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Questioning the Jenkins Signing

Old Dirty Beckham : 3/16/2016 12:27 pm
I get that contract numbers aren't always what they seem but the Giants handed out 12 million a year for a guy who may not be better than DRC. It's not like they went out and signed Joe Haden. I can't help but look at the early results of FA and think that the Giants would have been better served spreading that money out to a few players.

Wouldn't the team look better if they had, say, Jeff Allen and Prince? Or Jeff Allen and Casey Haywood?

If the Giants are unable to sign Okung who is out there that can come in and start at tackle? Are we really going to use another top 10 pick on an OL? Are we really going to draft an OL in the first 3 out of the last four years? 4 straight years with an OL going in the top 45?
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RE: I'm pumped on the Jenkins signing  
dust_bowl : 3/16/2016 1:46 pm : link
In comment 12862245 Patrick77 said:
Quote:
What to me is concerning is that Prince left for basically pennies. Having him signed for that money for this upcoming season would have been some sick depth - even if he could only play his normal 12 games.

Jenkins is very talented, very aggressive, and a gambler. He is a lot like a younger DRC. If those two play up to their talent and we have a pass rush finally the difference in the defense could be huge.
hes let up most tds in league since 2012.
I don't like the signing  
KWALL2 : 3/16/2016 1:50 pm : link
Way too much for this player. Should have went cheaper at CB and filled a few other holes.

We could have used these guys:

WR Benjamin, TE Green, LB Lamur, S McLeod/Iloka.
RE: RE: I'm pumped on the Jenkins signing  
Patrick77 : 3/16/2016 1:51 pm : link
In comment 12862248 dust_bowl said:
Quote:
In comment 12862245 Patrick77 said:


Quote:


What to me is concerning is that Prince left for basically pennies. Having him signed for that money for this upcoming season would have been some sick depth - even if he could only play his normal 12 games.

Jenkins is very talented, very aggressive, and a gambler. He is a lot like a younger DRC. If those two play up to their talent and we have a pass rush finally the difference in the defense could be huge.

hes let up most tds in league since 2012.


According to who?

Even if that stat is true (very possible). Is that due to them playing zero safety high, the safety cheating to one side, single safety high, having horrible safeties, having no pass rush, having linebackers that suck and he tries to jump or cheat underneath routes? etc...

The guy's physical talent has been undeniable since he entered the league. If it is coaching and fundamentals he is worth the risk.
RE: RE: RE: You  
Victor in CT : 3/16/2016 1:52 pm : link
In comment 12862231 dust_bowl said:
Quote:
In comment 12862208 Victor in CT said:


Quote:


In comment 12862097 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


guys keep making the false assumption that the Giants are an attractive landing spot.

We have an unproven 38-year old coach. We have a DC who has fielded 2 of the 3 worst defenses in NFL history.

We have a GM on the hot seat.

We haven't made the playoffs in four years or had a winning season in three years.

The roster was a disaster heading into free agency.



Bingo Eric! A very accurate State of the Giants Union.

oh cause the jags are so attractive.

The reality is looking at princes deal it is perfectly legit to argue the Giants should have given prince a similar deal he got by jags and the excess money could be used elsewhere.

I'm happy with the start of free agency. But here is the reality. If odb tore his acl next year the Giants would win two games. With all their o linemen investments it's barely mediocre and the right side is a joke. The Giants may have fixed the d line but until they make the o line good they will struggle.

To the ops point. How much better is Jenkins then prince? Prob a little. But not the difference their two salaries suggest.


1) the Jags COULD be. Not saying they are yet, but they have been amassing talent and Gus Bradley seems to have them moving forward. And don't forget from a business standpoint, no income tax in Florida, and Jax is a low cost of living area.

2) Prince, besides not being very good, is always hurt. 1 16 game season in 5 years, only averaged 11 games per season. I'm glad they cut bait with him. And as we saw in FA, the rest of the league agrees with that assessment. In a league starved for quality CBs he could only get a shitty 1 yr, show me deal.

