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Our rbs have no breakaway speed

Bleedblue10 : 9/25/2015 12:03 pm
Jennings in particular looks really slow to me(idk maybe I'm wrong) not that our run blocking is any good but there were a few runs last night that a speedy back would have had a shot to go to the house.
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Nick  
Old Dirty Beckham : 9/25/2015 12:37 pm : link
Williams had 14 carries for 29 yards. What 4-5 yard are you talking about?
Jennings might be a rare guy who  
giants#1 : 9/25/2015 12:41 pm : link
plays out his entire contract. He's nothing special and I'm sure they'll look to upgrade the spot in the offseason, but he's on a relatively cheap deal and doesn't have any huge roster bonuses coming up. So no huge cap savings from cutting him. Hopefully Williams can step up and force Jennings into the 3rd RB role.
RE: We dont have good running backs  
rickrossa : 9/25/2015 12:44 pm : link
In comment 12508377 Old Dirty Beckham said:
Quote:
Curious how Vereen goes from being such a big part of the offense to having zero catches.


Pretty simple...different team...different scheme. our WR's caught 14 passes but I would like to see him touch the ball more consistantly
We're deficient here  
giantgiantfan : 9/25/2015 12:47 pm : link
for sure and have been since Bradshaw. Vereen is actually pretty quick though, you could see that in week 1 or 2 when the right side of the line completely collapsed and he was able to cut back and spin to the left side. Giants will need to address this, but bigger problems exist.

For now I can say that I trust Williams to not put the ball on the ground and generally the same with Jennings. I also trust Vereen to catch passes.
You take away  
Doomster : 9/25/2015 12:49 pm : link
Each guy's long run(9, 11 and 5), and they averaged 2 yards per carry....the week before, 1.5.....nothing to write home about....

I remember in the Dallas game where Jennings had two big holes, thinking, Wilson would have taken both of them to the house.....perchance to dream....
I am not worried about the homerun  
Lionhart28 : 9/25/2015 12:53 pm : link
as much as a rb that can accelerate and actually hit the hole more quickly. Jennings is brutal to watch. Some of these 2 and 3 yard gains could be 8 and 10 yarders with a back who accelerates better.
RE: We dont have good running backs  
81_Great_Dane : 9/25/2015 12:59 pm : link
In comment 12508377 Old Dirty Beckham said:
Quote:
Curious how Vereen goes from being such a big part of the offense to having zero catches.
After last week, I expect Washington's defensive game plan focused on taking away Vereen and containing Beckum. Like: "Make 'em go to Randle, make 'em go to Donnell." Great plan, except Randle woke up. Donnell had a couple of good plays IIRC but if last night's performance is the best they can get out of him, any D can live with that.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/25/2015 1:35 pm : link
How many NFL running backs have breakaway speed?
Where is all this lovefest  
chuckydee9 : 9/25/2015 1:43 pm : link
for Wilson coming from? If we had Wilson he would be warming the bench with his great speed... He couldn't pass block to save his life.. When he was back there, defense knew we were running, they'd stack the line and there was no way he would be able to pass protect for our receivers to get deep... Speed isn't everything... Wilson lacked everything but speed.. I know our RBs are not like Jamal Charles but they are good enough.. We need better blocking.. Give me someone who gets 4+ yards on most plays... then I can use Victor Cruz and OBJ as my homerun threat...
Redskins rookie Matt Jones has been impressive to start the season  
steve in ky : 9/25/2015 1:44 pm : link
He would have been a nice pick in the 3rd round.
Jennings and Williams seem to have  
RAIN : 9/25/2015 1:50 pm : link
regressed a bit. Jennings in particular seemed to be on a pitch count due to the short week. He had less of a burst than usual.

Williams.. I'm not really a fan. I like his power, but I'd rather have some vision to accompany that power. He doesn't really match this offense.

A guy that does. Raijon Neal.. practice squad .. raiders.

RE: You take away  
Tesla : 9/25/2015 2:07 pm : link
In comment 12508516 Doomster said:
Quote:
Each guy's long run(9, 11 and 5), and they averaged 2 yards per carry....the week before, 1.5.....nothing to write home about....

I remember in the Dallas game where Jennings had two big holes, thinking, Wilson would have taken both of them to the house.....perchance to dream....


Why just take away their longest run? How about taking away their top 5 runs and seeing how much they "really" averaged?

