Talent and coaching keeps you in games and puts you in a position to win them, being emotionally strong for 60 minutes is what makes you win them.
Clock management and play-calling are part of the equation but at the end of the day, players need to be tough and FINISH the game on the field.
This is what happens when you draft a lot of "squeaky clean" and "smart" guys, who are a bit too soft when the game is on the line.
Remember, the other team is trying to win the game too. Smart, tough, resilient players find ways to win. If you don't have enough of those types of guys, they find ways to lose.
Plain and simple.
Again, with the shitshow that has been trotted out on the field...
lacks playmakers in the back 7, aside from DRC. We all saw it on full display.
I'm adding a coverage safety to my Giants Christmas wish list. A Earl Thomas clone, if there is one. Giants might have to get creative and find a big CB to convert.
This stat shows that when the Giants are competitive (either good or bad) they are terrible at closing out games.
I refrained from offering my hypothesis as to why but I think there are a few issues here:
1. Coaching - I'm a huge TC fan and want him to be here for years but I think a weakness of his is closing out games. Too often the Giants appear to be too conservative when they have a small lead. They try to run out the clock and end up punting the ball back with enough time to lose. Instead the right play is often to be aggressive and go for 1st downs to seal it. Interestingly enough, that's what they tried to do this past Sunday and it didn't work. But it was the right move.
2. Pass Defense - The secondary has been terrible for a few years now. With weak secondaries teams can march down the field to take the lead with only seconds remaining. Had the pass defense been stronger my guess is the Giants would have held onto some leads.
the offense had a fair opportunity to win the game late and either came up empty or settled for FG in the red zone with time left for opponent to come back for winning score.
Only exception is 2013 loss to Dallas where offense scored TD to tie with 4:45 remaining and Dallas ran out rest of clock before kicking winning FG.
The one win in the 1-8 "close" record is of course at home against 49ers this year and that is the only late winning offensive drive since Sandy 2012.
This stat shows that when the Giants are competitive (either good or bad) they are terrible at closing out games.
I refrained from offering my hypothesis as to why but I think there are a few issues here:
1. Coaching - I'm a huge TC fan and want him to be here for years but I think a weakness of his is closing out games. Too often the Giants appear to be too conservative when they have a small lead. They try to run out the clock and end up punting the ball back with enough time to lose. Instead the right play is often to be aggressive and go for 1st downs to seal it. Interestingly enough, that's what they tried to do this past Sunday and it didn't work. But it was the right move.
2. Pass Defense - The secondary has been terrible for a few years now. With weak secondaries teams can march down the field to take the lead with only seconds remaining. Had the pass defense been stronger my guess is the Giants would have held onto some leads.
I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
I agree he's been better lately but this goes back to 2012. I think it took him a little while to adjust to the new NFL. Watch Belicheck with a lead and you'll see he goes for the jugular every time.
We have two instances this year where we misplayed
I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
I agree he's been better lately but this goes back to 2012. I think it took him a little while to adjust to the new NFL. Watch Belicheck with a lead and you'll see he goes for the jugular every time.
when you have a veteran QB, especially this season when he has played so well. The Giants clearly lack confidence and poise in critical situations, and a coach can't escape some responsibility for that.
TC hangs his hat on the 2 SBs, and that is a great accomplishment. But overall he is barely above .500 despite having very good QBs both here and in Jacksonville. In his years with the Giants, he has never needed to play a back-up QB. In TC's 8 years at Jacksonville, Brunnel missed a total of 10 games.
If Eli just goes down for a sack or doesnt tell Jennings to not score in Game 1 we win there and if Collins or OBJ comes up with a catch Sunday, we win another one. None of those plays have to do with TC. Just bad execution. Punter kicks the ball out of bounds and/or doesnt pull on a facemask and the Saints game maybe turns out differently too. Again, just bad execution and thats it.
If Eli just goes down for a sack or doesnt tell Jennings to not score in Game 1 we win there and if Collins or OBJ comes up with a catch Sunday, we win another one. None of those plays have to do with TC. Just bad execution. Punter kicks the ball out of bounds and/or doesnt pull on a facemask and the Saints game maybe turns out differently too. Again, just bad execution and thats it.
Comes with the territory gmen.
Tom got the credit and praise when they were 12-4 in those games and the whole "FINISH" mantra and the "ROAD WARRIORS" stuff.
Now it is going the other way and he has to take the hit in that direction too. It can't be all praise and no blame. That isn't fair. You take the good and the bad and you soldier on.
If Eli just goes down for a sack or doesnt tell Jennings to not score in Game 1 we win there and if Collins or OBJ comes up with a catch Sunday, we win another one. None of those plays have to do with TC. Just bad execution. Punter kicks the ball out of bounds and/or doesnt pull on a facemask and the Saints game maybe turns out differently too. Again, just bad execution and thats it.
