Again, I keep asking myself... if this is Eli is this a big deal? No, it isn't. If this is Romo is this a big deal? Nope. If this was Russell Wilson is this a big deal? Uh uh. If this is Big Ben is this a big deal? Nope again (and he has a history too). If this video was taken the night... or even two nights... before a game... THEN I could understand. But it was his week off.
The difference between your examples and Manziel is Manziel hasn't done anything to earn any credibility and has a history of his team not liking his choices, so of course it's a bigger deal. You cant be surprised that there are different rules for different people.
Also, just this week before the Seahawks game the media was reporting the Seahawks are concerned that Russell Wilson might be getting too distracted by life off field.
RE: It's not tolerated because Manziel is not good at football
if he was putting up 300 yds and 3 TD each week then we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Say it ain't so!
You mean to tell me that if you get accused of rape... but win a Super Bowl in your second season... then you WON'T be in danger of losing your job? Ya don't say....
Again, I keep asking myself... if this is Eli is this a big deal? No, it isn't. If this is Romo is this a big deal? Nope. If this was Russell Wilson is this a big deal? Uh uh. If this is Big Ben is this a big deal? Nope again (and he has a history too). If this video was taken the night... or even two nights... before a game... THEN I could understand. But it was his week off.
The difference between your examples and Manziel is Manziel hasn't done anything to earn any credibility and has a history of his team not liking his choices, so of course it's a bigger deal. You cant be surprised that there are different rules for different people.
Also, just this week before the Seahawks game the media was reporting the Seahawks are concerned that Russell Wilson might be getting too distracted by life off field.
He hasn't done anything to earn any credibility YET. Neither had most of the guys I named early in their careers except Ben and Wilson... and most give their respective defenses the most of the credit for their early Super Bowl wins. The guy is in his what, third season? Checking himself into a rehab facility to deal with an issue isn't showing a level of maturity?
I get that they don't like his history of not making good choices but so the guy should not be allowed to go out and legally have a good time anymore? He wasn't out there with his shirt off. He wasn't even out there making it rain. It's a 30 second clip of him singing along to a rap song with a bottle in his hand and that's it.
If they hadn't named him the starter prior to this video coming to light, I might could understand the team's position because that could mean that they may still not be happy with the way he prepares himself to do his job. But they JUST named him the starter so I'm assuming they must be at least satisifed, if not happy, with his preparation. So a video emerges of him having a good time (a video I'm assuming HE didn't take of himself) and all that goes by the wayside?
abuse treatment, but it is doubtful that there is a legitimate treatment center in the U.S. that would treat for cocaine addiction and then endorse drinking alcohol.
Generally speaking, the patient should stop consumption of all potentially addictive drugs such as alcohol and even marijuana.
So the Browns likely aren't coming down on him for drinking alcohol, but rather what it likely means to his commitment to sobriety.
Ok... now THAT I'm not sure even I believe. If that's true then yeah... I guess that could help his cause. But even if it's not true and that was taken recently, I still think Manziel has a legitimate reason to think he's being treated unfairly by his coach. So showing him at the party means more than him attending a charity event also that weekend (if what BurberryManning said above is true)?
Feel free to help da kids... but NO GOING OUT AND HAVING A GOOD TIME YOURSELF!!!! Yeah... that seems fair.
our very own future HOF QB Eli Manning had two underage drinking offenses issues to him at Ole Miss. Think about that....you're the biggest name on campus and the speed limits were reduced to your legendary father's football number (18mph)...just how bombed was Eli to have received those tickets?
Things have turned out well for Eli.
And let's not get started with Ben Roethlisberger...if we had been following Ben during his off days as a 20something we might been named accomplices
Eh...drinking in college followed by a spotless career? That's your comparison to Manziel drinking heavily for 2 days the other day? And conducting himself embarrassingly?
So why not bench him after he admitted to having a few beers that day he got pulled over because his girl was trippin? He admitted he had a few beers then but wasn't drunk. Evidently the HC felt comfortable that Manziel had whatever issues he had with substance abuse still under control after that incident. In that video it doesn't appear obvious that Manziel is drunk and if he's not, what's the difference? The party instead of the incident happening in a car? The rap song?
our very own future HOF QB Eli Manning had two underage drinking offenses issues to him at Ole Miss. Think about that....you're the biggest name on campus and the speed limits were reduced to your legendary father's football number (18mph)...just how bombed was Eli to have received those tickets?
