to their guys. How much cap space are they going to have after this? Hopefully not a ton.
I'm interested in Oliver Vernon but if Curry's contract is any indication, Vernon is going to get a huge deal that I won't want the Giants to take part in.
Happens every yeah, especially when the Giants sign one of their own. Quick to yell overpaid while knowing nothing of comparable salaries for the position.
Happens every yeah, especially when the Giants sign one of their own. Quick to yell overpaid while knowing nothing of comparable salaries for the position.
Well, luckily this year we may avoid that exercise in futility as the NYG have nobody worthy of a "must resign" moniker....
His numbers this year are not really relevant. He was playing out of position in a 3-4. When he did get in he was always around the qb. He's a good player and he's going to have a big spike in stats next year.
He wasn't going to have numbers playing as a 3-4 DE
hes a rusher, not a space eater. They're betting on his potential playing in an attacking 4-3.
Agreed.
I wonder how active the Giants can be in FA. Teams like Denver are sure to lose some players. But I don't want the Giants to overpay simply because they have a good amount of cap space.
Are cash strapped heading into FA and are vulnerable so both Vernon and Jackson should be available. However, as more potential FA DEs fall off the board it does make you wonder if that will put greater pressure on the team to resign JPP. You can only solve so many problems through the draft.
I see Jackson mentioned a lot. Will he hit free agency? If Peyton retires, wouldn't that free up cap space so the Bronos could re-sign Miller and Jackson?
He played OLB in the 3-4 so he did rush the passer.
Absolutely right: he has primarily been an edge rusher in the 3-4, and has been disruptive when he has been on the field, which has been around a third of the defensive snaps under Bill Davis.
That's a bit of a double-edged sword. On one hand, there's no question he can rush the passer, and there's less wear on his tires than the typical fifth-year player approaching his 28th birthday. On the other hand, nobody knows how well he will handle a heavier workload, or how well he will hold up against the run.
With Curry signed, three-quarters of the starting line is set. Cox remains the centerpiece - most likely as the 3-technique DT - with Logan as the main space-eater. On the outside, Curry figures to be the primary RDE. Graham and Barwin are good players, although they and Marcus Smith (a bust so far) don't fit the 4-3 as well as Curry. So in year one, Schwartz might wind up with one of the incumbent 3-4 DEs starting at LDE. Cox could stay at DE, with somebody like Thornton moving inside.
Giants $40-50m wont buy as much as we might have initially thought
...the QB draft class was horrible. Lane Johnson is a good player, but he isn't going to fill the void in Philly's trophy case. I don't think Chip Kelly set that team back as much as the lack of a franchise QB. 2013 was their chance to finally replace McNabb, and the best the NCAA could offer was EJ Manuel, Geno Smith and Mike Glennon. Ryan Nassib might still turn out to be the best QB from that class - if only because he hasn't had a chance to suck yet.
keep in mind he's been playing out of position. Also he only played 27% of the defensive snaps last year (36% in 2014).
If he was so good, why would he play only 27% of the snaps.
Because an effective 4-3 DE is not as effective in a 3-4. Square peg, round hole - like many of the players the Giants have wasted draft picks on over the years.
I believe Osweiler is a free agent and they will need to re-sign him and Von Miller. Already re-signed Wolfe. Trevathan is a free agent as well. I think Jackson is going to hit FA and he would be my number 1 target if I were JR.
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I see Jackson mentioned a lot. Will he hit free agency? If Peyton retires, wouldn't that free up cap space so the Bronos could re-sign Miller and Jackson?
keep in mind he's been playing out of position. Also he only played 27% of the defensive snaps last year (36% in 2014).
If he was so good, why would he play only 27% of the snaps.
Because an effective 4-3 DE is not as effective in a 3-4. Square peg, round hole - like many of the players the Giants have wasted draft picks on over the years.
This.
He's an edge pass rusher. They only really put him in for passing downs and even then not at his natural position. Those throwing around low sack numbers need to account for that. If they stayed in the 3-4, I would have though the Giants might have a shot at him. When it was known they were going back to the 4-3, I pretty much lost any small hope the Giants would sign him.
Similar circumstances for Mario Williams. If he's cut, he might be a good veteran option for the Giants. They could certainly use some veteran leadership on defense. He would be just a stop gap though until they can develop players through the draft. I hope they are considering him for a 2-3 year deal. I'm thinking similar to what the Broncos did with Demarcus Ware.
But he may well be worth that (or more) going forward. And they know him better than anyone. That's a very aggressive move and probably a pretty smart one. I figured, given his limited playing time under Kelly, he'd want to see what the market was but $9.5mil/per is as much market as anyone in his position needs to see.
was pretty critical of the Eagles resigns yesterday on Philly radio.
