Again missing the point. Let me bring you back to the question which was about compromise. DUring the stimulus discussions Obama wanted to get rid of the Bush tax cuts for the wealthiest people noting (CORRECTLY) that they did not need them and were not going to help grow the economy.
He eventually COMPROMISED (which you say he never did) to ensure that some stimulus went through,,,
The point was that you said only repubs talk about positions and that your lib friends do not. You specifically said they do not espouse taking money from the rich and giving it to the poor. My point is that if they mention taxes or tax cuts that are not across the board or do not flatten the tax rates, they actually are.
how do you not see the inherent contradiction between this: Â
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
Well voting for RINOs hasn't done the country any good. Bush spent almost as much as OBama.
It's fun listening to liberal leaning people talk about conservatives. You just don't get it. The GOP has burned its bridges with a lot of its base by not doing what they were elected to do. People are angry and frustrated. That is why Trump and Carson and Fiorina are doing so well. The establishment GOP is dead. They were just democrats lite anyway.
You say and think I lean liberal but my comments never support that.
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
It's not self-immolating if you feel the party no longer represents you at all, which is happening more and more every day.
Got some bad news for you, Greg
They never did represent you.
Yes, we know that. But what is funny is that people are still questioning why people who have voted republican are now rebelling.
Do you think the Democrats represent you? I used to think they represented the working man, but not anymore.
RE: RE: RE: Again, can people really say with a straight face Â
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
Well voting for RINOs hasn't done the country any good. Bush spent almost as much as OBama.
It's fun listening to liberal leaning people talk about conservatives. You just don't get it. The GOP has burned its bridges with a lot of its base by not doing what they were elected to do. People are angry and frustrated. That is why Trump and Carson and Fiorina are doing so well. The establishment GOP is dead. They were just democrats lite anyway.
You say and think I lean liberal but my comments never support that.
I agree completely. I have to say that, more than anyone else, I have a hard time in determining which side LTS is. SO I just assume...vapid?
but you're of the belief that government should play as limited a role as humanly possible and in a country as large, diverse, and free as ours, the government absolutely has to oversee A LOT.
Them's the breaks.
You need to get involved and support a libertarian party if you'd like to actually be represented.
As it stands, the GOP was never a strictly libertarian party.
They should oversee a lot. But it has to be within what is the purview of the federal government. Most of what they do now is not. That's not libertarian, that is how the government was set up.
The question was about what has Obama compromised on of which there are many examples but that was the first one that come to mind which made sense because it was an obvious example. It also showed a lot about the Republican party at the time of need in the country.
Regarding the left, I just don't see it and my FB friends or anywhere else don't compare to the vitriol and far right views. And factually incorrect views. Anything and everything that comes out they grasp on too. You can send them the link to Snopes where it showed they were 100% wrong and they ignore it.
And the funny part is that it has been that way from the very beginning. Remember Obama was going to have camps and all this other crazy shit....It was from the beginning and it never stopped.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Again, can people really say with a straight face Â
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
It's not self-immolating if you feel the party no longer represents you at all, which is happening more and more every day.
Got some bad news for you, Greg
They never did represent you.
Yes, we know that. But what is funny is that people are still questioning why people who have voted republican are now rebelling.
Do you think the Democrats represent you? I used to think they represented the working man, but not anymore.
No, democrats don't represent me at all. Nor do republicans.
Hence why I'm not affiliated.
I don't question why conservatives are disappointed with their party fwiw.
It is leading in the government and will likely be the elected. Maybe voting for Trump or Carson or Fiorina is some kind of picket sign you all are putting up but when one of them is not the candidate will you admit that the establishment is alive and well?
Sorry if I don't take your opinion as any value. If A Bush is nominated he will not win and then what with the establishment do? They are just a bunch of sad old men trying to stay in power while sucking up all the money from voters and donors. They remind me of Eldrich Palmer in the Strain.
All of the problems in Washington are due to Republicans. The President and the Democrats in Congress have nothing or very little to do with the problems.
