NFT: Knicks Chat: Shved, Butler, Green being discussed

Who?

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In comment 12359358 SicilianGMEN said:

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Who?

Caron Butler and Willie Green

is 36 next season. Gimme Shved

Can they only offer vet min?

In comment 12359364 Del Shofner said:

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Can they only offer vet min?

2.8 room exemption to spend

at 2.8 mil.

Still hope we get Aldrich back though.

like butler cause he is going to want to play and i dont want him taking minutes away from Galloway, grant, or even Early since butler could play some 3. I like what i saw from shved so im fine with him coming back. Although id rather use the 2.8 on Smith if we could. Sounds like he has more offers, but are teams really offering much more then that for him?

Im also ok with Ledo filling out the end of the bench. Its very small, but their is still some upside there.

C: ROLO, KOQ

PF: Williams, KP

SF: Melo, Early, Atetekuompo

SG: AA, Galloway, Shved (expected)

PG: Calderon, Grant (grant probably starts)

Remaining spots will go to some combo of: the Lithuwanian center, Ricky Ledo, Lance Thomas, Lou Amundson, Labarie

on our summer league roster makes the team. Really liked his highlight tape. Can shoot 3s, off the bounce, and has moves to finish at the rim. Plus a 7'6" wingspan.

I'd start Lopez and KOQ with KOQ backing up Lopez and a heavy dose of Porz + Melo at the 4. Also, bring back Aldrich, who was way better than Smith. Aldrich is 18+ PER and .115 WS/48 for us over 100 games. Not sure why he isnt getting 4-5 million somewhere.

center is not coming this year. We need at least one more big capable of playing 20 minutes or so. Im not saying we need that right off the bat but we only have 4 bigs and thats counting Williams who could end up being horrible. Personally i dont really care for aldrich, im fine with him, but if we bring him in id still want one more PF/C type guy.

really is one of the best (k)nicknames in the NBA

but if you start him and Oquinn and use Oquinn as Lopez backup then one of them pretty much plays the whole first quarter. Maybe thats doable.

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In comment 12359366 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 12359364 Del Shofner said: Quote: Can they only offer vet min? 2.8 room exemption to spend

But that's on one guy, right? Still need like three more players to get up to 15.

Okafor. Worth the gamble.

which is a big if. He is going to go to a contender.

Get him out there with the 1's and let him learn on the fly. He doesn't need to play 35 minutes a night, but he "fits" well with a Melo/RoLo front court and gives them some good floor spacing right off the bat.

There's also arguably less pressure on him as a scorer if he's out there with Melo/AA than if he's the top guy for the 2nd unit.

Grant
AA
Melo
KP
RoLo

With Calderon/KOQ/Galloway/Williams the first guys off the bench.

In comment 12359406 Del Shofner said:

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In comment 12359366 DanMetroMan said: Quote: In comment 12359364 Del Shofner said: Quote: Can they only offer vet min? 2.8 room exemption to spend But that's on one guy, right? Still need like three more players to get up to 15.

They can offer the 2.8 and then minimums after that to go above the cap I believe. Also, I really doubt the final roster after summer camp is 15 players as teams usually keep 1-2 spots open in the event of an injury.

Unlike football or baseball, there is no IR or DL for players to go on in the event of an injury. As a result, you need to keep some spots open to sign players off the street in the case of emergency.

like

KP
Melo
RoLo
Bam Bam
Calderon
Galloway
Early
O'Quinn
Affalo
Ledo
Greek

are all solid bets/on the team

Shved might be back

Summer league intriguing guys

Galdikas
Labeyrie

Johnson has been fantastic in summer league.

would be ideal to bring the roster to 14 (and then keep one spot open going into the year with the option to send some players to D-league or cut them in the event of injury) but I'm fine with Aldrich or Amudson too as a backup bigman. Amudson is garbage offensively but average 2.2 bpg per 36 minute and did this over 40 games with NYC (so pretty large sample size).

Team wouldn't be great but it's a start and there's a good mix of new talent + players with the team last year. You need a combination of both so that the team doesn't experience too large of turnover.

vs. Winslow
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In comment 12359496 kash94 said:

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would be ideal to bring the roster to 14 (and then keep one spot open going into the year with the option to send some players to D-league or cut them in the event of injury) but I'm fine with Aldrich or Amudson too as a backup bigman. Amudson is garbage offensively but average 2.2 bpg per 36 minute and did this over 40 games with NYC (so pretty large sample size). Team wouldn't be great but it's a start and there's a good mix of new talent + players with the team last year. You need a combination of both so that the team doesn't experience too large of turnover.

