NFT: Knicks chat: Are the Knicks in trouble?

tells me that statistically KAT really hasnt been materially better that KP per possession. Timberwolves play faster and KAT plays a few more MPG. The stats are actually scary close. KAT is a more efficient scorer, but otherwise, pretty damn similar.


Link - ( New Window )

is the thing we thought he could come right in and do is shoot and that is the aspect of his game that has bene inconsistent...

Now i do not think his shot was as good as we thought but i still expect it to improve to the point where it is consistent...

And I'm assuming KAT plays like a more traditional big man and takes many more shots closer to the basket which would make is FG% higher but not the same overall variety of a threat as KP will become.

his worst game of the year, wonder how badly that hurt his stats.

I think towns and KP have both been amazing. Hopefully they can keep it up. I feel like its been awhile since we have had a couple top 5 picks put up awesome seasons. Its usually one guy due to busts/injuries.

I'm pretty happy. I hate the idea of playing Amundson and Vujacic, though. They should hang out on the bench unless the game is out of hand.

Also, Fisher made it a point to say he wanted to get out and run a little bit this year. The guys on the second unit in theory should be able to do that - Grant and Galloway, and Williams has shown he's pretty good in transition. And yet, the team is last in the NBA on fast breaks at 8.1 per game. Last year's team averaged 8.4 per game.

"It’s important not to have guys have a down vibe by sitting and watching too much. You got to get some action."

In comment 12643694 Canton said:

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"It’s important not to have guys have a down vibe by sitting and watching too much. You got to get some action."

continuing, "And Cleanthony Early can go to hell".

In comment 12643694 Canton said:

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"It’s important not to have guys have a down vibe by sitting and watching too much. You got to get some action."

Which has to be the dumbest thing i have ever heard a coach say....

This is not the cub scout, this is not some rec league where everyone has to get minutes, time to be a big boy Fisher and set your rotation...

In comment 12643684 Canton said:

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Quote: WFAN’s Mike Francesa told Porzingis he would prefer to call him “Special K,’’ but the 7-foot-3 Latvian didn’t bite. Knicks team president Phil Jackson bestowed “KP’’ on Porzingis the day after the draft. “KP6” originated when MSG Network sideline reporter Rebecca Haarlow and Knicks-telecast producer Spencer Julien sat down with Porzingis for a piece during training camp and they came up with a play on Chris Paul’s CP3. When Porzingis said he likes Jackson’s “KP,’’ Haarlow replied: “What if it’s like KP6 instead of CP3?’’ Porzingis answered: “I need to still prove myself in the league before they start to call me like that, but yeah that’d be nice in the future. KP6 sounds good.’’ Haarlow has called Porzingis KP6 on the air and Porzingis confirmed he’s now all for it.

I wish the name Kavorka would stick.

now?

In comment 12643706 Deej said:

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In comment 12643694 Canton said: Quote: "It’s important not to have guys have a down vibe by sitting and watching too much. You got to get some action." continuing, "And Cleanthony Early can go to hell".

Exactly. And of all the guys who should probably sit on the bench the majority of the time, why choose the younger one to not dress? Rather than the guy who hasn't been in the league in 5 years, or the one who has played on 12 different teams since 2007 or whatever.

In comment 12643730 SethFromAstoria said:

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now?

Hah was too lazy to find who said it in the first place. But that's why I said stick instead of suggesting it as my own idea. Someone needs to photoshop one of those hats on him.

In comment 12643664 steve in ky said:

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And I'm assuming KAT plays like a more traditional big man and takes many more shots closer to the basket which would make is FG% higher but not the same overall variety of a threat as KP will become.

He's not a guy like KP, but he's also no Shaq. KAT is a new breed shooting center. And the most efficient shot tends to be the 3, and KP takes a lot of those.

KP shoots .537 at 0-3 feet, .382 at 3-10, .357 at 10-16, .500 at 16-3 pt line, and .341 from down town. Towns at the same distances is .667-.458-.375-.500-.167. So he's more efficient at everything sub-16 feet.

Interesting that KP is so good from 10-16 feet, in 28 attempts. Suggests that maybe he should be doing more jump shooting and less of the fancy moves. Though in any event I think his development is more important than this years' stats.

most efficient shot is the dunk. Moreover, I believe that shooting 0-3 feet is usually the most efficient shot (hard to get down there though). But after that, 3s are really efficient -- much more so than the midrange game for most players.

