Did I hear him correctly after the game, he said once they made adjustments we figured it out and made plays on the ball? I hope this year is just rookie growing pains and they move him to SS he is not a FS.
he plays off receivers like he's playing in college. NFL receivers can't get the kind of cushion he's giving them. He got served today... The Giants had LB's in coverage and Collins couldn't provide any help up top. I really hope he's going to school with the playing time he's getting... so far, it's not showing.
in terms of perception because there have been a ton of times earlier this year where he has been burned but the opposing mediocre QB missed the throw or didn't see it.
His coverage skills are the #1 thing that scares me about this loss. We need him to improve otherwise we'll need to invest highly in another safety with better skills vs. the pass.
a rookie struggling with the speed of the NFL, which right now is exposing his weaknesses in coverage. We also have no pass rush. He may never be as good in coverage as he is against the run, but he'll improve.
His coverage skills are the #1 thing that scares me about this loss. We need him to improve otherwise we'll need to invest highly in another safety with better skills vs. the pass. [/quote]
The Giants needed a centerfield free safety even after drafting Collins. He was never going to solve the need to also invest in this type of player.
Is a rookie on a team that has zero pass rush. He certainly needs to improve but the best safeties would have a tough time in coverage On this team.
I never understand what you want these guys to say. As a player you have to be positive. You cant say "we sucked." You make up some positive bs and feed it to the media.
He's played a whopping 8 professional games, he is behind a non-existent pass rush, and playing with a washed up co-safety. Plus one of his CB's have been sucky since Prince went down. Not an ideal situation for a rookie. Give him time.
Definitely needs to improve both his coverage skills and playing the ball in the air. I'm not as worried about the "mistakes" because I think he is intelligent and will eventually rectify those.
correct, weren't they Charles? He is better in man than he is zone. He can't handle deep half or third coverages. But he is a physical talent. Spagnuolo is doing a terrible job with him. Have to utilize his talents while masking his liabilities.
being put in positions to be exposed playing the Tom Coughlin defense. If there's a new HC next year he will be one of the best players on the team if he stays healthy. If Cam Chancellor was on the Giants he'd look like CC Brown.
It's not a knock to say he's an in the box safety Â
It's a role with lesser value in today's game but it's still necessary.
The further he gets from the LoS the more trouble he will have. Of course he's a rookie and will improve and having competent players surrounding him, which he doesn't have now, will certainly help.
I don't see downfield coverage or interceptions ever being the strong suit for his game. It wasn't at 'Bama and from what I've seen it never will be.
but he is certainly not a bust, as many here are indicating! Give him time to freaking develop for goodness sake. He's a rookie playing in a complicated scheme. He's shown some good this year and some bad, however, IMO, it appears that his bad has been from hesitation and not being in the right place on certain plays. I think he will get better at diagnosing the plays and being in better position. He'll get better. He's a SS and nothing more. We need to utilize his strengths in the box more and not ask him to do too much in deep half of the field. Know your players limitations and play to their strengths.
Brees was killing the entire defense yesterday with ball fakes, eye discipline, and spreading the ball around the entire field. Collins wasn't the only DB back there struggling, biting hard on fakes, and running around like a chicken with its head chopped off.
the defense looked better in the second half... If Brees hits Cooks on that first drive pass (Brees hits that 70% of times).. our defense would've allowed 5 td's in 5 drives.. Our first half defense was horrible.. Second half was horrible as well but at least we had 2 turnovers and it seemed like we were forcing them into 3rd downs... those first half drives our defense looked like a mess...
good point; he certainly wasn't the only one but they kept showing him in replays being one click behind. I think because most of thw big plays were around/through him.
I think Collins is/will be a decent NFL safety but most of the difference makes at safety have been guys with great anticipation and good quickness.
It looked like he twice mis-read plays that resulted in TDs. I haven't rewatched yet to see if there's more, but he definitely bit on fakes. But, he was only one of many that shat the bed yesterday. I saw a number of plays where Brees changed the play at the LOS, and NYG failed to adjust coverage technique, for example.
He's been OK. He's done a lot of good things as a rookie. The pick in the end zone last week was an exceptional play.
It's still very early but I don't think we have anything special here. There are some concerns about quickness and matching up. That's what the knock was and it looks to be accurate.