Sounds like it's Shved OR Smith. Not both. Can't afford both.

Ledo feature
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In comment 12359500 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 12359496 kash94 said: Quote: would be ideal to bring the roster to 14 (and then keep one spot open going into the year with the option to send some players to D-league or cut them in the event of injury) but I'm fine with Aldrich or Amudson too as a backup bigman. Amudson is garbage offensively but average 2.2 bpg per 36 minute and did this over 40 games with NYC (so pretty large sample size). Team wouldn't be great but it's a start and there's a good mix of new talent + players with the team last year. You need a combination of both so that the team doesn't experience too large of turnover. Sounds like it's Shved OR Smith. Not both. Can't afford both.

Ah - I would rather offer to Smith honestly but he probably goes for above 2.8 as some have mentioned - he did last year I think

reportedly already has offers for more than the Knicks can offer him.

who Dan and others have mentioned may be worthy of a look is Joshua Smith of Georgetown.

Former 5 star recruit out of HS with a very very solid post game. He's also HUGE at 6-10, 350 and can block the occasional shot. While he's not a great rebounder it did improve as the season went along: averaged 11 and 6 on 62% shooting last year.

Although Phil hasn't been limiting himself to players of this nature, Smith is a decent triangle big I'd think due to low post game and solid passing ability. Has a lot of flaws but so does anyone at this stage and the Knicks definitely need a big who can score in the post.

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In comment 12359522 kash94 said:

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who Dan and others have mentioned may be worthy of a look is Joshua Smith of Georgetown. Former 5 star recruit out of HS with a very very solid post game. He's also HUGE at 6-10, 350 and can block the occasional shot. While he's not a great rebounder it did improve as the season went along: averaged 11 and 6 on 62% shooting last year. Although Phil hasn't been limiting himself to players of this nature, Smith is a decent triangle big I'd think due to low post game and solid passing ability. Has a lot of flaws but so does anyone at this stage and the Knicks definitely need a big who can score in the post.

Smith average 1.2 apg in just 20 minutes per game. He's not an Okafor in this level but he's pretty decent.

KP, Grant, Early, Ledo, Greek, Williams, and maybe KOQ & Galloway (and Shved) depending on how you want to define "upside guys".

That's enough IMO. I think we finish off the roster with vets who will provide leadership, lead by example, and give us a competent 15 minutes/spot start.

In comment 12359523 BeerFridge said:

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Ovidijus Galdikas

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Lopez, Zinger, Melo and Grant can be starters on the next good Knicks team. Galloway and O'Quinn can be good bench players on the next good Knicks team. The challenge for Phil is to fill that gaping void at the other guard spot. Afflalo buys him a little time for now.

Obviously the plan changes if by some miracle Durant is healthy and wants in next year, but I'm not counting on it.

In comment 12359597 bceagle05 said:

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Lopez, Zinger, Melo and Grant can be starters on the next good Knicks team. Galloway and O'Quinn can be good bench players on the next good Knicks team. The challenge for Phil is to fill that gaping void at the other guard spot. Afflalo buys him a little time for now. Obviously the plan changes if by some miracle Durant is healthy and wants in next year, but I'm not counting on it.

Yea mentioned this yesterday but the hope I think is that in 2 years, Porz is a nice 15-20 ppg #3 option while Lopez remains how he is defensively and Grant becomes maybe a 12 ppg, 6 apg good defender PG. Melo needs to be at least 75% of what he is now and if you combine those 4 guys + another star at the 2, that should be enough for a great starting lineup. Then if half of Hernangomez, Galloway, Early, Thannis, Ledo, Schved, Derrick Williams, Oquinn, future draft picks, etc work out to their potential, that's a decent bench.

A TON of ifs in that equation and things almost never work out that nicely, but I think that's what the Knicks would hope for.

In comment 12359548 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 12359523 BeerFridge said: Quote: . Ovidijus Galdikas Link - ( New Window )

Ah, that guy. Ok. I'm not super excited about him. He is tall though. Give me Aldrich, however.

