would be saying oh it is only preseason it doesnt matter how good they have looked, preseason doesnt count...
True, pre-season doesn't count in assessing MOVING FORWARD..It's for evaluation of 90 players to get to the best 46..It's for getting(if possible) into hitting shape..
would be saying oh it is only preseason it doesnt matter how good they have looked, preseason doesnt count...
True, pre-season doesn't count in assessing MOVING FORWARD..It's for evaluation of 90 players to get to the best 46..It's for getting(if possible) into hitting shape..
that a large portion of people here like to shit on the team. They like to bash players, management and coaches. They like to pick individual plays out to make sweeping comments about. they minimize successes and focus on the negatives.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
that a large portion of people here like to shit on the team. They like to bash players, management and coaches. They like to pick individual plays out to make sweeping comments about. they minimize successes and focus on the negatives.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
You already mentioned it. Those people are a.) spoiled or b.) wanna be assclowns because they can.
He's not all that optimistic to date, but always leaves the room for improvement..I may disagree with some of his outlook, but he ALWAYS gives reasons why he feels that way..He doesn't rant..That's how a board is supposed to look TO ME..
that a large portion of people here like to shit on the team. They like to bash players, management and coaches. They like to pick individual plays out to make sweeping comments about. they minimize successes and focus on the negatives.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
+1.
I've always been an optimistic fan, but understand why many are pessimistic. But some actually seem to wish the Giants fail so they can crow about it
projected 1st teamers displayed continuity, gaining yardage on offense, getting 1st downs and defense looked active and fast, then yes, I would feel better entering the season regardless if we were 3-0, or 0-3 in the preseason ...
doesn't apply. More excited for the season to start? Sure. The 2015 games so far don't count. We all know they're meaningless once the regular season starts. But there is a lack of reality about how terrible the Giants have been in their last 40 regular season games. They've won 16 of the 40 but most of the wins were against the very bottom of the NFL and/or 3rd string QB's. That's a big NFL sample size. I can only speak for myself but what I'm seeing so far in 2015 from the starters is a regression to even more terrible. So instead of being able to beat the very bottom teams or 3rd string QB's the Giants appear to have sunk to the very bottom. Maybe it's just pre season and once the games count the Giants will play very differently but the last 40 games say it's unlikely. The Giants are trending toward a catastrophic season.
but the fact of the matter is that football is football.
It's "Basic Skills" month. Players need to show that against other teams, they can run, pass, block, catch, etc. Sans one drive against the Jets that would have ended in a short FG, had it not been for a penalty against the Jets, the Giants grade out at a "D minus", perhaps a "D". The #1's have not shown an ability to perform basic skills against other teams and it's very alarming at the least. There seems to be some sense of security on coming up with excuses. Excuses like the naysayers are "bad fans", that the "games don't count" and they are not "showing everything".....
Being a naysayer doesn't make me a bad fan, it makes me a realist. I love my Giants and always will. It's frustrating to watch the team get abused every week. Different people deal with the same situations differently, it doesn't make us bad fans.
Preseason is an illusion and far from reality since the final roster is yet to be determined and the actual starters have not necessarily played together and gelled. BBI posters would be freaking out no matter what the pre-season outcomes were.
The fact of the matter is, we don't yet know what will happen with the final roster. While there are a lot of holes, I still see some potential in that perhaps the Giants offense could be good enough to outscore the points allowed by the defense. And I personally feel a lot more confident in the coaching staff now (Quinn excluded) than I have in a while.
Hope springs eternal but I am not holding my breath for more than an 8-8 season.
doesn't apply. More excited for the season to start? Sure. The 2015 games so far don't count. We all know they're meaningless once the regular season starts. But there is a lack of reality about how terrible the Giants have been in their last 40 regular season games. They've won 16 of the 40 but most of the wins were against the very bottom of the NFL and/or 3rd string QB's. That's a big NFL sample size. I can only speak for myself but what I'm seeing so far in 2015 from the starters is a regression to even more terrible. So instead of being able to beat the very bottom teams or 3rd string QB's the Giants appear to have sunk to the very bottom. Maybe it's just pre season and once the games count the Giants will play very differently but the last 40 games say it's unlikely. The Giants are trending toward a catastrophic season.
And YOUR lack of reality is us setting all-time injury records the last two years, especially to, as FMiC says, cluster groups(positions)...Fortunately it's (hopefully) cyclical and we are due(again hopefully) a break..This is not the entire story, but certainly an important one..Think before you post your "certainties."
the optimists are using the red herring of the preseason Â
to try to diminish the view of those who have watched the last two seasons of terrible football and, accounting for offseason changes which include the loss of the teams best defender, predict more of the same.
RE: the optimists are using the red herring of the preseason Â
to try to diminish the view of those who have watched the last two seasons of terrible football and, accounting for offseason changes which include the loss of the teams best defender, predict more of the same.
Van you and buford elope and then jump off a cliff?
that a large portion of people here like to shit on the team. They like to bash players, management and coaches. They like to pick individual plays out to make sweeping comments about. they minimize successes and focus on the negatives.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
A billion dollar business is a strange cause to repeatedly get all white knight about.
I have a hard time being one after after being 7-9,and 6-10 the last two years and our starters looking like crap in the preseason. If folks here find that reason for optimism,good for you.