This despite the fact that the Democrats controlled both Houses for two years, only lost the Senate recently, and the Executive Branch has never been stronger, the Legislative Branch more impotent, and a Judicial Branch willing to legislate on behalf of the White House.
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
Well voting for RINOs hasn't done the country any good. Bush spent almost as much as OBama.
It's fun listening to liberal leaning people talk about conservatives. You just don't get it. The GOP has burned its bridges with a lot of its base by not doing what they were elected to do. People are angry and frustrated. That is why Trump and Carson and Fiorina are doing so well. The establishment GOP is dead. They were just democrats lite anyway.
You say and think I lean liberal but my comments never support that.
I agree completely. I have to say that, more than anyone else, I have a hard time in determining which side LTS is. SO I just assume...vapid?
I appreciate that. I'm on side America. It feels quite lonely sometimes.
Ultimately, I've accepted that, at this time, libertarianism has no chance of being a credible player in national politics because the American public believes they can have their cake and eat it. Actually, this is why I've started to come around on the idea of shrugging at tax increases - you motherfuckers want Uncle Sugar to wrap you in his warm embrace? Then let's pay for it, and see how they like it. I'd love nothing more to call the bluff of the tax-the-rich crowd. They will never be able to collect enough from only the very rich to fund their utopia. Inevitably, everyone's going to have to take a haircut, probably a big one, and even then it may not be enough to pay for the leviathan. I'd prefer unpleasant honesty to reassuring fiction.
I am not liberal. I am a true moderate independent. I could like Kasich, I could like Rand friggin Paul.
I don't love Obama but think he did a good job overall with what he had to work with. I don't like Hillary. I always like Biden though. Not sure about Sanders but he might be right when everything is considered.
I am very pro gay rights, pro abortion rights, pro-gun, tend to be economically conservative although I cant stand the handouts to the rich when people focus on much smaller handouts to the poor. I would have made a fine fiscal conservative 20 years ago.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
No, I am saying the Republican party is out of date, and crazy to the right. It is not the same party from 20 years ago. What is right now is far right then. What is left now is moderate then.
I am not saying it is all the Republicans fault but much of it is. And to be on the side of Womens rights, Gay rights, People's rights over corporations rights is not such a radical concept.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
Agree on governorship but much of that is based on real dollars. Conservative spending. Now people are seeing their school budgets slashed and their property taxes going up.
There is a simple concept which I heard some time ago and makes sense and that is that the Republicans really don't like government and really aren't very good at it either for the same reason.
Listening is not compromising. Gates is not compromising.
Fiscal cliff and budget? Slowing the rate of growth is not the same thing as an actual cut.
Look, I tried to give you some examples on very short notice, apparently it's your party that is in dismay right now and you keep using Obama as a scapegoat for their inability to govern.
This is nothing new, as they have blamed Obama for pretty much everything that goes wrong.
Just look at the results in the past 7 years. After the Republicans took took control of the house in 2010, it's been a quagmire all over again & again.
People should use Obamacare to cure that Obama Derangement Syndrome.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos? Unemployment for those groups is sky high, they've lost economic progress that they gained over the past 20 years, blacks did better under Reagan than Obama, and he does deserve blame for that. The cities they live in are a mess, being run by democrats for decades. And look at the current candidates. Dems are all old white people. The Republicans have a black man, two Hispanics and an Asian.
Also, there are plenty of black evangelists. I'm not sure what 'Nationalists' or 'White Majority' groups you think the Republicans have catered to. The Dems have pretty much alienated whites, men in particular and now even women. And it remains to be seen if the black vote comes out if Obama is not on the ticket.
The same thing can be said of President Obama and Harry Reid.
.
the difference is obama/reid do not want govt to fail or default on its obligations.
The US will not default. That is a huge red herring. When there is a shut down, both sides are involved, not just one
Nice talking point but no cigar. Your threating to shutdown the government if Planned Parenthood isn't defunded, where is the compromise in that? The only reason this stunt is being pulled is because it can't pass as a stand alone.