Things have turned out well for Eli.
And let's not get started with Ben Roethlisberger...if we had been following Ben during his off days as a 20something we might been named accomplices
Eh...drinking in college followed by a spotless career? That's your comparison to Manziel drinking heavily for 2 days the other day? And conducting himself embarrassingly?
I thought about bringing up the drunk pic of Eli (the one with his arm around the blond girl) but that was back in college and although I don't see much of a difference, I have to agree that there is a difference in how a QB should act in college as opposed to the NFL (see Winston). So I didn't think the comparison would be a good one.
But drinking heavily for 2 days and embarrassing himself? You talking about the video and party Randy? Honest question because I hadn't heard anything about that and if that's the case that changes my stance completely.
not being the Browns coach, I can't speak to what he is thinking. What I can say definitively is that Manziel's behavior is disturbing if he is an addict.
he wouldnt be allowed to party like this. Jerry, to his credit, hires security detail on these guys and keeps them out of trouble.
I find myself pitying Manziel. The talent is there, the work ethic is not. It's a shame to see him piss on his career like this - i envision he will finally wake up and get it approaching 30 and will be one of those guys who pleasantly surprises late in his career on his 4th team.
That's of course if he doesnt get himself killed first.
I really think guys like this never "get it." What the hell, he's getting paid millions whether he busts his ass or parties his ass off. Why work hard when you're rolling in money anyway?
is like Moore. He's going to be judged more harshly because of his reputation. Everything he does on and off the field will be watched because of his prior transgressions. He's also a QB.
not being the Browns coach, I can't speak to what he is thinking. What I can say definitively is that Manziel's behavior is disturbing if he is an addict.
Rob - I agree 100% with that and have absolutely no problem if he is in fact an addict who can't seem to kick his habit.
But what if he has kicked it nd was just enjoying a night out and never got to the point where he was drunk? All he was shown doing was holding the a bottle. From the video I saw, he never even takes a sip. Now I can agree it'd be a little naive to think that he wasn't drinking... but do we have to automatically assume he had gotten drunk that night and has fallen back into the abyss?
Geez... I feel like I sound like a Manziel apologists when I really am not. I just have a thing about seeing people treated unfairly and I think he is to a degree. If the video showed him with his shirt off... at a strip club... pouring liquor all over himself and some girl... while stage diving off of a stage... then yeah, I could see a possible benching and I'd be on everyone else's side on this. But it's a 30 second clip of him holding a bottle and rapping to a rap song.
is like Moore. He's going to be judged more harshly because of his reputation. Everything he does on and off the field will be watched because of his prior transgressions. He's also a QB.
And because of his past, he deserves to be judged more harshly. But he should also be judged fairly.
Can't believe I've talked about a guy for an hour and half who I really don't care about that much. Sheesh... I must've really missed posting BBI lately.
RE: It's not tolerated because Manziel is not good at football
not being the Browns coach, I can't speak to what he is thinking. What I can say definitively is that Manziel's behavior is disturbing if he is an addict.
This guy just got named starter, he can't lay off the public partying for like six more weeks?
Feel free to add something constructive to the thread in your next post please.
Actually, my previous post was of value. Maybe you could read the start of the thread rather than doing your best to justify Manziel's actions caught on video
Feel free to add something constructive to the thread in your next post please.
Actually, my previous post was of value. Maybe you could read the start of the thread rather than doing your best to justify Manziel's actions caught on video
I'm actually of the opinion that they don't need any justification. The guy was out having fun. And I did see your first post... just didn't think much of either of them.
1) You've gone into rehab the prior offseason for substance abuse. Its another example that shows Manziel can't beat this addiction. While I'm sympathetic....
2) as an organization you need to know if this 'leader' can take you to where you need to go. If I'm Pettine or the Browns, based on #1, i have serious doubts.
3) This isnt an isolated incident. Hell its not even an isolated incident this year - we are barely a month off him getting pulled over with alcohol in his system after a public feud with his girlfriend where the league is still investigating whether he assaulted her.
Certain things - kids being kids - are worth defending. I dont see this as one of those cases. Browns are 2-8... i mean wait 6 weeks to have fun. And for all the talk about Roethlisberger... i cant recall one of these issues popping up during the season. Yes, the infamous motorcycle accident in an offseason and the rape charges also in an offseason.
