How do you knock how they used him? The goal isn't to get sack numbers.
They moved him all over and he was a vital part of a defense that got crazy pressure on QBs which allowed them to cover up for a very inexperienced set of DBs.
Like Yankee said, when asked to rush from the edge he displayed special skills. Skills that will work in the NFL.
Of all the guys being talked about in the press for the Giants, Floyd is my favorite. It would be an exciting addition (and I believe instant impact player) to the defense.
Admittedly I don't know much, but just basing off of that PFF scouting report, he should be the pick. Tough to pass up on a guy who could be so freakishly athletic and such a good pass rusher.
RE: Article doesn't even touch on his coverage ability
This is the guy for the role they envisioned for Kiwi(and more). Do it all LB, side line to side line paly the run, rush passers-by from multiple angles,play zone and even cover TEs and RBS one on one.
I don't know if you watched the tape on the Vanderbilt game in that slide show, coach, but that one play when he covers the slot receiver 30 yards downfield is damn impressive
After watching the tape, I'm sold. The only thing is that he seems like a classic 3-4 LB. If the Giants take him, makes you wonder about their plans.
Do they let Hankin walk, make Snacks the NT and switch Bromley to DE in some sort of hybrid 3-4/4-3 or maybe switch to 3-4 altogether?
I started the linked post about a month ago. Much of what PFF and NJ.com are saying confirms what I have heard. Pretty much Floyd's versatility and Georgia's defensive scheme prevented the possibility of big pass rush numbers, he has huge upside, and no reason why he can't be an Anthony Barr type player. Old BBI thread, some thoughts on Floyd - ( New Window )
How do you knock how they used him? The goal isn't to get sack numbers.
They moved him all over and he was a vital part of a defense that got crazy pressure on QBs which allowed them to cover up for a very inexperienced set of DBs.
Like Yankee said, when asked to rush from the edge he displayed special skills. Skills that will work in the NFL.
Of all the guys being talked about in the press for the Giants, Floyd is my favorite. It would be an exciting addition (and I believe instant impact player) to the defense.
I would love to be sold on him. Yes, his athletic ability is eyebrow raising. Yes, I love that he is tall and can run with wideouts if need be (wonder if using him against guy like Dez or AJ Green inside the 10 would happen). But KWALL and others, have you watched him play the run? In that Vandy tape, his lack of aggression and sensing how the play developed was evident to say the least. He was constantly chasing, easily quarantined by blockers, taking bad angles to the runner's path and arm tackling. I just have a very hard time taking a DE/LB like that at 10.
A lot of the attributes I've listed are fine for WILL. But I hate drafting "athletes".
I find myself torn between the idea of Floyd at 10, and trading back for an extra 2nd or 3rd. The two players I like the most by round are Floyd in 1 and vonn bell in 2. I think a decent WR can be had in round 3. I just worry about RT. I don't like the idea of taking an OT in round 1, but if the Giants want a young guy to come in and play, he's probably going to have to be selected before round 4.
but in the footage included in the link, when Floyd lined up ILB or roughly over center and 3 - 5 yards off LOS, he rarely figured in the play, being easily taken out (including by holds that were not called). I did not watch all the clips. I get that this is not where his strengths are, but curious that this aspect did not come up, in the context of playing the run.
I'm not impressed by him, plus this pick reminds me to much of Clint Sintim. Imo he doesn't fit well in the Giants system. Last thing the Giants need is another experiment..
I find myself torn between the idea of Floyd at 10, and trading back for an extra 2nd or 3rd. The two players I like the most by round are Floyd in 1 and vonn bell in 2. I think a decent WR can be had in round 3. I just worry about RT. I don't like the idea of taking an OT in round 1, but if the Giants want a young guy to come in and play, he's probably going to have to be selected before round 4.
I like Floyd a lot - he's going to be an impact player for us -- and I think the talent level of the first round drops after the first 10 picks if yo include the 2 QBs -- I think you have to go with an uber talent like him as opposed to trading back - because the players you get in trading back are less likely to have the same kind of impact --- It's a process we are not going to solve all our problems with a snappity snap snap
RE: RE: Article doesn't even touch on his coverage ability
This is the guy for the role they envisioned for Kiwi(and more). Do it all LB, side line to side line paly the run, rush passers-by from multiple angles,play zone and even cover TEs and RBS one on one.
I don't know if you watched the tape on the Vanderbilt game in that slide show, coach, but that one play when he covers the slot receiver 30 yards downfield is damn impressive
After watching the tape, I'm sold. The only thing is that he seems like a classic 3-4 LB. If the Giants take him, makes you wonder about their plans.
Do they let Hankin walk, make Snacks the NT and switch Bromley to DE in some sort of hybrid 3-4/4-3 or maybe switch to 3-4 altogether?
