Ralph Vacchiano & #8207;@RVacchianoNYDN 28m28 minutes ago
For the record, CBS' Bill Cowher says no one from the Giants even reached out to him to gauge his interest n replacing Tom Coughlin.
Obviously, that ship has sailed, but if what Cowher is saying is true, it's amazing how worked up we get on BBI about stuff that we just conjure up on our own. I'm as guilty as anybody.
seemed to make the most sense it me. Unless TC had decided to leave anyway after last year. He was not the problem, We will find out down the line.
I don't disagree with this. However, the way they interviewed people and the whole process just didn't seem right. Hue Jackson was contacted late hence why there was no interview. Mike Smith came out of nowhere. After the whole process was complete it seems more and more like their mind was made up prior to the interview process and that bothers me. It doesn't bother me if McAdoo was really the best candidate and best situation for us to succeed but having that predetermined is not the right way to approach this. I have no idea if this was the case. They very well could have kept an open mind. I hope they did.
and I was never a huge proponent of hiring him given he was out so long. But, I think not even calling him is egregious on the Giants part. How are you not interested in a coach of his caliber where there is at least a hint of interest? That is no different than the Knicks not calling Jackson for the coaching job because they decided he wouldn't take it. You have to explore options like this. Let him say no.
good I don't understand all the love here for a coach who was a good
seemed to make the most sense it me. Unless TC had decided to leave anyway after last year. He was not the problem, We will find out down the line.
I don't disagree with this. However, the way they interviewed people and the whole process just didn't seem right. Hue Jackson was contacted late hence why there was no interview. Mike Smith came out of nowhere. After the whole process was complete it seems more and more like their mind was made up prior to the interview process and that bothers me. It doesn't bother me if McAdoo was really the best candidate and best situation for us to succeed but having that predetermined is not the right way to approach this. I have no idea if this was the case. They very well could have kept an open mind. I hope they did.
Sometimes you think you know what you want, but you still shop around to make sure there isn't something better out there. I have no problem with the way the Giants handled things... due diligence.
I would have been more concerned if they hired McAdoo without at least hearing what others had to offer.
Given the way this process seemed to play out, I am concerned they didn't call either. Had they really been interested in the possibility of hiring someone other than McAdoo, then at least one of Gruden or Cowher should have been called. To me, the problem is really that they only seemed to have their eyes on McAdoo; it was his job to lose by a wide margin, apparently.
I am not saying I didn't want them to interview others. Due diligence to me means keeping an open mind and really analyzing all possibilities. Just interviewing when you have your mind made up is worrisome.
"I've never said, I'll never go back," Cowher says. "Why shut a door you don't have to? I just don't want to be the person that says, 'No, I'm never going to coach again.' And then five years from now I come back and people say, 'But you said you weren't!' I feel sometimes when I answer the question, people go, 'Oh there he is! He's waiting for the perfect job!"
Quote:
"Right now, I love what I'm doing. More importantly, I love the lifestyle. Having the flexibility it's given me to do things I couldn't do for the first 49 years of my life."
From a Rolling Stone article not too long ago... He's happy doing what he's going. Link - ( New Window )
I am not saying I didn't want them to interview others. Due diligence to me means keeping an open mind and really analyzing all possibilities. Just interviewing when you have your mind made up is worrisome.
But we don't know that they had their minds set on him.
From what I've read, they interviewed McAdoo just once at first. They liked the interview but still interviewed others. When Jackson pulled out, and reports came out Eagles were interested in McAdoo, they met again with him, and finalized the deal. The process took what, 2 weeks maybe?
That, to me at least, indicates they dud keep an open mind, but eventually hired they guy they liked best from all they interviewed, before it got too late.
I know it to be true. And for the record there was a strong contingent in the front office who wanted him badly.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
I know it to be true. And for the record there was a strong contingent in the front office who wanted him badly.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
If that's the case, he's doing himself a favor, not the Giants.
From Giants' perspective, they picked the better fit for them, whatever reasons there may be, personnel control, coaching philosophy, vision... Etc. At this point there's nothing for them to worry about, they didn't "settle" for anything.
