Some of you make it see as though the path back to contention is as simple as acquiring picks and starting over by securing talent at other positions, sucking for a year or two and then drafting another franchise QB. What is the track record of teams actually doing that and succeeding? I can't think of any outside of the recent Colts and that was when there was A) an all time, slam dunk prospect on the horizon, and B) that Colts team is not that good outside of Luck being extraordinary. If youre going to bring up the 9ers going from Montana to Young, Pack from Favre to Rodgers or even Eagles with McNabb to Vick, those inheriting players were already on the team and those teams were already stocked with vets.
You build teams through the draft and we have started to do that. Despite what many would have you believe, there is a decent amount of young talent on this roster. Obviously we have ODB, cruz and RR (at least for another year), and it looks like we have a tough physical albeit young receiver in Geremy Davis. The line, our talent is pretty much in 3 players, all were drafted in house in Pugh, Flowers (who reminds me of a more tame Erick Williams) and Richburg. Depth on the lines is def a priority going forward. Corner we are pretty set with starters for at least 3 more years (assuming Prince gets a new deal), but again depth here is always needed. Pretty much bank on OL and DB draft picks every year. DL? Hankins is getting ready to become all pro, Bromley has been one of the lone bright spots of the preseason, OO looks like the goods and Moore has a ton of ability to unlock. The other potential difference makers on the team are Landon Collins, JT Thomas and (dare I say) Orleans Darkwa.
That is A LOT more than other doormat teams of years past who look for that quarterback to lead them out have. Many of those players are cost controlled.
So why dump with Eli? Yea, we m8ght not be shit this year. Most were saying when MacAdoo took over itd be a 3 year plan. Well we're in year 2. If we traded Eli, in 2 years we might be the Houston Texans or the Jets. If you're looking for the next 3rd rounder (a la Russell Wilson or Kaepernick) to lead a stacked team to the Super Bowl, don't hold your breath. With the number of teams in CFB going to the spread, finding an NFL ready guy with knowledge of a pro style is going to be harder and harder. I think we might start seeing more and more of the pro ready guys coming from smaller schools.
Here it is. Eli is 34 and (knock on wood) has stayed remarkably healthy. Plantar Fascitis for a QB? Manageable. He is still very good in tight moments and we might have to wait another year to build the rezt of the team up around him. Big deal. We aren't the Pats. We don't play against the Fins, Bills and Jets twice a year. We reload and build a TOUGH, battle ready team when we are in contention. What was all the amazing talent we had on ANY of our Super Bowl teams? Outside of the D on the first two squads, maybe Bavaro could be considered all pro? Was Simms considered top 5 in the league in 86? Hoss?
We have a clutch, tough, great quarterback who will cost a lot but if we get rid of Eli, the wait for another run will be A LOT longer. Brady is what? 38? Extend Eli, show improvement, make a run next year at the latest.
Also Wilson and Kaepernick (and the bloom is off that rose) came to squads with perhaps the Top two defenses n the league
Give Eli a Top Ten D and we probably win the whole thing.
We also know that in the last 10 years we're the only team to win two SBs..The magnitude of that accomplishment cannot be underscored enough..As aggravating as that would be, I would take two world championships followed by 5-7 playoff-less seasons anytime..No questions asked..
It is SO HARD to win a SB..Very, very hard
Also Wilson and Kaepernick (and the bloom is off that rose) came to squads with perhaps the Top two defenses n the league
Give Eli a Top Ten D and we probably win the whole thing.
Rocco watch how good the Texans are this year with Hoyer or Mallet as their QB. You just dont let a two time super bowl winning qb off ur team. Especially one who TWICE led a drive to win the game with his last drive.
And for the first time in 60 seasons, I might consider that as well
We also know that in the last 10 years we're the only team to win two SBs..The magnitude of that accomplishment cannot be underscored enough..As aggravating as that would be, I would take two world championships followed by 5-7 playoff-less seasons anytime..No questions asked..