Along those lines their average was skewed by a lot of runs at the end of the game when Washington knew we were going to run.
RE: Nick  
Mason : 9/25/2015 2:08 pm : link
In comment 12508476 Old Dirty Beckham said:
Quote:
Williams had 14 carries for 29 yards. What 4-5 yard are you talking about?


He's talking about he has average 5 yards per carry.
RE: Unless counting Wilson  
Mike from SI : 9/25/2015 2:12 pm : link
In comment 12508410 USAF NYG Fan said:
Quote:
we haven't had that since Tiki. Count me among those that is fairly happy with the committee of RBs we have now.

Keep in mind the Redskins are a "keep everyone in front them" defense so it would be hard to get big yards even with a fast back.


Young Ahmad Bradshaw had breakaway speed....
Our RB's are fine  
Natek212 : 9/25/2015 2:28 pm : link
It's the run blocking that is not good.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/25/2015 2:49 pm : link
I'm more optimistic about our backs than most.
What a shame Wilson's career was cut short  
David in LA : 9/25/2015 2:58 pm : link
Imagine what this offense would look like with him and OBJ.
That's why we should have kept  
SHO'NUFF : 9/25/2015 3:05 pm : link
Akeem Hunt. Hopefully nobody grabs him before Week 6.
Disagree. When Williams has had room to run he makes big yards,  
Victor in CT : 9/25/2015 3:26 pm : link
They rarely have a big hole to run through.
RE: We dont have good running backs  
djstat : 9/25/2015 3:35 pm : link
In comment 12508377 Old Dirty Beckham said:
Quote:
Curious how Vereen goes from being such a big part of the offense to having zero catches.


Cause he blocked and WR were open...23/32 a few less drops and eli is 26/32...learn some football
RE: RE: Unless counting Wilson  
Victor in CT : 9/25/2015 3:45 pm : link
In comment 12508746 Mike from SI said:
Quote:
In comment 12508410 USAF NYG Fan said:


Quote:


we haven't had that since Tiki. Count me among those that is fairly happy with the committee of RBs we have now.

Keep in mind the Redskins are a "keep everyone in front them" defense so it would be hard to get big yards even with a fast back.



Young Ahmad Bradshaw had breakaway speed....


So did Jacobs. At 270 lbs that was frightening to see
Jennings' days are numbered.  
Tom in NY : 9/25/2015 3:53 pm : link
He's a good veteran presence, but his inability to show any short area quickness negate his opportunity to gain positive yards on anything other than a wide open hole.

I expect the 3 other backs to continuously get more opportunities as the season progresses, and Jennings to be waived post-season.

They seem to have 2 "change of pace" backs in Williams and Vereen, an uncertainty in Darkwa, and a former #2 on his last legs in Jennings.

Good thing is the Jennings plays, and enjoys special teams.
Last year around this time Jennings was at the top of the league  
Ten Ton Hammer : 9/25/2015 3:54 pm : link
in rushing before he got hurt

I don't really think he lost anything. The next "wide open hole" they get will be the first.
Jennings looked plenty fast last year  
SHO'NUFF : 9/25/2015 4:24 pm : link
when he broke out for that 70-80 yard run in the preseason.
Can anybody be happy  
Randy in CT : 9/25/2015 4:26 pm : link
after a W?
A l,ot of people..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 9/25/2015 4:51 pm : link
were gushing about Morris and Jones leading up to the game. IMO, our RB's played better.

But - because they are our RB's they must suck dick.
RE: Can anybody be happy  
Les in TO : 9/25/2015 4:52 pm : link
In comment 12509055 Randy in CT said:
Quote:
after a W?
it's as if people expect every game to be the same result as the 2000 mfc chapsionship game - complete dominance in all three phases. the negative threads outweigh the positive ones like 3:1
RE: RE: Can anybody be happy  
Randy in CT : 9/25/2015 4:54 pm : link
In comment 12509095 Les in TO said:
Quote:
In comment 12509055 Randy in CT said:


Quote:


after a W?

it's as if people expect every game to be the same result as the 2000 mfc chapsionship game - complete dominance in all three phases. the negative threads outweigh the positive ones like 3:1
Yep. What we needed was a W and for us to show more signs of life. TC had a saying along the lines of a work in progress. I agree.
RE: They got tripped up, not caught from behind last night  
USAF NYG Fan : 9/25/2015 4:59 pm : link
In comment 12508417 Moondawg said:
Quote:
and tiki did not have "breakaway speed" he had unbelievable quickness, but he got caught from behind all the time.