3) I agree with your 2nd paragraph re an OBJ injury etc., and ironically it supports Eric's statements
The Giants roster is still a disaster.  
Rudy5757 : 3/16/2016 1:58 pm : link
We replaced our good players with good or better players but we havent replaced our bad players. We had a bad right side of the OL and we still have a bad right side. We had a bad #2 WR and we dont even have him anymore. We have bad LBs and really didnt do much to improve that. We had a bad FS and still have a bad FS or unproven guy coming off of injuries. We still have no depth across the board.

If camp started today and lets say we have including our 6 future draft pics, we need to sign 20 FAs just to get to the max training camp roster. Some of which need to be starters.

If I was a FA and the money was close I would look for a better team. We had to overpay to attract talent, young guy we can build around because we have very few. i have no problem overpaying but I have a problem with not addressing glaring holes in the roster.
Again,  
ryanmkeane : 3/16/2016 1:58 pm : link
people making the assumption that we didn't go after other players because we signed Jenkins is just categorically false. We have plenty of cap space. Jordan has reported throughout this process that they barely looked into the crop of safeties. They simply weren't that interested - regardless of Jenkins.
RE: RE: RE: Why did the Giants HAVE  
Klaatu : 3/16/2016 2:03 pm : link
In comment 12862244 dust_bowl said:
Quote:
In comment 12862234 Klaatu said:


Quote:


In comment 12862226 Old Dirty Beckham said:


Quote:


to replace Prince with the most expensive corner on the market? Was that necessary?



Yes. Next question.

klatu you have no authority to definitely state that. What if the best corner on market was prince? Would you have given him same deal? If so you made ops point for him. In fact that's all you did was make the ops point.


Do not question my authority if you can't even spell my name correctly.

Oh, and the only point the OP has is on his head.
.  
arcarsenal : 3/16/2016 2:07 pm : link
There's no player that Jenkins prevented us from signing.
DRC is a much more intelligent player than Jenkins, IMO.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/16/2016 2:18 pm : link
He's a complete cornerback and a damn good one.

Maybe Jenkins turns into that like DRC did after initially being immature and getting toasted often, but right now on his career to date he's not worth this money.
You have no idea about that  
KWALL2 : 3/16/2016 2:18 pm : link
If we don't sign Jenkins you have no idea what the plan would have been or who would have been signed
RE: RE: RE: RE: Why did the Giants HAVE  
dust_bowl : 3/16/2016 2:18 pm : link
In comment 12862278 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 12862244 dust_bowl said:


Quote:


In comment 12862234 Klaatu said:


Quote:


In comment 12862226 Old Dirty Beckham said:


Quote:


to replace Prince with the most expensive corner on the market? Was that necessary?



Yes. Next question.

klatu you have no authority to definitely state that. What if the best corner on market was prince? Would you have given him same deal? If so you made ops point for him. In fact that's all you did was make the ops point.



Do not question my authority if you can't even spell my name correctly.

Oh, and the only point the OP has is on his head.
lol fair point.
RE: You have no idea about that  
Patrick77 : 3/16/2016 2:28 pm : link
In comment 12862309 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
If we don't sign Jenkins you have no idea what the plan would have been or who would have been signed


This is true. The other side to that is the Giants are sitting on somewhere between 18-28 million (depending who you believe) of cap space they can spend on free agents if they desire. They aren't limited money-wise right now.
I really like Janoris and I think he's better than Prince, but it did  
Anakim : 3/16/2016 2:30 pm : link
suck when Sean Smith (who I had as the #1 CB available) got less money and less guaranteed money than Janoris did. Obviously Reese thought that Janoris was better than both Smith and Prince so that's all that matters.
It's always better to have one player who, on a given day,  
SB 42 and 46 and ? : 3/16/2016 2:34 pm : link
can make one of the plays that decides the game over two or three average to above average players, like (no disrespect intended) Chris Canty or Kiwanuka who just show up in the middle of the stat sheet every week.