It is SO HARD to win a SB..Very, very hard
Two disagreements:
1) Pitt won 2
2) I disagree with your thought that a great O and avg D can win you a championship. I can name maybe the '06 Colts as a team that fit that category.
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I'll find something more constructive to do with my Sunday afternoons.
And for the first time in 60 seasons, I might consider that as well
I too, would pretty much not make Giants games a priority on Sundays anymore. I would look at them as a team with flawed leadership and wait for them to have a cataclysmic change from the top down.
Eli makes more than his usual share of mistakes in the pre-season..Nothing new..Not close to being a concern of mine
I agree.
We've seen this too many times when the games count too.
We get that Eric, but really, are you ready to put it all on Nassib?
Uh oh...
They did win in '05. 05 season 06 game.
Maybe Im confused....you said great O and above avg D. Did you mean to flip that?
Eric...hes not in rhythm....its preseason! As the foot doc said, Eli not be8ng sharp right not is the least if my worries.
Eric the sense of urgency isnt there in the preseason. If ur really that smoked about eli's mistakes the last few weeks, you might want to take a break from the preseason. Not telling you what to do, but my memories of the Giants in recent preseasons have not been good.
As far as Eli is concerned, he's never going to stop making some inexplicable throws. He could win ten SuperBowls and they'd still happen. His genius is that he never lets a previous mistake affect his next throw.
As I said on another thread, my guess is he gets extended, unless the team really is bad this year. In that case, he may get franchised.
Understood, but I am firmly in the camp that holds on to a productive Eli until without a doubt there is a clear better option or we have no choice but to move on.
If your saying Ryan is the real deal our transition franchise QB for the next decade (Young, Rodgers, Luck, Cunningham, Boomer etc.) then so be it. I am not sure.
It's improvement. The offense will be fine barring injury and getting Cruz back should be an upgrade over Parker.
This. Simple. You better have Rodgers or Luck if you want to move on. We don't.
That said, while i can empathize with those worried about not having Eli, I equally do not get the absolute lack of belief that we could have a good team with Nassib.
You don't need a top 5 pick to have a starting QB who can be a good pro in this league. Nassib is showing something.
This may honestly become a rebuild + financial conversation. Maybe it should. We don't know, it is too early to be having the conversation.
As to the D, I guess I wasn't clear..Let me repost..It's an Offensive league..On paper we can be on a par with most if not all offenses..Many of these great Os(perhaps all?) have average D's as well..So, it is my contention that with a great(on paper) O and an average D, we can seriously compete..
With the possible exception of Seattle and maybe a few others, average Ds are enough to compete if you have a great O imo
That said, while i can empathize with those worried about not having Eli, I equally do not get the absolute lack of belief that we could have a good team with Nassib.
You don't need a top 5 pick to have a starting QB who can be a good pro in this league. Nassib is showing something.
This may honestly become a rebuild + financial conversation. Maybe it should. We don't know, it is too early to be having the conversation.
Nassib is showing "nothing" in terms of a predictor for future performances..It's pre-season..He has the # 2 job sewn up and there's no pressure to have to get it done..What he is showing is perhaps why they drafted him 4th..They expected this
More modern time, after Simms to Eli, deep valleys. Deep dark valleys at the QB position.
That is what i read more of... and it makes sense. He has had 1 good season (which was similar to many QBs in the NFL)--- and several poor ones prior.
The team is being prudent in their decision making on this contract as it likely dictates their flexibility and direction for the next 4-5 years.
Lets see the season evolve a bit with regards to the Eli decision... and the amount of homersim is as absurd as the negativity. 2007 means something for my memory and when i look back... it means nothing for 2016-2018... and neither does 2011 either.
Regarding all this rebuilding talk: Isn't that what we've been doing for the past two years? It's not like the cupboard's bare here.
That is one thing that would make me stop rooting for this team
that is in the past, you need to remove emotion and history from the equation and evaluate whether or not it makes sense to pay Eli 20+M per season to lead this team through a rebuild at 35 - 38 years old or cut ties with him, use that money elsewhere and get the QB some other way.
