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NFT: OJ Simpon - Your Verdict

UConn4523 : 2/3/2016 9:23 am
my friends were talking about the show this morning which I haven't watched yet but one of them thinks he didn't do it. I was too young then to really know all the details but do that many people really think he didn't do it?

Genuine question, especially with the Making a Murderer thread.
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He was clearly guilty...  
Chris in Philly : 2/3/2016 10:15 am : link
but his lawyers did a great job of obfuscation and misdirection...
Of course he killed them  
ZogZerg : 2/3/2016 10:23 am : link
It's obvious to all. His Lawyers were great, but OJ still fucked things up after that.

The people that don't think he did this are the same ones who believe 9/11 was a government conspiracy and Columbine never happened.
He so did it ....  
short lease : 2/3/2016 10:25 am : link
If you're are innocent why are you driving around with a gun to your head while I am trying to watch the NBA finals? Remorse ... that's why.

I am going to refrain from name calling but, that jury got it wrong.

Doesn't matter (I guess it does) - he is where he belongs.
RE: To this day I can't comprehend how he isn't in jail  
short lease : 2/3/2016 10:25 am : link
In comment 12798664 Patrick77 said:
Quote:
The evidence, motive, history, etc... is staggering. Even the bias should have been against him, he fled for fucks sake.


He is in jail - just not for murder.
RE: I should have stated in jail for murder  
short lease : 2/3/2016 10:26 am : link
In comment 12798681 Patrick77 said:
Quote:
Him being in jail for stupid things he did after this doesn't really show the justice system worked in any capacity.


Sorry Patrick - I answered your other post before reading this one.
of course he was guilty  
Enzo : 2/3/2016 10:31 am : link
but his defense team did a great job of mucking up what should have been a slam dunk trial.
He's guilty  
rsjem1979 : 2/3/2016 10:31 am : link
Despite a bungled investigation and prosecution, everything points to his guilt. He had motive, he had opportunity, he had no alibi, and the DNA ties him to the scene in a hundred different ways.

It's utterly implausible that anyone else committed the crime. And if a jury of OJ's actual "peers" (wealthy Brentwood residents) had heard the case instead of a jury of people who idolized him, he'd have been convicted. The fact that they deliberated for only 4 hours and came up with a not-guilty verdict tells you they didn't understand the critical facts of the case, or even try to.
I blame CTE  
Scyber : 2/3/2016 10:37 am : link
Why not?
RE: I blame CTE  
Patrick77 : 2/3/2016 10:40 am : link
In comment 12798828 Scyber said:
Quote:
Why not?


I don't think anyone is saying CTE means OJ wasn't guilty.

But I do believe as we learn more and more about it and who had it there is going to be a disturbing trend of changing behavior and horrible actions.
Guilty  
Steve in South Jersey : 2/3/2016 10:47 am : link
without a doubt.
RE: To believe he did not do it is  
Big Al : 2/3/2016 11:10 am : link
In comment 12798731 Big Al said:
Quote:
to either be seriously stupid or have such a strong bias to repress any logical thinking.
About a year after the trial there was a TV show that assembled about 8 members of the jury and they were presented with a number of things they had no answer for but still insisted their verdict was correct. That jury was a pretty good combination of the two things that I cited above.
He 100% did it  
Vanzetti : 2/3/2016 11:15 am : link
but I also think the verdict was correct. You can't explain away the glove. Either the police planted it (most likely imo) or the prosecution just messed up big time. That glove would not have fit a 12 year old, let alone a man OJ's size. He was obviously not wearing it when he committed the murder. So someone dabbed it in the blood and put it in the driveway. No way in hell someone gets rid of the murder weapon so expertly that it is never found and then drops a bloody glove on his well-lit path.

The stuff about it shrinking in the rain is laughable.
The glove  
Patrick77 : 2/3/2016 11:18 am : link
I don't know for certain what it was made out of. But anyone who has used gloves of various types can understand how a glove covered in a liquid (blood, water) that then sat for X amount of time would likely be a hard fit. Or how a person could make it appear to be a hard fit in front of a room of people pretty easily.

The whole trying on the glove was stupid to do.
RE: OJ didn't do it  
Deej : 2/3/2016 11:19 am : link
In comment 12798634 YAJ2112 said:
Quote:
but Robert Blake? Oh, Baretta did that shit.


Thank you! I say "Oh, Baretta did that shit" all the time and no one ever gets it.