If what you're saying is true, Giants picking McAdoo over him, hurts him more than it hurts them. That's how I would see it anyways.
I said it when we hired BM and I'm happy with his hire
I know it to be true. And for the record there was a strong contingent in the front office who wanted him badly.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
Cowher should have just declined to comment. Neither a false denial, nor a complete lack of interest by the Giants, reflects well on him.
seemed to make the most sense it me. Unless TC had decided to leave anyway after last year. He was not the problem, We will find out down the line.
Maybe he want the problem..but how soon everyone forgets. Coach Coughlin is directly responsible for atleast 3 loses. 1st game against Dallas, That next week against The Falcons and The Game against The Jets.
Poor clock management in those 3 games caused us a w each time.
he's being both polite and strategic. He says that no one reached out to him, emphasis on him, personally. That is no doubt true. And, by saying that, he (politely) denies that he turned down the Giants and (strategically) leaves the door open for the future.
Why would he possibly be interested in the future, if he wasn't interested in the current situation? Maybe he didn't want to work with Reese, to whom Mara was publicly committed. Maybe he didn't want to hitch himself to 35 year old Eli. (He's been very complimentary of Eli in the past, yes, but who knows what he really thinks now.)
I know it to be true. And for the record there was a strong contingent in the front office who wanted him badly.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
I don't see why he would feel the need to "do the Giants a solid". Dragging this story up from the dead doesn't do the team any favors. In fact, what it does it get beat writers to ask more questions. I don't see how this benefits the team whatsoever. Now Mara has to answer this question next time he speaks.
Why exactly should we believe "ThatLimmerickGuy"? Maybe I've missed something, and I mean this in the nicest possible way, but most of what I've seen this guy post is absolute garbage. Is he actually claiming to have some kind of inside sources?
Bwahaaaaaaaaaa! Well, alrighty then! There you have it folks! Cowher is a liar! ThatLimmerickGuy says so!
Cowher absolutely could be lying. Saying the Giants really wanted him
Would be indirectly undercuttinga fellow coach in McAdoo.
The only choice he has is to deny it. It's bad form to say anything else. Frankly he shouldn't even have addressed it. The team is trying to move forward.
The guy hasn't coached in 10 years. How does anybody know if he can relate to today's young players. How does anybody know he can put the hours and effort in anymore?
I would like to have a little information on the source discussed here. It's hard for me to believe that those in the know in the front office do not talk. If the source came through Cowher or the agent, they says something else
Sure, Cowher could be lying. Though I kind of like to give people the benefit of doubt and not just call them a liar without having any facts. This poster above doesn't have any more a clue than you or I do. He's guessing and pretending he has sources. Now, don't get me wrong, there are posters on BBI that absolutely have sources, I really, really doubt this guy is one of them.
Somebody close to the Giants asks the people representing Cowher if he would have an interest. The word comes back "No" and everybody moves on. Nobody contacted Cowher-directly.
George Young got caught playing that game during the 83 season when he had feelers put out to Howard Schellenberger about replacing Parcells. Problem was the conduit was in Parcells' camp. GY denied it. But he was exposed as a liar. Parcells never forgave Young. Nor did Young forgive Parcells for going public with the information.
Young gained his revenge when Bill made entreaties to return to the team after Reeves was fired. Mara wanted Bill . So did his son. But GY invoked the no-interference clause in his contract.
This is a nut-slicing, dick- smoking business. It's not very honorable, at least what goes on behind the scenes.
Why exactly should we believe "ThatLimmerickGuy"? Maybe I've missed something, and I mean this in the nicest possible way, but most of what I've seen this guy post is absolute garbage. Is he actually claiming to have some kind of inside sources?
Bwahaaaaaaaaaa! Well, alrighty then! There you have it folks! Cowher is a liar! ThatLimmerickGuy says so!
It actually doesn't matter. For Cowher to comment, either way, is dumb on his part.
RE: Cowher absolutely could be lying. Saying the Giants really wanted him
Would be indirectly undercuttinga fellow coach in McAdoo.