You're right. I was confusing quickness with top speed. Good call. I guess Da'Rel Scott had it but that's all he had. Bradshaw was very quick but never fast. Jacobs, well he was the juggernaut.

So I guess that makes my point even more then. We've never really had that as far back as I can remember. I don't think I can even name very many bacsk in the league now that have "top end speed". Those are all WRs and DBs now I guess.
I have a different opinion. Not a bug Williams after  
BlueLou : 9/25/2015 5:40 pm : link
Last year, but he looks quicker, faster, and more confident this year. He's running with a nice low pad level too.
Williams is exhibiting better patience and vision too.  
BlueLou : 9/25/2015 5:44 pm : link
He's plenty fast for a guy his size and build.
RE: They got tripped up, not caught from behind last night  
GeofromNJ : 9/25/2015 6:58 pm : link
In comment 12508417 Moondawg said:
Quote:
and tiki did not have "breakaway speed" he had unbelievable quickness, but he got caught from behind all the time.
Tiki didn't get caught from "all the time". He often outran the pursuit. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASx7TGjzEyI
RE: RE: Williams does not have a quick first step.  
GeofromNJ : 9/25/2015 7:03 pm : link
In comment 12508440 giants#1 said:
Quote:
William's first step is fine. It's his vision/cutback ability that is lacking.
I agree totally. He reminds me of Ron Dayne in that he always seems to running into a brick wall. He's more powerful than Dayne, and maybe a little quicker off the mark. But not any more elusive.
RE: RE: They got tripped up, not caught from behind last night  
Moondawg : 9/25/2015 7:17 pm : link
In comment 12509227 GeofromNJ said:
Quote:
In comment 12508417 Moondawg said:


Quote:


and tiki did not have "breakaway speed" he had unbelievable quickness, but he got caught from behind all the time.

Tiki didn't get caught from "all the time". He often outran the pursuit. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASx7TGjzEyI


Good highlights. Now find the highlights where he gets caught from behind more than half the time.
Running game  
Marty866b : 9/25/2015 9:32 pm : link
Ours is too easy to defend. There is no deception in our running plays and the defense does not have to defend the edges. EVERYTHING is run inside due to lack of speed in the backfield. We have more running plays for negative yardage then anyone and that I am just guessing on. I'd like to see Darkwa get a try. How hurt is he?
RB  
stretch234 : 9/26/2015 7:27 am : link
We had the speed back in Wilson until he broke his neck

It is not just as simple as finding a speed guy. You need a guy that can actually play

Wilson would be awesome in this offense
RE: Redskins rookie Matt Jones has been impressive to start the season  
HomerJones45 : 9/26/2015 8:18 am : link
In comment 12508663 steve in ky said:
Quote:
He would have been a nice pick in the 3rd round.
Yeah, he looked very athletic fumbling.
So, to some up  
HomerJones45 : 9/26/2015 8:27 am : link
you guys want a powerful, elusive, fast runner who can block and catch.

Unfortunately, Jim Brown and Earl Campbell both retired some years back. In the meantime, you will need to settle on some other mix of characteristics.

And some of you are unaccustomed to the NFL where players have a role. Each of our RB have a role- Williams is the horse, Vereen is the pass catching 3rd and long back and Jennings does a little bit of both. All are expected to pass block and hang on to the ball.

Of course Darkwa is the most popular running back- he hasn't played.
They dont need breakaway speed. They just need a running lane.  
Curtis in VA : 9/26/2015 8:57 am : link
Let me know when our makeshift OL and TE provide that
RE: RE: Redskins rookie Matt Jones has been impressive to start the season  
steve in ky : 9/26/2015 9:06 am : link
In comment 12509643 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
In comment 12508663 steve in ky said:


Quote:


He would have been a nice pick in the 3rd round.

Yeah, he looked very athletic fumbling.


