But he is not a pimple on prime Tiki's butt cheeks. That comments section is ridiculous. Tons of people saying Tiki is delusional to put himself in Bells class and that Bell is vastly better than Tiki ever was. These people are either flat stupid or 15 years old. Tiki has been gone almost a decade, its tough to believe there is a generation of fans who never saw him play
But he is not a pimple on prime Tiki's butt cheeks. That comments section is ridiculous. Tons of people saying Tiki is delusional to put himself in Bells class and that Bell is vastly better than Tiki ever was. These people are either flat stupid or 15 years old. Tiki has been gone almost a decade, its tough to believe there is a generation of fans who never saw him play
They are Steeler fans (and front runners), so they are very insecure when the Steelers or anything Steelers is not the bestest.
people really forget how good Barber was at the end of his career. Really bizarre arc for a RB. Led league in yards from scrimmage in consecutive seasons, #12 for his career. And if he hadnt retired, I bet he gets another 2500-4000. And he's <1k out of the top 10.
I think Bell is going to be a tremendous player, but he's had one year
Tiki is correct. They have similar skill sets...not my favorite human being although who knows what went on with him and his wife but Tiki's stats were ridiculous for a few years.
During that 3 year window (04-06) Tiki ran for over 5,000 yards, about 428 more than Tomlinson who was the next closest. He also had the highest YPC of any of the 15 RB who ran for minimum 3,000 yards in that span. He had 700 more yards from scrimmage than any other player
Then when he retired, Tiki forgot all the good things TC and the Giants did for him and he bashed the NY Giants. Which is an unforgivable sin, esp on BBI.
RE: I didn't know Bell bailed on his preganant wife for another woman
but Tiki made his own bed. I doubt he cares much anyway. I actually haven't seen much of Leveon Bell so I don't know about the comparison but, I just remember how Tiki would bounce off of tacklers like a pinball. He could run up the gut, to the side, catch the ball. He really was one of the most complete backs I've seen. It can be difficult to recall how good he was and I have a hard time believing Leveon is on his level - though he may get there in time.
But he is not a pimple on prime Tiki's butt cheeks. That comments section is ridiculous. Tons of people saying Tiki is delusional to put himself in Bells class and that Bell is vastly better than Tiki ever was. These people are either flat stupid or 15 years old. Tiki has been gone almost a decade, its tough to believe there is a generation of fans who never saw him play
Very true and exactly what I was thinking. Youngsters posting. I remember being young and stupid and thinking Gale Sayers career while good, was not as good as Tiki Barber's years ago.
Out of sight, out of mind I believe...
Tiki had I think three 200+ rushing games in 2006...
but in a pure football sense, he has every right to make that comparison. Saying Tiki doesn't have the right to or shouldn't make the statement is lunacy.
This would not be a discussion if none of the off-field stuff happened and Tiki was remembered lovingly.
I actually think it's more of an insult to Tiki than Bell. Tiki's accomplished MUCH more than Bell has.
Giants fans are starting to care just a little less about the post playing career BS and start to remember just how incredible Tiki was on the football field.
It's long overdue. Many will hang onto the grudge and the hatred for as long as they can but as I've been saying for a long time now.. it's time to just let it go.
A few dumb comments and career moves shouldn't extinguish his accomplishments in a NYG uniform. The guy isn't a murderer.
Giants fans are starting to care just a little less about the post playing career BS and start to remember just how incredible Tiki was on the football field.
It's long overdue. Many will hang onto the grudge and the hatred for as long as they can but as I've been saying for a long time now.. it's time to just let it go.
A few dumb comments and career moves shouldn't extinguish his accomplishments in a NYG uniform. The guy isn't a murderer.
Actually not at all(in my case)..He's still a huge prick to me, but facts are facts, he was our best ever two-way back ever, imv..:)
Giants fans are starting to care just a little less about the post playing career BS and start to remember just how incredible Tiki was on the football field.
It's long overdue. Many will hang onto the grudge and the hatred for as long as they can but as I've been saying for a long time now.. it's time to just let it go.
A few dumb comments and career moves shouldn't extinguish his accomplishments in a NYG uniform. The guy isn't a murderer.
It's a shame, but perception trumps reality for a lot of people.
There's a whole generation of Giants fans who only know about him from his media comments, who have no idea this guy was a couple of solid seasons away from HoF consideration.
All depends on which side of the fence you are standing on...
I think Bell is going to be a tremendous player, but he's had one year
Ten Ton Hammer : 10/6/2015 11:30 pm : link : reply
at a high level, and it wasn't near Tiki's best.
Just like this previous statement......
It took Tiki 4 seasons to get going.....Leveon started right out of the gate....his second year, was just as good as Tiki's 9th season(and best one)....one fumble in over 700 touches?
Steeler fans are just reacting like Giant fans, like this poster.....
On the field, Tiki was Giants greatest RB, even better than Gifford...He fumbled for 7 seasons...no denying that...in Tiki's first 7 seasons, he had one season equal to Bell's second season, so it's understandable Steeler fans have their panties in an uproar....but what are they arguing about....Tiki never said he was better....he said Bell reminded him of him....
