The perception of Eli by fans of other teams..(a bit long)

and why NFLN allows this buffoon on the air is beyond comprehension. He was worse with Warren Sapp.

He was interrupting the announcer doing the game highlights, so many times that the announcer had to stop and say "stop it Michael".

Hopefully he'll get caught doing something and go a similar route to Warren Sapp

But he makes some of the stupidest decisions I have seen. Just because a player is a hell of a player does not mean they do not make mistakes, and he makes a lot of them and people have the right to complain about them.

He won 2 Superbowls, he beat Brady twice to put the cherry on top. There is no argument on if he is a hell of a player, I don't complain at all about his ability, but his decision making is what can get people frustrated, especially at the end of halfs. He is too much of a gambler in certain situations. Gamble when it calls for, but when you have 3 points in the bag that puts you up 2 scores before the half, you can not throw a pick on the last play from scrimmage.

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Eli bashers will point to the potential INT that hit the turf, and continue believing Eli's 4th quarter play is 'luck'.

He had a great game. The INT and potential INT were the only bad throws I remember off the top of my head. Out of 54 attempts.

and supportive big time of ELi..

His Eli Elly point was that Eli never gets so rattled that he can't come back. That many QBs once they're rattled are done for a game and he said Eli is great that way. I'm no Irvin fan but he was all over Faulk about dissing Eli.

Faulk was the one who had to be forced into giving Eli any credit

Quote:

Sunday Night wrap-up: Eli Manning overcomes his mistakes Posted by Darin Gantt on October 11, 2015, 11:40 PM EDT The last drive will be the one people remember. But despite a late rally to lead the Giants to a 30-27 win over the 49ers, there were still many, many things to be worried about for Eli Manning and their passing game. He hit Larry Donnell for the game-winning touchdown with 26 seconds left, capping an impressive-looking stat line. He finished with a career-high 41 completions for 441 yards and three touchdowns. But there were just enough bad plays mixed in to make a game far more interesting than it should have been. The interception he threw just before halftime could have been three free points, and he nearly threw another pick prior to a go-ahead field goal late in the fourth. And the accidental timeout call (which may have been confused for something else) was nearly another late-game clock management snafu. The touchdown pass to Donnell will be described as clutch, but it was also extremely fortunate since Manning was running out of people to throw to. Star wideout Odell Beckham left in the fourth quarter with a hamstring injury and returned for the final drive well enough to draw a penalty. And when Rueben Randle was lost with his own hamstring problem, the Giants were playing in a tie game with Dwayne Harris, Myles White and Geremy Davis at wide receiver. (Is this where we’re obliged to mention what James Jones is doing for the Packers? We think it is. Five touchdowns since being cut by the Giants and rejoining Aaron Rodgers. Sorry.) But Manning made enough things happen at the right time to make it moot. For a moment.

Link - ( New Window )

I don't remember them saying Good Brett and Bad Brett when Brett threw tons of picks -- and he threw more than anyone. Or them calling Peyton Bad Peyton when he throws them, or has one of his impatient melt-down games. I'm not saying Eli is Brett or Peyton, but YES, you'd think after two SBMVPs and holding every Giants passing record in history already, this nonsense would be over by now.

One day these guys are going to be watching Eli go into the HOF, and they'll be scratching their heads wondering: How did often-bad Eli throw for all those yards and TDs?

When you get rid of the BS, most fans of other teams will say he is a really good QB. I was in PA recently talking to a bunch of Eagle fans, and they all agree he is very good.

He is easy target to get on, he is not his brother and people still don't like the fact he forced the trade.

His media perception will not change - it is what it is.