I lived through all the same history as many people here who became fans around the '86 season so I experience some awful QB play and the jettisoning of Phil Simms, but I don't think that means b/c of the way Simms was let go, make a potential mistake with Eli.
If there is a way to get the team competitive around him and pay him then I think it's more compelling, but otherwise how is this season, or next season, or the one after different than the past 3 which are NOT what the organization should be looking to duplicate.
I also think if this season goes poorly Reese and Coughlin should be shown the door. I strongly don't believe winning two super bowls 5 and 9 years ago give you a lifetime appointment as coach or GM.
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to be having this conversation since we have not played a game yet.
That said, while i can empathize with those worried about not having Eli, I equally do not get the absolute lack of belief that we could have a good team with Nassib.
You don't need a top 5 pick to have a starting QB who can be a good pro in this league. Nassib is showing something.
This may honestly become a rebuild + financial conversation. Maybe it should. We don't know, it is too early to be having the conversation.
Nassib is showing "nothing" in terms of a predictor for future performances..It's pre-season..He has the # 2 job sewn up and there's no pressure to have to get it done..What he is showing is perhaps why they drafted him 4th..They expected this
well he has shown what he needs to for the #2 spot. until he is given an opportunity, you don't know what he can do. so they can only go off of what they see in him.
The conversation of spending $20M per on Eli if the team is in shambles is a real one, I don't get the disregard for it as a conversation topic if the Giants don't do well this year. I equally think it is negligent for the Giants to go and spend a top five pick on a QB if they are slotted that high when we have Nassib and the picks spent there.
That is a slam dunk to me
Let's say you jettison Eli, the reasoning is you need cap money for the rebuild. Well what happens if you get lucky again and draft a franchise QB. When his time comes he needs to be paid as well. Who says that by that time the team has won any championships or is any better than it is now?
I believe strongly that if this front office can not put enough talent around Eli to compete, cap or no cap, find some guys who can. Much easier to find that guy than another franchise QB.
Nassib has the best job in the world, backup to a franchise QB. He faces almost no expectations and he plays against backups in the preseason or in practice. I agree he looked good last night, it means basically nothing. The odds of Nassib being a fraction as good as Eli Manning, as being able to lead a NYC football franchise and all that entails on and off the field, is in my opinion infinitesimal.
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I'll find something more constructive to do with my Sunday afternoons.
And for the first time in 60 seasons, I might consider that as well
Where this organization is vs where Eli is in his career is a conversation worth having, but this fan base is so incredibly delusional when it comes to its back-up QBs. From David Carr being a top 20 QB to letting Rhett Bomar go being the biggest mistake Jerry Reese will ever make, it just never stops with some of you.
The Mara's are going to pay Eli with a contract similar to Big Ben and Rivers, because they are comparable QBs. You can give Ben the edge in the stats, but the Super Bowls are the same. It's the going rate for a good starting QB, and the Giants know if they don't pay it, somebody else will.
WE HAVE ONE POTENTIAL SOLID STARTER AT S IN COLLINS!
WE HAVE 2 CB's THAT CAN START FOR A LONG TIME IF WE GET THE PRINCE DEAL DONE! ZERO, ZILCH, NADA BEHIND THEM WE ALL KNOW 3 OR EVEN 4 CBS IS CRUCIAL TO EVERY TEAM! WE HAVE ONE DT THAT CAN PLAY AT A HIGH LEVEL IN HANKINS! AYERS IS A SOLID STARTER AT DE! MOORE NEEDS WORK BUT HE HAS FLASHED, RUNNING OUT OF EXCUSES FOR HIM ITS YEAR 3! WE NEED 11 GUYS WHO CAN PLAY AT THIS LEVEL ON D AND AS OF NOW WE HAVE 4 OR 5! AND IF PRINCE OR DRC GETS HURT WHICH WILL MORE THAN LIKELY HAPPEN GIVEN THEIR TRACK RECORD WE ARE FUCKED ONCE AGAIN THIS YEAR!! WE NEED A DT, 2 LBS, A PASS RUSHER OR 2, A SAFETY AND A CORNER OR TWO... WE HAVE A LOOONG WAY TO GO THIS TEAM WILL BE PICKING IN THE TOP 10 AGAIN IN 2016
My sentiments exactly.
