| The Jets would love to trade Mo Wilkerson for a first-round pick in a tag-and-trade scenario. |
Sure the Jets want a 1st round pick but the 10th pick in the second round could be considered a good haul. Seeing that the Giants were likely to draft a d-lineman with one of their first two picks anyway this would take care of the need and allow them to go secondary or linebacker with their 1st rounder.
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You pair him with a mario williams on the other side and hankins in the middle and you have a pretty strong defensive line again.
^This.
Best value on DL is Nick Fairley but Reese and Ross r clueless
One player isn't fixing this. I don't care how good you think that player is.
Not worth it.
I'll take a top talent like Wilkerson over an unknown quantity in a draft pick and cap space that would probably be used to overpay a couple players lesser than Wilkerson. A better allocation of resources: a known top player.
Not worth it.
That's not the way to think of this; there's no guarantee you get a Wilkerson in that area of the 2nd round, as he's far exceeded his draft position.
In any event, I'd probably still say no unless he'd want to take a friendly contract (and that seems far-fetched).
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Wilkerson himself was only selected about 12 spots ahead of where the Giants are picking in the 2nd round.
Not worth it.
That's not the way to think of this; there's no guarantee you get a Wilkerson in that area of the 2nd round, as he's far exceeded his draft position.
In any event, I'd probably still say no unless he'd want to take a friendly contract (and that seems far-fetched).
There's absolutely no guarantee - but it's very likely that in the 10th pick of the 2nd round, in a draft deep with DL, that you'll walk away with a good player, if not significantly better than good. And that player will cost you bupkus for the next 5 years.
Wilkerson would be pricey, and you'd compound that by dumping a likely solid young cost controlled player from the roster. That's a good recipe for getting into cap trouble in a hurry.
^^^^ THIS x 10000000000!
Jets would have a pick to package with some of their other picks to move up to select a QB. We get a bonafied stud without giving up picks.
This is the best idea I heard all off season.
Suh was a slam dunk signing. How do you not make that move.
Is that team any better?
Yup - and so were Hankins and Linval Joseph. Not to mention guys like Steve Smith and Chris Snee.
Reese has been good more often than not in the 1st and 2nd rounds - and we're giving away a pick towards the top of the 2nd? No thanks.
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In comment 12843560 jcn56 said:
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Wilkerson himself was only selected about 12 spots ahead of where the Giants are picking in the 2nd round.
Not worth it.
That's not the way to think of this; there's no guarantee you get a Wilkerson in that area of the 2nd round, as he's far exceeded his draft position.
In any event, I'd probably still say no unless he'd want to take a friendly contract (and that seems far-fetched).
There's absolutely no guarantee - but it's very likely that in the 10th pick of the 2nd round, in a draft deep with DL, that you'll walk away with a good player, if not significantly better than good. And that player will cost you bupkus for the next 5 years.
Wilkerson would be pricey, and you'd compound that by dumping a likely solid young cost controlled player from the roster. That's a good recipe for getting into cap trouble in a hurry.
I think you over-emphasize the potential impact of that 2nd round pick. Nevertheless, I agree with your position because of (1) cost control; and (2) I don't think Wilkerson is a guarantee star in a new system--I hate paying for past production instead of future production.
For argument's sake let's say that M. Jackson is the same player. Now the arguement becomes "do I want to tie up a huge percentage of my cap is M.J.?
That's a fair question, cause sometimes I think only a QB should be getting that type of money.
So on his own Wilkinson / Jackson is a debate. Now tell me that you want a Weston Richenbach and his verylow salary for the right to pay 15 million or so.
I can sign M. Jackson and hold on to my superb and lowly paind center.
And btw, I think we have a right to expect that they'll turn that second round pick into something as good as W.R.
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But I would swap firsts, I think.
^^^^ THIS x 10000000000!
Jets would have a pick to package with some of their other picks to move up to select a QB. We get a bonafied stud without giving up picks.
This is the best idea I heard all off season.
This an excellent idea. Hope Reese checks it out. In checking the Draft value chart difference between 10 & 20 is 450 points or the value of our 2nd round pick (480 points).
Could this be a trade that works for both parties? Besides the obvious need for a QB, Jets also need LB, RB, & OT. A very good player for them could be there at 10. They shed a player they really can't afford at a position where they're really solid. Giants get a difference maker on defense and still get to pick a player that can clearly fill any of our many holes. Wilkerson would be happy, stated Giants would be his #1 target if he hit free agency! Win Win for everyone?
