I hope it is finally becoming clear to a lot of people who simply think playing through injuries is an easy thing to do as they watch the Cowboys flounder with backups at key positions or the Eagles high-octane offense looking like a pop-gun by having to use guards who were probably security guards a few weeks ago.
I'm wondering what kind of methods these teams will use to get players back into the games. We've heard Dez say he's going to play week 7. How much shit are they going to put him on? What will Jerrah do to try and speed Romo's recovery? What will Chip Kelly and his new age crystal healing do to get players back on the turf?
I know we bemoan the injuries the Giants have suffered and we've somewhat minimized the impact as well. 2015 is rapidly becoming the year of the injury and teams are seeing that it isn't just key players getting injured having an impact, but also cluster injuries at key positions. For the time being, the Giants are benefitting.
What I really want to see is how our rivals handle the situation compared to the way we have.
Thoughts?
There is a site that tracks it. I don't know about league-wide, but the Giants set the (unofficial) record for games missed due to injuries in 2013 and then broke it in 2014.
It's weird because it feels like the Giants have been relatively lucky injury wise, but they've been without their starting LT and star defensive player all season.
Although I wonder if that's not partially just us feeling the injury situation worsening because league wide depth isn't what it used to be.
Depending on the results, they will either be labeled heroic or foolish.
Depending on the results, they will either be labeled heroic or foolish.
They can't really rush Romo back since he's on IR-D. Isn't he out at least 8 weeks? That would be a week 11 return at the earliest, so whether they rush him or not will likely depend on their record. If they're 4-5 or 5-4, I can certainly see them rushing him back. If they're 3-6 they *might* play it safe and somewhat concede the season.
And even if their injuries are 100% when they do return, you'll hear stories about them "gutting it out" just to drum up sympathy and create a hero story.
Football has always been violent, in the past it was much more violent. Maybe guys were at one time more willing to play through an issue or teams were less willing to just throw a guy on IR, but id highly doubt actual physical trauma endured is up much at all. Less physical game and better conditioned players. I often see some making some backward ass claims regarding the fitness level of todays player to justify the "injuries are skyrocketing" stuff, insinuating that the better shape is leading to more injuries, which is just silly to me
The thrust of that post was mainly about the Chip Kelly answer to injuries..It's cyclical as you know..Just a longer lasting cycle for us..:)
Yes.
The PFATS (Professional Football trainers) group has had several seminars from scientist who study skeletal developments to say that simply put - athletes are packing on too much muscle and that the skeletal balance is off. It is placing too much of an impact on joints and ligaments.
In the past 20 years, ligament injuries are up a whopping 216% from years prior, despite enhancements made in field conditions.
Football has always been violent, in the past it was much more violent. Maybe guys were at one time more willing to play through an issue or teams were less willing to just throw a guy on IR, but id highly doubt actual physical trauma endured is up much at all. Less physical game and better conditioned players. I often see some making some backward ass claims regarding the fitness level of todays player to justify the "injuries are skyrocketing" stuff, insinuating that the better shape is leading to more injuries, which is just silly to me
I don't doubt that part of it is empirical, we see a lot more info regarding injuries now than we did 10 or 15 years ago thanks to the popularity of fantasy football.
I also think part of it is players not playing through the injuries as much. Liability has become a much bigger concern league wide - where they used to throw out a guy who got knocked around week after week (Brian Westbrook?), now players will be more likely to see the bench than before. With more money at stake, I think players are more conscious about their health and take a more active role (could be back to point #1, but I don't remember as many players getting second opinions on their own back 10-15 years ago).
There's also no denying that sports medicine has advanced to the point where guys can linger with injuries that used to just outright kill their careers, so you have some players who are oft injured now who back then would just be done (remember Sehorn's microfracture surgery?).
Steroids have taken that jump too - you didn't have guys this big and this fast back 10 years ago, that's something factual that can't be denied, and maybe that size is just too much for the human body to bear on average.
Im not dismissing those findings and i would obviously defer to them, but thats a bit of a vague overview
E, i guess my point is simply, unlike the last two years, these injuries fall under the "every team has injuries" category which I understand and am ok with..I was not ok with the record-setting last two years. Those were really hard to,play through imo..This we can play and have played through..There are no excuses this year, as far as I'm concerned..To date that is..:)
Eric,am I naive,but won't the Giants go to whomever is the best orthopedist in the country? Maybe they are, I don't know, but I'd send him to that mythical doctor in Vienna, who has a cure for everything.
Are we saying that nobody can help Cruz, or figure out what exactly is wrong?
Sheese!
They use physics to show that forces have gotten higher over the years. There really shouldn't be any debate over that. Lineman have increased weight an average of 36% since 1980. LB's are up an average of 23 pounds since that time. Safeties are heavier. Players are heavier, yet also leaner.
