McCarthy used to have a pretty good conservative rep, but when he got involved with the leadership he became just another establishment guy. Let's see how much weight the TP really has in the caucus for all you folks who think they run the show. So far Chafetz, who I grew a little disenchanted with in Utah, is what I guess you'd call the TP person in the race.
of frightened political figures in my lifetime. GOP politics has become a battle of witless dolts who pray for opportunities to compromise with an opposition party that is smart enough to know their competition are weak sisters. More than anything, I hope this finally pushes the electorate to reject the current GOP party orthodoxy of saying anything to get elected, then when elected scrambling to find the most squishy moderate position. More than any other time, the table is set for a big ideological shift... I think that shift will be toward a more decisive conservative (constitutional based -- not social) position, but it will have to come from the chaos that has been fueled by a couple of decades of fear and capitulation.
He seemed highly capable of giving his foot a home in his mouth.
Chafetz's handling of the Planned Parenthood hearing was close to world class incompetent, so I have no respect for him Who else is there that can get the needed number of votes of 218? Without a Speaker after Boehner retires, I wonder what happens on debt ceiling, shutting down government, etc.
McCarthy used to have a pretty good conservative rep, but when he got involved with the leadership he became just another establishment guy. Let's see how much weight the TP really has in the caucus for all you folks who think they run the show. So far Chafetz, who I grew a little disenchanted with in Utah, is what I guess you'd call the TP person in the race.
The same thing happened to my rep. He was Linders aide and when Linder retired, he was basically given the seat. Now he's a leadership toady. I'm not sure who will get the job, but I've heard a lot of people mention Daniel Webster.
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Alas.....
Yea, unfortunately they go for the guy that is conservative social issues and moderate fiscal issues (Bush). They need to flip their thinking!
I am surprised I haven't seen Trey Gowdy's name mentioned yet
He likes power. Or there is always Cathy McMorris Rodgers, who has more support among the Tea Party folks and is already Chair of the House Republican Conference
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Alas.....
I don't know if I agree, but I think it all depends on what your end goal is. I think I share some of their values but not all and even some that I share I don't think I am as inflexible or extreme, however...at my core I believe a person has the right to believe what they want to believe, that their beliefs have no less (or more) legitimacy than anyone else's, and that nobody should change them just for expediency's sake.
So, yeah, maybe by tempering them or rejecting them they would go further in terms of political power, but I think that there is something to respect in a person holding onto their won principles, especially at a cost.
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
If you only listen to what he says and not what he does, you might think so. Also, referring to conservatives as whackos and jackasses is not helpful.
He didn't call conservatives wackos. He called the Rejectionist Wing wackos.
Yes, they rejected the establishment. In case you haven't heard, the Republican establishment has been play fast and loose with their base. They campaign on one platform and do the opposite when they get into DC. Sure, they make a lot of noise and show votes, but they go along with what DC wants. The GOP base has caught on. Apparently the liberals haven't.
Because they would hemorrhage support from their existing voters while likely only picking up a trickle of new supporters to replace them. You're suggesting that there is a vast pool of potential voters who simply won't vote Republican because of what...abortion? Do you really think there are many Democrat voters who'd flip if the GOP would only embrace abortion?
Since Presidential elections only come down now to a few counties in a few states, I'm not sure that argument holds much water.
When independents can tip the scales in either direction, it absolutely matters.
The present GOP gets a pretty big hunk of their electoral support from Bible-Belt types. Take those planks out of the platform, and those voters either stay home or support somebody like a Carson or a Huckabee on a 3rd-party run.
The problem is not conservative vs liberal. The problem is an inability to compromise. By your logic, the conservatives have to vote purely to the right and the liberals to teh left. When the hell is anything going to get done if one side doesn't acknowledge, much less respect, the other side. It can't be my way or the highway or nothing good will get done. This argument with the GOP is about not recognizing the other and willing to do damage to the country to get their way.
What I've learned over the years is people vote for Party regardless of who the Party nominates. They say they will keep an open mind, but they really don't.
Are there really any independents? Or is that a self-described designation that makes one feel above messy Party politics?
I suspect "independents" tend to vote for one party over another too.
It's politically tone deaf. Unvarnished truth is not for public consumption.
Chafetz's handling of the Planned Parenthood hearing was close to world class incompetent, so I have no respect for him Who else is there that can get the needed number of votes of 218? Without a Speaker after Boehner retires, I wonder what happens on debt ceiling, shutting down government, etc.
