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PFF: John Jerry highest graded NYG in Jets game

Pete in MD : 9/1/2015 4:00 pm
I didn't see this posted anywhere and I know PFF is not perfect but I found this interesting since the BBI consensus seems to be that he played poorly.
Quote:
Top 5 graded players:

1. OL John Jerry (+3.2)

2. DL Cullen Jenkins (+2.2)

3. LB Uani’ Unga (+1.8)

4. QB Ryan Nassib (+1.8)

5. OL Brett Jones (+1.3)

Link - ( New Window )
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/1/2015 4:03 pm : link
Not based on what I saw.

As I mentioned in my game review, he just doesn't sustain his blocks. Look at Akeem Hunt's 15-yard run (easy to find on tape in the 4th quarter). He's playing against a scrub and he makes contact and immediately falls of his block. That's always been his issue when run blocking. He makes contact but doesn't sustain.

In pass pro, stunts have always caused him issues.
PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
GiantsFan84 : 9/1/2015 4:05 pm : link
I don't know why people treat it like it's meaningful
I'm shocked..SHOCKED  
PEEJ : 9/1/2015 4:05 pm : link
that Kuhn wasn't a top performer as well.
Time for  
Carl in CT : 9/1/2015 4:06 pm : link
A new system
.  
MOOPS : 9/1/2015 4:08 pm : link
RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
Matt in SGS : 9/1/2015 4:11 pm : link
In comment 12447347 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
I don't know why people treat it like it's meaningful


Because several organizations, including the Giants, use it.
The Giants use some of PFF's stats  
PEEJ : 9/1/2015 4:13 pm : link
I don't think they use their grades
It's crap if it doesn't support your thesis  
Big Blue '56 : 9/1/2015 4:18 pm : link
and spot on if it does..

How good or accurate would you say it is in pre-season?  
Bill L : 9/1/2015 4:21 pm : link
Seems like there would be lots of opportunities to skew grades. For example, if you're a fringe starter but because of rotations and when the other team takes out it better players, you end up playing more against 3rd and 4th guys, wouldn't you grade out really well?
Hahahahahahahhahahahahaha.  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/1/2015 4:24 pm : link
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.
It's because some of you do not understand metrics  
David in LA : 9/1/2015 4:28 pm : link
no metric is perfect, it just gives you a reasonable snapshot.
The grades are subjective  
Pete in MD : 9/1/2015 4:31 pm : link
so they are obviously not perfect but they can't be total crap. They are a consensus of three different analysts watching game film. Even if they are just casual fans, it's fairly easy to determine if a player did well or not on an individual play. I agree that they often don't know what each player is supposed to do on each play but, looking at their grading system, the pluses and minuses come from stuff that stands out. If a WR runs a route and doesn't get thrown to, they just get a zero for that play.

BTW, I think the site is run by a Giants fan. Their example of a -2 play is Brett Favre throwing the INT in the 2007 NFC Championship and the +2 play example is Eli to Manningham in the SB.
I believe the Giants use them  
giants#1 : 9/1/2015 4:39 pm : link
for their snap counts (at minimum). No idea if they use their grades for anything. Hard to mess up snap counts.

As for the grades...it's preseason and Jerry in particular was playing into the 4th quarter. So he was going against 2nd/3rd stringers for part of the time. While getting a positive grade in that situation is still good, it doesn't necessarily mean he'll shine against starters.

RE: RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
Joe in Cambridge : 9/1/2015 4:41 pm : link
In comment 12447372 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
several organizations, including the Giants, use it.
The Giants use the PFF grades on players? Is there any proof of this?
RE: RE: RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
Big Blue '56 : 9/1/2015 4:42 pm : link
In comment 12447481 Joe in Cambridge said:
Quote:
In comment 12447372 Matt in SGS said:


Quote:


several organizations, including the Giants, use it.

The Giants use the PFF grades on players? Is there any proof of this?


Joe, long time..How are you?
RE: Hahahahahahahhahahahahaha.  
Ira : 9/1/2015 4:42 pm : link
In comment 12447435 Dave in Hoboken said:
Quote:
Hahahahahahahahahahahaha.