Joe Johnson
Lance Stephenson
Kobe
OJ Mayo
Wade
Eric Gordon
Derozen (if he opts out)
Beal (restricted)

Some other decent bench players also at that position. Not an exciting bunch unfortunately.

like Eric Gordon at a reduced number. I'd sign him if they can't bring in a bigger name.

In comment 12359651 EricNY33 said:

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like Eric Gordon at a reduced number. I'd sign him if they can't bring in a bigger name.

Same - not sure how he is outside of being a shooter, but 13.4, 4, and 3 on 41% and 48% shooting. Career 17 ppg player shooting 44% and 38%. Issue is the health though as he's never played a full season outside of the shortened season a few years ago.

Westbrook doesn't strike me as a triangle guard, but I wonder if he's the dream scenario to play the "slasher" role. It would take a miracle.

In comment 12359617 BeerFridge said:

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In comment 12359548 DanMetroMan said: Quote: In comment 12359523 BeerFridge said: Quote: . Ovidijus Galdikas Link - ( New Window ) Ah, that guy. Ok. I'm not super excited about him. He is tall though. Give me Aldrich, however.

Not just tall - the answer to a trivia question as to the youngest Lithuanian bride in 2008:

"Prior to becoming famous for his actions on the court, Galdikas appeared in the Lithuanian media because of his relationship with and subsequent marriage to an underage girl to avoid facing charges for statutory rape. He was 19 at the time and his wife, at 15 years old, was the youngest bride in Lithuania in 2008."

Still waiting to see if he can return to his form in LAC before the injuries took a toll on him.

I'd also take Wilson Chandler over more than half those guys on that list as he will be much cheaper 3 and D option.

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@IanBegley Ricky Ledo: "This is the year everyone's going to know me." Interesting look at Ledo's background

Video: Interesting look at Ledo's background, - ( New Window )

this off season was about getting the base of the team formed and all teh role players in place...

Next off season will be about using the max space on a star player to put next to Melo with the role players of the team already there and in place and a year under their belt in the triangle...

In comment 12359723 nygiants16 said:

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this off season was about getting the base of the team formed and all teh role players in place... Next off season will be about using the max space on a star player to put next to Melo with the role players of the team already there and in place and a year under their belt in the triangle...

Not sure who that would be though.

Overall top free agents:
-Al Horford
-Joe Johnson
-Deron Williams (ETO)
-Al Jefferson
-Joakim Noah
-Parsons (Player Option)
-Dirk (Player Option)
-Gallo
-Wilson Chandler
-Drummond (Restricted)
-David Lee
-Dwight Howard (ETO)
-Kobe
-Roy Hibbert
-Mike Conley
-Jeff Green
-Wade
-Whiteside
-Eric Gordon
-Durant
-Terance Ross (restricted)
-Derozen (ETO)
-Beal (restricted)

Most of those guys aren't stars and a lot of them are restricted FA's and Centers anyway. An option could be to go hard after a guy like Conley or Howard and then trade a Grant or Lopez for another player afterwards. This is all assuming they don't have a shot at Durant (which I don't think they do).

2017 is more interesting with guys like Westbrook, Ibaka, Curry, Paul (player option), Griffin (player option), and many more (although I'm sure a lot of them will resign before the year starts).

Only way this team will take a step towards being a contender

I wouldn't be surprised if they go hard after Paul with the connection to melo

given his relationship with the OKC media, I'd be really surprised if he even entertains signing here. Durant too, for the same reason.
Grantland: Distant Thunder: What Did Oklahoma City’s Media Do to Piss Off Russell Westbrook and Kevin Durant? - ( New Window )

would he be a Grateful Shved?

This coming year my mistake

(assuming that certain options are accepted in 2016 and declined in 2017)

-Dwight Howard
-Derrick Rose
-Westbrook
-Ibaka
-Teague
-Griffin
-Chris Paul
-Curry
-Lawson
-Bogut
-Jrue Holliday
-DeRozen
-Dirk
-Oladipo
-McLemore
-Hill
-Shabazz
-Giannis

And maybe even more depending on how the rest of this free agency goes. Remember cap is projected to be over 100 million then so a lot of free agents would want to align themselves so they can sign a contract that year.