Called Lane Johnson a B to B- player, and Ertz a B+ player, and was skeptical of the money the gave him.
This was before the Curry news broke, wonder what he thinks of that?
I probably also think this indicates they won't be resigning Bradford......unless they have even more cap room.
I can understand them not signing Bradford but then these signing won't get them very far. As average (if that) as Bradford is, he's the best QB available outside of Cousins who won't get near FA. And if they do resign him they're hooked to a very average (if that) QB.
I wonder what other demand there might be for Sam Bradford
He apparently turned down a huge extension from Kelly, right? If that's the case, and he wants to play hardball - given the amounts of money that might get thrown around this offseason, it's conceivable they'll have to pay him even more than what he turned down, so long as there's another team willing to pay him.
not "re-signs". They were both under contract for 2016 still so the extensions likely had little to no impact on the Eagles 2016 cap space.
Curry was a UFA so a good chunk of his deal will hit the 2016 cap. Depending on the structure of the deal, that could be anywhere from $5-10M+ and the Eagles were projected to have $21M in cap space prior to re-signing Curry. So they should still have plenty of money left to lock up Bradford (if they choose).
This is a pretty big indictment against Chip Kelly. They're basically saying he had a ~$10M player riding the bench...
RE: I wonder what other demand there might be for Sam Bradford
He apparently turned down a huge extension from Kelly, right? If that's the case, and he wants to play hardball - given the amounts of money that might get thrown around this offseason, it's conceivable they'll have to pay him even more than what he turned down, so long as there's another team willing to pay him.
I'm no Bradford fan, but even as an Alex Smith level QB he should get $15M per on the open market. Off the top of my head, you have to figure the following teams will be interested:
Jets - depending on Fitz
Texans - legit playoff team with an average QB
Eagles
Cleveland?
Rams - may not want him back
There is absolutely nothing noteworthy as far as free agent QB's go. He's got a year left on his deal and he's cheap - which would be a good situation for some other team. They'd need to sign him next year but he'd also have all the motivation in the world to prove he's worth it.
RE: I wonder if now wouldn't be a good time to try and trade Nassib.
There is absolutely nothing noteworthy as far as free agent QB's go. He's got a year left on his deal and he's cheap - which would be a good situation for some other team. They'd need to sign him next year but he'd also have all the motivation in the world to prove he's worth it.
You'd have to hope that Reese is listening, but I think BBI underrates the value of Nassib. He's been decent in preseason outings, he knows the offense, and he's cheap as dirt. You'd need a backup regardless, so whatever you send him away for has to merit the cost of replacing him afterward.
Unless someone were willing to part with a rd 1-3 pick (which I highly doubt), I wouldn't do it.
My estimates for JPP's future contract appear to be about 3 million too low. If Currry is worth close to 10 M per year JPP is 12 or 13. That's steep.
The franchise tag last year was $14 million. That's for a 10 fingered fully healthy DE. JPP is not that player. He might not be worth $8 million per year at this point. If he's looking for $10 million plus, you say "happy trails, fella". Chances are, in 2016 we aren't fielding a competitive defense, even with JPP. Draft a DE at 10 and let him learn on the job along with Odi, who is essentially still a rookie.
My estimates for JPP's future contract appear to be about 3 million too low. If Currry is worth close to 10 M per year JPP is 12 or 13. That's steep.
The franchise tag last year was $14 million. That's for a 10 fingered fully healthy DE. JPP is not that player. He might not be worth $8 million per year at this point. If he's looking for $10 million plus, you say "happy trails, fella". Chances are, in 2016 we aren't fielding a competitive defense, even with JPP. Draft a DE at 10 and let him learn on the job along with Odi, who is essentially still a rookie.
I agree. My problem is that the market rate isn't set by us. To me this Curry deal is crazy. But it helps set the market, and there is no way IMO that JPP is valued in the NFL less than Curry currently.
My estimates for JPP's future contract appear to be about 3 million too low. If Currry is worth close to 10 M per year JPP is 12 or 13. That's steep.
The franchise tag last year was $14 million. That's for a 10 fingered fully healthy DE. JPP is not that player. He might not be worth $8 million per year at this point. If he's looking for $10 million plus, you say "happy trails, fella". Chances are, in 2016 we aren't fielding a competitive defense, even with JPP. Draft a DE at 10 and let him learn on the job along with Odi, who is essentially still a rookie.
I agree. My problem is that the market rate isn't set by us. To me this Curry deal is crazy. But it helps set the market, and there is no way IMO that JPP is valued in the NFL less than Curry currently.
I'd rather spend $12 million on another DL instead of a (potential permanently) maimed JPP. Who that is, I don't know for sure. That's for Reese and Sternfield to determine.
