you have to use terror/violence to attempt to secure political ends. These people, to the best of my knowledge, are protesters. Mostly morons but not terrorists.
are all groups we dissent with 'terrorists'? I certainly don't want to seem more unenlightened than I am; thanks in advance.
Threat of violence I'd think would be necessary.
It depends on whether you take a threat to use violence if acted upon as sufficient, and I think you're in danger of roping in run of the mill protesters who use occupation as a form of protest, but I think it's pretty academic. These guys look ridiculous and are undermining their own cause.
why not? As far as I'm aware, they are occupying an area illegally, and have threatened to use violence if the government tries to take it back.
I it really that different from other occupy protests, sit-ins etc? The threat of violence isnt "do what we want or people will die". The thread is not to accomplish the goal. It's maybe academic. Im sure under some federal statute that jaywalking can be called terrorism.
why not? As far as I'm aware, they are occupying an area illegally, and have threatened to use violence if the government tries to take it back.
I it really that different from other occupy protests, sit-ins etc? The threat of violence isnt "do what we want or people will die". The thread is not to accomplish the goal. It's maybe academic. Im sure under some federal statute that jaywalking can be called terrorism.
it's much different than that.
RE: If they weren't so heavily armed I'd agree with protestors Â
I have to assume nonsensical rantings about "sovereignty" are key.
The underlying issue which they fail in spectacular fashion to articulate is the incredibly large amount of government owned (public) grazing land in the Western United States that is being managed (in their view poorly, unfairly, and with too much political influence) by a Federal agency (BLM) rather than by local governments.
I dont really agree. I think that's what they want you to think. But they're not the locals. The locals want them gone. IMO they're really just self-important morons who exist in some feedback loop where dumb conceptions of law are passed around uncritically. Listening to this live feed just reinforces that perception (I just turned it off; the yelling was getting to me).
will be judged on reasonable force. What would a reasonable FBI agent in a similar situation with the same experience do in the same situation.
Right now they are faced with multiple, ongoing documented threats and the knowledge the left over 4 people are heavily armed and have threatened not to be taken alive. They are also irate and lack rational thought.
Hopefully they fully cooperate while being arrested since there isn't a lot of wiggle room for them to not be considered a threat to the life and safety of the agents. Even if unarmed, any motion that could be construed as reaching for a weapon would be considered reasonable.
is that these people are the product of our current culture where some politicians and media outlets knowingly espouse hate-baiting extremist views to scare susceptible idiots into thinking about apocalyptic endings.
Any violence by the FBI
madgiantscow009 : 10:12 pm : link : reply
will be judged on reasonable force. What would a reasonable FBI agent in a similar situation with the same experience do in the same situation.
Right now they are faced with multiple, ongoing documented threats and the knowledge the left over 4 people are heavily armed and have threatened not to be taken alive. They are also irate and lack rational thought.
Hopefully they fully cooperate while being arrested since there isn't a lot of wiggle room for them to not be considered a threat to the life and safety of the agents. Even if unarmed, any motion that could be construed as reaching for a weapon would be considered reasonable.
They could have busted in weeks ago and left everyone dead and the public wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm surprised it didn't happen in day 2 or 3 to be honest.
to justify their armament and the more they use Scripture to condemn the FBI, the more I wonder what the reaction would be if the justification for a different religion.
most people give you a blank stare when you say "Ruby Ridge" but a strata of people will tell you in very vivid (if not necessarily factual) detail about the massacre that took place there. These people have long memories and really don't need anything else to feed into their paranoia.
ter·ror·ism
ˈterəˌrizəm/Submit
noun
the use of violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims.
Threat of violence I'd think would be necessary.
Quote:
are all groups we dissent with 'terrorists'? I certainly don't want to seem more unenlightened than I am; thanks in advance.
Threat of violence I'd think would be necessary.
It depends on whether you take a threat to use violence if acted upon as sufficient, and I think you're in danger of roping in run of the mill protesters who use occupation as a form of protest, but I think it's pretty academic. These guys look ridiculous and are undermining their own cause.
I it really that different from other occupy protests, sit-ins etc? The threat of violence isnt "do what we want or people will die". The thread is not to accomplish the goal. It's maybe academic. Im sure under some federal statute that jaywalking can be called terrorism.
Quote:
why not? As far as I'm aware, they are occupying an area illegally, and have threatened to use violence if the government tries to take it back.
I it really that different from other occupy protests, sit-ins etc? The threat of violence isnt "do what we want or people will die". The thread is not to accomplish the goal. It's maybe academic. Im sure under some federal statute that jaywalking can be called terrorism.
it's much different than that.
Really?
Quote:
.
Really?
If they occupied a federal facility peacefully and listed some demands = protestors.
Same thing with an arsenal = ?
Who are they terrorizing?
The underlying issue which they fail in spectacular fashion to articulate is the incredibly large amount of government owned (public) grazing land in the Western United States that is being managed (in their view poorly, unfairly, and with too much political influence) by a Federal agency (BLM) rather than by local governments.
Yup. She wants the publicity.
careful, this can drop your IQ a few points listening to these people.
she has huge jugs too
Right now they are faced with multiple, ongoing documented threats and the knowledge the left over 4 people are heavily armed and have threatened not to be taken alive. They are also irate and lack rational thought.
Hopefully they fully cooperate while being arrested since there isn't a lot of wiggle room for them to not be considered a threat to the life and safety of the agents. Even if unarmed, any motion that could be construed as reaching for a weapon would be considered reasonable.
madgiantscow009 : 10:12 pm : link : reply
will be judged on reasonable force. What would a reasonable FBI agent in a similar situation with the same experience do in the same situation.
Right now they are faced with multiple, ongoing documented threats and the knowledge the left over 4 people are heavily armed and have threatened not to be taken alive. They are also irate and lack rational thought.
Hopefully they fully cooperate while being arrested since there isn't a lot of wiggle room for them to not be considered a threat to the life and safety of the agents. Even if unarmed, any motion that could be construed as reaching for a weapon would be considered reasonable.
They could have busted in weeks ago and left everyone dead and the public wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm surprised it didn't happen in day 2 or 3 to be honest.
I remember Youtube having a live stream of the Vatican when the last pope was picked. But yeah, I don´t recall much live content on Youtube.