Berman says they are contemplating offering their remaining 2.8 to Shved but also considering others such as Butler and Green
- Bargnani will NOT be back
-Ledo has some guaranteed money owed this year and Jackson likes him with some backup 3 minutes
-Still want Smith but think he will get more than the 2.8 they can offer
-KP may not play summer league, this would be a bummer
Latvian rookie Kristaps Porzingis still hasnt decided if he will play for the Knicks summer league, according to multiple sources. The 7-foot-3 Porzingis, coming off a rugged Spanish League season with Sevilla, had been nursing hip tightness entering the NBA draft an injury that cut short his pre-draft workout with the Knicks.
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Caron Butler and Willie Green
2.8 room exemption to spend
Still hope we get Aldrich back though.
Im also ok with Ledo filling out the end of the bench. Its very small, but their is still some upside there.
PF: Williams, KP
SF: Melo, Early, Atetekuompo
SG: AA, Galloway, Shved (expected)
PG: Calderon, Grant (grant probably starts)
Remaining spots will go to some combo of: the Lithuwanian center, Ricky Ledo, Lance Thomas, Lou Amundson, Labarie
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Can they only offer vet min?
2.8 room exemption to spend
But that's on one guy, right? Still need like three more players to get up to 15.
There's also arguably less pressure on him as a scorer if he's out there with Melo/AA than if he's the top guy for the 2nd unit.
Grant
AA
Melo
KP
RoLo
With Calderon/KOQ/Galloway/Williams the first guys off the bench.
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In comment 12359364 Del Shofner said:
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Can they only offer vet min?
2.8 room exemption to spend
But that's on one guy, right? Still need like three more players to get up to 15.
They can offer the 2.8 and then minimums after that to go above the cap I believe. Also, I really doubt the final roster after summer camp is 15 players as teams usually keep 1-2 spots open in the event of an injury.
Unlike football or baseball, there is no IR or DL for players to go on in the event of an injury. As a result, you need to keep some spots open to sign players off the street in the case of emergency.
KP
Melo
RoLo
Bam Bam
Calderon
Galloway
Early
O'Quinn
Affalo
Ledo
Greek
are all solid bets/on the team
Shved might be back
Summer league intriguing guys
Galdikas
Labeyrie
Team wouldn't be great but it's a start and there's a good mix of new talent + players with the team last year. You need a combination of both so that the team doesn't experience too large of turnover.
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Team wouldn't be great but it's a start and there's a good mix of new talent + players with the team last year. You need a combination of both so that the team doesn't experience too large of turnover.
Sounds like it's Shved OR Smith. Not both. Can't afford both.
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would be ideal to bring the roster to 14 (and then keep one spot open going into the year with the option to send some players to D-league or cut them in the event of injury) but I'm fine with Aldrich or Amudson too as a backup bigman. Amudson is garbage offensively but average 2.2 bpg per 36 minute and did this over 40 games with NYC (so pretty large sample size).
Team wouldn't be great but it's a start and there's a good mix of new talent + players with the team last year. You need a combination of both so that the team doesn't experience too large of turnover.
Sounds like it's Shved OR Smith. Not both. Can't afford both.
Ah - I would rather offer to Smith honestly but he probably goes for above 2.8 as some have mentioned - he did last year I think
Former 5 star recruit out of HS with a very very solid post game. He's also HUGE at 6-10, 350 and can block the occasional shot. While he's not a great rebounder it did improve as the season went along: averaged 11 and 6 on 62% shooting last year.
Although Phil hasn't been limiting himself to players of this nature, Smith is a decent triangle big I'd think due to low post game and solid passing ability. Has a lot of flaws but so does anyone at this stage and the Knicks definitely need a big who can score in the post.
Former 5 star recruit out of HS with a very very solid post game. He's also HUGE at 6-10, 350 and can block the occasional shot. While he's not a great rebounder it did improve as the season went along: averaged 11 and 6 on 62% shooting last year.
Although Phil hasn't been limiting himself to players of this nature, Smith is a decent triangle big I'd think due to low post game and solid passing ability. Has a lot of flaws but so does anyone at this stage and the Knicks definitely need a big who can score in the post.
Smith average 1.2 apg in just 20 minutes per game. He's not an Okafor in this level but he's pretty decent.
That's enough IMO. I think we finish off the roster with vets who will provide leadership, lead by example, and give us a competent 15 minutes/spot start.
Ovidijus Galdikas
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Obviously the plan changes if by some miracle Durant is healthy and wants in next year, but I'm not counting on it.
Obviously the plan changes if by some miracle Durant is healthy and wants in next year, but I'm not counting on it.
Yea mentioned this yesterday but the hope I think is that in 2 years, Porz is a nice 15-20 ppg #3 option while Lopez remains how he is defensively and Grant becomes maybe a 12 ppg, 6 apg good defender PG. Melo needs to be at least 75% of what he is now and if you combine those 4 guys + another star at the 2, that should be enough for a great starting lineup. Then if half of Hernangomez, Galloway, Early, Thannis, Ledo, Schved, Derrick Williams, Oquinn, future draft picks, etc work out to their potential, that's a decent bench.
A TON of ifs in that equation and things almost never work out that nicely, but I think that's what the Knicks would hope for.
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Ovidijus Galdikas Link - ( New Window )
Ah, that guy. Ok. I'm not super excited about him. He is tall though. Give me Aldrich, however.
Lance Stephenson
Kobe
OJ Mayo
Wade
Eric Gordon
Derozen (if he opts out)
Beal (restricted)
Some other decent bench players also at that position. Not an exciting bunch unfortunately.
Same - not sure how he is outside of being a shooter, but 13.4, 4, and 3 on 41% and 48% shooting. Career 17 ppg player shooting 44% and 38%. Issue is the health though as he's never played a full season outside of the shortened season a few years ago.
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In comment 12359523 BeerFridge said:
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Ovidijus Galdikas Link - ( New Window )
Ah, that guy. Ok. I'm not super excited about him. He is tall though. Give me Aldrich, however.
Not just tall - the answer to a trivia question as to the youngest Lithuanian bride in 2008:
"Prior to becoming famous for his actions on the court, Galdikas appeared in the Lithuanian media because of his relationship with and subsequent marriage to an underage girl to avoid facing charges for statutory rape. He was 19 at the time and his wife, at 15 years old, was the youngest bride in Lithuania in 2008."
I'd also take Wilson Chandler over more than half those guys on that list as he will be much cheaper 3 and D option.
Video: Interesting look at Ledo's background, - ( New Window )
Next off season will be about using the max space on a star player to put next to Melo with the role players of the team already there and in place and a year under their belt in the triangle...
Next off season will be about using the max space on a star player to put next to Melo with the role players of the team already there and in place and a year under their belt in the triangle...
Not sure who that would be though.
Overall top free agents:
-Al Horford
-Joe Johnson
-Deron Williams (ETO)
-Al Jefferson
-Joakim Noah
-Parsons (Player Option)
-Dirk (Player Option)
-Gallo
-Wilson Chandler
-Drummond (Restricted)
-David Lee
-Dwight Howard (ETO)
-Kobe
-Roy Hibbert
-Mike Conley
-Jeff Green
-Wade
-Whiteside
-Eric Gordon
-Durant
-Terance Ross (restricted)
-Derozen (ETO)
-Beal (restricted)
Most of those guys aren't stars and a lot of them are restricted FA's and Centers anyway. An option could be to go hard after a guy like Conley or Howard and then trade a Grant or Lopez for another player afterwards. This is all assuming they don't have a shot at Durant (which I don't think they do).
2017 is more interesting with guys like Westbrook, Ibaka, Curry, Paul (player option), Griffin (player option), and many more (although I'm sure a lot of them will resign before the year starts).