But until Bell matches Tiki's last three seasons, he is playing catch up....no doubt Bell is a talent....but this is only his 3rd year....and running backs don't have longevity in this new NFL...
tremendous back. Once TC helped him get the fumbling under control he was the best back in the NFL for 3 years running. Running, catching and blocking, he did all and did it well.
before the 2007 season, do you really think those 8/9 year old fans opinions of Tiki and his media career are important or they even have one? Not being a dick, I have an 8-year old and if she said to me, "yeah, but he's such a jerk for those comments criticizing Eli" "or dressing up like a dinosaur? come on" or "leaving his pregnant wife? what's up with that?" i'd have to see if she were abducted by aliens.
Fans who saw him play even in only 2006 have to consider him an elite RB.
I don't think there is a whole generation of fans who don't know Tiki unless you're talking the 2nd graders and below. and that's kind of a stretch IMO.
If Tiki were 3 inches taller and 40 pounds heavier
I think those younger than 21 have little to no recollection of Tiki. Just do the math. If you are a senior in high school right now you were 9 years old when Tiki retired. That kid may have fleetig memories of hearing Tiki's name or watching him once or twice (thats if that kid was engaged with the NFL at age 9 when some/most dont become more than a casual fan until later) but that kid cant speak to what tiki was based on live memories. Anyone younger than that kid surely has no recollection of tiki barber from his playing days.
That kid who is a senior in HS today was probably 8, not even 9 when Tiki retired. Kids in HS and below have to have next to no memories of him (especially if they werent Giant fans). Im highly skeptical any college kids have memories that are beyond fleeting either
The guy ruined himself personally in everyone's eyes, but as a player there was never any question about his effort or quality. The guy was an incredible player who always brought it. The mouthbreathers that booed him at the stadium should be ashamed.
At least he didn't miss games due to shooting himself or blowing his hand up.
It's not 'hatred' to base your opinion of a man...
I can remember a fair bit about the 84-85 seasons, when I was at those ages. Plus, we taped a lot of games and I watched the tapes for years afterwards. It's just a function of my upbringing - Giants games were just a big part of our lives. Watching the games with my dad was my favorite part of the week during football season.
I think those younger than 21 have little to no recollection of Tiki. Just do the math. If you are a senior in high school right now you were 9 years old when Tiki retired. That kid may have fleetig memories of hearing Tiki's name or watching him once or twice (thats if that kid was engaged with the NFL at age 9 when some/most dont become more than a casual fan until later) but that kid cant speak to what tiki was based on live memories. Anyone younger than that kid surely has no recollection of tiki barber from his playing days.
How do they view Phil Simms? As an analyst? Troy Aikman too?
I know a lot about players I never saw play or I was young when they played. I'm pretty sure most non-Giants or even Giants fans of that age don't "know" Tiki for bad-mouthing Eli and Coughlin. My point was if they know the media comments (which happened while his playing career was still fresh) odds are they know more about Tiki than just the media comments.
Way before it became fashionable to dislike him. I thougt he was a snob who tried too hard to show you how smart he was and how classy he was. I didnt like that he appeared to have better relationships with members of the media than his own teammates, it always rubbed me the wrong way. I didnt like how he handled Strahans contract situation which was just a conniving attempt to create a contrast that puts him in a better light. I didnt like the guy personally way before it became fashionable to dislike him
But on the field is another matter entirely. The guy was a monster in his prime, better than many backs who are actually in the hall
That's what I've never understood - his criticism of Eli was fairly tepid. And, given what Eli had done to that point in his career, hardly unjustified. He never, ever had a bad word to say about the franchise as a whole despite the horseshit people yammer about "durrr he bashed the Giants!!" He clearly didn't like Coughlin.....yet pre-2007 most of the other veterans couldn't stand Coughlin either. That's why Coughlin famously made all those changes going into the 2007 season, remember?
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but when Pepper Johnson was cut he was pretty pissed off and said a bunch of nasty things about the organization. No one holds it against him, nor should they.
Regarding his marriage.....yeah, he left his wife. A shitload of other athletes do the same. Hardly admirable, but hardly unusual either. The circumstances WERE unusual and shitty, but since none of us know what his marriage was like or what his wife is like, the outrageous outrage has always seemed a bit much to me. The people who make a huge deal out of it are likely the people that already hated him to begin with.
RE: eh, it's possible to have fairly good memories of seasons at 8-9
I can remember a fair bit about the 84-85 seasons, when I was at those ages. Plus, we taped a lot of games and I watched the tapes for years afterwards. It's just a function of my upbringing - Giants games were just a big part of our lives. Watching the games with my dad was my favorite part of the week during football season.
Greg, im sure you hae memories of the 84 and 85 Giants as an 8/9 year old. Most 8 and 9 year olds (as well as most people in general) arent Giants fans. Im sure your memories of Lions RB Billy Sims (multi pro bowler who retired after 84) are next to non existent or fleeting at best. And im sure if we are beig honest that you wouldnt even put much stock in your own evaluations with regards to players even with the giants at age 9.
