I have not posted in awhile, since the hacking issue, but I figured I would share what I have heard on the Giants coaching search.
Don't shoot the messenger, but I have ran this and my source by Eric again.
This disappoints me, as like everybody else, I was hoping the Giants were pulling a red herring, but they are not.
They had planned to hire McAdoo as others have reported, but they were encouraged to speak to Hue Jackson, because of his overall resume on both sides of the ball. Also, they are intrigued by how he used his Running Backs and skill position players, especially AJ Green with less than great QB play. That being said, they have a lot of competition for Jackson.
Also asked about Cowher and Saban, neither has any interest, not sure a call was even placed to Saban, maybe through back channels. Cowher is happy doing what he is doing.
The most interesting tidbit was on Josh McDaniels, who I liked for the job and this is what my source wrote me. I am not sure if he got this from the Giants or one of his sources, but it is pretty blunt.
The Giants are the ultimate company-man franchise, and the league's committee that recommends coaching candidates to franchises didn't even put McDaniels on its preferred list. He's a cocky, weird dude who pissed off everyone as a HC in Denver and who did a terrible job as Spags' OC in St. Louis....And maybe Bob Quinn, the new Detroit GM and ex-Patriots front office guy, has already promised him the gig after the playoffs -- when he fires Caldwell.
Again, don't shoot the messenger, but I would say that McAdoo adn Jackson are candidates 1 and 1A.
Personally I don't want McDaniels because of everything stated right there. Hugh Jackson has had the most positional coach success in my opinion, so I am pretty excited about his interview.
My Cat just left me a sign it McAdoo too.
Or am I completely mistaken?
Or am I completely mistaken?
I think it was the other way around.
Thanks, RV.
Sounds like Jackson is a legit candidate, but the Giants won't give up personnel control or probably win a bidding war (if it comes to that), so they consider him less than likely, assuming he interviews well.
And they'd be comfortable with McAdoo as coach, so as long as he's not hired by someone else, and Jackson goes elsewhere, he's their guy.
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Peyton Hillis's wife? Or was it the other way around?
Or am I completely mistaken?
I think it was the other way around.
Thanks, RV.
McDaniels banged Peyton Hillis????? That is a wild man.
The rumor was that Hillis was traded after hitting on Laura McDaniels. Accounts vary, but I don't think even the most lurid version involved consummation.
Now, Danny Kanell and Whitney Casey (Sehorn)... that's a different story.
I had a similar reaction.
Coughlin's issue is the talent and I agree as the Giants only have 8 players worth keeping past this year, which is Reese's fault. (Eli, ODB, Flowers, Pugh, Richburg, Hankins, DRC and Collins.) Possibly JPP and Prince at the right prices. I am not considering special teams.
He may not have, that's 100% just guessing on my part on how one potential coaching job could be more attractive than the other.
I mean, if you're Hue Jackson why would you pick CLE over NYG? There isn't a reason I can think of other than if they let you shop for the groceries (or at least have a significant input to personnel)
Though most the guys they've interviewed appear to be OC's, they could also be interviewing options for a potential new DC spot. For example, if what the OP says about Caldwell is true, then maybe that means Austin will be released as well and they are interested in bringing him on as a DC with McAdoo HC.
Jackson as head coach with Ben Mac sticking around as OC?
Is that a possibility?
Hohhot Rim Shot...
Why are you so down on Jackson? Does he really want total control? It seems like that's a stipulation for dumpster fire clubs like Cleveland.
As far as Harris, I know you said you werent considering specials but I think he proved enough as a WR to say that he is a very good 3 or 4 WR and tough as nails.
As for Vereen, it's not his fault he wasnt utilized until game number 16.
If I was Mara I would ask Ben Mac to explain the Vereen situation. I'd also ask about the 3rd and goal against New England just before we kicked the FG only to lose the game.
Only 4 teams scored more than we did.
