Buried beneath the sensationalized social media avalanche of panic: the more judicious and careful observations of Los Angeles Times reporter Matt Pearce that the feds have made no official determinations that any hate crimes have taken place and that "it's unclear whether any of the fires are linked."
It was observed that "one of the half-dozen church crimes was most likely "accidental" and had "no element of criminal intent."
Another "was likely touched off by an electrical short" after a tree limb fell on the property, yanking the electrical service line with it.
And yet another alleged "black church arson" actually involved a white church "struck by lightning."
Buried beneath the sensationalized social media avalanche of panic: the more judicious and careful observations of Los Angeles Times reporter Matt Pearce that the feds have made no official determinations that any hate crimes have taken place and that "it's unclear whether any of the fires are linked."
It was observed that "one of the half-dozen church crimes was most likely "accidental" and had "no element of criminal intent."
Another "was likely touched off by an electrical short" after a tree limb fell on the property, yanking the electrical service line with it.
And yet another alleged "black church arson" actually involved a white church "struck by lightning."
Link - ( New Window )
and try to find the retractions.....retractions are bad business, and boring.
each time we have a storm there are usually a few houses or other buildings that burn down. A church near us burned to the ground a few years ago. I wouldn't ignore the lightning factor, especially this time of year. Our house was struck by lightning a few years ago, but luckily there was limited damage.
each time we have a storm there are usually a few houses or other buildings that burn down. A church near us burned to the ground a few years ago. I wouldn't ignore the lightning factor, especially this time of year. Our house was struck by lightning a few years ago, but luckily there was limited damage.
It's nice to have an optimistic view, but given that this is the 7th one since the SC shooting, and this same church was burned before...
of the burnings were the result of lightning and one wasn't even a black church. The FBI and ATF investigate all church burnings so if there is a link, they will find it.
at least 15 to 20 trucks and cars with huge confederate flags driving around the past week or so. I say that's a large number because usually we'd just see the one random redneck doing so every maybe once or twice per year.
They have even infested this tiny quiet beach town I'm in on the NC coast right now.
which you also acknowledged in your original post, I can't figure out if you were being facetious or not in starting this thread.
What "actual reasons" are you referring to Bill? The 3 churches that have already been confirmed as arson, or the other 4 that are still under investigation? Or are you just trolling?
the flag isn't about hate? Nooooooo of course not.
Oh give it a break. Because of my father’s job I lived a good portion of my youth in the south, and can tell you from firsthand experience that the confederate flag has different meaning to different people. For most people from the south it is a symbol of southern pride and heritage, for many in the African American community it is understandably a symbol of oppression, discrimination and slavery, and for a very small minority it is a symbol of their hate (KKK, Neo-Nazis, Skinheads, etc…). The haters don’t need a flag to hate.
the flag isn't about hate? Nooooooo of course not.
Oh give it a break. Because of my father’s job I lived a good portion of my youth in the south, and can tell you from firsthand experience that the confederate flag has different meaning to different people. For most people from the south it is a symbol of southern pride and heritage, for many in the African American community it is understandably a symbol of oppression, discrimination and slavery, and for a very small minority it is a symbol of their hate (KKK, Neo-Nazis, Skinheads, etc…). The haters don’t need a flag to hate.
The presence of two posters with Beer in their name, each with very different opinions, confuses the fuck out of me.
In so deep into your head you probably think about me when you do the nasty with your old lady. I take it as a compliment that I mean so much to you. Thank you of always thinking of me
the flag isn't about hate? Nooooooo of course not.
Oh give it a break. Because of my father’s job I lived a good portion of my youth in the south, and can tell you from firsthand experience that the confederate flag has different meaning to different people. For most people from the south it is a symbol of southern pride and heritage, for many in the African American community it is understandably a symbol of oppression, discrimination and slavery, and for a very small minority it is a symbol of their hate (KKK, Neo-Nazis, Skinheads, etc…). The haters don’t need a flag to hate.
