NFT: Met fans- which pitcher has the highest ceiling?

Still think he has a chance to be a good ball player. It can all click out of nowhere. Wally may jumpstart him. Anything can happen.

Since you mention DeJesus. Surprised him and David Murphy have gotten no mention. Sure Parra is a better player, but would anyone really have been upset if the Mets gave up non prospects and received those two to add to the bench? Very underrated and under the radar trades I thought.

tools?? What are Smith's PLUS tools?? Not every prospect is a 5 tool talent. Some players just do a lot of things well. Nimmo's hit tool seems to be developing pretty well and might be a "plus". His defense has always been solid. His power might yet still be developing and it might not but as a leadoff type Im not too concerned about it.

LOL typical of this guy.

In comment 12391738 DanMetroMan said:

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In comment 12391730 ZGiants98 said: Quote: In comment 12391726 DanMetroMan said: Quote: I checked he was something like 38th in both wrc+ and woba for contest. 111 isn't a positive for a guy you are hoping to be a difference maker. If you are okay with him merely being a good platoon OF/Dejesus type this fine but that's not what people are expecting/wanting Thats actually exactly what Im expecting though. A platoon partner for Lagares. And if that's your want/expectation then you have a good shot at getting that but I think the vast majority are expecting a core player, "another Conforto", maybe even an all-star.

We could be off on our perceptions but I really don't think thats the perception around here. I really doubt people are looking at Nimmo as a future all-star anymore. I see solid player that could contribute but not some all-star at all.

In comment 12391730 ZGiants98 said:

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In comment 12391726 DanMetroMan said: Quote: I checked he was something like 38th in both wrc+ and woba for contest. 111 isn't a positive for a guy you are hoping to be a difference maker. If you are okay with him merely being a good platoon OF/Dejesus type this fine but that's not what people are expecting/wanting Thats actually exactly what Im expecting though. A platoon partner for Lagares.

So you think we'd always be talking about a guy who is projected as a platoon player if he wasn't a first rounder?

In comment 12391740 Shecky said:

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Still think he has a chance to be a good ball player. It can all click out of nowhere. Wally may jumpstart him. Anything can happen. Since you mention DeJesus. Surprised him and David Murphy have gotten no mention. Sure Parra is a better player, but would anyone really have been upset if the Mets gave up non prospects and received those two to add to the bench? Very underrated and under the radar trades I thought.

Angels got them for literally nothing

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The Mets have enhanced their inconsistent offense with the additions of Juan Uribe and Kelly Johnson but still have their sights clearly on a big bat, with Justin Upton, Carlos Gonzalez, Carlos Gomez, Gerardo Parra and Jay Bruce among the better targets.

Mets still seeking big bat - ( New Window )

I think the VAST majority of Mets fans are expecting Brandon Nimmo to be an above average every day player who hits 20+ homers, steals bases (this 100% isn't going to happen) and posts a big OBP. Cecchini is having a better offensive season and he's a SS and is younger and nobody is projecting stardom for Cecchini.

In comment 12391745 Torrag said:

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LOL typical of this guy.

Dude, seriously you are a fucking joke. We all laughed and I admitted my mistake looking at the numbers. Who the fuck are you anyway? Where were you over the last few years when HH, Arc, Dan, and others were in the weeds talking baseball? Fucking bandwagon fan thats wants to join the bus now? Going to target me and make swipes at me daily now? Fuck off. You haven't earned your stripes here. Not even close.

In comment 12391757 DanMetroMan said:

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I think the VAST majority of Mets fans are expecting Brandon Nimmo to be an above average every day player who hits 20+ homers, steals bases (this 100% isn't going to happen) and posts a big OBP. Cecchini is having a better offensive season and he's a SS and is younger and nobody is projecting stardom for Cecchini.

Well then Id be shocked? People here are expecting 20+ homeruns from Nimmo right now??? Wow. Not disagreeing with you but as a social experiment anybody here agree with that? Is that how you all are viewing Nimmo currently??

Jon Heyman 3m
also in story, astros have checked on @JUST_JUP, zack wheeler discussed with reds in jay bruce talk

Now you're the thread police. You're worse than a joke. You're a cliche.

I've been an active poster on BBI for a decade moron.

do Wheeler for Bruce, the "extra" would be my concern.

But at two years for a combined $26M or so he's a good value.

In comment 12391768 Torrag said:

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Now you're the thread police. You're worse than a joke. You're a cliche. I've been an active poster on BBI for a decade moron.

Not on Mets threads. Guess you are just a "Mets fan" when you want to be. Cool beans.