RE: I wonder if now wouldn't be a good time to try and trade Nassib.
There is absolutely nothing noteworthy as far as free agent QB's go. He's got a year left on his deal and he's cheap - which would be a good situation for some other team. They'd need to sign him next year but he'd also have all the motivation in the world to prove he's worth it.
I agree they should look to deal Nassib before losing him for nothing, but disagree that the FA QB is barren. At least as far as QBs go. Usually you have nothing but Hoyer and McCown types hit the market. This year you potentially have two guys in Cousins and Bradford that are legit starting QBs currently set to hit free agency. They're not top 10 QBs, but they're certainly average guys you can win with. And then you still have a guy like Fitzpatrick who's a notch below those two and available.
I'm interested in Oliver Vernon but if Curry's contract is any indication, Vernon is going to get a huge deal that I won't want the Giants to take part in.
Ya think? It's like people who want to trade two single A relievers for an ace.
Happens every yeah, especially when the Giants sign one of their own. Quick to yell overpaid while knowing nothing of comparable salaries for the position.
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On pay for FAs.
Happens every yeah, especially when the Giants sign one of their own. Quick to yell overpaid while knowing nothing of comparable salaries for the position.
Well, luckily this year we may avoid that exercise in futility as the NYG have nobody worthy of a "must resign" moniker....
His numbers this year are not really relevant. He was playing out of position in a 3-4. When he did get in he was always around the qb. He's a good player and he's going to have a big spike in stats next year.
Agreed.
I wonder how active the Giants can be in FA. Teams like Denver are sure to lose some players. But I don't want the Giants to overpay simply because they have a good amount of cap space.
Curry has 10 fingers intact.
JPP may permanently be the maimed JAG we saw last year.
Not sure why that's funny...
agree
I see Jackson mentioned a lot. Will he hit free agency? If Peyton retires, wouldn't that free up cap space so the Bronos could re-sign Miller and Jackson?
Absolutely right: he has primarily been an edge rusher in the 3-4, and has been disruptive when he has been on the field, which has been around a third of the defensive snaps under Bill Davis.
That's a bit of a double-edged sword. On one hand, there's no question he can rush the passer, and there's less wear on his tires than the typical fifth-year player approaching his 28th birthday. On the other hand, nobody knows how well he will handle a heavier workload, or how well he will hold up against the run.
With Curry signed, three-quarters of the starting line is set. Cox remains the centerpiece - most likely as the 3-technique DT - with Logan as the main space-eater. On the outside, Curry figures to be the primary RDE. Graham and Barwin are good players, although they and Marcus Smith (a bust so far) don't fit the 4-3 as well as Curry. So in year one, Schwartz might wind up with one of the incumbent 3-4 DEs starting at LDE. Cox could stay at DE, with somebody like Thornton moving inside.
Free safety,2 DE, DT, 2 Lbers and corner....plus a RT, TE and WR.....looking for 10 new starters will not be easy.
I say, move Flowers to RT, insert Beatty.....instant upgrade in 2 spots.
Live with TEs we have.....take a flyer with a late round guy
Bring back Brinkley as a 2 down MLB
Try to resign Ayers, aging NJ guy and JPP coming off surgery..... on the cheap and hope Double O gets in the mix.
Go after top FS in FA. Barry? Hopefully one of IR guys can contribute some.....keep Collins in the box type safety
Pick up a #2 WR in FA....with size. Plenty in FA.
Find a Jenkins type DT...
Draft at DT, corner and Lber....
Glad the Eagles did this.
If he was so good, why would he play only 27% of the snaps.
Quote:
keep in mind he's been playing out of position. Also he only played 27% of the defensive snaps last year (36% in 2014).
If he was so good, why would he play only 27% of the snaps.
Because an effective 4-3 DE is not as effective in a 3-4. Square peg, round hole - like many of the players the Giants have wasted draft picks on over the years.
Quote:
I believe Osweiler is a free agent and they will need to re-sign him and Von Miller. Already re-signed Wolfe. Trevathan is a free agent as well. I think Jackson is going to hit FA and he would be my number 1 target if I were JR.
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I see Jackson mentioned a lot. Will he hit free agency? If Peyton retires, wouldn't that free up cap space so the Bronos could re-sign Miller and Jackson?
I don't see NYG paying $23M in guaranteed money for many players either.
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In comment 12798539 USAF NYG Fan said:
Quote:
keep in mind he's been playing out of position. Also he only played 27% of the defensive snaps last year (36% in 2014).
If he was so good, why would he play only 27% of the snaps.
Because an effective 4-3 DE is not as effective in a 3-4. Square peg, round hole - like many of the players the Giants have wasted draft picks on over the years.
This.
