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No James Jones thread?

Mike in Long Beach : 9/29/2015 12:17 am
7 catches, 139 yards and a TD tonight...

On pace for: 64 catches, 1168 yards, 21 TDs.

I normally don't hop on these type of bandwagons, but everyone on this board knew it was a bad move the second Jones was cut. It's kinda depressing to see the numbers he put up tonight.

I saw his comments on the Giants organization. The guy's all class. Good for him, but I wish he was still on our team.
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Argument could be made if Jones was here instead of Parker  
micky : 9/29/2015 9:26 am : link
for that Atlanta drop game, may have most likely had 1 more win with other factors included.

But Jones wanted to be in GB instead as it turned out.
RE: ...  
ryanmkeane : 9/29/2015 9:26 am : link
In comment 12513816 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Who cares if he wanted to be here or not? If had played for Parker - like he should have - we might be 2-1 or 3-0.

Would suck if we finish one game out of the NFC East title.


Eric I agree with most of your takes but this one is quite amateur hour if you ask me. Finishing 1 game out because we didn't keep James Jones? How many injuries, plays throughout the season, etc happen in order for a team to lose out on the playoff race? You guys need to let this go and move on.
Let's just keep in mind for 1 second  
ryanmkeane : 9/29/2015 9:27 am : link
that even without James Jones, we were up by 3 points with 1st and goal at the 4 with under 2 minutes left. Without James Jones, we were up 10 points in the 4th quarter against Atlanta. You guys need a reality check.
Saying we would be 3-0  
ryanmkeane : 9/29/2015 9:28 am : link
with James Jones is complete and utter BS, and it's just a reason for some BBIers to place blame on the losses - when in reality it was coaching and Eli.
ryanmkeane  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/29/2015 9:30 am : link
Not so sure...all five of those dropped passes were huge.
RE: ryanmkeane  
ryanmkeane : 9/29/2015 9:30 am : link
In comment 12513924 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Not so sure...all five of those dropped passes were huge.

Agreed, huge drops for sure. But the overall arch of the game told a different story. We had both games won, and lost them, not necessarily because of those drops.
ryanmkeane  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/29/2015 9:34 am : link
Sure, there were bigger issues in both games...but both games could have also changed on the drops. Probably a dozen things in each game had to go wrong for the Giants.
the  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/29/2015 9:34 am : link
odds are that even if James had stuck with the Giants, the coaching staff probably would have stupidly had Parker playing over him. But we'll never know.
RE: Once Cruz comes back  
micky : 9/29/2015 9:36 am : link
In comment 12513869 blueblood said:
Quote:
Jones would have been a 4th receiver. Much Ado about nothing really..


he would've lite a fire under Randle for that 3rd slot wr. It would've been a positive. Keeping Randle on call.
RE: Does there have to be a thread every week?  
River Mike : 9/29/2015 9:39 am : link
In comment 12513684 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
.


Have to? No. But is there something wrong with a poster wanting to discuss the wisdom of front office moves? No. Every week? It depends. After a relevant event such as a 100yd game by the player in question? Sure.

RE: The crying over spilled milk even for a sports site is  
River Mike : 9/29/2015 9:42 am : link
In comment 12513803 Headhunter said:
Quote:
On another level. La'el Collins for 3 months now Jones. This is how you deal with "real" life? Just going on and on over something that happened? How much is too much whining? I guess I will find out. Move on with your lives and try to live in the present, just some unsolicited advice that will be ignored I'm sure


Good idea, move on. Others would like to discuss it.
Mike,  
Big Blue '56 : 9/29/2015 9:42 am : link
in my case you're preaching to the choir..:)
RE: I wonder exactly who the person was  
jcn56 : 9/29/2015 9:43 am : link
In comment 12513866 mrvax said:
Quote:
that made the decision to cut Jones. Not to berate the bastid, I'd just like to know what he was thinking and how did he evaluate his WR's.