So opponents should give in to childish tantrums when polls show a majority of Americans don't want funding eliminated:
"At a time when Republicans have been calling for cutting off federal funding to Planned Parenthood and threatening to shut down the government to do so, the new poll found that a strong majority of Americans — 61% — oppose eliminating funding, while 35% support a funding cut off."
Even people in favor of defunding don't want the gov't shut down because of this issue. Yes, the American public is more responsible than Republican Members of the House:
"But even among people who want to cut off funding to Planned Parenthood, only 27% favored forcing a government shutdown to accomplish the goal."
“If this happens, this is going to be very difficult for the American public to understand,” said GOP pollster Bill McInturff, who helped conduct the survey"
No witch hunt here with Obama (even though I don't like him).
I'm merely responding to the claim that the Republicans are the roadblock and the Democrats aren't.
Both sides are the problem.
The few examples you gave me are not compelling. Republicans gave Obama TPP, but they wanted it. That doesn't mean they are willing compromisers either, but they are clearly willing to vote with the President if it serves their interests.
Ultimately, I've accepted that, at this time, libertarianism has no chance of being a credible player in national politics because the American public believes they can have their cake and eat it. Actually, this is why I've started to come around on the idea of shrugging at tax increases - you motherfuckers want Uncle Sugar to wrap you in his warm embrace? Then let's pay for it, and see how they like it. I'd love nothing more to call the bluff of the tax-the-rich crowd. They will never be able to collect enough from only the very rich to fund their utopia. Inevitably, everyone's going to have to take a haircut, probably a big one, and even then it may not be enough to pay for the leviathan. I'd prefer unpleasant honesty to reassuring fiction.
I don't have much to add here. You're last sentence says it all.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos?
Terribly, thus highlighting the ridiculousness of the democratic party as well. They offer these blocs bread crumbs then they go jerk themselves off.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos? Unemployment for those groups is sky high, they've lost economic progress that they gained over the past 20 years, blacks did better under Reagan than Obama, and he does deserve blame for that. The cities they live in are a mess, being run by democrats for decades. And look at the current candidates. Dems are all old white people. The Republicans have a black man, two Hispanics and an Asian.
Also, there are plenty of black evangelists. I'm not sure what 'Nationalists' or 'White Majority' groups you think the Republicans have catered to. The Dems have pretty much alienated whites, men in particular and now even women. And it remains to be seen if the black vote comes out if Obama is not on the ticket.
Ask Steve Scalise about Nationalists. Do you really think he is the only one? Why is he still in leadership? Hell, he just might run fors peaker. And do not act like you never heard of the Southern Strategy before.
Black & Latinos are actually doing better than they were 30 years ago and definitely better than in 2007-2008. Maybe you can ask one for yourself as I have heard that lame argument before.
You talk as if there was some golden age for Blacks & latinos of Yesteryear....Gimme a break.
I don't think most on the left want big spending and raises in taxes either. I think there are some taxes that can be raised and some spending that should occur. Infrastructure in this country needs major repair. Even Trump says he will raise the taxes on some wealthy people and they can afford it. not sure how viable his plan is but it is not purely a left idea.
99% of the wealth is owned by what 1% of the people? There is a huge disparity in the country, middle class is deteriorating. Education is stupid expensive. One in 5 kids is born in poverty
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos?
Terribly, thus highlighting the ridiculousness of the democratic party as well. They offer these blocs bread crumbs then they go jerk themselves off.
You know, sometimes you have to take the breadcrumbs from one party if the other party is handing out dog shit.
I'll keep posting this every time. Eventually, someone might actually read it. Link - ( New Window )
I have read that a while ago, But the Southern Strategy does in fact exist & still being used by Republicans. It may have been used by Dem's as well before the 60's, But it exist is my point and still in play.
So for many Blacks & Latinos, it about the lesser of the 2 evils.
Gotta Choose One.
Let's Make It The Less Racist One.
RE: the Southern Strategy myth will never die, apparently Â
I'll keep posting this every time. Eventually, someone might actually read it. Link - ( New Window )
The last line of the article reads
"The development of the Southern GOP was a slow-moving, gradual process that lasted over a century, and is just being completed today."
now McCarthy should be investigated for admitting to abuse of power.