In comment 12543646 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

Quote: Sunday Night wrap-up: Eli Manning overcomes his mistakes Posted by Darin Gantt on October 11, 2015, 11:40 PM EDT The last drive will be the one people remember. But despite a late rally to lead the Giants to a 30-27 win over the 49ers, there were still many, many things to be worried about for Eli Manning and their passing game. He hit Larry Donnell for the game-winning touchdown with 26 seconds left, capping an impressive-looking stat line. He finished with a career-high 41 completions for 441 yards and three touchdowns. But there were just enough bad plays mixed in to make a game far more interesting than it should have been. The interception he threw just before halftime could have been three free points, and he nearly threw another pick prior to a go-ahead field goal late in the fourth. And the accidental timeout call (which may have been confused for something else) was nearly another late-game clock management snafu. The touchdown pass to Donnell will be described as clutch, but it was also extremely fortunate since Manning was running out of people to throw to. Star wideout Odell Beckham left in the fourth quarter with a hamstring injury and returned for the final drive well enough to draw a penalty. And when Rueben Randle was lost with his own hamstring problem, the Giants were playing in a tie game with Dwayne Harris, Myles White and Geremy Davis at wide receiver. (Is this where we’re obliged to mention what James Jones is doing for the Packers? We think it is. Five touchdowns since being cut by the Giants and rejoining Aaron Rodgers. Sorry.) But Manning made enough things happen at the right time to make it moot. For a moment. Link - ( New Window )

one of the worst articles I've ever read. Eli is by far and away one of the most underrated players now and maybe in nfl history.

In comment 12543628 I Love Clams Casino said:

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and why NFLN allows this buffoon on the air is beyond comprehension. He was worse with Warren Sapp. He was interrupting the announcer doing the game highlights, so many times that the announcer had to stop and say "stop it Michael". Hopefully he'll get caught doing something and go a similar route to Warren Sapp

This. I watched the 5 minute clip on the giants app of them doing the highlights on the NFLN after the game and irvin was a complete jackass. I dont know who the fuck he was talking but he was literally talking the whole time to whoever was sitting next to him while the main guy was doing the highlights. How the hell can the producers see and watch this and think it's a good product? Whatever happened to a little bit of profesionalism?

that Eli throws 54 times, completing 76% of his passes to a team missing their veteran slot receiver to a knee injury, a back-up tight end to MRSA and he still needs to have a game-winning two-minute drive to beat a team that has looked like dogshit all season. And on that game-winning drive, the majority of it was without their #1 WR and their #3-turned-#2 WR to hamstring injuries.

Any article that leads with discussing Eli overcoming his mistakes in this game should only be used at the bottom of a birdcage.

with two minutes left and the goal line almost out of sight. Well, maybe Unitas.

And I remember Accorsi's statement...JOhn Unitas has something that sets him apart from the other QB's And he has two of them.

things said about Eli or the Giants.

Quote:

Literally Irvin goes back and forth calling him Elly and Eli (good and bad Eli..get it?) and harps on the int and the near int on the last drive..

I think he was complimenting Eli. If you listened to the context when he was saying all this they had just picked Giants as being just below but right with there with the very best teams in the league record and stats wise, but then Faulk went on to say that he thought the Giants could still beat any of those teams and that Eli had a way about him of rising to a higher level when going up against an elite QB and Eli elevates his game in those situations.

Then Irvin, agreeing with that premise was giving Eli credit and said basically Eli was unflappable, and went on to kind of joke how no matter what happens Eli was still the cool collected calm Eli, he was making the point if you rattled him in the 1st quarter where many other qb's would be off their game for the rest of the game Eli would come right back like nothing happened being Eli again in the second QTR. If you rattled him again in the 3rd you can be sure the cool calm Eli would be right back to finish the game in the 4th qtr. He was making the point that Eli was a cool customer and nothing rattles him. He was agree with Faluk and made a point of saying the Giants because of Eli could beat any team and he said on any given day the Giants can beat any of them largely because of Eli.

In comment 12543650 David B. said:

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I don't remember them saying Good Brett and Bad Brett when Brett threw tons of picks -- and he threw more than anyone. Or them calling Peyton Bad Peyton when he throws them, or has one of his impatient melt-down games. I'm not saying Eli is Brett or Peyton, but YES, you'd think after two SBMVPs and holding every Giants passing record in history already, this nonsense would be over by now. One day these guys are going to be watching Eli go into the HOF, and they'll be scratching their heads wondering: How did often-bad Eli throw for all those yards and TDs?

I've been comparing Eli to a poor man's Favre for some time now (others have too, this isn't a unique insight by me). I think the narrative on Eli would be different if he had a more outwardly fiery personality, as dumb as that sounds.

Take Eli as my QB any day of the week. If you give him a decent supporting case and a o line that can give him time, he'll be successful. This system allows him to really be in control. And he's playing great because of it. Btw, I love the way he put his head down and ran for the 1st down last night. Last thing, When Donnell caught that touch down, read Eli's lips. This guy wants to win

100.7 passer rating for the season.