I wouldn't be surprised if they go hard after Paul with the connection to melo
Grantland: Distant Thunder: What Did Oklahoma Citys Media Do to Piss Off Russell Westbrook and Kevin Durant? - ( New Window )
-Dwight Howard
-Derrick Rose
-Westbrook
-Ibaka
-Teague
-Griffin
-Chris Paul
-Curry
-Lawson
-Bogut
-Jrue Holliday
-DeRozen
-Dirk
-Oladipo
-McLemore
-Hill
-Shabazz
-Giannis
And maybe even more depending on how the rest of this free agency goes. Remember cap is projected to be over 100 million then so a lot of free agents would want to align themselves so they can sign a contract that year.
-Dwight Howard
-Derrick Rose
-Westbrook
-Ibaka
-Teague
-Griffin
-Chris Paul
-Curry
-Lawson
-Bogut
-Jrue Holliday
-DeRozen
-Dirk
-Oladipo
-McLemore
-Hill
-Shabazz
-Giannis
And maybe even more depending on how the rest of this free agency goes. Remember cap is projected to be over 100 million then so a lot of free agents would want to align themselves so they can sign a contract that year.
PLEASE get CP3 in 2017. Let's have a Paul-Melo tandem for the final year of his deal here... of course this is assuming the Knicks don't trade Melo before then.
I wouldn't be surprised if they go hard after Paul with the connection to melo
Paul could work. Who knows what the Clippers will be like in 2 years. He's a fan of NYC, Melo, and if he doesn't have a ring by then, he'll definitely make perhaps some unconventional moves at that point of his career to go with a team with upside.
For as much as people knock him for his playoff performances and injury issues, he played all 82 games last year and averaged 19 and 10 shooting 49, 40 and 90. Insane 26 PER.
7'1 without shoes is upped to 7'3 because most NBA players are given 2 inches for shoes in the officially listed #s.
Then you could root for him as a DeadHead-Hunter!
Yeah, those differences are due to shoes/without shoes measurements. There's a point where being really tall starts to be a bad thing, anyways.
I wont say no to paul, but if he is going to be getting a big money deal still ( I assume he will) that will be very risky at that point.
Most of the rest of the guys are on the wrong side of 30.
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how fast KP is growing. Just a few weeks ago, he was 7'1" with a chance to grow into his frame at 7'2". Can't believe he's up to 7'3" already. At this pace, he'll be around 9'6" before the season starts.
7'1 without shoes is upped to 7'3 because most NBA players are given 2 inches for shoes in the officially listed #s.
At the risk of being contrarian, do any of you own basketball shoes that give you a 2" lift? Seems like that's a bit generous anyway. For American players that have with/without shoe measurements (any of those who just went through the draft combine, for example), isn't the variance closer to an inch or less?
Most of the rest of the guys are on the wrong side of 30.
Drummond is restricted.
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In comment 12359786 Gatorade Dunk said:
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how fast KP is growing. Just a few weeks ago, he was 7'1" with a chance to grow into his frame at 7'2". Can't believe he's up to 7'3" already. At this pace, he'll be around 9'6" before the season starts.
7'1 without shoes is upped to 7'3 because most NBA players are given 2 inches for shoes in the officially listed #s.
At the risk of being contrarian, do any of you own basketball shoes that give you a 2" lift? Seems like that's a bit generous anyway. For American players that have with/without shoe measurements (any of those who just went through the draft combine, for example), isn't the variance closer to an inch or less?
My shoes give me a bit less than an inch. That being said, big men usually have heavier, thicker shoes. Not sure what type of shoes KP wears, but they could be a bit optimistic when listing these measurements.
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would be my targets next year, but they're all long shots at best.
Most of the rest of the guys are on the wrong side of 30.
Drummond is restricted.
Hence why he's a massive longshot.
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In comment 12359786 Gatorade Dunk said:
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how fast KP is growing. Just a few weeks ago, he was 7'1" with a chance to grow into his frame at 7'2". Can't believe he's up to 7'3" already. At this pace, he'll be around 9'6" before the season starts.
7'1 without shoes is upped to 7'3 because most NBA players are given 2 inches for shoes in the officially listed #s.
At the risk of being contrarian, do any of you own basketball shoes that give you a 2" lift? Seems like that's a bit generous anyway. For American players that have with/without shoe measurements (any of those who just went through the draft combine, for example), isn't the variance closer to an inch or less?
Could shoes be differently made for pros? Maybe more cushioning? I haven't bought actual basketball shoes in a decade.
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In comment 12359795 Deej said:
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In comment 12359786 Gatorade Dunk said:
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Could shoes be differently made for pros? Maybe more cushioning? I haven't bought actual basketball shoes in a decade.
Don't know for sure but my guess would be that they don't play in the stock ones you can get at a foot locker. I'm sure there are at least some minor unique features that are customized for each player. But I can't see a shoe making a player two inches taller though.
Well if you know that for sure then there's the answer. Again, I was just guessing that they have some customization to an extent (like perfect size, additional cushioning, more shock support, etc.).
I wont say no to paul, but if he is going to be getting a big money deal still ( I assume he will) that will be very risky at that point.
True but that deal should be for less years. Paul will be 32 in 2017. If he wants 4 years, depending on the health of his knee, I would give it to him. There's a chance at hime too if L.A. falls apart.
Obut I wouldn't be absolutely shocked if NBA players had specially-made shoes. I didn't think that would be out of the realm of possibility.
Jordan wore Jordans, LeBron wears LeBrons, Shaq wore Shaqs, Melo wears Melos, KD wears KDs. The list goes on and on.
Like there's anything interesting to talk about today, lol.
Jordan wore Jordans, LeBron wears LeBrons, Shaq wore Shaqs, Melo wears Melos, KD wears KDs. The list goes on and on.
Not talking about brands. Talking about the specific features within the shoes KD wears, Melo wears, Jordan wear, etc. Melo wears J's but I'd be shocked if it had the same insoles, arches and cushioning as my pair of Melo's.
This is where we are at until the Summer League starts for us.
Plus, I was one of those losers who actually collected Jordans and paid attention to what sneakers basketball players wore. No clue why.
This is where we are at until the Summer League starts for us.
Plus, I was one of those losers who actually collected Jordans and paid attention to what sneakers basketball players wore. No clue why.
LOL collecting things is ok... even sneakers. Did you wear them?
And the biggest surprise for me so far is Aaron Gordon. He's hitting pull up jump shots off the dribble and getting a couple of 3s in every game. If this is not just a hot streak and it continues, he could really become a big time 2-way player.
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And Euro's who's names we can't spell that might move to America to play basketball.
This is where we are at until the Summer League starts for us.
Plus, I was one of those losers who actually collected Jordans and paid attention to what sneakers basketball players wore. No clue why.
LOL collecting things is ok... even sneakers. Did you wear them?
At some point all of them were worn, but I kept them in mint condition while wearing them. I would have "crease guards" in the front so the front wouldn't crease (obvious statement is obvious). I've caught myself putting plastic bags on my shoes while it rained and I was walking home.
If it was a new release, I would start wearing them a couple of years later because mostly everyone else dogged theirs by now and I was the only kid with a fresh pair of whichever model it was.
I still have a few really valuable Jordans in my closet that I haven't worn in years, but I wouldn't even know how to get rid of them at this point.
And the biggest surprise for me so far is Aaron Gordon. He's hitting pull up jump shots off the dribble and getting a couple of 3s in every game. If this is not just a hot streak and it continues, he could really become a big time 2-way player.