I'd have a hard time believing this wasn't largely Coughlin. Not just because I think he's the one who comes up with the cuts (albeit having to vet them through the rest of the FO first), but in particular because this is a WR. Coughlin has always been credited for his work and influence on the WRs, I'd have a hard time accepting that Parker was somehow forced on him over Jones.
RE: Saying we would be 3-0  
River Mike : 9/29/2015 9:47 am : link
In comment 12513920 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
with James Jones is complete and utter BS, and it's just a reason for some BBIers to place blame on the losses - when in reality it was coaching and Eli.


This always amazes me. A dozen things go wrong that could have changed the course of a game, and posters here latch on to their pet theories on which ones actually did the deed and dismiss anyone who suggests that the other ones were important and could also have changed the game. Its SOP on BBI
Well,  
Doomster : 9/29/2015 9:48 am : link
It would not be the first time a player was cut from one team and went on to have success on another.


It's not just that...it's the fact that we knew we weren't going to have Cruz at the start of the season....we still don't know if we will have him for the next game, and how many weeks will it take before he becomes a factor in the games? Randle wasn't playing in preseason, and Parker did nothing in preseason, to make himself stand out...

I have no idea of what was going on in practice.....did Parker look that good or was he dropping balls then?

Once again, the Giants denied Eli a weapon he could have used in the first two games....who is to say if Jones had a couple good games, that Randle wouldn't be starting? And with some competition in front of him, maybe it would have lit a fire under his arse?

And while Randle had a good last game, he still doesn't look right out there....when your knees are bad you don't practice hard, or train hard.....he still looks slow out there......I feel like games like the last one may be far and few between....

As for Reese, he knew the Packers were desperate for a receiver....could have easily received a draft pick for him....
...  
christian : 9/29/2015 9:53 am : link
It's awfully disappointing the GM put Jones' supposed desire for more snaps over what was best for the team. RR has a chronic condition and Cruz is coming off surgery and a major injury.

The assumption Jones would end up 4th on the chart is unfounded. We play tons of 3 WR sets, the XY & Z are "first" on the chart, and it's painfully obvious Randal was not 100% the first two weeks. Add Macadoo's comments about WRs knowing all the routes and it's pretty damn safe to assume cutting Jones led to at least one loss.

We aren't running a charity, we're running a football team. This was a bad call anyway you slice it.
RE: The crying over spilled milk even for a sports site is  
jeff57 : 9/29/2015 9:56 am : link
In comment 12513803 Headhunter said:
Quote:
On another level. La'el Collins for 3 months now Jones. This is how you deal with "real" life? Just going on and on over something that happened? How much is too much whining? I guess I will find out. Move on with your lives and try to live in the present, just some unsolicited advice that will be ignored I'm sure


And deservedly so.
RE: I wonder exactly who the person was  
jeff57 : 9/29/2015 9:57 am : link
In comment 12513866 mrvax said:
Quote:
that made the decision to cut Jones. Not to berate the bastid, I'd just like to know what he was thinking and how did he evaluate his WR's.


Most likely the coaches.
RE: RE: I wonder exactly who the person was  
Milton : 9/29/2015 10:00 am : link
In comment 12513961 jcn56 said:
Quote:
In comment 12513866 mrvax said:


Quote:


that made the decision to cut Jones. Not to berate the bastid, I'd just like to know what he was thinking and how did he evaluate his WR's.



I'd have a hard time believing this wasn't largely Coughlin. Not just because I think he's the one who comes up with the cuts (albeit having to vet them through the rest of the FO first), but in particular because this is a WR. Coughlin has always been credited for his work and influence on the WRs, I'd have a hard time accepting that Parker was somehow forced on him over Jones.
Yeah, when it comes to minimum-salaried players like Jones and Parker, neither of whom were a draft pick, it's gotta be the head coach who makes the call, not the GM.
p.s.-- How many of you remember when George Young kept Stan White over Tommy Maddox against the wishes of Dan Reeves?
Let's just hope that Cruz can play and doesn't have issues  
nyynyg : 9/29/2015 10:13 am : link
if he does, than the Jones move reaches a stratospheric level of poor decision making. It's bad already. If Cruz can play and well, we are in good shape and we are only discussing the impact Jones could have had in games 1 & 2 (which is real).
99.9% sure Jones  
Big Blue '56 : 9/29/2015 10:14 am : link
was a TC cut..Reese has little to no say over who stays or goes re cuts..Imo
Now if it was another coach, the GM could conceivably  
Big Blue '56 : 9/29/2015 10:16 am : link
step in, but that's not their job. Their job is getting and signing players..The HC determines who makes his squad or doesn't..
Still not as bad as when they let Ed McCaffery go.  
micky : 9/29/2015 10:16 am : link
.
The End  
shyster : 9/29/2015 10:21 am : link
Watching NFL Network just now and the fantasy guy says "If you had to choose between starting Calvin Johnson and James Jones, it would be very close."