Comes with the territory gmen.
Tom got the credit and praise when they were 12-4 in those games and the whole "FINISH" mantra and the "ROAD WARRIORS" stuff.
Now it is going the other way and he has to take the hit in that direction too. It can't be all praise and no blame. That isn't fair. You take the good and the bad and you soldier on.
Agreed. I think both the players and the coach deserve part of the blame. I simply stating that its such a fine line, that I cant really read too much into that stat. One easily made play here and there and we are 4-6 instead of 1-8. I guess 1-8 makes a trend, but I still feel like we just havent getting the breaks this year.
All of those games came down to one or two plays that were left on the field. In some cases the other team made great plays. Is it really necessary to blame anyone?
24 games over .500, and one of those seasons includes an expansion team.
How is that "barely over .500"? It is a season and a half of more wins than losses.
Do the math. Over 20 seasons, TC is 169-145 in regular season for a .538 winning percentage. Throw out the 4-12 his first year at Jacksonville and Eli's rookie year of 6-10, and you have 159-123 for .564. That .564 is with always having Eli Manning and Mark Brunnel, two Pro Bowlers, as your QBs.
This stat shows that when the Giants are competitive (either good or bad) they are terrible at closing out games.
I refrained from offering my hypothesis as to why but I think there are a few issues here:
1. Coaching - I'm a huge TC fan and want him to be here for years but I think a weakness of his is closing out games. Too often the Giants appear to be too conservative when they have a small lead. They try to run out the clock and end up punting the ball back with enough time to lose. Instead the right play is often to be aggressive and go for 1st downs to seal it. Interestingly enough, that's what they tried to do this past Sunday and it didn't work. But it was the right move.
2. Pass Defense - The secondary has been terrible for a few years now. With weak secondaries teams can march down the field to take the lead with only seconds remaining. Had the pass defense been stronger my guess is the Giants would have held onto some leads.
I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
24 games over .500, and one of those seasons includes an expansion team.
How is that "barely over .500"? It is a season and a half of more wins than losses.
Do the math. Over 20 seasons, TC is 169-145 in regular season for a .538 winning percentage. Throw out the 4-12 his first year at Jacksonville and Eli's rookie year of 6-10, and you have 159-123 for .564. That .564 is with always having Eli Manning and Mark Brunnel, two Pro Bowlers, as your QBs.
Clock management and play-calling are part of the equation but at the end of the day, players need to be tough and FINISH the game on the field.
This is what happens when you draft a lot of "squeaky clean" and "smart" guys, who are a bit too soft when the game is on the line.
Remember, the other team is trying to win the game too. Smart, tough, resilient players find ways to win. If you don't have enough of those types of guys, they find ways to lose.
Plain and simple.
I'm adding a coverage safety to my Giants Christmas wish list. A Earl Thomas clone, if there is one. Giants might have to get creative and find a big CB to convert.
Early leader for the BBI Open Mouthbreather Trophy for the day.
So stupid. Congrats!
exactly
Would anyone deny that losing the close ones hurts more than being blown out? The latter will make you angry, but doesn't hurt as much.
I refrained from offering my hypothesis as to why but I think there are a few issues here:
1. Coaching - I'm a huge TC fan and want him to be here for years but I think a weakness of his is closing out games. Too often the Giants appear to be too conservative when they have a small lead. They try to run out the clock and end up punting the ball back with enough time to lose. Instead the right play is often to be aggressive and go for 1st downs to seal it. Interestingly enough, that's what they tried to do this past Sunday and it didn't work. But it was the right move.
2. Pass Defense - The secondary has been terrible for a few years now. With weak secondaries teams can march down the field to take the lead with only seconds remaining. Had the pass defense been stronger my guess is the Giants would have held onto some leads.
Only exception is 2013 loss to Dallas where offense scored TD to tie with 4:45 remaining and Dallas ran out rest of clock before kicking winning FG.
The one win in the 1-8 "close" record is of course at home against 49ers this year and that is the only late winning offensive drive since Sandy 2012.
I refrained from offering my hypothesis as to why but I think there are a few issues here:
1. Coaching - I'm a huge TC fan and want him to be here for years but I think a weakness of his is closing out games. Too often the Giants appear to be too conservative when they have a small lead. They try to run out the clock and end up punting the ball back with enough time to lose. Instead the right play is often to be aggressive and go for 1st downs to seal it. Interestingly enough, that's what they tried to do this past Sunday and it didn't work. But it was the right move.
2. Pass Defense - The secondary has been terrible for a few years now. With weak secondaries teams can march down the field to take the lead with only seconds remaining. Had the pass defense been stronger my guess is the Giants would have held onto some leads.