It would not be appointment television the way it has been for me, and part of that is a declining interest in the league in general. Eli's departure would be a final nail.
Still two weeks until the start of the season. Does not surprise me at all. I would expect the Giants to wait until all preseason games are over before anything gets serious. There is very little negotiating room for the franchise here. It's either they want Eli or they don't, and they would be crazy to break up the Manning-OBJ pairing (and they know it).
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In comment 12443202 bceagle05 said:
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I'll find something more constructive to do with my Sunday afternoons.
And for the first time in 60 seasons, I might consider that as well
Well, if the team is really bad, I'm certainly not going to plan my days around watching them. But I stuck with the Mets, I have stuck with the Knicks (mostly), and I stuck with the Giants from 1970 on. I grew up with them when things were really awful, I won't give up on them when Eli leaves.
I hear ya buddy..Since 1956 for me...But the NFL has become nearly unwatchable with all the O rules in place...It wouldn't take much to pull back..Eli gone would hasten that pull back as much as I live and breathe blue..
the team doesn't.
the fan base could probably use a purging anyway.
A team that is a Qb away from being in the playoffs, championships over the next 3-4 years?
What do you get? A as in 1, starter and/or a couple of picks? What spot 15?20?/47?50? with our GM, who many want out?
We are better off paying a premium for 1 or 2 FAs, especially OL, or D, and a few others, and pull the FT on JPP and work with Eli on an extension.
Well a couple of reasons. You wait for Rothlesberger to set the market as he would probably be the highest paid of the three. You wait for Rivers to set the floor, since he is the one without rings. Eli slides in the middle. So realistically, negotiations could not start until Rivers was done and both sides knew it. I don't think there is much more to this story at all. The Giants are not going to part ways with a Super Bowl winning QB who has plenty of years left and is paired with one of the best young WRs in the NFL. They want to keep that tandem together.
Can't wait till this freaking extension gets done.
Can't wait till this freaking extension gets done.
Same here!!!
the team doesn't.
the fan base could probably use a purging anyway.
Who made you judge and jury of who or what makes a good fan? You mentioned elsewhere that you endured all the ups and downs of others who have followed the team since 1986. You've had the golden years. You didn't experience the 70s. You didn't suffer through Jerry Golsteyn, Randy Dean, Craig Morton and Joe Piscarcik. The only pro-bowler we had was our punter Dave Jennings. You have no right to judge anyone.
We've seen this too many times when the games count too.
Oh my god you're kidding...
Are we really bashing Eli because of last night? This place has gone nuts.
Not that it even matters because it's still just the preseason and it doesn't matter!!
This place is nuts
That's kind of unfair. All of those QBs have better teams than Eli has, especially on the offensive line.
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on a message board/online community stop watching the Giants?
the team doesn't.
the fan base could probably use a purging anyway.
Who made you judge and jury of who or what makes a good fan? You mentioned elsewhere that you endured all the ups and downs of others who have followed the team since 1986. You've had the golden years. You didn't experience the 70s. You didn't suffer through Jerry Golsteyn, Randy Dean, Craig Morton and Joe Piscarcik. The only pro-bowler we had was our punter Dave Jennings. You have no right to judge anyone.
I wasn't judging anyone. Sorry if my post came across that way. I was just saying who cares if people stop watching the team or just are less invested in it. Being completely honest I have already become less invested in the Giants myself. Every loss I used to get pissed off an angry and the worse loss the worse I took it, Cowboys Redskins and Eagles losses I was downright angry.
Now, I still hate the losses, but with 3 kids and activities on weekends, I don't even see every game real time. I definitely don't live and die with the team like I used to, and I definitely don't get emotional after losses.
fans can do what they want and what other people think shouldn't matter.