McAdoo has done wonders with this kid.

you still have a couple of BBI posters who think Eli was "lucky" in the Super Bowl that a pass about 2 feet over a CB's head wasn't picked because Samuel got his fingertip on the ball.

Looked to me like he was expecting the receiver (Beckham?) to turn back for the back shoulder pass, but instead he broke towards end line and left the ball open to the defender.

yesterday you saw that he threw the ball away every time he was under pressure and that kept his team in the game. Eli was always at his best when he threw the ball away under pressure. He did that during both Superbowl runs but it was an adjustment he made for the postseason. Eli has a tendency to go through stretches during the season where he's trying to squeeze passes in to force the action and he has had success doing that when he's had WR who will go up and fight for the ball (Plax, Toomer, Cruz) but when he does not it's a disaster. People who know little about the game only respect big stats and Eli has rarely been on top of the mountain in qb rating, tds or passing yards so his greatness comes down to intangibles and his biggest intangible is how he can elevate his play when his team needs him the most. I'm ok with the kind of respect he gets around the league, reminds me of the same respect Jeter got - another player who's value cannot be calculated with numbers.

Even when Al Michaels first came on the air last night, he introduced the QB matchup as follows: "Colin Kaepernick, who led the 49ers to Super Bowl 47, takes on Eli Manning and the New York Giants." Really? That's the accomplishment you're going to highlight between those two?

I was annoyed listening to Irvin there, too. All the "good Eli" and "bad Eli" shit has always irked me. He's not a dog.

and I truly agree with this, Eli is under the microscope more than any athlete I have ever seen in NY. Every throw and every decision is made into a media event. He is a qb, not the best in the league, but a damn fine one. And, even the best ones make plenty of mistakes. There are two Qbs I would trade for Eli for now (Brady, Rodgers) and that is it. Despite the media perception, he is a smart, durable, winning qb. They don't grow on trees in this league.

are looking for ways to be offended.

...too many people don't watch the guy every week and let the production team on four-letter network and the prick in the production truck who decides to show him making emotional gestures dictate how they evaluate Eli as a QB.

is by now the opinions of Eli have been formed and based on the results of the past system. What if we ran this system with Eli first, when he was drafted? What would opinion of him be then?

Eli need to be highly productive in this system for people to even start changing their opinions of him. I can't remember Brett F. getting this much shit over his turnovers and bad decisions.

to enjoy the Eli Manning era while you can. There will come a time when we will look back longingly. There are a lot of Scott Brunner, Kent Graham, Dave Brown games that end up completely meaningless. Your team can not win consistently with these guys at the helm.

Eli gives us a punchers chance every time the Giants take the field. I'm good with that. Who gives a rats ass what these clowns in the media think. We are fans, short for fanatics, we know better. Or at least we should.

mistakes of forcing balls downfield. It's a good system for him in this juncture of his career.

With that said, Eli will be laughing at those same people on his induction day to the HOF, IMO.

and if that happened during some of his other games I might agree...But damn last night was such an odd game to bring out the old story lines and shit on him. He led a fourth quarter come back and was off the charts statistically and they point to the one pick and the "almost picks." They were literally looking to critique every incompletion not taking into account how many passes he threw and just how good he was outside of some of those passes.

In comment 12543644 BrettNYG10 said:

Quote:

Eli bashers will point to the potential INT that hit the turf, and continue believing Eli's 4th quarter play is 'luck'. He had a great game. The INT and potential INT were the only bad throws I remember off the top of my head. Out of 54 attempts.

there was another dropped INT in the end zone. but otherwise I agree.

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but I know how sensitive this place can be to any criticism Eli gets, no matter how true it is.

In comment 12544013 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

In comment 12543644 BrettNYG10 said: Quote: Eli bashers will point to the potential INT that hit the turf, and continue believing Eli's 4th quarter play is 'luck'. He had a great game. The INT and potential INT were the only bad throws I remember off the top of my head. Out of 54 attempts. there was another dropped INT in the end zone. but otherwise I agree.

I felt like I was missing one - good call.

This is the offense the Giants should have had since Eli was drafted. He was accurate enough through 20 yards. And what I waited to see was would he find a way to get it done with Odell, Randall & Cruz on the sidelines and he got it done. For the 1st time in a long time it felt like the old Eli.