No because I have this thing called a job and it takes up a large portion of my time.. :-)
And the biggest surprise for me so far is Aaron Gordon. He's hitting pull up jump shots off the dribble and getting a couple of 3s in every game. If this is not just a hot streak and it continues, he could really become a big time 2-way player.
Pretty high on Gordon too. He's only like 18 right? Magic have a ton of young players with potential over there and have a potential high 1st round pick in a few years via the Lakers
And the biggest surprise for me so far is Aaron Gordon. He's hitting pull up jump shots off the dribble and getting a couple of 3s in every game. If this is not just a hot streak and it continues, he could really become a big time 2-way player.
Pretty high on Gordon too. He's only like 18 right? Magic have a ton of young players with potential over there and have a potential high 1st round pick in a few years via the Lakers
They were still in incredibly good condition and I decided to wear them to some party so I can feel like the freshest motherfucker alive. Long story short, the sole ended up falling off half the sneaker and I had to scotch tape my sneaker together. I guess that's what happens when you wear decade old sneakers that are more or less held by glue.
This is true, but douchebag or not, KG is a first ballot HOF'er.
I think he ends up playing second fiddle to Wiggins and Wiggins becomes the face of the franchise....
I still think he will be very good, i just dont know if he will live up to superstar...
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None of the top 10 picks have yet to disappoint, all have been putting up nice games. Really like what Myles Turner has shown so far more specifically.
And the biggest surprise for me so far is Aaron Gordon. He's hitting pull up jump shots off the dribble and getting a couple of 3s in every game. If this is not just a hot streak and it continues, he could really become a big time 2-way player.
No because I have this thing called a job and it takes up a large portion of my time.. :-)
One of the many perks of still being in school I guess.
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In comment 12359904 AnotherGiantsFan said:
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I still have a few really valuable Jordans in my closet that I haven't worn in years, but I wouldn't even know how to get rid of them at this point.
Haha what size are you?
I think he ends up playing second fiddle to Wiggins and Wiggins becomes the face of the franchise....
I still think he will be very good, i just dont know if he will live up to superstar...
Because he's a Timberwolf. If he were a Knick you'd be singing a different tune. You can argue against it but you're a Knicks apologist my friend. Just accept it. :-)
Your fears about Towns though are kinda what I mean. Having a guy like KG there who was a superstar and carried a team SHOULD rub off on him. That's my point.
I think he ends up playing second fiddle to Wiggins and Wiggins becomes the face of the franchise....
I still think he will be very good, i just dont know if he will live up to superstar...
Plenty of "laid back" guys have been superstars: Duncan, Jeter, Rivera, Durant, Eli, etc. If you've got the talent and put in the work, you don't have to be a hot head to succeed.
And Wiggins being the face of the franchise won't impact whether he becomes a star or not either. MJ was the face of the Bulls but Pippen still became a superstar. Eli being the face of the Giants hasn't stopped Beckham.
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Pretty high on Gordon too. He's only like 18 right? Magic have a ton of young players with potential over there and have a potential high 1st round pick in a few years via the Lakers
Yeah, they just need a coach that could figure out how to utilize the talent properly. If you are comparing talent, I think they edge out Milwaukee. Orlando has a bunch of potential 2-way players in Oladipo, Payton, Gordon and Hezonja. Could also package Harris and maybe Vucevic along with Harkless, Nicholson, and Fournier for a cornerstone piece (maybe Cousins still?).
As for Milwaukee, the only complete players they have are Middleton and Giannis (if he can get his shot down). MCW is TO prone and doesn't look like he can shoot properly, and Parker and Monroe aren't great defensive players by any means.
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In comment 12359911 EricNY33 said:
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In comment 12359904 AnotherGiantsFan said:
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I still have a few really valuable Jordans in my closet that I haven't worn in years, but I wouldn't even know how to get rid of them at this point.
Haha what size are you?
11, but I was a 10.5 in my Jordan era so I probably have sizes from 10-10.5
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and not the if he is lazy part..from what i read he is a very hard worker BUT i wonder if he has the attitude to be a superstar...he seems very laid back and kind of go with the flow type of player rather than come in and take over type of player...
I think he ends up playing second fiddle to Wiggins and Wiggins becomes the face of the franchise....
I still think he will be very good, i just dont know if he will live up to superstar...
Because he's a Timberwolf. If he were a Knick you'd be singing a different tune. You can argue against it but you're a Knicks apologist my friend. Just accept it. :-)
Your fears about Towns though are kinda what I mean. Having a guy like KG there who was a superstar and carried a team SHOULD rub off on him. That's my point.
Yea, KG won't let their heads get to big and will make sure they put in the work needed. Plus, he's as good a team defender as we've seen the last 2 decades and having a guy like that around Towns/Wiggins (both of which have the talent to be lockdown defenders) should only help.
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and not the if he is lazy part..from what i read he is a very hard worker BUT i wonder if he has the attitude to be a superstar...he seems very laid back and kind of go with the flow type of player rather than come in and take over type of player...
I think he ends up playing second fiddle to Wiggins and Wiggins becomes the face of the franchise....
I still think he will be very good, i just dont know if he will live up to superstar...
Plenty of "laid back" guys have been superstars: Duncan, Jeter, Rivera, Durant, Eli, etc. If you've got the talent and put in the work, you don't have to be a hot head to succeed.
And Wiggins being the face of the franchise won't impact whether he becomes a star or not either. MJ was the face of the Bulls but Pippen still became a superstar. Eli being the face of the Giants hasn't stopped Beckham.
Beckham is a superstar already? Since when?
They were still in incredibly good condition and I decided to wear them to some party so I can feel like the freshest motherfucker alive. Long story short, the sole ended up falling off half the sneaker and I had to scotch tape my sneaker together. I guess that's what happens when you wear decade old sneakers that are more or less held by glue.
So you went from being the freshest mofo alive, to the hobo off the street with duct taped shoes. I'm sure the ladies were all over you that night!
Agreed. Was a huge shock for me. I thought he would be a defensive player first primarily. To be honest, many of this stuff came from left field. Not sure if it was a combo of other Kansas guys like Embiid, Ellis and Seldon stealing his thunder, but he tended to defer a lot and he had suspect handles. Now after just one year, I can see him being up there with Davis in the top tier in a few years.
Plenty of "laid back" guys have been superstars: Duncan, Jeter, Rivera, Durant, Eli, etc. If you've got the talent and put in the work, you don't have to be a hot head to succeed.
And Wiggins being the face of the franchise won't impact whether he becomes a star or not either. MJ was the face of the Bulls but Pippen still became a superstar. Eli being the face of the Giants hasn't stopped Beckham.
But all the players you mentioned had that killer instinct to take over in the big spot...
My question about towns is does he have that killer instinct? Maybe he does and i am just over looking it, but i havnt seen it yet...
Beckham is a superstar already? Since when?
Superstar? Maybe not, but he's a top 10 WR and had no trouble playing 2nd fiddle to Eli. He did get a vote for the All-Pro team and made the pro-bowl.
Don't like Beckham as an example, Duncan had no problem developing with the Spurs despite the Admiral being the face of the franchise. Ditto Leonard in recent years despite Duncan still the face of the Spurs.
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Because he's a Timberwolf. If he were a Knick you'd be singing a different tune. You can argue against it but you're a Knicks apologist my friend. Just accept it. :-)
Your fears about Towns though are kinda what I mean. Having a guy like KG there who was a superstar and carried a team SHOULD rub off on him. That's my point.
haha you are probably right
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In comment 12359977 nygiants16 said:
Plenty of "laid back" guys have been superstars: Duncan, Jeter, Rivera, Durant, Eli, etc. If you've got the talent and put in the work, you don't have to be a hot head to succeed.
