season, so how do you justify $15mill. for a portion of games ? is there a way to pro-rate his earnings for 2015 ? rather the resources go elsewhere, players who have proven the desire to get better and follow a straight path ie. Eli, Prince etc. ...
See Big Blue Blogger's thread on this. The team is not on the hook for non football injuries with respect to guaranteed money
I would say that we are dealing with a good natured level headed young man. Let's give him a long term lucrative contract and let Eli Manning twist in the wind unsure of his tenure with the Giants.
I wonder how many people on here will call him dumb? I know, I know, he knows how to play soccer better than JPP knows how to play with fireworks.
Playing soccer is an attempt at staying in shape. If JPP hurt himself playing basketball or soccer, I'd have no issue and treat it the same as Beatty.
A sport that has almost as many injuries as the NFL? I am sure you could find ways to stay in shape without playing such a sport with so many injuries. My only point is not to prove JPP is right, but to show how dumb our line in the sand is regarding athletes stupidity. If you can relate to it, it is ok; if you can't, it is not. I have never went near a firework in my life, but I hear a lot of people like playing with them. While it seems foolish to me, what right do I have to say that is any worse than a pro athlete playing a game where there are significant injury risks?
Eli Manning twist in the wind unsure of his tenure with the Giants.
I'm not sure that's the case at all given that his agent said he wasn't worried whatsoever and the deal would get done when it's time to. Eli Manning isn't "twisting in the wind". He's got an 11 year working relationship with the franchise, and he's a beloved figure.
1. That chris r post was just phenomenal. I actually caught my jaw dropping after I read it. He fucks with everyone and everyone falls for it every time. Myself included.
2. Torrag gets upset that he got corrected while in an argument, meanwhile he pulled the same shit with me a few days ago when I made nitpicking into two words. Clown.
3. One obvious troll makes a clear racist comment, and all the high and mighty posters come on here to claim this thread racist. No, it's the one poster that's racist. The thread itself seems immature, but not racist.
4. That Headhunter response to that X-Ray was absolute fucking gold. I don't know why I found that as funny as I did.
5. B in ALBs Happy Gilmore picture also deserves more credit. Fucking hysterical.
RE: RE: Based on the dialogue of that You Tube clip
Eli Manning twist in the wind unsure of his tenure with the Giants.
I'm not sure that's the case at all given that his agent said he wasn't worried whatsoever and the deal would get done when it's time to. Eli Manning isn't "twisting in the wind". He's got an 11 year working relationship with the franchise, and he's a beloved figure.
The point is that Eli's status has become an issue when it shouldn't even be a blip on the radar screen for this guy. He and his agent shouldn't have to be asked to comment about it. This GM should go to a class on "priorities".
RE: RE: RE: Rory McIlroy tore a ligament playing soccer
I wonder how many people on here will call him dumb? I know, I know, he knows how to play soccer better than JPP knows how to play with fireworks.
Playing soccer is an attempt at staying in shape. If JPP hurt himself playing basketball or soccer, I'd have no issue and treat it the same as Beatty.
A sport that has almost as many injuries as the NFL? I am sure you could find ways to stay in shape without playing such a sport with so many injuries. My only point is not to prove JPP is right, but to show how dumb our line in the sand is regarding athletes stupidity. If you can relate to it, it is ok; if you can't, it is not. I have never went near a firework in my life, but I hear a lot of people like playing with them. While it seems foolish to me, what right do I have to say that is any worse than a pro athlete playing a game where there are significant injury risks?
What is the benefit to playing with fireworks? I'm fine if a player prefers taking the marginal risk of playing basketball over running 5 miles to get his cardio in.
RE: RE: RE: Based on the dialogue of that You Tube clip
Eli Manning twist in the wind unsure of his tenure with the Giants.
I'm not sure that's the case at all given that his agent said he wasn't worried whatsoever and the deal would get done when it's time to. Eli Manning isn't "twisting in the wind". He's got an 11 year working relationship with the franchise, and he's a beloved figure.
The point is that Eli's status has become an issue when it shouldn't even be a blip on the radar screen for this guy. He and his agent shouldn't have to be asked to comment about it. This GM should go to a class on "priorities".
It's only become an issue for people who are tasked with selling newspapers. And this is just a guess, but the GM probably has to have a talk with John Mara before handing out, or not handing out, $100+ million dollar contracts. So, I'm sure John Mara is quite in the loop here.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Rory McIlroy tore a ligament playing soccer
I wonder how many people on here will call him dumb? I know, I know, he knows how to play soccer better than JPP knows how to play with fireworks.