I do believe fan bases purge themselves, and old fans lose interest (I talk to old Giants fans who just don't keep up with the team as much anymore, they don't know all the players, or the opponents etc.) and they're replaced by newer fans.
I didn't mean to make it seem like I was judging anyone for being a good fan, my point was simply who cares.
"What was all the amazing talent we had on ANY of our Super Bowl teams? Outside of the D on the first two squads, maybe Bavaro could be considered all pro? Was Simms considered top 5 in the league in 86? Hoss?"
You lose credibility and undermine practically your entire opening post.
Christ, it has literally been years since you've had a positive post about this team and seem to relish in them doing poorly.
Judging credibility isn't your strong suit.
"What was all the amazing talent we had on ANY of our Super Bowl teams? Outside of the D on the first two squads, maybe Bavaro could be considered all pro? Was Simms considered top 5 in the league in 86? Hoss?"
You lose credibility and undermine practically your entire opening post.
Uhhhhh....ok. Go.
When you fire a blanket statement like you did at me, you lose all credibility.
Where was this derth of talent you're hinting at. Im actually looking forward to reading what you consider as uber talented players we had.
Not sure if I understand the post, but Im sure any one or more of the Texans, Bills, Jets, Chiefs and hell even the Skins or the Bears would be interested in Eli.
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In comment 12443446 pjcas18 said:
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on a message board/online community stop watching the Giants?
the team doesn't.
the fan base could probably use a purging anyway.
Who made you judge and jury of who or what makes a good fan? You mentioned elsewhere that you endured all the ups and downs of others who have followed the team since 1986. You've had the golden years. You didn't experience the 70s. You didn't suffer through Jerry Golsteyn, Randy Dean, Craig Morton and Joe Piscarcik. The only pro-bowler we had was our punter Dave Jennings. You have no right to judge anyone.
I wasn't judging anyone. Sorry if my post came across that way. I was just saying who cares if people stop watching the team or just are less invested in it. Being completely honest I have already become less invested in the Giants myself. Every loss I used to get pissed off an angry and the worse loss the worse I took it, Cowboys Redskins and Eagles losses I was downright angry.
Now, I still hate the losses, but with 3 kids and activities on weekends, I don't even see every game real time. I definitely don't live and die with the team like I used to, and I definitely don't get emotional after losses.
fans can do what they want and what other people think shouldn't matter.
I do believe fan bases purge themselves, and old fans lose interest (I talk to old Giants fans who just don't keep up with the team as much anymore, they don't know all the players, or the opponents etc.) and they're replaced by newer fans.
I didn't mean to make it seem like I was judging anyone for being a good fan, my point was simply who cares.
Pjacs, thanks for the apology. Sorry, I probably over reacted.
I am much more concerned with the schizophremic approach of the team to rebuild. One minute it's looking for youth to infuse to an aging team and the next its shopping for over-the-hill or injury prone vets who might be the last piece to get to the playoffs. Part of the problem is that the head coach knows he is working on a one year rebuild to keep his job. That no-win situation leads to thinking that can affect your personnel decisions in a way that hurts the team's efforts to develop youth.
We'll see this week how it goes but in my mind it would be a disaster to cut young players with potential in the hope that aging vets can provide one last hurrah. So how many Meriweathers, Miles, Browns, Jones, etc. make the final roster? What happens to Darkwa and Unga and Whitlock? Those are issues to discuss and worry about instead of which team will pay Eli next year.
[quote] And Eli was clutch at the end of the other Dallas game.
You could make the argument that Eli's overthrow to Parker that was intercepted lost us the 2nd Dallas game. It was an easy touch pass to a wide open Parker for a TD and Eli blew it. 14 point swing.
If he takes one dollar more, the naysayers would complain....fact is, it's based more on the market and the position....Rivers, Newton, and Ryan have ridiculous contracts, for qb's that have won nothing....but it's the going rate for qb's in the NFL....
If Eli gets 22.000001M per, he becomes the highest paid.....until the next Eli(te) NFL qb contract comes up for a new contract....
