And you could be absolutely right..But in most cases the pre-season is rarely a harbinger of things to expect
But on an individual basis, it can be. It's not guaranteed to be because there are so many potentially mitigating factors -- an extremely driven rookie can excel playing against a veteran who's kind of going through the motions, or a rookie can be overthinking to a degree he won't be as his confidence develops, etc. But if I'm a Raiders fan for example, I feel I have pretty good reason to believe that what I've seen from Kahlil Mack and Amari Cooper is indicative of how they'll be this season barring injury. You can see the skill and the competitiveness.
Forget "ripping the team" ... instead just look at the W/L predictions Â
First of all, throw out that part of OP that talks about the pre-season record. The record is totally meaningless. On the other hand, if you were to tell me that there were major talent upgrades before the pre-season that were demonstrating that talent during the pre-season (ala LT during his first year), then fuck ya I'd be thinking differently and it would change my 6-10 prediction for the season record.
But my prediction is based upon the defense and what I expect from the defense based upon: (1) what I've seen from the defense the past two seasons; (2) the additions made during FA and the draft; (3) JPP ; and (4) lastly, and least signficantly, what I've seen thus far in pre-season. In fact, it isn't so much what I've seen, but what I haven't seen - I've seen nothing that changes my opinion based upon numbers 1-3.
So, I knew at the end of last season how bad this defense was and that it was going to take 2-3 years to get it top 10 again - and that this year was going to be a disaster - unless they made some MAJOR splashes in FA and the draft - which they didn't. So the defense is what it is, not because of pre-season, but because it's sucked for a while now and is not getting better, but it's actually worse.
The defense is going to be historically bad and that was a known quantity as of JUNE.
eh, the OP focuses too much on the loudest complainers Â
Who is left from those Defenses that causes you such concern? Beason was terrific in '13 and essentially out the entire '14..JT Thomas is new, Kennard appears to have great upside..Hsnkins is a stud, Bromley is effectively "new" and Ellis, Selvie, Odi are new..Moore is young and could be special..That remains to be seen..DRC, unlike ladt year is healthy, Collins is new, Taylor appears to be good to go and so on..
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
Who is left from those Defenses that causes you such concern? Beason was terrific in '13 and essentially out the entire '14..JT Thomas is new, Kennard appears to have great upside..Hsnkins is a stud, Bromley is effectively "new" and Ellis, Selvie, Odi are new..Moore is young and could be special..That remains to be seen..DRC, unlike ladt year is healthy, Collins is new, Taylor appears to be good to go and so on..
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
First of all, forget me (and the Giants defense) for a moment. My post was primarily to reject the idea that it isn't possible to evaluate the relative strengths of teams in the NFL before the season starts. I flatly reject that. I suspect that every single head coach and GM in the NFL has a pretty damn good idea of which teams are stronger than others. If fans don't know, it's not because it isn't unknowable - but just that they don't have the information or knowledge base to make the evaluation.
Now, as for the Giants defense, there hasn't been any new additions that impress me based upon what they've done in the past. It's not as though the Giants had three first round picks and went all-in in the D. Is it possible that some of these guys become all world players out of nowhere? Sure, but highly doubtful. Hankins is the only raw pure talent on the entire D. Every single other player is either aging, "just a guy", or worse, isn't likely to be playing in the NFL next year or the year after.
Sorry, it's tough to take a bunch of no-names - street free agents essentially - and ask me to believe that they are magically going to compete against legitimate NFL offenses. My prediction? Of the 22 defensive players on the squad for game 1 this year, 11 won't be in the NFL 2 years from today. That's 50%.
Good post, and I suspect you'll be proven correct re: the defense. It's short on impact talent (DE), not productive at DT other than Hankins, and thin in the backend.
I have been a Giants fan my entire life and I will always be one, but it has became apparent to me many years ago that Giants fans for better or worse are among the most pessimistic in the league. The time I have spent here has done nothing to change my mind.