Playing soccer is an attempt at staying in shape. If JPP hurt himself playing basketball or soccer, I'd have no issue and treat it the same as Beatty.
A sport that has almost as many injuries as the NFL? I am sure you could find ways to stay in shape without playing such a sport with so many injuries. My only point is not to prove JPP is right, but to show how dumb our line in the sand is regarding athletes stupidity. If you can relate to it, it is ok; if you can't, it is not. I have never went near a firework in my life, but I hear a lot of people like playing with them. While it seems foolish to me, what right do I have to say that is any worse than a pro athlete playing a game where there are significant injury risks?
What is the benefit to playing with fireworks? I'm fine if a player prefers taking the marginal risk of playing basketball over running 5 miles to get his cardio in.
True, there is no athletic benefit to it, but there is a benefit in having fun. I just think a lot of times we kill a player because we think it is stupid and forget that they don't. They all have lives and if soccer makes Rory happy, great. If fireworks makes JPP happy, that's great for him (so long as it is legal in the jurisdiction). what about riding a motorcycle? As I said, my main point is where do we draw the line? For you, it seems to me if they get athletic benefits, but I doubt that was why Rory was playing soccer. I would imagine he was playing primarily because he loves the game and the benefit was simply ancillary.
Playing soccer isn't inherently dangerous. Could you get hurt? Sure, but you could also get hurt falling down the stairs.
Fire crackers are inherently dangerous. We've all heard by now about the imbecile who lit a fire cracker on his head and died. There's pretty much no threat of death or limb loss in soccer.
you do need to take precaution (and that might be where the issue lies), but I'm the last person who's going to jump up on that moral high horse and say "you shouldn't be playing with fireworks" that's silly. I'm in my early 40's and they're as much fun now as they were when I was 13.
even for a superstar professional athlete.
if you don't like fireworks you won't get it, but IMO lighting off fireworks isn't the issue.
don't play with fireworks
RE: Comparing soccer and fire crackers is asinine.
Playing soccer isn't inherently dangerous. Could you get hurt? Sure, but you could also get hurt falling down the stairs.
Fire crackers are inherently dangerous. We've all heard by now about the imbecile who lit a fire cracker on his head and died. There's pretty much no threat of death or limb loss in soccer.
I don't know the stats, but if I had to guess, there are more catastrophic firework injuries, but many more of the injuries that Rory suffered in soccer than fireworks, which would keep an athlete out of his sport for a significant time.
By all accounts,JPP is a good guy. He may or may not be the hardest working or one who makes the best decisions but he hasn't been suspended,arrested,etc. So he is a big kid and does immature stuff. I hope this teaches JPP a hard lesson and he straightens himself out and becomes the best football player he can be for the NY Giants. This is not even close to carrying a concealed weapon and shooting yourself.
I tend to agree with Marty here. Being a dumb ass with fireworks is pretty common. When I was young, I took stupid chances too.
JPP is 26 years old. He's not that young anymore. Time to grow up. He may not be a criminal but he is an immature idiot - less like Plaxico and more like Jeremy Shockey.
I don't recall Shockey doing anything off the field that prevented him from being on it ... why is his name always mentioned ? the guy was a fire ball on field, do you take issue with that ? seems like we could use a player or 2 on both sides of the ball with the desire of Shockey ... team is full of pussy's ...
If you dont think Shockey was an immature asshole then I don't know what to tell you. He made plenty of headlines off the field, even with the Saints. I'm not calling JPP an asshole (maybe he is, I dont know) but he is really immature and this is a pretty good example of it.
JPP's foolishness is only due in part to playing with fireworks
Most of it is that he was actually stupid enough to allow one to blow up in his hand.
Look at the picture of the van full of fireworks. Watch the Instagram video. If you think that is the portrait of something other than a complete fool, then you see the world differently than I do.
And that's fine. The only thing that is important is how the Giants' front office sees this. If they choose to retain him and make him a cornerstone of the long term on field product, then I think it's fair to question not only their judgment, but their sanity as well.
RE: And then Tom Brady went cliff diving this year.
He also went hand gliding. We forget that these guys are people. I work with professionals, many who do thrill seeking sky diving, cliff diving, skiing, mountain climbing. Nobody calls them idiots. Would I ever do that, not a chance, I am afraid of my own shadow. I don't think they are dumb for enjoying or seeking things that give them thrills.