And Wiggins being the face of the franchise won't impact whether he becomes a star or not either. MJ was the face of the Bulls but Pippen still became a superstar. Eli being the face of the Giants hasn't stopped Beckham.
But all the players you mentioned had that killer instinct to take over in the big spot...
My question about towns is does he have that killer instinct? Maybe he does and i am just over looking it, but i havnt seen it yet...
But claiming they had the killer instinct is hindsight. I'm sure there are still idiots out there knocking Eli for being too laid back.
Little too early to tell and I'm not a fan of "does not have killer instinct" type of trait. End of the day we don't know too much about his inner mind at this stage as others have mentioned, plenty of calm athletes have succeeded.
There's plenty of reasons to believe he won't be a star and rather just a very solid player, but I don't think it will be because of attitude.
They were about as onto me as the sole was to my sneakers sans tape.
Duncan carried his teams in college, there was no doubt about him coming out of college...
Jeter from his rookie season he stood out...people knew he was going to be special...
All the players you mentioned showed from the start that they had that killer instinct...they had that gene where they want to go out and carry there team...
Towns has yet to show that yet...maybe he has it and just has not shown it and i am wrong
All i am saying is i have not seen that from Towns yet...
He had an oppurtunity to do it against Winsconsin in College and he deferred to the Harrison twins, now to be fair tha tmay not be his fault because Calipari game planned it that way
Duncan carried his teams in college, there was no doubt about him coming out of college...
Jeter from his rookie season he stood out...people knew he was going to be special...
All the players you mentioned showed from the start that they had that killer instinct...they had that gene where they want to go out and carry there team...
Towns has yet to show that yet...maybe he has it and just has not shown it and i am wrong
He showed it in the Notre Dame game. He was showing it in the Wisconsin game until the Harrison twins decided to stop going to him.
In fact... as the season went on Towns grew more and more into that role. The thing with him was he needed someone to give him the ball.
1- offensive system
2- he didn't play many minutes
3- attitudes of other players
4- the position he plays (it's not like he's a guard or SF who can dribble the ball up the court. he literally needs someone to give it to him).
But who knows at this point - anyone's guess is fair game
All i am saying is i have not seen that from Towns yet...
He had an oppurtunity to do it against Winsconsin in College and he deferred to the Harrison twins, now to be fair tha tmay not be his fault because Calipari game planned it that way
Yeah, it was UK's system that asks the complete opposite of its players. Cal sticks to the platoon system, even if it calls for sitting a player that starts off hot. Towns was a man against boys in the ND game.
He showed it in the Notre Dame game. He was showing it in the Wisconsin game until the Harrison twins decided to stop going to him.
In fact... as the season went on Towns grew more and more into that role. The thing with him was he needed someone to give him the ball.
I agree he started showing more and more as the season went on and that is why he was the number 1 pick....
Now he has to show it in the NBA...my question is how much is he going to defer? it is not like he is going to a team with a bunch of veterans, it is a young team looking to be carried...
now i am not going to kill the kid if his first month in the NBA he is not taking the league by storm, but i want to see if he improves each month of the season as he gets acclimated...
I want to see the same thing from Porzingis, i want to see him improve as the season goes on, i know there are going to be games where he plays like dog shit but i want to see bounce back games and him improving as he gets used to the style of play
But Eli showed he had the guts to lead a team down the field with time running out, even in his rookie season, his first win is a drive down the field to win the game...
In his second season he led the team to a 11-5 record and a division championship with a couple of game winning drives...
It is going to take a couple of years but from superstar players you see glimpses of it early on then they start to put it together...
Towns i dont think is going to be the type of player that it is going to be just about scoring, it is going to be about everything, he has the tools to take over a game in a bunch of different ways...
Fortunately for him he has Wiggins on his team, so I don't think that burden is put on him. I think we all agreed that none of the players in this draft were capable of being the guy. I think Towns could be the #2 on a second team and I see every other top pick from this draft as being the #3 guy at best.
KP, Grant, Labeyrie, Ndour and Galdikas. I've seen the greek kid a decent amount.
Bray doesn't look like an NBA caliber talent to me (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkJpGMNNiP8)
Baron https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gZDhPEhOWYw
Strong is turning 29... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62cGPUUewzw
He wants to wear 6 but is deferring to Wear at this point.
We're winning this shit
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what i am saying is i am not sure he is going to be THE guy on his team, i am not sure he has it in him to say ok guys follow me
Fortunately for him he has Wiggins on his team, so I don't think that burden is put on him. I think we all agreed that none of the players in this draft were capable of being the guy. I think Towns could be the #2 on a second team and I see every other top pick from this draft as being the #3 guy at best.
If Wiggins is leading the team the Wolves are in trouble.
Agreed, although interested to see Labourly(however you spell it) play since he is a draft pick...
Really not interested in Wear and hope he is not brought back...
Grant Galloway Early Greek Porz should be the starting 5...i hope Fisher doesnt start LEdo and Wear and brings Grant and POrz off the bench...let the rooks start and play
He's lowkey a very key guy for this year and the future. Knicks need some of these young guys to come out of no where and surprise.
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Man, that's an ugly #.
He wants to wear 6 but is deferring to Wear at this point.
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In comment 12360068 nygiants16 said:
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what i am saying is i am not sure he is going to be THE guy on his team, i am not sure he has it in him to say ok guys follow me
Fortunately for him he has Wiggins on his team, so I don't think that burden is put on him. I think we all agreed that none of the players in this draft were capable of being the guy. I think Towns could be the #2 on a second team and I see every other top pick from this draft as being the #3 guy at best.
If Wiggins is leading the team the Wolves are in trouble.
Why? Guy at age 19 averaged 17, 5, and 2 on 44% and 31% shooting along with very solid defense. Also got better every month as the year went on including a 23, 6, and 4 line the last 10 ish games of the year.
Jury is still out but he definitely showed characteristics of being a star guy in a few years.
Not sure about the specifics yet but David Lee to Boston is done. #NBA
Not sure about the specifics yet but David Lee to Boston is done. #NBA
Boston's situation is even more perplexing than Philly's. Doing a great job of accumulating assets but these "assets" end up becoming the marcus smart's, aver bradley's, and tyler zeller's of the league. They are banking on one of these late first rounders to become the next jimmy Butler at this point.
Not sure about the specifics yet but David Lee to Boston is done. #NBA
Ugh this would make me sick.
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Tommy Dee @ThomasCDee 26s26 seconds ago
Not sure about the specifics yet but David Lee to Boston is done. #NBA
Boston's situation is even more perplexing than Philly's. Doing a great job of accumulating assets but these "assets" end up becoming the marcus smart's, aver bradley's, and tyler zeller's of the league. They are banking on one of these late first rounders to become the next jimmy Butler at this point.
I think they were hoping one of the 1sts they acquired would turn into a top 5 pick, but they haven't gotten that lucky yet.
ESPN sources say that the Celtics have agreed to send Gerald Wallace to the Warriors for David Lee
ESPN sources say that the Celtics have agreed to send Gerald Wallace to the Warriors for David Lee
Probably don't get assets cuz its really only $5 million to the Celtics. David Lee is going to start for them whereas Wallace was doing jack shit. Probably saves GS around $20 million overall though.
As noted that saves them 5 million this year and around 15 million more in taxes I think.
As noted that saves them 5 million this year and around 15 million more in taxes I think.
Could save more if they stretch Wallace. Barnes is their only significant FA next year and he's restricted. Speights would be the only other guy they'd need to re-sign. They have around $40 million to play with next year.
He's essentially a Brandon Brass replacement. This team isn't that much different than last year. Rozier will just eat some of Smart/Thomas/Bradley minutes. Lee just replaces bass; a bit of an offensive upgrade but worse on defense.
