I have no confidence when I think about John Mara as the Co-Owner, CEO, and President of the Giants. The team has won two Super Bowls since he took over, so that should instill some confidence in his abilities, but I have none.
I have no confidence that he can make the right decisions about the GM and coaching staff, but I don't know if this is unfounded, so I'm looking for input. One concern I have is he has too much responsibility and there aren't enough 'football' people in the front office making decisions. Another concern is the way he talks about results, but only makes piecemeal changes.
I know there are posters on this site that understand the Giants org chart. Who does Mara lean on when big decisions need to be made. Is it Reese? If so, Reese isn't going anywhere.
This isn't necessarily a fire Reese, fire the coaching staff post. Here is where I stand: I want an infrastructure in place that will give the Giants a chance to win another Super Bowl with our franchise QB. What I don't know is what changes need to be made. What's more problematic is I don't trust that Mara knows either. Thoughts?
With extensive failure comes change or if you don't learn from your lessons you are doomed to repeat them
New faces, new system, new voice. The guy can't coach forever, this is it
He also realizes that change is necessary at times. That could come this offseason depending on whether he feels the in jury epidemic is denying TC a fair opportunity to reach their mutual goal of the playoffs and a chance in the tournament.
He also realizes that change is necessary at times. That could come this offseason depending on whether he feels the in jury epidemic is denying TC a fair opportunity to reach their mutual goal of the playoffs and a chance in the tournament.
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...continuity is one of the critical ingredient to success.
He also realizes that change is necessary at times. That could come this offseason depending on whether he feels the in jury epidemic is denying TC a fair opportunity to reach their mutual goal of the playoffs and a chance in the tournament.
I agree on both counts. However I wonder if the change that's needed starts with John Mara finding his own George Young to take over the football side of things.
That's what I am wondering as well. I get worried when I see Owner/President. Not as worried as I would be as a Cowboys fan. Not sure who said it, but owners own, coaches coach, players play. That goes for front office as well.
It is understandable I guess once he gets his turn to not want to be more involved. It certainly can't be easy and takes tremendous strength to relinquish that much power but I think the team would be better served moving forward if he removed himself from all football decisions and put his energy's into simple being a great supportive owner, and a great ambassador for the team and the league as Wellington was during the last era of his tenure.
It is understandable I guess once he gets his turn to not want to be more involved. It certainly can't be easy and takes tremendous strength to relinquish that much power but I think the team would be better served moving forward if he removed himself from all football decisions and put his energy's into simple being a great supportive owner, and a great ambassador for the team and the league as Wellington was during the last era of his tenure.
I think the issue is more in line with is John able to discern whether or not his football people (FO and coaches) are competent enough to turn around what has become a middling franchise, at best, since the middle of 2012?
No one is questioning that.
Actually, I read that each of Wellington's 11 (?) children owns an equal share of the family's 50% stake of the team. The NFL demands only one voice to speak for this 50%, and for now they all vote for John Mara.
But if for whatever reason one of them decides to sell and sell for a higher price to the Tisch family who is wealthier, then the Mara family will become only the minority owner.
Correct me if I am wrong, but that's what I seem to remember reading.
+1
Amen. He's nothing more than an entitled millionaire who has done nothing but win the DNA lottery.
People need to take a quick look around the league to see what's going on. If you're looking for a consistently top ranked team, there's not a lot of that going around. In fact, there's really only one shop in town.
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I'm not sentimental about the Mara family. In my conscious memory as a fan, the more hands-on they've been, the worse the team has been.
Amen. He's nothing more than an entitled millionaire who has done nothing but win the DNA lottery.
Agree. Don't think he or Tisch are bad guys or dumb but they are scions of wealth. Tisch made some great movies. How that skill set of Mara's makes one a great NFL executive is beyond me.
Here rightly promoted Reese when Ernie retired but he's been mediocre to horrible. Leoe focus on the draft but cap mangement and free agency have been disasters u see him. He's been GM for 9 years and fields a team with about 15-20 borderline players yesterday. The coach is a great man but if you are forced to fire bout coordinators tow years in a row you shouldn't be the head coach anymore.
And winning a playoff spot at 7-9 or even 8-8 is not a reason for this status quo to remain. The team is paper thin and outside of about 3-4 players almost no top tier talent
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I'm not sentimental about the Mara family. In my conscious memory as a fan, the more hands-on they've been, the worse the team has been.
Amen. He's nothing more than an entitled millionaire who has done nothing but win the DNA lottery.