By all accounts,JPP is a good guy. He may or may not be the hardest working or one who makes the best decisions but he hasn't been suspended,arrested,etc. So he is a big kid and does immature stuff. I hope this teaches JPP a hard lesson and he straightens himself out and becomes the best football player he can be for the NY Giants. This is not even close to carrying a concealed weapon and shooting yourself.
I tend to agree with Marty here. Being a dumb ass with fireworks is pretty common. When I was young, I took stupid chances too.
JPP is 26 years old. He's not that young anymore. Time to grow up. He may not be a criminal but he is an immature idiot - less like Plaxico and more like Jeremy Shockey.
I don't recall Shockey doing anything off the field that prevented him from being on it ... why is his name always mentioned ? the guy was a fire ball on field, do you take issue with that ? seems like we could use a player or 2 on both sides of the ball with the desire of Shockey ... team is full of pussy's ...
If you dont think Shockey was an immature asshole then I don't know what to tell you. He made plenty of headlines off the field, even with the Saints. I'm not calling JPP an asshole (maybe he is, I dont know) but he is really immature and this is a pretty good example of it.
Shockey never did anything off the field that prevented him from participating on Sunday ... you can not compare JPP to Shockey ... If JPP had an ounce of what Shockey display'ed desire wise one could imagine what kind of player we would have ...
If Tom Brady would've broken his neck and died while cliff diving,
most of us would be calling him an asshole too. Here's the difference though... if something happened to Tom Brady, his kids and family would be fine. He wife makes more money than he does. His parents lived comfortably before he made it big.
Do you honestly think JPP's family is getting access to 15 million dollars ever again if he loses his ability to play football due to this foolishness? I saw a story on his family... they weren't broke, but no one there is ever getting close to 15 million again. To put your family and children's future at risk like that is insane.
I'm not trying to sound holier than thou. In high school, my best friend got a box of fireworks from his uncle and we lit them in the field behind a school. Here's the difference... we were kids AND no one was dependent on us as bread winners.
Did Brady cliff dive into kiddie pool?. Did he fly his glider into power lines?
I agree that Brady's behavior was risky. I'd call it riskier even than enjoying some fireworks. But what isn't being factored into that comparison is that Brady pulled those things off fine, while JPP couldn't even pull off the fireworks without being lucky to still have ten fingers at the end of it.
JPP is a fool. Brady is not. That is an enormously important distinction to make.
And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
RE: If Tom Brady would've broken his neck and died while cliff diving,
most of us would be calling him an asshole too. Here's the difference though... if something happened to Tom Brady, his kids and family would be fine. He wife makes more money than he does. His parents lived comfortably before he made it big.
Do you honestly think JPP's family is getting access to 15 million dollars ever again if he loses his ability to play football due to this foolishness? I saw a story on his family... they weren't broke, but no one there is ever getting close to 15 million again. To put your family and children's future at risk like that is insane.
I'm not trying to sound holier than thou. In high school, my best friend got a box of fireworks from his uncle and we lit them in the field behind a school. Here's the difference... we were kids AND no one was dependent on us as bread winners.
If that is your criticism, that's absolutely fine. I don't think there's that much concern for him as a person so much as concern for what can he do for the fans on sundays.
Did Brady cliff dive into kiddie pool?. Did he fly his glider into power lines?
I agree that Brady's behavior was risky. I'd call it riskier even than enjoying some fireworks. But what isn't being factored into that comparison is that Brady pulled those things off fine, while JPP couldn't even pull off the fireworks without being lucky to still have ten fingers at the end of it.
JPP is a fool. Brady is not. That is an enormously important distinction to make.
If anything, they're both fools. The difference is one of them didn't get hurt engaging in their foolery. Think Belichick didn't have a talk with him once that story came out? And if JPP doesn't get hurt, nobody cares about this either.
Shockey was the model teammate and person. He never displayed any off field antics that made headlines or publicly bad-mouthed the team or got into a shouting match with his boss and got sent packing out of New York. Sure, he didn't injure himself or get suspended, but his immaturity put a dent in his production and wallet and character, in other ways.
And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
If anything, they're both fools. The difference is one of them didn't get hurt engaging in their foolery. Think Belichick didn't have a talk with him once that story came out? And if JPP doesn't get hurt, nobody cares about this either.
I disagree in the sense that if a story came out that said, "JPP buys truck full of fireworks and plans to light them himself", plenty of people would've said "WTF?" Just because we hear about it afterwards or we don't hear about it at all because no one (thankfully) got hurt doesn't make his decision less stupid.
