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| Another tech giant that says it must import foreign workers because there aren’t enough skilled American workers in the industry is laying off thousands of workers. Qualcomm — a major producer of smartphone chips — announced last week it’s eliminating 15 percent of its workforce or about 4,500 employees, just weeks after fellow tech giant Microsoft announced a massive round of layoffs. Both companies are top beneficiaries of the H-1b visa program, which backers say allows companies to temporarily hire foreign workers for jobs they can’t find qualified Americans workers to fill. Critics contend the program is really used to cut costs. Microsoft and Qualcomm were in the top 15 users of H-1b visas in Fiscal Year 2013, according to U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services data obtained by Computer World. They’re part of a major tech lobbying effort to increase the cap on these temporary workers, on the grounds there is a shortage of Americans with science, technology, engineering and math degrees. |
There may be an issue here, but the facts as presented in the article don't support it
And this is being repeated in firms all over the country. The HIB visa program is being abused at the expense of American jobs.
Overall, yes, it's outrageous that in high tech fields, the US is "exporting jobs" to foreigner working in the US.
Have to adjust staff. Life goes on.
Tech firms claim not enough US qualified workers but it's also known individuals getting these visas will often work for less.
There is a real benefit to having those jobs performed in America. These people pay taxes. They rent homes. They eat at restaurants and shop at stores. And there's also a real benefit to not accelerating the departure of high tech jobs to as-yet unbuilt facilities in Asia.
There is a real benefit to having those jobs performed in America. These people pay taxes. They rent homes. They eat at restaurants and shop at stores. And there's also a real benefit to not accelerating the departure of high tech jobs to as-yet unbuilt facilities in Asia.
No, there isn't. These companies already outsource to these areas - they find it more cost effective to manage these resources on shore, which is why they're basically building on-shore 'offshore' centers by importing workers from these areas and putting them into US geographic locations that are relatively low cost.
Although it's better than losing the job offshore entirely, the fact remains that it's dishonest. The 'let's let in H1B's because we have no skilled workers to fill these jobs' is bullshit. We have the skilled workers, these companies are just unwilling to pay the wages required to hire them.
are used to hire promising foreign students recently graduated from US universities. Keep the brains here, we educated them. Keeps US tech firms vibrant and competitive, thereby creating more jobs for US citizens.
If the H1B visa program was used as it was intended, keeping students who were schooled here to work here, then that would be a benefit. As it is being used, or abused, it is just another job drain.
If you were a kid going to school, why would you put yourself through a STEM program just to have your wages stagnated or your job possibly outsources to one of these H1b Visa workers?
are used to hire promising foreign students recently graduated from US universities. Keep the brains here, we educated them. Keeps US tech firms vibrant and competitive, thereby creating more jobs for US citizens.
No, most of these folks have studied abroad and are hired dirt cheap. If anything, extending visas to people who were here on student visas would accomplish what you're looking for.
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are used to hire promising foreign students recently graduated from US universities. Keep the brains here, we educated them. Keeps US tech firms vibrant and competitive, thereby creating more jobs for US citizens.
No, most of these folks have studied abroad and are hired dirt cheap. If anything, extending visas to people who were here on student visas would accomplish what you're looking for.
Was just giving the tech company argument. It would make sense to try and keep exceptional students just recently graduated.
It use to be (at least decades ago) that employers had to prove no US citizens qualified. Is this now just a rubber stamp type process?
Second. Could anyone give me an idea of what the job market will be like for the 4,500 who are laid off?
It's a sham, and if tech workers had any kind of industry leadership, professional association, what have you - you'd see a lot less of it.
It's a sham, and if tech workers had any kind of industry leadership, professional association, what have you - you'd see a lot less of it.
It would seem than that the problem is in the process. It shouldn't be all that difficult to insure the job was listed at the actual prevailing rate.
Second. Could anyone give me an idea of what the job market will be like for the 4,500 who are laid off?
People I know in the tech field have been out of work for months and up to 2 years before finding a new position. Of course that all depends on your location and experience. But the job market is not great for anyone.
They've also been under pressure by an activist investor (who totally sucks, by the way) to cut costs and streamline operations.
Large, successful companies often bloat the cost structure during the growth phase and subsequently must cut them as their industry and business matures.
QCOM's status as a top 15 user of H-1b's makes sense given their large size - they're probably one of the ten biggest tech companies ranked by market cap.
It's outrageous because companies are abusing the H1B Visa program to bring in low wage, low skilled (comparatively) workers to replace Americans. That is specifically not allowed in the law.
Second. Could anyone give me an idea of what the job market will be like for the 4,500 who are laid off?
Providing green card to students graduating with an advanced degree in a STEM field, sounds like a great idea. However, it could have unintended consequences, if it's easy for them to stay.
It would make sense for these foreign students to take a lower salary now just to get the experience of working in a US Corp. environment. Am aware of several students sent by their parents to attend private US high schools and continue with US college, not because they intend for their children to stay here. Rather to learn American culture, they are much more valuable to employers when they return home.