Of course it is a worry that he has given up so many big plays. He is young and has time to improve.

Also, in his last three seasons he has had 55, 56, and 55 solo tackles. I don't know how much emphasis to put on this, but Prince in his 16 game season in 2013 had 76 solo tackles and in just 11 games last year had 55 solo tackles.

With both Rolle and Prince gone, we may see some embarrassing catch and run plays next season.
RE: I'm pumped on the Jenkins signing  
shabu : 3/16/2016 2:52 pm : link
In comment 12862245 Patrick77 said:
Quote:
What to me is concerning is that Prince left for basically pennies. Having him signed for that money for this upcoming season would have been some sick depth - even if he could only play his normal 12 games.

Jenkins is very talented, very aggressive, and a gambler. He is a lot like a younger DRC. If those two play up to their talent and we have a pass rush finally the difference in the defense could be huge.


More evidence of shit drafting .
RE: RE: RE: RE: Why did the Giants HAVE  
BMac : 3/16/2016 3:05 pm : link
In comment 12862278 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 12862244 dust_bowl said:


Quote:


In comment 12862234 Klaatu said:


Quote:


In comment 12862226 Old Dirty Beckham said:


Quote:


to replace Prince with the most expensive corner on the market? Was that necessary?



Yes. Next question.

klatu you have no authority to definitely state that. What if the best corner on market was prince? Would you have given him same deal? If so you made ops point for him. In fact that's all you did was make the ops point.



Do not question my authority if you can't even spell my name correctly.

Oh, and the only point the OP has is on his head.


I thought it was a hole, but that would be beside the point.
.  
arcarsenal : 3/16/2016 3:13 pm : link
So the Giants didn't pursue Ladarius Green because they signed Janoris Jenkins? Makes no sense. Given the lack of interest in TE's this entire FA period it seems pretty clear the org simply thinks what they have is passable for now and didn't want to invest more money there right now.

Iloka never left CIN. They wanted him back and he stayed.

Maybe they would have pursued McCleod harder if they hadn't signed Jenkins but the fact remains NYG could have still afforded any of these players had they really wanted them.

hitdog has said it many times.. the Giants identified specific players to target and went and got those players.
Jenkins was plan A  
KWALL2 : 3/16/2016 3:38 pm : link
If they did not sign him, the money would have been used on Plan B. Whatever that was but they had one.

We have $40 million going to Jenkins in the next 3 years. That would have bought a few players. If he was not signed I'm sure they had a backup plan to spend it.
RE: You  
Matt M. : 3/16/2016 3:40 pm : link
In comment 12862097 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
guys keep making the false assumption that the Giants are an attractive landing spot.

We have an unproven 38-year old coach. We have a DC who has fielded 2 of the 3 worst defenses in NFL history.

We have a GM on the hot seat.

We haven't made the playoffs in four years or had a winning season in three years.

The roster was a disaster heading into free agency.
I agree on all counts. I think the FA flurry may make them a more attractive spot than they were before FA started, but maybe not by much.
A few thoughts  
Matt M. : 3/16/2016 4:11 pm : link
1) We were not looking to replace DRC, who is still under contract. We were looking to replace Prince.

2) Jenkins is at least as good, if not better than Prince. But, he is more durable, which makes him more desirable.

3) The problem isn't the giants not having enough money for Okung. The problem is he wants a lot more money than anyone wants to pay for a guy who hasn't played a full 16 game season yet. Plus, I don't think it is clear if he would play LT or RT for us. You don't pay a RT starting LT money generally. we payed McKenzie well, but he was one of the top 2 or 3 RT in the league when we signed him.
We had to sign Jenkins, no choice  
SGMen : 3/16/2016 5:05 pm : link
Prince came back from his injury and played very average to below average ball. The guy was always hurt and that is unfortunate.