I'm not blind to the fact that we've struggled during the preseason Â
But to jump from that to "this season's over" is a big leap, considering how I've seen teams change from one week to the next.
And for the people who say the Giants "just don't have the talent," I'd argue that the same could be said in 07, when we ran James Butler & Gibril Wilson out as our starting safeties and rookie Aaron Ross along with old-timer Sam Madison out as our 1 & 2 CBs.
It's a message board and in our own way we want the Giants to win and be exciting to watch so I don't mean to be disrespectful. But what you've seen so far this year has broken the injury cycle? I mean seriously what are you watching? Starting LT out for at least half the season. Best DL out for at least half the season. Center hurt. RG still not 100%. MLB hurt again as usual. Cruz still injured. Safeties and back up DB's falling daily. The injury list might actually be worse than the past 2 years so far before they even play a regular season game.
It's a message board and in our own way we want the Giants to win and be exciting to watch so I don't mean to be disrespectful. But what you've seen so far this year has broken the injury cycle? I mean seriously what are you watching? Starting LT out for at least half the season. Best DL out for at least half the season. Center hurt. RG still not 100%. MLB hurt again as usual. Cruz still injured. Safeties and back up DB's falling daily. The injury list might actually be worse than the past 2 years so far before they even play a regular season game.
arnie, SO FAR, the injuries we've sustained are mostly to backups..Yes, not thrilling, but at least, for now our projected starters appear reasonably healthy. I can live with that as these types of injuries are common around the league..athe last two years were not common imv, not by a long shot..
If it stays like this (in the main) I would have very few excuses to offer should our season go south..We are obviously thin at S, but tor now, that most likely can be filled by our future signings..
I think that it's a given that their record has absolutely Â
nothing to do with how happy BBIer's are. Clearly about a lack of talent on defense, and a sluggish offense that may not hit it's stride until it's too late.
The key qualification in the question is "looked great." Hell yeah I'd be excited about players who consistently look great in preseason games, as I was with Cruz a few years back. Sometimes, you actually can tell when a player actually has a decent chance to be a player. Sometimes, preseason performance actually isn't utterly meaningless!
Here's an easy, glaring example I can think of: I watched a Raiders preseason game a few weeks ago in which a Trent Richardson play was entirely emblematic of Trent Richardson's career to date. I think the play actually got a lot of national exposure because of how bad it was. An absolutely gaping whole opened to the left, and Trent Richardson cut to the right and, I dunno, ran into the back of his guard or something. Even had that play occurred in week one of Richardson's career you'd think, "Whoa, that ain't a good sign." Your fears might have been assuaged by the "it's just preseason" argument but they'd ultimately be corroborated by future performance.
It's a message board and in our own way we want the Giants to win and be exciting to watch so I don't mean to be disrespectful. But what you've seen so far this year has broken the injury cycle? I mean seriously what are you watching? Starting LT out for at least half the season. Best DL out for at least half the season. Center hurt. RG still not 100%. MLB hurt again as usual. Cruz still injured. Safeties and back up DB's falling daily. The injury list might actually be worse than the past 2 years so far before they even play a regular season game.
arnie, SO FAR, the injuries we've sustained are mostly to backups..Yes, not thrilling, but at least, for now our projected starters appear reasonably healthy. I can live with that as these types of injuries are common around the league..athe last two years were not common imv, not by a long shot..
If it stays like this (in the main) I would have very few excuses to offer should our season go south..We are obviously thin at S, but tor now, that most likely can be filled by our future signings..
Cruz, RR, Richburg, Prince, Beason, Schwartz, JPP ... these guys are not backups
None of these injuries are serious or season-enders which was my point..What has killed us the last few years have been the season-enders or if not, solid players(like DRC) had to gut it out the whole year at less than their normal efficiency..The injuries you list are common with most teams..I'm not concerned about that, because they're par for the league-wide course imo
get it through your head that the case for pessimism is not in the final score.
Those of us that are negative have seen nothing to get excited over from the first team. The defense - the offense - both have stunk up the place. I'm not talking about didn't play up to their capabilities or were a little sluggish. They were horrible.
That's the reason we're all worried about having to suffer through another losing season.
It's a message board and in our own way we want the Giants to win and be exciting to watch so I don't mean to be disrespectful. But what you've seen so far this year has broken the injury cycle? I mean seriously what are you watching? Starting LT out for at least half the season. Best DL out for at least half the season. Center hurt. RG still not 100%. MLB hurt again as usual. Cruz still injured. Safeties and back up DB's falling daily. The injury list might actually be worse than the past 2 years so far before they even play a regular season game.
arnie, SO FAR, the injuries we've sustained are mostly to backups..Yes, not thrilling, but at least, for now our projected starters appear reasonably healthy. I can live with that as these types of injuries are common around the league..athe last two years were not common imv, not by a long shot..
If it stays like this (in the main) I would have very few excuses to offer should our season go south..We are obviously thin at S, but tor now, that most likely can be filled by our future signings..
Cruz, RR, Richburg, Prince, Beason, Schwartz, JPP ... these guys are not backups
Randle, Richburg, Prince, Schwartz have all returned to practice...
Cruz said he expects to practice Labor day...
Beason has been working on the side the past 2 practices...
get it through your head that the case for pessimism is not in the final score.