But its rare that a QB draws attention to himself twice during one season. Especially one that has never proven himself enough in this league to warrant all these second chances.
and some people still don't get it. By people I mean fans/BBIers. "He's just a kid"? That's news to me. He's the age of a man playing a mans game and getting paid well for it. He went to rehab, apparently, which means there was a major problem. Unless he did t go which is an even bigger issue.
I just don't see how anyone who's been paying attention doesn't see why Manziel partying on a bye week would be a problem. Thankfully he's not a Giant.
Except for the fact that one of the songs in the video didnt release until late September and the other back in the spring - bother after rehab... Link - ( New Window )
is on a very short leash and especially during the season, needs to demonstrate that he's all in for improving himself and his team. while players can go out and have a drink/enjoy their fame, during the season they should be all-business.
Feel free to add something constructive to the thread in your next post please.
Actually, my previous post was of value. Maybe you could read the start of the thread rather than doing your best to justify Manziel's actions caught on video
I'm actually of the opinion that they don't need any justification. The guy was out having fun. And I did see your first post... just didn't think much of either of them.
Well, he was just demoted so I guess you option has a lot value than those not giving him a pass.
I'm still of the opinion that this isn't a big deal but of course, my opinion doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things. Oh well... like I said, I don't care enough about the guy to continue on with this.
outside of troll jobs why would a guy who went to rehab less than a year ago and has now been caught with alcohol twice not be a big deal. If you can answer that that would be cool.
outside of troll jobs why would a guy who went to rehab less than a year ago and has now been caught with alcohol twice not be a big deal. If you can answer that that would be cool.
UConn4523 - I'm honestly not interested in discussing this anymore because, as I said, I'm obviously in the minority on this issue. But for you... I'll respond...
It's my belief that it's not a big deal because even though he went to rehab (for exactly what we don't know) in the first instance where alcohol was involved (I'm assuming your referring to the incident with his girl), he admitted to having a few drinks but was clearly not inebriated (cops words, not mine). In this second instance where alcohol is involved (the bottle), in the 30 second video all that's shown is him holding a bottle and, IMO, he doesn't appear to be drunk in that video either. Now, with that last part said, I'm not going to naively state with any certainty that because he didn't appear to be drunk in the video it doesn't mean he didn't get drunk later on (or was in fact drunk in the video). Chances are he at the very least got drunk at some point that night... if he wasn't drunk already in the video and just hides it well.
He went to rehab to hopefully correct a problem he believed he had with some sort of substance. Some seem to be assuming that it may've been alcohol related but there's no proof of that. Some also have said (and I actually agree with them) that even if he didn't go because of alcohol issues, the fact that he may've been drinking may be, as someone said earlier in the thread, just substituting one vice for another and that's not good either... and I actually even agree with that.
BUT, if being caught in a 30 second video holding a bottle and singing along to a rap song means that he still doesn't 'get it' and that he still doesn't take his job seriously as a QB in the NFL... that I'm not so sure I agree with. As I said before, his HC just named him the starter for the rest of the season... so I'm assuming (possibly incorrectly) that his coaches have been pleased with how he'd been handling himself since getting out of rehab. I've been hearing story after story about how Manziel seemed to be a different guy this season (not to mention his own quotes regarding him being changed and admitting his faults) and it just seems unfair to me to just give up on the guy based on a 30 second clip where he's doing nothing but holding a bottle and rapping on his 'week off' (since they were on a Bye).
I hadn't heard any other issues the team had with him since he got out of rehab. All I'd been hearing is how he seemed to be a changed man from everyone and his coach entrusting him to be the starter for the rest of the year seemed to support that notion. Then comes the incident regarding his girlfriend, where it was found that Manziel had done nothing wrong and in which he admitted that he had had a few beers earlier that day/night but, again... this is the cop's words, not mine, he was not drunk in any way when he got pulled over. It seems that most are holding that incident against him with regards to this one and putting the two together when, IMO, he didn't do anything wrong or do anything to have people lose any faith in him. BurberryManning mentioned that during that party weekend he also went to a charity event AND actually came back to the Browns facility two days early. But that doesn't matter to most, including his coaches... all they know is that he was pulled over because his girl was acting up and that there's a video of him holding a bottle at a party (again, during the bye week).