I would always prefer to see individuals stand out in preseaon Â
What fan wouldn't? But more important to me is injuries. I've seen too many flashy preseaons that led nowhere to believe in August performances. There is too much concrete evidence to support this belief. With that said there are also times where preseaon great play does in fact lead to greater things. It's just too random to know for sure whether it's fools gold or not.
if these young prospects grow quickly : 1) Odi, he might not bring the pass rush right away but he's got enough tools, smarts, and raw power to hold down one edge of the defense. 2) Collins, already flashing as a presence and tackler, the defense needs his leadership as well as gifts. 3) Spags' ability as a teacher could be worth a +1-2 wins over the course of 16 games. Just fielding a well-prepared unit that plays fundamentals in plus category would bring significant improvement. I expect we'll see him put Kennard up on the ends as the fifth DL to boost the pass rush, and help the DE opposite Odi or Wynn as needed.
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
I feel like I know what I"m watching talent wise compared to what we've had when we were successful and that alone gives me pause about our chances. The game results don't matter to me in the pre-season but it's how your players look against other ones and so far we have looked shitty.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
I don't care whether we WIN any pre-season games... Â
as long as the starters look good. If we play well when the first team is in there, but then our backups lose the game in the second half... I am fine with that.
The problem I have is that our starters look like they just got off of the bus from a week long binge in Tijuana
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
if these young prospects grow quickly : 1) Odi, he might not bring the pass rush right away but he's got enough tools, smarts, and raw power to hold down one edge of the defense. 2) Collins, already flashing as a presence and tackler, the defense needs his leadership as well as gifts. 3) Spags' ability as a teacher could be worth a +1-2 wins over the course of 16 games. Just fielding a well-prepared unit that plays fundamentals in plus category would bring significant improvement. I expect we'll see him put Kennard up on the ends as the fifth DL to boost the pass rush, and help the DE opposite Odi or Wynn as needed.
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
I think a lot of people understand the strengths/weaknesses of the team, but I think what a lot of people are sick of is the responses posters give: We have too many syracuse players, we should play Nassib with the 1st team, Reese sucks, TC is too old, etc.....
There are 2 main problems with the team now.
1. Our drafts from about 2009-2012 have been disasterous that has really put us behind the 8 ball as far as talent.
2. We have too many guys injured. Even the guys banged up and that are expected to play are missing valuable practice time.
The drafts have gotten better the last few years. But we need guys healthy. Once that happens, then we can properly judge how reese, coughlin, and the players.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
agree with BB56, I respect the mature posters who can rationally make a good counterargument without getting sarcastic, hostile or personal. just like in the real world though it takes all kinds! :)
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
agree with BB56, I respect the mature posters who can rationally make a good counterargument without getting sarcastic, hostile or personal. just like in the real world though it takes all kinds! :)
you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
Lets take the 3 men who get the most criticism on this board:
Eli
Coughlin
Reese
The type of poster that annoys me is that they make a point, whihc is refuted right off the bat by a number of posters. They stick to that point because they dont want to look wrong. And after a certain amount of time, they result to saying stupid shit like "Eli Homer" or they have rose colored glasses. And that their original point was that they are rational and making the most sense, when in reality - they have no clue what they are saying.
I enjoy nothing more than being called an Eli-lover. Really? Because I support him, and from my years of playing the position that somtimes I understand there is a lot more that goes into the play than just the result in itself. I know fantasy football has taken over the lives of many posters, doesnt mean they understand the game.
Usually the posters that classified themselves as "rational" tend to have an agenda and are usually wrong.
you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
Who are you talking to?
Not you. The above poster who stirs the pot but when called on it, tries to deflect the blame on the people who call him out.
that a large portion of people here like to shit on the team. They like to bash players, management and coaches. They like to pick individual plays out to make sweeping comments about. they minimize successes and focus on the negatives.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
I feel like I know what I"m watching talent wise compared to what we've had when we were successful and that alone gives me pause about our chances. The game results don't matter to me in the pre-season but it's how your players look against other ones and so far we have looked shitty.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
than some of you think. We've looked like shit in the pre-season but to me I have a ton of hope because Eli was awful in the pre-season, I expect him to play better once the regular season rolls around and we have a full playbook from an offensive mind I trust in McAdoo (certainly over Gilbride). The OL has given him a pretty good pocket. This OL still has a ton of work to do to become an above-average unit, but the talent is there for this to be a surprisingly solid OL. Flowers looks impressive early on, don't know if he has the grace to be a truly elite LT but his nastiness and power are immediate assets.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
than some of you think. We've looked like shit in the pre-season but to me I have a ton of hope because Eli was awful in the pre-season, I expect him to play better once the regular season rolls around and we have a full playbook from an offensive mind I trust in McAdoo (certainly over Gilbride). The OL has given him a pretty good pocket. This OL still has a ton of work to do to become an above-average unit, but the talent is there for this to be a surprisingly solid OL. Flowers looks impressive early on, don't know if he has the grace to be a truly elite LT but his nastiness and power are immediate assets.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
I like this
Quote:
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
But on an individual basis, it can be. It's not guaranteed to be because there are so many potentially mitigating factors -- an extremely driven rookie can excel playing against a veteran who's kind of going through the motions, or a rookie can be overthinking to a degree he won't be as his confidence develops, etc. But if I'm a Raiders fan for example, I feel I have pretty good reason to believe that what I've seen from Kahlil Mack and Amari Cooper is indicative of how they'll be this season barring injury. You can see the skill and the competitiveness.