I wanted Prince to get a one year "JPP" type deal (less money of course but a chance to show his wares one more time) and stay since you need 3 corners minimum in the league but alas it was not to be.

One thing I noticed is that we purged some "bodies" or maybe some "less than want it attitudes" from the team: Beatty, Schwarz, Prince (UFA without contract offer), Randle (UFA without contract offer), etc. House cleaning is often about attitude, injury and possibility of youth upgrade on the cheap.

Jenkins was a need pickup. We had to. No choice. If he and DRC line up for 16 games the next two years and play to their level our starting corner play will be above average. What more can you ask for in this pass happy league day & age?

Jenkins is entering his prime  
bigbluehoya : 3/16/2016 5:10 pm : link
Has a track record of making plays, has all the physical tools, has been durable up to this point, and has the type of weaknesses that are believed to be correctable via coaching/experience.
SGMEN  
Old Dirty Beckham : 3/16/2016 5:23 pm : link
Couldnt they have signed a different corner? They HAD to sign Janoris Jenkins?

The rams didnt think so.
By most accounts  
bigbluehoya : 3/16/2016 5:36 pm : link
The Rams did some considerable hand-wringing about which CB to tag. They decided on Johnson, but were by no means sour on Jenkins.
Why does everyone think the giants should sign everyone?  
adamg : 3/16/2016 6:21 pm : link
Green, Amukamara, every RB on the market, and every old safety...

Just because they have money doesn't mean they have to sign only the FAs available this year.

And signing every average player isn't going to make a brilliant team if they don't have some sort of strategy and reason for signing beyond having a well-known name.

Jenkins is a great signing. He's a young CB who already has six defensive touchdowns. He averages 1.5 TDs per year and 2.5 INTs per year. Prince averages less INTs per season than Jenkins averages TDs for the stat nerds out there.

Also, the level of retardation every time money comes up is tiring. Every year the price of play goes up. Isn't it weird that A-Rod made so much more money than Babe Ruth? No, it isn't. Because the price of play goes up over time. Just like Carmelo makes more than Jordan did.

And just because we have over 20 million more to spend in cap doesn't mean we need to spend it now. Von Miller is a FA next year. If we botch the LB position again, we can dip into FA next year too. I'm not too worried though, since it looks like Leonard Floyd is our first round pick.

And the TE question that was just raised: we have Tye who was All-Rookie and Donnell coming back from injury. They also like that kid Cunningham. Either way, we have two starting caliber guys there without the need to waste money overpaying in FA which is the thrust of complaining in this thread anyway.

Bitch when we lose. Bitching about getting the top DE and top CB because it cost money is retarded, especially when the solution is spending more money on shittier players. Getting a shitty safety and Prince for the same amount is useless. Prince is bound to either miss games or play subpar due to injury. Jenkins has missed fewer games than Prince has years in the league.
Adam  
KWALL2 : 3/16/2016 7:29 pm : link
You need to check on your stats. Jenkins gave up a lot more TDs than that. More TDs than just about any CB in the NFL in the past 4 years. He's also a terrible tackler.

Great signing? Sure it is.
But great analogy  
KWALL2 : 3/16/2016 7:30 pm : link
With Babe Ruth.
RE: By most accounts  
shockeyisthebest8056 : 3/16/2016 8:03 pm : link
In comment 12862742 bigbluehoya said:
Quote:
The Rams did some considerable hand-wringing about which CB to tag. They decided on Johnson, but were by no means sour on Jenkins.


The Bleacher Report said that Jenkins turned down an offer from the Rams that would've made him a top 15 paid corner in the sport annually. Why would they try to keep someone who wasn't any good (or not that good)? The Rams certainly were more interested in keeping Jenkins than the Giants were in keeping Prince.
amazing  
grizz299 : 3/16/2016 8:39 pm : link
A poster writes a totally stupid thread that is illogical and mis-informed. Another poster nicely points out the flawed logic and the OP gets snooty.