While I agree, remember that alot of these bores turn into James Dolans and Irsay Jrs. So it could be worse. Much much worse. The one thing Mara has going for him an awareness of this. Steve Tisch, for example, would be nightmare.
I am extremely frustrated because they have lost 4 games that they could/should have won. If you give them two and one against Philly or Washington and this season is over. I understand injuries but every year we have injuries at the same positions. OL, Safety and LB. That to me screams Reese is not bolstering this team with talent through the draft or free agency which leads me back to Mara. It is time to cut bait and start over.
Be upset, be frustrated, yell and scream all you want. But to imply that the team has been 'horrible', 'mediocre' or anything else in that timeframe just sounds ignorant.
Might as well go outside and yell at a fire hydrant for getting pissed on, makes about as much sense.
People need to take a quick look around the league to see what's going on. If you're looking for a consistently top ranked team, there's not a lot of that going around. In fact, there's really only one shop in town.
I'm not saying that. I have no idea who his sounding boards are. I am also concerned he is too hands on.
That says a lot about the ignorance of the fanbase.
With extensive failure comes change or if you don't learn from your lessons you are doomed to repeat them
New faces, new system, new voice. The guy can't coach forever, this is it
+1
Mara is a class guy and I am perfectly happy with him as the owner. I am trying to get feedback on whether he is taking on too many football decisions.
The wildcard is Chris Mara - I've never been a fan, success or failure, of having one of the owners involved in the day to day football operations, in particular such a prominent role. I don't see how you could be objective in assessing their performance, or how their presence wouldn't somehow muck up the governance structure (e.g. - Reese should outrank Mara, but if Mara is adamant about something that Reese doesn't agree on, how likely will Reese be to overrule him?).
Here's the solution: clean house upon season end. Hire Eric DeCosta away from Baltimore. Let him make the necessary decisions to repair this sinking ship. Don't give me "look at Baltimore this year" either. The Ravens have been infinitely more consistent and successful than we have since drafting Joe Flacco. DeCosta is widely regarded as a rising star in the NFL and can either hand pick which team he'll manage or wait for Ozzie Newsome to retire and take over there. Unfortunately, Mara will probably stick to status quo and we'll be having the same discussion next year....
After this year, teh Ravens will have missed the playoffs 2 out of the past three years and only have 1 ring to show for it in Flacco's tenure.
Again - this comes down to whether people want to minimize SB wins over playoff appearances, and I get the impression people do.
So many BBI'ers look up to the way the Eagles and Cowboys regular season's go and those two teams have won jackshit, yet they want us to compare and mimic them.
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The Ravens have been infinitely more consistent and successful than we have since drafting Joe Flacco.
After this year, teh Ravens will have missed the playoffs 2 out of the past three years and only have 1 ring to show for it in Flacco's tenure.
Again - this comes down to whether people want to minimize SB wins over playoff appearances, and I get the impression people do.
So many BBI'ers look up to the way the Eagles and Cowboys regular season's go and those two teams have won jackshit, yet they want us to compare and mimic them.
What is inaccurate in what I said? They have been more consistent and successful than the NYG since 2008 (Flacco's rookie year), and it's not even debatable. They have qualified for the playoffs in 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 (won a Super Bowl), and 2014. We have qualified in 2008 and 2011 (won a Super Bowl). DeCosta is to Newsome what Ross is to Reese. He's the guy I want to rebuild this mess the right way. Reese has had 3 years and we aren't getting better.
Mara needs to shit can Reese and Ross Who have built a roster that is threadbare. At best. It's a mess w injuries but even win everyone healthy other the. OBJ and maybe DRC the drop off other than Eli is precipitous.
Not to mention a guy like Kuhn starting? S is a mess. CB is a disaster WRs is threadbare when they have spent a ton of picks in that spot. DL too. Extensions to Beason and last ones to off injured guys like DD Snee and Baas which screwed the cap up
9 years of Resse. This roster is all his. w a huge cash amount I pray they get new blood in the front office more than change the coach
Mara's the owner of a private entity. His duties are to make sure the entity is successful on many fronts. If he doesn't think the product on the field is good enough then he should be the one applying the pressures to change it. But that is under his idea of timing, not yours or anyone else's. An owner with patience (or maybe best said "not impatient") probably has a much more successful & stable organization than most.
Lastly, it seems like Mara has the respect of the organization, league office and other owners which shoiuld mean a great deal if your trying to assess him. Maybe some of that was granted because of the Mara name, but its not like John hasn't been around the block awhile so...
Be upset, be frustrated, yell and scream all you want. But to imply that the team has been 'horrible', 'mediocre' or anything else in that timeframe just sounds ignorant.