I have critiques from the game which is why I wouldn't say it was a great game by him but there not important enough to mention. Keep the rock rollin.

like this examples from Jay Busbee's article for Shutdown Corner:

"Of course, Manning also fluttered pass after pass into, and out of, 49er hands, and also botched another timeout call late in the game. But this time when he fell down the stairs, he landed on his feet, and as always, seemed as surprised as the rest of us that he won."

Not going to link it because I don't want to drive traffic to this garbage. Seems like Shutdown Corner's writers have gotten really negative/sarcastic lately, but it almost seems like Busbee is writing for the peanut gallery here.

In comment 12543809 AnishPatel said:

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is by now the opinions of Eli have been formed and based on the results of the past system. What if we ran this system with Eli first, when he was drafted? What would opinion of him be then? Eli need to be highly productive in this system for people to even start changing their opinions of him. I can't remember Brett F. getting this much shit over his turnovers and bad decisions.

this is on point - Eli wasn't a big fantasy stat producer for a long time, so many rank and file fans equated that to him not being that good

But then there's my buddy the Pats fan, who texted "Eli sucks!" after the INT to end the half.

To which I replied "And yet no matter how many different ways Brady cheats, he can't beat Eli in the Super Bowl"

hehe

don't appreciate what they have in Eli WAY too often.

I'd like to see what Eli and the coaches have to say about that INT.

I thought he threw the ball thinking OBJ would come back for it.

Maybe he just threw a bad ball (after a win, you don't harp on this shit--especially after Eli's day)

Maybe he mis-threw it.

Whatever it was, you especially get over it after the heroics of the finals minutes. Unless you're an asshole who still is heavily influenced by your dad's Giants and mis-perceptions.

but Eli was fantastic last night. Especially on the game winner. With what he had out there It really is a testament
to how good of a player he is. Was a great win.

Good point Randy - I think Odell getting jammed at the line threw that play off. I'd have to rewatch.

Not that Eli doesn't deserve criticism for that throw (if you didn't have it, you should throw it away in that situation), but often times blame should be split on a play like that.

In comment 12543785 Essex said:

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and I truly agree with this, Eli is under the microscope more than any athlete I have ever seen in NY. Every throw and every decision is made into a media event. He is a qb, not the best in the league, but a damn fine one. And, even the best ones make plenty of mistakes. There are two Qbs I would trade for Eli for now (Brady, Rodgers) and that is it. Despite the media perception, he is a smart, durable, winning qb. They don't grow on trees in this league.

This sums it up nicely

In comment 12543646 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

Quote: Sunday Night wrap-up: Eli Manning overcomes his mistakes Posted by Darin Gantt on October 11, 2015, 11:40 PM EDT The last drive will be the one people remember. But despite a late rally to lead the Giants to a 30-27 win over the 49ers, there were still many, many things to be worried about for Eli Manning and their passing game. He hit Larry Donnell for the game-winning touchdown with 26 seconds left, capping an impressive-looking stat line. He finished with a career-high 41 completions for 441 yards and three touchdowns. But there were just enough bad plays mixed in to make a game far more interesting than it should have been. The interception he threw just before halftime could have been three free points, and he nearly threw another pick prior to a go-ahead field goal late in the fourth. And the accidental timeout call (which may have been confused for something else) was nearly another late-game clock management snafu. The touchdown pass to Donnell will be described as clutch, but it was also extremely fortunate since Manning was running out of people to throw to. Star wideout Odell Beckham left in the fourth quarter with a hamstring injury and returned for the final drive well enough to draw a penalty. And when Rueben Randle was lost with his own hamstring problem, the Giants were playing in a tie game with Dwayne Harris, Myles White and Geremy Davis at wide receiver. (Is this where we’re obliged to mention what James Jones is doing for the Packers? We think it is. Five touchdowns since being cut by the Giants and rejoining Aaron Rodgers. Sorry.) But Manning made enough things happen at the right time to make it moot. For a moment. Link - ( New Window )

What a fucking fuckwad. From where was this steaming pile of excrement pulled?

That throws almost ints.

In comment 12544027 Stupendamatic said:

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but I know how sensitive this place can be to any criticism Eli gets, no matter how true it is.