He's a scummy self promoter without character who purported to be the epitome of class. Phony and shallow from head to toe in both his personal life and dealings with his professional colleagues. Some people will give anyone a pass if they 'did it on the field wearing the blue'. He made his bed and now he's lying in it. It's not 'hate', it's the appropriate distaste for a man who deserves it.
I think everyone should be able to agree that Tiki was at least a borderline Hall of Famer. I consider him worthy of the Hall, but even those who don't must concede that he should be considered or that he was close. He was a fantastic running back who had some fantastic seasons and he left in his prime.
And yet, somehow, he's now getting killed for saying that a third-year player with one fantastic season reminds him of himself. I've never seen a guy get killed for giving out such a mighty compliment.
He's a scummy self promoter without character who purported to be the epitome of class. Phony and shallow from head to toe in both his personal life and dealings with his professional colleagues. Some people will give anyone a pass if they 'did it on the field wearing the blue'. He made his bed and now he's lying in it. It's not 'hate', it's the appropriate distaste for a man who deserves it.
I don't know what he has done to make a single Giant fan hate him. He's a shitty husband? Fine, don't marry him. Shitty on TV? Don't hire him to do TV.
But we only know him because he was a football player on the team we root for. And he was a fucking beast for them.
Any Giants fan that hates Tiki Barber is a horse's ass.
you guys keep saying hate. It isn't hate it's the desire for a guy that is slime to GO AWAY. He is not entitled to anything from Giants fans. He forfeited that when he took a clear stance against the team for blatant self interest. You apologists can make all the rationalizations you want. That is the truth.
in what way did he "take a clear stance against the team"?
one could argue that if it weren't for Tiki, then Coughlin would have been out of a job after 2006 or that if he remained as head coach, that he would not have softened his ways which players credit for building a stronger team atmosphere.
The main reason "fans" turned on him is because he retired in his prime and they felt cheated and resented it. Yes, he stuck his foot in his mouth with comments that were blown all out of proportion, especially because they were about Eli and Coughlin.
I've watched this team for more than 50 years, and I believe no one worked harder to improve himself than Tiki. He went from a small kick returner-3rd down specialist to the most complete back in team history who could run around and through people, follow his blocks with great skill and catch passes. He had a fumbling problem and I'm certain coaching helped. But the meme that Coughlin saved his career is a gross exaggeration.
The main reason "fans" turned on him is because he retired in his prime and they felt cheated and resented it.
YAHTZEE!!!!!
this is probably true, but really only lasted until the Super Bowl win.
Once the Giants won, I'm pretty sure no one cared that Tiki retired in his prime.
Plus and I can't speak for everyone, I never cared what Tiki said to the media - about Eli, about Coughlin, about anyone. Since his punt return TD against Dallas I wanted to see him get the ball more and once he did he blossomed (with Coughlin's help). I only ever remember Tiki as the elite running back he became and nothing else.
but...as I've said many times on here, 99% of the time i root for laundry and don't care what these guys do or say off the field.
Tiki retiring early pissed off a lot of fans and added to the resentment because there's this underlying spite that he didn't leave everything his body had on the field, as if he should have only retired as a broken down man. It's not the only reason-- he has done plenty of dumb things on his own-- but I think it contributes. Further to that, I've seen people criticize his decision to announce his retirement mid-season, as if it created a distraction to the team.
But then again, NFL Network's A Football Life about Barry Sanders, one of the greatest and most beloved players of all-time, there is a part where fans turned on him because he announced his retirement in the off-season and didn't gave fans the chance to say goodbye.
In some respects, these guys are going to be criticized for retiring in their primes no matter what they do.
Yeah, he said some stupid things. Agreed. However, the level of the vitriol is so ridiculously out of whack. Forget moutains and molehills, this was Mt Everest and a molehill, and that is what was driven by resentment for him retiring while he was still at his peak. Not only at his peak, but at a time when the team was coming off a disappointing season. And the point about Barry Sanders is a good one - Sanders didn't say one negative thing about the Lions (other than maybe something about being tired of losing - can't really remember), yet a lot of Lions fans resented him for years.
He did so in a manner calculated to promote his own interests. It's a lot easier to forgive a guy 'popping off' than it is when a player does so with a clear agenda. Tiki brought this on himself.
when Bell rushes for 200 yards three times in one season
you guys keep saying hate. It isn't hate it's the desire for a guy that is slime to GO AWAY. He is not entitled to anything from Giants fans. He forfeited that when he took a clear stance against the team for blatant self interest. You apologists can make all the rationalizations you want. That is the truth.
Oh god, this is so dramatic.
So he said Tiki gave a shitty pregame speech that was comical.
BFD.
LT is revered while banging underage hookers, but Tiki makes a comment about Eli (which, at the time, half of you would have agreed with) and he's "slime".