But if this opens the door for Chaffetz, then we are all the big losers in this. After the way he handled the Planned Parenthood hearing, it is clear that he is incompetent and either a scumbag or a lunatic for trying to make Planned Parenthood feel guilty for his parents cancer-caused deaths.
Melts - What I meant was that you have faith that the instutions aren't themselves inherently corrupting. You believe that there can be some kind of "good government"
Melts - What I meant was that you have faith that the instutions aren't themselves inherently corrupting. You believe that there can be some kind of "good government"
I wasn't retreating.
I was merely thanking you for the link. It more or less proved My point.
Not even a tiny bit. It directly contradicts your point.
It contradicts My point that it exist? Because that was My point, is that it does exist an being used today.
Are you saying it doesn't exist?
In case you didn't want to hear the audio of Lee Atwater, here is what he said.
Quote:
You start out in 1954 by saying, “Nigger, nigger, nigger.” By 1968 you can't say “nigger” — that hurts you. Backfires. So you say stuff like forced busing, states' rights and all that stuff. You're getting so abstract now [that] you're talking about cutting taxes, and all these things you're talking about are totally economic things and a byproduct of them is [that] blacks get hurt worse than whites.
And subconsciously maybe that is part of it. I'm not saying that. But I'm saying that if it is getting that abstract, and that coded, that we are doing away with the racial problem one way or the other. You follow me — because obviously sitting around saying, “We want to cut this,” is much more abstract than even the busing thing, and a hell of a lot more abstract than “Nigger, nigger.”
Do these statements sound familiar?
Do you think Black & Latinos can't this connection?
Melts - What I meant was that you have faith that the instutions aren't themselves inherently corrupting. You believe that there can be some kind of "good government"
Got it. Well I do believe there *can* be good government but the nature of our democracy right now? Yea the system is thoroughly corruptible for even the most well intentioned people.
I have some ideas for how to fix that but alas, I gotta focus on my own responsibilities first.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
How is Kansas doing nowadays?
Brownback was cited as a real conservative. A great candidate for president from the our party's nominee is not conservative enough crowd. Now, I'm sure they don't want anyone to look.
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
How is Kansas doing nowadays?
Brownback was cited as a real conservative. A great candidate for president from the our party's nominee is not conservative enough crowd. Now, I'm sure they don't want anyone to look.
As someone who leans Left, I always thought that John Huntsman or maybe Kasich would be OK as a consolation if a D lost, but they just do not have a chance in hell, because they are deemed too moderate.
But I wouldn't poop my pants if they were elected.
Fiscal cliff and budget? Slowing the rate of growth is not the same thing as an actual cut.
He eventually COMPROMISED (which you say he never did) to ensure that some stimulus went through,,,
and this:
Quote:
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
Well voting for RINOs hasn't done the country any good. Bush spent almost as much as OBama.
It's fun listening to liberal leaning people talk about conservatives. You just don't get it. The GOP has burned its bridges with a lot of its base by not doing what they were elected to do. People are angry and frustrated. That is why Trump and Carson and Fiorina are doing so well. The establishment GOP is dead. They were just democrats lite anyway.
You say and think I lean liberal but my comments never support that.
It would be the same for me trying to tell you what liberals want.
Quote:
in a country as ..... free as our
and this:
Quote:
the government absolutely has to oversee A LOT.
Government oversight =/= taking away freedom
In some cases? Sure.
Not all. Not by a long shot.
Quote:
In comment 12534625 GMenLTS said:
Quote:
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
It's not self-immolating if you feel the party no longer represents you at all, which is happening more and more every day.
Got some bad news for you, Greg
They never did represent you.
Yes, we know that. But what is funny is that people are still questioning why people who have voted republican are now rebelling.
Do you think the Democrats represent you? I used to think they represented the working man, but not anymore.
Quote:
In comment 12534625 GMenLTS said:
Quote:
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
Well voting for RINOs hasn't done the country any good. Bush spent almost as much as OBama.