We were a bit unlucky in that sense. As far as Collins goes, I have yet to see him flash as an NFL player. He looks like a JAG to me. Could be worse but certainly not a guy you build a defense around or expect to make a pro bowl.
and put LC at SS, and some of his weaknesses aren't as obvious. As a rookie, he's a biter, it appears he's blowing subtle aspects of his coached techniques, eg, playing receiver's wrong shoulder, staring in the backfield, not switched inside/outside when the offense switches alignment at the LOS, etc, and his margin for error at this level is much lower than college.
I suspect at SS, he's put in a better position to succeed, better suited to his skills and his instincts.
It wasn't weak. It wasn't from laying off guys. It was terrible technique. He missed a few tackles. He routinely picked up the wrong receiver, started in the wrong direction, and/or was too shallow in his angles when providing deep support, which left him underneath the receiver. This directly cost them a few TDs and several other big plays. I honestly believe he will be a very good S, but he was awful yesterday and one of the biggest reasons they lost. Some of that, I blame on the coaching because, regardless of what he said, they made no adjustments and he never corrected himself.
Merriweather has played better than anyone could have expected. He has played clean, has been great supporting the run and short passing game, and not really done anything to cost them. But, he is really another SS. they need a true FS to compliment Collins next year.
It wasn't weak. It wasn't from laying off guys. It was terrible technique. He missed a few tackles. He routinely picked up the wrong receiver, started in the wrong direction, and/or was too shallow in his angles when providing deep support, which left him underneath the receiver. This directly cost them a few TDs and several other big plays. I honestly believe he will be a very good S, but he was awful yesterday and one of the biggest reasons they lost. Some of that, I blame on the coaching because, regardless of what he said, they made no adjustments and he never corrected himself.
Merriweather has played better than anyone could have expected. He has played clean, has been great supporting the run and short passing game, and not really done anything to cost them. But, he is really another SS. they need a true FS to compliment Collins next year.
He's been missing tackles all year. To me thats pretty alarming. No one wants to address it though.
Reason IMO that Collis is getting so much heat on Â
BBI is that expectations were so high for him after the Draft. IIRC Reese said he was the highest graded player on the Giants board at the end of the 1st Round.
IMO Reese needs to do a better job ranking players on the Giants board.
safety likely playing in the wrong safety position for a team that generates zero pass rush and a dinged up secondary. I think it's a bit tough to evaluate him properly.
He's not being put in a position to succeed. He's an in-the-box thumper, not a centerfielder. Those of us who watched him at Alabama knew what his limitations were before the season even started. They have to find a mobile ballhawk type to pair with him to get maximum value out of him.
living through the french revolution - when they were into cutting off heads just for the fun of it
Collins has shown some great stuff this year - and he's a rookie - and the defense did play much better in the second half
Brees did the same thing to our defense when it was filled with "all pros" - he's an outstanding QB and the Giants got very little pressure on him
Even an experienced pro is going to look bad when Brees is on his game
I completely agree! Collins has been a bright spot on the team this year.
They scored 50+ points with DRC out there, why didn't he stop them!? (/sarcasm)
In the box safety/needs to lose weight/no coverage skills/zero closing skills/slow/doesn’t hit very hard/confused ... ??
To the credit of BBI, there are alot of people out there defending him.
Somehow I get the sense that there are fans who are adults and can put things in perspective, and then a bunch of 12 year olds and drunks that can't. That is at least one way to understand the f--upedness of this thread.
he plays off receivers like he's playing in college. NFL receivers can't get the kind of cushion he's giving them. He got served today... The Giants had LB's in coverage and Collins couldn't provide any help up top. I really hope he's going to school with the playing time he's getting... so far, it's not showing.
its really hard for any rookie to look good in a defense as bad as this one is especially with absolutely no pass rush and he won't get much better if the pass rush doesn't improve.
lately has been hosley stinking it up in starting duty while prince is out,and you have merriweather at the other safety spot so an even bigger liability in coverage when they had prince and drc out there collins was making some plays and close a few times to making a big play on the ball he is more of a box safety which is why he fell into round 2 no point pointing the finger now they planned for either philips or chad jones to be playing there but injury forced the move for him its done get over it
they could have traded for another CB or safety,hell why didnt they take vernon davis for a sixth round pick playing with beckham,randle,cruz and vereen davis would have light it up for them in there,i like donnell but fells was a big lose davis would have had a resurgence with manning throwing to him while defences focused on beckham and co
His coverage skills are the #1 thing that scares me about this loss. We need him to improve otherwise we'll need to invest highly in another safety with better skills vs. the pass.