As a nation, we are trying to get more students to get degrees in STEM fields. If they may end up facing a suppressed job market upon graduation, this isn't going to help. These kids are bright, they can do many other things. You already see some students, not seeking a job in their field or graduate school. They are getting jobs in the Financial Sector where they can make alot more money.
I know my brother, who was displaced by his company hiring H1B visas was willing to relocate, he's single with no kids, and he just got a job now 2 years later.
You hear all these stories about how the middle class is disappearing, well this is why.
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First, wouldn't the passage of the "Staple Act", a reform of immigration law that would provide a green card to any foreign student upon receipt of a masters or PHD in a STEM subject from a US university solve the one issue? It does seem ridiculous to me that we educate these students here and force them to leave the country after they become qualified to make a valuable contribution and want to stay.
Second. Could anyone give me an idea of what the job market will be like for the 4,500 who are laid off?
Providing green card to students graduating with an advanced degree in a STEM field, sounds like a great idea. However, it could have unintended consequences, if it's easy for them to stay.
But one of the unintended consequences is that they form startups that create jobs in the US. Silicon Valley surely shows that's possible. So it works both ways
It would make sense for these foreign students to take a lower salary now just to get the experience of working in a US Corp. environment. Am aware of several students sent by their parents to attend private US high schools and continue with US college, not because they intend for their children to stay here. Rather to learn American culture, they are much more valuable to employers when they return home.
The kids sent by their parents to US prep schools (and with the possible exception of the Chinese their parents are paying full freight) simply won't take the green card. How's that different than the current situation? And if they stay for a few years and leave it opens up an entry level position for another US grad.
As a nation, we are trying to get more students to get degrees in STEM fields. If they may end up facing a suppressed job market upon graduation, this isn't going to help.
Unless colleges create more slots in STEM departments it really won't cause depression in the job market, though other factors could cause it
These kids are bright, they can do many other things. You already see some students, not seeking a job in their field or graduate school. They are getting jobs in the Financial Sector where they can make alot more money.
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In comment 12395820 njm said:
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First, wouldn't the passage of the "Staple Act", a reform of immigration law that would provide a green card to any foreign student upon receipt of a masters or PHD in a STEM subject from a US university solve the one issue? It does seem ridiculous to me that we educate these students here and force them to leave the country after they become qualified to make a valuable contribution and want to stay.
Second. Could anyone give me an idea of what the job market will be like for the 4,500 who are laid off?
Providing green card to students graduating with an advanced degree in a STEM field, sounds like a great idea. However, it could have unintended consequences, if it's easy for them to stay.
But one of the unintended consequences is that they form startups that create jobs in the US. Silicon Valley surely shows that's possible. So it works both ways
It would make sense for these foreign students to take a lower salary now just to get the experience of working in a US Corp. environment. Am aware of several students sent by their parents to attend private US high schools and continue with US college, not because they intend for their children to stay here. Rather to learn American culture, they are much more valuable to employers when they return home.
The kids sent by their parents to US prep schools (and with the possible exception of the Chinese their parents are paying full freight) simply won't take the green card. How's that different than the current situation? And if they stay for a few years and leave it opens up an entry level position for another US grad.
As a nation, we are trying to get more students to get degrees in STEM fields. If they may end up facing a suppressed job market upon graduation, this isn't going to help.
Unless colleges create more slots in STEM departments it really won't cause depression in the job market, though other factors could cause it
These kids are bright, they can do many other things. You already see some students, not seeking a job in their field or graduate school. They are getting jobs in the Financial Sector where they can make alot more money.
njm, we really don't disagree. The Staples Act in theory is a great idea particularly if its considers only those with a PHD. You mentioned master's as well. My concern is that it may discourage US students to pursue a STEM field; to start lower salaries and greater competition in job market. As indicated in my last paragraph we are already seeing some of this.
In my field, the RF Engineers are largely foreign, I've found a few Americans with the expertise but all of them, to a man are demanding outrageous salaries because of all of their experience. I finally settled on a new guy, he's from India with an EE and MBA and he's the best one I have hired. Each time I've had to find one, an overwhelming number are foreign and every single American is asking for the moon and I just won't pay it.
If I can get someone younger and hungrier for half of what I'd pay some older guy who feels entitled to things, why on earth would I pick the American?
In my field, the RF Engineers are largely foreign, I've found a few Americans with the expertise but all of them, to a man are demanding outrageous salaries because of all of their experience. I finally settled on a new guy, he's from India with an EE and MBA and he's the best one I have hired. Each time I've had to find one, an overwhelming number are foreign and every single American is asking for the moon and I just won't pay it.
If I can get someone younger and hungrier for half of what I'd pay some older guy who feels entitled to things, why on earth would I pick the American?
This is why Nike has their factories in China.
They don't, however, import these workers to the US.