That sums it up.
Bobby Hart  
Lowell : 9/1/2015 4:52 pm : link
looked good pass blocking against Babin. Hart has pretty good feet and has some agility. Babin tried a spinner off an outside rush and Hart stayed with him. A young guy worth keeping around.
RE: RE: RE: RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
Joe in Cambridge : 9/1/2015 4:53 pm : link
In comment 12447487 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Joe, long time..How are you?
Hey BB56, pretty good. Dropped a ton of weight. And now that football is back, I couldn't possibly complain... at least not for a couple more weeks.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
Big Blue '56 : 9/1/2015 4:54 pm : link
In comment 12447519 Joe in Cambridge said:
Quote:
In comment 12447487 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


Joe, long time..How are you?

Hey BB56, pretty good. Dropped a ton of weight. And now that football is back, I couldn't possibly complain... at least not for a couple more weeks.


Good stuff..
I remember a play by Hart  
Gman11 : 9/1/2015 5:04 pm : link
against Babin. They were showing a replay where the guard got beat, but Hart stood his ground and blocked effectively. Now Babin isn't exactly a pro bowler, but he isn't the UDFA signed as camp fodder either. He's done some good things in this league and Hart looked pretty decent against him.
That grade is way off  
madgiantscow009 : 9/1/2015 5:14 pm : link
I had him at (+28.3). Total domination.
I think I read from one of the beats...  
sb from NYT Forum : 9/1/2015 5:14 pm : link
...that the Giants use PFF to help analyze FAs and Schwartz's high ranking after the 2013 season was one of the reasons they targeted him.
RE: RE: RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
BigBlueinChicago : 9/1/2015 5:18 pm : link
In comment 12447481 Joe in Cambridge said:
Quote:
In comment 12447372 Matt in SGS said:


Quote:


several organizations, including the Giants, use it.

The Giants use the PFF grades on players? Is there any proof of this?


As of January 2015, 13 of the 32 NFL teams (40%) were clients of PFF (including 7 of the teams who were in the playoffs), so money is exchanging hands. It is likely the number may have gone up in the last 8 months as they have only gained more footing and not less.

To me, the chances are very possible that they are based on the math.

For anyone to than say they are crap is to essentially say that all of the teams are being duped by these guys and having their money stolen. Clearly enough teams seem to find their work useful enough to contract with them.
RE: RE: RE: RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
Big Blue '56 : 9/1/2015 5:22 pm : link
In comment 12447568 BigBlueinChicago said:
Quote:
In comment 12447481 Joe in Cambridge said:


Quote:


In comment 12447372 Matt in SGS said:


Quote:


several organizations, including the Giants, use it.

The Giants use the PFF grades on players? Is there any proof of this?



As of January 2015, 13 of the 32 NFL teams (40%) were clients of PFF (including 7 of the teams who were in the playoffs), so money is exchanging hands. It is likely the number may have gone up in the last 8 months as they have only gained more footing and not less.

To me, the chances are very possible that they are based on the math.

For anyone to than say they are crap is to essentially say that all of the teams are being duped by these guys and having their money stolen. Clearly enough teams seem to find their work useful enough to contract with them.


Why would that surprise you? Many on here believe the Giants FO do not know what they're doing..That they're crap..:)
doesn't know  
Big Blue '56 : 9/1/2015 5:23 pm : link
.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: PFF is crap when it comes to their grades  
BigBlueinChicago : 9/1/2015 6:19 pm : link
In comment 12447579 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Why would that surprise you? Many on here believe the Giants FO do not know what they're doing..That they're crap..:)


Lol. You got a point there BB.
Why all the hate for JERRY.  
OldPolack : 9/1/2015 6:48 pm : link
The BullShit case presented by the Czar of football?

As a teen I played JV in the Bronx/Manhattan football league.
The New York Eagles were 70% minority and the needling was part of the game.
Players would joke about who is darker, whose mother came from the high-ass tribes of Africa
The hate for Jerry by BBI is bullshit.
He started every game last year because they could not find a better lineman.
Put the hate on Reese and TC for not addressing the offensive line.

