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Andre Williams Preseason

Essex : 9/4/2015 8:07 am
I said this on the game thread and I will say it now, I am very disappointed in his progression. While I realize it is the preseason, he has looked awful. He is averaging 2.6 YPC and if you take away his one 11 yard run, it is a putrid 2 YPC. Now, I am not calling for him to be cut, but I am much more intrigued by Darkwa than I am Williams. We keep hearing about how he has improved his catching ability, he had one catch in the preseason. Hopefully, I am proven wrong and he becomes a solid contributor, but at this point I am concerned.
Williams  
Marty866b : 9/4/2015 8:12 am : link
The OP is spot on. Williams looks slow off the snap and has no quick change of direction and has more carries fro negative or no yardage then any other back we have. Darkwa is the better player.
he has no vision  
area junc : 9/4/2015 8:15 am : link
i see that he's frustrated he takes shots every play because he doesnt see them coming or cant get out of the way
Couple thoughts  
Fort Mill Mike : 9/4/2015 8:17 am : link
1. It seemed toward the end of last season the Williams is one of those RBs who needs a cluster of carries to get going. He also seemed to finish strong late in the game last year.

2. Except for one apparently difficult pass he couldn't bring in last night, his receiving ability has looked good this preseason.

That said, it would be a shame not to be able to keep Darkwa on the roster too
Doesn't matter..  
Big Blue '56 : 9/4/2015 8:25 am : link
Let's see how he progresses when he has a regular OL taking all the snaps..

What RB has looked particularly good?

Now they play for real
RE: Doesn't matter..  
Essex : 9/4/2015 8:28 am : link
In comment 12452859 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
Let's see how he progresses when he has a regular OL taking all the snaps..

What RB has looked particularly good?

Now they play for real


I know it is not comparing apples to apples because at the time of the game they play, but both Darkwa and Hunt have looked better. Jennings, while not going crazy in the preseason, has averaged over a yard more per carry.
Really  
mdthedream : 9/4/2015 8:30 am : link
the only thing that matters can he carry it in on short yardage situations and for TDs. That is where I think he fits. In today's offenses I don't see him as a every down back.
RE: RE: Doesn't matter..  
Big Blue '56 : 9/4/2015 8:31 am : link
In comment 12452867 Essex said:
Quote:
In comment 12452859 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


Let's see how he progresses when he has a regular OL taking all the snaps..

What RB has looked particularly good?

Now they play for real



I know it is not comparing apples to apples because at the time of the game they play, but both Darkwa and Hunt have looked better. Jennings, while not going crazy in the preseason, has averaged over a yard more per carry.


My point is, let's see how he does this year when the bullets start flying..We'll get a much more definitive read at that time, imo..
check out the  
area junc : 9/4/2015 8:31 am : link
draw after Flowers facemask penalty. he gets drilled square in the chops at the LOS on a play that should've gained 20 yards.
that isnt the kind of mistake u can correct in the film room
Williams is a bigger  
jvm52106 : 9/4/2015 8:34 am : link
and I think less talented Lewis Tillman.
I'm not anti-Williams at all....  
penkap75 : 9/4/2015 8:35 am : link
But looking at him last and this preseason, he has no vision. Smashes right into the back of his linemen. And despite his impressive size/build, it doesnt seem defenders have any trouble bringing him down. Part of it is because he is always trying to do some kind of spin move which makes him very easy to tackle. Darkwa seems like a much more natural runner, and catches better too.
If you takes away his stuffs, he averages 11 yds/carry  
WideRight : 9/4/2015 8:40 am : link
Yes that was sarcasm.

Williams is who he is, a good deisel truck in a funny car race. Making people miss isn't his specialty, but he plays his game well.

I also think he is a very good complement to Jennings and Vereen. He's a steady force who can take the pounding that those guys can't. Don't underestimate the value of that when Jennings and Vereen start having questionable nagging injuries at midseason.
RE: If you takes away his stuffs, he averages 11 yds/carry  
Big Blue '56 : 9/4/2015 8:57 am : link
In comment 12452893 WideRight said:
Quote:
Yes that was sarcasm.

Williams is who he is, a good deisel truck in a funny car race. Making people miss isn't his specialty, but he plays his game well.

I also think he is a very good complement to Jennings and Vereen. He's a steady force who can take the pounding that those guys can't. Don't underestimate the value of that when Jennings and Vereen start having questionable nagging injuries at midseason.


If things go well with our running game, he could be extra valuable in the 4th quarter, pounding the rock against a fatigued D..
I'm not faulting Williams but  
nicky43 : 9/4/2015 8:59 am : link
in the first three games I thought we got more production out of Hunt. Maybe because he was playing against 2nd and 3rd string players but man that guy is fast and has good vision. He was also patient to allow the holes to open, something Williams is still learning.

Also, if you took away Jacobs'  
Big Blue '56 : 9/4/2015 8:59 am : link
stuffs or tackles behind the line, he'd have averaged 18-20 yards per carry..:)
I think he'll do much better in the regular season  
ZogZerg : 9/4/2015 9:00 am : link
..
RE: I'm not faulting Williams but  
Big Blue '56 : 9/4/2015 9:01 am : link
In comment 12452936 nicky43 said:
Quote:
in the first three games I thought we got more production out of Hunt. Maybe because he was playing against 2nd and 3rd string players but man that guy is fast and has good vision. He was also patient to allow the holes to open, something Williams is still learning.