Whether we overpaid or not is debatable. But the point that we should have signed mutliple players is not illogical, Labeling it "illogical" is kindness the op doesn't deserve. The point is, there's plenty of money left signing the best corner available doesn't stop us from getting the multiple players you're lobbying for.

Most time "dumb" posts go with dumb posters. I don't this guy is stupid, making seeking attention and need to advertise witlessness.
$40 million  
KWALL2 : 3/16/2016 10:43 pm : link
Over the next 3 years to one player does not prevent us from signing more players?

And you're calling people stupid while you write that?
This board is truly intolerable at times.  
chopperhatch : 3/16/2016 10:44 pm : link
I have taken several sustained "breaks" from here but I've come to realize that what makes this place great is also its biggest drawback. Great spot for info with cool posters while at the same time, a place where every numbskull with a keyboard will complain about EVERY signing as well as EVERY consigning.

Fact: we addressed two of our biggest areas of need with big ticket players to make us more win now

Fact: had we not signed these players, the majority of the idiots would be on how we didn't spend our cap dollars

Fact: both our D line and secondary added high priced players who have a proven durability record.

Fact: Jenkins takes gambles, but he also makes plays on the ball. While DRC tends to drop his TDs, Jenkins tends not to. Plus he is young.


Can we for once, just once enjoy a successful FA period and not second guess the GM as if you barely missed out on the Giants giving you the job?

For fuck's sake this place...instead of discussing the potential for new schemes, how the additions will make us better, and the draft, we have to listen to BBI mouth breathing fucktards yammer on about how "we should've signed Osmele and Prince instead" as if said fucktards was at the negotiating table and heard Reese say "no thanks, we'd rather low-ball you two and overpay for arguably the top rated corner on the market."

Just die.
KWALL  
Go Terps : 3/16/2016 10:47 pm : link
Somehow the money being doled out has been deemed irrelevant this offseason.
RE: amazing  
Devon : 3/16/2016 10:51 pm : link
In comment 12862961 grizz299 said:
Quote:
A poster writes a totally stupid thread that is illogical and mis-informed. Another poster nicely points out the flawed logic and the OP gets snooty.

Whether we overpaid or not is debatable. But the point that we should have signed mutliple players is not illogical, Labeling it "illogical" is kindness the op doesn't deserve. The point is, there's plenty of money left signing the best corner available doesn't stop us from getting the multiple players you're lobbying for.

Most time "dumb" posts go with dumb posters. I don't this guy is stupid, making seeking attention and need to advertise witlessness.


The guy who constantly complains about Eli's typical QB contract hamstringing Jerry Reese and his ability to make moves is all good with Jenkins and thinks (likely over)paying him has no impact on signing anyone.
RE: $40 million  
chopperhatch : 3/16/2016 11:03 pm : link
In comment 12863064 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
Over the next 3 years to one player does not prevent us from signing more players?

And you're calling people stupid while you write that?


So I'm guessing you would've rather offered Prince that kinda money (that's what he was looking for) for an oft injured player?

And I am failing to find statistics where he was responsible for 5 TDs this year.

If anything, from what I have read and understand about the player, teams don't throw in his direction very often and he makes plays on the ball. Albeit gambling from time to time. He tackles well and isn't injured a lot. I dunno how that is a bad investment of big dollars that we already had in FA.
RE: KWALL  
chopperhatch : 3/16/2016 11:12 pm : link
In comment 12863071 Go Terps said:
Quote:
Somehow the money being doled out has been deemed irrelevant this offseason.


That's not even close to what the general consensus is. But by all means, quote the board majority as you like.

The vast majority of the board thinks that while we overpaid, we overpaid to bring in the very best players at positions of need for these reasons:

- Eli has maybe 4-7 years of high level play left (maybe more because of how healthy he's been) and we need to retool quickly

- We have a very high draft position where other needs can be addressed

- We blew it on several drafts leaving the cupboard bare

- We had the money


Terps, if you had had it your way, we would be spending like the Jags were 4 years ago (meaning, not at all) and just letting our remaining time with Eli be a period of mediocrity until when all of our frugal ways comes to fruition and we have the players, we then have to look for another quarterback.