Those of us that are negative have seen nothing to get excited over from the first team. The defense - the offense - both have stunk up the place. I'm not talking about didn't play up to their capabilities or were a little sluggish. They were horrible.
That's the reason we're all worried about having to suffer through another losing season.
Please..The first teamers haven't played all that much and obviously need more practice and game experience once they are down to the final 53 or 46 for game day..They are constantly shuffling players in and out for evaluation..You can't get an objective read based on 14-15 or so snaps(on both sides of the ball)..Some teams look great with those 14-15 snaps, others don't..
They hardly game plan for this shit..Save your pessimism for when they play for real..When they get an entire gameful of snaps..Even then, it may take several weeks to get in sync..
I think there's a difference between acting worried that this season Â
may be bad, and acting resigned to the opinion that this season will be bad.
The majority of BBI tends to pick the latter and go hard with it every gd year.
Also, I agree with '56. Honestly, if you would have showed me our current injury list over the offseason and said "Here's where we'll be with one preseason game left" - I would have taken it.
We're decimated safety, sure. But we've always sucked at safety. Seriously, for the past 10 years - the Giants have been mediocre, at best, at safety. We look back with delight at the "good old days" of having Kenny Phillips back there. Kenny freakin Phillips, who only started 2 full seasons with the team and recorded 8 interceptions in four years.
Oh, and then the same folks rail on the signing of Stevie Brown, Â
Here is a simple response to a simple question: If we were 3-0 in pre-season... actually, forget the record... If our first team players had looked good so far through the pre-season, most people (myself included) would have more hope for the upcoming season.
I wouldn't be planning for the Super Bowl but I would feel good about the team taking the next step (another year in MacAdoo's offense, Spags being back on D). Yes, that would make me happy.
I take no joy in shitting on the team. I wouldn't be coming on BBI to proclaim "it's only pre-season" so who cares. So these general statements that some here like to make about BBI en masse ring pretty hollow to me.
RE: David
dorgan : 1:44 pm : link : reply
In comment 12444939 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I have them going back to 1996 still... http://www.bigblueinteractive.com/new-york-giants-game-previews-reviews/ - ( New Window )
WTF does he know?
No offense to anyone, but I pay no attention to pre-season beyond watching individuals that interest me. I can't imagine checking out prior year's pre-season games. The current ones don't mean much and the previous years' games mean less.
and the injury front was not what it is - our best lineman on both sides of the ball gone indefinitely - and we only had two safeties with season ending injuries, and Cruz were fully back, I'd feel much better about this year. It is the difference between 6 wins and 10 wins.
and the injury front was not what it is - our best lineman on both sides of the ball gone indefinitely - and we only had two safeties with season ending injuries, and Cruz were fully back, I'd feel much better about this year. It is the difference between 6 wins and 10 wins.
Some Fan, when has an Eli-led offense during the pre-season look like anything other than crap? Perhaps at times? Sure..In general, if you didn't know better, you'd never guess he's won two SBs..
Wait until the bullets fly for real..
I do agree that some preseasons offense looked bad Â
but I thought in the SB year and the year after we played pretty well on offense in pre-season. I could be off but they just seemed tougher in those years.
you self-righteous pricks! I am delighted to be lumped with you..
I'm honored to be counted among the likes of you pricks!!
and some of you guys are missing the point here - there are a lot of bad signs about this year's iteration of our beloved G-Men...I get why many are pessimistic about our chances.
my point is directed to the select few cunts who take on a full blown "haha I told you so!" attitude whenever something bad happens to the Giants. I swear I really think some people want the Giants to lose so their gloom and doom will be validated
that's different from the kind of poster who isn't optimistic, but would be excited to be proven wrong
For evidence, someone could dig up the game thread from the Giants loss to the Skins late in the 2007 season...at least 1 poster actually said they'd rather the Giants lose and see Coughlin fired than see us win the Super Bowl
Poor bastards really must gave suffered through that legendary Super Bowl run.
RE: I do agree that some preseasons offense looked bad Â
but I thought in the SB year and the year after we played pretty well on offense in pre-season. I could be off but they just seemed tougher in those years.
And you could be absolutely right..But in most cases the pre-season is rarely a harbinger of things to expect..If we have a crappy year, then so be it..It won't be because someone "saw something" in pre-season imo
I agree with those that say pre-season scores are unimportant, Â
but how the Giants have been functioning is an indication of their ability. In the Cincinnati game the offense looked uncoordinated and the defense was slow to react and got consistently pushed around and driven backwards. Before you say that it was only the 1st game, how do you explain that Cincinnati looked so much better? It is of course possible that the Bengals, who made the playoffs the past two seasons, are ready to make a Super Bowl bid. That however, just begs the question. Why did Cincinnati look so much better than the Giants even in game # 1? Is it because they really are better?
It is worrying tho that the Giants have shown little improvement in the 2 subsequent games.
I admit that NY's offense has seldom looked good in pre-season games, even in their Super Bowl seasons. I also expected Spag's defense to look rough due to there being a new coach and new system. On the offensive end Eli's 9 for 9 in the 2nd quarter of the Jet game was not exactly shabby & Eric Flowers and his companions have been holding up well on pass blocking. Run blocking not so good, but that needs more coordination & will hopefully improve as the season progresses.
Notice however, that Coughlin has stated the 1st team will play in the Patriot game. Is that a red alarm that says things are not going well or does Coughlin usually do that? You can bet that New England will not play their 1st team in that game.
