lends itself to being a better tackle than guard

Will tell me what are O-Line is, in Dallas week 1 regular season.