And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Shockey reportedly consistently ran incorrect routes, leading to multiple Eli interceptions. Eli took a huge step once Shockey went down with inferior talents at TE. Eli has turned low-cost investments into incredibly productive players for the Giants, including Boss (left due to FA), Ballard (injuries), and Donnell.
Shockey is a great example of what Britt/Terps discussed early in the thread in ensuring your investing in guys with the right character.
And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Would have continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense....if what? He hadn't been a douche? And while he was productive, he also made a slew of mistakes - some of them costly because he was an arrogant prick. Ask Eli Manning if he misses Jeremy Shockey. Given the choice between Shockey and some of the "misfits" like Boss, Ballard, or Bennett - I think he'd take the misfits any day. Both on the field and in the locker room.
And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Would have continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense....if what? He hadn't been a douche? And while he was productive, he also made a slew of mistakes - some of them costly because he was an arrogant prick. Ask Eli Manning if he misses Jeremy Shockey. Given the choice between Shockey and some of the "misfits" like Boss, Ballard, or Bennett - I think he'd take the misfits any day. Both on the field and in the locker room.
Who's to say the slew of mistakes weren't on a young QB learning the nuisances of the NFL ... from what I also remember was a very shakey young rookie QB those first few years, you can not pin the mistakes solely on one player ... Anyway, everyone has missed my point, why even mention or draw comparison to Shockey when comparing him to JPP ... JPP is a moron, alienated a then 1st rd. rookie and has questionable commitment to his craft ...
And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Shockey reportedly consistently ran incorrect routes, leading to multiple Eli interceptions. Eli took a huge step once Shockey went down with inferior talents at TE. Eli has turned low-cost investments into incredibly productive players for the Giants, including Boss (left due to FA), Ballard (injuries), and Donnell.
Shockey is a great example of what Britt/Terps discussed early in the thread in ensuring your investing in guys with the right character.
And this is really all I was saying when I mentioned Shockey.
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Shockey is a great example of what Britt/Terps discussed early in the thread in ensuring your investing in guys with the right character.
I think we all know the partying and drinking stories.
So, when you see that he's breaking down and injured as a 26-28 year old, you know he wasn't really committed.
Would the Giants have put up with the antics on the field as long as he rolled up his sleeves and acted like he wanted to be the best? They've done that for other players.
RE: Part of shockey's problem was that he didn't really prepare like a pro
I think we all know the partying and drinking stories.
So, when you see that he's breaking down and injured as a 26-28 year old, you know he wasn't really committed.
Would the Giants have put up with the antics on the field as long as he rolled up his sleeves and acted like he wanted to be the best? They've done that for other players.
he had issue with the newly appointed GM at the time, he was beloved by EA, but there was tension behind the scenes when Reese took over ... I do not think there as a Sunday where he was never the most fired up ready player on the field ... so stop with the preparation nonsense ...
I recall articles criticizing Shockey for not joining Eli's off-season workouts.
We also have this:
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Toomer said Shockey 'tried to take advantage' of Eli by pressuring him for the ball. He also said there was 'no question' Eli had improved his play after the distraction of Jeremy Shockey was gone from the locker room and from the huddle.
when there reports of properzi catching him partying the nite before. Fassel let him get away with absolute everything. Yet he claims he was treated like a zoo animal or something as a Giant to perform on the spot. Yeah, sounds like a guy who took his craft serious.
I usually hate to get involved in any Shockey talk because I'm
obviously biased and I think BBI has a tendency to form group think about certain players/coaches to which no stats/facts can penetrate those beliefs.
- Eli has led the league in INTs 3 times, twice after Shockey played his last game in Blue. Heck, Shockey didn't even play all of the games the one year Eli led the league in picks while he was still on the team. Enough with the Shockey route running as the source of Eli's picks nonsense. Eli throws a lot of picks. I love the guy, but he throws picks regardless of the receivers, offense, stadium, or opponent. You guys watched the San Francisco game last year, right? You would've thought Eli took a shit at midfield with the amount of complaining on BBI after the pick in Seattle last season.
- Shockey's problem wasn't off the field issues... he simply got hurt and wasn't the same physically. It happens to physical players and especially at that position. Kevin Boss' career was short. Jake Ballard's career was a shooting star. Whether players are angels off the field or not, they get hurt in this game. There are a thousand examples of guys who don't drink and party who get hurt all the damn time. It's just happens in this sport.