Also, Hunt and Darkwa are fighting for their professional lives..Williams is a lock for the 53..Some players give all they have in pre-season..Others don't until it really matters..Imo
How is he supposed to get anything going on 2 carries per game?  
Victor in CT : 9/4/2015 9:03 am : link
Many if not most backs need carries to find their rhythm, especially big backs. But I guess it was more important that bubble boy Orleans Darkwa got his reps. Just as is was more important that bubble boy Kuhn get reps instead of Bromley and Ellis.
RE: How is he supposed to get anything going on 2 carries per game?  
Big Blue '56 : 9/4/2015 9:04 am : link
In comment 12452953 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
Many if not most backs need carries to find their rhythm, especially big backs. But I guess it was more important that bubble boy Orleans Darkwa got his reps. Just as is was more important that bubble boy Kuhn get reps instead of Bromley and Ellis.


Accents the pre-season point very well..
I've heard Williams compared to Trent Richardson  
Tuckrule : 9/4/2015 9:11 am : link
But I'm holding out hope for Williams. All those yards in college and yards after contact has to mean something. He's been catching passes better this offseason according to reports. He's a big bruising back. Worse comes to worse he's our goaline back and I feel mac can make good use of him
I'm surprised by all the negativity  
g-baby : 9/4/2015 9:20 am : link
I saw a number of improvements in his game this preseason, including his vision. Last night he made a cut behind the LOS away from the designed hole to gain 4-5 yards on a run. That's something he would have NEVER done last season.

I've also been pleased with his exhibiting more patience and better acceleration. He seems to be taking the mantra of "slow to the hole, fast through the hole" to heart.

I think we'll see some more juice from him come the regular season when he can get in a rhythm behind an offensive line w/consistent personnel.
The line hasn't opened up holes for any runners  
jeff57 : 9/4/2015 9:22 am : link
Williams isn't the problem, the line is.
yeah it's preseason and all that  
mfsd : 9/4/2015 9:27 am : link
but it's still reasonable to question Williams vision...he hasn't had a lot of room, but he's not shown he's the kind of back who figures out a way to squirt/slither/weave through traffic for 3-4 yards when there isn't much there

I'm a little more surprised we kept Harper over Hunt  
USAF NYG Fan : 9/4/2015 9:28 am : link
I thought Hunt was having a better pre-season. Maybe they thought it would make it easier to get him to the practice squad?

Williams will be fine. I still view him as able to get the tough yards. I think there is potential to surprise a defense with him on a wheel route because few would expect him as a receiver.

I like Jennings but we can't ignore his injury history. Just unlucky I guess. I think they may keep 5 backs total. We should probably go short on TEs to compensate since there is nothing special there anyway.
RE: yeah it's preseason and all that  
mfsd : 9/4/2015 9:28 am : link
In comment 12452994 mfsd said:
Quote:
but it's still reasonable to question Williams vision...he hasn't had a lot of room, but he's not shown he's the kind of back who figures out a way to squirt/slither/weave through traffic for 3-4 yards when there isn't much there


Now I should say, I missed 2/3rds of last night's game, so may have missed some improvement from him
RE: he has no vision  
Capt. Don : 9/4/2015 9:36 am : link
In comment 12452847 area junc said:
Quote:
i see that he's frustrated he takes shots every play because he doesnt see them coming or cant get out of the way


Vision is a problem for him and it seems to me that vision on the field is something that you have or you dont.
This is basically,  
Doomster : 9/4/2015 9:45 am : link
RB by committee.....there is no real starting RB on this team that can carry the load.....
We've often done RB by committee.  
CT Charlie : 9/4/2015 11:14 am : link
It keeps the D guessing and it keeps the RB's fresh. It would help to have a stronger line or an all-pro RB, but that's not happening.
Our backfield  
mattlawson : 9/4/2015 12:36 pm : link
Has looked sluggish all preseason. I clicked over the cowboys last night after our game ended and it was like watching running plays on fast-forward by comparison
hes a bruises  
NYG4246 : 9/4/2015 12:44 pm : link
hes not gonna break long runs, he needs to pound the ball to get his yards. his yards will come late in games. dont sweat pre-season carries my fiend
Williams is . . . .  
TC : 9/4/2015 12:52 pm : link
big, strong and faster than most give him credit for. He looks like a brute. But his instincts are those of a finesse back, and that's how he continues to play the game. His vision isn't very good, he can't make the tiny adjustments in body angle and motion, and sync those up with his power to optimize the tools he DOES have.

In college he was playing against smaller, less powerful opponents where his size and strength could dominate, but many of his yards came from long gainers where he was able to find a hole in the defense, and accelerate through it. It's not working in the NFL. When he makes contact, most often you can see him stop and think. He literally goes limp, and gets taken down very easily in a way that the much smaller Darkwa never is.

In brief he usually doesn't finish runs. I expect him to continue to play, to have the occasional long gainer, and maybe even a big game or two, but I also see him continuing to frustrate those who watch and coach him.
Running Game  
Rong5611 : 9/4/2015 1:06 pm : link
As Jennings goes, so goes the running game. Clearly the best runner we have.

We'll have to see, but based on the pre-season Williams hasn't really improved that much vs. last year, I think.
There's no blocking for any RB  
arniefez : 9/4/2015 2:31 pm : link
but he's certainly nothing special. Maybe HH if injured they could play him at FB
He could have had a better preseason...  
The Tempest : 9/4/2015 2:56 pm : link
and the offense as well. I'm not concerned about Williams yet since he will make the roster simply for being a big guy suited for short yardage plays. Hopefully he develops into something more but the Giants are looking much better on paper at RB with the addition of Vereen in the offseason.
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