Could this be a trade that works for both parties? Besides the obvious need for a QB, Jets also need LB, RB, & OT. A very good player for them could be there at 10. They shed a player they really can't afford at a position where they're really solid. Giants get a difference maker on defense and still get to pick a player that can clearly fill any of our many holes. Wilkerson would be happy, stated Giants would be his #1 target if he hit free agency! Win Win for everyone?
Ok, so you would swap 1st and give up a 2nd to get one DT. So instead of getting maybe Shaq Lawson or Ogbah AND one of the highly rated DTs in the draft, we get Mo Wilkerson, only.
Not me.
The calculus is different when you have a franchise QB and even more so when you also have an elite WR like Beckham. You can turn a team around much more quickly. The roster definitely needs upgrades but I don't think NYG is as far away as some of you guys, especially given the state of the division.
In a similar vein, watch out for Oakland next year. Carr, Cooper and Mack are a great core to build around.
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Could this be a trade that works for both parties? Besides the obvious need for a QB, Jets also need LB, RB, & OT. A very good player for them could be there at 10. They shed a player they really can't afford at a position where they're really solid. Giants get a difference maker on defense and still get to pick a player that can clearly fill any of our many holes. Wilkerson would be happy, stated Giants would be his #1 target if he hit free agency! Win Win for everyone?
Ok, so you would swap 1st and give up a 2nd to get one DT. So instead of getting maybe Shaq Lawson or Ogbah AND one of the highly rated DTs in the draft, we get Mo Wilkerson, only.
Not me.
Sorry if I didn't make myself clear. Thought Choppers idea of swapping 1st round picks rather than giving up our 2nd was a great idea. Only brought up that the value of the swap would be equal to our 2nd round pick as a comparison of what the Jets would be getting. So in this scenario, Jets would get our pick at 10, we would get Jets pick at 20 & Wilkerson.
That would be great, but I don't see anyway the Jets do that. They'd be giving up Wilkerson for moving up 10 spots in the 1st round.
I could see them swapping #10 for #20, and getting #40 for Wilkerson.
Still not sure I would do it.
As long as MW's leg was a fracture without healing complications, it is the safest and most effective thing you could do.
Considering the Jets got a 1 (13) and a next year 3/4 (4) for an older Revis, I believe a 2 is a pipe dream and the Jets will keep him.
I don't expect this to happen, but it may be time to rethink a defensive model that hasn't generated a good defense since 2008. I think the focus should be on adding talent wherever they can, and then tailoring the system to the talent.
Wilkerson is a significantly better player than any of the other defensive free agents available, IMO.
As long as MW's leg was a fracture without healing complications, it is the safest and most effective thing you could do.
Considering the Jets got a 1 (13) and a next year 3/4 (4) for an older Revis, I believe a 2 is a pipe dream and the Jets will keep him.
1 player fixes the whole defense?
Let's hope the Giants aren't that stupid. Miami certainly was...
My reading comprehension works just fine - your implication that we'd somehow be much better off with Wilkerson alone, after forking over upwards of $15M in salary and a high draft pick, is the joke in question.
1st He was a true junior when he came out.
2nd He played for that almost Alabama powerhouse - Temple.
He was discounted for his age and his level of competition.
Look how well that worked out. You all don't seem to understand that Football is a team sport.
Not a sound comparison.
Not a sound comparison.
Sure, unlike us last season...
The Dolphins are rife with dysfunction that trickles down from their owner. They could have signed Reggie White and it wouldn't have mattered.
The Dolphins are rife with dysfunction that trickles down from their owner. They could have signed Reggie White and it wouldn't have mattered.
I have news for you - Suh is the one who triggered the escalation of dysfunction in Miami that got the coach fired. His refusal to play the DC's schemes resulted in the whole operation going down the shit tubes.
Acting like Wilkerson became the Michael Jordan of football overnight is cute, but unrealistic. For starters, the guy had a pretty bad injury last season. Second - even if he's a wrecking ball at DE - that's one DE, and a cast of crap around him. That's before moving back with a lack of a MLB, no FS, missing at least a starting CB and if not more.
Allocating that much more salary to Wilkerson than the next tier DE - and then taking away a high draft pick - would not come close to turning around the defense.
And again, Wilkerson isn't Suh, and the Giants aren't the Dolphins.
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News to me.
The Dolphins are rife with dysfunction that trickles down from their owner. They could have signed Reggie White and it wouldn't have mattered.
I have news for you - Suh is the one who triggered the escalation of dysfunction in Miami that got the coach fired. His refusal to play the DC's schemes resulted in the whole operation going down the shit tubes.