- Let's not compare JPP and Shockey, either as players or connect them somehow because of this incident. I like JPP, but he hasn't come close to matching his 2011 performance. Shockey was 1st team All-Pro as a rookie and was leading NFL TEs in catches (2nd in yards) at the time of his season-ending injury the next year. He ended up making 3 more Pro Bowls after his rookie season.
- Using Amani Toomer as evidence Shockey is a bad guy or selfish? The same Amani Toomer who accused the Giants coaching staff of "freezing him out" at the end of his career?
"No, because you know what? No matter what, they've got an agenda," Toomer said. "I could talk until I'm blue in the face, it's not going to make any difference. And you know from dealing with the head coach that's not how he is. You could talk to him, but if he has something in his mind that's what's going to go on."
So if we're only concerned with outcomes, and not risks, then if JPP is fine, we're good then right?
The outcome here was that JPP let an explosive donate in his hand, and he likely did this a few feet away from children and a van full of more explosives. If that's an outcome with which you want to associate yourself, good for you.
See Big Blue Blogger's thread on this. The team is not on the hook for non football injuries with respect to guaranteed money
at this point, we don't know the extent of the burns, nor whether there is nerve damage.
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I wonder how many people on here will call him dumb? I know, I know, he knows how to play soccer better than JPP knows how to play with fireworks.
Playing soccer is an attempt at staying in shape. If JPP hurt himself playing basketball or soccer, I'd have no issue and treat it the same as Beatty.
A sport that has almost as many injuries as the NFL? I am sure you could find ways to stay in shape without playing such a sport with so many injuries. My only point is not to prove JPP is right, but to show how dumb our line in the sand is regarding athletes stupidity. If you can relate to it, it is ok; if you can't, it is not. I have never went near a firework in my life, but I hear a lot of people like playing with them. While it seems foolish to me, what right do I have to say that is any worse than a pro athlete playing a game where there are significant injury risks?
I'm not sure that's the case at all given that his agent said he wasn't worried whatsoever and the deal would get done when it's time to. Eli Manning isn't "twisting in the wind". He's got an 11 year working relationship with the franchise, and he's a beloved figure.
1. That chris r post was just phenomenal. I actually caught my jaw dropping after I read it. He fucks with everyone and everyone falls for it every time. Myself included.
2. Torrag gets upset that he got corrected while in an argument, meanwhile he pulled the same shit with me a few days ago when I made nitpicking into two words. Clown.
3. One obvious troll makes a clear racist comment, and all the high and mighty posters come on here to claim this thread racist. No, it's the one poster that's racist. The thread itself seems immature, but not racist.
4. That Headhunter response to that X-Ray was absolute fucking gold. I don't know why I found that as funny as I did.
5. B in ALBs Happy Gilmore picture also deserves more credit. Fucking hysterical.
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Eli Manning twist in the wind unsure of his tenure with the Giants.
I'm not sure that's the case at all given that his agent said he wasn't worried whatsoever and the deal would get done when it's time to. Eli Manning isn't "twisting in the wind". He's got an 11 year working relationship with the franchise, and he's a beloved figure.
The point is that Eli's status has become an issue when it shouldn't even be a blip on the radar screen for this guy. He and his agent shouldn't have to be asked to comment about it. This GM should go to a class on "priorities".
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In comment 12357492 Essex said:
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I wonder how many people on here will call him dumb? I know, I know, he knows how to play soccer better than JPP knows how to play with fireworks.
Playing soccer is an attempt at staying in shape. If JPP hurt himself playing basketball or soccer, I'd have no issue and treat it the same as Beatty.
A sport that has almost as many injuries as the NFL? I am sure you could find ways to stay in shape without playing such a sport with so many injuries. My only point is not to prove JPP is right, but to show how dumb our line in the sand is regarding athletes stupidity. If you can relate to it, it is ok; if you can't, it is not. I have never went near a firework in my life, but I hear a lot of people like playing with them. While it seems foolish to me, what right do I have to say that is any worse than a pro athlete playing a game where there are significant injury risks?
What is the benefit to playing with fireworks? I'm fine if a player prefers taking the marginal risk of playing basketball over running 5 miles to get his cardio in.
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In comment 12357519 Johnny Boy said:
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Eli Manning twist in the wind unsure of his tenure with the Giants.
I'm not sure that's the case at all given that his agent said he wasn't worried whatsoever and the deal would get done when it's time to. Eli Manning isn't "twisting in the wind". He's got an 11 year working relationship with the franchise, and he's a beloved figure.
The point is that Eli's status has become an issue when it shouldn't even be a blip on the radar screen for this guy. He and his agent shouldn't have to be asked to comment about it. This GM should go to a class on "priorities".