He's an edge pass rusher. They only really put him in for passing downs and even then not at his natural position. Those throwing around low sack numbers need to account for that. If they stayed in the 3-4, I would have though the Giants might have a shot at him. When it was known they were going back to the 4-3, I pretty much lost any small hope the Giants would sign him.
Similar circumstances for Mario Williams. If he's cut, he might be a good veteran option for the Giants. They could certainly use some veteran leadership on defense. He would be just a stop gap though until they can develop players through the draft. I hope they are considering him for a 2-3 year deal. I'm thinking similar to what the Broncos did with Demarcus Ware.
Called Lane Johnson a B to B- player, and Ertz a B+ player, and was skeptical of the money the gave him.
This was before the Curry news broke, wonder what he thinks of that?
I probably also think this indicates they won't be resigning Bradford......unless they have even more cap room.
Called Lane Johnson a B to B- player, and Ertz a B+ player, and was skeptical of the money the gave him.
This was before the Curry news broke, wonder what he thinks of that?
I probably also think this indicates they won't be resigning Bradford......unless they have even more cap room.
I can understand them not signing Bradford but then these signing won't get them very far. As average (if that) as Bradford is, he's the best QB available outside of Cousins who won't get near FA. And if they do resign him they're hooked to a very average (if that) QB.
Curry was a UFA so a good chunk of his deal will hit the 2016 cap. Depending on the structure of the deal, that could be anywhere from $5-10M+ and the Eagles were projected to have $21M in cap space prior to re-signing Curry. So they should still have plenty of money left to lock up Bradford (if they choose).
This is a pretty big indictment against Chip Kelly. They're basically saying he had a ~$10M player riding the bench...
I'm no Bradford fan, but even as an Alex Smith level QB he should get $15M per on the open market. Off the top of my head, you have to figure the following teams will be interested:
Jets - depending on Fitz
Texans - legit playoff team with an average QB
Eagles
Cleveland?
Rams - may not want him back
I don't see NYG paying $23M in guaranteed money for many players either.
Agreed.
You'd have to hope that Reese is listening, but I think BBI underrates the value of Nassib. He's been decent in preseason outings, he knows the offense, and he's cheap as dirt. You'd need a backup regardless, so whatever you send him away for has to merit the cost of replacing him afterward.
Unless someone were willing to part with a rd 1-3 pick (which I highly doubt), I wouldn't do it.
The franchise tag last year was $14 million. That's for a 10 fingered fully healthy DE. JPP is not that player. He might not be worth $8 million per year at this point. If he's looking for $10 million plus, you say "happy trails, fella". Chances are, in 2016 we aren't fielding a competitive defense, even with JPP. Draft a DE at 10 and let him learn on the job along with Odi, who is essentially still a rookie.
Quote:
My estimates for JPP's future contract appear to be about 3 million too low. If Currry is worth close to 10 M per year JPP is 12 or 13. That's steep.
The franchise tag last year was $14 million. That's for a 10 fingered fully healthy DE. JPP is not that player. He might not be worth $8 million per year at this point. If he's looking for $10 million plus, you say "happy trails, fella". Chances are, in 2016 we aren't fielding a competitive defense, even with JPP. Draft a DE at 10 and let him learn on the job along with Odi, who is essentially still a rookie.
I agree. My problem is that the market rate isn't set by us. To me this Curry deal is crazy. But it helps set the market, and there is no way IMO that JPP is valued in the NFL less than Curry currently.
Quote:
In comment 12798720 Patrick77 said:
Quote:
My estimates for JPP's future contract appear to be about 3 million too low. If Currry is worth close to 10 M per year JPP is 12 or 13. That's steep.
The franchise tag last year was $14 million. That's for a 10 fingered fully healthy DE. JPP is not that player. He might not be worth $8 million per year at this point. If he's looking for $10 million plus, you say "happy trails, fella". Chances are, in 2016 we aren't fielding a competitive defense, even with JPP. Draft a DE at 10 and let him learn on the job along with Odi, who is essentially still a rookie.
I agree. My problem is that the market rate isn't set by us. To me this Curry deal is crazy. But it helps set the market, and there is no way IMO that JPP is valued in the NFL less than Curry currently.
I'd rather spend $12 million on another DL instead of a (potential permanently) maimed JPP. Who that is, I don't know for sure. That's for Reese and Sternfield to determine.
I agree they should look to deal Nassib before losing him for nothing, but disagree that the FA QB is barren. At least as far as QBs go. Usually you have nothing but Hoyer and McCown types hit the market. This year you potentially have two guys in Cousins and Bradford that are legit starting QBs currently set to hit free agency. They're not top 10 QBs, but they're certainly average guys you can win with. And then you still have a guy like Fitzpatrick who's a notch below those two and available.
3 finger JPP would get more money than Vinny Curry.