First of all, throw out that part of OP that talks about the pre-season record. The record is totally meaningless. On the other hand, if you were to tell me that there were major talent upgrades before the pre-season that were demonstrating that talent during the pre-season (ala LT during his first year), then fuck ya I'd be thinking differently and it would change my 6-10 prediction for the season record.
But my prediction is based upon the defense and what I expect from the defense based upon: (1) what I've seen from the defense the past two seasons; (2) the additions made during FA and the draft; (3) JPP ; and (4) lastly, and least signficantly, what I've seen thus far in pre-season. In fact, it isn't so much what I've seen, but what I haven't seen - I've seen nothing that changes my opinion based upon numbers 1-3.
So, I knew at the end of last season how bad this defense was and that it was going to take 2-3 years to get it top 10 again - and that this year was going to be a disaster - unless they made some MAJOR splashes in FA and the draft - which they didn't. So the defense is what it is, not because of pre-season, but because it's sucked for a while now and is not getting better, but it's actually worse.
The defense is going to be historically bad and that was a known quantity as of JUNE.
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
Not to mention a new DC..You can't possibly know how this D will perform..Sure it may take a while to acclimate to change and get in sync, but none of us KNOW how this will play out..
This D, no matter what any of us think might happen bears NO resemblance to the last two years..NONE
First of all, forget me (and the Giants defense) for a moment. My post was primarily to reject the idea that it isn't possible to evaluate the relative strengths of teams in the NFL before the season starts. I flatly reject that. I suspect that every single head coach and GM in the NFL has a pretty damn good idea of which teams are stronger than others. If fans don't know, it's not because it isn't unknowable - but just that they don't have the information or knowledge base to make the evaluation.
Now, as for the Giants defense, there hasn't been any new additions that impress me based upon what they've done in the past. It's not as though the Giants had three first round picks and went all-in in the D. Is it possible that some of these guys become all world players out of nowhere? Sure, but highly doubtful. Hankins is the only raw pure talent on the entire D. Every single other player is either aging, "just a guy", or worse, isn't likely to be playing in the NFL next year or the year after.
Sorry, it's tough to take a bunch of no-names - street free agents essentially - and ask me to believe that they are magically going to compete against legitimate NFL offenses. My prediction? Of the 22 defensive players on the squad for game 1 this year, 11 won't be in the NFL 2 years from today. That's 50%.
should be
If fans don't know, it's not because it isn't knowable
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
The problem I have is that our starters look like they just got off of the bus from a week long binge in Tijuana
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Agree
The triangle up front (DTs+MIKE) must consistently stop the run as the anchor. But so far, we have no DT performing next to Hankins, and Beason is again ailing.
To my eye, the team is improving each week but it's definitely early in terms of having a feel for the delta between good and bad teams in 2015. imo.
Very fair post and rational..:)
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
Quote:
the main problem is that not many people take a very reasoned or supported stance whether they are raging homers or people looking to clear out the roster and staff. You know as well as anyone that's where 99% of the posts are directed.
There are quite a few people who can be negative towards players and it leads to reasonable discussion.
But then you have a lot of others. Just today we've had comments:
- This needs to be Reese's last year
- Beason is a useless piece of crap
- 99% of our draft picks from round 5-7 since 2011 never set foot on the field
- Coughlin needed to be fired 3 years ago
- We are the worst team in the league right now, you can bet on it
It could be argued that those comments should be let go or not call out stupidity.
You are sometimes positive and sometimes negative, but everyone knows where you stand. You aren't being called a fucking moron, nor should you be.