As presently constituted, the ceiling is about a 6 seed. But it's another case of accumulating assets. Lee is a better asset than Wallace. Eventually, Ainge is going to make a big trade. The roster has a bit of a logjam in certain areas. It's about figuring out who they can get that is an upgrade. The moment of hoping for the number one pick has passed for this team.
@TheRealKingFish: Is there a way the Knicks can do this for Calderon? https://t.co/jfzNNbvFvw
@ZachLowe_NBA: @TheRealKingFish Yes.
is someone going to hire Kevin McHale to run another team?
As presently constituted, the ceiling is about a 6 seed. But it's another case of accumulating assets. Lee is a better asset than Wallace. Eventually, Ainge is going to make a big trade. The roster has a bit of a logjam in certain areas. It's about figuring out who they can get that is an upgrade. The moment of hoping for the number one pick has passed for this team.
Lee is an expiring contract in a year where the expiring has fallen off as an "asset". Lee is not an asset as he is gone in a year. Amir Johnson is more of an asset due to his extra year. But neither Lee not Johnson are significant improvements over Zeller, Sullinger, Bass, and Jerebko, at least not according to advanced numbers.
Out of all the teams below .500 in the east, the celtics are second only to the Nets in terms of teams that made the least amount of improvements. Pacers, Bucks, and Pistons have done more to improve upon last year, I wouldn't be surprised if the celtics missed out on the playoffs, which isn't really a bad thing for them.
Johnson and Lee bring different things to last year's crop of big men. For one, they are better rebounders and scorers in the paint. Guys like Olynyk, Bass and Jerebko are jump shooters.
While they haven't done much to improve, you have to look at the team from last year starting with the Rondo trade, particularly after the Isaiah Thomas trade. Once Thomas came aboard, the team went 20-11, and that was with Thomas getting hurt and missing 8 games. Guys like Crowder and Turner really stepped up. There's no superstar on the team. But there are many solid players. And, given the way they ended the year, there is hope that this is at least a .500 team. Don't underestimate Brad Stevens getting the most out of a roster.
they have one every other year, although other teams have swap rights. I think they begin controlling their own picks in 2019.
That's not to mention the picks they have coming from seemingly every other team over the next 3-4 years.
Johnson and Lee bring different things to last year's crop of big men. For one, they are better rebounders and scorers in the paint. Guys like Olynyk, Bass and Jerebko are jump shooters.
While they haven't done much to improve, you have to look at the team from last year starting with the Rondo trade, particularly after the Isaiah Thomas trade. Once Thomas came aboard, the team went 20-11, and that was with Thomas getting hurt and missing 8 games. Guys like Crowder and Turner really stepped up. There's no superstar on the team. But there are many solid players. And, given the way they ended the year, there is hope that this is at least a .500 team. Don't underestimate Brad Stevens getting the most out of a roster.
I have great respect for Stevens. But like the Rondo thing, you can say the same thing about Detroit sans Josh Smith and the Pacers with Hill and George injured. Pacers essentially added Ellis, Turner, Hill, and George to replace David West and Roy Hibbert (whose shenanigans on offense pretty much negated his defensive impact).
SVG got SVG-type players. They added the jump shooters that thrive in his system in Marcus Morris and Ilyasova, drafted Johnson and are getting Jennings back.
Bucks are pretty much adding Jabari Parker to their roster in addition to Monroe and Vasquez.
I won't even start an argument for the Knicks vsC's yet, as they admittedly have much to prove still. But they are adding a healthy Melo, Lopez, O'quinn, Afflalo, Grant, KP and Derrick Williams to a 17 win team. They upgraded every single position on the starting lineup and a few spots on the bench. I could just be a homer but I can easily see them hitting at least .500 as well.
As for David Lee, even if a team wanted him, they aren't getting anything of value for a guy making $15 million for half a season rental. Sullinger, Olynyk and Zeller aren't going to get back 1st rounders. None of these guys will fetch a Demarcus Cousins-level player.
Next years Nets pick doesn't look like it will be that high in the lottery, if it is at all. And while Lopez and T Young are far from NBA cornerstones, having them locked down for long term deals make it hard for a future Nets pick to fall in the top 10 in the foreseeable future.
It was really cute when the Celtics were accumulating all of these draft picks, but actually seeing what they are turning out to isn't as exciting as once thought to be. As the saying goes, Ainge is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic. And while they aren't bad by any means, being mediocre is a terrible place to be. And its only a matter of a few years before Stevens is back in the NCAA.
that's not really a good thing and doesn't say much for their value as assets. If we're evaluating their roster, the most valuable asset is probably Isiah, but that's primarily due to his contract. Overall, I'd say their best asset is Stevens (I'm a big fan of his). But the roster seems like a jumbled group of spare parts and role players. And looking at who they could have drafted (Winslow), making the playoffs this year ended up hurting them.
I'm sorry, that roster isn't going to be .500. And the one thing the Celtics have over all of these other teams is great depth. They go 10 deep, easily, every night. That might not be a good thing. But in the long grind of a season, when inevitable injuries hit, they are well prepared to withstand them.
Anyway, it's July 7th. No way these teams look the same in 4 months.
Link - ( New Window )
Congrats to @JasonSmith014 on your brand new contract with the @OrlandoMagic! Could not be more excited for you #PureMagic
New York free agent Jason Smith has agreed to a one-year, $4.3 million deal with the Orlando Magic, league source tells RealGM.
2016:
1st round-
Boston
Brooklyn
Minnesota
Dallas
2nd round-
Philadelphia
Dallas
Cleveland
Miami
2017:
1st round-
Boston
Memphis
2nd round-
Boston
Cleveland
Minnesota
LAC
2018:
1st round-
Boston
Brooklyn
2nd round-
Boston
Some of these are protected and some of these are subject to potential switches, but ridiculous how many picks they have lol.
Still has value for a team who's main goal should be avoiding the lottery at all costs. I agree on Shved.
True, but unfortunately we couldn't match $4.3M.
Grant, Galloway, KP, Melo, Lopez, Affalo, Early, O'Quinn, Calderon, Ledo, Williams, Greek, Galdikas, throw out an offer to Barton or bring bad Shved.
By then Stevens will be coaching IU.
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I'm sorry, that roster isn't going to be .500. And the one thing the Celtics have over all of these other teams is great depth. They go 10 deep, easily, every night. That might not be a good thing. But in the long grind of a season, when inevitable injuries hit, they are well prepared to withstand them.
Anyway, it's July 7th. No way these teams look the same in 4 months.
Melo has dragged a worse team talent-wise to 54 wins.
Link - ( New Window )
I hope they can. They may get close.
Scoring was always going to be a major issue. The roster had no chance of looking good on paper in one off-season. I mean in the dream scenario where they picked 1st and added Towns and then signed DeAndre Jordan (or Monroe etc) the roster still would look pretty bad. This was always going to be a 2 year rebuild.
of course there are some who argue Ainge waited too long to trade them thereby reducing his return.
that's not the main goal, nor should it be.
Scoring was always going to be a major issue. The roster had no chance of looking good on paper in one off-season. I mean in the dream scenario where they picked 1st and added Towns and then signed DeAndre Jordan (or Monroe etc) the roster still would look pretty bad. This was always going to be a 2 year rebuild.
There's plenty to like about the potential future of the Knicks. But .500 is truly absurd. One of these years though, you're going to have to convince a star from another team to sign with you as a free agent. Not one since Amare.
I'd bet the over on 30 wins. Lakers are easily worse. Magic, Philly, Charlotte, Portland and maybe Denver (maybe not) are worse on paper.
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Still has value for a team who's main goal should be avoiding the lottery at all costs. I agree on Shved.
that's not the main goal, nor should it be.
