I know many of the Mouth Breathers on here love to cite how "fans of other teams think Eli is an average QB"..
Well most fans don't actually watch other games so what they base these "informed opinions" is watching ESPN and NFL network..
Watching the highlights of last nights game on NFL.com (which are taken from Gameday Live) its easy to see how a clueless lazy fan might come to that conclusion..
Literally Irvin goes back and forth calling him Elly and Eli (good and bad Eli..get it?) and harps on the int and the near int on the last drive..
Never a mention of the defense allowing another 2 4th quarter TD drives..or allowing a QB and an offense that was pretty much dead in the water coming into the game look like one of the best offenses in the NFL..
Not one mention of our QB throwing for 441 while completing 75% of his passes with 3 scores..
Meanwhile Rodgers threw 2 picks yesterday and won 24-10, and Matty Ice threw 2 and also won..(in that recap we hear Ryan "couldn't get into any rhythm give the Redskins defense credit")..
What a joke..
And also this just reinforces the fact he needs to be almost perfect for us to have any chance to win..
Irvin is a moron - (
New Window )
Eli need to be highly productive in this system for people to even start changing their opinions of him. I can't remember Brett F. getting this much shit over his turnovers and bad decisions.
Eli gives us a punchers chance every time the Giants take the field. I'm good with that. Who gives a rats ass what these clowns in the media think. We are fans, short for fanatics, we know better. Or at least we should.
With that said, Eli will be laughing at those same people on his induction day to the HOF, IMO.
He had a great game. The INT and potential INT were the only bad throws I remember off the top of my head. Out of 54 attempts.
there was another dropped INT in the end zone. but otherwise I agree.
Quote:
Eli bashers will point to the potential INT that hit the turf, and continue believing Eli's 4th quarter play is 'luck'.
He had a great game. The INT and potential INT were the only bad throws I remember off the top of my head. Out of 54 attempts.
there was another dropped INT in the end zone. but otherwise I agree.
I felt like I was missing one - good call.
I have critiques from the game which is why I wouldn't say it was a great game by him but there not important enough to mention. Keep the rock rollin.
"Of course, Manning also fluttered pass after pass into, and out of, 49er hands, and also botched another timeout call late in the game. But this time when he fell down the stairs, he landed on his feet, and as always, seemed as surprised as the rest of us that he won."
Not going to link it because I don't want to drive traffic to this garbage. Seems like Shutdown Corner's writers have gotten really negative/sarcastic lately, but it almost seems like Busbee is writing for the peanut gallery here.
Eli need to be highly productive in this system for people to even start changing their opinions of him. I can't remember Brett F. getting this much shit over his turnovers and bad decisions.
this is on point - Eli wasn't a big fantasy stat producer for a long time, so many rank and file fans equated that to him not being that good
But then there's my buddy the Pats fan, who texted "Eli sucks!" after the INT to end the half.
To which I replied "And yet no matter how many different ways Brady cheats, he can't beat Eli in the Super Bowl"
hehe
I'd like to see what Eli and the coaches have to say about that INT.
I thought he threw the ball thinking OBJ would come back for it.
Maybe he just threw a bad ball (after a win, you don't harp on this shit--especially after Eli's day)
Maybe he mis-threw it.
Whatever it was, you especially get over it after the heroics of the finals minutes. Unless you're an asshole who still is heavily influenced by your dad's Giants and mis-perceptions.
to how good of a player he is. Was a great win.
Not that Eli doesn't deserve criticism for that throw (if you didn't have it, you should throw it away in that situation), but often times blame should be split on a play like that.
This sums it up nicely
Quote:
Sunday Night wrap-up: Eli Manning overcomes his mistakes
Posted by Darin Gantt on October 11, 2015, 11:40 PM EDT
The last drive will be the one people remember.
But despite a late rally to lead the Giants to a 30-27 win over the 49ers, there were still many, many things to be worried about for Eli Manning and their passing game.
He hit Larry Donnell for the game-winning touchdown with 26 seconds left, capping an impressive-looking stat line. He finished with a career-high 41 completions for 441 yards and three touchdowns.
But there were just enough bad plays mixed in to make a game far more interesting than it should have been. The interception he threw just before halftime could have been three free points, and he nearly threw another pick prior to a go-ahead field goal late in the fourth. And the accidental timeout call (which may have been confused for something else) was nearly another late-game clock management snafu.
The touchdown pass to Donnell will be described as clutch, but it was also extremely fortunate since Manning was running out of people to throw to.
Star wideout Odell Beckham left in the fourth quarter with a hamstring injury and returned for the final drive well enough to draw a penalty. And when Rueben Randle was lost with his own hamstring problem, the Giants were playing in a tie game with Dwayne Harris, Myles White and Geremy Davis at wide receiver.