It's fun listening to liberal leaning people talk about conservatives. You just don't get it. The GOP has burned its bridges with a lot of its base by not doing what they were elected to do. People are angry and frustrated. That is why Trump and Carson and Fiorina are doing so well. The establishment GOP is dead. They were just democrats lite anyway.
You say and think I lean liberal but my comments never support that.
Them's the breaks.
You need to get involved and support a libertarian party if you'd like to actually be represented.
As it stands, the GOP was never a strictly libertarian party.
They should oversee a lot. But it has to be within what is the purview of the federal government. Most of what they do now is not. That's not libertarian, that is how the government was set up.
Regarding the left, I just don't see it and my FB friends or anywhere else don't compare to the vitriol and far right views. And factually incorrect views. Anything and everything that comes out they grasp on too. You can send them the link to Snopes where it showed they were 100% wrong and they ignore it.
And the funny part is that it has been that way from the very beginning. Remember Obama was going to have camps and all this other crazy shit....It was from the beginning and it never stopped.
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Quote:
In comment 12534644 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 12534625 GMenLTS said:
Quote:
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
It's not self-immolating if you feel the party no longer represents you at all, which is happening more and more every day.
Got some bad news for you, Greg
They never did represent you.
Yes, we know that. But what is funny is that people are still questioning why people who have voted republican are now rebelling.
Do you think the Democrats represent you? I used to think they represented the working man, but not anymore.
No, democrats don't represent me at all. Nor do republicans.
Hence why I'm not affiliated.
I don't question why conservatives are disappointed with their party fwiw.
It is leading in the government and will likely be the elected. Maybe voting for Trump or Carson or Fiorina is some kind of picket sign you all are putting up but when one of them is not the candidate will you admit that the establishment is alive and well?
Sorry if I don't take your opinion as any value. If A Bush is nominated he will not win and then what with the establishment do? They are just a bunch of sad old men trying to stay in power while sucking up all the money from voters and donors. They remind me of Eldrich Palmer in the Strain.
You are basically saying this:
All of the problems in Washington are due to Republicans. The President and the Democrats in Congress have nothing or very little to do with the problems.
This despite the fact that the Democrats controlled both Houses for two years, only lost the Senate recently, and the Executive Branch has never been stronger, the Legislative Branch more impotent, and a Judicial Branch willing to legislate on behalf of the White House.
Wow.
Fiscal cliff and budget? Slowing the rate of growth is not the same thing as an actual cut.
Didn't Obama suggest the sequester as a threat and the Republicans took him up on it? LOL, the one time they got one over on him.
Quote:
In comment 12534663 buford said:
Quote:
In comment 12534625 GMenLTS said:
Quote:
that conservatives are going to just say fuck it, stay home, and let a dem win? Or fuck it, lets vote for this third party guy who has no chance, split our own party, and again let a dem win easily?
How self immolating would that be?
Well voting for RINOs hasn't done the country any good. Bush spent almost as much as OBama.
It's fun listening to liberal leaning people talk about conservatives. You just don't get it. The GOP has burned its bridges with a lot of its base by not doing what they were elected to do. People are angry and frustrated. That is why Trump and Carson and Fiorina are doing so well. The establishment GOP is dead. They were just democrats lite anyway.
You say and think I lean liberal but my comments never support that.
I agree completely. I have to say that, more than anyone else, I have a hard time in determining which side LTS is. SO I just assume...vapid?
I appreciate that. I'm on side America. It feels quite lonely sometimes.
I don't love Obama but think he did a good job overall with what he had to work with. I don't like Hillary. I always like Biden though. Not sure about Sanders but he might be right when everything is considered.
I am very pro gay rights, pro abortion rights, pro-gun, tend to be economically conservative although I cant stand the handouts to the rich when people focus on much smaller handouts to the poor. I would have made a fine fiscal conservative 20 years ago.
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
I am not saying it is all the Republicans fault but much of it is. And to be on the side of Womens rights, Gay rights, People's rights over corporations rights is not such a radical concept.
Quote:
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
How is Kansas doing nowadays?