But hey let's go fresh and blow off 2016 and 2017 hey Eli is young..wait
It was not the Giants that viewed him as succesor, it was Coughlin...
and what's with this committee that recommends coaching? any one else find that strange?
If Mcadoo and Spags are HC and DC i am extrememly dissapointed, at that point might as well of just kept Coughlin..
Coughlin's issue is the talent and I agree as the Giants only have 8 players worth keeping past this year, which is Reese's fault. (Eli, ODB, Flowers, Pugh, Richburg, Hankins, DRC and Collins.) Possibly JPP and Prince at the right prices. I am not considering special teams.
Also Hankins, Vereen, maybe Jennings, maybe one or two others
The Giants need a running back that is elusive through the hole and makes people miss. As for Vereen, they can probably find a cheaper option.
I would keep Harris, but again, he makes a lot of money for what he is, a 4th WR.
and what's with this committee that recommends coaching? any one else find that strange?
Makes it seem like an old boys club.
I like the idea of Hue Jackson though. I've read that Joe Flacco loved working for him, the players really seem to like him. Also, 8-8 with Oakland is nothing to be ashamed about.
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I was 50/50 on whether they should fire Coughlin or not this season but if McAdoo or Jackson are the choices, they should have just kept him. This is a joke.
Why are you so down on Jackson? Does he really want total control? It seems like that's a stipulation for dumpster fire clubs like Cleveland.
I'm more down on McAdoo than Jackson though I guess Jackson is the best of the bunch between him, McAdoo, Marrone and Smith. But I'm not really blown away by Jackson like most others are just because he had one average season with a poor team. Plus hiring him means McAdoo is gone as OC and I'd kind of like to see him retain that role for continuity if possible. Which probably isn't realistic or likely but still.
I also don't think Jackson is a legit candidate if the information is true that they had to be recommended to interview him. Who even makes that recommendation anyway? Would Reese push for it, wanting a guy with at least some HC experience when his job is on the line?
Spags came up aces in 2007, but that was with a hall of famer plus 2 other pro bowl level players on the DL in Stray, Tuck, and Osi plus a quality MLB in Pierce. We've got nothing close to that level of talent on defense now. Spags has been exposed since then in his subsequent stops.
I agree it's time to rebuild with a new DC who gets a say in drafting/signing his type of guys.
He had MORE receptions, targets, and TDs than he had the previous season with the Patriots... how exactly was he used wrong?
I would love to know the decision making process over game planning/playcalling. i.e. how much leash McAdoo had to control the offense vs how much coughlin had input/overruled decisions.
He had MORE receptions, targets, and TDs than he had the previous season with the Patriots... how exactly was he used wrong?
Because he should have been used more since he's probably the 2nd best option we had on offense.
In regards to the OP, I just don't understand what they are trying to do. All this just to hire McAdoo? Doesn't make any sense to me.
If you ignore the age consideration, I seriously doubt there is another team out there who would opt for McAdoo over TC as a short term option, given the choice.
Not that chick again.
Why not wait a bit... And see if the next chapter in TC's career is with the Giants or not. IF Tom falls on his sword, and takes a job with the Giants, they win because some who felt Tom was wronged by the Giants will see his finger prints on McAdoo... and feel better about his promotion.
If Tom ends up elsewhere... "We cast a wide net and it was clear that after an extensive search the most impressive guy and the right guy for the team, right now is Ben McAdoo."
It all comes back to Tom. The spin will revolve around Tom.
He had MORE receptions, targets, and TDs than he had the previous season with the Patriots... how exactly was he used wrong?
Perhaps wrong is less accurate than not enough. There were five games this season where he caught 0-1 passes. On a team with no weapons outside of Beckham, that can't really be.
There were 5 games this season where he caught 6-8 passes.
Personally I have 5 candidates ahead of MacAdoo and Jackson. So I wouldn't be too keen on either guy TBH. We'll see how it all plays out.