In comment 12643738 Deej said:

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In comment 12643664 steve in ky said: Quote: And I'm assuming KAT plays like a more traditional big man and takes many more shots closer to the basket which would make is FG% higher but not the same overall variety of a threat as KP will become. He's not a guy like KP, but he's also no Shaq. KAT is a new breed shooting center. And the most efficient shot tends to be the 3, and KP takes a lot of those. KP shoots .537 at 0-3 feet, .382 at 3-10, .357 at 10-16, .500 at 16-3 pt line, and .341 from down town. Towns at the same distances is .667-.458-.375-.500-.167. So he's more efficient at everything sub-16 feet. Interesting that KP is so good from 10-16 feet, in 28 attempts. Suggests that maybe he should be doing more jump shooting and less of the fancy moves. Though in any event I think his development is more important than this years' stats.

It seems like he regularly grabs an offensive board and goes right back up a couple of times, and misses a few of those a game. That probably factors in somewhat.

As for the lower % from 0 to 16 feet, I'd guess that the players guarding him are more comfortable on defense at that range. If anything, I'd say that's where he needs to focus his improvement efforts going forward to make him a more complete offensive player.

In comment 12643757 Aspano! said:

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If anything, I'd say that's where he needs to focus his improvement efforts going forward to make him a more complete offensive player.

That was kind of my closing point -- if he has an inside/outside game he gets deadly. I suspect he's so good at 16-3p shooting because he's so hard to close out on -- especially by more traditional 4s.

His length is really ridiculous. He is just hovering in rebound over guys heads. They're boxing him out now because of the putback highlights from early, but in doing so they're letting him just go over the top. Because he's Gumby, damnit!

IMO right now too often when he is real close he still kind of try's a fade away instead of going up as strong as he probably could. It will come.

Miami showed how the Knicks offense can be controlled. Learn how they did that and figure out how to deal with it.

It was the 3rd road game in 4 nights and against a team that will end the season as one of the 2 or 3 best in the East.

As for the bench, it seems as though Fisher is starting to slowly settle in on a rotation that he likes. It may not be the guys that we want it to be, but it looks like the rotation is shaping up to be Lopez, Porzingis, Melo, Afflalo, Calderon, Seraphin, Thomas, Galloway, Grant. Seems like the 10th spot is still up for grabs with O'Quinn, Amundson, and Williams duking it out for that spot. If it were up to me Seraphin and Amundson would be out of the rotation in favor of O'Quinn and Thomas/Williams would platoon depending on whether we need scoring punch or defense.

One trend that I do like that I am seeing is an increase in minutes for KP. Over the last 4 games he has averaged 32.5 minutes per night, and he was over 35 the last 2 games. Another encouraging trend with Porzingis is that his shot is starting to fall and his getting to closer to what I think we expected coming into the season. Over the last 5 games he's shooting 46% from the field and 56% from 3. He will definitely cool off from downtown, but I don't think its unreasonable to expect him to hang around the high 30s all year.

Ideally you would get more than 26 minutes per night out of Lopez, but that has been about where he has been his whole career so that may not really change. I do like the idea that was floated about bringing Afflalo off the bench in favor of Galloway. It is becoming obvious that KP, Melo, and Afflalo or the "go to" scorers, and it would greatly benefit the second unit to have one of those 3 on the court with them at all times.

whether he learned that lesson or not we'll see. He wanted to see how resilient his guys would be after being down. So he let a hodge podge group stay on the floor that wasn't playing well against the high ranking defense. He didn't call a timeout either. Later in the game they tried to recover but the deficit was too huge.

No need to be worried at this point they'll get it together.

...how can they be 'in trouble'. If they make the post season in any capacity this year it's a bonus.

In comment 12643710 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 12643694 Canton said: Quote: "It’s important not to have guys have a down vibe by sitting and watching too much. You got to get some action." Which has to be the dumbest thing i have ever heard a coach say.... This is not the cub scout, this is not some rec league where everyone has to get minutes, time to be a big boy Fisher and set your rotation...

I dont trust most of what coaches say in most sports. But I really dont trust what Fisher says. No idea what he's really thinking, but I dismiss everything he says as word salad.

and expectations were pretty low this year. I would say they have exceeded expectations thus far.

Melo did not play well during the first half and things went south quickly.

We will see what happens tonight, I say they look much better and the teams are within 5 at the end.

yeesh.. this isnt a win now team.. enjoy the first actual rebuilding process in 20 years..

They were way better than the first unit. They have to get back to playing pressure D and generating turnovers.

I would also consider taking Porzingas out earlier in the first quarter and then re-inserting him to play some minutes with the second unit so there is a scoring threat on the floor.