I've spent a lot of time in the South myself - and there's lots of folks that are still fighting the Civil War in their minds, and that are not only in denial that the South lost the war, but to this day think that the outcome was just plain wrong. This is especially true of relatives of Southern Officers that fought in the War.
and fuck your Taylor ham, overrated pizza, and cheesestaks...chicken fried steak, shrimp and grits, ham with red-eye, greens and fried chicken, low country boil...kill them all.
display flags or other memorabilia that could reasonably be interpreted as offensive.
I don't display anything. But so much as displaying a flag sends a poor message, desecrating one also does. So fuck the people in Brooklyn (or wherever it is) this weekend. They're no different in spirit or ethos than the ones who display the Confederate flag with malicious intent.
of idiots with Confederate flags in their trucks up in Dalton Georgia, and a bunch of them got into an accident, LOL. There are videos on You Tube. We saw one in the parking lot of the local supermarket. Most people were making fun of them.
Look, I want the FBI to investigate these church fires and if they catch someone, they should be prosecuted and sent away. But let's not get hysterical until we know it's some kind of racist crime wave.
display flags or other memorabilia that could reasonably be interpreted as offensive.
I don't display anything. But so much as displaying a flag sends a poor message, desecrating one also does. So fuck the people in Brooklyn (or wherever it is) this weekend. They're no different in spirit or ethos than the ones who display the Confederate flag with malicious intent.
I have an American flag in front of the house. Sort of simple, really.
from funerals, graduation, etc but they're either displayed in a case or boxed. I know several neighbors which display what looks to be a marine corps flag. At one point we had a small blue star mothers flag in the window but only for a short while because I thought it was hokey.
My damn neighbor has a Pittsburgh Steelers flag standing on her lawn all autumn.
Personally, I think the American flag and the POW-MIA flag are the only ones people should have and all that should fly on gov't buildings besides the state flags. Nothing else.
and fuck your Taylor ham, overrated pizza, and cheesestaks...chicken fried steak, shrimp and grits, ham with red-eye, greens and fried chicken, low country boil...kill them all.
That's what the South is to me, haters.
I'm equal opportunity. Give me a taylor ham, egg and cheese on an egg bagel any day of the week, but you can pry my barbecue and my shrimp and grits from my cold, dead hands.
Kidding aside though, much of the South is more, and better, integrated than wide swaths (geographic and population) of the North. It may be difficult to wrap your head around someone who flies the Confederate battle flag but manages to live and work in a multi-racial world but it does happen.
this is another hands up don't shoot orgy that we have seen previously here or maybe there is some basis in fact to there being hate groups behind some of these. As aleays, I take the position that we wait until we get some facts from investigations before we reach any conclusions.
RE: We are all allowed to have our own opinions... Â
and fuck your Taylor ham, overrated pizza, and cheesestaks...chicken fried steak, shrimp and grits, ham with red-eye, greens and fried chicken, low country boil...kill them all.
That's what the South is to me, haters.
I'm equal opportunity. Give me a taylor ham, egg and cheese on an egg bagel any day of the week, but you can pry my barbecue and my shrimp and grits from my cold, dead hands.
Kidding aside though, much of the South is more, and better, integrated than wide swaths (geographic and population) of the North. It may be difficult to wrap your head around someone who flies the Confederate battle flag but manages to live and work in a multi-racial world but it does happen.
When we moved to upstate NY from Dallas I was surprised at how much more race was noticed. So many people use "coloreds" as descriptors. I chalked it up to big city versus podunk rather than region but of all the places that I've where I have seen or felt racial animus, it's been the northeast by far where it has been more prevalent.
Long Island, Virginia, California, Arizona, Alabama, Florida. This is, of course, merely anecdotal, but in my experience the races come into contact a helluva lot more in the south than the north. Doesn't mean they always get along, but there's more of a comfort level with intermingling in daily life there.
I also saw more interracial babies in rural Alabama than anywhere else I've been, FWIW. It's an odd dynamic - there are undoubtedly plenty of racists remaining in rural southern societies but they manage to interact on a daily basis much more than in the north.
the flag isn't about hate? Nooooooo of course not.
Oh give it a break. Because of my father’s job I lived a good portion of my youth in the south, and can tell you from firsthand experience that the confederate flag has different meaning to different people. For most people from the south it is a symbol of southern pride and heritage, for many in the African American community it is understandably a symbol of oppression, discrimination and slavery, and for a very small minority it is a symbol of their hate (KKK, Neo-Nazis, Skinheads, etc…). The haters don’t need a flag to hate.