It's only become an issue for people who are tasked with selling newspapers. And this is just a guess, but the GM probably has to have a talk with John Mara before handing out, or not handing out, $100+ million dollar contracts. So, I'm sure John Mara is quite in the loop here.
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In comment 12357507 BrettNYG10 said:
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In comment 12357492 Essex said:
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I wonder how many people on here will call him dumb? I know, I know, he knows how to play soccer better than JPP knows how to play with fireworks.
Playing soccer is an attempt at staying in shape. If JPP hurt himself playing basketball or soccer, I'd have no issue and treat it the same as Beatty.
A sport that has almost as many injuries as the NFL? I am sure you could find ways to stay in shape without playing such a sport with so many injuries. My only point is not to prove JPP is right, but to show how dumb our line in the sand is regarding athletes stupidity. If you can relate to it, it is ok; if you can't, it is not. I have never went near a firework in my life, but I hear a lot of people like playing with them. While it seems foolish to me, what right do I have to say that is any worse than a pro athlete playing a game where there are significant injury risks?
What is the benefit to playing with fireworks? I'm fine if a player prefers taking the marginal risk of playing basketball over running 5 miles to get his cardio in.
True, there is no athletic benefit to it, but there is a benefit in having fun. I just think a lot of times we kill a player because we think it is stupid and forget that they don't. They all have lives and if soccer makes Rory happy, great. If fireworks makes JPP happy, that's great for him (so long as it is legal in the jurisdiction). what about riding a motorcycle? As I said, my main point is where do we draw the line? For you, it seems to me if they get athletic benefits, but I doubt that was why Rory was playing soccer. I would imagine he was playing primarily because he loves the game and the benefit was simply ancillary.
Fire crackers are inherently dangerous. We've all heard by now about the imbecile who lit a fire cracker on his head and died. There's pretty much no threat of death or limb loss in soccer.
you do need to take precaution (and that might be where the issue lies), but I'm the last person who's going to jump up on that moral high horse and say "you shouldn't be playing with fireworks" that's silly. I'm in my early 40's and they're as much fun now as they were when I was 13.
even for a superstar professional athlete.
if you don't like fireworks you won't get it, but IMO lighting off fireworks isn't the issue.
don't play with fireworks
Fire crackers are inherently dangerous. We've all heard by now about the imbecile who lit a fire cracker on his head and died. There's pretty much no threat of death or limb loss in soccer.
I don't know the stats, but if I had to guess, there are more catastrophic firework injuries, but many more of the injuries that Rory suffered in soccer than fireworks, which would keep an athlete out of his sport for a significant time.
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In comment 12357297 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 12357286 Marty866b said:
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By all accounts,JPP is a good guy. He may or may not be the hardest working or one who makes the best decisions but he hasn't been suspended,arrested,etc. So he is a big kid and does immature stuff. I hope this teaches JPP a hard lesson and he straightens himself out and becomes the best football player he can be for the NY Giants. This is not even close to carrying a concealed weapon and shooting yourself.
I tend to agree with Marty here. Being a dumb ass with fireworks is pretty common. When I was young, I took stupid chances too.
JPP is 26 years old. He's not that young anymore. Time to grow up. He may not be a criminal but he is an immature idiot - less like Plaxico and more like Jeremy Shockey.
I don't recall Shockey doing anything off the field that prevented him from being on it ... why is his name always mentioned ? the guy was a fire ball on field, do you take issue with that ? seems like we could use a player or 2 on both sides of the ball with the desire of Shockey ... team is full of pussy's ...
If you dont think Shockey was an immature asshole then I don't know what to tell you. He made plenty of headlines off the field, even with the Saints. I'm not calling JPP an asshole (maybe he is, I dont know) but he is really immature and this is a pretty good example of it.
Look at the picture of the van full of fireworks. Watch the Instagram video. If you think that is the portrait of something other than a complete fool, then you see the world differently than I do.
And that's fine. The only thing that is important is how the Giants' front office sees this. If they choose to retain him and make him a cornerstone of the long term on field product, then I think it's fair to question not only their judgment, but their sanity as well.
He also went hand gliding. We forget that these guys are people. I work with professionals, many who do thrill seeking sky diving, cliff diving, skiing, mountain climbing. Nobody calls them idiots. Would I ever do that, not a chance, I am afraid of my own shadow. I don't think they are dumb for enjoying or seeking things that give them thrills.