I don't know what Jones' chances were going into the Jets game but once the pick six happened I knew he was gone. Someone Must Be Blamed.
RE: ...  
Mike in ramapo college : 9/29/2015 10:30 am : link
In comment 12513816 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Who cares if he wanted to be here or not? If had played for Parker - like he should have - we might be 2-1 or 3-0.

Would suck if we finish one game out of the NFC East title.


Yeah, who gives a fuck what he wanted! It's not like he is a veteran who could have been very impressionable on a young receiving corps and could have soured the entire unit.

You really want a 4th string player (assumption was Cruz was not going to be out this long, nor that Randle's issues would continue to linger) that could cause that much contention? Really? Yes, he would have helped the team, if he was actually committed to it. He was not. This discussion is nauseating at this point.
There have been some reasonable posts here.  
Mike in Long Beach : 9/29/2015 10:49 am : link
The idea that Jones wanted to be cut I do think has some legs. He didn't outwardly come out and say it, but if the Giants thought the dropoff between Parker and Jones was negligible and Jones wanted a shot in Green Bay with Nelson gone, I think you can fairly argue there was some semblance of logic in place, especially considering Parker is younger.

But the whole "He'd only be our #4 WR so who cares" idea is ridiculous. The same people who bitch about the absurd amount of injuries this team has suffered really can't understand why a talented backup might be necessary for the Giants? He would've seen the field plenty. All it would take is Cruz's knee to flare up, Beckham's hamstring to get tweaked or Randle's arthritic knee to worsen.

The 4th receiver on this team has tremendous value. In fact, our former 4th WR (Parker) is probably the player most responsible for our first two losses. This isn't much ado about nothing. There have been tangible, obvious negative impacts as a result of this decision.
Mike in ramapo college  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/29/2015 10:52 am : link
Give me a break. He signed here voluntarily for a reason. He wasn't going to raise a stink because he wasn't back with Green Bay.
RE: Well,  
drkenneth : 9/29/2015 11:00 am : link
In comment 12513983 Doomster said:
Quote:
It would not be the first time a player was cut from one team and went on to have success on another.


It's not just that...it's the fact that we knew we weren't going to have Cruz at the start of the season....we still don't know if we will have him for the next game, and how many weeks will it take before he becomes a factor in the games? Randle wasn't playing in preseason, and Parker did nothing in preseason, to make himself stand out...

I have no idea of what was going on in practice.....did Parker look that good or was he dropping balls then?

Once again, the Giants denied Eli a weapon he could have used in the first two games....who is to say if Jones had a couple good games, that Randle wouldn't be starting? And with some competition in front of him, maybe it would have lit a fire under his arse?

And while Randle had a good last game, he still doesn't look right out there....when your knees are bad you don't practice hard, or train hard.....he still looks slow out there......I feel like games like the last one may be far and few between....

As for Reese, he knew the Packers were desperate for a receiver....could have easily received a draft pick for him....


"Could have easily received a draft pick for him."

Sure. Piece of cake. Sigh.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 9/29/2015 11:59 am : link
Art Stapleton ‏@art_stapleton 7m7 minutes ago

James Jones tied for 2nd in NFL with 4 TD catches (Julio, Cobb, Benjamin) behind Larry Fitzgerald's 5.
Has 12 catches, 219 yards.

RE: ...  
micky : 9/29/2015 12:04 pm : link
In comment 12514338 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Art Stapleton ‏@art_stapleton 7m7 minutes ago

James Jones tied for 2nd in NFL with 4 TD catches (Julio, Cobb, Benjamin) behind Larry Fitzgerald's 5.
Has 12 catches, 219 yards.