If the Giants do not show a clear improvement on Thursday then I am concerned that it will be a long, painful season. Win or lose, I bleed Blue, & will continue to watch & root for our heroes.
RE: I agree with those that say pre-season scores are unimportant, Â
but how the Giants have been functioning is an indication of their ability. In the Cincinnati game the offense looked uncoordinated and the defense was slow to react and got consistently pushed around and driven backwards. Before you say that it was only the 1st game, how do you explain that Cincinnati looked so much better? It is of course possible that the Bengals, who made the playoffs the past two seasons, are ready to make a Super Bowl bid. That however, just begs the question. Why did Cincinnati look so much better than the Giants even in game # 1? Is it because they really are better?
It is worrying tho that the Giants have shown little improvement in the 2 subsequent games.
I admit that NY's offense has seldom looked good in pre-season games, even in their Super Bowl seasons. I also expected Spag's defense to look rough due to there being a new coach and new system. On the offensive end Eli's 9 for 9 in the 2nd quarter of the Jet game was not exactly shabby & Eric Flowers and his companions have been holding up well on pass blocking. Run blocking not so good, but that needs more coordination & will hopefully improve as the season progresses.
Notice however, that Coughlin has stated the 1st team will play in the Patriot game. Is that a red alarm that says things are not going well or does Coughlin usually do that? You can bet that New England will not play their 1st team in that game.
If the Giants do not show a clear improvement on Thursday then I am concerned that it will be a long, painful season. Win or lose, I bleed Blue, & will continue to watch & root for our heroes.
Because that's what happens in pre-season..A lot..Many teams look great and then nada..Remember the 4(or 5)-0 Lions the year they went 0-16 during the regular season? Spurrier's 'Skins in the pre-season?
The Giants generally look like crap during the pre-season, even if they win the majority of games..The Patriots often look like total crap as well
RE: RE: I do agree that some preseasons offense looked bad Â
And you could be absolutely right..But in most cases the pre-season is rarely a harbinger of things to expect
But on an individual basis, it can be. It's not guaranteed to be because there are so many potentially mitigating factors -- an extremely driven rookie can excel playing against a veteran who's kind of going through the motions, or a rookie can be overthinking to a degree he won't be as his confidence develops, etc. But if I'm a Raiders fan for example, I feel I have pretty good reason to believe that what I've seen from Kahlil Mack and Amari Cooper is indicative of how they'll be this season barring injury. You can see the skill and the competitiveness.
Forget "ripping the team" ... instead just look at the W/L predictions Â
First of all, throw out that part of OP that talks about the pre-season record. The record is totally meaningless. On the other hand, if you were to tell me that there were major talent upgrades before the pre-season that were demonstrating that talent during the pre-season (ala LT during his first year), then fuck ya I'd be thinking differently and it would change my 6-10 prediction for the season record.
But my prediction is based upon the defense and what I expect from the defense based upon: (1) what I've seen from the defense the past two seasons; (2) the additions made during FA and the draft; (3) JPP ; and (4) lastly, and least signficantly, what I've seen thus far in pre-season. In fact, it isn't so much what I've seen, but what I haven't seen - I've seen nothing that changes my opinion based upon numbers 1-3.
So, I knew at the end of last season how bad this defense was and that it was going to take 2-3 years to get it top 10 again - and that this year was going to be a disaster - unless they made some MAJOR splashes in FA and the draft - which they didn't. So the defense is what it is, not because of pre-season, but because it's sucked for a while now and is not getting better, but it's actually worse.
The defense is going to be historically bad and that was a known quantity as of JUNE.
eh, the OP focuses too much on the loudest complainers Â
Who is left from those Defenses that causes you such concern? Beason was terrific in '13 and essentially out the entire '14..JT Thomas is new, Kennard appears to have great upside..Hsnkins is a stud, Bromley is effectively "new" and Ellis, Selvie, Odi are new..Moore is young and could be special..That remains to be seen..DRC, unlike ladt year is healthy, Collins is new, Taylor appears to be good to go and so on..
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
Who is left from those Defenses that causes you such concern? Beason was terrific in '13 and essentially out the entire '14..JT Thomas is new, Kennard appears to have great upside..Hsnkins is a stud, Bromley is effectively "new" and Ellis, Selvie, Odi are new..Moore is young and could be special..That remains to be seen..DRC, unlike ladt year is healthy, Collins is new, Taylor appears to be good to go and so on..
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
First of all, forget me (and the Giants defense) for a moment. My post was primarily to reject the idea that it isn't possible to evaluate the relative strengths of teams in the NFL before the season starts. I flatly reject that. I suspect that every single head coach and GM in the NFL has a pretty damn good idea of which teams are stronger than others. If fans don't know, it's not because it isn't unknowable - but just that they don't have the information or knowledge base to make the evaluation.
Now, as for the Giants defense, there hasn't been any new additions that impress me based upon what they've done in the past. It's not as though the Giants had three first round picks and went all-in in the D. Is it possible that some of these guys become all world players out of nowhere? Sure, but highly doubtful. Hankins is the only raw pure talent on the entire D. Every single other player is either aging, "just a guy", or worse, isn't likely to be playing in the NFL next year or the year after.