The only choice he has is to deny it. It's bad form to say anything else. Frankly he shouldn't even have addressed it. The team is trying to move forward.
The guy hasn't coached in 10 years. How does anybody know if he can relate to today's young players. How does anybody know he can put the hours and effort in anymore?
yeah cause Bruce Arians and Pete Carroll are having a rough time relating to todays younger players..
And Cowher is younger than both of them..
Coaching is coaching.. if he wanted to.. He could do it.. I dont believe he wants to if it is not totally on his terms
I know it to be true. And for the record there was a strong contingent in the front office who wanted him badly.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
Either he's lying or, you're just full of shit.
Based upon what we know, I'm leaning towards you being full of shit.
I think not even calling him is egregious on the Giants part. How are you not interested in a coach of his caliber where there is at least a hint of interest? ..... You have to explore options like this. Let him say no.This statement is so full of buloney and hubris....
there is so much wrong with that statement....it is NOT egregious on the Giants part.... And they do NOT have to explore options like that. Except in your mind...In case you haven't noticed this was their decision to make in any reasonable manner that THEY wanted to. It is not "egregious" if they decided they didn't want a man who had been out of football forever. And they most certainly do not have to explore "options" like this.
You sound like a fool and I'm sure you're not..Just settle down.
Given the way this process seemed to play out, I am concerned they didn't call either. Had they really been interested in the possibility of hiring someone other than McAdoo, then at least one of Gruden or Cowher should have been called. To me, the problem is really that they only seemed to have their eyes on McAdoo; it was his job to lose by a wide margin, apparently.
Matt - those are two separate issues, though.
Gruden and Cowher have been out of coaching for some time. I wouldn't blame *any* team for not calling them. It's entirely likely that neither one has any designs on returning to the sideline, and there's nothing to say that the long layoff hasn't rendered them completely useless as coaches.
Being concerned that the Giants were fixated on McAdoo is another matter, though - one that can only be dismissed if they legitimately considered other coaching options. They did interview outside candidates, and presumably ones that were leading candidates for jobs elsewhere (and two of them were hired elsewhere). We don't know how seriously they pursued them, though. That's where I'd get upset, if it was revealed that there was never any serious consideration given to anyone else, and the hiring process was more of a dog and pony show.
that this love affair with Macadoo doesn't lead to Ray Handley 2.0. It's hard to believe that the Giants are so in love with potential that they wouldn't reach out to a guy with a proven track record to lead this team. I've really been wondering what Mara was thinking this offseason. You keep a GM who hasn't really added a wealth of talent in the draft through the years, he scapegoats Coughlin, and then hires a guy based on hope. I may eat my words but this offseason is a total head scratcher.
that this love affair with Macadoo doesn't lead to Ray Handley 2.0. It's hard to believe that the Giants are so in love with potential that they wouldn't reach out to a guy with a proven track record to lead this team. I've really been wondering what Mara was thinking this offseason. You keep a GM who hasn't really added a wealth of talent in the draft through the years, he scapegoats Coughlin, and then hires a guy based on hope. I may eat my words but this offseason is a total head scratcher.
Actually, the offseason made perfect sense if you look at it from the angle that McAdoo was the preordained winner.
In that scenario - the Giants had plans to transition from Coughlin to McAdoo as the coach of the future, but had to accelerate it because of results. Reese and Coughlin were both on the hot seat, the change at the top usually works with the coach getting the ax first and then the GM, so Coughlin's out, the transition to McAdoo happens sooner, and Reese is on the hot seat.
Cowher was never a serious consideration for two likely reason. One, who the hell knows if the guy can even coach anymore (it's been 10 years, not a lot of examples of guys who disappear for 10 years and come back successful). Two, rumors that he wanted total control of personnel. That's not the Giants way, nor is it the way most organizations operate. Just look at what happened in Philly to see why they might not want to go that route.
Forget Cowher and Gruden - if you're upset at them not looking at other coaches, it's time to look at how seriously guys like Gase, Jackson, Marrone, etc. were considered.