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In comment 12357470 Curtis in VA said:
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In comment 12357297 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 12357286 Marty866b said:
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By all accounts,JPP is a good guy. He may or may not be the hardest working or one who makes the best decisions but he hasn't been suspended,arrested,etc. So he is a big kid and does immature stuff. I hope this teaches JPP a hard lesson and he straightens himself out and becomes the best football player he can be for the NY Giants. This is not even close to carrying a concealed weapon and shooting yourself.
I tend to agree with Marty here. Being a dumb ass with fireworks is pretty common. When I was young, I took stupid chances too.
JPP is 26 years old. He's not that young anymore. Time to grow up. He may not be a criminal but he is an immature idiot - less like Plaxico and more like Jeremy Shockey.
I don't recall Shockey doing anything off the field that prevented him from being on it ... why is his name always mentioned ? the guy was a fire ball on field, do you take issue with that ? seems like we could use a player or 2 on both sides of the ball with the desire of Shockey ... team is full of pussy's ...
If you dont think Shockey was an immature asshole then I don't know what to tell you. He made plenty of headlines off the field, even with the Saints. I'm not calling JPP an asshole (maybe he is, I dont know) but he is really immature and this is a pretty good example of it.
Shockey never did anything off the field that prevented him from participating on Sunday ... you can not compare JPP to Shockey ... If JPP had an ounce of what Shockey display'ed desire wise one could imagine what kind of player we would have ...
Do you honestly think JPP's family is getting access to 15 million dollars ever again if he loses his ability to play football due to this foolishness? I saw a story on his family... they weren't broke, but no one there is ever getting close to 15 million again. To put your family and children's future at risk like that is insane.
I'm not trying to sound holier than thou. In high school, my best friend got a box of fireworks from his uncle and we lit them in the field behind a school. Here's the difference... we were kids AND no one was dependent on us as bread winners.
I agree that Brady's behavior was risky. I'd call it riskier even than enjoying some fireworks. But what isn't being factored into that comparison is that Brady pulled those things off fine, while JPP couldn't even pull off the fireworks without being lucky to still have ten fingers at the end of it.
JPP is a fool. Brady is not. That is an enormously important distinction to make.
Do you honestly think JPP's family is getting access to 15 million dollars ever again if he loses his ability to play football due to this foolishness? I saw a story on his family... they weren't broke, but no one there is ever getting close to 15 million again. To put your family and children's future at risk like that is insane.
I'm not trying to sound holier than thou. In high school, my best friend got a box of fireworks from his uncle and we lit them in the field behind a school. Here's the difference... we were kids AND no one was dependent on us as bread winners.
If that is your criticism, that's absolutely fine. I don't think there's that much concern for him as a person so much as concern for what can he do for the fans on sundays.
I agree that Brady's behavior was risky. I'd call it riskier even than enjoying some fireworks. But what isn't being factored into that comparison is that Brady pulled those things off fine, while JPP couldn't even pull off the fireworks without being lucky to still have ten fingers at the end of it.
JPP is a fool. Brady is not. That is an enormously important distinction to make.
If anything, they're both fools. The difference is one of them didn't get hurt engaging in their foolery. Think Belichick didn't have a talk with him once that story came out? And if JPP doesn't get hurt, nobody cares about this either.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
If anything, they're both fools. The difference is one of them didn't get hurt engaging in their foolery. Think Belichick didn't have a talk with him once that story came out? And if JPP doesn't get hurt, nobody cares about this either.
I disagree in the sense that if a story came out that said, "JPP buys truck full of fireworks and plans to light them himself", plenty of people would've said "WTF?" Just because we hear about it afterwards or we don't hear about it at all because no one (thankfully) got hurt doesn't make his decision less stupid.
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And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Shockey reportedly consistently ran incorrect routes, leading to multiple Eli interceptions. Eli took a huge step once Shockey went down with inferior talents at TE. Eli has turned low-cost investments into incredibly productive players for the Giants, including Boss (left due to FA), Ballard (injuries), and Donnell.
Shockey is a great example of what Britt/Terps discussed early in the thread in ensuring your investing in guys with the right character.
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And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Would have continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense....if what? He hadn't been a douche? And while he was productive, he also made a slew of mistakes - some of them costly because he was an arrogant prick. Ask Eli Manning if he misses Jeremy Shockey. Given the choice between Shockey and some of the "misfits" like Boss, Ballard, or Bennett - I think he'd take the misfits any day. Both on the field and in the locker room.