Sorry, it's tough to take a bunch of no-names - street free agents essentially - and ask me to believe that they are magically going to compete against legitimate NFL offenses. My prediction? Of the 22 defensive players on the squad for game 1 this year, 11 won't be in the NFL 2 years from today. That's 50%.
Good post, and I suspect you'll be proven correct re: the defense. It's short on impact talent (DE), not productive at DT other than Hankins, and thin in the backend.
I have been a Giants fan my entire life and I will always be one, but it has became apparent to me many years ago that Giants fans for better or worse are among the most pessimistic in the league. The time I have spent here has done nothing to change my mind.
I would always prefer to see individuals stand out in preseaon Â
What fan wouldn't? But more important to me is injuries. I've seen too many flashy preseaons that led nowhere to believe in August performances. There is too much concrete evidence to support this belief. With that said there are also times where preseaon great play does in fact lead to greater things. It's just too random to know for sure whether it's fools gold or not.
if these young prospects grow quickly : 1) Odi, he might not bring the pass rush right away but he's got enough tools, smarts, and raw power to hold down one edge of the defense. 2) Collins, already flashing as a presence and tackler, the defense needs his leadership as well as gifts. 3) Spags' ability as a teacher could be worth a +1-2 wins over the course of 16 games. Just fielding a well-prepared unit that plays fundamentals in plus category would bring significant improvement. I expect we'll see him put Kennard up on the ends as the fifth DL to boost the pass rush, and help the DE opposite Odi or Wynn as needed.
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
I feel like I know what I"m watching talent wise compared to what we've had when we were successful and that alone gives me pause about our chances. The game results don't matter to me in the pre-season but it's how your players look against other ones and so far we have looked shitty.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
I don't care whether we WIN any pre-season games... Â
as long as the starters look good. If we play well when the first team is in there, but then our backups lose the game in the second half... I am fine with that.
The problem I have is that our starters look like they just got off of the bus from a week long binge in Tijuana
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
if these young prospects grow quickly : 1) Odi, he might not bring the pass rush right away but he's got enough tools, smarts, and raw power to hold down one edge of the defense. 2) Collins, already flashing as a presence and tackler, the defense needs his leadership as well as gifts. 3) Spags' ability as a teacher could be worth a +1-2 wins over the course of 16 games. Just fielding a well-prepared unit that plays fundamentals in plus category would bring significant improvement. I expect we'll see him put Kennard up on the ends as the fifth DL to boost the pass rush, and help the DE opposite Odi or Wynn as needed.
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
I think a lot of people understand the strengths/weaknesses of the team, but I think what a lot of people are sick of is the responses posters give: We have too many syracuse players, we should play Nassib with the 1st team, Reese sucks, TC is too old, etc.....
There are 2 main problems with the team now.
1. Our drafts from about 2009-2012 have been disasterous that has really put us behind the 8 ball as far as talent.
2. We have too many guys injured. Even the guys banged up and that are expected to play are missing valuable practice time.
The drafts have gotten better the last few years. But we need guys healthy. Once that happens, then we can properly judge how reese, coughlin, and the players.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
agree with BB56, I respect the mature posters who can rationally make a good counterargument without getting sarcastic, hostile or personal. just like in the real world though it takes all kinds! :)
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
agree with BB56, I respect the mature posters who can rationally make a good counterargument without getting sarcastic, hostile or personal. just like in the real world though it takes all kinds! :)
you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
Lets take the 3 men who get the most criticism on this board:
Eli
Coughlin
Reese
The type of poster that annoys me is that they make a point, whihc is refuted right off the bat by a number of posters. They stick to that point because they dont want to look wrong. And after a certain amount of time, they result to saying stupid shit like "Eli Homer" or they have rose colored glasses. And that their original point was that they are rational and making the most sense, when in reality - they have no clue what they are saying.
I enjoy nothing more than being called an Eli-lover. Really? Because I support him, and from my years of playing the position that somtimes I understand there is a lot more that goes into the play than just the result in itself. I know fantasy football has taken over the lives of many posters, doesnt mean they understand the game.
Usually the posters that classified themselves as "rational" tend to have an agenda and are usually wrong.
you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
Who are you talking to?
Not you. The above poster who stirs the pot but when called on it, tries to deflect the blame on the people who call him out.
that a large portion of people here like to shit on the team. They like to bash players, management and coaches. They like to pick individual plays out to make sweeping comments about. they minimize successes and focus on the negatives.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
I feel like I know what I"m watching talent wise compared to what we've had when we were successful and that alone gives me pause about our chances. The game results don't matter to me in the pre-season but it's how your players look against other ones and so far we have looked shitty.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
than some of you think. We've looked like shit in the pre-season but to me I have a ton of hope because Eli was awful in the pre-season, I expect him to play better once the regular season rolls around and we have a full playbook from an offensive mind I trust in McAdoo (certainly over Gilbride). The OL has given him a pretty good pocket. This OL still has a ton of work to do to become an above-average unit, but the talent is there for this to be a surprisingly solid OL. Flowers looks impressive early on, don't know if he has the grace to be a truly elite LT but his nastiness and power are immediate assets.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
than some of you think. We've looked like shit in the pre-season but to me I have a ton of hope because Eli was awful in the pre-season, I expect him to play better once the regular season rolls around and we have a full playbook from an offensive mind I trust in McAdoo (certainly over Gilbride). The OL has given him a pretty good pocket. This OL still has a ton of work to do to become an above-average unit, but the talent is there for this to be a surprisingly solid OL. Flowers looks impressive early on, don't know if he has the grace to be a truly elite LT but his nastiness and power are immediate assets.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
I like this
Quote:
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
True, pre-season doesn't count in assessing MOVING FORWARD..It's for evaluation of 90 players to get to the best 46..It's for getting(if possible) into hitting shape..