There is a simple concept which I heard some time ago and makes sense and that is that the Republicans really don't like government and really aren't very good at it either for the same reason.
Fiscal cliff and budget? Slowing the rate of growth is not the same thing as an actual cut.
Look, I tried to give you some examples on very short notice, apparently it's your party that is in dismay right now and you keep using Obama as a scapegoat for their inability to govern.
This is nothing new, as they have blamed Obama for pretty much everything that goes wrong.
Just look at the results in the past 7 years. After the Republicans took took control of the house in 2010, it's been a quagmire all over again & again.
People should use Obamacare to cure that Obama Derangement Syndrome.
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos? Unemployment for those groups is sky high, they've lost economic progress that they gained over the past 20 years, blacks did better under Reagan than Obama, and he does deserve blame for that. The cities they live in are a mess, being run by democrats for decades. And look at the current candidates. Dems are all old white people. The Republicans have a black man, two Hispanics and an Asian.
Also, there are plenty of black evangelists. I'm not sure what 'Nationalists' or 'White Majority' groups you think the Republicans have catered to. The Dems have pretty much alienated whites, men in particular and now even women. And it remains to be seen if the black vote comes out if Obama is not on the ticket.
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In comment 12534500 Eric from BBI said:
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The same thing can be said of President Obama and Harry Reid.
.
the difference is obama/reid do not want govt to fail or default on its obligations.
The US will not default. That is a huge red herring. When there is a shut down, both sides are involved, not just one
Nice talking point but no cigar. Your threating to shutdown the government if Planned Parenthood isn't defunded, where is the compromise in that? The only reason this stunt is being pulled is because it can't pass as a stand alone.
So opponents should give in to childish tantrums when polls show a majority of Americans don't want funding eliminated:
"At a time when Republicans have been calling for cutting off federal funding to Planned Parenthood and threatening to shut down the government to do so, the new poll found that a strong majority of Americans — 61% — oppose eliminating funding, while 35% support a funding cut off."
Even people in favor of defunding don't want the gov't shut down because of this issue. Yes, the American public is more responsible than Republican Members of the House:
"But even among people who want to cut off funding to Planned Parenthood, only 27% favored forcing a government shutdown to accomplish the goal."
“If this happens, this is going to be very difficult for the American public to understand,” said GOP pollster Bill McInturff, who helped conduct the survey"
Link - ( New Window )
I'm merely responding to the claim that the Republicans are the roadblock and the Democrats aren't.
Both sides are the problem.
The few examples you gave me are not compelling. Republicans gave Obama TPP, but they wanted it. That doesn't mean they are willing compromisers either, but they are clearly willing to vote with the President if it serves their interests.
I don't have much to add here. You're last sentence says it all.
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That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos?
Terribly, thus highlighting the ridiculousness of the democratic party as well. They offer these blocs bread crumbs then they go jerk themselves off.
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That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos? Unemployment for those groups is sky high, they've lost economic progress that they gained over the past 20 years, blacks did better under Reagan than Obama, and he does deserve blame for that. The cities they live in are a mess, being run by democrats for decades. And look at the current candidates. Dems are all old white people. The Republicans have a black man, two Hispanics and an Asian.
Also, there are plenty of black evangelists. I'm not sure what 'Nationalists' or 'White Majority' groups you think the Republicans have catered to. The Dems have pretty much alienated whites, men in particular and now even women. And it remains to be seen if the black vote comes out if Obama is not on the ticket.
Ask Steve Scalise about Nationalists. Do you really think he is the only one? Why is he still in leadership? Hell, he just might run fors peaker. And do not act like you never heard of the Southern Strategy before.
Black & Latinos are actually doing better than they were 30 years ago and definitely better than in 2007-2008. Maybe you can ask one for yourself as I have heard that lame argument before.
You talk as if there was some golden age for Blacks & latinos of Yesteryear....Gimme a break.
99% of the wealth is owned by what 1% of the people? There is a huge disparity in the country, middle class is deteriorating. Education is stupid expensive. One in 5 kids is born in poverty
What is the Republican plan for this?