Looks like the offense improved year over year and we lost Cruz... and didn't find a TE until season end and our OL was challenged. I am happy with the progress of the Offense and disagree that Macadoo hasn't done shit. What concerns me is how bad our defense looked -- which I thought was going to be the strength of the team last year. We need some playmakers on defense, a friggin pass rush would help!
This, which kind of worries me.
TC just made it happen sooner than they wanted
I don't disagree with this. However, the way they interviewed people and the whole process just didn't seem right. Hue Jackson was contacted late hence why there was no interview. Mike Smith came out of nowhere. After the whole process was complete it seems more and more like their mind was made up prior to the interview process and that bothers me. It doesn't bother me if McAdoo was really the best candidate and best situation for us to succeed but having that predetermined is not the right way to approach this. I have no idea if this was the case. They very well could have kept an open mind. I hope they did.
actually it strengthens my faith in the Mara/Reese fo
Quote:
seemed to make the most sense it me. Unless TC had decided to leave anyway after last year. He was not the problem, We will find out down the line.
I don't disagree with this. However, the way they interviewed people and the whole process just didn't seem right. Hue Jackson was contacted late hence why there was no interview. Mike Smith came out of nowhere. After the whole process was complete it seems more and more like their mind was made up prior to the interview process and that bothers me. It doesn't bother me if McAdoo was really the best candidate and best situation for us to succeed but having that predetermined is not the right way to approach this. I have no idea if this was the case. They very well could have kept an open mind. I hope they did.
Sometimes you think you know what you want, but you still shop around to make sure there isn't something better out there. I have no problem with the way the Giants handled things... due diligence.
I would have been more concerned if they hired McAdoo without at least hearing what others had to offer.
From a Rolling Stone article not too long ago... He's happy doing what he's going.
Link - ( New Window )
But we don't know that they had their minds set on him.
From what I've read, they interviewed McAdoo just once at first. They liked the interview but still interviewed others. When Jackson pulled out, and reports came out Eagles were interested in McAdoo, they met again with him, and finalized the deal. The process took what, 2 weeks maybe?
That, to me at least, indicates they dud keep an open mind, but eventually hired they guy they liked best from all they interviewed, before it got too late.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
If that's the case, he's doing himself a favor, not the Giants.
From Giants' perspective, they picked the better fit for them, whatever reasons there may be, personnel control, coaching philosophy, vision... Etc. At this point there's nothing for them to worry about, they didn't "settle" for anything.
If what you're saying is true, Giants picking McAdoo over him, hurts him more than it hurts them. That's how I would see it anyways.
Thank god it's over with.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
Cowher should have just declined to comment. Neither a false denial, nor a complete lack of interest by the Giants, reflects well on him.
Maybe he want the problem..but how soon everyone forgets. Coach Coughlin is directly responsible for atleast 3 loses. 1st game against Dallas, That next week against The Falcons and The Game against The Jets.
Poor clock management in those 3 games caused us a w each time.
Can't blame that on the front office.
Why would he possibly be interested in the future, if he wasn't interested in the current situation? Maybe he didn't want to work with Reese, to whom Mara was publicly committed. Maybe he didn't want to hitch himself to 35 year old Eli. (He's been very complimentary of Eli in the past, yes, but who knows what he really thinks now.)
The world can still turn.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
I don't see why he would feel the need to "do the Giants a solid". Dragging this story up from the dead doesn't do the team any favors. In fact, what it does it get beat writers to ask more questions. I don't see how this benefits the team whatsoever. Now Mara has to answer this question next time he speaks.
Bwahaaaaaaaaaa! Well, alrighty then! There you have it folks! Cowher is a liar! ThatLimmerickGuy says so!
The only choice he has is to deny it. It's bad form to say anything else. Frankly he shouldn't even have addressed it. The team is trying to move forward.
He's kind of an enigma - Some say he's tough, but I see him fraternizing with the players way too much.
He does seem to be a hard worker (lunch-pail kind of guy), but in some ways it just seems that he's already peaked.