Quote:


Prosecutor: Mr. Chappelle, what would it take to convince you that R. Kelly is guilty?

Dave Chappelle: Okay, I'd have to see a video of him singing "Pee On You," two forms of government ID, a police officer there to verify the whole thing, four or five of my buddies and Neal taking notes, and R. Kelly's grandma to confirm his identity.

R. Kelly's Grandma: That's my Robert, always peeing on people.
Think about this  
Stan in LA : 2/3/2016 11:24 am : link
If Ron Goldman had not, simply by chance, showed up that night, would there have been any murders?

I think not.
RE: The glove allowed the jury in the criminal trial  
Big Al : 2/3/2016 11:24 am : link
In comment 12798670 njm said:
Quote:
to decide it was not "beyond a reasonable doubt". Bur remember, the jury in the civil lawsuit with a "preponderance of the evidence" standard found him guilty.

He was guilty.
I have always thought there was a misinterpretation of how the reasonable doubt argument was discussed by many. Personally I think the glove stuff was nonsense and breaks down under real analysis rather than some sound bite by a lawyer.

However if you have 20 facts pointing directly to guilt, finding reasonable doubt to 5 of them does not do away with the overwhelming case based on the other facts where you can only show unreasonable doubt. Reasonable doubt in one factor does not disprove that factor as wrong. You just dismiss it and look at everything else.

Sort of like saying you have a film of someone shooting someone and evidence that the weapon was bought by the shooter. Raising reasonable doubt about whether he actually bought the gun does not dismiss the film evidence.
OJ did it ...  
Beer Man : 2/3/2016 11:24 am : link
I followed the trail and have no doubt
Agree with Big Al  
RinR : 2/3/2016 11:30 am : link
The glove should never have been the deciding factor in whether he was guilty or not. The DNA evidence tied him to the murders; that alone should have been enough. But he had great lawyers who argued that it was mishandled and got contaminated and the test results could not be trusted.

So there were several things that led to reasonable doubt.
In a post "CSI" world, he would never get off.  
BeerFridge : 2/3/2016 11:33 am : link
but DNA evidence was really new to the general public then.
RE: Think about this  
bceagle05 : 2/3/2016 11:34 am : link
In comment 12798943 Stan in LA said:
Quote:
If Ron Goldman had not, simply by chance, showed up that night, would there have been any murders?

I think not.


Yep, Goldman had one of the most tragic "wrong place, wrong time" instances you could ever imagine. If you put any credence into OJ's "If I Did It" book, he noticed there were candles lit in the house, then a good-looking 25-year-old shows up, and he went ballistic.
Of  
Randy in CT : 2/3/2016 11:38 am : link
course.
Blame can be spread around  
bc4life : 2/3/2016 11:40 am : link
DA Chris Darden was an idiot for expecting a defendant to cooperate with his glove demonstration. OJ was flexing his hand and when Darden pressed the issue, OJ growled, Darden cowered and stopped pressing.

Crime scene mismanaged. Strange procedural things like Detectives handling blood samples. Unprofessional conduct between DAs. Furman perjuring himself about matters unrelated to the trial.

Judge in over his head.

And, to call the jury defendant friendly is the understatement of the century. One juror attended the celebration afterwards - wtf?

He was guilty as guilty can be, but the blame can be spread around.
Of course he did it and is guilty  
X : 2/3/2016 11:45 am : link
There were no other suspects - and never have been
OJ's DNA was at the crime scene
The cut on OJ's hand

And there is so much more eveidence
So many things botched with that case.  
bceagle05 : 2/3/2016 11:51 am : link
How bout the witnesses? Jill Shively nearly gets in a car accident with OJ minutes after the murder while he's driving from Nicole's house back to his - he even glares right at her so she can make a positive ID. Then she goes and sells her story to "Hard Copy" and the prosecution can't call her.

I've always been fascinated by the limo driver - imagine coming to the realization that you had a double-murderer in the backseat of your car just a few minutes after he did the deed, likely with bloody clothes and maybe a murder weapon in his possession at the time?
The glove not fitting  
KWALL2 : 2/3/2016 11:54 am : link
What a joke. It was a men's large.

It fits when you don't spread your fingers wide when you put it on.
Correction  
KWALL2 : 2/3/2016 11:57 am : link
It was a men's xlarge.
Ok glove - ( New Window )
Pretty sure he was guilty  
Bramton1 : 2/3/2016 12:06 pm : link
But the LAPD fucked the case up so badly (detective lying about racial slurs, poor handling of DNA evidence, the glove incident, etc.).