The Fins lost 3 linemen because of the scandal.
Look at the Fins running game now.

PFF 'rankings' are a joke  
Torrag : 9/1/2015 7:08 pm : link
You know how many man hours it would take to watch every player on every snap and arrive at a grade? The whole thing is a bill of goods.
Is it  
BigBlueJ : 9/1/2015 7:33 pm : link
because Jerry stayed in against second tier players?
Matt  
KWALL2 : 9/1/2015 7:37 pm : link
No NFL team uses the grades from PFF. I guarantee you that.

At one point some may have used it for stats such as formations and player counts. But they sure as hell are not using it to grade players.
The PFF grades  
chuckydee9 : 9/2/2015 7:11 am : link
are based on the number of plays... the higher the number of plays the higher the score unless you do something bad.... Due to the sample size and the lack of actually competing for a full game the numbers are way off... but if you look at their grades for the season as a whole... they are about as good as any other stat that can be used across the board.
If the Giants use PFF then that explains why they have fielded such  
Curtis in VA : 9/2/2015 7:20 am : link
a putrid football team the past few years.
I agree grades don't mean anything, it,s how dominant  
Rich Houston-NYG-WR-1971 : 9/2/2015 7:42 am : link
The player is
what Eric said. The guy is just weak.  
Victor in CT : 9/2/2015 8:12 am : link
Simply not sustaining is good for him. When the real shooting starts he will get blown up and pushed into the backfield like last year.
what Eric said. The guy is just weak.  
Victor in CT : 9/2/2015 8:13 am : link
Simply not sustaining is good for him. When the real shooting starts he will get blown up and pushed into the backfield like last year.
RE: Matt  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/2/2015 8:27 am : link
In comment 12447751 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
No NFL team uses the grades from PFF. I guarantee you that.

At one point some may have used it for stats such as formations and player counts. But they sure as hell are not using it to grade players.


May want to scale back on the guarantee.

http://mmqb.si.com/2015/01/25/pro-football-focus-nfl-neil-hornsby-cris-collinsworth-analytics

“One of the things that one NFL team wants us to collect is if a defender is blocked before he makes contact,” Elsayed says. “There are lots of little bits of information that might seem very useless. But NFL teams just love them, and think they’re indicative of performance.”

DETROIT — A day after the conference championship games, Gunther Cunningham is sitting at his desk at the Lions’ headquarters. It’s been two weeks since Detroit lost to the Cowboys in the wild-card round, but Cunningham, a senior coaching assistant, is still dissecting the game via Pro Football Focus.
Cunningham is speaking over the phone to The MMQB, but he sends a picture of his oversized computer screens, on which he’s using PFF’s play analysis tool to sort defensive plays based on the Cowboys’ offensive formations.
A self-described “oddball” when it comes to stats and analytics, Cunningham, 68, first got a computer in 1991 to help him explore on-field tendencies when he was the Los Angeles Raiders’ linebackers coach. He started using Pro Football Focus three years ago as the Lions’ defensive coordinator; he found out about it from his friend Jon Dykema, who is staff counsel for Detroit and works with the team president on player contracts.


It's worth reading.
To add  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/2/2015 8:29 am : link
“What really impressed me is the fact that 13 NFL teams have contracted with Pro Football Focus for their data,” Collinsworth told The MMQB last August, after becoming a business partner. “I have been around the NFL for over 30 years, I know how hard it is to get behind the wall of those teams. And they’ve got 13 teams to trust their data. That’s huge.”
If these are the grades...  
silverfox : 9/2/2015 9:25 am : link
...sounds like we need some new teachers.
Where does it say an NFL  
KWALL2 : 9/2/2015 9:59 am : link
Team uses the grades? I'll answer "it doesn't"

He used it to gather data on player formations. He didn't use the PFF player grades.

Thanks for trying to clear it up.

My guarantee sticks. No NFL team uses the PFF grades for anything.
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