I would like to have a little information on the source discussed here. It's hard for me to believe that those in the know in the front office do not talk. If the source came through Cowher or the agent, they says something else
George Young got caught playing that game during the 83 season when he had feelers put out to Howard Schellenberger about replacing Parcells. Problem was the conduit was in Parcells' camp. GY denied it. But he was exposed as a liar. Parcells never forgave Young. Nor did Young forgive Parcells for going public with the information.
Young gained his revenge when Bill made entreaties to return to the team after Reeves was fired. Mara wanted Bill . So did his son. But GY invoked the no-interference clause in his contract.
This is a nut-slicing, dick- smoking business. It's not very honorable, at least what goes on behind the scenes.
Bwahaaaaaaaaaa! Well, alrighty then! There you have it folks! Cowher is a liar! ThatLimmerickGuy says so!
It actually doesn't matter. For Cowher to comment, either way, is dumb on his part.
The only choice he has is to deny it. It's bad form to say anything else. Frankly he shouldn't even have addressed it. The team is trying to move forward.
yep
yeah cause Bruce Arians and Pete Carroll are having a rough time relating to todays younger players..
And Cowher is younger than both of them..
Coaching is coaching.. if he wanted to.. He could do it.. I dont believe he wants to if it is not totally on his terms
I happened to be in a situation where I was able to get some good info last month and tried to share as much as I could.
Nevermind. I won't even bother if I hear anything its really not worth it.
It's like when they brought in Jan Michael Vincent to be Charles Bronson's assistant in The Mechanic.
Think about it logically for a second. Cowher is doing the Giants a solid.
If Cowher says "oh yeah we talked but it didn't work out" it both makes the giants look like they settled for mcadoo and also tries to make a scenario where mcadoo impressed more than cowher.
My source was clear. Cowher was a lot closer than many people think but he wanted a lot more personnel control and the Giants love their organizational structure.
Either he's lying or, you're just full of shit.
Based upon what we know, I'm leaning towards you being full of shit.
there is so much wrong with that statement....it is NOT egregious on the Giants part.... And they do NOT have to explore options like that. Except in your mind...In case you haven't noticed this was their decision to make in any reasonable manner that THEY wanted to. It is not "egregious" if they decided they didn't want a man who had been out of football forever. And they most certainly do not have to explore "options" like this.
You sound like a fool and I'm sure you're not..Just settle down.
Just because the Giants didn't it's something horrible?
Matt - those are two separate issues, though.
Gruden and Cowher have been out of coaching for some time. I wouldn't blame *any* team for not calling them. It's entirely likely that neither one has any designs on returning to the sideline, and there's nothing to say that the long layoff hasn't rendered them completely useless as coaches.
Being concerned that the Giants were fixated on McAdoo is another matter, though - one that can only be dismissed if they legitimately considered other coaching options. They did interview outside candidates, and presumably ones that were leading candidates for jobs elsewhere (and two of them were hired elsewhere). We don't know how seriously they pursued them, though. That's where I'd get upset, if it was revealed that there was never any serious consideration given to anyone else, and the hiring process was more of a dog and pony show.
Actually, the offseason made perfect sense if you look at it from the angle that McAdoo was the preordained winner.
In that scenario - the Giants had plans to transition from Coughlin to McAdoo as the coach of the future, but had to accelerate it because of results. Reese and Coughlin were both on the hot seat, the change at the top usually works with the coach getting the ax first and then the GM, so Coughlin's out, the transition to McAdoo happens sooner, and Reese is on the hot seat.
Cowher was never a serious consideration for two likely reason. One, who the hell knows if the guy can even coach anymore (it's been 10 years, not a lot of examples of guys who disappear for 10 years and come back successful). Two, rumors that he wanted total control of personnel. That's not the Giants way, nor is it the way most organizations operate. Just look at what happened in Philly to see why they might not want to go that route.
Forget Cowher and Gruden - if you're upset at them not looking at other coaches, it's time to look at how seriously guys like Gase, Jackson, Marrone, etc. were considered.