but I will have to endure the next few years here. Last time I'm going to comment on it. Nobody knows what will happen. Do you really think Harvey is worrying about Free Agency 4 years before he is eligible? He by his own admission is having a tougher time working through stuff coming off the TJ. He was a Yankee fan growing up, big whoop, EVERY baseball player was a fan of some team growing up and you rarely if ever hear a guy say I'm going to ---------------- because I rooted for them as a kid. I know his agent is Scott Boras. So what?
+10
Are we, as long suffering Mets fan, so psychologically damaged by years of ineptitude that we are now pulling the "let's break up with the other person first before they break up with us" routine with Harvey? The guy was practically our lone bright spot the past 3 years and now we're okay with the thought of him leaving? He proudly carried the team and gave us a reason to watch the Mets during dark times. Until proven otherwise, he's our guy and we should count our blessings that we have him.
Huh? Who's saying to "get rid of Harvey before he leaves us first" type of comment? Nobody that I've seen here so let's not get carried away. Harvey's history and public comments are less than comforting as mets fans so I can certainly understand why fans might think this way. But it's a long ways away and we should just enjoy him while he's here. Who knows what can happen. Hopefully he working on his third straight World Series championship!
You took that line literally. I wasn't saying that people wanted to get rid of him, but you and others have resigned to the fact that he's
leaving/going to the Yankees. You said he was a "goner" and 100% about the money. I, in turn, agreed with Headhunter that it was baseless. Not sure how that's getting carried away; a few of you are certain he's going to the Yankees, a few of us disagree.
Lol, how else am I supposed to take that line if not literally? You specifically said that people were taking "that" routine when absolutely nobody was. You can call people out for things they didn't say. You were obviously exaggerating/fabricating stuff to support your point.
And, yes, Harvey going to the Yankees is baseless and silly. But Harvey being all about $$ is absolutely not baseless. Not that it's much of a stretch anyway since most pro athletes are all about money. Do a little research on Harvey and you'll understand.
You took a tongue-in-cheek line (one that was making light of how we're long accustomed to letdowns as Mets fans) and interpreted it as me saying "You guys want to get rid of Harvey." Since you clearly took that line the wrong way, let me clarify: I did not say you guys said "Let's get rid of Harvey". I was alluding to you guys accepting his departure at the end of his current contract as a foregone conclusion. You misinterpreted an analogy made in jest and are making a fuss about it. Take your own advice and stop calling people out for things they didn't say.
Shitty of a season Addison Russell is having. He's young but the worst fielding percentage of any 2ndbaseman in baseball?? And the bat has been very underwhelming.
No chance I would trade Thor or Matz for him. Zero.
That's silly. He's been up for like 2 months. He was a consensus top 5 prospect coming into this year. Very few hitters come into baseball at age 21 and light the world on fire from day one.
That's silly. He's been up for like 2 months. He was a consensus top 5 prospect coming into this year. Very few hitters come into baseball at age 21 and light the world on fire from day one.
He has been a disgrace defensively. All those "tools" should have at least allowed him to be decent playing 2nd base. Of course he's young and his bat can get better but there is no chance I would trade a bonafied young ace like Thor or Matz for some kid that has tools that may or may not translate some day.
Russell is going to get a lot better. You're severely underselling him and I don't think you have to worry about Thor/Matz getting dealt for him because the Cubs would turn us down anyway.
Russell is going to get a lot better. You're severely underselling him and I don't think you have to worry about Thor/Matz getting dealt for him because the Cubs would turn us down anyway.
Likewise, I think Sandy would laugh them off the phone in reverse.
Granderson's recent hot streak really elevated him into "really good" territory. His OPS is over .800 now.. he's hitting about .260 which he's only done once since 2008, getting on base.
He's already about a 2 WAR player this year in 77 games. He was a 1.2 WAR player through ALL of last season.
He's got to avoid one of those black hole ice cold streaks, though.. because if he follows this up with one of those, everything will sink back into "average-below average" territory.