Fuck it, I love Tiki. Smart dude, went to UVA on an academic scholarship, well spoken. he's not perfect, he has an ego, but as far as football players go, he's good enough in my book.
RE: It isn't that Tiki 'said some stupid things'...
He did so in a manner calculated to promote his own interests. It's a lot easier to forgive a guy 'popping off' than it is when a player does so with a clear agenda. Tiki brought this on himself.
When people say it's in his own self interest, they act as if Tiki went and exposed some inter-team affair for a book he was promoting.
What was his own self interest? Do you think his insight into the locker room boosted his profile that much? he was just doing his new job. he probably shouldn't have said it, but this "own self interest" stuff is baffling and just the go-to line.
he was an analyst, he was giving his experiences and insight.
RE: It isn't that Tiki 'said some stupid things'...
He did so in a manner calculated to promote his own interests. It's a lot easier to forgive a guy 'popping off' than it is when a player does so with a clear agenda. Tiki brought this on himself.
I suppose "his own interests" means he was being paid as a football commentator, a career in which he seems to have failed. I never saw his remarks as that awful. I can see people disagreeing, but I still believe the impetus for the strong dislike was his retirement.
...He did so in a manner calculated to promote his own interests. It's a lot easier to forgive a guy 'popping off' than it is when a player does so with a clear agenda. Tiki brought this on himself.
I'm really missing this here... Was spilling that Eli's pregame speech was "comical" somehow going to further "his own interests" to any measurable degree?
What was the agenda? To rip Eli to and accomplish what exactly? It's not like he was going to become the #1 color commentator on Fox if he simply ripped Eli.
It was an ill advised comment because he took it too far and could have worded it differently, but he was an NFL analyst, being asked a direct question, and gave his honest opinion based on his experiences.
Tiki retiring early pissed off a lot of fans and added to the resentment because there's this underlying spite that he didn't leave everything his body had on the field, as if he should have only retired as a broken down man. .
Respectfully, I don't really agree with that yet could be wrong. I believe the following reasons are why fans don't like him.
1. Being Ungrateful - Tiki threw Coughlin under the bus whereas it was Coughlin who helped solved Tiki's fumbling issues by instructing him on how to hold the ball more securely.
2. Disrespected the QB (Eli) - claiming Eli's attempt to be a leader was "comical" backfired as it truly represented Tiki's lack of leadership.
3. Retirement tour - this was a player who went on the record that he didn't have the heart anymore and made sure his retirement tour was more important and above the Ny Giants.
For those three reasons along with giving himself a pass with the phrase "i'm only expressing my opinion" I believe people perceive Tiki to be a self-absorbed and unlikable person.
Tiki retiring early pissed off a lot of fans and added to the resentment because there's this underlying spite that he didn't leave everything his body had on the field, as if he should have only retired as a broken down man. .
Respectfully, I don't really agree with that yet could be wrong. I believe the following reasons are why fans don't like him.
1. Being Ungrateful - Tiki threw Coughlin under the bus whereas it was Coughlin who helped solved Tiki's fumbling issues by instructing him on how to hold the ball more securely.
2. Disrespected the QB (Eli) - claiming Eli's attempt to be a leader was "comical" backfired as it truly represented Tiki's lack of leadership.
3. Retirement tour - this was a player who went on the record that he didn't have the heart anymore and made sure his retirement tour was more important and above the Ny Giants.
For those three reasons along with giving himself a pass with the phrase "i'm only expressing my opinion" I believe people perceive Tiki to be a self-absorbed and unlikable person.
This is a weak list.
1) Where's the vitriol for shockey who said "we were outcoached, write that down"?
2) Eli wasn't his QB anymore. Tiki wasn't on the team, he was an analyst. He doesn't owe Eli anything. You can find it distasteful, but it's not actively disrespecting your teammate and QB.
3) How did he make sure his "retirement tour" was above the Giants season? He saved Coughlin's job in the last game that year against the Redskins. What's the alternative - he keeps playing even though his heart isn't in it? Essentially you're saying the mere fact he announced he'd retire mid season is that big of a deal, even though he got us into the playoffs and saved Coughlin's job that year.
4) In a league of people like Cromartie, where these players are fucking everything that moves, this bothers you? After he retired? Besides, it's not like anyone here knows the relationship he had with his ex-wife, or his son from the marriage.
These are weak reasons. We've got Greg Hardy in this league and people are looking for reasons to hate Tiki. It just makes no sense.
He might be a douchebag but there's been so many worse people on the Giants.
Spot on. The true Tiki was unveiled with the selfish distraction in season victory tour retirement announcement. His relationship with Giants fans was all downhill from there as he prepared to enter his media career with the premeditated attacks on and at the expense of his teammates and coaches reputations.
Spot on. The true Tiki was unveiled with the selfish distraction in season victory tour retirement announcement. His relationship with Giants fans was all downhill from there as he prepared to enter his media career with the premeditated attacks on and at the expense of his teammates and coaches reputations.