I just don't think that's fair. Is it an good look to have your starting QB out at a party holding a bottle? No, it isn't. I freely admit and agree with that. But does that mean that he doesn't take his job seriously and do what he needs to do to prepare himself to do his job to the best of his ability? I don't think it means that at all. I suppose I'm just trying to put myself in Manziel's shoes and if I'd been doing everything that was expected of me... but because of one incident that wasn't my fault and where I'd done no wrong...and another where all I am shown doing is holding a bottle at a party... to have that negate all the good I'd been trying to do over the past few months... well, that would bother me a lot. And please realize, I hope that Manziel is mature enough to know that this is very much his own fault for putting himself in those positions in the first place.
I knew I was going to be in the minority on this stance and that's cool. I don't expect anyone to feel the same way I do and, as I said in my first post, if someone could give me a valid reason why I should change my mind I'm willing to listen because although I feel the way I do, I DO understand the perspective of those who think he should be benched or cut. I really do. But I just think for him to lose his job... after seemingly putting in the work to be a better player for the past few weeks/months... because of a video where all he's doing is holding a bottle... just seems petty to me. But... that seems to be just me and I can live with that. I don't much care either way because I'm nowhere near a Manziel fan.
while i agree with him on this topic we've seen on Mets/Rangers threads the guy just wants to be an antagonist.
Dont bother. It seems he desperately wants to win the annual douche rankings contest but unlike others (i like to think myself) where it just flows naturally - he comes across as trying too hard.
while i agree with him on this topic we've seen on Mets/Rangers threads the guy just wants to be an antagonist.
Dont bother. It seems he desperately wants to win the annual douche rankings contest but unlike others (i like to think myself) where it just flows naturally - he comes across as trying too hard.
Mets - I know. I've been watching his posts for a while now. I choose not to go back and forth with him because I just don't think he's worth it. Besides... you know me... that's not really my thing anyway. I'd rather see how much mouth ya got if I ever meet ya. *grin*
outside of the alcohol incidents, it's also the not keeping your head down after all the chances that was given. It's a slap in the face to his coaches and the owner who traded for him. It shows me that even if he was 100% sober, he cares more about clubbing than staying out of the limelight. this same thing happened to Romo/Witten before the playoffs I believe (Cabo vacation). They got wrecked for it and there wasn't even a precedence for that behavior.
We also have no idea what the team knows, or what expectations the team has laid out for JF. Maybe they told him, no more alcohol? We don't know. Just because all you've seen is a 30 second clip doesn't mean that's the entire story. Also, perhaps they made him the starter for the rest of the season, in part, to motivate him? And I'm not saying that's the case, because I have no idea. But I'm fairly confident that the Browns haven't based this decision on a "30 second video" as you keep bringing up. The Bowns have likely much more to base this decision on than anyone knows.
outside of the alcohol incidents, it's also the not keeping your head down after all the chances that was given. It's a slap in the face to his coaches and the owner who traded for him. It shows me that even if he was 100% sober, he cares more about clubbing than staying out of the limelight. this same thing happened to Romo/Witten before the playoffs I believe (Cabo vacation). They got wrecked for it and there wasn't even a precedence for that behavior.
First off, I apologize for the length of it. Didn't realize how long it was until after I'd hit 'Submit'.
And I understand what you're saying. But in both cases, it didn't appear, to me at least, that he was seeking any attention... attention found him. It's not like he got into a fight... or was cussing all in the video... or squeezed a waitresses butt or anything like that. He was a guy who appeared to be having some fun on his week off. To me, that's probably the biggest thing... the fact that he was out on his week off when I'm sure plenty of other players...and even maybe some QBs of other teams... were out enjoying themselves. If that video was never posted... and he went on to lead the team to a couple of wins and maybe even hope for the future at the QB position, does he still get benched? I think not.
At this point I'm sure you and most everyone else will not agree with me on this and I'm ok with that. I personally think he got a raw deal... but hey, he did bring it on himself. Let me ask you this, hypothetically, if this same video of him partying came out but he was at home instead of out in a club, would you still feel the same? Just curious.
