Don't you think it's fair to go back and see how we did in prior Drafts to see how we replenished aging/retired vets?
We drafted as follows from 2008 through 2011 in Rounds 4 through 7 :
2008
Bryan Kehl 4th
Jonathan Goff 5th
Andre Wodson 6th
Robert Henderson 6th
Marcus Monk 7th
2009
Andre Brown 4th
Rhett Bomar 5th
DeAndre Brown 6th
2010
Phillip Dillard 4th
Mitch Petrus 5th
Stanley Woodson 7th
2011
James Brewer 4th
Adrian Tracy 6th
Matt Dodge 7th
EVERYONE of those draftees is out of the NFL. 99% of them never appeared in a regular season game.
You may want to check your math - of the 14 you named, 50% have indeed appeared in regular season games (most appeared in several). One - Bryan Kehl - appeared in over SEVENTY games...
Not saying any of those 14 had a real impact (well, one did for all the wrong reasons), but it's just so lazy to use such ridiculous hyperbole...
problem isn't that Reese made a bad pick with Brewer. He was a fourth round pick. Most of those players don't work out. The problem is that Reese has a poor day three draft record, aside from 2007, although it has been improving lately.
2008: Bryan Kehl (who we trade up for IIRC), Jonathan Goff, Andre Woodson, and Robert Henderson.
2009: The whole draft was a waste, aside from Nicks and Beatty. The day three picks were Andre Brown, Rhett Bomar, DeAndre Wright, and Stoney Woodson. This was also the year that Clint Sintim, Ramses Barden, and Travis Beckum were selected. Remember also that Reese wanted to draft Darrius Heyward-Bey.
2010: Phillip Dillard, Mitch Petrus, Adrian Tracy, and Matt Dodge.
2011: James Brewer, Greg Jones, Tyler Sash, Jacquian Williams, and Da'Rel Scott. This was also the year that Marvin Austin and Jerrel Jernigan were selected. Austin was selected one spot ahead of Stephen Paea. Prince was the only decent player from that draft.
2012: Adrian Robinson, Brandon Mosley, Matt McCants, and Markus Kuhn. This was also the year that David Wilson and Jayron Hosley were selected. Wilson was selected even though Cordy Glenn was apparently the highest rated player on the Giants' board. Randle was the only decent player from that draft, and he was benched twice last year. He and Eli have also had some communication problems.
2013: Ryan Nassib, Cooper Taylor, Eric Herman, and Michael Cox. Much better. Nassib was a good pick. Taylor just needs to stay healthy. Herman had a good career at Ohio U. Cox was a reasonable flier.
2014: Andre Williams, Nat Berhe, Devon Kennard, and Bennett Jackson. Much better again.
2015: Too soon to tell.
Bradshaw fell because of character concerns. Many teams had a third or fourth gourd grade on him based on his talent.
The drafts between 2008 - 2012 produced very few serviceable players, especially from day three. Brewer is one example, but there are many others as well. Reese has compounded this problem by refusing to or at least being reluctant to cut these picks, including Brewer and Robinson.
Kehl, Goff and even Henderson from the 2008 hung around the league for a couple of years. Goff was our starting middle linebacker and wasn't a bad player at all. Every single player from that 2008 class with the exception of Woodson and Henderson (who ended up on IR with an ankle injury in his first season), suffered a knee injury, TT and Goff both had multiple ACL injuries which were career ending.
Every single player from that 2008 class with the exception of Woodson and Henderson (who ended up on IR with an ankle injury in his first season), suffered a knee injury, TT and Goff both had multiple ACL injuries which were career ending.
Fucking Reese should have known that they would.
The criticism of the Brewer pick in isolation is ridiculous
Though there is a 20 year pattern with this team in taking guys in the 3-5 round range who "project" to eventually play left tackle. In two decades, there has been:
I always think of Toby Myles as the archetype. We always had the Toby Myles slot reserved on the team for the mid-round developmental LT. I've yet to see it work out for us.
they go for the guy who they describe in their post-draft remarks as being athletic (or physically gifted) with untapped potential. Like they believe that by the time they get out of the 2nd or third round there are no known quality OL so the best strategy is lottery tickets who have great ceilings. Might just be my imagination though.
Crazy thing is how good we've drafted in the first round
Nicks was a true #1 WR. He was felled by injuries. JPP has been very good. Not a consistent superstar, but 42 sacks and good run D aint nothin. Prince has been a good corner when healthy. Wilson before injury was looking like exactly what you hoped he could be; I didnt like the idea of a change of pace back/returner at #32, but he was reaching his potential I believe. Pugh -- solid OL, should do better inside. The last two picks, ODB and Flowers, look like potential long term building blocks.
everybody is well scouted and the field of available picks of a certain quality is narrower. Plus, you're less of a risk-taker. And often, you're filling a gap so the guy is almost a starter by default.