Oh bullshit - plenty of players announce their impending retirement either before or during their last season, and he dragged the Giants into the playoffs pretty much singlehandedly.
Spot on. The true Tiki was unveiled with the selfish distraction in season victory tour retirement announcement. His relationship with Giants fans was all downhill from there as he prepared to enter his media career with the premeditated attacks on and at the expense of his teammates and coaches reputations.
Premeditated? Do you have some evidence of that? And didn't his "victory tour" include leading the Giants to the playoffs?
I've seen any number of players announce retirement before the season
Not too many make a backpage grabbing mid season surprise announcement. Seems pretty calculated to me. As were his comments immediately upon sitting in that TV chair.
Those defending him are blinded by their fandom. You can acknowledge his ability on the field while admitting his failures as a person. They are legion. Done with this thread now and moving on.
Spot on. The true Tiki was unveiled with the selfish distraction in season victory tour retirement announcement. His relationship with Giants fans was all downhill from there as he prepared to enter his media career with the premeditated attacks on and at the expense of his teammates and coaches reputations.
Oh bullshit - plenty of players announce their impending retirement either before or during their last season, and he dragged the Giants into the playoffs pretty much singlehandedly.
A bit more happened than a retirement tour in case you forgot or didn't read
Tiki retiring early pissed off a lot of fans and added to the resentment because there's this underlying spite that he didn't leave everything his body had on the field, as if he should have only retired as a broken down man. .
Respectfully, I don't really agree with that yet could be wrong. I believe the following reasons are why fans don't like him.
1. Being Ungrateful - Tiki threw Coughlin under the bus whereas it was Coughlin who helped solved Tiki's fumbling issues by instructing him on how to hold the ball more securely.
2. Disrespected the QB (Eli) - claiming Eli's attempt to be a leader was "comical" backfired as it truly represented Tiki's lack of leadership.
3. Retirement tour - this was a player who went on the record that he didn't have the heart anymore and made sure his retirement tour was more important and above the Ny Giants.
For those three reasons along with giving himself a pass with the phrase "i'm only expressing my opinion" I believe people perceive Tiki to be a self-absorbed and unlikable person.
This is a weak list.
1) Where's the vitriol for shockey who said "we were outcoached, write that down"?
2) Eli wasn't his QB anymore. Tiki wasn't on the team, he was an analyst. He doesn't owe Eli anything. You can find it distasteful, but it's not actively disrespecting your teammate and QB.
3) How did he make sure his "retirement tour" was above the Giants season? He saved Coughlin's job in the last game that year against the Redskins. What's the alternative - he keeps playing even though his heart isn't in it? Essentially you're saying the mere fact he announced he'd retire mid season is that big of a deal, even though he got us into the playoffs and saved Coughlin's job that year.
4) In a league of people like Cromartie, where these players are fucking everything that moves, this bothers you? After he retired? Besides, it's not like anyone here knows the relationship he had with his ex-wife, or his son from the marriage.
These are weak reasons. We've got Greg Hardy in this league and people are looking for reasons to hate Tiki. It just makes no sense.
He might be a douchebag but there's been so many worse people on the Giants.
Them call out the Giants and their fans for being weak. You're living on the moon if you believe the reasons are otherwise.
That the timing of his announcement undermined the team and was the reason for a disappointing 2nd half of 06? Because thats horseshit. Injuries crushed that season and Tiki was carrying what was an otherwise bad football team with a mash unit on defense and skitting young Qb.
He didnt have make that public midseason, but the fact that he did was for the most part irrelevant. It certainly didnt stop him from beasting and getting us into the playoffs by setting franchise records at fed ex field. Its certainly foolish in my view to hold some animosity toward him over that almost a decade later
Tiki's comments after the Carolina playoff loss. Shame on Coughlin for not better preparing the starting linebacker who was stocking groceries earlier in the week. What a shame Coughlin didn't remind Tiki of who solved his fumbling problems while Tiki was just voicing his "opinion" that The coaching staff was "outcoached".
...everything he does it motivated by self interest without regard to others or consequences. Example? Stepping out on your wife and leaving her while she is carrying your twin babies.
What Tiki did is one of the worst things you can do in these parts
You can have his personality,and if you do your job and are good,you'll be fine.The majority will cheer and love ya.But going after teammates and coaches,that puts you in the black book with Pat Riley.It's going to be difficult to come back from that.
that TC was the sole reason Barber fixing his fumble issue. If it was such a magic fix, David Wilson would not have had those issues at all. No one gives Tiki credit for working his ass off.
that TC was the sole reason Barber fixing his fumble issue. If it was such a magic fix, David Wilson would not have had those issues at all. No one gives Tiki credit for working his ass off.
Holding the football differently once Coughlin arrived is working his ass off? Thought he was always working his ass off yet just fumbling at an alarming rate
when you're trying to break a bad habit. Tiki put in work to address it. Give Coughlin credit for IDing what he wasn't doing, but Tiki gets credit for carrying it through.