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In comment 12357620 Mason said:
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And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Would have continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense....if what? He hadn't been a douche? And while he was productive, he also made a slew of mistakes - some of them costly because he was an arrogant prick. Ask Eli Manning if he misses Jeremy Shockey. Given the choice between Shockey and some of the "misfits" like Boss, Ballard, or Bennett - I think he'd take the misfits any day. Both on the field and in the locker room.
Who's to say the slew of mistakes weren't on a young QB learning the nuisances of the NFL ... from what I also remember was a very shakey young rookie QB those first few years, you can not pin the mistakes solely on one player ... Anyway, everyone has missed my point, why even mention or draw comparison to Shockey when comparing him to JPP ... JPP is a moron, alienated a then 1st rd. rookie and has questionable commitment to his craft ...
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In comment 12357620 Mason said:
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And his off the field crap did cost the team on the field production. He wasn't that committed to his craft which explains why his career or lack of it has progressed to this point. And Parcells absolutely called it.
he was pretty productive during his tenure here as a Giant, leading multiple seasons in receiving/receptions ... he probably would of still continued to be very productive and key weapon in this offense ... funny how TE has been a revolving door of misfits since his departure
Shockey reportedly consistently ran incorrect routes, leading to multiple Eli interceptions. Eli took a huge step once Shockey went down with inferior talents at TE. Eli has turned low-cost investments into incredibly productive players for the Giants, including Boss (left due to FA), Ballard (injuries), and Donnell.
Shockey is a great example of what Britt/Terps discussed early in the thread in ensuring your investing in guys with the right character.
And this is really all I was saying when I mentioned Shockey.
I just suck at English.
I used to really like Shockey. I can relate to being extremely good-looking and talented.
So, when you see that he's breaking down and injured as a 26-28 year old, you know he wasn't really committed.
Would the Giants have put up with the antics on the field as long as he rolled up his sleeves and acted like he wanted to be the best? They've done that for other players.
So, when you see that he's breaking down and injured as a 26-28 year old, you know he wasn't really committed.
Would the Giants have put up with the antics on the field as long as he rolled up his sleeves and acted like he wanted to be the best? They've done that for other players.
he had issue with the newly appointed GM at the time, he was beloved by EA, but there was tension behind the scenes when Reese took over ... I do not think there as a Sunday where he was never the most fired up ready player on the field ... so stop with the preparation nonsense ...
And let's not act like having a BAC of 1.0 most days of the week is proper. Taking care of your body is part of the job.
We also have this:
Evidence points to Shockey being a shitty teammate.
Bleacher Report - ( New Window )
- Eli has led the league in INTs 3 times, twice after Shockey played his last game in Blue. Heck, Shockey didn't even play all of the games the one year Eli led the league in picks while he was still on the team. Enough with the Shockey route running as the source of Eli's picks nonsense. Eli throws a lot of picks. I love the guy, but he throws picks regardless of the receivers, offense, stadium, or opponent. You guys watched the San Francisco game last year, right? You would've thought Eli took a shit at midfield with the amount of complaining on BBI after the pick in Seattle last season.
- Shockey's problem wasn't off the field issues... he simply got hurt and wasn't the same physically. It happens to physical players and especially at that position. Kevin Boss' career was short. Jake Ballard's career was a shooting star. Whether players are angels off the field or not, they get hurt in this game. There are a thousand examples of guys who don't drink and party who get hurt all the damn time. It's just happens in this sport.
- Let's not compare JPP and Shockey, either as players or connect them somehow because of this incident. I like JPP, but he hasn't come close to matching his 2011 performance. Shockey was 1st team All-Pro as a rookie and was leading NFL TEs in catches (2nd in yards) at the time of his season-ending injury the next year. He ended up making 3 more Pro Bowls after his rookie season.
- Using Amani Toomer as evidence Shockey is a bad guy or selfish? The same Amani Toomer who accused the Giants coaching staff of "freezing him out" at the end of his career?
"No, because you know what? No matter what, they've got an agenda," Toomer said. "I could talk until I'm blue in the face, it's not going to make any difference. And you know from dealing with the head coach that's not how he is. You could talk to him, but if he has something in his mind that's what's going to go on."
and
"Fact that JPP remains in hospital 36 hrs or so after accident tells you damage not minor #Giants"
Toomer wasn't the only person who criticized Shockey's attitude.
You're dismissing a lot of evidence to defend your boy.
The outcome here was that JPP let an explosive donate in his hand, and he likely did this a few feet away from children and a van full of more explosives. If that's an outcome with which you want to associate yourself, good for you.