Saban
Patricia
Smith
McDermott
McDaniels
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and was tied for 2nd in receiving TDs.
He had MORE receptions, targets, and TDs than he had the previous season with the Patriots... how exactly was he used wrong?
Perhaps wrong is less accurate than not enough. There were five games this season where he caught 0-1 passes. On a team with no weapons outside of Beckham, that can't really be.
There were 5 games this season where he caught 6-8 passes.
Maybe cause the other teams were adjusting coverage to him and OBJ.
You can't throw it to him if he is covered.
I don't care about number of catches. He had more here because the only other pass catching option we have is Beckham. They should have used Vereen a lot more.
A bigger issue was failing to use Beckham more. More? Yes More! We threw him about 6-7 screens all year. That's outrageous. This is a no risk play. Look how PIT uses the play early in games to get Brown the ball. They do it every game. ANd often. They throw it to Bryant too.
NYG should have had more plays getting Beckham the ball on short routes/screens.
They should have thrown them to guys like Harris and Vereen split wide.
This guys Jackson does it? Great. Would love to see him in NYG next year.
McDaniel? He's a clowm. Glad he's not on the radar.
The OP says the Giants "had wanted" to hire McAdoo but didnt b/c Jackson was highly recommended.
The problem I have with this thinking is that if they really "wanted" to hire Ben McAdoo, they interviewed him last Tuesday, the day after TC walked out the door. If that's your guy, you hire him because that is your belief and in this business you better have strong convictions. If you don't lock up the guy you are strongly considering, you sure as hell don't let him interview with the Philadelphia Eagles. What do the Giants have to gain by letting the Eagles brass sit in a room alone with their #1 head coaching candidate.
Also, if Hue Jackson is the reason they waited on McAdoo, how would that have made sense last Tuesday, considering right now Jackson could just as easily be prepping for the divisional round of the playoffs with perhaps even more time to even sniff an interview with the guy.
I don't dispute the info or the source, just saying it makes no sense from a mgmt. standpoint which is scary.
As a fan, if the Giants hire McAdoo my first gut feeling is going to be that this search did not exactly go as they planned.
On the flipside, if McAdoo was named head coach some time late last week I would have said to myself, the Giants like this guy's makeup and see him as a real up and coming mind.
The OP says the Giants "had wanted" to hire McAdoo but didnt b/c Jackson was highly recommended.
The problem I have with this thinking is that if they really "wanted" to hire Ben McAdoo, they interviewed him last Tuesday, the day after TC walked out the door. If that's your guy, you hire him because that is your belief and in this business you better have strong convictions. If you don't lock up the guy you are strongly considering, you sure as hell don't let him interview with the Philadelphia Eagles. What do the Giants have to gain by letting the Eagles brass sit in a room alone with their #1 head coaching candidate.
Also, if Hue Jackson is the reason they waited on McAdoo, how would that have made sense last Tuesday, considering right now Jackson could just as easily be prepping for the divisional round of the playoffs with perhaps even more time to even sniff an interview with the guy.
I don't dispute the info or the source, just saying it makes no sense from a mgmt. standpoint which is scary.
As a fan, if the Giants hire McAdoo my first gut feeling is going to be that this search did not exactly go as they planned.
On the flipside, if McAdoo was named head coach some time late last week I would have said to myself, the Giants like this guy's makeup and see him as a real up and coming mind.
This was exactly my point in the other thread...
The longer this goes the more and more the Giants seem like they are getting cold feet in hiring Mcadoo
Some days it seems to me that the front office thinks in terms of "If Coughlin doesn't make the playoffs, we need to fire him" instead of "The team isn't winning. What is broken and how do we fix it."
Eh, it worked out pretty well the last time they did it.
Harris, Vereen, Jennings, Tye, Hart, OO, Bromley, Brown, and Wing, are players I would add to your list.
who are the ultimate causes for the Giants Injury fiascos of the past few years?