(Is this where we’re obliged to mention what James Jones is doing for the Packers? We think it is. Five touchdowns since being cut by the Giants and rejoining Aaron Rodgers. Sorry.)
But Manning made enough things happen at the right time to make it moot. For a moment.
Link - ( New Window )
What a fucking fuckwad. From where was this steaming pile of excrement pulled?
This too. No QB is perfect. Eli is damn good, but not perfect. However, it appears that discussing a bad play, which will happen to any QB, is a mortal sin here. Slamming anyone who deigns to talk about a mistake, is a badge of "I'm a good fan and you are stupid" level of pettiness.
That said, Eli was lights out last night and there's no one else I would rather have as our Giants QB considering the whole package.
He won 2 Superbowls, he beat Brady twice to put the cherry on top. There is no argument on if he is a hell of a player, I don't complain at all about his ability, but his decision making is what can get people frustrated, especially at the end of halfs. He is too much of a gambler in certain situations. Gamble when it calls for, but when you have 3 points in the bag that puts you up 2 scores before the half, you can not throw a pick on the last play from scrimmage.
When Favre made dumb mistakes it was all about him "just wanting to win games and he's a gunslinger"
If he had done it on a play that stopped the clock, that might be something to hand-wring about, not stopping the clock after a long completion in the field of play.
And frankly, Coleman got it wrong anyway. He blew the whistle when the clock was at :53 and they only moved it back to :50.
However, I recall at LEAST 2 of his passes that hit guys in the hands (one to OBJ, another to Harris) that were not completed.
We're never going to get perfect. Hell, even Phil's "perfect" Super Bowl had a TD that was a tipped ball. A couple inches more and is it an INT?
Eli makes some infuriating passes and decisions from time to time. But that guy is aces in my book. Last night was just another notch on his belt. And (sniff sniff) in my heart.
I LOVE YOU ELI!!!!! lol
Remember these old quotes from the Parcells Simms era:
I’ll never forget the opening game of the ’84 season against the Philadelphia Eagles. Coach was standing at the locker room door saying things to players as they walked by. As I passed him, he says, “Hey Simms, if you don’t throw at least two interceptions today, you’re not taking enough chances.” I’m thinking, “Wow! What a thing to say to a quarterback!” It was his way of giving me a quick message to try to take the pressure off so I could relax and go out and play to the best of my ability. He did the same thing in Super Bowl XXI. All week long he kept telling me, “Make sure you’re aggressive and don’t be afraid to take a chance.”
Outside of locker rooms, everyone is obsessed with stats like picks. Inside locker rooms, all they care about is wins. Did you win? Then who gives a shit that you threw some picks?
Yeah, there are times Eli should throw the ball away -- but that's easy to say in hindsight. He IS a gunslinger (like Favre and others). He's trying to make things happen to win the game -- and he has earned the right to do that. These guys are not always looking for the "safest" play. They take chances, and sometimes it goes wrong.
If you want to see how bad Eli's interception stats are in the context of history and other QBs (included HOFers) see the link below.
All time Interceptions leader - ( New Window )
You have been here long enough to not be surprised by that.
Quote:
and come away with the interpretation that he was taking shots at Eli, especially when he was calling out Faulk for not giving him close to enough credit.
You have been here long enough to not be surprised by that.
Heh! ... and LOL
Dave did you watch the clip I posted..?
2011 is the year we can all point to and say "That's the real Eli we all know is a cold as ice assassin"
2013 is the year the haters can all point to and say "That's the real Eli we all know is a goofy INT machine"
2014 was a good bounceback season but it wasn't enough to remove the taste of shit from our mouths that 2013 provided. If he keeps playing like this in 2015, people will start to realize 2013 was an anomaly and give him more credit.
I'd say he was dealt a bad hand, and I think there is a large enough sample size (the other 8 or 9 years of his career), to do that without waiting for a turnaround.
Especially considering how last year, and this year have gone, and there's already been said turnaround.
But even when he was given time he was missing passes left and right.
He threw 27 INTs and 18 TDs.
I don't care however many excused you want to make. A -9 TD to INT differential in today's day and age is nothing short of pathetic. Sure bad protection led to some and bad receiver play led to others, but 27 is a huge number and a lot of those were completely on Eli.
Gilbride's O looked broken and archaic in 2013 and Eli has been much better in Mac's O (40 TD to 16 INT the past 21 games). But 2013 was so awful it left a bad imprint on the minds of fans. It was his 3rd time leading the league in INTs and he led by a lot.