Quote:
would be saying oh it is only preseason it doesnt matter how good they have looked, preseason doesnt count...
True, pre-season doesn't count in assessing MOVING FORWARD..It's for evaluation of 90 players to get to the best 46..It's for getting(if possible) into hitting shape..
agreed 100%
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
You already mentioned it. Those people are a.) spoiled or b.) wanna be assclowns because they can.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
+1.
I've always been an optimistic fan, but understand why many are pessimistic. But some actually seem to wish the Giants fail so they can crow about it
"It's just preseason--don't get excited!"
"We won, but we looked like shit!"
Etc?
It's "Basic Skills" month. Players need to show that against other teams, they can run, pass, block, catch, etc. Sans one drive against the Jets that would have ended in a short FG, had it not been for a penalty against the Jets, the Giants grade out at a "D minus", perhaps a "D". The #1's have not shown an ability to perform basic skills against other teams and it's very alarming at the least. There seems to be some sense of security on coming up with excuses. Excuses like the naysayers are "bad fans", that the "games don't count" and they are not "showing everything".....
Being a naysayer doesn't make me a bad fan, it makes me a realist. I love my Giants and always will. It's frustrating to watch the team get abused every week. Different people deal with the same situations differently, it doesn't make us bad fans.
I'd love to hear Eric Kennedy weigh in on this
The fact of the matter is, we don't yet know what will happen with the final roster. While there are a lot of holes, I still see some potential in that perhaps the Giants offense could be good enough to outscore the points allowed by the defense. And I personally feel a lot more confident in the coaching staff now (Quinn excluded) than I have in a while.
Hope springs eternal but I am not holding my breath for more than an 8-8 season.
And YOUR lack of reality is us setting all-time injury records the last two years, especially to, as FMiC says, cluster groups(positions)...Fortunately it's (hopefully) cyclical and we are due(again hopefully) a break..This is not the entire story, but certainly an important one..Think before you post your "certainties."
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
A billion dollar business is a strange cause to repeatedly get all white knight about.
And for the people who say the Giants "just don't have the talent," I'd argue that the same could be said in 07, when we ran James Butler & Gibril Wilson out as our starting safeties and rookie Aaron Ross along with old-timer Sam Madison out as our 1 & 2 CBs.
"It's just preseason--don't get excited!"
"We won, but we looked like shit!"
Etc?
Huh?
arnie, SO FAR, the injuries we've sustained are mostly to backups..Yes, not thrilling, but at least, for now our projected starters appear reasonably healthy. I can live with that as these types of injuries are common around the league..athe last two years were not common imv, not by a long shot..
If it stays like this (in the main) I would have very few excuses to offer should our season go south..We are obviously thin at S, but tor now, that most likely can be filled by our future signings..
Here's an easy, glaring example I can think of: I watched a Raiders preseason game a few weeks ago in which a Trent Richardson play was entirely emblematic of Trent Richardson's career to date. I think the play actually got a lot of national exposure because of how bad it was. An absolutely gaping whole opened to the left, and Trent Richardson cut to the right and, I dunno, ran into the back of his guard or something. Even had that play occurred in week one of Richardson's career you'd think, "Whoa, that ain't a good sign." Your fears might have been assuaged by the "it's just preseason" argument but they'd ultimately be corroborated by future performance.
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It's a message board and in our own way we want the Giants to win and be exciting to watch so I don't mean to be disrespectful. But what you've seen so far this year has broken the injury cycle? I mean seriously what are you watching? Starting LT out for at least half the season. Best DL out for at least half the season. Center hurt. RG still not 100%. MLB hurt again as usual. Cruz still injured. Safeties and back up DB's falling daily. The injury list might actually be worse than the past 2 years so far before they even play a regular season game.
arnie, SO FAR, the injuries we've sustained are mostly to backups..Yes, not thrilling, but at least, for now our projected starters appear reasonably healthy. I can live with that as these types of injuries are common around the league..athe last two years were not common imv, not by a long shot..
If it stays like this (in the main) I would have very few excuses to offer should our season go south..We are obviously thin at S, but tor now, that most likely can be filled by our future signings..
Cruz, RR, Richburg, Prince, Beason, Schwartz, JPP ... these guys are not backups
Those of us that are negative have seen nothing to get excited over from the first team. The defense - the offense - both have stunk up the place. I'm not talking about didn't play up to their capabilities or were a little sluggish. They were horrible.
That's the reason we're all worried about having to suffer through another losing season.
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In comment 12446902 arniefez said:
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It's a message board and in our own way we want the Giants to win and be exciting to watch so I don't mean to be disrespectful. But what you've seen so far this year has broken the injury cycle? I mean seriously what are you watching? Starting LT out for at least half the season. Best DL out for at least half the season. Center hurt. RG still not 100%. MLB hurt again as usual. Cruz still injured. Safeties and back up DB's falling daily. The injury list might actually be worse than the past 2 years so far before they even play a regular season game.
arnie, SO FAR, the injuries we've sustained are mostly to backups..Yes, not thrilling, but at least, for now our projected starters appear reasonably healthy. I can live with that as these types of injuries are common around the league..athe last two years were not common imv, not by a long shot..