We also have no idea what the team knows, or what expectations the team has laid out for JF. Maybe they told him, no more alcohol? We don't know. Just because all you've seen is a 30 second clip doesn't mean that's the entire story. Also, perhaps they made him the starter for the rest of the season, in part, to motivate him? And I'm not saying that's the case, because I have no idea. But I'm fairly confident that the Browns haven't based this decision on a "30 second video" as you keep bringing up. The Bowns have likely much more to base this decision on than anyone knows.
BBShock - you're 100% right about that and I meant to mention that in my post to UConn. The team definitely knows more about Manziel as a person and player than any of us and so it's possible there have been other things that he has done, that we don't know about, that played a part in this decision. You're absolutely right and I meant to add that in my post.
make a slight difference in most cases but in this one, he shouldn't be around alcohol if that's what he went to rehab for. If he cares about football he wouldn't bother tempting this kind of thing during the season. He's been given too many chances and Pettine doesn't want to put the team in JMs hands, I applaud that.
I hear you. Still not sure I completely agree but I'm inclined to think that BBShock may be right in that some other issues may've played a part in the demotion. Anyway, I'm done talking about the guy as I've spent more time thinking about Manziel in the past few hours than the past few years. Have a good one buddy.
You can keep your insults to yourself man. I'm not interested in trading barbs with you. Thanks.
You following me pal. Stop playing the victim like the other guy who lurks all day.
People see some things in a different light. There's no need to make a disagreement personal.
Don't sweat it AP. Just ignore him. I am. Like I said, he's not worth the aggravation. He thinks I'm following him and trying to be a victim and I'm doing neither obviously.
Again, I keep asking myself... if this is Eli is this a big deal? No, it isn't. If this is Romo is this a big deal? Nope. If this was Russell Wilson is this a big deal? Uh uh. If this is Big Ben is this a big deal? Nope again (and he has a history too). If this video was taken the night... or even two nights... before a game... THEN I could understand. But it was his week off.
The difference between your examples and Manziel is Manziel hasn't done anything to earn any credibility and has a history of his team not liking his choices, so of course it's a bigger deal. You cant be surprised that there are different rules for different people.
Also, just this week before the Seahawks game the media was reporting the Seahawks are concerned that Russell Wilson might be getting too distracted by life off field.
Say it ain't so!
You mean to tell me that if you get accused of rape... but win a Super Bowl in your second season... then you WON'T be in danger of losing your job? Ya don't say....
You and me both! He was so close (from what I read) - his asshole Son stopped him. ; )
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Again, I keep asking myself... if this is Eli is this a big deal? No, it isn't. If this is Romo is this a big deal? Nope. If this was Russell Wilson is this a big deal? Uh uh. If this is Big Ben is this a big deal? Nope again (and he has a history too). If this video was taken the night... or even two nights... before a game... THEN I could understand. But it was his week off.
The difference between your examples and Manziel is Manziel hasn't done anything to earn any credibility and has a history of his team not liking his choices, so of course it's a bigger deal. You cant be surprised that there are different rules for different people.
Also, just this week before the Seahawks game the media was reporting the Seahawks are concerned that Russell Wilson might be getting too distracted by life off field.
He hasn't done anything to earn any credibility YET. Neither had most of the guys I named early in their careers except Ben and Wilson... and most give their respective defenses the most of the credit for their early Super Bowl wins. The guy is in his what, third season? Checking himself into a rehab facility to deal with an issue isn't showing a level of maturity?
I get that they don't like his history of not making good choices but so the guy should not be allowed to go out and legally have a good time anymore? He wasn't out there with his shirt off. He wasn't even out there making it rain. It's a 30 second clip of him singing along to a rap song with a bottle in his hand and that's it.
If they hadn't named him the starter prior to this video coming to light, I might could understand the team's position because that could mean that they may still not be happy with the way he prepares himself to do his job. But they JUST named him the starter so I'm assuming they must be at least satisifed, if not happy, with his preparation. So a video emerges of him having a good time (a video I'm assuming HE didn't take of himself) and all that goes by the wayside?
It may be an old video - ( New Window )
But that doesn't change the fact that I think he's being treated unfairly a bit here.
Anyway, I'm moving on. I've stated my case. I see where you, TTH, and others are coming from... I just don't completely agree with it.
Generally speaking, the patient should stop consumption of all potentially addictive drugs such as alcohol and even marijuana.