RE: But in the first round there's usually less range
everybody is well scouted and the field of available picks of a certain quality is narrower. Plus, you're less of a risk-taker. And often, you're filling a gap so the guy is almost a starter by default.
According to this study [url} http://walterfootball.com/nfldraftology408_1.php {/url} Waterfootball puts the percentage of 1st round busts at 33%. He has some stringent guiedelines but maybe 1st round picks aren't as sure as we think or rather hope.
RE: But in the first round there's usually less range
everybody is well scouted and the field of available picks of a certain quality is narrower. Plus, you're less of a risk-taker. And often, you're filling a gap so the guy is almost a starter by default.
According to this study Walterfootball.com puts the percentage of 1st round busts at 33%. He has some stringent guide lines but maybe 1st round picks aren't as sure as we think or rather hope. Link - ( New Window )
The other cuts:
Michael Bamiro
Juron Criner
Justin Halley
Eric Herman
Derrick Johnson
Jordan Stanton
Jimmy Staten
Will Tye
Beatty goes to PUP
Josh Gordy and Bennett Jackson go to IR
Brandon Mosley and Akeem Hunt were waived/injured
Don't you think it's fair to go back and see how we did in prior Drafts to see how we replenished aging/retired vets?
We drafted as follows from 2008 through 2011 in Rounds 4 through 7 :
2008
Bryan Kehl 4th
Jonathan Goff 5th
Andre Wodson 6th
Robert Henderson 6th
Marcus Monk 7th
2009
Andre Brown 4th
Rhett Bomar 5th
DeAndre Brown 6th
2010
Phillip Dillard 4th
Mitch Petrus 5th
Stanley Woodson 7th
2011
James Brewer 4th
Adrian Tracy 6th
Matt Dodge 7th
EVERYONE of those draftees is out of the NFL. 99% of them never appeared in a regular season game.
You may want to check your math - of the 14 you named, 50% have indeed appeared in regular season games (most appeared in several). One - Bryan Kehl - appeared in over SEVENTY games...
Not saying any of those 14 had a real impact (well, one did for all the wrong reasons), but it's just so lazy to use such ridiculous hyperbole...
2008: Bryan Kehl (who we trade up for IIRC), Jonathan Goff, Andre Woodson, and Robert Henderson.
2009: The whole draft was a waste, aside from Nicks and Beatty. The day three picks were Andre Brown, Rhett Bomar, DeAndre Wright, and Stoney Woodson. This was also the year that Clint Sintim, Ramses Barden, and Travis Beckum were selected. Remember also that Reese wanted to draft Darrius Heyward-Bey.
2010: Phillip Dillard, Mitch Petrus, Adrian Tracy, and Matt Dodge.
2011: James Brewer, Greg Jones, Tyler Sash, Jacquian Williams, and Da'Rel Scott. This was also the year that Marvin Austin and Jerrel Jernigan were selected. Austin was selected one spot ahead of Stephen Paea. Prince was the only decent player from that draft.
2012: Adrian Robinson, Brandon Mosley, Matt McCants, and Markus Kuhn. This was also the year that David Wilson and Jayron Hosley were selected. Wilson was selected even though Cordy Glenn was apparently the highest rated player on the Giants' board. Randle was the only decent player from that draft, and he was benched twice last year. He and Eli have also had some communication problems.
2013: Ryan Nassib, Cooper Taylor, Eric Herman, and Michael Cox. Much better. Nassib was a good pick. Taylor just needs to stay healthy. Herman had a good career at Ohio U. Cox was a reasonable flier.
2014: Andre Williams, Nat Berhe, Devon Kennard, and Bennett Jackson. Much better again.
2015: Too soon to tell.
Bradshaw fell because of character concerns. Many teams had a third or fourth gourd grade on him based on his talent.
The drafts between 2008 - 2012 produced very few serviceable players, especially from day three. Brewer is one example, but there are many others as well. Reese has compounded this problem by refusing to or at least being reluctant to cut these picks, including Brewer and Robinson.
Kehl, Goff and even Henderson from the 2008 hung around the league for a couple of years. Goff was our starting middle linebacker and wasn't a bad player at all. Every single player from that 2008 class with the exception of Woodson and Henderson (who ended up on IR with an ankle injury in his first season), suffered a knee injury, TT and Goff both had multiple ACL injuries which were career ending.
Oben - 96/3
Myles - 98/5
Hatch - 02/3
Koets - 07/6
Brewer - 11/4
I always think of Toby Myles as the archetype. We always had the Toby Myles slot reserved on the team for the mid-round developmental LT. I've yet to see it work out for us.
According to this study [url} http://walterfootball.com/nfldraftology408_1.php {/url} Waterfootball puts the percentage of 1st round busts at 33%. He has some stringent guiedelines but maybe 1st round picks aren't as sure as we think or rather hope.
According to this study Walterfootball.com puts the percentage of 1st round busts at 33%. He has some stringent guide lines but maybe 1st round picks aren't as sure as we think or rather hope.
Link - ( New Window )