Trio of young middle infielders havent exactly panned out so far.
Exactly. And I'm not saying Russell won't be good. Just irks me that people act like this is the "chosen one" when he's been kicking the ball all over the infield all season. I'm sure he's going to be good player someday but Matz and Syndergaard are already good.
Granderson's recent hot streak really elevated him into "really good" territory. His OPS is over .800 now.. he's hitting about .260 which he's only done once since 2008, getting on base.
He's already about a 2 WAR player this year in 77 games. He was a 1.2 WAR player through ALL of last season.
He's got to avoid one of those black hole ice cold streaks, though.. because if he follows this up with one of those, everything will sink back into "average-below average" territory.
Yup. And even when he was cold he was still walking and getting on base. I don't think he gets nearly enough credit for the season he's having. And his hot streaks can last a while. This might not even be the peak yet.
do. Sometimes a 21 year old just becomes a 22 year old. Lasting Milledge, Fernando Martinez, Gregory Polanco to name a few of the top prospects in the game that fizzled. Pro Sports is littered with the carcasses of can't miss
prospects. You name the sport I'll give you a can't miss that did, then another, then another
Yes, there are guys who miss and never pan out but making much of anything out of Russell's first 2 months in the bigs is a waste of time. People thought Harper was underwhelming or not living up to the hype at one point, too.
It certainly didn't come off as tounge in cheek or in jest...but I guess that's the trouble with humor over the Internet, lol.
As for Addison Russell, I questioned his pedestrian stats a while back. I guess it's just a product of our environment but we are quick to question our own young players while giving the benefit of the doubt to other teams young players...but I guess that's just because we see them all the time.
I wouldn't feel good about trading Thor or Matz for the "potential" that Russell "might" become. If I'm trading those types of pitchers, I wasn't proven taken in return. Not potential. We already have potential.
I'm not writing off or building up anyone after 2 months
which takes pretty much all prospects off the table. Puig or Frazier? Sure, if it's this generation's Piazza trade that's something to think about. But I'd be very hesitant to use our "1 bullet", as Sandy said, to put the weight of the world on a 21/22 year old.
RE: I wouldn't trade Matz or Thor for anything other than a sure thing
that is crazy, however; to deny that consensus top 5 picks in any sport can bust is just as crazy.
You are right, it happens all the time. It would be a big big risk to trade our starting pitcher depth for Russell. Especially since Russell's minor league stats aren't that dissimilar from our own "potential" player Flores.
Listening to Francesa talk about trade possibilities
I think Gomez is the best possible pie in the sky option. He's an impending FA who isn't having his best season. Not sure it will be possible to get him without giving up Thor/Matz/Conforto, but if it is he'd be a great fit. Can play all 3 OF positions, hit 1st or 2nd, and would bring a ton of energy to this club.
Herrera, Nimmo, Montero or Mejia?
He also brought up Hanley, but his injury stuff is scary and he's probably too much $. Does have 15 HRs though.
Yes Gomez has had a bad year, but if he was having a normal year (20 hrs / 30 steals / gold glove) you'd have to give up Matz or Thor for him, no question. You still might.
Rotate Cuddyer in a little bit with those 3 guys, and honestly with the way Lagares has played, it's 50-50 whether or note Gomez ends up in a corner or CF. Put a 20 HR/30 steal guy with his kind of speed at the top of the lineup and it changes this lineup in a big way.
for Carlos Gomez who has one year left before he's a free agent. I'm not sure I'd do it even if I had a chance to negotiate an extension with him first.
It just doesn't make any sense.
if I'm trading one of them it's for a young cost-controlled OFer with all-star potenital. Not a season and a half rental who will be 31 when the extension kicks in.
Thor/Matz 22/23 year old stud top of the rotation starter under team control for 5+ years for 1 year of Carlos Gomez.
The entire thought was proposed as can you get him without giving up one of them since he's close to FA and having a bad year? Does some combo of Nimmo/Herrera/Montero/Robles/etc. get it done?