Eli will be 35 in 4 mos. He wants to be one of the highest paid Qb's if not the highest paid. This does not allow us to add the many needed positions this team needs to compete. We are injury prone. Free Agency is expensive. We only have a limited # of picks which have not always been used wisely. We are not winning anything with these injuries. Eli has not quite been his self since Burress left. Last year was the exception but he also had Superman as his WR which made things easier for him. But we still missed the playoffs!
If Eli is getting out played by his understudy who is a heck of a lot cheaper and he has equity you can't just ignore that at all cost. Why sit Nassib for another five years when he's playing better than Eli now. A cheaper, younger Nassib allows you to get some more FA's in here and extra picks or great player via trade or both.
Make no mistake this is on TC for not doing what was better for the team and not seeing Nassib go with the ones in this last game. He didn't want a QB controversy, but what you did was put Eli's feelings ahead of what's best for the team in the long run. And in the long run that could cost you from being competitive or relevant for a long time.
Eli will be 35 in 4 mos. He wants to be one of the highest paid Qb's if not the highest paid. This does not allow us to add the many needed positions this team needs to compete. We are injury prone. Free Agency is expensive. We only have a limited # of picks which have not always been used wisely. We are not winning anything with these injuries. Eli has not quite been his self since Burress left. Last year was the exception but he also had Superman as his WR which made things easier for him. But we still missed the playoffs!
If Eli is getting out played by his understudy who is a heck of a lot cheaper and he has equity you can't just ignore that at all cost. Why sit Nassib for another five years when he's playing better than Eli now. A cheaper, younger Nassib allows you to get some more FA's in here and extra picks or great player via trade or both.
Make no mistake this is on TC for not doing what was better for the team and not seeing Nassib go with the ones in this last game. He didn't want a QB controversy, but what you did was put Eli's feelings ahead of what's best for the team in the long run. And in the long run that could cost you from being competitive or relevant for a long time.
And then there's Brady, Peyton, Brees, all years older who have lots of money sunk into them..Eli could easily play another 5-6 years..No signs of physically slowing down..Mentally, we know how sharp he is..Franchise QBs need to be paid very well..He will be..I would certainly pump the same or more money into Eli than I would Ben who is a year or more younger and physically going downhill, imo..
He's going to get his $20-$22 mill/yr with around $60 guaranteed over 5 years, imv
You just don't see many elite QB's let go because personnel guys rightfully know the value tehy hold. I'd rather pay Eli his worth than do what some teams do. You want to be the Bears and pay Cutler? You want to have to pay Cam Newton? Teams will overpay for QB's whether they are good or bad. At least we will pay ours what he's worth.
6+M on the cap is a HUGE difference.
Of course Brady is in unique situation with a multi-millionaire wife, but Eli is kind of in a unique situation too in that he has career earnings over 150M plus endorsements and a 120M net worth.
I hate seeming like I'm advising someone else what do to with their money, but it would go a long way to the rebuild process if Eli signed a deal like Brady's versus Rivers or Ben.
6M per year extra on the cap for those 4 or 5 years of his deal will give the team flexibility to add free agents where they might be needed.
Though that is highly unlikely if not altogether not going to happen.
Eli will be 35 in 4 mos. He wants to be one of the highest paid Qb's if not the highest paid. This does not allow us to add the many needed positions this team needs to compete. We are injury prone. Free Agency is expensive. We only have a limited # of picks which have not always been used wisely. We are not winning anything with these injuries. Eli has not quite been his self since Burress left. Last year was the exception but he also had Superman as his WR which made things easier for him. But we still missed the playoffs!
If Eli is getting out played by his understudy who is a heck of a lot cheaper and he has equity you can't just ignore that at all cost. Why sit Nassib for another five years when he's playing better than Eli now. A cheaper, younger Nassib allows you to get some more FA's in here and extra picks or great player via trade or both.