So the Browns likely aren't coming down on him for drinking alcohol, but rather what it likely means to his commitment to sobriety.
Ok... now THAT I'm not sure even I believe. If that's true then yeah... I guess that could help his cause. But even if it's not true and that was taken recently, I still think Manziel has a legitimate reason to think he's being treated unfairly by his coach. So showing him at the party means more than him attending a charity event also that weekend (if what BurberryManning said above is true)?
Feel free to help da kids... but NO GOING OUT AND HAVING A GOOD TIME YOURSELF!!!! Yeah... that seems fair.
Things have turned out well for Eli.
And let's not get started with Ben Roethlisberger...if we had been following Ben during his off days as a 20something we might been named accomplices
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our very own future HOF QB Eli Manning had two underage drinking offenses issues to him at Ole Miss. Think about that....you're the biggest name on campus and the speed limits were reduced to your legendary father's football number (18mph)...just how bombed was Eli to have received those tickets?
Things have turned out well for Eli.
And let's not get started with Ben Roethlisberger...if we had been following Ben during his off days as a 20something we might been named accomplices
Eh...drinking in college followed by a spotless career? That's your comparison to Manziel drinking heavily for 2 days the other day? And conducting himself embarrassingly?
I thought about bringing up the drunk pic of Eli (the one with his arm around the blond girl) but that was back in college and although I don't see much of a difference, I have to agree that there is a difference in how a QB should act in college as opposed to the NFL (see Winston). So I didn't think the comparison would be a good one.
But drinking heavily for 2 days and embarrassing himself? You talking about the video and party Randy? Honest question because I hadn't heard anything about that and if that's the case that changes my stance completely.
I find myself pitying Manziel. The talent is there, the work ethic is not. It's a shame to see him piss on his career like this - i envision he will finally wake up and get it approaching 30 and will be one of those guys who pleasantly surprises late in his career on his 4th team.
That's of course if he doesnt get himself killed first.
I really think guys like this never "get it." What the hell, he's getting paid millions whether he busts his ass or parties his ass off. Why work hard when you're rolling in money anyway?
Rob - I agree 100% with that and have absolutely no problem if he is in fact an addict who can't seem to kick his habit.
But what if he has kicked it nd was just enjoying a night out and never got to the point where he was drunk? All he was shown doing was holding the a bottle. From the video I saw, he never even takes a sip. Now I can agree it'd be a little naive to think that he wasn't drinking... but do we have to automatically assume he had gotten drunk that night and has fallen back into the abyss?
Geez... I feel like I sound like a Manziel apologists when I really am not. I just have a thing about seeing people treated unfairly and I think he is to a degree. If the video showed him with his shirt off... at a strip club... pouring liquor all over himself and some girl... while stage diving off of a stage... then yeah, I could see a possible benching and I'd be on everyone else's side on this. But it's a 30 second clip of him holding a bottle and rapping to a rap song.
And because of his past, he deserves to be judged more harshly. But he should also be judged fairly.
I wonder if he would have been cut by the Cowboys...dude's not really good at this whole NFL QB thing.
This guy just got named starter, he can't lay off the public partying for like six more weeks?
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"Let the kid be a kid"
Give me a break.
Feel free to add something constructive to the thread in your next post please.
Actually, my previous post was of value. Maybe you could read the start of the thread rather than doing your best to justify Manziel's actions caught on video
Quote:
In comment 12642443 Giants2012 said:
Quote:
"Let the kid be a kid"
Give me a break.
Feel free to add something constructive to the thread in your next post please.
Actually, my previous post was of value. Maybe you could read the start of the thread rather than doing your best to justify Manziel's actions caught on video
I'm actually of the opinion that they don't need any justification. The guy was out having fun. And I did see your first post... just didn't think much of either of them.
1) You've gone into rehab the prior offseason for substance abuse. Its another example that shows Manziel can't beat this addiction. While I'm sympathetic....
2) as an organization you need to know if this 'leader' can take you to where you need to go. If I'm Pettine or the Browns, based on #1, i have serious doubts.
3) This isnt an isolated incident. Hell its not even an isolated incident this year - we are barely a month off him getting pulled over with alcohol in his system after a public feud with his girlfriend where the league is still investigating whether he assaulted her.