I don't think calling out idiotic comments is being high and mighty. And that goes both ways. When Matt in Syracuse thought Collins would throw for 5000 yards and 80 TD's he was called on it. If you disagree with somebody, you bring it hard too. It is a natural, and often a reasonable reaction.
When somebody's ramblings are so disparate from either our own or reality, we want to refute them. I could give a shit if somebody is frustrated or elated, that isn't what's attacked. It is the mindlessness that is attacked. The people who have the urge to post on a board but don't even take the time to put anything other than a one sentence throwaway line out there.
It isn't telling people how to be fans - it telling them how to at least function on a message board so people who actually do bring analysis or knowledge don't have to be inundated with their ridiculous shit.
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
I think a lot of people understand the strengths/weaknesses of the team, but I think what a lot of people are sick of is the responses posters give: We have too many syracuse players, we should play Nassib with the 1st team, Reese sucks, TC is too old, etc.....
There are 2 main problems with the team now.
1. Our drafts from about 2009-2012 have been disasterous that has really put us behind the 8 ball as far as talent.
2. We have too many guys injured. Even the guys banged up and that are expected to play are missing valuable practice time.
The drafts have gotten better the last few years. But we need guys healthy. Once that happens, then we can properly judge how reese, coughlin, and the players.
So I've learned the hard way-really pick and choose your posters..The must reads..
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
Yes. but that being said...quite often you will find rational/reasonable NEGATIVE comments about the team that are met with hostility and attacks vs simple disagreement. In the end, who cares? It is just a message board :)
Eli
Coughlin
Reese
The type of poster that annoys me is that they make a point, whihc is refuted right off the bat by a number of posters. They stick to that point because they dont want to look wrong. And after a certain amount of time, they result to saying stupid shit like "Eli Homer" or they have rose colored glasses. And that their original point was that they are rational and making the most sense, when in reality - they have no clue what they are saying.
I enjoy nothing more than being called an Eli-lover. Really? Because I support him, and from my years of playing the position that somtimes I understand there is a lot more that goes into the play than just the result in itself. I know fantasy football has taken over the lives of many posters, doesnt mean they understand the game.
Usually the posters that classified themselves as "rational" tend to have an agenda and are usually wrong.
Who are you talking to?
Quote:
you dont do that and make call out threads and make threads with information you cannot back up. Hence why a lot of people make negative comments towards you.
Who are you talking to?
Not you. The above poster who stirs the pot but when called on it, tries to deflect the blame on the people who call him out.
it has been over a decade since the last time we had a season with fewer than 6 wins. We have 2 SB's in the past 8 years. And you read this board and people go apeshit like we are the Browns.
Even the board's owner talks about replacing Eli based on preseason stats - a player that has never had a good preseason before.
It is madness, coupled with quite a few trolls who exist only to try and stir the pot.
I can't for the life of me understand this. I know a lot of football fans. Hell, I even know Bills and Browns fans, and while they often accept defeat, they don't have nearly the amount of vitriol and anger as people here do.
Well Said.
I see all the "we're not game planning" and "eli is just taking deep shots this game, so it's not a big deal" and I just shake my head. Every team approaches these games in a similar manner. Get some quality work in against a real opponent and see what you need to work on. So far we have to work on everything and the issues we faced last year, such as an inability to run or stop it, reared their heads in all 3 games so far against the other teams starters. That's NOT GOOD. Yes there is time to fix, correct, get guys healthy but that means those teams are already way ahead of us. How quickly do we bridge that gap with a team still loaded with question marks up and down the starting 22.
I don't piss and moan because it's fun, when I think this is a good team I'm adamant about that too. I get no joy out of watching our players get shoved around and drop passes and miss throws and whiff on tackles. This is a team with a big big lack of talent and health in too many areas for this to be a successful campaign. This doesn't affect my view of 2 super bowls in 8 years, but am I supposed to be happy that we kind of stink because 4 years ago we didn't? That logic works for some of you, and that's great, but don't sit here and tell people how to feel about a team or why a negative take on this bunch is just oh so beneath you as a fan.
I take it to heart because I love this game and have since I could hold a football. When I see it being played poorly by poor players it irks me, always will and nothing changes that. So I'm less of a fan or somehow I'm not on teh same level as you level headed do gooders who "see the big picture"? So I get upset at shitty play, so what? Why do you care? So instead of debating anything we get holier than thou posts about how much wiser you all are with not one..not ONE thing to back up what you're saying. Blind faith or blind belief and clinging to wins from 4 years ago get you by. Not me.