LOL and I'm sure glad he did and I also know you're smart enough to know that was a dumb reply to whether or not he has had an impressive start to his rookie season.
RBs don't need breakaway speed and most don't have it anyway  
PatersonPlank : 9/26/2015 9:08 am : link
Emmit Smith for example. Chris Johnson does and he is a backup. Besides how often would they use it? What is more important is quickness and breaking tackles. Besides speed doesn't help you if there are no holes, elusiveness and quickness does (ala Barry Sanders). Our RB's are not the problem.
RE: Nick  
hitdog42 : 9/26/2015 9:52 am : link
In comment 12508476 Old Dirty Beckham said:
Quote:
Williams had 14 carries for 29 yards. What 4-5 yard are you talking about?


That is correct
RE: I'd be shocked  
hitdog42 : 9/26/2015 9:52 am : link
In comment 12508449 Old Dirty Beckham said:
Quote:
If Jennings was on the Giants next year.

I remember reading that the team loved Abdullah and would have selected him in the third rd had he made it there.


Whoops meant to reply to this one

That is correct on Abdullah
Williams got his clock  
area junc : 9/26/2015 10:16 am : link
Cleaned in ridiculous fashion a few times again because he has no idea what's coming at him
We missed breaking a long one on about 3 different occasions.  
arcarsenal : 9/26/2015 10:19 am : link
And it wasn't really because of lack of speed. It was because they got tripped up right before they hit daylight.
Darkwa will get his chance soon.  
chops : 9/26/2015 4:58 pm : link
.
RE: RE: They got tripped up, not caught from behind last night  
Mike from SI : 9/26/2015 5:44 pm : link
In comment 12509101 USAF NYG Fan said:
Quote:
In comment 12508417 Moondawg said:


Quote:


and tiki did not have "breakaway speed" he had unbelievable quickness, but he got caught from behind all the time.


You're right. I was confusing quickness with top speed. Good call. I guess Da'Rel Scott had it but that's all he had. Bradshaw was very quick but never fast. Jacobs, well he was the juggernaut.

So I guess that makes my point even more then. We've never really had that as far back as I can remember. I don't think I can even name very many bacsk in the league now that have "top end speed". Those are all WRs and DBs now I guess.


This is false. Bradshaw absolutely was fast in his first few years. Do you not remember the Buffalo game in '07?
Yeah Bradshaw was plenty fast in pads, he just wasn't a blazer  
BlueLou : 9/28/2015 2:00 pm : link
in the underwear Olympics AKA the NFL combine, running a 4.55 there.

He did post an excellent 20 yard shuttle time at 4.09, and an elite 3 cone at 6.70...

Andre Williams in underwear at the combine ran 4.56, which was not good enough to be a top performer among RBs, and his 3 cone was a rather dismal 7.27, which perhaps explains the jitterbug difference that Bradshaw possessed that Williams doesn't have.
On the flip side, Williams posted "top performer" #s in his broad jump, short shuttle, and long shuttle at the combine and had a 4" better vertical jump than AB (38" vs 34".)

Williams has decent enough "breakaway" speed IMO. It's his vision, more than anything else, that's questionable. And thus far this year he looks to be improving.

I gave him heck last year for lack of vision, so I hope what I am seeing now is a real improvement.

Some data and food for thought linked re speed:

Williams' Combine performance:

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/andre-williams?
id=2543565

Bradshaw's combine data:

http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/andre-williams?id=2543565
Wake Up Call: Notable 40 Times - ( New Window )
RE: RE: RE: Unless counting Wilson  
81_Great_Dane : 9/29/2015 1:51 am : link
In comment 12508987 Victor in CT said:
Quote:
IYoung Ahmad Bradshaw had breakaway speed....



So did Jacobs. At 270 lbs that was frightening to see
Y'know, Jacobs was pretty darn fast, but he wasn't really a threat to score from anywhere on the field, because DBs were able to catch him from behind. At his best he'd be good for one or two runs a game of around 30-40 yards, but he wasn't fast enough to go much longer than that.

Also, he didn't have great balance, so he wouldn't bounce off tacklers and continue running. He could run over tacklers sometimes and get another 5 yards on his way to the ground, but he wouldn't keep his feet and go for another 25. Tacklers would bounce off him sometimes, but he would fall down, too. If he'd had better balance and more ability to shed tacklers, he'd have been more of a home run threat, with or without breakaway speed.
WILSON WOULD BE NICE  
Sonic Youth : 9/29/2015 1:57 am : link
the earlier thread was ridiculed but was 100% valid.

give this offense wilson, and we are one of the best in the league.
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