Heck of a start for him. Wish TC had seen the potential
RE: Once Cruz comes back  
ColHowPepper : 9/29/2015 12:08 pm : link
In comment 12513869 blueblood said:
Quote:
Jones would have been a 4th receiver. Much Ado about nothing really..

sooo, that's why it's being reported that Giants are working out Nicks, Welker, and others....?
All I know is  
nyynyg : 9/29/2015 12:15 pm : link
I would pay money to see a reporter ask TC this question when he is standing at the microphone:

"So coach, did you happen to see James Jones' performance this week?" LOL
If...  
smorgan741 : 9/29/2015 12:27 pm : link
a frog had wings he wouldn't bump his ass on any rocks. Guys I normally don't post like this but come on what's done is done. For every bad move there are countless others to be thankful for. OBJ falling in our laps,
look at all the quarterbacks that have gone down and young players that are coming thru on defense. Are you so awesome at your job that you can judge others.Mistakes are made but is your glass half empty or half full? Big waste of time and counterproductive.
Don't feel like reading this whole threat  
DCOrange : 9/29/2015 12:42 pm : link
Giants have Welker and Nicks in today
RE: Don't feel like reading this whole threat  
micky : 9/29/2015 1:16 pm : link
In comment 12514459 DCOrange said:
Quote:
Giants have Welker and Nicks in today


Well if you read this whole thread, you would've found out that no they really didn't afterall.
RE: yea  
bbwcno92 : 9/30/2015 11:24 am : link
In comment 12513688 madhatter9382 said:
Quote:
this one was bad... every giant fan knew it was a mistake right away, i just dont understand and i guess i/we never will. Why did they cut him?! lol


Do any of you even read? James Jones was not cut, perse, he basically asked for his release because he knew what the Giants already had in OBJ, Randle & Cruz... you all can stop it now with the James Jones nonsense. Jones wanted to be a bigger part of the offense, a role for him, not taking back seat to the other 3 guys. Get over it.

http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2015/09/james_jones_tells_the_mmqb_he_basically_asked_the.html
Roster spots are a premium  
JonC : 9/30/2015 11:38 am : link
NYG determined they wanted to keep the 24 year old draft pick Randle over a veteran from another team, and said veteran asked for his release so he could see the field more in GB.

NYG took a calculated risk that teams take every year, and it failed in this instance in the short term, at least. It's in the past with no ability to change it, energy is better spent on the Buffalo Bills.
Bbwc92  
AP in Halfmoon : 9/30/2015 11:54 am : link
I doubt Jones desire to play in Green Bay had much of an impact on the decision to release him. Coughlin and Reese care about winning, period. They went with youth for the 4th WR. Regardless, it's ancient history.
the only thing I have to say about James Jones  
Jersey55 : 9/30/2015 4:49 pm : link
is that its too bad we couldn't have known that Cruz wasn't going to be ready and held on to Jones for another week or 2, right now we have OBJ and Randall and another mystery man...
RE: RE: RE: ...  
Jersey55 : 9/30/2015 4:51 pm : link
In comment 12513853 TyFromQueens said:
Quote:
In comment 12513843 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


In comment 12513816 Eric from BBI said:

the team let Jones go because he asked to be released
Quote:


Who cares if he wanted to be here or not? If had played for Parker - like he should have - we might be 2-1 or 3-0.

Would suck if we finish one game out of the NFC East title.



I agree with a lot of what you are saying, but people don't want to hear the slot argument, but it's real. GB had Jordy Nelson go down, he's an outside WR, James Jones is playing that position, Randall Cobb is their slot WR.

On the Giants it would have meant move Beckham inside to the slot, or play Jones there (or makes Jones the 4th WR and play Parker there) so rewriting history to say the Giants would have any different record is complete speculation.

I'm not saying they should have let Jones go, it was a bad decision but I understand why they did it and comparing GB to the NYG isn't a fair comparison, the personnel is just different making Jones fit in seamlessly.