Make no mistake this is on TC for not doing what was better for the team and not seeing Nassib go with the ones in this last game. He didn't want a QB controversy, but what you did was put Eli's feelings ahead of what's best for the team in the long run. And in the long run that could cost you from being competitive or relevant for a long time.
i normally try to avoid individual poster attacks, but you're one of the worst, most cracked out posters on the site. You belong on a YouTube comments section.
Eli hasn't been the same since Burress left? TC was avoiding a QB controversy??
I'll worry when there is something to worry about.
My posse's getting big and my posse's getting bigger.
Sorry, I have no understanding of what you just said..:)
Ok whats your plan if they let him go and play nassib. Who you signing as a free agent. Remember these players have to want to play for a team that is essentially a bottom 7 team in the league.
I actually think the team and Manning are in two different spots at this point, I've said that repeatedly.
Your post and pretty much every post you make is full of made up bull shit though. You're a terrible poster that helps make this place impossible to have sort of sane conversation about Manning because your consistent garbage about him understandably gets people in defense mode. That you have #10 as your sn is an embarrassment.
I actually think the team and Manning are in two different spots at this point, I've said that repeatedly.
Your post and pretty much every post you make is full of made up bull shit though. You're a terrible poster that helps make this place impossible to have sort of sane conversation about Manning because your consistent garbage about him understandably gets people in defense mode. That you have #10 as your sn is an embarrassment.
He was a Brad Van Pelt fan
By the way, what are Eli's QBR rating and 3rd down percentages for the last 3 years?
Before you challenge me on my thoughts and opinions I want you to at least have some idea of what we're talking about. You know what a message board is??? Different people with thoughts and opinions. Or did you mean to go to Giantsheep.com? I'm sorry. Eli's the best Qb in the league and Giants are going to the SB! Better? If you want to debate you have to actually debate the point. Your the worst doesn't count. I may even swing your way but you have to say something more than Eli rocks because your a giants fan.
How was a guy on a team with the 27th defense, 31st run game, an OL that gave up the most pressures in the NFL, and an all-time record for fourth quarter comebacks classified as a game manager that carried/covered up for by the rest of his team?
Why would anyone with half a brain think the threat of a QB controversy would EVER enter Tom Coughlin's mind, in any capacity, in a pre-season fucking game?
BTW, for a bonus, do you know what Eli's splits were for the games with his Superman WR and those without him last year? 7.01 YPA, 2.25 TD/G, 66.9%, 93.6 passer rating vs 7.44 YPA, 1.75 TD/G, 61.9%, 91.7 passer rating.
And I just said (and have repeatedly said, to the point where I've been called an Eli hater in large part because idiots like you incite the homers with your garbage and they're constantly on high alert/sensitivity) that I think the team and Manning are at two different places and neither of them are likely going to benefit from extending their partnership. I just can separate that belief of mine from A) the reality that they're obviously going to extend him whether any of us "like" it or not B) the team being a mess and his age not fitting into a rebuild of the scale it needs doesn't mean he sucks or always sucked C) the pre-season doesn't suddenly matter when it's never ever been an indicator of what Eli is going to do or not do in real games
You used to pimp Tebow as a Giant regularly. The sheer stupidity of it is the only reason I recognize your sn. It's WOAT-level. Even Giants.com would probably throw you in the bushes.
2nd your saying you actually agree that it's in the Giants best interest to think this one through before extending but you want to debate the burress point??
Burress was on the roster in 2008. 2011 we barely made the playoffs and Eli had a QBR of 59 under Stafford and Michael Vick. 2009 Phillip Rivers was ranked 2nd that year. Eli was ranked 10 under Vince Young. And 2014 like I said imo was due to OBJ. No OBJ and his numbers would have been worse. But even with OBJ he didn't make the 10. I even went back as far as 2006 to try to see how Eli ranked against Phillip and Ben. I found something interesting. There hasn't been a one year that Eli ranked above both Phillip and Ben statistically at the same time despite being the #1 pick in the draft. We all know the Kings ransom the Giants gave up. But if you look at all time career passer ratings.