Truthfully, I agree with this. Millions of non-racist people love the confederate flag out of southern pride.
That is and should be irrelevant though, because the flag not only means something else to others, but it truly is a symbol of racism at it's core.
this is another hands up don't shoot orgy that we have seen previously here or maybe there is some basis in fact to there being hate groups behind some of these. As aleays, I take the position that we wait until we get some facts from investigations before we reach any conclusions.
Would that those attacking HRC on the other thread would take such a viewpoint. Currently, she's been deemed guilty by both association and innuendo, but without, as yet, hard facts.
She may be guilty as hell, innocent as a newborn lamb, or, likely, somewhere in between. But she doesn't get the same level of judicious "let's wait for the facts" consideration.
Pre-suppose all you like, but how do you all reconcile the jarring disconnect? Is it that suspected political misbehavior scores higher on the outrage scale with some of you than the possibility of racially-motivated crime?
It was observed that "one of the half-dozen church crimes was most likely "accidental" and had "no element of criminal intent."
Another "was likely touched off by an electrical short" after a tree limb fell on the property, yanking the electrical service line with it.
And yet another alleged "black church arson" actually involved a white church "struck by lightning."
Link - ( New Window )
Really? I thought it was the headline this morning on Good Morning America.
Quote:
Buried beneath the sensationalized social media avalanche of panic: the more judicious and careful observations of Los Angeles Times reporter Matt Pearce that the feds have made no official determinations that any hate crimes have taken place and that "it's unclear whether any of the fires are linked."
It was observed that "one of the half-dozen church crimes was most likely "accidental" and had "no element of criminal intent."
Another "was likely touched off by an electrical short" after a tree limb fell on the property, yanking the electrical service line with it.
And yet another alleged "black church arson" actually involved a white church "struck by lightning."
Link - ( New Window )
and try to find the retractions.....retractions are bad business, and boring.
All over the local morning news this morning in Richmond.
This is CNN.
It's nice to have an optimistic view, but given that this is the 7th one since the SC shooting, and this same church was burned before...
They have even infested this tiny quiet beach town I'm in on the NC coast right now.
But even if a couple of these are explained away as lightning or natural causes it's still alarming at its face. One is alarming at its face.
What "actual reasons" are you referring to Bill? The 3 churches that have already been confirmed as arson, or the other 4 that are still under investigation? Or are you just trolling?
Also, a church about an hour outside of Charleston burned after a clear lightning strike and a tree falling on it.
I hope the media does their homework before inciting things here.
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the flag isn't about hate? Nooooooo of course not.
Oh give it a break. Because of my father’s job I lived a good portion of my youth in the south, and can tell you from firsthand experience that the confederate flag has different meaning to different people. For most people from the south it is a symbol of southern pride and heritage, for many in the African American community it is understandably a symbol of oppression, discrimination and slavery, and for a very small minority it is a symbol of their hate (KKK, Neo-Nazis, Skinheads, etc…). The haters don’t need a flag to hate.
The presence of two posters with Beer in their name, each with very different opinions, confuses the fuck out of me.
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ridiculous....
Really? I thought it was the headline this morning on Good Morning America.
It WAS a lead story in the 7 AM Today Show.
Quote:
the flag isn't about hate? Nooooooo of course not.
Oh give it a break. Because of my father’s job I lived a good portion of my youth in the south, and can tell you from firsthand experience that the confederate flag has different meaning to different people. For most people from the south it is a symbol of southern pride and heritage, for many in the African American community it is understandably a symbol of oppression, discrimination and slavery, and for a very small minority it is a symbol of their hate (KKK, Neo-Nazis, Skinheads, etc…). The haters don’t need a flag to hate.
I've spent a lot of time in the South myself - and there's lots of folks that are still fighting the Civil War in their minds, and that are not only in denial that the South lost the war, but to this day think that the outcome was just plain wrong. This is especially true of relatives of Southern Officers that fought in the War.
That's what the South is to me, haters.