What do you see as the main goal? This team isn't in any realistic way going anywhere this season. They're hoping they can be in the mix for the 8th seed.
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is the second worst in the league. Go look at this page of depth charts. I'd say that Philly is worse. But is there anyone else you can honestly say your are better than, on paper, for this upcoming season? Link - ( New Window )
I'd bet the over on 30 wins. Lakers are easily worse. Magic, Philly, Charlotte, Portland and maybe Denver (maybe not) are worse on paper.
I'll give you Portland. Charlotte has Kemba, MKG, Jefferson, Zeller, Batum. Orlando has Oladipo, Payton, Harris, Vucevic. LA has Russell, Clarkson, Kobe, Randle, Hibbert. I don't think the Knicks equal any of those, even though they have the best player amongst all those I just listed. They simply have nothing beyond Melo.
"not one since Amare" is a nonsense statement considering this summer was the only time they've had max cap room since then. And Melo forcing his way here is basically the same thing.
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a superstar. Pierce, Garnett and Rondo, at the time of those trades, were clearly not superstars.
of course there are some who argue Ainge waited too long to trade them thereby reducing his return.
Rondo, they waited. Him tearing his ACL hurt that process. With Pierce and Garnett, they were coming off a season where they took Miami to the brink in the ECF. They had to go for it one more time. And then Rondo tore his ACL that last season. So I can't fault Ainge for not trading them sooner. Garnett also fell off big time, much more than anyone would have expected.
developing the young players. If it costs them the playoffs, who cares. The draft pick is a sunk cost and means nothing to us now.
they didn't "have" to do anything. Good for them for pushing Miami, but what were you expecting the next season? For a bunch of declining players in their mid 30s to improve and beat the younger/better Heat who have the best player in the world? And Garnett's decline was actually very predictable given his age, mileage, and previous knee problems.
I don't hate the Knicks nearly as much as I hate the other biggest rivals to my favorite teams in other sports. I probably would if they were good. So let's come back to it in a few years.
Your evaluation of those guys, especially Smart, is way off though. You said earlier that Olynyk wouldn't fetch a first rounder? He would. Not a high one. But a first rounder, for sure. Marcus Smart is far more talented on offense than Tony Allen ever could have been. And "the Celtics don't have anything going for them in the future" is truly one of the most asinine statements I've ever read on BBI. They have a top young coach (who isn't leaving for Indiana or any other college team anytime soon), a bunch of young talent, a good GM and ownership situation, and a million draft picks. No, they won't be able to sign a marquee free agent, because no one wants to play in Boston. But they will trade for one. Maybe not this year. But that trade for a superstar is coming. And there is room for 2 max guys next year. You never know.
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In comment 12360404 Pego61 said:
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I'll give you Portland. Charlotte has Kemba, MKG, Jefferson, Zeller, Batum. Orlando has Oladipo, Payton, Harris, Vucevic. LA has Russell, Clarkson, Kobe, Randle, Hibbert. I don't think the Knicks equal any of those, even though they have the best player amongst all those I just listed. They simply have nothing beyond Melo.
LOL are you serious about the Lakers? Kobe hasn't been a productive player in 3 years and is coming off his second injured season. Clarkson's offense doesn't outweigh his defensive flaws yet. Randle and Russell are two defensive liabilities as rookies. Hibbert's defense does not make up for his offense. They aren't cracking 30 wins.
I tend to agree as many of those young guys they have expiring contracts soon. Once they become FA's and get a larger contract, they lose a large degree of their value.
You can say "What after Melo" and scoff at Lopez, Afflalo, Calderon, Porz, Grant and others all you want. But look where the .500 line was in the East last year. Milwaukee got there on pure defense (26th in offensive rating). Other than Knight (traded after 52 games), their top scorers were MCw (14.1), Middleton (13.4), and the Freak (12.7). Then look at 40-42 Boston. Boston's top 8 minutes leaders in order were: Avery Bradley, Evan Turner, Brandon Bass, Marcus Smart, Ty Zeller, Sully, and Olynyk, and Jae Crowder.
The talent bar for .500 in the East is low. Very low.
No... it's Porzingis and he hasn't played a minute in the NBA yet. So yes... that's scary lol
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Rondo, they waited. Him tearing his ACL hurt that process. With Pierce and Garnett, they were coming off a season where they took Miami to the brink in the ECF. They had to go for it one more time. And then Rondo tore his ACL that last season. So I can't fault Ainge for not trading them sooner. Garnett also fell off big time, much more than anyone would have expected.
they didn't "have" to do anything. Good for them for pushing Miami, but what were you expecting the next season? For a bunch of declining players in their mid 30s to improve and beat the younger/better Heat who have the best player in the world? And Garnett's decline was actually very predictable given his age, mileage, and previous knee problems.
I would argue that what they got for Pierce and Garnett was the best they could have. All those draft picks are valuable. And no one was going to give a great player for, as you say "a bunch of declining players". And a Garnett decline was expected, but I don't think the Nets expected his ppg to drop 8 points in his first year there. That precipitous a fall was unexpected.
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so I'm probably really biased. As opposed to many Knicks fans, I don't particularly hate the Celtics, probably because of Brad Stevens. But the Celtics don't have anything going for them in the future, especially once these good contracts are over with. Olynyk, Sully, Zeller, Thomas, Bradley and even Smart aren't nearly as valuable to other teams. No one wants to play in Boston anymore than NY. Smart is the only real "asset" of value and he's a glorified Tony Allen.
I don't hate the Knicks nearly as much as I hate the other biggest rivals to my favorite teams in other sports. I probably would if they were good. So let's come back to it in a few years.
Your evaluation of those guys, especially Smart, is way off though. You said earlier that Olynyk wouldn't fetch a first rounder? He would. Not a high one. But a first rounder, for sure. Marcus Smart is far more talented on offense than Tony Allen ever could have been. And "the Celtics don't have anything going for them in the future" is truly one of the most asinine statements I've ever read on BBI. They have a top young coach (who isn't leaving for Indiana or any other college team anytime soon), a bunch of young talent, a good GM and ownership situation, and a million draft picks. No, they won't be able to sign a marquee free agent, because no one wants to play in Boston. But they will trade for one. Maybe not this year. But that trade for a superstar is coming. And there is room for 2 max guys next year. You never know.
I didn't mean picks, I apologize for that, I meant their roster. And Smart is better than Tony Allen, which is why I used the term "glorified" to describe him. But that's what he is. He can be a league average 3 point shooter, but a Tony Allen with a 3 and slightly better handles isn't going to flag down any big time stars. Clearly the Celtics think so high of him that they would easily trade him right?
And keep telling yourself about Stevens staying in the NBA. We shall revisit that statement in a few years.
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offense on paper looks horrid. Not sure if there is any way the Knicks are a good offensive team. I mean a guy with 45 NBA games under his belt (Galloway) is arguably the 2nd best scorer on the team....
No... it's Porzingis and he hasn't played a minute in the NBA yet. So yes... that's scary lol
So your big 3 scoring wise... Melo, Porzingis, Galloway... 1 superstar coming off knee surgery, 1 guy none of us had heard of at this time last year and 1 guy who none of us had heard of before mid-season lol
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In comment 12360424 DanMetroMan said:
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offense on paper looks horrid. Not sure if there is any way the Knicks are a good offensive team. I mean a guy with 45 NBA games under his belt (Galloway) is arguably the 2nd best scorer on the team....
No... it's Porzingis and he hasn't played a minute in the NBA yet. So yes... that's scary lol
So your big 3 scoring wise... Melo, Porzingis, Galloway... 1 superstar coming off knee surgery, 1 guy none of us had heard of at this time last year and 1 guy who none of us had heard of before mid-season lol
I am not that concerned about Melo coming off injury. But the other two are very good points lol
As far as the Lakers go, they'll suck too. And given their place in the West, they'll probably have a terrible record. But potential injuries aside, they have more talent overall. And I forgot to mention Lou Williams before.
