Maybe we should be revising the Ch. Kelly Indictment thread

The only question that people should have is if he can keep his QBs healthy.

So he can't be written off or dismissed at this point. Wait and see.

giving the Redskins a run for their money to get the Preseason Champs trophy

His ego and personality will doom him though.

putting up over 40 points twice during Spurrier's first preseason with the likes of Wuerrful and Shane Matthews at QB.

They're not lighting up the league on new formations or quirky playcalls. Kelly is not re-inventing the wheel.

They're running NFL plays and concepts you've seen before, that anyone could run if they chose to, only with highly precise execution, and at a rapid pace.

The innovation comes in the attention paid to physical fitness and training.

What I do know is its frustrating as anything seeing a division rival's offense score points all the time while my team is giving them up.

Bleurgh.

then they're going to be very tough to beat imv..Bradford would benefit greatly as Romo did..

In comment 12433343 Big Blue '56 said:

Quote:

then they're going to be very tough to beat imv..Bradford would benefit greatly as Romo did..

Agreed if Murray performs like last year it will greatly improve the odds of Bradford staying healthy. Everyone is seriously underrating the impact Murray had on the entire Dallas team last year. They controlled the clock which kept their defense off the field and opened up the play action passing game. Romo is really going to miss Murray and we have seen what a reliable running game can do for an offense.

In comment 12433332 Ten Ton Hammer said:

Quote:

They're not lighting up the league on new formations or quirky playcalls. Kelly is not re-inventing the wheel. They're running NFL plays and concepts you've seen before, that anyone could run if they chose to, only with highly precise execution, and at a rapid pace. The innovation comes in the attention paid to physical fitness and training.

This. When I hear about how Chip Kelly runs so many plays and keeps the pressure on the defense, this is nothing new. Go back to the K-Gun offense in Buffalo in the 1990s. When it's working well, like the AFC Championship game in 1990, they can smoke someone 51-3. When it's not working and you are off the field quick and your defense gets worn down...like, oh Super Bowl XXV, you lose.

And going with a read-option offense featuring a brittle QB is plain stupid. I know all the attention Suggs got this weekend, but the bottom line is the rules of the game say that he can hit a QB who is pretending to keep the ball and they don't have the same rules of protection. It would be a miracle if Bradford is able to play the entire season. But if something goes wrong, he's got Sanchez and Barkley and Tebow...umm, hurray?

One thing to also keep in mind, when guys leave that team, they seem to be slamming this new way that he has them in for conditioning. Players don't like coaches, it happens. But coaches, whether they like it or not, have to adjust. Chip seems set in his ways and is out to prove he's right. Those types of coaches tend to go down in flames, ie- Mike Martz.

Maybe I'll be proven wrong, but Chip looks to me to be best suited to go back to college. The good thing for Giants fans is that if that is the case, the Eagles already have given him the keys. So if he goes back, he's crashed the car and the Eagles will take years to undo the damage. This thought makes me happy.

regular season. They have had games where they run out to big leads in the first half and then have to hold on to win late in the fourth quarter. They supposedly run double the amount of plays other teams do in a single practice so they would likely be ahead of other teams at this point. The other teams are not game planning for them in the preseason I would assume. Their defense wore out last year down the stretch from being on the field so much.

burn the team out? They lost 3 of their last 4 (only beating us in a meaningless week 17 game).

Kelly has the same type athletes as everyone else. He is arrogant to think only he has the magic formula to maximize performance.

It looks like they hit a wall figuratively and literally last year. And even for his 10 wins - it resulted in a non-playoff season.

how much of your valuable time would it have taken to add 1 more letter to Ch. if you count the .? I mean you couldn't commit to Chip?

It's how you maximize posts per minute.

In comment 12433398 Headhunter said:

Quote:

how much of your valuable time would it have taken to add 1 more letter to Ch. if you count the .? I mean you couldn't commit to Chip?

He most likely ran out of subject line space. I have and I try to get the essentials in that subject line by cutting out the letters that wouldn't be missed..Except by you...:)

Is something that I just do not get. There's a group who thinks he's the next coming, and there's a group who loves rebelling against that notion. Time will sort out what he is. To me the most interesting thing about Chip Kelly is that he's a middle aged, single man who actually looks like a lesbian.

I ran out of space and had to abbreviate Ch. for Chip. The one space made a difference.

I am sorry to upset you so...I can see where Ch. Kelly for Chip Kelly could confuse and disorient you. But maybe if you'd give me an idea for future references....Is T.C. all right, can I go with J.R? if we slip into politics do I have to type out Franklin Delanor Roosevelt, or does F.D.R work, maybe you'd be comfortable with Franklin D. Roosevelt, eh.?
And if we slip into the auto world can you handle G.M.?
Thanks again
Grizz
Post Script (that's long for the unacceptable P.S)....., dumb dumb and dumber..

.