Les, I don't disagree with the fact that it is always best to consider all options. I am just wondering if they "fired" Coughlin with the intention of promoting McAdoo, or whether they "fired" him knowing worst case scenario, they could promote McAdoo.
I do think if McAdoo does not get the Giants or Eagles job, he heads back to the Packers as offensive coordinator.
Did not hear anything on Patricia, does not seem the NFL is high on him yet.
Not so much because I don't think the guy can succeed, but that I'm not so sure he'd be a great fit here and with Eli.
Whole thing smells fishy to me still.
I do think if McAdoo does not get the Giants or Eagles job, he heads back to the Packers as offensive coordinator.
Did not hear anything on Patricia, does not seem the NFL is high on him yet.
Only BBI is in love with that Patricia Belichick
Whole thing smells fishy to me still.
Maybe it just didn't work out logistically...
People are over the top on the roster. This team was in 14 games at the 2 minute warning, went 6-8. The team was not getting destroyed by anyone, until they got eliminated the night before Minnesota, after a week of OBJ distractions.
The other thing is they have picks 1-6 in the draft, and around $45 million in cap space. If management was so poor, they would have squandered high picks (see Washington)or be up against it cap wise. The team is poised to be able to complete for the division title next year.
Whole thing smells fishy to me still.
3 interviews in one day is a lot. Maybe it's that simple?
I do, however, question them allowing Ben Mac to interview in Philly if that was the case.
I understand the Giants are a very accommodating franchise when it comes to career development, but they couldnt have stopped him from going to the Eagles for an interview? Even if they said, we will approve any interview except Philly?
I'm not in love with Jackson, but I prefer him to McAdoo for the simple reason that I feel the Giants need a complete overhaul from the training staff to the schemes.
Secondly, if the Giants were THAT interested, don't you think the interview with the Giants would take precedence over the Browns and 49ers for him?
Any rumblings on who McAdoo would bring in as his DC. We need to get this defense fixed
On Kennard, I like him, but he can't stay on the field.
People are over the top on the roster. This team was in 14 games at the 2 minute warning, went 6-8. The team was not getting destroyed by anyone, until they got eliminated the night before Minnesota, after a week of OBJ distractions.
The other thing is they have picks 1-6 in the draft, and around $45 million in cap space. If management was so poor, they would have squandered high picks (see Washington)or be up against it cap wise. The team is poised to be able to complete for the division title next year.
A couple of those you can claim belong in the aformentioned list (Kennard if healthy, Collins, etc), but it was mainly a list of core guys that you can build a team around. The guys you listed are mostly role players (at best) and backups. If you're backups or a couple starters (3-5 preferably) are comprised of that list you're fine. But even counting Jerry/Schwartz as 1 player and ignoring the STs, you're list contains 8-10 "starters". Which means the depth behind them is even lower quality...
http://www.sacbee.com/sports/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/article54011460.html - ( New Window )
in terms of DC candidates, McAdoo has connections to mike Nolan and jim haslett both of whom have a lot of experience including as head coaches. I would think they would go with someone with such big experience over, say, a linebackers or secondary coach that McAdoo worked with in green bay.
The OP says the Giants "had wanted" to hire McAdoo but didnt b/c Jackson was highly recommended.
The problem I have with this thinking is that if they really "wanted" to hire Ben McAdoo, they interviewed him last Tuesday, the day after TC walked out the door. If that's your guy, you hire him because that is your belief and in this business you better have strong convictions. If you don't lock up the guy you are strongly considering, you sure as hell don't let him interview with the Philadelphia Eagles. What do the Giants have to gain by letting the Eagles brass sit in a room alone with their #1 head coaching candidate.
Also, if Hue Jackson is the reason they waited on McAdoo, how would that have made sense last Tuesday, considering right now Jackson could just as easily be prepping for the divisional round of the playoffs with perhaps even more time to even sniff an interview with the guy.