You can say "What after Melo" and scoff at Lopez, Afflalo, Calderon, Porz, Grant and others all you want. But look where the .500 line was in the East last year. Milwaukee got there on pure defense (26th in offensive rating). Other than Knight (traded after 52 games), their top scorers were MCw (14.1), Middleton (13.4), and the Freak (12.7). Then look at 40-42 Boston. Boston's top 8 minutes leaders in order were: Avery Bradley, Evan Turner, Brandon Bass, Marcus Smart, Ty Zeller, Sully, and Olynyk, and Jae Crowder.
The talent bar for .500 in the East is low. Very low.
Agree with this.
Afflalo can score but he's not very efficient in doing so. Grant can score too, but we don't know about on a NBA level. Same with Porzy. However, if I am looking at next season my want is that Porzingis proves to be the second leading scorer. That bodes well for the future.
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not too concerned about Melo either. Just stated to make the point. The offense is going to HAVE TO be a "good system" ie triangle, Princeton etc or it's going to be a very long season offensively. I mean Lopez, O'Quinn, Affalo all have strong defensive reps (Affalo's maybe a bit overstated), Grant's rep is that of a guy who could develop into a solid defender... almost have to hope triangle + decent defense is enough.
Afflalo can score but he's not very efficient in doing so. Grant can score too, but we don't know about on a NBA level. Same with Porzy. However, if I am looking at next season my want is that Porzingis proves to be the second leading scorer. That bodes well for the future.
Affalo can "score" but it's as a high volume deep shooter. He's not a good "offensive player".
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In comment 12360491 DanMetroMan said:
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not too concerned about Melo either. Just stated to make the point. The offense is going to HAVE TO be a "good system" ie triangle, Princeton etc or it's going to be a very long season offensively. I mean Lopez, O'Quinn, Affalo all have strong defensive reps (Affalo's maybe a bit overstated), Grant's rep is that of a guy who could develop into a solid defender... almost have to hope triangle + decent defense is enough.
Afflalo can score but he's not very efficient in doing so. Grant can score too, but we don't know about on a NBA level. Same with Porzy. However, if I am looking at next season my want is that Porzingis proves to be the second leading scorer. That bodes well for the future.
Affalo can "score" but it's as a high volume deep shooter. He's not a good "offensive player".
Thank you for repeating what I just said lol
As far as the Lakers go, they'll suck too. And given their place in the West, they'll probably have a terrible record. But potential injuries aside, they have more talent overall. And I forgot to mention Lou Williams before.
Lou williams= shot chucker with no defense
Kobe last 3 years = shot chucker with no defense
nick young= shot chucker with no defense
Randle= we don't know what his offense in the NBA is with no defense
Russell= Don't know how he translates as a rookie but awful defense
Clarkson= promising offense talent with no defense
Hibbert= washed up center with good rim protection, no offense or rebounding
Bass= nice efficient, only two way player on roster
to
Grant= two-way seasoned college player
Galloway= second year player who played well on both ends his first year
Lopez= good defensive player that is highly efficient on offense
O'quinn= good two way player
Afflalo= mediocre on both ends
Melo= still a positive on the floor, efficient numbers support him over Kobe at this point
Williams= shot chucker with no defense
KP= good shooter but likely liability on defense at this point
I don't know how your doing this paper test.
Olynyk sure tried Love. Still got knocked the fuck out of the 1st round.
Surprise! The Knicks may actually know what theyre doing. - ( New Window )
he shot 36% last year. He needs to improve quite a bit to even sniff the all star team.
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The rumor was #3 and Noel for Smart, #16 and #28. I love Smart but I'd have done that in a second. We weren't trading him to move up a few picks. I think Smart will be much more than a Tony Allen. He has all-star potential. He's also a great slasher to the basket. As his game progresses, you'll see more of that.
As far as the Lakers go, they'll suck too. And given their place in the West, they'll probably have a terrible record. But potential injuries aside, they have more talent overall. And I forgot to mention Lou Williams before.
Lou williams= shot chucker with no defense
Kobe last 3 years = shot chucker with no defense
nick young= shot chucker with no defense
Randle= we don't know what his offense in the NBA is with no defense
Russell= Don't know how he translates as a rookie but awful defense
Clarkson= promising offense talent with no defense
Hibbert= washed up center with good rim protection, no offense or rebounding
Bass= nice efficient, only two way player on roster
to
Grant= two-way seasoned college player
Galloway= second year player who played well on both ends his first year
Lopez= good defensive player that is highly efficient on offense
O'quinn= good two way player
Afflalo= mediocre on both ends
Melo= still a positive on the floor, efficient numbers support him over Kobe at this point
Williams= shot chucker with no defense
KP= good shooter but likely liability on defense at this point
I don't know how your doing this paper test.
You don't exactly frame your answers without bias. I have no bias here. If anything, I hate the Lakers more.
Porzingis is "likely" a liability, but Randle and Russell definitely are? Apparently, almost everyone on the Knicks is a good two way player. The way you frame their attributes, Jerian Grant is clearly better than Russell as he is "seasoned". The Lakers will assuredly suck on defense. But they are LIGHTYEARS ahead on offense.
@kporzee to http://Knicks.com ’s @jonahballow: "I was just trying not to force it too much because of the little injury I had.
.@kporzee to http://Knicks.com ’s @jonahballow: "Hopefully I can showcase myself well & do good in Summer League.”
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Avery Bradley, Evan Turner, Brandon Bass, Marcus Smart, Ty Zeller, Sully, and Olynyk, and Jae Crowder until you try them.
Olynyk sure tried Love. Still got knocked the fuck out of the 1st round.
Gave a better fight than the Hawks did, and that was facing Cleveland's entire team.
Go find one respected basketball person who would take the Knicks future over the Celtics. Just one.
Offensively he is 3 tiers ahead. Hibbert had an O and D rating of 101, making him a net neutral on the court.
RoLo had an O rating of 117(!) and D rating of 104, making him a positive player on the floor.
And KP will be a liability, much like Randle and Russell were in college. Defensive numbers support my claims for all of the players above mentioned, if you are concerned with any player specifically, let me know and I can show the numbers.
Dave Deckard: We're creative too but we never got past "Rolo" for Robin and "Brolo" for his twin. Those were pretty satisfactory. There's always Sideshow Bob or Sideshow Rob for the hair.
JS: Robin seems like a good natured guy who mostly goes after goofball mascots. It's hard to imagine that the only fire and desire he shows is on the sidelines, though. Does Robin have any major rivals? Additionally, is there anyone he consistently dominates? Or someone who routinely dominates him?
DD: He's not really that type. He's going to lunchbucket everybody. But he has trouble with super athletic guys like Dwight Howard one-on-one. He also has problems covering centers with a face-up jumper from 15 feet and out. Lopez is just not made to wander outside. He's like Antaeus, who was invincible as long as his feet were on the ground but got pwned by Hercules when lifted into the air. Within 10 feet of the bucket Lopez is great. Outside that...pfffft.
JS: What is Robin's least talked about skill? Do you see some untapped potential somewhere in there?
DD: His offensive game evolved in Portland...which is to say he learned to face up from 8-10 feet instead of being chained to the rim. He's also plenty smart. He knows how the game works, puts himself in good position, and doesn't mess up your flow. I don't think there's a ton of untapped potential there but don't discount his ability to adjust.
JS: Did you notice a pet play, or a go-to move that just always seemed to spring him free for an easy score?