If you can't evaluate players and realize we have had far more talent here when we were competitive then I don't know what to tell you. Maybe you don't care to do that, maybe football is just a thing you like and you kinda hope the chips fall right and that's great. That's not everyone. I see where the issues probably will be this year by evaluating our players in games, albeit meaningless ones. I see a lack of talent, and a lot of it in key areas. That I suppose makes me some kind of jerk who just can't enjoy life...or whatever you all are spouting up there on High Horse Lane. Get over yourselves, some people get worked up, some don't...oh my god what a total shock...people react differently to things. Who knew??? Feel free to keep looking down your noses to anyone who doesn't share you oh so insightful world view. Hopefully I haven't upset any of you super balanced know it alls who can't be troubled to think about such things as someone's inability to anchor vs a double team or beat press coverage or execute a down block. Please forgive me and anyone else who thinks this team isn't very good. You're better than we are, we know that now and thank you so much for pointing out in a smug self congratulatory way. One day, maybe I can be as fulfilled and wise as all of you, as long as BBI is here I know who I can look up to for all that ails me. It's you, the ever happy never worry bunch who won't let the naysayers do anything without chiding them and letting them know just how much better you all are.
Great post.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
Flowers and the Pugh/Richburg combo give us 3 young OLineman with the arrow pointing up. Schwartz staying healthy for long is a question mark, but when he plays he's not bad at all. Pugh/Richburg/Schwartz certainly has potential if luck breaks our way. The only way I see a 2013 type of season from the interior OL is if a couple of those guys get hurt. I think Eli is going to have the space to step into his throws this year. Newhouse is a question mark, a shame Beatty got hurt or this OL would have even more potential. Hopefully he comes back strong and Flowers makes Beatty's future position a question mark.
Run behind Flowers. It was just obvious in pre-season that this should be something we emphasize. He's just a powerful man and he can hit moving targets if he has to which is something we've always liked in our OLineman. Our RB situation is just odd at this point, Andre Williams just hasn't grabbed the reigns like we'd hoped but Vereen/Jennings/Williams is a versatile backfield even if they lack explosiveness. Maybe Darkwa does something if given a chance. It starts with the OL providing lanes, because none of these guys look great at creating something out of nothing other than Vereen on a short pass.
We also have Odell Beckham. He only played 12 games and he needs to prove it for a longer time. Hopefully his head isn't getting too big too soon, but the talent is obvious. He might have the best hands in the league yet his feet might be his best asset. He's insanity. I want to believe and I hope it's true. Cruz/Randle is an interesting duo. There are clear injury concerns here. But if both stay healthy and Cruz is making a good impact, that's a nice 2/3 to surround Beckham with. Hopefully Donnell stops fumbling because we need him to be confident so he can be a RZ threat again with all the attention that's going to be given to Beckham.
This O isn't a lock to be Top 5. We're an injury prone team and we're depending on the luck to change this year and for our guys to stay relatively healthy. But if that happens, this team absolutely has Top 5 offense potential. We were 13th in points last year and we clearly have another level we can climb to.
Our D does scare me. There just seems to be a lack of talent. But I'll say this. JPP was our best defender and his specialty was being one of the best run defending DLineman in the league. He's not an explosive pass rusher but he controls the point so well against OLineman which makes him a beast vs. the run. And yet last season our run D ranked 30th in Yards per Game and DEAD LAST in Yards per carry. JPP's run-stuffing clearly made a big difference last season LOL. I think he's a very good player but there's reason to believe that this run-D can improve even without him, because we were the absolute worst last season at it. Who knows, maybe he's still pretty good when he's back. Hopefully Spags isn't too aggressive because I could see us giving up a lot of big plays if he is. He needs to find the right balance because we aren't that talented here.
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
I like this
TLDR, I think our D is pretty bad but our offense has so much more potential than some of you pussies make it seem like. It's the NFL, the difference between 6-10 and 10-6 isn't much. We don't have a 3 win team you fucking whiny cunts. This is a team that's at worst a 6 win team again and at best a 10 win playoff team led by Eli fucking big game Manning and that dude Odell. Leap Year Eli is going to do it again.
:)