This too. No QB is perfect. Eli is damn good, but not perfect. However, it appears that discussing a bad play, which will happen to any QB, is a mortal sin here. Slamming anyone who deigns to talk about a mistake, is a badge of "I'm a good fan and you are stupid" level of pettiness.

That said, Eli was lights out last night and there's no one else I would rather have as our Giants QB considering the whole package.

these guys are given cue cards in terms of what to say? some say good things and some say bad things to get you to watch and become emotional.

In comment 12543757 jsuds said:

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Looked to me like he was expecting the receiver (Beckham?) to turn back for the back shoulder pass, but instead he broke towards end line and left the ball open to the defender.

I thought that initially, then it looked like the DB cut underneath Beckham, taking away the inside and back shoulder, then I watch it again and I'm up in the air. In either scenario, I think the throw was too far inside, but not necessarily a bad decision.

In comment 12543629 PaulN said:

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But he makes some of the stupidest decisions I have seen. Just because a player is a hell of a player does not mean they do not make mistakes, and he makes a lot of them and people have the right to complain about them. He won 2 Superbowls, he beat Brady twice to put the cherry on top. There is no argument on if he is a hell of a player, I don't complain at all about his ability, but his decision making is what can get people frustrated, especially at the end of halfs. He is too much of a gambler in certain situations. Gamble when it calls for, but when you have 3 points in the bag that puts you up 2 scores before the half, you can not throw a pick on the last play from scrimmage.

When Favre made dumb mistakes it was all about him "just wanting to win games and he's a gunslinger"

we would have lost a few more seconds waiting for people to get lined up, I don't see the agita regarding the Timeout.

If he had done it on a play that stopped the clock, that might be something to hand-wring about, not stopping the clock after a long completion in the field of play.

And frankly, Coleman got it wrong anyway. He blew the whistle when the clock was at :53 and they only moved it back to :50.

Don't recall the target - maybe Randle - but he WAY over-threw it on he near sideline, about 12-15 yards up.

However, I recall at LEAST 2 of his passes that hit guys in the hands (one to OBJ, another to Harris) that were not completed.

We're never going to get perfect. Hell, even Phil's "perfect" Super Bowl had a TD that was a tipped ball. A couple inches more and is it an INT?

Eli makes some infuriating passes and decisions from time to time. But that guy is aces in my book. Last night was just another notch on his belt. And (sniff sniff) in my heart.

I LOVE YOU ELI!!!!! lol

Eli doesn't give a shit about picks (or any of his stats) if he WINS THE GAME.

Remember these old quotes from the Parcells Simms era:

I’ll never forget the opening game of the ’84 season against the Philadelphia Eagles. Coach was standing at the locker room door saying things to players as they walked by. As I passed him, he says, “Hey Simms, if you don’t throw at least two interceptions today, you’re not taking enough chances.” I’m thinking, “Wow! What a thing to say to a quarterback!” It was his way of giving me a quick message to try to take the pressure off so I could relax and go out and play to the best of my ability. He did the same thing in Super Bowl XXI. All week long he kept telling me, “Make sure you’re aggressive and don’t be afraid to take a chance.”

Outside of locker rooms, everyone is obsessed with stats like picks. Inside locker rooms, all they care about is wins. Did you win? Then who gives a shit that you threw some picks?

Yeah, there are times Eli should throw the ball away -- but that's easy to say in hindsight. He IS a gunslinger (like Favre and others). He's trying to make things happen to win the game -- and he has earned the right to do that. These guys are not always looking for the "safest" play. They take chances, and sometimes it goes wrong.

If you want to see how bad Eli's interception stats are in the context of history and other QBs (included HOFers) see the link below.
All time Interceptions leader - ( New Window )

and come away with the interpretation that he was taking shots at Eli, especially when he was calling out Faulk for not giving him close to enough credit.

In comment 12544664 David in LA said:

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and come away with the interpretation that he was taking shots at Eli, especially when he was calling out Faulk for not giving him close to enough credit.

You have been here long enough to not be surprised by that.

In comment 12544675 steve in ky said:

Quote:

In comment 12544664 David in LA said: Quote: and come away with the interpretation that he was taking shots at Eli, especially when he was calling out Faulk for not giving him close to enough credit. You have been here long enough to not be surprised by that.

Heh! ... and LOL