Might as well go outside and yell at a fire hydrant for getting pissed on, makes about as much sense.
And ditto for "Owners should own and not be involved in football operations."
2) Much better than average...even top level... relationships with the NFL itself. If you dont think that protects the team and counts over time and overall and on the edges ....you have not worked in a consortium or franchise model
3) the leaders set the tone of firm fairness that marks relationships with the players and the players union.
4) Relationships with community groups and civic leaders, political scammers and civic bureaucracies matter in the inevitable items that come up over the decades. That protects fans. And seat owners
5) the above four items become very very important over the next decades as challenges to the health and malpractice and safety of the players will require moral leadership and legal and risk and practical considerations.
6) Reputation is an asset. it counts in conversations with coaches and players and reps and college coaches and media and adversaries and NFL committees. Reputation is damaged by one incident people do not forget. One nick in credibility plays out for a long wave. Make a reputation damaging mistake and you pay for the risk the other guy perceives in doing business with you.
BBI for example has a reputation from its past and present that colors for good or bad its relationships with the team, the players, their families and the media.
Its part of doing business.
The giants reputation on the leadership level ( FA agent relationships is its own game) allows them access to anyone they wish to talk to...does not turn into a full win at the negotiating table...but it does accomplish step one...talking.
We are quite fortunate when it comes to ownership. The Giants are not a toy amongst the other crown jewels in someones portfolio nor a ego emotional bond...but rather a decades long stewardship.
If you know anything about the overall Tisch Family you know that long term dynastic diligence and stewardship and attention to detail has been their hallmark. Forget the movie stuff....they run tough to operate businesses into competitive profit leaders for decades. That does not happen by accident.
imho, this is not an area we should spend much time on. Plenty to debate and worry about and improve....but ownership is not one of them.
2) Much better than average...even top level... relationships with the NFL itself. If you dont think that protects the team and counts over time and overall and on the edges ....you have not worked in a consortium or franchise model
3) the leaders set the tone of firm fairness that marks relationships with the players and the players union.
4) Relationships with community groups and civic leaders, political scammers and civic bureaucracies matter in the inevitable items that come up over the decades. That protects fans. And seat owners
5) the above four items become very very important over the next decades as challenges to the health and malpractice and safety of the players will require moral leadership and legal and risk and practical considerations.
6) Reputation is an asset. it counts in conversations with coaches and players and reps and college coaches and media and adversaries and NFL committees. Reputation is damaged by one incident people do not forget. One nick in credibility plays out for a long wave. Make a reputation damaging mistake and you pay for the risk the other guy perceives in doing business with you.
BBI for example has a reputation from its past and present that colors for good or bad its relationships with the team, the players, their families and the media.
Its part of doing business.
The giants reputation on the leadership level ( FA agent relationships is its own game) allows them access to anyone they wish to talk to...does not turn into a full win at the negotiating table...but it does accomplish step one...talking.
We are quite fortunate when it comes to ownership. The Giants are not a toy amongst the other crown jewels in someones portfolio nor a ego emotional bond...but rather a decades long stewardship.
If you know anything about the overall Tisch Family you know that long term dynastic diligence and stewardship and attention to detail has been their hallmark. Forget the movie stuff....they run tough to operate businesses into competitive profit leaders for decades. That does not happen by accident.
imho, this is not an area we should spend much time on. Plenty to debate and worry about and improve....but ownership is not one of them.
Yes they are all of those things and all the more why they should concentrate on their obvious strengths and what they have to offer in leadership and stay out of the football decision making.
Even so, most are seemingly okay with this year being year 2 of a 4-year rebuild process. Why? Let's let Reese and Coughlin tinker a little more so maybe Eli will have a good team around him at age 37?
Once Eli retires, it might be another 10 years before we get another franchise QB, we absolutely can't take these next few years for granted. I don't understand why most are continuously confident that the following year will be different with a few roster additions but the exact same staff.
2 years ago it was "injuries, new players, refs, blah blah" last year it was "I'm okay with 3 crappy years because we get to enjoy a SB every 4 years, wait til next year," now that this year is going similarly bad again, it's "what do you expect, parity, HSS sucks..."
Since when is the NFL not a result-oriented league? None of us, none, knows what's the right move, but given these last few years, bringing Coughlin and Reese back is as much of a coin toss as hiring an entirely new staff.
It's not about being appreciative and not being impulsive, why are we content with having Eli as the QB and likely 4 straight years of sub-.500 record?
nepotism