Yes Vernon and Jenkins were overpaid. But it's not like we overpaid Mario Williams or Okung. These are young players who can not only get better but they plug HUGE holes for us.
Chances are  
chopperhatch : 3/16/2016 11:15 pm : link
5 years from now, Eli might be done and these contracts are going to really hurt. So what? Once he's done we have to basically start over anyways, why not make one last push at a ring or two.

And no I don't think we are all that far away from legit competing for one based on the division and the way our offense looks as presently constructed.

He doesn't have to be better than DRC  
Giants2012 : 3/16/2016 11:17 pm : link
He has to make the defense better.

As far as Osemele, the Raiders had/have the cap space to have signed Jenkins too. Can't have them all but the Giants did get better IMO.

RE: He doesn't have to be better than DRC  
chopperhatch : 3/16/2016 11:20 pm : link
In comment 12863097 Giants2012 said:
Quote:
He has to make the defense better.

As far as Osemele, the Raiders had/have the cap space to have signed Jenkins too. Can't have them all but the Giants did get better IMO.


He's better at holding on to picks than DRC. He's better at staying on the field than Princess. He makes us better, more consistent at the position. But it just illuminates our need to have FS figured out. Team seems to be banking on Jackson, Berhe and Mykelle. They better be right.
RE: RE: He doesn't have to be better than DRC  
adamg : 3/17/2016 12:15 am : link
In comment 12863099 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
In comment 12863097 Giants2012 said:


Quote:


He has to make the defense better.

As far as Osemele, the Raiders had/have the cap space to have signed Jenkins too. Can't have them all but the Giants did get better IMO.




He's better at holding on to picks than DRC. He's better at staying on the field than Princess. He makes us better, more consistent at the position. But it just illuminates our need to have FS figured out. Team seems to be banking on Jackson, Berhe and Mykelle. They better be right.


Looking at tape of Berhe and Jackson, they both seem like they have play-maker potential. Berhe especially seems Garnes like in terms of hit power. He also seems to have a great work ethic and the right mindset. I'm really looking forward to his return in 2016.
RE: RE: RE: He doesn't have to be better than DRC  
chopperhatch : 3/17/2016 12:38 am : link
In comment 12863149 adamg said:
Quote:
In comment 12863099 chopperhatch said:


Quote:


In comment 12863097 Giants2012 said:


Quote:


He has to make the defense better.

As far as Osemele, the Raiders had/have the cap space to have signed Jenkins too. Can't have them all but the Giants did get better IMO.




He's better at holding on to picks than DRC. He's better at staying on the field than Princess. He makes us better, more consistent at the position. But it just illuminates our need to have FS figured out. Team seems to be banking on Jackson, Berhe and Mykelle. They better be right.



Looking at tape of Berhe and Jackson, they both seem like they have play-maker potential. Berhe especially seems Garnes like in terms of hit power. He also seems to have a great work ethic and the right mindset. I'm really looking forward to his return in 2016.


I actually like Berhe as the 3rd safety. God willing he emerges as a SS and makes Spags think more about LC as a Will. Bennett Jackson REALLY intrigues me. Played corner so he understands how to read receivers and has some ball skills. Really would be a bonus if both of these guys come back from injury to contribute.

This is what we SHOULD be talking about: what we have, and what we could be getting. But no...all most want to talk about is how we overpaid for very good players at positions of need.
RE: RE: RE: RE: He doesn't have to be better than DRC  
adamg : 3/17/2016 2:07 am : link
In comment 12863170 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
In comment 12863149 adamg said:


Quote:


In comment 12863099 chopperhatch said:


Quote:


In comment 12863097 Giants2012 said:


Quote:


He has to make the defense better.