Stop saying stupid shit daily.

would replace/block Conforto? He doesn't play CF right? Not sure I'd want to give up Wheeler for that. I'd rather think bigger and go after Gomez.

is underrated. If I told you guys "we traded Wheeler for a guy who finished top 10 in MVP voting twice in the last 3 seasons, had hit 30+ homers 3 times and will be 29 for the entire 2016 season (and under contract for 2017) both at below market rates, almost everyone would be happy.

In comment 12391779 Torrag said:

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Stop saying stupid shit daily.

Lol. If you don't think you are targeting me daily here over the last week or so you are absolutely delusional. GTFO. Thanks for showing up for the playoff run. How convenient for you.

He isn't so good we should deplete the system for him. As always the price matters.

In comment 12391787 DanMetroMan said:

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is underrated. If I told you guys "we traded Wheeler for a guy who finished top 10 in MVP voting twice in the last 3 seasons, had hit 30+ homers 3 times and will be 29 for the entire 2016 season (and under contract for 2017) both at below market rates, almost everyone would be happy.

I do it and and make it work. Bruce and Granderson are locks for two OF spots. Conforto, and whoever splits CF with Granderson can rotate it around and we should be fine.

the Brewers would need a "franchise altering" package for Gomez. They could be bluffing but they also have no pressure to deal him.

starts his career 4 for his first 10, 4 k's

about Bruce is playing in Cincinnati and that short porch but he's still a good enough player that I role the dice and not think twice.

Side comment, I was talking to a die hard Cincinnati fan the other day and I mentioned Bruce and he sort of just rolled his eyes. Had more of a "good riddance" attitude about him. Said he is VERY streaky.

Might mean nothing but I found it interesting.

Like I said, Id love to add Bruce.

I remember accessing BBI via a 14.4 modem and the Lynx browser.

So you're all newbies to me.

In terms of quality of player he is very good and I think Wheeler is fair value given the contract. His profile (feast or famine lefty who K's a lot) is inconveniently similar to Duda and he may take Conforto out of the lineup, but he's still a good enough player that it could be worth it. Just may be better deals out there.

fans are bizarre. They routinely have ripped Joey Votto for being happy with a walk. Joey Votto is an incredible player when healthy.

You just tried a Vegas performance comparison of a player that hasn't been there a week. You'll say almost anything to support your position. No matter how far fetched.

As far as Bruce and 30 homers. I don't have his home/road splits but his home ballpark is a bandbox. Again at his dollar value he's a good player. I don't necessarily think 'underrated' is a label he warrants but hey that's your opinion.

Votto gets on base as well as anyone in baseball. Who cares how he does it. Dude is an awesome player.

Wheeler for Bruce? Sign me up. Still don't know how that OF alignment works but I would love to land Bruce. Has a team option for a reasonable 13M in 2017, IIRC as well.. so he'd be far from a rental. Underrated player because of his crappy 2014.

In comment 12391809 Torrag said:

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You just tried a Vegas performance comparison of a player that hasn't been there a week. You'll say almost anything to support your position. No matter how far fetched. As far as Bruce and 30 homers. I don't have his home/road splits but his home ballpark is a bandbox. Again at his dollar value he's a good player. I don't necessarily think 'underrated' is a label he warrants but hey that's your opinion.

If you actually read what I posted, his AAA numbers meant nothing nor did it support what I was saying. We all know Nimmo Just got promoted to Vegas. And I especially knew Dan knew that. Wasn't trying to trick anyone. lol. But keep being the complete imbecile you are and coming after me like a scorned teenager that stole your girlfriend.

is an irrational one. It seems every time I've seen him play the Mets, I've seen him strikeout. I know this can't be true, yet that is what my I see in my mind's eye when I read his name

In comment 12391803 Deej said:

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I remember accessing BBI via a 14.4 modem and the Lynx browser. So you're all newbies to me.

And your easily one of the best Mets posters here. Its not even a question.

facts are what they are

2012 and 2013 he finished 10th in MVP voting

2010- 5.1 WAR
2011- 3.0 WAR
2012 2.5 WAR
2013 4.2 WAR
2014 -0.8 WAR (battled a knee issue all year)
2015 1.9 WAR (on pace for 3.0 WAR per ZIPS)

He's 9th in wRC+ amongst RF's this season
He's 9th in wOBA
He's 8th in homers
9th in OBP
9th in RBI

2008-2013 115 OPS+
2014 was horrid
2015 125 OPS+

By WAR value he's already been worth 15.5 million in 2015 and has been worth 30+ twice in his career. He's signed through 2017 at 12.5 and 13 million where guys like Upton are going to get 100+

GAB IS a launching pad, Citifield is 6th in homers per game and believe it or not it's very close

GAB 1.37 homers per game (3rd)
Citifield 1.268 homers per game (6th)