If it stays like this (in the main) I would have very few excuses to offer should our season go south..We are obviously thin at S, but tor now, that most likely can be filled by our future signings..
Cruz, RR, Richburg, Prince, Beason, Schwartz, JPP ... these guys are not backups
Randle, Richburg, Prince, Schwartz have all returned to practice...
Cruz said he expects to practice Labor day...
Beason has been working on the side the past 2 practices...
JPP who the fuck knows
Those of us that are negative have seen nothing to get excited over from the first team. The defense - the offense - both have stunk up the place. I'm not talking about didn't play up to their capabilities or were a little sluggish. They were horrible.
That's the reason we're all worried about having to suffer through another losing season.
Please..The first teamers haven't played all that much and obviously need more practice and game experience once they are down to the final 53 or 46 for game day..They are constantly shuffling players in and out for evaluation..You can't get an objective read based on 14-15 or so snaps(on both sides of the ball)..Some teams look great with those 14-15 snaps, others don't..
They hardly game plan for this shit..Save your pessimism for when they play for real..When they get an entire gameful of snaps..Even then, it may take several weeks to get in sync..
The majority of BBI tends to pick the latter and go hard with it every gd year.
Also, I agree with '56. Honestly, if you would have showed me our current injury list over the offseason and said "Here's where we'll be with one preseason game left" - I would have taken it.
We're decimated safety, sure. But we've always sucked at safety. Seriously, for the past 10 years - the Giants have been mediocre, at best, at safety. We look back with delight at the "good old days" of having Kenny Phillips back there. Kenny freakin Phillips, who only started 2 full seasons with the team and recorded 8 interceptions in four years.
This thread is good evidence of a lot of them.
Here is a simple response to a simple question: If we were 3-0 in pre-season... actually, forget the record... If our first team players had looked good so far through the pre-season, most people (myself included) would have more hope for the upcoming season.
I wouldn't be planning for the Super Bowl but I would feel good about the team taking the next step (another year in MacAdoo's offense, Spags being back on D). Yes, that would make me happy.
I take no joy in shitting on the team. I wouldn't be coming on BBI to proclaim "it's only pre-season" so who cares. So these general statements that some here like to make about BBI en masse ring pretty hollow to me.
Anyway, does that answer your question, OP?
clouds were made of marshmallows...
everyday was a summer day....
coca cola came out of our faucets....
everyone on BBI could just get along.....
RE: David
dorgan : 1:44 pm : link : reply
In comment 12444939 Eric from BBI said:
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I have them going back to 1996 still... http://www.bigblueinteractive.com/new-york-giants-game-previews-reviews/ - ( New Window )
WTF does he know?
No offense to anyone, but I pay no attention to pre-season beyond watching individuals that interest me. I can't imagine checking out prior year's pre-season games. The current ones don't mean much and the previous years' games mean less.
I know what you were referencing..Minimal snaps caused your peanut brain to deduce that we look like shot..Moron
Some Fan, when has an Eli-led offense during the pre-season look like anything other than crap? Perhaps at times? Sure..In general, if you didn't know better, you'd never guess he's won two SBs..
Wait until the bullets fly for real..
I'm honored to be counted among the likes of you pricks!!
and some of you guys are missing the point here - there are a lot of bad signs about this year's iteration of our beloved G-Men...I get why many are pessimistic about our chances.
my point is directed to the select few cunts who take on a full blown "haha I told you so!" attitude whenever something bad happens to the Giants. I swear I really think some people want the Giants to lose so their gloom and doom will be validated
that's different from the kind of poster who isn't optimistic, but would be excited to be proven wrong
For evidence, someone could dig up the game thread from the Giants loss to the Skins late in the 2007 season...at least 1 poster actually said they'd rather the Giants lose and see Coughlin fired than see us win the Super Bowl
Poor bastards really must gave suffered through that legendary Super Bowl run.
And you could be absolutely right..But in most cases the pre-season is rarely a harbinger of things to expect..If we have a crappy year, then so be it..It won't be because someone "saw something" in pre-season imo
It is worrying tho that the Giants have shown little improvement in the 2 subsequent games.
I admit that NY's offense has seldom looked good in pre-season games, even in their Super Bowl seasons. I also expected Spag's defense to look rough due to there being a new coach and new system. On the offensive end Eli's 9 for 9 in the 2nd quarter of the Jet game was not exactly shabby & Eric Flowers and his companions have been holding up well on pass blocking. Run blocking not so good, but that needs more coordination & will hopefully improve as the season progresses.
Notice however, that Coughlin has stated the 1st team will play in the Patriot game. Is that a red alarm that says things are not going well or does Coughlin usually do that? You can bet that New England will not play their 1st team in that game.
If the Giants do not show a clear improvement on Thursday then I am concerned that it will be a long, painful season. Win or lose, I bleed Blue, & will continue to watch & root for our heroes.
It is worrying tho that the Giants have shown little improvement in the 2 subsequent games.