As far as Osemele, the Raiders had/have the cap space to have signed Jenkins too. Can't have them all but the Giants did get better IMO.




He's better at holding on to picks than DRC. He's better at staying on the field than Princess. He makes us better, more consistent at the position. But it just illuminates our need to have FS figured out. Team seems to be banking on Jackson, Berhe and Mykelle. They better be right.



Looking at tape of Berhe and Jackson, they both seem like they have play-maker potential. Berhe especially seems Garnes like in terms of hit power. He also seems to have a great work ethic and the right mindset. I'm really looking forward to his return in 2016.



I actually like Berhe as the 3rd safety. God willing he emerges as a SS and makes Spags think more about LC as a Will. Bennett Jackson REALLY intrigues me. Played corner so he understands how to read receivers and has some ball skills. Really would be a bonus if both of these guys come back from injury to contribute.

This is what we SHOULD be talking about: what we have, and what we could be getting. But no...all most want to talk about is how we overpaid for very good players at positions of need.


It sounds like Reese really is keyed on Floyd too. It'd be cool to have him and LC/Berhe on either side with Jackson playing center field between them. We've got enough LB pieces to take care of the middle... Another edge rusher and we're getting into deep D territory.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: He doesn't have to be better than DRC  
SGMen : 3/17/2016 3:03 am : link
In comment 12863200 adamg said:
Quote:
In comment 12863170 chopperhatch said:


Quote:


In comment 12863149 adamg said:


Quote:


In comment 12863099 chopperhatch said:


Quote:


In comment 12863097 Giants2012 said:


Quote:


He has to make the defense better.

As far as Osemele, the Raiders had/have the cap space to have signed Jenkins too. Can't have them all but the Giants did get better IMO.




He's better at holding on to picks than DRC. He's better at staying on the field than Princess. He makes us better, more consistent at the position. But it just illuminates our need to have FS figured out. Team seems to be banking on Jackson, Berhe and Mykelle. They better be right.



Looking at tape of Berhe and Jackson, they both seem like they have play-maker potential. Berhe especially seems Garnes like in terms of hit power. He also seems to have a great work ethic and the right mindset. I'm really looking forward to his return in 2016.



I actually like Berhe as the 3rd safety. God willing he emerges as a SS and makes Spags think more about LC as a Will. Bennett Jackson REALLY intrigues me. Played corner so he understands how to read receivers and has some ball skills. Really would be a bonus if both of these guys come back from injury to contribute.

This is what we SHOULD be talking about: what we have, and what we could be getting. But no...all most want to talk about is how we overpaid for very good players at positions of need.



It sounds like Reese really is keyed on Floyd too. It'd be cool to have him and LC/Berhe on either side with Jackson playing center field between them. We've got enough LB pieces to take care of the middle... Another edge rusher and we're getting into deep D territory.
i a, not sold on Floyd. I still hold out hope we get RB Elliott due to his play-making or OLF Stanley as he is starting for next five or more years for us. A strong OL makes us better.

If we go OLT, FS, RB, OG, DL and LB we'd plug some holes but miss fixing WR.
Along with other flaws in Prince's game and durability,  
BlueLou : 3/17/2016 4:03 am : link
he simply doesn't disrupt WRs well at the LOS. That's one thing I've noticed about his play numerous times. Because if that he doesn't suit well to Spag's pressure schemes IMO.

I haven't seen JJ enough to know if that's a strength of his, but Spags knows him, no?

That alone could be key to the swap out.
RE: We had to sign Jenkins, no choice  
DonQuixote : 3/17/2016 4:03 am : link
In comment 12862679 SGMen said:
Quote:

...
One thing I noticed is that we purged some "bodies" or maybe some "less than want it attitudes" from the team: Beatty, Schwarz, Prince (UFA without contract offer), Randle (UFA without contract offer), etc. House cleaning is often about attitude, injury and possibility of youth upgrade on the cheap.