Certain things - kids being kids - are worth defending. I dont see this as one of those cases. Browns are 2-8... i mean wait 6 weeks to have fun. And for all the talk about Roethlisberger... i cant recall one of these issues popping up during the season. Yes, the infamous motorcycle accident in an offseason and the rape charges also in an offseason.
But its rare that a QB draws attention to himself twice during one season. Especially one that has never proven himself enough in this league to warrant all these second chances.
I just don't see how anyone who's been paying attention doesn't see why Manziel partying on a bye week would be a problem. Thankfully he's not a Giant.
Except for the fact that one of the songs in the video didnt release until late September and the other back in the spring - bother after rehab...
Link - ( New Window )
https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/669254472384823297
https://twitter.com/MikeGarafolo/status/669254472384823297
I wonder if he promised the Browns he wouldn't be out partying. I know he had issues with the day-drinking with the college girl and other things.
also see: burress, plaxico.
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In comment 12642452 T-Bone said:
Quote:
In comment 12642443 Giants2012 said:
Quote:
"Let the kid be a kid"
Give me a break.
Feel free to add something constructive to the thread in your next post please.
Actually, my previous post was of value. Maybe you could read the start of the thread rather than doing your best to justify Manziel's actions caught on video
I'm actually of the opinion that they don't need any justification. The guy was out having fun. And I did see your first post... just didn't think much of either of them.
Well, he was just demoted so I guess you option has a lot value than those not giving him a pass.
UConn4523 - I'm honestly not interested in discussing this anymore because, as I said, I'm obviously in the minority on this issue. But for you... I'll respond...
It's my belief that it's not a big deal because even though he went to rehab (for exactly what we don't know) in the first instance where alcohol was involved (I'm assuming your referring to the incident with his girl), he admitted to having a few drinks but was clearly not inebriated (cops words, not mine). In this second instance where alcohol is involved (the bottle), in the 30 second video all that's shown is him holding a bottle and, IMO, he doesn't appear to be drunk in that video either. Now, with that last part said, I'm not going to naively state with any certainty that because he didn't appear to be drunk in the video it doesn't mean he didn't get drunk later on (or was in fact drunk in the video). Chances are he at the very least got drunk at some point that night... if he wasn't drunk already in the video and just hides it well.
He went to rehab to hopefully correct a problem he believed he had with some sort of substance. Some seem to be assuming that it may've been alcohol related but there's no proof of that. Some also have said (and I actually agree with them) that even if he didn't go because of alcohol issues, the fact that he may've been drinking may be, as someone said earlier in the thread, just substituting one vice for another and that's not good either... and I actually even agree with that.
BUT, if being caught in a 30 second video holding a bottle and singing along to a rap song means that he still doesn't 'get it' and that he still doesn't take his job seriously as a QB in the NFL... that I'm not so sure I agree with. As I said before, his HC just named him the starter for the rest of the season... so I'm assuming (possibly incorrectly) that his coaches have been pleased with how he'd been handling himself since getting out of rehab. I've been hearing story after story about how Manziel seemed to be a different guy this season (not to mention his own quotes regarding him being changed and admitting his faults) and it just seems unfair to me to just give up on the guy based on a 30 second clip where he's doing nothing but holding a bottle and rapping on his 'week off' (since they were on a Bye).
I hadn't heard any other issues the team had with him since he got out of rehab. All I'd been hearing is how he seemed to be a changed man from everyone and his coach entrusting him to be the starter for the rest of the year seemed to support that notion. Then comes the incident regarding his girlfriend, where it was found that Manziel had done nothing wrong and in which he admitted that he had had a few beers earlier that day/night but, again... this is the cop's words, not mine, he was not drunk in any way when he got pulled over. It seems that most are holding that incident against him with regards to this one and putting the two together when, IMO, he didn't do anything wrong or do anything to have people lose any faith in him. BurberryManning mentioned that during that party weekend he also went to a charity event AND actually came back to the Browns facility two days early. But that doesn't matter to most, including his coaches... all they know is that he was pulled over because his girl was acting up and that there's a video of him holding a bottle at a party (again, during the bye week).