Part of the problem with going with the hot hand on the second unit is guys feel pressure to score right away to stay on the floor. That leads to their jacking shots. KOQ, Williams, Thomas and Seraphin all take many ill-advised shots.

In comment 12643974 Deej said:

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In comment 12643710 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 12643694 Canton said: Quote: "It’s important not to have guys have a down vibe by sitting and watching too much. You got to get some action." Which has to be the dumbest thing i have ever heard a coach say.... This is not the cub scout, this is not some rec league where everyone has to get minutes, time to be a big boy Fisher and set your rotation... I dont trust most of what coaches say in most sports. But I really dont trust what Fisher says. No idea what he's really thinking, but I dismiss everything he says as word salad.

The thing though, his rotation looks an awful lot like what he said in this quote, every game 12 guys play at minimum..he seems to give everyone a chance in the first half...it is dumb and it is going to ruin this team if he keeps doing it...

Not all 13 guys deserve minutes...

In comment 12643980 GiantsUA said:

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. Melo did not play well during the first half and things went south quickly.

Good point. This is not a team that can not afford to have Melo play a poor game or half. They might be able to get away with it agst a second division team but not agst better competition.

Whiteside has made Miami a lot more formidable. They are definitely top 4 in the East.

In comment 12643996 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 12643974 Deej said: I dont trust most of what coaches say in most sports. But I really dont trust what Fisher says. No idea what he's really thinking, but I dismiss everything he says as word salad. The thing though, his rotation looks an awful lot like what he said in this quote, every game 12 guys play at minimum..he seems to give everyone a chance in the first half...it is dumb and it is going to ruin this team if he keeps doing it... Not all 13 guys deserve minutes...

Yes but is he playing everyone for the sake of not allowing a down vibe, or is it because he generally doesnt think anyone is that much better than anyone else? I have to believe that Fisher, with all his experience in the league, does not think that the only way to prevent a down vibe is to run a rotation that no one else runs. Taking him at his word, he's saying that he isnt even minimally competent at managing a normal team situation.

In comment 12644011 Deej said:

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In comment 12643996 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 12643974 Deej said: I dont trust most of what coaches say in most sports. But I really dont trust what Fisher says. No idea what he's really thinking, but I dismiss everything he says as word salad. The thing though, his rotation looks an awful lot like what he said in this quote, every game 12 guys play at minimum..he seems to give everyone a chance in the first half...it is dumb and it is going to ruin this team if he keeps doing it... Not all 13 guys deserve minutes... Yes but is he playing everyone for the sake of not allowing a down vibe, or is it because he generally doesnt think anyone is that much better than anyone else? I have to believe that Fisher, with all his experience in the league, does not think that the only way to prevent a down vibe is to run a rotation that no one else runs. Taking him at his word, he's saying that he isnt even minimally competent at managing a normal team situation.

It is not the first time he has said this...

He said it after the first game he played Amundson...He said He wanted to give him a chance since he had not played all season to get into a game and be part of the game....

It makes sense...look at his rotations, he plays Vujacic for a 3 minute spurt...why? what other explanation is there?

is that nobody has distinguished himself after the first handful of games. If Grant, Williams and Seraphin were playing as well as Galloway, I think we would see very little of anyone else.

In comment 12644032 nygiants16 said:

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In comment 12644011 Deej said: Quote: In comment 12643996 nygiants16 said: Quote: In comment 12643974 Deej said: I dont trust most of what coaches say in most sports. But I really dont trust what Fisher says. No idea what he's really thinking, but I dismiss everything he says as word salad. The thing though, his rotation looks an awful lot like what he said in this quote, every game 12 guys play at minimum..he seems to give everyone a chance in the first half...it is dumb and it is going to ruin this team if he keeps doing it... Not all 13 guys deserve minutes... Yes but is he playing everyone for the sake of not allowing a down vibe, or is it because he generally doesnt think anyone is that much better than anyone else? I have to believe that Fisher, with all his experience in the league, does not think that the only way to prevent a down vibe is to run a rotation that no one else runs. Taking him at his word, he's saying that he isnt even minimally competent at managing a normal team situation. It is not the first time he has said this... He said it after the first game he played Amundson...He said He wanted to give him a chance since he had not played all season to get into a game and be part of the game.... It makes sense...look at his rotations, he plays Vujacic for a 3 minute spurt...why? what other explanation is there?

Slept with their wives/girlfriends and wants to avoid another Matt Barnes mishap?

In comment 12644040 Deej said:

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is that nobody has distinguished himself after the first handful of games. If Grant, Williams and Seraphin were playing as well as Galloway, I think we would see very little of anyone else.