Acting like Wilkerson became the Michael Jordan of football overnight is cute, but unrealistic. For starters, the guy had a pretty bad injury last season. Second - even if he's a wrecking ball at DE - that's one DE, and a cast of crap around him. That's before moving back with a lack of a MLB, no FS, missing at least a starting CB and if not more.
Allocating that much more salary to Wilkerson than the next tier DE - and then taking away a high draft pick - would not come close to turning around the defense.
just wanted to comment on the last part here, how much do you think we would pay for one of the DE's that would actually help us? 10-15M/Per? How much more are you allocating to Mo than if you were to sign Vernon or one of the other "top DE's" this year in this FA market?
And again, Wilkerson isn't Suh, and the Giants aren't the Dolphins.
Williams has been a very good player for quite some time - the question now is whether his down year was tied more to scheme than it was to physical decline.
But the point here is you could practically add two of those guys for the price of one, and still retain that draft pick.
And while it's fun to bring up Sintim, let's not forget that both Linval Joseph and Hankins were drafted in the second round as well. Presuming in a deep DL draft, the Giants could score along those lines - now we're talking about a rookie Hankins, JPP and Mario Williams instead of Wilkerson?
In a heartbeat, without question. If the defense were closer, Wilkerson could be the piece that puts them over the top. The defense is in shambles though - we need credible bodies right now, more of them, more than we need one superstar.
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In comment 12843955 Go Terps said:
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News to me.
The Dolphins are rife with dysfunction that trickles down from their owner. They could have signed Reggie White and it wouldn't have mattered.
I have news for you - Suh is the one who triggered the escalation of dysfunction in Miami that got the coach fired. His refusal to play the DC's schemes resulted in the whole operation going down the shit tubes.
Acting like Wilkerson became the Michael Jordan of football overnight is cute, but unrealistic. For starters, the guy had a pretty bad injury last season. Second - even if he's a wrecking ball at DE - that's one DE, and a cast of crap around him. That's before moving back with a lack of a MLB, no FS, missing at least a starting CB and if not more.
Allocating that much more salary to Wilkerson than the next tier DE - and then taking away a high draft pick - would not come close to turning around the defense.
just wanted to comment on the last part here, how much do you think we would pay for one of the DE's that would actually help us? 10-15M/Per? How much more are you allocating to Mo than if you were to sign Vernon or one of the other "top DE's" this year in this FA market?
Based on all the talk it seems most of the DEs are going to get somewhere from $8-11M a year, with some exceptions. At $8M a year - that's two for the price of one Wilkerson.
Vernon is going to be more expensive - but again, that's Vernon + draft pick as opposed to Wilkerson alone. And that's with the expectation that Vernon will improve outside of Miami, based on his age and performance to date. I'm not the biggest advocate of signing Vernon because of the cost, though.
So the Jets trade Wilkinson for our no 10 in the second round. They've relieved their cap by 15million and now they turn aroudn and sign M. Jackson for 15 million.
Effectively they've acquired a pick that should turn into a LOW SALARIED Hankins, Joseph or Weston Richenberg FOR NOTHING.
That's how absure the notion is and any GM who considered it should be cannned. If you want to spend 15 million on a non QB (and that whole notion is debatable) you don't ahve to give away a valued second rounder just go out and sign Vernon or M. Jackson or one Mario Williams and one 5 million player.
That would be great, but I don't see anyway the Jets do that. They'd be giving up Wilkerson for moving up 10 spots in the 1st round.
I could see them swapping #10 for #20, and getting #40 for Wilkerson.
Still not sure I would do it.
Jets have been trying to negotiate a contract with Wilkerson since supposedly 2014. Rumor is Wilkerson was only tagged for trade bait. Have no idea if true, normally you want to keep your best players. But Jets very solid on DL and have cap issues. Question becomes trade value. With current CBA just don't see teams giving up high draft picks unless either for QB or that proverbial team just one player away. Is there a team picking ahead of NYG that would being willing to swap in return for Wilkerson? If there isn't and Jets really don't wish to pay tag money for a year (with no chance of signing long term deal), Jets could do worse than using Wilkerson to swap 1st round picks with the Giants. Jets need LB, RB, & OT should be a good one at 10. Or if they really like one of the QBs packaging the 10th pick to move up higher?
Great thought by Chopper.
You're entitled to your opinion, but I don't agree with it. I'll take JPP and MW over Wilkerson and Kerry Wynn any day. And that's without considering what you might get from the draft pick you want to give away to get Wilkerson.