I think that's the most realistic "big get" that could happen for this team, though still obviously a long shot.
Total nonsense trade proposal strictly for discussion
this isn't directed at you, but these ridiculous WFAN trades only serve to say their guy is better than our guy. I've never seen one of these that doesn't imply I wish the Mets had that guy. Harvey for Harper? Harvey for Trout? Get my drift?
RE: Total nonsense trade proposal strictly for discussion
If the cubs approached me and not the other way around, i would ask for more plus Bryant, Harvey is a bit more established than Bryant (rookie). Call me crazy but I would try to get more for Harvey.
this isn't directed at you, but these ridiculous WFAN trades only serve to say their guy is better than our guy. I've never seen one of these that doesn't imply I wish the Mets had that guy. Harvey for Harper? Harvey for Trout? Get my drift?
Funny you should say that. It's just something that was thrown out there on ESPN radio from Ryan Ruocco.
"Metro2007 wrote:
I just can't knock taking a lefty who throws low 90's, good frame, plus slider and local... plus "Lets go Matz" will be awesome! lol"
As a Mets fan, you look at the calendar and worry.
Quote:
In comment 12347261 PhiPsi125 said:
Quote:
In comment 12347231 stillpoe said:
Quote:
In comment 12347194 Headhunter said:
Quote:
but I will have to endure the next few years here. Last time I'm going to comment on it. Nobody knows what will happen. Do you really think Harvey is worrying about Free Agency 4 years before he is eligible? He by his own admission is having a tougher time working through stuff coming off the TJ. He was a Yankee fan growing up, big whoop, EVERY baseball player was a fan of some team growing up and you rarely if ever hear a guy say I'm going to ---------------- because I rooted for them as a kid. I know his agent is Scott Boras. So what?
+10
Are we, as long suffering Mets fan, so psychologically damaged by years of ineptitude that we are now pulling the "let's break up with the other person first before they break up with us" routine with Harvey? The guy was practically our lone bright spot the past 3 years and now we're okay with the thought of him leaving? He proudly carried the team and gave us a reason to watch the Mets during dark times. Until proven otherwise, he's our guy and we should count our blessings that we have him.
Huh? Who's saying to "get rid of Harvey before he leaves us first" type of comment? Nobody that I've seen here so let's not get carried away. Harvey's history and public comments are less than comforting as mets fans so I can certainly understand why fans might think this way. But it's a long ways away and we should just enjoy him while he's here. Who knows what can happen. Hopefully he working on his third straight World Series championship!
You took that line literally. I wasn't saying that people wanted to get rid of him, but you and others have resigned to the fact that he's
leaving/going to the Yankees. You said he was a "goner" and 100% about the money. I, in turn, agreed with Headhunter that it was baseless. Not sure how that's getting carried away; a few of you are certain he's going to the Yankees, a few of us disagree.
Lol, how else am I supposed to take that line if not literally? You specifically said that people were taking "that" routine when absolutely nobody was. You can call people out for things they didn't say. You were obviously exaggerating/fabricating stuff to support your point.
And, yes, Harvey going to the Yankees is baseless and silly. But Harvey being all about $$ is absolutely not baseless. Not that it's much of a stretch anyway since most pro athletes are all about money. Do a little research on Harvey and you'll understand.
You took a tongue-in-cheek line (one that was making light of how we're long accustomed to letdowns as Mets fans) and interpreted it as me saying "You guys want to get rid of Harvey." Since you clearly took that line the wrong way, let me clarify: I did not say you guys said "Let's get rid of Harvey". I was alluding to you guys accepting his departure at the end of his current contract as a foregone conclusion. You misinterpreted an analogy made in jest and are making a fuss about it. Take your own advice and stop calling people out for things they didn't say.
No chance I would trade Thor or Matz for him. Zero.
He has been a disgrace defensively. All those "tools" should have at least allowed him to be decent playing 2nd base. Of course he's young and his bat can get better but there is no chance I would trade a bonafied young ace like Thor or Matz for some kid that has tools that may or may not translate some day.