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In comment 12534696 Jint 77 said:
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That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
Let's see, the dems 'cater' to blacs and latinos? How is that working out for the blacks and latinos?
Terribly, thus highlighting the ridiculousness of the democratic party as well. They offer these blocs bread crumbs then they go jerk themselves off.
You know, sometimes you have to take the breadcrumbs from one party if the other party is handing out dog shit.
Lee Atwater explaining a bit of Southern Strategy....
https://youtu.be/AT2fsv7xt4E
Link - ( New Window )
Lol, you get from my posts that I have faith in these people and this system?
Hell, my faith in the public at large is waning tremendously lately.
I feel like one of the few rational people out there in a sea full of mouthbreathers.
I have read that a while ago, But the Southern Strategy does in fact exist & still being used by Republicans. It may have been used by Dem's as well before the 60's, But it exist is my point and still in play.
So for many Blacks & Latinos, it about the lesser of the 2 evils.
Gotta Choose One.
Let's Make It The Less Racist One.
The last line of the article reads
"The development of the Southern GOP was a slow-moving, gradual process that lasted over a century, and is just being completed today."
So it is not a myth. Thanks.
But if this opens the door for Chaffetz, then we are all the big losers in this. After the way he handled the Planned Parenthood hearing, it is clear that he is incompetent and either a scumbag or a lunatic for trying to make Planned Parenthood feel guilty for his parents cancer-caused deaths.
Melts - What I meant was that you have faith that the instutions aren't themselves inherently corrupting. You believe that there can be some kind of "good government"
Melts - What I meant was that you have faith that the instutions aren't themselves inherently corrupting. You believe that there can be some kind of "good government"
I wasn't retreating.
I was merely thanking you for the link. It more or less proved My point.
It contradicts My point that it exist? Because that was My point, is that it does exist an being used today.
Are you saying it doesn't exist?
In case you didn't want to hear the audio of Lee Atwater, here is what he said.
And subconsciously maybe that is part of it. I'm not saying that. But I'm saying that if it is getting that abstract, and that coded, that we are doing away with the racial problem one way or the other. You follow me — because obviously sitting around saying, “We want to cut this,” is much more abstract than even the busing thing, and a hell of a lot more abstract than “Nigger, nigger.”
Do these statements sound familiar?
Do you think Black & Latinos can't this connection?
He was rumored to be having an affair with a colleague. That would explain his abrupt decision to back out.
Melts - What I meant was that you have faith that the instutions aren't themselves inherently corrupting. You believe that there can be some kind of "good government"
Got it. Well I do believe there *can* be good government but the nature of our democracy right now? Yea the system is thoroughly corruptible for even the most well intentioned people.
I have some ideas for how to fix that but alas, I gotta focus on my own responsibilities first.
Maybe one day..
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In comment 12534696 Jint 77 said:
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That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
How is Kansas doing nowadays?
Brownback was cited as a real conservative. A great candidate for president from the our party's nominee is not conservative enough crowd. Now, I'm sure they don't want anyone to look.
If that had been a conservative professor?
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In comment 12534708 Eric from BBI said:
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In comment 12534696 Jint 77 said:
Quote:
That the Republican Party adopted the Southern Strategy of the last 40 years and didn't even try to cater to Black, Latino, or Asian groups like they did with the "Far Right Evangelists" and Nationalist groups and every other majority white group out there.....
And it's nothing wrong with catering to those groups, but at the expense of alienating all other groups at the same time is finally biting them in the ass.....And all they can do is blame Obama.
You have to admit at this point in time, they have no capability to govern.
I would argue that Republican state governors have been taking Democrat state governors to the wood shed in recent years.
How is Kansas doing nowadays?
Brownback was cited as a real conservative. A great candidate for president from the our party's nominee is not conservative enough crowd. Now, I'm sure they don't want anyone to look.
As someone who leans Left, I always thought that John Huntsman or maybe Kasich would be OK as a consolation if a D lost, but they just do not have a chance in hell, because they are deemed too moderate.
But I wouldn't poop my pants if they were elected.