The real tragedy of this was there were no more Naked Gun movies after this, because no one was going to put OJ Simpson in a movie again.
RE: I blame CTE  
short lease : 2/3/2016 12:21 pm : link
In comment 12798828 Scyber said:
Quote:
Why not?


Don't people usually kill themselves when suffering from CTE?
Usually it is a suicide not a homicide - just sayin' ; ).
Well, if scientists ever get to examine OJ's brain  
Bramton1 : 2/3/2016 12:24 pm : link
and they find significant signs of CTE, that could be it for the NFL.

OK, maybe not, but if someone can link CTE to homicidal behavior, that can't be good for the league.
its initial symptoms  
UConn4523 : 2/3/2016 12:26 pm : link
are aggression, depression, anxiety, anger, etc. There's another 10,000 medical ailments with the same side effects but still, CTE if he has it could have played a role.
Fun fact  
Bramton1 : 2/3/2016 12:48 pm : link
He been paroled for the major charges, but some lesser charges have him locked up until... 2017.
Theres no doubt he was guilty. It was a major fuckup by the  
Anakim : 2/3/2016 1:52 pm : link
prosecution and brilliant tactics by Cochran, Shapiro and Dershowitz. The prosecution did a generally terrible job, but there was more than enough there for Simpson to be convicted.

And perhaps the most brilliant defense tactic (fuck the glove) was getting Robert Kardashian on the Dream Team. Not because he was such an amazing lawyer, but because it prevented him from testifying due to attorney/client privilege and therefore, prevented him from discussing how he essentially hid OJ's "luggage."


A real travesty of justice
I forget the investigating officers name  
ed90631 : 2/3/2016 3:07 pm : link
but the fact that the defense was able to successfully paint him as an anti-black bigot went a long way to convince the jury of the illegitimacy of any evidence procured by him and his fellow detectives.

He was proved to be a liar in an unrelated incident. To be effective as a police officer and a detective means your credibility must be substantial if not perfect. His was not.
RE: I forget the investigating officers name  
ed90631 : 2/3/2016 3:10 pm : link
In comment 12799464 ed90631 said:
Quote:
but the fact that the defense was able to successfully paint him as an anti-black bigot went a long way to convince the jury of the illegitimacy of any evidence procured by him and his fellow detectives.

He was proved to be a liar in an unrelated incident. To be effective as a police officer and a detective means your credibility must be substantial if not perfect. His was not.
aha...Furman.
Just another example  
Sarcastic Sam : 2/3/2016 3:17 pm : link
in a long list, of how fucked out our "justice" system is.
Guilty.  
Crispino : 2/3/2016 3:39 pm : link
People are convicted of murder in this country every day on the strength of about one one thousandth of the evidence that pointed the OJ's guilt. He got away with murder. You have to really stretch hard to ignore the avalanche of evidence against him. Or have a very strong bias in his favor.
Old joke  
Mike in Marin : 2/3/2016 3:39 pm : link
What did Ron Goldman say to Nicole Brown Simpson when he saw her in heaven ?

"Here are your fucking sunglasses."
The correct verdict was rendered  
Matt M. : 2/3/2016 3:46 pm : link
It almost a certainty that he did it. But, the police, DA, crime labs, etc. all bungled the case from the moment the first officers arrived on the scene. According to the law, the correct verdict was rendered.
It really is amazing  
bceagle05 : 2/3/2016 3:52 pm : link
that so many paid professionals could drop the ball like that.
guilty.  
mattlawson : 2/3/2016 5:10 pm : link
.
RE: In a post  
JOrthman : 2/3/2016 5:12 pm : link
In comment 12798965 BeerFridge said:
Quote:
but DNA evidence was really new to the general public then.


I disagree, the public has a much higher standard now in the post CSI era, an almost unrealistic standard.
I just finished the first episode.  
Photoguy : 2/3/2016 8:17 pm : link
I'm having a bit of a problem with Travolta in the role of Shapiro. I'm still thinking in terms of "Hey, it's Travolta playing Robert Shapiro" I suppose as this thing unwinds, I'll get used to it, but for now it's distracting. I remember pretty much all of the events, and the coverage was pretty much wall to wall on CNN. I remember that once it got to trial, the monotony started to make it hard to watch. God only knows, how those jurors felt. I was convinced O.J. did it, the glove notwithstanding.