Likewise, I think Sandy would laugh them off the phone in reverse.
No to Russel while Familia for Tulo will happen.
He's already about a 2 WAR player this year in 77 games. He was a 1.2 WAR player through ALL of last season.
He's got to avoid one of those black hole ice cold streaks, though.. because if he follows this up with one of those, everything will sink back into "average-below average" territory.
Exactly. And I'm not saying Russell won't be good. Just irks me that people act like this is the "chosen one" when he's been kicking the ball all over the infield all season. I'm sure he's going to be good player someday but Matz and Syndergaard are already good.
He's already about a 2 WAR player this year in 77 games. He was a 1.2 WAR player through ALL of last season.
He's got to avoid one of those black hole ice cold streaks, though.. because if he follows this up with one of those, everything will sink back into "average-below average" territory.
Yup. And even when he was cold he was still walking and getting on base. I don't think he gets nearly enough credit for the season he's having. And his hot streaks can last a while. This might not even be the peak yet.
prospects. You name the sport I'll give you a can't miss that did, then another, then another
Yes, there are guys who miss and never pan out but making much of anything out of Russell's first 2 months in the bigs is a waste of time. People thought Harper was underwhelming or not living up to the hype at one point, too.
It takes time.
As for Addison Russell, I questioned his pedestrian stats a while back. I guess it's just a product of our environment but we are quick to question our own young players while giving the benefit of the doubt to other teams young players...but I guess that's just because we see them all the time.
I wouldn't feel good about trading Thor or Matz for the "potential" that Russell "might" become. If I'm trading those types of pitchers, I wasn't proven taken in return. Not potential. We already have potential.
You are right, it happens all the time. It would be a big big risk to trade our starting pitcher depth for Russell. Especially since Russell's minor league stats aren't that dissimilar from our own "potential" player Flores.
Herrera, Nimmo, Montero or Mejia?
He also brought up Hanley, but his injury stuff is scary and he's probably too much $. Does have 15 HRs though.
First time ever through deGrom-Thor-Harvey-Matz rotation, they went...
3-0, 29.2 IP, 19 H, 5 BB, 21 K
1.21 ERA, 0.81 WHIP
IT'S HAPPENING!
IT'S HAPPENING! [/quote]
The PhenoMETnals
granderson has a higher bwar, gomez isn't having a great season.
Familia will be a likely selection but you never know about all star relievers.
is he available for pinch hitting duties?
IT'S HAPPENING!
The PhenoMETnals [/quote]
worst nickname ever.
If they somehow got in the playoffs, who's in your playoff rotation?
Rotate Cuddyer in a little bit with those 3 guys, and honestly with the way Lagares has played, it's 50-50 whether or note Gomez ends up in a corner or CF. Put a 20 HR/30 steal guy with his kind of speed at the top of the lineup and it changes this lineup in a big way.
It just doesn't make any sense.
if I'm trading one of them it's for a young cost-controlled OFer with all-star potenital. Not a season and a half rental who will be 31 when the extension kicks in.
Thor/Matz 22/23 year old stud top of the rotation starter under team control for 5+ years for 1 year of Carlos Gomez.
Not if I were the GM.
I think that's the most realistic "big get" that could happen for this team, though still obviously a long shot.
Matt Harvey for Kris Bryant.
Go.
Matt Harvey for Kris Bryant.
Go.
If the cubs approached me and not the other way around, i would ask for more plus Bryant, Harvey is a bit more established than Bryant (rookie). Call me crazy but I would try to get more for Harvey.
Funny you should say that. It's just something that was thrown out there on ESPN radio from Ryan Ruocco.
"Metro2007 wrote:
I just can't knock taking a lefty who throws low 90's, good frame, plus slider and local... plus "Lets go Matz" will be awesome! lol"
:)
3rd in fwar and top 10 in bwar, metrics love him. Kipnis is tied with Frazier in fwar btw.