I just don't think that's fair. Is it an good look to have your starting QB out at a party holding a bottle? No, it isn't. I freely admit and agree with that. But does that mean that he doesn't take his job seriously and do what he needs to do to prepare himself to do his job to the best of his ability? I don't think it means that at all. I suppose I'm just trying to put myself in Manziel's shoes and if I'd been doing everything that was expected of me... but because of one incident that wasn't my fault and where I'd done no wrong...and another where all I am shown doing is holding a bottle at a party... to have that negate all the good I'd been trying to do over the past few months... well, that would bother me a lot. And please realize, I hope that Manziel is mature enough to know that this is very much his own fault for putting himself in those positions in the first place.
I knew I was going to be in the minority on this stance and that's cool. I don't expect anyone to feel the same way I do and, as I said in my first post, if someone could give me a valid reason why I should change my mind I'm willing to listen because although I feel the way I do, I DO understand the perspective of those who think he should be benched or cut. I really do. But I just think for him to lose his job... after seemingly putting in the work to be a better player for the past few weeks/months... because of a video where all he's doing is holding a bottle... just seems petty to me. But... that seems to be just me and I can live with that. I don't much care either way because I'm nowhere near a Manziel fan.
You can keep your insults to yourself man. I'm not interested in trading barbs with you. Thanks.
Dont bother. It seems he desperately wants to win the annual douche rankings contest but unlike others (i like to think myself) where it just flows naturally - he comes across as trying too hard.
Dont bother. It seems he desperately wants to win the annual douche rankings contest but unlike others (i like to think myself) where it just flows naturally - he comes across as trying too hard.
Mets - I know. I've been watching his posts for a while now. I choose not to go back and forth with him because I just don't think he's worth it. Besides... you know me... that's not really my thing anyway. I'd rather see how much mouth ya got if I ever meet ya. *grin*
First off, I apologize for the length of it. Didn't realize how long it was until after I'd hit 'Submit'.
And I understand what you're saying. But in both cases, it didn't appear, to me at least, that he was seeking any attention... attention found him. It's not like he got into a fight... or was cussing all in the video... or squeezed a waitresses butt or anything like that. He was a guy who appeared to be having some fun on his week off. To me, that's probably the biggest thing... the fact that he was out on his week off when I'm sure plenty of other players...and even maybe some QBs of other teams... were out enjoying themselves. If that video was never posted... and he went on to lead the team to a couple of wins and maybe even hope for the future at the QB position, does he still get benched? I think not.
At this point I'm sure you and most everyone else will not agree with me on this and I'm ok with that. I personally think he got a raw deal... but hey, he did bring it on himself. Let me ask you this, hypothetically, if this same video of him partying came out but he was at home instead of out in a club, would you still feel the same? Just curious.
BBShock - you're 100% right about that and I meant to mention that in my post to UConn. The team definitely knows more about Manziel as a person and player than any of us and so it's possible there have been other things that he has done, that we don't know about, that played a part in this decision. You're absolutely right and I meant to add that in my post.
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to recognize a no brainier.
You can keep your insults to yourself man. I'm not interested in trading barbs with you. Thanks.
You following me pal. Stop playing the victim like the other guy who lurks all day.
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In comment 12642867 Giants2012 said:
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to recognize a no brainier.
You can keep your insults to yourself man. I'm not interested in trading barbs with you. Thanks.
You following me pal. Stop playing the victim like the other guy who lurks all day.
People see some things in a different light. There's no need to make a disagreement personal.
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In comment 12642912 T-Bone said:
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In comment 12642867 Giants2012 said:
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to recognize a no brainier.
You can keep your insults to yourself man. I'm not interested in trading barbs with you. Thanks.
You following me pal. Stop playing the victim like the other guy who lurks all day.
People see some things in a different light. There's no need to make a disagreement personal.
Don't sweat it AP. Just ignore him. I am. Like I said, he's not worth the aggravation. He thinks I'm following him and trying to be a victim and I'm doing neither obviously.
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In comment 12642912 T-Bone said:
Quote:
In comment 12642867 Giants2012 said:
Quote:
to recognize a no brainier.
You can keep your insults to yourself man. I'm not interested in trading barbs with you. Thanks.
You following me pal. Stop playing the victim like the other guy who lurks all day.
People see some things in a different light. There's no need to make a disagreement personal.
Kid can't stay out of the media
Giants2012 : 1:05 pm : link : reply
Doesn't exactly come across as a leader of men in that video.
Exactly - my quote was apparently sent him over the edge