I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
Quote:
I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
I agree he's been better lately but this goes back to 2012. I think it took him a little while to adjust to the new NFL. Watch Belicheck with a lead and you'll see he goes for the jugular every time.
That's not on the talent - you're not winning in the waning minutes if you're outmanned.
maybe the OT win doesn't count for some reason?
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In comment 12631832 armstead98 said:
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I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
I agree he's been better lately but this goes back to 2012. I think it took him a little while to adjust to the new NFL. Watch Belicheck with a lead and you'll see he goes for the jugular every time.
Fair point. So agree with 75% of your statement
Giants were 12-4 in such games
9-4 in regular season
3-0 in playoffs
TC hangs his hat on the 2 SBs, and that is a great accomplishment. But overall he is barely above .500 despite having very good QBs both here and in Jacksonville. In his years with the Giants, he has never needed to play a back-up QB. In TC's 8 years at Jacksonville, Brunnel missed a total of 10 games.
2012 - Philadelphia (L 17-19)
2012 - Washington (L 16-17)
2013 - Dallas (L 21-24)
2013 - Detroit (W 23-20)
2014 - Dallas (L 28-31)
2014 - Jacksonville (L 24-25)
2015 - Dallas (L 26-27)
2015 - San Francisco (W 30-27)
2015 - New Orleans (L 49-52)
2015 - New England (L 26-27)
Comes with the territory gmen.
Tom got the credit and praise when they were 12-4 in those games and the whole "FINISH" mantra and the "ROAD WARRIORS" stuff.
Now it is going the other way and he has to take the hit in that direction too. It can't be all praise and no blame. That isn't fair. You take the good and the bad and you soldier on.
Quote:
If Eli just goes down for a sack or doesnt tell Jennings to not score in Game 1 we win there and if Collins or OBJ comes up with a catch Sunday, we win another one. None of those plays have to do with TC. Just bad execution. Punter kicks the ball out of bounds and/or doesnt pull on a facemask and the Saints game maybe turns out differently too. Again, just bad execution and thats it.
Comes with the territory gmen.
Tom got the credit and praise when they were 12-4 in those games and the whole "FINISH" mantra and the "ROAD WARRIORS" stuff.
Now it is going the other way and he has to take the hit in that direction too. It can't be all praise and no blame. That isn't fair. You take the good and the bad and you soldier on.
Agreed. I think both the players and the coach deserve part of the blame. I simply stating that its such a fine line, that I cant really read too much into that stat. One easily made play here and there and we are 4-6 instead of 1-8. I guess 1-8 makes a trend, but I still feel like we just havent getting the breaks this year.
All I can think of is why is this chucklefuck tweeting about anything
How is that "barely over .500"? It is a season and a half of more wins than losses.
How is that "barely over .500"? It is a season and a half of more wins than losses.
Do the math. Over 20 seasons, TC is 169-145 in regular season for a .538 winning percentage. Throw out the 4-12 his first year at Jacksonville and Eli's rookie year of 6-10, and you have 159-123 for .564. That .564 is with always having Eli Manning and Mark Brunnel, two Pro Bowlers, as your QBs.
Quote:
This stat shows that when the Giants are competitive (either good or bad) they are terrible at closing out games.
I refrained from offering my hypothesis as to why but I think there are a few issues here:
1. Coaching - I'm a huge TC fan and want him to be here for years but I think a weakness of his is closing out games. Too often the Giants appear to be too conservative when they have a small lead. They try to run out the clock and end up punting the ball back with enough time to lose. Instead the right play is often to be aggressive and go for 1st downs to seal it. Interestingly enough, that's what they tried to do this past Sunday and it didn't work. But it was the right move.
2. Pass Defense - The secondary has been terrible for a few years now. With weak secondaries teams can march down the field to take the lead with only seconds remaining. Had the pass defense been stronger my guess is the Giants would have held onto some leads.
I agree with half of your hypothesis. Agree on the pass D. Disagree about TC. Maybe that used to be the case, but lately he has been super aggressive with a small lead. I for one think his new approach is the better way to go in today's NFL where a good QB can get you in field goal range in less than a minute with no timeouts.
^^^THIS.
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24 games over .500, and one of those seasons includes an expansion team.
How is that "barely over .500"? It is a season and a half of more wins than losses.
Do the math. Over 20 seasons, TC is 169-145 in regular season for a .538 winning percentage. Throw out the 4-12 his first year at Jacksonville and Eli's rookie year of 6-10, and you have 159-123 for .564. That .564 is with always having Eli Manning and Mark Brunnel, two Pro Bowlers, as your QBs.
What's your point?