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I think this is true and not discussed very much. It is very possible the new coaching staff simply does not want certain players around any more, for any amount of money. Maybe they are trying to build a different kind of team ... so yes, maybe Prince could have been retained for very little cash, but maybe, even with the injuries, that isn't all there is to it.

chopper  
Go Terps : 3/17/2016 9:06 am : link
That's not what I would consider sound team building. I don't believe we got Eli much closer to a ring with this spending.

And you're wrong about what I would do. I'm fine spending money, I'm just not fine spending it crazily because we feel like we have to try to make a last push for Eli. I would have made some moves to bolster the offense first. They would have been far less inflated on the market and more likely to equate to wins on the field.

We spent crazy money and don't have a great player to show for it.
RE: RE: He doesn't have to be better than DRC  
Ten Ton Hammer : 3/17/2016 9:27 am : link
In comment 12863099 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
In comment 12863097 Giants2012 said:


Quote:


He has to make the defense better.

As far as Osemele, the Raiders had/have the cap space to have signed Jenkins too. Can't have them all but the Giants did get better IMO.




He's better at holding on to picks than DRC.


Not so sure that's true. DRC has played double the amount of games as Jenkins and has 24 INTs vs. 10.

Jenkins gets thrown at often because he gives up a lot.
Jenkins  
stretch234 : 3/17/2016 10:35 am : link
I think Prince is the overall better player. However, if you are going to pay a FA CB I am not opposed to paying a similar aged player, who is healthy, and not a big drop off.

All his guaranteed money, sans 2 yrs of pro-rated bonus are paid by the end of yr 3, when he is 29. They then will be only on the hook for 4M if they move on.

Prince is far from the only CB who misses games, the vast majority do. Getting a guy who stays on the field is a big deal.
Chopper  
KWALL2 : 3/17/2016 11:52 am : link
Jenkins gave up 5 TDs/year the past 4 years. The last 3 seasons he had 1,2, and 3 ints while the QB rating throwing at him is was over 100. He did this while playing with a very talented defense and pass rush. He's also a weak tackler averaging close to a missed tackle each game for the last 4 years.

The problem isn't spending big money. I have no problem spending it on pass rushers. The problem is spending big money on this player. He's a number 3 CB with issues. Instead of spending the money there I would have preferred they went cheaper or used a draft pick at CB. Then used the money to fill 3 holes with good value signings like TE Green (he will be one of the best FA deals of 2016), LB Lamur from CIN, safety like McLeod, CB like Hayard.

We could have filled several holes. Instead we paid an enormous deal for a #2 CB who gives up s lot of TDs every year.
Correction  
KWALL2 : 3/17/2016 11:53 am : link
He's a #2CB. Not 3.
RE: The Giants roster is still a disaster.  
dg901 : 3/18/2016 8:00 am : link
In comment 12862269 Rudy5757 said:
Quote:
We replaced our good players with good or better players but we havent replaced our bad players. We had a bad right side of the OL and we still have a bad right side. We had a bad #2 WR and we dont even have him anymore. We have bad LBs and really didnt do much to improve that. We had a bad FS and still have a bad FS or unproven guy coming off of injuries. We still have no depth across the board.

If camp started today and lets say we have including our 6 future draft pics, we need to sign 20 FAs just to get to the max training camp roster. Some of which need to be starters.

If I was a FA and the money was close I would look for a better team. We had to overpay to attract talent, young guy we can build around because we have very few. i have no problem overpaying but I have a problem with not addressing glaring holes in the roster.

Depth is a luxury more than a prevalence. Quality depth requires luck and/or money. You mention unknown talent on the team which hasn't been on the field, lets hope the coaches and staff knowledge to know exactly what they have, something we as fans do not have the insight into to make blanket assessments about projected starters for any position we see a void already on the roster. We also have 6 top 10 picks in each of the 1st 6 rd's of the draft.
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