He looks poised for a great year though. If he keeps it up people will start to remember how good he really is.
Hakeem Nicks had a fork deep in his back the entire season.
Look at this offense:
Running backs:
35 Andre Brown
39 John Conner FB
29 Michael Cox KR
44 Peyton Hillis
0 Left
Wide receivers:
80 Victor Cruz
12 Jerrel Jernigan
18 Louis Murphy
88 Hakeem Nicks
82 Rueben Randle PR
19 Julian Talley
Only 2 guys left
Tight ends:
84 Larry Donnell
83 Brandon Myers
86 Bear Pascoe FB
81 Adrien Robinson
Only 1 left
Offensive linemen:
65 Will Beatty T
77 Kevin Boothe C
73 James Brewer G
66 David Diehl G
79 Stephen Goodin G/T
62 Eric Herman G
67 Brandon Mosley G/T
72 Justin Pugh T
61 Dallas Reynolds C
3 guys left
There are only 6 total guys left from that 2013 offense. What does that tell you about that team?
That was a horrible, HORRIBLE roster on offense.
Fewer of them under McAdoo. But that near INT on the final drive? Wow, that was bad. We got a bit lucky that ball hit the turf.
Eli is what he is. Very talented, hard working, tough and prepared and also prone to a few "WTF!?!" plays a game.
There's no harm in admitting he stunk that year, at least not now that he's gotten himself back on track (with assists from McAdoo, Langsdorf, and now Sullivan).
I think coughlin/McAdoo/eli need to collectively re-assess clock management and playcalling (risk/return) to close out halves and games as there have been some costly mistakes but if he can play as well as he has the first 5 games we should be in good shape.
I was talking national perception
I think coughlin/McAdoo/eli need to collectively re-assess clock management and playcalling (risk/return) to close out halves and games as there have been some costly mistakes but if he can play as well as he has the first 5 games we should be in good shape.
Not surprisingly, Eli's Yards per Completion is at 10.8 this season which is a career-low and his Completion % is at 66.7% which is a career-high.
Turnovers are down.
I think we can safely say at this point that a LOT of what was happening with Eli during his first ten years was as much as a result of offensive philosophy and system, as it was him.
I think this was one of the reasons a lot of people, myself, included, wanted to see him in another system (quarterback friendly) before it was said and done to know for sure.
It's not over yet, but I'm thinking that we can see that system plays a large part in what a QB's numbers look like.
The typical national fan won't realize that when they check out Eli's career numbers in the future.
Surprisingly, most fans (on Reddit at least, not nationally) have come around to respecting Eli, and understood the difference in scheme and the subsequent impact on stats.
There were two fans, one an Eagles fan and one a Vikings fan, who still shit on Eli. The Vikings fan said there were "easily" 10 QBs better than him last year, and even said "arguably Tannehill".
Eagles fan was your typical bitter Eagle fan, saying that Eli was lucky, should have 10 picks already, etc etc.
Both did get downvoted into oblivion though, so it seems that the perception is beginning to change.
A couple more systems in McAdoos offense should do the track.... and dare Is say another ring?
thread for those interested - ( New Window )
and thats what killed me. Of all games to jump all over him. I mean statistically it was a monster game.
Fewer of them under McAdoo. But that near INT on the final drive? Wow, that was bad. We got a bit lucky that ball hit the turf.
Eli is what he is. Very talented, hard working, tough and prepared and also prone to a few "WTF!?!" plays a game.
You need to rewatch that play...or read Eric's review!!
He was hit as he threw..another thing that should have been picked up by the "the expert analysts" but was not as they were intent on continuing their narrative..
The same people that care about power rankings?
Awesome-
And "this is the offense we should have run" bullshit. We likely win zero Super Bowls without our old offense. So what would this whiny fan boyish concern over "the perception of Eli" be without 2 Super Bowls?
Good lord- these posts as if people have been wronged when the Giants are too low in power rankings or Drew Brees is ranked too high on a qb list. Is there not more to life... And football ... Then this?
The same people that care about power rankings?
Awesome-
And "this is the offense we should have run" bullshit. We likely win zero Super Bowls without our old offense. So what would this whiny fan boyish concern over "the perception of Eli" be without 2 Super Bowls?
Good lord- these posts as if people have been wronged when the Giants are too low in power rankings or Drew Brees is ranked too high on a qb list. Is there not more to life... And football ... Then this?
This is close minded. I wanted to see Eli in a more QB friendly system to see if the turnovers were a result of his play or a result of the offensive system. A reasonable thing to wonder, IMO.
Especially if you believe that the turnover battle is often key to winning a game.
NOBODY on this board was a bigger defender of the Gilbride system than I was.