RE: my friend's defense is the glove not fitting  
section125 : 2/3/2016 8:30 pm : link
In comment 12798719 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
was it confirmed that it got wet and shrunk? I can't really remember.


Believe it did get wet, not sure it shrunk.

That being said, I want to see you put on a fur lined glove while wearing a rubber glove. Also, after OJ feigned not being able to get his hand in it, when told to take it off, he just pulls it off as if it was lubricated....what a freakin sham.

The prosecution put the limo driver on first and he should have been last. His testimony alone should have all but convicted OJ. Saw him (or "somebody") climb over the wall, run into the house and then come out 15 or 20 minutes later after taking a shower and still sweating like a pig. OJ said he overslept... Why was OJs car outside that wall and not in the garage or in the driveway??
The prosecution could not have done a worse job if it wanted to.
Matt  
KWALL2 : 2/3/2016 8:36 pm : link
How was that the correct verdict? Mountain of evidence picked apart with the race card. That gives you reasonable doubt?



I am 99% sure he is guilty of the murders...  
EricJ : 2/3/2016 8:47 pm : link
however, the 1% chance that it was not him leads me to believe that it could have been his son and that he was covering for him. That would explain the similarities in the DNA. I also think that the cops had the wrong getaway car. There were bloody footprints leaving the scene and according to the police OJ should have been covered in blood. However, there were just a few blood specs/drops in his car. I think the car leaving the scene was a different one and that he went to his car afterwards to get something but never got in.
What's crazy is  
Mike Graves : 2/3/2016 10:00 pm : link
During the time of these murders OJ was filming a TV movie called frogman where he played a navy seal and was getting training during the filming of this show he even bought a knife during the filming and which was believed to be the same knife he used to do the murders and some of the training was said to come into play in how he committed the murders, the movie never aired the FBI confiscated the film, crazy.
RE: I am 99% sure he is guilty of the murders...  
Mike Graves : 2/3/2016 10:03 pm : link
In comment 12799994 EricJ said:
Quote:
however, the 1% chance that it was not him leads me to believe that it could have been his son and that he was covering for him. That would explain the similarities in the DNA. I also think that the cops had the wrong getaway car. There were bloody footprints leaving the scene and according to the police OJ should have been covered in blood. However, there were just a few blood specs/drops in his car. I think the car leaving the scene was a different one and that he went to his car afterwards to get something but never got in.


Another story was Oj hired serial killer Glen Rogers to do it. I still believe OJ did it but I could definitely see his mental son committing the murders
I am under the impression that 100% of the population assumes  
PatersonPlank : 2/3/2016 10:25 pm : link
he's guilty. It was a fiasco.
RE: What's crazy is  
Mike From Brielle : 2/4/2016 7:41 pm : link
In comment 12800051 Mike Graves said:
Quote:
During the time of these murders OJ was filming a TV movie called frogman where he played a navy seal and was getting training during the filming of this show he even bought a knife during the filming and which was believed to be the same knife he used to do the murders and some of the training was said to come into play in how he committed the murders, the movie never aired the FBI confiscated the film, crazy.


I've been told that some of the methods for cutting a throat that are taught in Basic Under Water Demolition School (BUDS) leave wounds that are very much like the ones left on Nicole (close to decapitation)but concurrently with forcing the K-Bar blade forward one forces the back of the victims head forward limiting somewhat the degree of blood spray. That was one of the things that made me think that OJ might have done it, because I thought he probably got some rudimentary SEAL training for the role he was playing, maybe he even had to go to Coronado for a while. I never bought into the whole DNA after the DA and mostly unattributed cops started saying that the DNA testing pointed to OJ way before they could have received the test results back. If that Scientist hadn't of been such a jerk that's what I think he would have testified to. Shapiro had already torn apart the DNA evidence so the defense probably thought they didn't need the scientist. Just the way Furhman carried himself for some reason kind of gave me the idea that he was sticking his thumb on the scales. The tapes shocked me but didn't surprise me. I said in another post that an NYPD detective once told me that "unless he's an idiot never try to frame a guilty man". OJ and his lawyers weren't idiots and every time they saw a piece of tampered evidence they eviscerated it. How do you know the evidence is tampered with?
Guilty as sin.  
SanFranNowNCGiantsFan : 2/6/2016 10:19 am : link
100%. The whole thing was an absolute circus. The prosecution sucked, Cochran turned the whole thing into a racial debate, & you had a cast of characters you couldn't make up.

I just watched FX's 'The People vs. O.J. Simpson'. Good show.
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