I don't dispute the info or the source, just saying it makes no sense from a mgmt. standpoint which is scary.
As a fan, if the Giants hire McAdoo my first gut feeling is going to be that this search did not exactly go as they planned.
On the flipside, if McAdoo was named head coach some time late last week I would have said to myself, the Giants like this guy's makeup and see him as a real up and coming mind.
I have to agree that you dont let your #1 candidate leave and interview with Philly. It makes no sense since the Giants had to give permission for him to interview. If they hire McAdoo and he keeps Spags what was the whole point of firing TC? And wouldnt it be great if TC takes a job in the front office so we keep everyone so we can go 6-10 again.
To me our O didnt feel like a top O in the league. We were too hot and cold. I think we were also in the middle of the road on 3 and outs which explains why the a top O finishes 6-10. Yes we had a bad D but we lost the early games due to the O. Against Dallas we caused 5 turnovers and still only had 26 points with a pick 6 by DRC and scoring FGs instead of TDs. In Atlanta we scored 20 points with a key fumble and still had 1:14 to drive and score. We start off 2-0 instead of 1-2 its a different season.
Our offensive numbers are also inflated by the NO game and the Carolina game. The NO game should never have been lost in regulation regardless of the D. Tied with 36 seconds and the ball. 7 points in the Philly game which included a pick 6. The 2nd Washington game with the season on the line and lets not forget Minnesota. The O was not great but the D was worse.
Plan for Hue Jackson remains to speak w/#Giants Thursday. Block out all the noise for now. As I've been saying, he's a serious candidate
The roster stuff is my opinion and I included Collins in my 8 keepers.
Some days it seems to me that the front office thinks in terms of "If Coughlin doesn't make the playoffs, we need to fire him" instead of "The team isn't winning. What is broken and how do we fix it."
This pretty well sums up why I didn't like the Coughlin firing.
so they got rid of him.
Don't understand the angst about BM. For all we know he could have done a better job as OC if TC hadn't meddled. What matters about BM is whether he's organized enough to be a HC. I don't know. How do you guys know whether he is or isn't?
I would call that bet.
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that the Giants had to be convinced to bring him in for an interview.
and what's with this committee that recommends coaching? any one else find that strange?
Makes it seem like an old boys club.
I'm sorry. I must have missed where the Giants were convinced to interview Hue Jackson... where did that come from?
And here we are playing footsie with Hue Jackson.
I don't care about number of catches. He had more here because the only other pass catching option we have is Beckham. They should have used Vereen a lot more.
Unless you know for certain that the RBBC and actual playing time was solely the purview of McAdoo, I'm not sure how you can blame him for Vereen's "lack" of targets or snaps.
Here's the percentage of snaps in which the Giants' top 4 receivers were targeted:
- Vereen: targeted on 19% of his snaps
- Beckham: targeted on 16% of his snaps
- Tye: targeted on 11% of his snaps
- Randle: targeted on 9% of his snaps
So, Vereen played the most snaps of any Giants' RB AND he had the ball thrown to him on a higher percentage of his snaps than anyone on the team.
Good I hope he brings Schwartz with him
Lot of bed wetting going on based on a few rumors.
One thing that doesn't make sense - if McAdoo doesn't get top job and he is out here because OC is hired - what's to say he doesn't catch on with one of the newly hired HCs elsewhere?
Doesn't make much sense to me either.
what has Mcdoo shown as an OC that makes him a candidate for a Giants HC job
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I agree with JonC that this is another half measure solution.
Some days it seems to me that the front office thinks in terms of "If Coughlin doesn't make the playoffs, we need to fire him" instead of "The team isn't winning. What is broken and how do we fix it."
This pretty well sums up why I didn't like the Coughlin firing.
the team has been trying to "fix it" with Coughlin at the controls for the last 4 years and it hasn't worked for whatever reason so its just time now for someone different to try to get the job done...