...because the first two pre-season games are so indicative of how a season is going to play out.

Their STs were the main reason for many of their wins. Their defensive backfield was a real Achilles heel, but it may not this year. I think they'll actually be better this year and give the Division a run for its money, unfortunately.

JR needs to build our defense back to respectability. We need a few more studs on D. I think we have a fairly solid foundation, but I think our ceiling this year is average.

when Bradford walked away from that hit by Suggs....

you can save a space by writing it as Franklin Delano Roosevelt

Who has been successful everywhere he has went. He raised UNH's profile, he was great at Oregon, and so far has been successful in the pros. His practices are designed to get every bit out of them possible. Make fun of his strength and conditioning tactics all you want, but at the very least he is trying something to stem injuries. At bottom, like Walsh before him, he is a true innovator who believes he could outscheme you on offense and to invest resources in defense. I hate the Eagles more than any team in Sports, but I would trade them coaches right now, and I recognize TC has won two Super Bowls and Chip Kelly has won squat at any level. Bill Walsh also won squat and you see how that turned out. Chip Kelly has no life, but football and I think besides BB there isn't a coach who is still working on this planet that I would trade for him. I think, like Walsh and BB, he is a once in a generation type of coach.

see, I thought he was wrong.

I wondered how he'd do with a bad team and if a few three and outs in two minutes each might not ruin any defense much less any team.

And as to the poster who wrote that he's running the same plays...I'm not sure that's true. He has plays that work off each other in a way that Most NFL teams are not using.

And of course, it's only pre-season can't be said often enough. But at least I don't think anyone can say it's an open and shut case.

The man has been head coach for 6 years and a coordinator before that; he has a body of work to judge him on.

I include college and the pros

There are two ways to stop that type of offense; keep them off the field or keep everything in front of you and really buckle down in the red zone.

I'm of the mind you can run them into the ground. There is nothing magical about his approach.

Spurrier pasted teams his first preseason and got exposed each of his two seasons in DC. Chip Kelly has the likes of Bill Belichick reaching out to him for pointers on offense and has gotten 10 wins each season. The only similarity between the two is that they both like to wear stupid visors.

but what many fail to realize with preseason is many teams are trying out new things, new players and new packages. Most don't game plan at all. The end product with a lot of teams can be rough because they are doing a lot of different things outside what they normallly would. So, my question is, was he running his regular packages and going all out and what was the other team doing?

I don't think we've ever had a good preseason with TC, but we've had some good years during the regular season.

Intersting. I guess last year's 5 and 0 preseason doesn't count.

on Chip, but he works fundamentals, runs a tight ship and is definitely in charge of that team. Good, solid coach.

That being said, I wouldn't get too concerned about an NFL team scoring points in the pre-season when that team is running an offense that can be taught to HS kids.


Scoring in the pre-season is all about which teams are further along in their prep work. Running a complex offense or defense is going to put you behind a team who runs a simpler scheme.

He's said it many times over. They run basically only five or six different plays. So from that standpoint I wouldn't call him an innovator who is rewriting the playbook.

He's basically trying to run as many plays a game as possible and with his fast break style of offense not allow the defense to do situational substitution and keep them on the field and make them even more vulnerable as they move down the field.

As for comparing them to the Bills Kelly and the K-gun it wasn't the fast break type of offense you see Chip Kelly using. Jim Kelly called the plays himself at the line of scrimmage after he looked over the defense. Grant it they didn't huddle and was more a two minute offense but not nearly the pace the Eagles try to employ.

If you like fast break basketball in the NFL then you love Chip ball. Me I hate it. The offense has the clear advantage to do whatever they want . I just feel the defenses are at such a disadvantage anymore because of the rules they should at least allow them to get set in their positions before the ball is snapped.

In comment 12434308 blueblood'11 said:

Quote:

Intersting. I guess last year's 5 and 0 preseason doesn't count.

Blue: At what point did they look good last preseason? I don't care what the record says. Who was in the game when leads were taken?

In comment 12433332 Ten Ton Hammer said:

Quote:

They're not lighting up the league on new formations or quirky playcalls. Kelly is not re-inventing the wheel. They're running NFL plays and concepts you've seen before, that anyone could run if they chose to, only with highly precise execution, and at a rapid pace. The innovation comes in the attention paid to physical fitness and training.

Funny, I just read an article (can't find it again) that states one key of Kelly's offense is simplicity. I had been under the impression that it was complex and innovative, but the article says that the simplicity means fewer mistakes and faster play with less thinking. And we all know that simplicity is ridiculed on BBI.

that is what he schemes for. Whether it is a blocking mismatch with an unbalanced line, or some type of stealth play (like that James Casey TD against us last year in Philly). Part of it, is not letting your defense regroup, part of it is scheme. Gimmick or not, it works and in two years nobody has really been able to slow it down. If Foles stays healthy, they probably win 12 games last year, and that is with a team that was not crafted the way he liked it. I am genuinely scared what is going to happen with players that he covets, like Murray who run North and South, instead of McCoy who do too much East to West for his liking. I was so hoping Roseman won that power war, because we would have been rid of him for good. Now, with him in charge, people who think he is going back to college are probably kidding themselves.