"Barber credits Coughlin with solving his chronic fumbling problems but wrote that he believes it was his performance that kept Coughlin employed by the Giants. Under Coughlin, Barber ranked among the NFL's top five rushers; in the three seasons beginning in 2004, Barber gained 1,518 (fifth), 1,860 (second) and 1,662 yards (fourth"
when you're trying to break a bad habit. Tiki put in work to address it. Give Coughlin credit for IDing what he wasn't doing, but Tiki gets credit for carrying it through.
He stopped fumbling over night and had his best seasons under Coughlin. The majority know he bit the hand that feeds him and one the many reasons he's disliked today. Of course, there are a slim few who think otherwise
yet i doubt your position will sway the majority as using Wilson, who barely even played, is a real stretch as Coughlin has successfully coached many HB's.
Statistically? Absolutely.
And if an analyst somewhere or another former pro football player said it, you wouldn't think twice.
But in his case, specifically - Tiki's better off not making statements like that.
During that 3 year window (04-06) Tiki ran for over 5,000 yards, about 428 more than Tomlinson who was the next closest. He also had the highest YPC of any of the 15 RB who ran for minimum 3,000 yards in that span. He had 700 more yards from scrimmage than any other player
Then when he retired, Tiki forgot all the good things TC and the Giants did for him and he bashed the NY Giants. Which is an unforgivable sin, esp on BBI.
agreed, but great football player at his peak
Very true and exactly what I was thinking. Youngsters posting. I remember being young and stupid and thinking Gale Sayers career while good, was not as good as Tiki Barber's years ago.
Out of sight, out of mind I believe...
That said, a humble guy in 2004 turned into a semi-douche towards to the end of 2006, to a full-on douche post retirement.
TC: You're welcome
This would not be a discussion if none of the off-field stuff happened and Tiki was remembered lovingly.
I actually think it's more of an insult to Tiki than Bell. Tiki's accomplished MUCH more than Bell has.
It's long overdue. Many will hang onto the grudge and the hatred for as long as they can but as I've been saying for a long time now.. it's time to just let it go.
A few dumb comments and career moves shouldn't extinguish his accomplishments in a NYG uniform. The guy isn't a murderer.
It's long overdue. Many will hang onto the grudge and the hatred for as long as they can but as I've been saying for a long time now.. it's time to just let it go.
A few dumb comments and career moves shouldn't extinguish his accomplishments in a NYG uniform. The guy isn't a murderer.
Actually not at all(in my case)..He's still a huge prick to me, but facts are facts, he was our best ever two-way back ever, imv..:)
It's long overdue. Many will hang onto the grudge and the hatred for as long as they can but as I've been saying for a long time now.. it's time to just let it go.
A few dumb comments and career moves shouldn't extinguish his accomplishments in a NYG uniform. The guy isn't a murderer.
It's a shame, but perception trumps reality for a lot of people.
There's a whole generation of Giants fans who only know about him from his media comments, who have no idea this guy was a couple of solid seasons away from HoF consideration.
Ten Ton Hammer : 10/6/2015 11:30 pm : link : reply
at a high level, and it wasn't near Tiki's best.
Just like this previous statement......
It took Tiki 4 seasons to get going.....Leveon started right out of the gate....his second year, was just as good as Tiki's 9th season(and best one)....one fumble in over 700 touches?
Steeler fans are just reacting like Giant fans, like this poster.....
On the field, Tiki was Giants greatest RB, even better than Gifford...He fumbled for 7 seasons...no denying that...in Tiki's first 7 seasons, he had one season equal to Bell's second season, so it's understandable Steeler fans have their panties in an uproar....but what are they arguing about....Tiki never said he was better....he said Bell reminded him of him....
But until Bell matches Tiki's last three seasons, he is playing catch up....no doubt Bell is a talent....but this is only his 3rd year....and running backs don't have longevity in this new NFL...
Fans who saw him play even in only 2006 have to consider him an elite RB.
I don't think there is a whole generation of fans who don't know Tiki unless you're talking the 2nd graders and below. and that's kind of a stretch IMO.
At least he didn't miss games due to shooting himself or blowing his hand up.
How do they view Phil Simms? As an analyst? Troy Aikman too?
I know a lot about players I never saw play or I was young when they played. I'm pretty sure most non-Giants or even Giants fans of that age don't "know" Tiki for bad-mouthing Eli and Coughlin. My point was if they know the media comments (which happened while his playing career was still fresh) odds are they know more about Tiki than just the media comments.
But on the field is another matter entirely. The guy was a monster in his prime, better than many backs who are actually in the hall
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but when Pepper Johnson was cut he was pretty pissed off and said a bunch of nasty things about the organization. No one holds it against him, nor should they.
Regarding his marriage.....yeah, he left his wife. A shitload of other athletes do the same. Hardly admirable, but hardly unusual either. The circumstances WERE unusual and shitty, but since none of us know what his marriage was like or what his wife is like, the outrageous outrage has always seemed a bit much to me. The people who make a huge deal out of it are likely the people that already hated him to begin with.