The Giants needed a centerfield free safety even after drafting Collins. He was never going to solve the need to also invest in this type of player.
I never understand what you want these guys to say. As a player you have to be positive. You cant say "we sucked." You make up some positive bs and feed it to the media.
Jabril Peppers in blue would make me horny in 2017.
So, why draft him so high and give up so much?
Is he the Marvin Austin of this year's draft? So far looking like it- can't cover and IMO doesn't hit very hard
This is absolutely not true.
like tiki, toomer and webster?
Definitely needs to improve both his coverage skills and playing the ball in the air. I'm not as worried about the "mistakes" because I think he is intelligent and will eventually rectify those.
Jabril Peppers in blue would make me horny in 2017.
Horny enough to spell his name right?
He's not a FS. He's miscast as one right now, but he's just not a FS. Flowers is too big to play WR, but that doesn't make him a bad OT.
No pass rush - no matter who is back there
He is no Kenny Phillips in that department.
The further he gets from the LoS the more trouble he will have. Of course he's a rookie and will improve and having competent players surrounding him, which he doesn't have now, will certainly help.
I don't see downfield coverage or interceptions ever being the strong suit for his game. It wasn't at 'Bama and from what I've seen it never will be.
Brees was killing the entire defense yesterday with ball fakes, eye discipline, and spreading the ball around the entire field. Collins wasn't the only DB back there struggling, biting hard on fakes, and running around like a chicken with its head chopped off.
Collins has shown some great stuff this year - and he's a rookie - and the defense did play much better in the second half
Brees did the same thing to our defense when it was filled with "all pros" - he's an outstanding QB and the Giants got very little pressure on him
Even an experienced pro is going to look bad when Brees is on his game
I think Collins is/will be a decent NFL safety but most of the difference makes at safety have been guys with great anticipation and good quickness.
It's still very early but I don't think we have anything special here. There are some concerns about quickness and matching up. That's what the knock was and it looks to be accurate.
I suspect at SS, he's put in a better position to succeed, better suited to his skills and his instincts.
Merriweather has played better than anyone could have expected. He has played clean, has been great supporting the run and short passing game, and not really done anything to cost them. But, he is really another SS. they need a true FS to compliment Collins next year.
Merriweather has played better than anyone could have expected. He has played clean, has been great supporting the run and short passing game, and not really done anything to cost them. But, he is really another SS. they need a true FS to compliment Collins next year.
He's been missing tackles all year. To me thats pretty alarming. No one wants to address it though.
IMO Reese needs to do a better job ranking players on the Giants board.
Quote:
10 lbs minimum asap. Way too big and lumbery to play FS.
He's not a FS. He's miscast as one right now, but he's just not a FS. Flowers is too big to play WR, but that doesn't make him a bad OT.
This. He is a SS with better than average range for a SS. This translates to a slower FS. He's a box safety + but not a true centerfielder.
Too bad we can't entice Ed Reed out of retirement and reverse age him about seven years.
Collins has shown some great stuff this year - and he's a rookie - and the defense did play much better in the second half
Brees did the same thing to our defense when it was filled with "all pros" - he's an outstanding QB and the Giants got very little pressure on him
Even an experienced pro is going to look bad when Brees is on his game
I completely agree! Collins has been a bright spot on the team this year.
They scored 50+ points with DRC out there, why didn't he stop them!? (/sarcasm)
In the box safety/needs to lose weight/no coverage skills/zero closing skills/slow/doesn’t hit very hard/confused ... ??
To the credit of BBI, there are alot of people out there defending him.
Somehow I get the sense that there are fans who are adults and can put things in perspective, and then a bunch of 12 year olds and drunks that can't. That is at least one way to understand the f--upedness of this thread.
its really hard for any rookie to look good in a defense as bad as this one is especially with absolutely no pass rush and he won't get much better if the pass rush doesn't improve.
they could have traded for another CB or safety,hell why didnt they take vernon davis for a sixth round pick playing with beckham,randle,cruz and vereen davis would have light it up for them in there,i like donnell but fells was a big lose davis would have had a resurgence with manning throwing to him while defences focused on beckham and co