And remember that includes the fact the Mets themselves don't have power hitters

Mets post's say 5 years ago here were few and far in between. If you started one, before the mods laid down the law about Yankee and Met fans posting on each others threads,you posted and got heat and ridicule. Met fans the few, did fire back and instigate at times. However, today, BBI has evolved into the best site on the Internet IMO to talk intelligent Met baseball

You said it as part of your argument. Now you disown it? I don't think you were trying to trick anyone. You're just so myopic you get excited and anything that supports your position becomes gospel. It's called grasping at straws. You're quite good at it. Not surprising with all the practice you have. I get it you're an optimistic Met fan. That's not a bad thing. It's just cloying when taken to such extremes. You're a good foil though for the reasonable, realistic Mets fans. Keep up the good work. Such as it is.

As I said I think he's a good dollar value. I'll stand by my opinion he isn't a star player or dynamic. Above average regular? Absolutley. Do I want him if the price is fair? I do.

on this. Nice going TC
Link - ( New Window )

kick in some cash and deal Ellsbury? Gardner makes Ellsbury expendable in CF and they have to hate that contract. Maybe cut it in half and send them Montero and Flores (2b?). Maybe Wheeler if they eat a ton of money.

Ellsbury is a guy I thought the Mets should have signed, though not at that contract for that many years.

In comment 12391848 Torrag said:

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As I said I think he's a good dollar value. I'll stand by my opinion he isn't a star player or dynamic. Above average regular? Absolutley. Do I want him if the price is fair? I do.

I'm not suggesting he's a superstar. I'm suggesting his resume is better than people are giving him credit for. He'd be the best offensive player on the Mets (not including Wright until we see Wright)

In comment 12391843 raever said:

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You said it as part of your argument. Now you disown it? I don't think you were trying to trick anyone. You're just so myopic you get excited and anything that supports your position becomes gospel. It's called grasping at straws. You're quite good at it. Not surprising with all the practice you have. I get it you're an optimistic Met fan. That's not a bad thing. It's just cloying when taken to such extremes. You're a good foil though for the reasonable, realistic Mets fans. Keep up the good work. Such as it is.

I IMMEDIATELY laughed and said my bad. Owned up to it almost immediately as I was just scanning his numbers briefly. I could have also said his wRC+ was 165 over the course of his time St. Lucie last year also which would have strengthened my case further but I didn't. If you actually took the time to read what I was saying rather than nitpicking one little aspect that I immediately apologized for, I was simply saying that he has held his own with the bat.

pj.. the Mets and Yankees would never deal with each other in any capacity beyond dealing spare parts. Francesa talks about this often but he's correct. The Mets would never ever send the Yankees a young pitcher who could turn into a superstar across town or vice versa. The risk that they'd never live it down and be reminded of it every day is too great for either team.

I know it sounds silly and like a bad reason not to do a deal if one made sense but that's just how it is.

Tonight's lineup:

@cgrand3 RF
Murphy 3B
Johnson 2B
Duda 1B
@mconforto8 LF
Nieuwenhuis CF
Flores SS
@Anthony_Recker C
Colon P

In comment 12391839 DanMetroMan said:

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GAB IS a launching pad, Citifield is 6th in homers per game and believe it or not it's very close GAB 1.37 homers per game (3rd) Citifield 1.268 homers per game (6th) And remember that includes the fact the Mets themselves don't have power hitters

I'm pretty content with how the park plays these days. I think they finally got it right.

Also, this REALLY underscores how ridiculous DeGrom is. His home numbers are comical.

giving Tejada a rest. Didn't think i'd ever write that sentence this season and not worry about getting ridiculed

In comment 12391851 pjcas18 said:

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kick in some cash and deal Ellsbury? Gardner makes Ellsbury expendable in CF and they have to hate that contract. Maybe cut it in half and send them Montero and Flores (2b?). Maybe Wheeler if they eat a ton of money. Ellsbury is a guy I thought the Mets should have signed, though not at that contract for that many years.

Isn't Gardner the everyday LF and Ellsbury the every day CF?? Why would they trade one of their best players heading towards the playoffs in first place??

Looking back, it might have been unfair to expect a lot out of him. There's less of that now.

In comment 12391864 Headhunter said:

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giving Tejada a rest. Didn't think i'd ever write that sentence this season and not worry about getting ridiculed

I figured this would be the case. Flores will start every game at second against left-handed pitchers and move around giving other players a day off here and there at SS, ect.

the ball does fly out, except for Uribe's shot which I thought was out of Citi Field off the bat

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Didn't think i'd ever write that sentence this season and not worry about getting ridiculed.

HH killin' it today.