Right, but Grant has still gotten consistent minutes. The last game he played was the shortest amount of time this year - 11 - 12 minutes. And he's shown that he has no confidence in his jumper.

And we could say yes, he's a rookie so he needs the minutes to help him get better. But then, what's the point of not even dressing Early?

The frustrating thing is there is no rhyme or reason to the minute allocations. The only thing we have to go by is that he tends to pull guys soon if they make mistakes, and he has said he wants to get everyone involved.

In comment 12644040 Deej said:

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is that nobody has distinguished himself after the first handful of games. If Grant, Williams and Seraphin were playing as well as Galloway, I think we would see very little of anyone else.

Come on it is a dumbass comment whether you believe him or not...

We have seen enough of vujacic to know he shouldn't be playing

And I would go with your theory if grant didn't come in for vujacic 3 minutes later and played the second half...

Your theory is debunked when he continues to play 12 guys

Thomas although he's contributed more.

I still haven't seen any evidence that Fisher knows what he's doing.

The Warriors are setting records even though Kerr can't stay upright, I just don't know why teams jump to give people without previous experience 5M a year to coach.

In comment 12643580 manh george said:

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The patterns with the second team have been emerging for a couple of weeks. I guess I expected more out of them.

I agree with you. O'quinn and Seraphim especially. People were calling for the latter to possibly start over KP before the season and O'Quinn was a rebounding machine for the first few games. Since, he has done virtually nothing and his time has thus decreased.

In comment 12644283 Matt M. said:

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In comment 12643580 manh george said: Quote: The patterns with the second team have been emerging for a couple of weeks. I guess I expected more out of them. I agree with you. O'quinn and Seraphim especially. People were calling for the latter to possibly start over KP before the season and O'Quinn was a rebounding machine for the first few games. Since, he has done virtually nothing and his time has thus decreased.

The last game O'Quinn played over 10 minutes he had 6 points 6 boards and 3 blocks since he has not had consistent minutes....

In comment 12644160 Jim in Hoboken said:

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Thomas although he's contributed more. I still haven't seen any evidence that Fisher knows what he's doing.

Really, none? So nothing out of an overwhelmingly positive start to the season should be credited to coaching?

In comment 12644299 Ten Ton Hammer said:

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In comment 12644160 Jim in Hoboken said: Quote: Thomas although he's contributed more. I still haven't seen any evidence that Fisher knows what he's doing. Really, none? So nothing out of an overwhelmingly positive start to the season should be credited to coaching?

Winning with 2 superstars ;)

In comment 12643737 Aspano! said:

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In comment 12643730 SethFromAstoria said: Quote: now? Hah was too lazy to find who said it in the first place. But that's why I said stick instead of suggesting it as my own idea. Someone needs to photoshop one of those hats on him.

kavorka � 1. an animal-like power that attracts a person to you, even if you spoke innocently for just a few minutes 2. quote: �It is a Latvian word which means �the lure of the animal'� � Latvian Priest 3. if possesed by it, only known remedy is a recipe of ten cloves garlic, three quarts of vinegar�
Porzingis....the Kavorka - ( New Window )

no doubt KP has a greater upside and that's not taking anything away from KAT

If the season ended today, who is happy with 41-41? I know I would be.

I want to see some development, and have a record that makes a UFA think we are ascendant. 41 wins accomplishes that. It is well above my preseason expectations.

It would be a few more than I expected. More than anything I'd like to see KP continue to kick ass and Grant show some improvement.

"KP6 originated when MSG Network sideline reporter Rebecca Haarlow and Knicks-telecast producer Spencer Julien sat down with Porzingis for a piece during training camp and they came up with a play on Chris Paul's CP3."

Those two idiots don't even "get" the CP3 nickname. Rebecca must butcher his name.

if I'm an idiot, but what is there to get about CP3 other than it's his initials and number? Is it some play on C-3PO?

See
Pee
Three

Are people incapable of pronouncing Kristaps Porzingis? His first name is two syllables, and his last name is three syllables - we can do this, guys!

In comment 12644363 Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy said:

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See Pee Three

uhh

In comment 12644377 bceagle05 said:

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Are people incapable of pronouncing Kristaps Porzingis? His first name is two syllables, and his last name is three syllables - we can do this, guys!

I seriously can't agree more and I think the nickname obsession is incredibly weird. He even has a name that is fun without a nickname and/or can be adjusted as you see fit..

Porzi, Porzingo, Zingis, Zingy, Porzonga, Porzingoramous,


so on and so forth