I admit that NY's offense has seldom looked good in pre-season games, even in their Super Bowl seasons. I also expected Spag's defense to look rough due to there being a new coach and new system. On the offensive end Eli's 9 for 9 in the 2nd quarter of the Jet game was not exactly shabby & Eric Flowers and his companions have been holding up well on pass blocking. Run blocking not so good, but that needs more coordination & will hopefully improve as the season progresses.
Notice however, that Coughlin has stated the 1st team will play in the Patriot game. Is that a red alarm that says things are not going well or does Coughlin usually do that? You can bet that New England will not play their 1st team in that game.
If the Giants do not show a clear improvement on Thursday then I am concerned that it will be a long, painful season. Win or lose, I bleed Blue, & will continue to watch & root for our heroes.
Because that's what happens in pre-season..A lot..Many teams look great and then nada..Remember the 4(or 5)-0 Lions the year they went 0-16 during the regular season? Spurrier's 'Skins in the pre-season?
The Giants generally look like crap during the pre-season, even if they win the majority of games..The Patriots often look like total crap as well
But on an individual basis, it can be. It's not guaranteed to be because there are so many potentially mitigating factors -- an extremely driven rookie can excel playing against a veteran who's kind of going through the motions, or a rookie can be overthinking to a degree he won't be as his confidence develops, etc. But if I'm a Raiders fan for example, I feel I have pretty good reason to believe that what I've seen from Kahlil Mack and Amari Cooper is indicative of how they'll be this season barring injury. You can see the skill and the competitiveness.
First of all, throw out that part of OP that talks about the pre-season record. The record is totally meaningless. On the other hand, if you were to tell me that there were major talent upgrades before the pre-season that were demonstrating that talent during the pre-season (ala LT during his first year), then fuck ya I'd be thinking differently and it would change my 6-10 prediction for the season record.
But my prediction is based upon the defense and what I expect from the defense based upon: (1) what I've seen from the defense the past two seasons; (2) the additions made during FA and the draft; (3) JPP ; and (4) lastly, and least signficantly, what I've seen thus far in pre-season. In fact, it isn't so much what I've seen, but what I haven't seen - I've seen nothing that changes my opinion based upon numbers 1-3.
So, I knew at the end of last season how bad this defense was and that it was going to take 2-3 years to get it top 10 again - and that this year was going to be a disaster - unless they made some MAJOR splashes in FA and the draft - which they didn't. So the defense is what it is, not because of pre-season, but because it's sucked for a while now and is not getting better, but it's actually worse.
The defense is going to be historically bad and that was a known quantity as of JUNE.
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
First of all, forget me (and the Giants defense) for a moment. My post was primarily to reject the idea that it isn't possible to evaluate the relative strengths of teams in the NFL before the season starts. I flatly reject that. I suspect that every single head coach and GM in the NFL has a pretty damn good idea of which teams are stronger than others. If fans don't know, it's not because it isn't unknowable - but just that they don't have the information or knowledge base to make the evaluation.
Now, as for the Giants defense, there hasn't been any new additions that impress me based upon what they've done in the past. It's not as though the Giants had three first round picks and went all-in in the D. Is it possible that some of these guys become all world players out of nowhere? Sure, but highly doubtful. Hankins is the only raw pure talent on the entire D. Every single other player is either aging, "just a guy", or worse, isn't likely to be playing in the NFL next year or the year after.
Sorry, it's tough to take a bunch of no-names - street free agents essentially - and ask me to believe that they are magically going to compete against legitimate NFL offenses. My prediction? Of the 22 defensive players on the squad for game 1 this year, 11 won't be in the NFL 2 years from today. That's 50%.
should be
If fans don't know, it's not because it isn't knowable
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
The problem I have is that our starters look like they just got off of the bus from a week long binge in Tijuana
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Agree
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
Very fair post and rational..:)
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
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the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
I think a lot of people understand the strengths/weaknesses of the team, but I think what a lot of people are sick of is the responses posters give: We have too many syracuse players, we should play Nassib with the 1st team, Reese sucks, TC is too old, etc.....
There are 2 main problems with the team now.
1. Our drafts from about 2009-2012 have been disasterous that has really put us behind the 8 ball as far as talent.
2. We have too many guys injured. Even the guys banged up and that are expected to play are missing valuable practice time.
The drafts have gotten better the last few years. But we need guys healthy. Once that happens, then we can properly judge how reese, coughlin, and the players.
So I've learned the hard way-really pick and choose your posters..The must reads..
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
Eli
Coughlin
Reese
The type of poster that annoys me is that they make a point, whihc is refuted right off the bat by a number of posters. They stick to that point because they dont want to look wrong. And after a certain amount of time, they result to saying stupid shit like "Eli Homer" or they have rose colored glasses. And that their original point was that they are rational and making the most sense, when in reality - they have no clue what they are saying.
I enjoy nothing more than being called an Eli-lover. Really? Because I support him, and from my years of playing the position that somtimes I understand there is a lot more that goes into the play than just the result in itself. I know fantasy football has taken over the lives of many posters, doesnt mean they understand the game.
Usually the posters that classified themselves as "rational" tend to have an agenda and are usually wrong.
Who are you talking to?
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you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
Who are you talking to?
Not you. The above poster who stirs the pot but when called on it, tries to deflect the blame on the people who call him out.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
Well Said.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
Great post.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
I like this
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
:)