In comment 12434319 River Mike said:

Quote:

In comment 12433332 Ten Ton Hammer said: Quote: They're not lighting up the league on new formations or quirky playcalls. Kelly is not re-inventing the wheel. They're running NFL plays and concepts you've seen before, that anyone could run if they chose to, only with highly precise execution, and at a rapid pace. The innovation comes in the attention paid to physical fitness and training. Funny, I just read an article (can't find it again) that states one key of Kelly's offense is simplicity. I had been under the impression that it was complex and innovative, but the article says that the simplicity means fewer mistakes and faster play with less thinking. And we all know that simplicity is ridiculed on BBI.

The myth that Chip runs this shadowy strategic offense has gone back to Oregon. People think the only way to score a lot of points is deception or doing something nobody has ever seen before.

In fact, perhaps the most important thing in that offense is stressing the fundamentals. Block on screens. Make the defense play the whole field. Act as if you expect to get the ball on every play. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4k5L-04LSU

Really the only thing different that he does (in game) is that he doesn't care about conventional NFL wisdom. He's okay with going against he grain and being criticised. He'll go for it on 4th downs, he's not going to take the air out of the ball and run out the clock if he's up on the scoreboard. He's ultra-aggressive.

Pretty much all you need to know about Chip Kelly's personality is in this youtube clip.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTiFRa70m48

He also places a high importance on great special teams play. I don't have the exact numbers from last season, but the Eagles special teams was a very productive unit. You could say he's turned that into an offensive opportunity too.

Quote:

On that same note JOrthman : 8/24/2015 8:36 pm : link : reply I don't think we've ever had a good preseason with TC, but we've had some good years during the regular season. JOrthman blueblood'11 : 6:58 am : link : reply Intersting. I guess last year's 5 and 0 preseason doesn't count.

I judge a preseason by how our starters do against the opposing starters. Last year, we were 1-4. This year we are 0-2. That tend to be a better predictor than the overall record. When scrubs who will no longer be on a team are beating another group of scrubs, it really doesn't matter.

but talk to me in December. He's had a good start to his career one that cannot be dismissed but year 3 really is a big year for QBs and head coaches. It's more or less his time to shine or fall.

And as unfair as it may be injuries will play a part.

.

Let's see HOW GOOD if he ever has to deal with "Giants' type" injuries..

a lot like I look at Rex Ryan and Harbaugh.

Colossal pricks who end up wearing out their welcome before they are able to achieve sustained success.

That's a huge difference between him and Walsh. Walsh was egotistical as a football mind, but as a person, he was polite and sometimes indifferent. I really can only thin k of one guy recently who might be considered a jerk who has had sustained success - Belicheck.

But Bill is also a bit of an introvert. Guys like ryan, Harbaugh and Kelly aren't, which gives them amples opportunities to put their foot in their mouths and piss people off.

Their talent base got worse. He may have done it as a culture change and that I understand. That club regressed last year and it all hinges on Murray and Bradford staying healthy. That is a significant risk.

Good point. Belichick has a lot of Chuck Noll to him - Noll was brilliant, egotistic, hated the press and barely spoke to them, generally regarded as cold, but introverted and quiet. A lot of his players didn't like Noll much (nor Belichick), but he wasn't up in their faces all the time and he pretty much left them alone off the football field.

But I think Chip Kelly and harbaugh are introverts as well. But, if the overall point was that Walsh was a gentleman off the field and did not suffer from some social interaction disorder like kelly and harbaugh and BB, I agree. Rex Ryan is an extrovert and I don't think he belongs in the class of these other guys. Rex knows football, but he has no idea how to manage a team.

Let's see his system work for a 16 game regular season. Running up points in pre season games where teams are not scheming against you means NOTHING

I don't know it well enough to explain it well, but he is using different plays...he's taking blocking to another level with his inside and outside zone reads from the spread offense..That's one reason I think (note the emphasize on I think, I'm not going to maintain I'm close to an expert) the plays can be called so quickly. The plays develop from the reads as it unfolds and the plays are in series and are used to set up the next one.

That's not to say it will work, just to counter the notion that he's running the same plays we've seen from other teams..

Results since? The league adapts quickly. Chip Kelly installs his system and its unstoppable season 1. Small sample but results since? The league adapts quickly. There are a lot of very smart football men in the NFL. Once they see what you do they find ways to shut it down. Talent and health are the key factors in winning. That's why hitching his cart to Bradford and Murray is problematical.

keeping the starting QB healthy during the season. That's what was the issue with Martz's offense and Kelly's will also allow defenders a free rush to the QB.