I don't display anything. But so much as displaying a flag sends a poor message, desecrating one also does. So fuck the people in Brooklyn (or wherever it is) this weekend. They're no different in spirit or ethos than the ones who display the Confederate flag with malicious intent.
Look, I want the FBI to investigate these church fires and if they catch someone, they should be prosecuted and sent away. But let's not get hysterical until we know it's some kind of racist crime wave.
Quote:
display flags or other memorabilia that could reasonably be interpreted as offensive.
I don't display anything. But so much as displaying a flag sends a poor message, desecrating one also does. So fuck the people in Brooklyn (or wherever it is) this weekend. They're no different in spirit or ethos than the ones who display the Confederate flag with malicious intent.
My damn neighbor has a Pittsburgh Steelers flag standing on her lawn all autumn.
Personally, I think the American flag and the POW-MIA flag are the only ones people should have and all that should fly on gov't buildings besides the state flags. Nothing else.
Read the article, they are already involved. The FBI and ATF investigate all church burnings.
That's what the South is to me, haters.
I'm equal opportunity. Give me a taylor ham, egg and cheese on an egg bagel any day of the week, but you can pry my barbecue and my shrimp and grits from my cold, dead hands.
Kidding aside though, much of the South is more, and better, integrated than wide swaths (geographic and population) of the North. It may be difficult to wrap your head around someone who flies the Confederate battle flag but manages to live and work in a multi-racial world but it does happen.
Hokey is the last thing I would think.
Quote:
At one point we had a small blue star mothers flag in the window but only for a short while because I thought it was hokey.
Hokey is the last thing I would think.
Quote:
and fuck your Taylor ham, overrated pizza, and cheesestaks...chicken fried steak, shrimp and grits, ham with red-eye, greens and fried chicken, low country boil...kill them all.
That's what the South is to me, haters.
I'm equal opportunity. Give me a taylor ham, egg and cheese on an egg bagel any day of the week, but you can pry my barbecue and my shrimp and grits from my cold, dead hands.
Kidding aside though, much of the South is more, and better, integrated than wide swaths (geographic and population) of the North. It may be difficult to wrap your head around someone who flies the Confederate battle flag but manages to live and work in a multi-racial world but it does happen.
When we moved to upstate NY from Dallas I was surprised at how much more race was noticed. So many people use "coloreds" as descriptors. I chalked it up to big city versus podunk rather than region but of all the places that I've where I have seen or felt racial animus, it's been the northeast by far where it has been more prevalent.
I also saw more interracial babies in rural Alabama than anywhere else I've been, FWIW. It's an odd dynamic - there are undoubtedly plenty of racists remaining in rural southern societies but they manage to interact on a daily basis much more than in the north.
Quote:
the flag isn't about hate? Nooooooo of course not.
Oh give it a break. Because of my father’s job I lived a good portion of my youth in the south, and can tell you from firsthand experience that the confederate flag has different meaning to different people. For most people from the south it is a symbol of southern pride and heritage, for many in the African American community it is understandably a symbol of oppression, discrimination and slavery, and for a very small minority it is a symbol of their hate (KKK, Neo-Nazis, Skinheads, etc…). The haters don’t need a flag to hate.
Truthfully, I agree with this. Millions of non-racist people love the confederate flag out of southern pride.
That is and should be irrelevant though, because the flag not only means something else to others, but it truly is a symbol of racism at it's core.
What do Florida and New York have in common?
The further north you go the deeper in the south you get.
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but I have to disagree with this thought...
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At one point we had a small blue star mothers flag in the window but only for a short while because I thought it was hokey.
Hokey is the last thing I would think.
Probably not the right words and I don't mean to be disrespectful. Just didn't like calling attention to ourselves.
Bill, that certainly makes sense.
Would that those attacking HRC on the other thread would take such a viewpoint. Currently, she's been deemed guilty by both association and innuendo, but without, as yet, hard facts.
She may be guilty as hell, innocent as a newborn lamb, or, likely, somewhere in between. But she doesn't get the same level of judicious "let's wait for the facts" consideration.
Pre-suppose all you like, but how do you all reconcile the jarring disconnect? Is it that suspected political misbehavior scores higher on the outrage scale with some of you than the possibility of racially-motivated crime?