This puts a lot of stress on joints. Oddly enough, the impetus of the studies came from the contradiction that steroid users had shorter recovery times from muscle buildup, but suffered more muscular/ligament injuries than non-steroid users. That led to research showing that players are essentially getting too big for their own bones. Guys like David Boston and LaRon Landry are perfect examples of that, and both players suffered through a variety of nagging muscular injuries.
Frankly, how the Eagles handle their Guard situation might be the key to their season - the interior part of their line is in shambles now.
I hope Cruz comes back and upgrades us but I've seen nothing from him to make me think he'll be even remotely close to the guy we saw in 2011 and 2012 ever again. A damn shame too.
Good points but a legit complaint is that the guys today due to the use of better PEDs and better training techniques, are heavier and faster. Collisions are probably more punishing IMO.
It was odd after a string of comments from Coughlin and others that the doctors make these decisions to then hear him say he was happy to have Flowers choose to play through his injury. I wonder if the Giants as a whole defer to or rely on the medical staff more and less on the players than other teams.
Hey, it's pickle juice, man. That's the cure.
Philly could go either way but they look bad. They pulled some nice long throws out yestrday but more a function of horrid Safety play by Redskins.
This season will really test who has the best 53 in the division because we are all playing backups and giving significant snaps to reserves.
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But it is fun, at the moment watching other teams emulate our disasterous two years..How people came on here time and again lauding the training and fitness techniques of Chip Kelly, the man with the "injury" answers..:)
Hey, it's pickle juice, man. That's the cure.
Nolan Ryan thought so..:)
As for handling injuries, I think this year is showing perhaps Reese isn't the fool that some make him out to be. The OL depth isn't terrible. Newhouse is filling in nicely and Hart and Jerry have done OK in limited roles (i.e. jumbo packages and brief extensions of playing time).
I agree that other teams handling of key injuries will be crucial keys to the make-up of the entire division.
Let's say a couple more WR's go down or another TE - then we start getting into the territory we had been in previous years with injuries to the safeties or CB's.
According to Football Outsiders’ Adjusted Games Lost (AGL) metric, the Giants have been one of the least fortunate teams in terms of being affected by injuries. Their AGL rankings for the Giants for the last five years:
2010: 22nd
2011: 26th
2012: 25th
2013: 32nd
2014: 32nd
As Football Outsiders notes, “This is the fifth year in a row the Giants ranked 22nd or worse, and they have missed the playoffs in four of those seasons… Then we have the Giants, looking to put together an injury dynasty. After setting the benchmark with 141.3 AGL in 2013, the 2014 club has the second-worst AGL on record at 137.1.”
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2015/2014-adjusted-games-lost - ( New Window )
It has been both. But the killer for teams is when those injuries get concentrated in a cluster. It is one thing to have to rely on a couple of backups for an extended period of time at a position, but the giants have actually been forced to start LB's OL' S' or CB's that weren't even in the league a few weeks prior to take the field in previous years.
You might survive if the guy is a K like Eric Schubert, but when you go into a playoff game with 3 LB's who were never in Cliff Claven's kitchen, the results are going to suck....
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Puts a tax on tendons, also. Plus, we all know that many of these guys are on the juice, even if they are passing the tests. Certain steroids are known to cause tendon injuries and it's a myth that any of them strengthen the tendons (even Equipoise).
I often see some making some backward ass claims regarding the fitness level of todays player to justify the "injuries are skyrocketing" stuff, insinuating that the better shape is leading to more injuries, which is just silly to me
The PFATS (Professional Football trainers) group has had several seminars from scientist who study skeletal developments to say that simply put - athletes are packing on too much muscle and that the skeletal balance is off. It is placing too much of an impact on joints and ligaments.
In the past 20 years, ligament injuries are up a whopping 216% from years prior, despite enhancements made in field conditions.
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that this does exist with a caveat - the higher fitness levels (fueled by HGH and other enhancements) overtaxes the body.
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Puts a tax on tendons, also. Plus, we all know that many of these guys are on the juice, even if they are passing the tests. Certain steroids are known to cause tendon injuries and it's a myth that any of them strengthen the tendons (even Equipoise).
I often see some making some backward ass claims regarding the fitness level of todays player to justify the "injuries are skyrocketing" stuff, insinuating that the better shape is leading to more injuries, which is just silly to me
The PFATS (Professional Football trainers) group has had several seminars from scientist who study skeletal developments to say that simply put - athletes are packing on too much muscle and that the skeletal balance is off. It is placing too much of an impact on joints and ligaments.
In the past 20 years, ligament injuries are up a whopping 216% from years prior, despite enhancements made in field conditions.
Not sure why this didn't post but the previous poster Matt M. hit the nail on the head. Steroids have been linked to tendon and ligament injuries and despite the testing, many of these guys are on the juice. There are also some myths out there that certain steroid compounds are helpful to ligaments and tendons (e.g. Equipoise), but that's not true.