DD: No score is easy with Lopez except a put-back. His go-to move is the offensive rebound. Either that or wait until everybody else gets tired of exploring their options then get 2 feet from the rim and put your hand up.
JS: Any departing words for Blazers faithful or the Knicks lifers?
DD: You're going to have tons of fun with Robin if you use him right. You'll be miserable if you ask him to do things he can't do. But either way, it's probably your fault. He is what he is and he's good at it.
There ya have it, we sat at the pool, we chatted about our new starting pivot. Make sure you say nice things to the folks over at Blazers Edge and you can follow Dave on Twitter for all the latest @DaveDeckard or @blazersedge.
Melo v Kobe - edge Melo
RoLo v Hibbert - edge RoLo
Those are the easy ones to identify since it's the teams' alpha dogs and defensive presences. But it's hard to even do a paper comparison at this point since both teams will likely see major contributions from young players (Russell/Randle for the Lakers, KP/Grant for the Knicks).
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In comment 12360509 Pego61 said:
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Go find one respected basketball person who would take the Knicks future over the Celtics. Just one.
If I were a "basketball person", I'd take the Celts over the Knicks in a heartbeat, ignoring potential rumors.
Just don't get too attached to Stevens is what I am saying.
Kristaps Porzingis is a 7-foot-1 Latvian teenager. He went through a solo workout in front of NBA executives and did what everyone who has seen him play expected him to do: He crushed it.
He swished threes. He showed his unique mobility and athleticism. And, of course, he kicked the pre-Draft pendulum into full-swing: first the hype, then the backlash to the hype, then the backlash to the backlash.
Its been an interesting couple of weeks for everyone involved.
But on Thursday, June 25, Porzingis will finally hear Commissioner Adam Silver call his name. So will Mario Hezonja a consensus top-10 pick like Porzingis and Willy Hernangomez, another client of Bermejos who could go in the late first round.
When it happens, they will join a long list of ACB players to be selected in the NBA Draft.
The Right Situation
Since 2001, 34 ACB players have been drafted. Fourteen of those players went in the first round.
*Nogueira never played for the Hawks, who traded him to Toronto before his first seaoson.
A few (Pau Gasol, Ricky Rubio, Nikola Mirotic) made All-Rookie 1st-team during their debut seasons. Some are out of the league or never made it all. And others, like Tiago Splitter and Serge Ibaka, have carved out essential roles on perennial title contenders.
Bermejo, who also represents Ibaka, stresses that situation rather than Draft position ultimately determines a players success.
A lot of the players and I dont blame them because its the easy thing to do they get too caught up on whether theyre a first-round pick, second-round pick or whatnot, Bermejo said. So the first thing you want to try to make them understand is the Draft is what gets you the opportunity to get into the NBA, which is good. But the most important thing is once you get to the NBA, you have to prove that you belong, you know? Thats a whole different story.
To prove you belong, you also have to be lucky opportunity and fit are extremely important.
Bermejo said that Ibaka, the 24th pick in 2008, has developed into a crucial player on a good team because he fell into the right situation.
I think Serge landed in the right spot for him. It was a very young team with not so much pressure, they were trying to build something. And (he was) surrounded by very talented and young players too, where he had space to grow and develop, Bermejo said.
Less than four years after he was drafted, Ibaka was starting in the NBA Finals.
The Transition
Ricky Rubio of the Minnesota Timberwolves talks to the media at adidas EUROCAMP, the most prestigious international pre-NBA Draft camp.Ricky Rubio of the Minnesota Timberwolves talks to the media at Adidas EuroCamp, the official international NBA Draft combine.
Like many foreign players who come to the NBA, Ibaka barely spoke English when he arrived. Someone from the agency stayed close to him during his first few seasons to try to ease the transition into a new language and culture.
Ricky Rubio, the 5th overall pick in the 2009 Draft, was in a similar situation. In an interview at the 2015 Adidas EuroCamp, Rubio said the non-basketball elements of the jump were most difficult.
Off the court was the biggest change for me because I always lived in Barcelona and never left home, Rubio said. For the first time I was moving to a country and city that I didnt know. I had to learn the language really well. I knew how to speak English, but its not the same living over there and having your own language, you know?
This shouldnt be as much of a factor for Porzingis and Hezonja, who speak English and have already moved to Spain from their native countries (Latvia and Croatia). But like Ibaka, the Gasols, Rubio and everyone before them, they will have to adjust to a different style of play.
Its a different game, but I like it more. Its more up and down, a more open game, Rubio said. (Its) more physical, so I had to hit the weight room more often. And just more games, so that means you gotta be healthy, you gotta be ready to play that amount of games.
Can They Play?
Porzingis is a smart kid. He knows hes thin. He knows the NBA is physical. After a tough loss at Fuenlabrada this season, I asked him what he needs to do to become NBA-ready. Without hesitation, he mentioned his strength.
I mean, to be able to play at the next level I gotta become stronger. Thats basically what Im working on a lot, Porzingis said. Im working on my post moves. Im not perfect at anything, so Im just working on everything basically.
Many of the photos you see of Porzingis are more than a year old, such as the two included in this piece by Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo! Sports. Hes added some muscle since then, and Bermejo doesnt think his slim frame will be an issue.
I remember Pau Gasols body when he went to the NBA it didnt look very different than what Kristaps body is right now. And Pau was the Rookie of the Year that year, Bermejo said. Im not saying that Kristaps is gonna be Rookie of the Year, but I dont think he will spend time in the D-League either, you know?
After Sevillas loss to Barcelona in March, I caught up with Sevilla assistant coach and Barcelona legend Audie Norris to talk about how Porzingis and Hernangomez will do in the NBA.
Well, I think they can compete on that level, Norris said. Theyre young, obviously, but they work hard. And the reason I say they can compete on that level is cause theyre hungry. Whatever team that signs these guys or drafts these guys, theyre gonna be happy with what they get. Theyre not gonna be impact players in their first year or two or whatever. Theyre gonna be guys that are gonna develop over time.
Unlike Porzingis and Hezonja, Hernangomez will likely stay in Spain for a couple years. He was unable to go through pre-Draft workouts because of his contract with Real Madrid, but hes already producing at the rate of guys like Splitter, Mirotic and Luis Scola.
onathan Givony @DraftExpress
Spanish center Guillermo Hernangomez had a historically great season in the ACB. Here's his DX scouting video: http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Guillermo-Hernangomez-NBA-Draft-Scouting-Report-and-Video-Breakdown-5028
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Jonathan Givony @DraftExpress
7 guys in ACB history posted a PER of 20 at age 20 or prior: Stanley Roberts, Splitter, R. Fernandez, Rubio, Mirotic, Scola, W. Hernangomez.
Link - ( New Window )
Fair enough, good point. I remember Lance Stephenson got called out for "stealing" many of his rebounds.
But he was crap on offense the last two season from an efficiency standpoint.
Watts recalled a preseason game against Valencia, one of Spain’s better teams, in which Porzingis had dominating stretches on the offensive and defensive ends, including a flurry of blocked shots.
Watts, a 6-8 forward, said: “I’ve been in Europe a long time and never had my shot blocked that many times in practice. I mean, he’s got that length.”
When contacted by N.B.A. teams looking for red flags on Porzingis, Byars told them there were none he could see, except Porzingis’s need to fill out.
“I don’t want to go on the record predicting the Hall of Fame, but he’s as seasoned and mature as any 19-year-old in Europe I’ve been around,” Byars said. “He’s thin, but it’s a strong thin frame.”
He added, “Kris has endless potential given the right situation, the right opportunity.”
Season at Dysfunctional Sevilla Should Have Kristaps Porzingis Ready for Knicks - ( New Window )