Phillip Rivers ranks 6th w/ 95.7
Ben Roethlisberger 8th w/ 93.9
Eli Manning ranks 41 w/ 82.4
So hindsight being 20/20 and all, the Giants traded the #6th all time QB for the 41st all time QB and gave up 3 additional picks to do it. Now the Giants will tell you 2 SB's to Phillip's 0, they feel pretty good about that. As they should. But you never really know what Phillip would have did on a solid team with a solid FO and those 3 extra picks to boot. So excuse me if I have a problem with his agent asking for his client to be paid like he's asking to be paid all the while never cracking the top 5 statistically and a two years removed from ranking just above Terrel Pryor at the bottom of the league.
Best case, Eli defies the odds and has the best year of his career with a bad defense and a bad O-line. Just don't blame those who are looking at plan B ahead of time.
That you seriously think 2011 was not anything special off of QBR (which is not the same as passer rating, just so you maybe can rub your one brain cell against your skull to not confuse the two like you seem to be doing) and can't seem to remember how Rivers played on some monsterously teams in SD is enough that I'm not going to bother with this anymore though. It's just not going to go anywhere and even doing a quick archive search would be a waste of time.
And you probably remember me saying Tebows college girlfriend was hot. And I want her to play for my team. Tebow not a chance.
We have a lot of fucking stupid posters here. We are using QB rating to judge a QB now.
Holy
fucking
shit
That you seriously think 2011 was not anything special off of QBR (which is not the same as passer rating, just so you maybe can rub your one brain cell against your skull to not confuse the two like you seem to be doing) and can't seem to remember how Rivers played on some monsterously teams in SD is enough that I'm not going to bother with this anymore though. It's just not going to go anywhere and even doing a quick archive search would be a waste of time.
Call me a homer or Kool-Aid drinker, but Eli's 2011 was the best clutch season I have ever seen in 60 years of bleeding blue and not just Giants related either
Quote:
2008, Manning actually was a "game manager" as people incorrectly use the term. Even 2010 was a better year than just the INT total would have some believe and better than the Plax years, largely.
That you seriously think 2011 was not anything special off of QBR (which is not the same as passer rating, just so you maybe can rub your one brain cell against your skull to not confuse the two like you seem to be doing) and can't seem to remember how Rivers played on some monsterously teams in SD is enough that I'm not going to bother with this anymore though. It's just not going to go anywhere and even doing a quick archive search would be a waste of time.
Call me a homer or Kool-Aid drinker, but Eli's 2011 was the best clutch season I have ever seen in 60 years of bleeding blue and not just Giants related either
But what was his QB rating. Thats what we judge players on.
Quote:
In comment 12446021 Devon said:
Quote:
2008, Manning actually was a "game manager" as people incorrectly use the term. Even 2010 was a better year than just the INT total would have some believe and better than the Plax years, largely.
That you seriously think 2011 was not anything special off of QBR (which is not the same as passer rating, just so you maybe can rub your one brain cell against your skull to not confuse the two like you seem to be doing) and can't seem to remember how Rivers played on some monsterously teams in SD is enough that I'm not going to bother with this anymore though. It's just not going to go anywhere and even doing a quick archive search would be a waste of time.
Call me a homer or Kool-Aid drinker, but Eli's 2011 was the best clutch season I have ever seen in 60 years of bleeding blue and not just Giants related either
But what was his QB rating. Thats what we judge players on.
Stat-wise, Rodgers probably buried him..But That has never been my focus anyway..But in this age of FF? :)
Punt
Punt
Punt
Punt
TD
Punt
Punt
FG
Punt
Punt
Yeah, that's part of what those stats calculate.
Punt
Punt
Punt
Punt
TD
Punt
Punt
FG
Punt
Punt
Yeah, that's part of what those stats calculate.
Giants were 13th in the NFL in scoring last year at over 23 points per game. Your drive has 10 points there. So, like everything else you have said, its all bullshit.
I don't even know what language that is supposed to be.
Not sure whst happened to him..He was a more than a decent poster for awhile there..Not used to these "swings" from him..Perhaps he's been hacked?