Greg, im sure you hae memories of the 84 and 85 Giants as an 8/9 year old. Most 8 and 9 year olds (as well as most people in general) arent Giants fans. Im sure your memories of Lions RB Billy Sims (multi pro bowler who retired after 84) are next to non existent or fleeting at best. And im sure if we are beig honest that you wouldnt even put much stock in your own evaluations with regards to players even with the giants at age 9.
And yet, somehow, he's now getting killed for saying that a third-year player with one fantastic season reminds him of himself. I've never seen a guy get killed for giving out such a mighty compliment.
I don't know what he has done to make a single Giant fan hate him. He's a shitty husband? Fine, don't marry him. Shitty on TV? Don't hire him to do TV.
But we only know him because he was a football player on the team we root for. And he was a fucking beast for them.
Any Giants fan that hates Tiki Barber is a horse's ass.
I've watched this team for more than 50 years, and I believe no one worked harder to improve himself than Tiki. He went from a small kick returner-3rd down specialist to the most complete back in team history who could run around and through people, follow his blocks with great skill and catch passes. He had a fumbling problem and I'm certain coaching helped. But the meme that Coughlin saved his career is a gross exaggeration.
YAHTZEE!!!!!
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The main reason "fans" turned on him is because he retired in his prime and they felt cheated and resented it.
YAHTZEE!!!!!
this is probably true, but really only lasted until the Super Bowl win.
Once the Giants won, I'm pretty sure no one cared that Tiki retired in his prime.
Plus and I can't speak for everyone, I never cared what Tiki said to the media - about Eli, about Coughlin, about anyone. Since his punt return TD against Dallas I wanted to see him get the ball more and once he did he blossomed (with Coughlin's help). I only ever remember Tiki as the elite running back he became and nothing else.
but...as I've said many times on here, 99% of the time i root for laundry and don't care what these guys do or say off the field.
But then again, NFL Network's A Football Life about Barry Sanders, one of the greatest and most beloved players of all-time, there is a part where fans turned on him because he announced his retirement in the off-season and didn't gave fans the chance to say goodbye.
In some respects, these guys are going to be criticized for retiring in their primes no matter what they do.
I'M A GIANTS FAN AND BELL IS SO MUCH BETTER OMG
Any Giants fan who thinks LeVeon Bell is better than Tiki is a fucking idiot or just not even a Giants fan.
Oh god, this is so dramatic.
So he said Tiki gave a shitty pregame speech that was comical.
BFD.
LT is revered while banging underage hookers, but Tiki makes a comment about Eli (which, at the time, half of you would have agreed with) and he's "slime".
Fuck it, I love Tiki. Smart dude, went to UVA on an academic scholarship, well spoken. he's not perfect, he has an ego, but as far as football players go, he's good enough in my book.
When people say it's in his own self interest, they act as if Tiki went and exposed some inter-team affair for a book he was promoting.
What was his own self interest? Do you think his insight into the locker room boosted his profile that much? he was just doing his new job. he probably shouldn't have said it, but this "own self interest" stuff is baffling and just the go-to line.
he was an analyst, he was giving his experiences and insight.
I suppose "his own interests" means he was being paid as a football commentator, a career in which he seems to have failed. I never saw his remarks as that awful. I can see people disagreeing, but I still believe the impetus for the strong dislike was his retirement.
...He did so in a manner calculated to promote his own interests. It's a lot easier to forgive a guy 'popping off' than it is when a player does so with a clear agenda. Tiki brought this on himself.
I'm really missing this here... Was spilling that Eli's pregame speech was "comical" somehow going to further "his own interests" to any measurable degree?
What was the agenda? To rip Eli to and accomplish what exactly? It's not like he was going to become the #1 color commentator on Fox if he simply ripped Eli.
It was an ill advised comment because he took it too far and could have worded it differently, but he was an NFL analyst, being asked a direct question, and gave his honest opinion based on his experiences.
I don't get what's so nefarious.
Respectfully, I don't really agree with that yet could be wrong. I believe the following reasons are why fans don't like him.
1. Being Ungrateful - Tiki threw Coughlin under the bus whereas it was Coughlin who helped solved Tiki's fumbling issues by instructing him on how to hold the ball more securely.
2. Disrespected the QB (Eli) - claiming Eli's attempt to be a leader was "comical" backfired as it truly represented Tiki's lack of leadership.
3. Retirement tour - this was a player who went on the record that he didn't have the heart anymore and made sure his retirement tour was more important and above the Ny Giants.
For those three reasons along with giving himself a pass with the phrase "i'm only expressing my opinion" I believe people perceive Tiki to be a self-absorbed and unlikable person.
And that is a comprehensive list of Miki's doochbaggery.
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Tiki retiring early pissed off a lot of fans and added to the resentment because there's this underlying spite that he didn't leave everything his body had on the field, as if he should have only retired as a broken down man. .
Respectfully, I don't really agree with that yet could be wrong. I believe the following reasons are why fans don't like him.