He took himself out of the running. That would of been my guess too.
The same thing happened to my rep. He was Linders aide and when Linder retired, he was basically given the seat. Now he's a leadership toady. I'm not sure who will get the job, but I've heard a lot of people mention Daniel Webster.
Something Hilary will never have happen.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
If you only listen to what he says and not what he does, you might think so. Also, referring to conservatives as whackos and jackasses is not helpful.
Yes, yes
I don't know all the players, but I'd trust Ryan.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Alas.....
To a San Francisco leftist, yes, I'm sure Boehner seemed very conservative.
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Not even remotely close to being true
Quote:
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Alas.....
Yea, unfortunately they go for the guy that is conservative social issues and moderate fiscal issues (Bush). They need to flip their thinking!
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Conservative enough. He's pretty damn conservative.
To a San Francisco leftist, yes, I'm sure Boehner seemed very conservative.
i think he meant the radical right which seems to have the most juice today.
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If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Not even remotely close to being true
Why?
Quote:
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Alas.....
So, yeah, maybe by tempering them or rejecting them they would go further in terms of political power, but I think that there is something to respect in a person holding onto their won principles, especially at a cost.
Being fiscally conservative is radical right?
Quote:
The last 20 years, the GOP has been ruled by conservatives, both in the WH and Congress.
I think it's cute conservatives try to rewrite history, as if the continued GOP failures are due to anything but strict application of conservative values.
It's the moderates fault. Sure.
This is the mindnumbingly stupid part that I can't wrap my head around
If the GOP would embrace a moderate take on social issues, they'd win the POTUS general going away.
Alas.....
John kaisich comes to mind.
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Conservative enough. He's pretty damn conservative.
If you only listen to what he says and not what he does, you might think so. Also, referring to conservatives as whackos and jackasses is not helpful.
He didn't call conservatives wackos. He called the Rejectionist Wing wackos.
Being fiscally conservative is radical right?
Being fiscally conservative is radical right?
for me politics is about compromise,the FAR right has no interest in any kind of compromise with anyone who disagrees with their views.
Hell no. He was Boehner's heir apparent until he got voted out by a nobody.
When independents can tip the scales in either direction, it absolutely matters.
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is it considered "radical right" to insist that the politicians you elect do what they said they would do?
Being fiscally conservative is radical right?
for me politics is about compromise,the FAR right has no interest in any kind of compromise with anyone who disagrees with their views.
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In comment 12534439 SanFranNowNCGiantsFan said:
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Conservative enough. He's pretty damn conservative.
If you only listen to what he says and not what he does, you might think so. Also, referring to conservatives as whackos and jackasses is not helpful.
He didn't call conservatives wackos. He called the Rejectionist Wing wackos.
Yes, they rejected the establishment. In case you haven't heard, the Republican establishment has been play fast and loose with their base. They campaign on one platform and do the opposite when they get into DC. Sure, they make a lot of noise and show votes, but they go along with what DC wants. The GOP base has caught on. Apparently the liberals haven't.
Quote:
Since Presidential elections only come down now to a few counties in a few states, I'm not sure that argument holds much water.
When independents can tip the scales in either direction, it absolutely matters.
The present GOP gets a pretty big hunk of their electoral support from Bible-Belt types. Take those planks out of the platform, and those voters either stay home or support somebody like a Carson or a Huckabee on a 3rd-party run.
- Defunding Planned Parenthood
- Attempts to repeal the ACA
- Policies of union busting across the country
- Creationalists to local school boards, funded by big money
- Attempts to repeal civil marriages between gays in several states
- Neoconservative spearheading of war in Iraq
- Bush era tax cuts
- "Defense of Marriage"
- "No child Left Behind"
- Welfare Rollbacks
Now you can argue whether the excution and public narratives were successful, but to say that Conservative voices have somehow been stifled is bogus.
What I've learned over the years is people vote for Party regardless of who the Party nominates. They say they will keep an open mind, but they really don't.
Are there really any independents? Or is that a self-described designation that makes one feel above messy Party politics?
I suspect "independents" tend to vote for one party over another too.
I could be wrong.
the difference is obama/reid do not want govt to fail or default on its obligations.
Not even close.....
Not the very same thing can be said about President Obama and Harry Reid.
The Dem's aren't perfect by any means, but there are many of them who are willing to compromise on most Issues.
Also, they aren't really into brinkmanship politics.