I think the Giants expected Cruz back sooner when they made the cuts. in which case as I've and other have maintained all along it would have been play Randle or Jones. and that's exactly how Jones interpreted the situation.

it's time to move on. Just like when you asked after the Dallas loss to Atlanta how do we feel now and I said it makes the first two losses sting a little, I was chastised on here and everyone unanimously attacked me ans said you can't live in the past - we need to move forward, we can't here either. Every James Jones catch, TD or 100 yard game is no reason to rehash the same tired conversations.

The Giants made a mistake, but I at least understand their thinking when they did it.




Indeed.now granted..when we signed JJ,I I editable thought Parker was on his way out from then. One major point you made that I want to reiterate on his It's quite obvious The Giants thought Cruz would be back sooner. I bet JJ did as well,which is why he knew he would be the 4th WR at best. With the opportunity to make a difference on GB and possibly get one more contract (remember he's 31) he also asked for his release (The way it was presented to us,it was a mutual decision)

Now maybe I'm wrong (I was out the country when the rosters were set) and Maybe Giants brass already knew Cruz was not going to play week one. If that's the case,it changes my whole outlook on the situation.

Regardless....we have to move on.
I just thought I'd bump this  
santacruzom : 10/5/2015 3:58 pm : link
because I just noticed that James Jones is 14th in the NFL in receiving yards and actually has slightly more yardage than Beckham.

*ducks!*
santacruz  
Torrag : 10/5/2015 4:31 pm : link
but he'd only be the 4th WR if we kept him...no BFD man

...signed BBI mouthbreathers.
ehh  
UConn4523 : 10/5/2015 4:48 pm : link
they dropped the ball by picking him over Parker but we have no idea what went on behind closed doors. Reports say he wanted a legit fulltime role. At that time Cruz was almost back and Randle was the #2. If he had angst about that, then releasing him was a good decision.

He's now playing with the best QB in football on a team hurting badly at WR. Good for him.
It was a bad decision  
Torrag : 10/5/2015 4:57 pm : link
Even your attempts to justify it ring hollow. Cruz hasn't seen a football field for over a year. He was expected back? Stupid. Randle was nursing tendonitis which had lingered far beyond expectations and had been totally unproductive up until that point. He may have asked for his release? Too fucking bad. Too boot if we do turn this season around we might face the guy as a key contributor to green bay's offense down the line.
Updated projections: 68 catch, 1268 yards, 16 TDs  
Mike in Long Beach : 10/5/2015 5:01 pm : link
:-D
Great sideline catch yesterday by JJ  
jeff57 : 10/5/2015 5:44 pm : link
.
RE: It was a bad decision  
UConn4523 : 10/5/2015 6:29 pm : link
In comment 12528250 Torrag said:
Quote:
Even your attempts to justify it ring hollow. Cruz hasn't seen a football field for over a year. He was expected back? Stupid. Randle was nursing tendonitis which had lingered far beyond expectations and had been totally unproductive up until that point. He may have asked for his release? Too fucking bad. Too boot if we do turn this season around we might face the guy as a key contributor to green bay's offense down the line.


Not going to argue with you. If you don't think Coughlin doesn't want to waste a roster spot on a guy that kinda wants to be somewhere else then you haven't been paying attention. He wasn't going to play over randle and he knew it. Jordy getting hurt opened the door back up.

Im not excusing the decision, but I understand it. Totally fine if you disagree.
You don't get it  
Torrag : 10/5/2015 6:35 pm : link
It doesn't matter if he wanted to be here or not. That isn't his decision. He would have a significant role on this team right now and we'd be better for it. We could easily have at least one more win if he was.
I do get it  
UConn4523 : 10/5/2015 7:47 pm : link
and I don't think anyone who advocates for him is wrong. My first post even states that it was probably a mistake. I just understand the decision. Someone who's mentally half way out the door likely isn't wanted by a guy like TC.
TC is worried about motivating a player that can help the Giants win..  
Torrag : 10/5/2015 7:58 pm : link
...that's what your position on James Jones boils down to? Ok you stick with that.

The more likely scenario is they misevaluated everyone involved from Cruz' rehab, Randle's tendonitis and general production, to Parker's viability as an NFL 3rd WR and the current depth chart is what they are left to operate with.
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