1. Being Ungrateful - Tiki threw Coughlin under the bus whereas it was Coughlin who helped solved Tiki's fumbling issues by instructing him on how to hold the ball more securely.
2. Disrespected the QB (Eli) - claiming Eli's attempt to be a leader was "comical" backfired as it truly represented Tiki's lack of leadership.
3. Retirement tour - this was a player who went on the record that he didn't have the heart anymore and made sure his retirement tour was more important and above the Ny Giants.
For those three reasons along with giving himself a pass with the phrase "i'm only expressing my opinion" I believe people perceive Tiki to be a self-absorbed and unlikable person.
This is a weak list.
1) Where's the vitriol for shockey who said "we were outcoached, write that down"?
2) Eli wasn't his QB anymore. Tiki wasn't on the team, he was an analyst. He doesn't owe Eli anything. You can find it distasteful, but it's not actively disrespecting your teammate and QB.
3) How did he make sure his "retirement tour" was above the Giants season? He saved Coughlin's job in the last game that year against the Redskins. What's the alternative - he keeps playing even though his heart isn't in it? Essentially you're saying the mere fact he announced he'd retire mid season is that big of a deal, even though he got us into the playoffs and saved Coughlin's job that year.
4) In a league of people like Cromartie, where these players are fucking everything that moves, this bothers you? After he retired? Besides, it's not like anyone here knows the relationship he had with his ex-wife, or his son from the marriage.
These are weak reasons. We've got Greg Hardy in this league and people are looking for reasons to hate Tiki. It just makes no sense.
He might be a douchebag but there's been so many worse people on the Giants.
Oh bullshit - plenty of players announce their impending retirement either before or during their last season, and he dragged the Giants into the playoffs pretty much singlehandedly.
Premeditated? Do you have some evidence of that? And didn't his "victory tour" include leading the Giants to the playoffs?
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Spot on. The true Tiki was unveiled with the selfish distraction in season victory tour retirement announcement. His relationship with Giants fans was all downhill from there as he prepared to enter his media career with the premeditated attacks on and at the expense of his teammates and coaches reputations.
Oh bullshit - plenty of players announce their impending retirement either before or during their last season, and he dragged the Giants into the playoffs pretty much singlehandedly.
A bit more happened than a retirement tour in case you forgot or didn't read
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In comment 12532107 PaulBlakeTSU said:
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Tiki retiring early pissed off a lot of fans and added to the resentment because there's this underlying spite that he didn't leave everything his body had on the field, as if he should have only retired as a broken down man. .
Respectfully, I don't really agree with that yet could be wrong. I believe the following reasons are why fans don't like him.
1. Being Ungrateful - Tiki threw Coughlin under the bus whereas it was Coughlin who helped solved Tiki's fumbling issues by instructing him on how to hold the ball more securely.
2. Disrespected the QB (Eli) - claiming Eli's attempt to be a leader was "comical" backfired as it truly represented Tiki's lack of leadership.
3. Retirement tour - this was a player who went on the record that he didn't have the heart anymore and made sure his retirement tour was more important and above the Ny Giants.
For those three reasons along with giving himself a pass with the phrase "i'm only expressing my opinion" I believe people perceive Tiki to be a self-absorbed and unlikable person.
This is a weak list.
1) Where's the vitriol for shockey who said "we were outcoached, write that down"?
2) Eli wasn't his QB anymore. Tiki wasn't on the team, he was an analyst. He doesn't owe Eli anything. You can find it distasteful, but it's not actively disrespecting your teammate and QB.
3) How did he make sure his "retirement tour" was above the Giants season? He saved Coughlin's job in the last game that year against the Redskins. What's the alternative - he keeps playing even though his heart isn't in it? Essentially you're saying the mere fact he announced he'd retire mid season is that big of a deal, even though he got us into the playoffs and saved Coughlin's job that year.
4) In a league of people like Cromartie, where these players are fucking everything that moves, this bothers you? After he retired? Besides, it's not like anyone here knows the relationship he had with his ex-wife, or his son from the marriage.
These are weak reasons. We've got Greg Hardy in this league and people are looking for reasons to hate Tiki. It just makes no sense.
He might be a douchebag but there's been so many worse people on the Giants.
Them call out the Giants and their fans for being weak. You're living on the moon if you believe the reasons are otherwise.
A bit more happened than a retirement tour in case you forgot or didn't read
Oh noes - he said something bad about Eli and St fucking Tommy. Quick - to the fainting couch!!
He didnt have make that public midseason, but the fact that he did was for the most part irrelevant. It certainly didnt stop him from beasting and getting us into the playoffs by setting franchise records at fed ex field. Its certainly foolish in my view to hold some animosity toward him over that almost a decade later
Holding the football differently once Coughlin arrived is working his ass off? Thought he was always working his ass off yet just fumbling at an alarming rate
Link - ( New Window )
He stopped fumbling over night and had his best seasons under Coughlin. The majority know he bit the hand that feeds him and one the many reasons he's disliked today. Of course, there are a slim few who think otherwise