I don't think he's covering slot receivers in the pros but yeah that was a great indicator of this guy's athleticsm and fluidity at 6'5 230+ lbs (now 245)
Get this kid in that Kiwi role and we may finally see the impact a player with freakish talent can make from that position.
but in the footage included in the link, when Floyd lined up ILB or roughly over center and 3 - 5 yards off LOS, he rarely figured in the play, being easily taken out (including by holds that were not called). I did not watch all the clips. I get that this is not where his strengths are, but curious that this aspect did not come up, in the context of playing the run.
You're not wrong, he looks pretty avg against fucking Vanderbilt.
I really want to like his potential, but I want a football player first. And he doesn't strike me as being strong enough at the POA.
"Jaguars should avoid Leonard Floyd, even in second round"
Which is exactly what he won't be doing for the Giants as a SAM in a 4-3. Not on the regular. Show me footage of him covering really good TEs and pass catching RBs, and I'd be more interested.
around Floyd is he wasn't used as pass rusher enough. he's an explosive pass rusher, both hand in the dirt and blitzer
i think the big problem people are having with him is there isn't an easy comparison. i see a lot of aldon smith in his game although he's obviously no where near as heavy
I hear the critics about him at SLB. He has the physical tools and has good coverage ability, what about him playing WLB? His current lack of power may not be such an issue plus he can use his speed and athleticism in space.
Why not keep Kennard at SLB with Floyd at WLB outside of Vernon.
but in the footage included in the link, when Floyd lined up ILB or roughly over center and 3 - 5 yards off LOS, he rarely figured in the play, being easily taken out (including by holds that were not called). I did not watch all the clips. I get that this is not where his strengths are, but curious that this aspect did not come up, in the context of playing the run.
He is good against the run to the outside. When they ran at him, he made the tackle but usually backed up a yard or two rather than moving up and filling the whole.
He is obviously not an ILB at the next level. Rick brought up that scouts see him as a 4-3 OLB. I just don't see it. He is best at rushing the passer from the outside just off the LOS like Aldon Smith or Demarcus Ware. He actually reminds me of LT in the way he lines up on either side of the LOS and pursues from behind. He obviously does not have LT's strength but he tries to play the game the same way. And he definitely plays to the whistle and does not take plays off. I like him.
because that's where he's gonna end up. He isn't this monster pass rusher despite what people are projecting. The actual results are he's mediocre at best.
Yeah, I know that's what's said, even though I don't recall ever seeing a 3-4 formation. But let's say it's true. It isn't often. Then you're looking at a guy -- Floyd -- who's BEST thing is clearly rushing the passer -- only getting to rush on a part-time basis. You don't (IMO) burn a 10th overall pick on that.
So in the course of a game, HOW OFTEN do you send him after the QB from the SAM position? Maybe, if he's really great at it at the NFL level, and it works, it becomes a feature on passing downs. Maybe he becomes a impact player as a specialist. But aren't we talking about the SAME ROLE/Position that made Kiwi just another guy, and Clint Sintim a wasted pick?
If the Giants base D was a 3-4, I think Floyd would be a great fit. But it isn't. And frankly, if you're taking a guy who's best thing is rushing, I'd rather have a Shaq Lawson or Kevin Dodd. Guys who would play a 4-down, DL role as part of the rotation, or be effective as the yearly attrition takes out the starters. (I also keep saying, there's a better than 50-50 chance JPP is gone after this year.)
If you're a base 4-3 D taking a LB at 10, it had better be a guy who's BEST THING IS LINEBACKING -- like Jack (if he slid), or Smith if he were healthy.
Floyd has the athleticism to "go sideline to sideline," but there isn't much evidence showing him do that on the highlights. I have seen NO FOOTAGE OF FLOYD COVERING ANYONE. And his run stopping looks adequate, not special.
Yeah, I know that's what's said, even though I don't recall ever seeing a 3-4 formation. But let's say it's true. It isn't often. Then you're looking at a guy -- Floyd -- who's BEST thing is clearly rushing the passer -- only getting to rush on a part-time basis. You don't (IMO) burn a 10th overall pick on that.
So in the course of a game, HOW OFTEN do you send him after the QB from the SAM position? Maybe, if he's really great at it at the NFL level, and it works, it becomes a feature on passing downs. Maybe he becomes a impact player as a specialist. But aren't we talking about the SAME ROLE/Position that made Kiwi just another guy, and Clint Sintim a wasted pick?
If the Giants base D was a 3-4, I think Floyd would be a great fit. But it isn't. And frankly, if you're taking a guy who's best thing is rushing, I'd rather have a Shaq Lawson or Kevin Dodd. Guys who would play a 4-down, DL role as part of the rotation, or be effective as the yearly attrition takes out the starters. (I also keep saying, there's a better than 50-50 chance JPP is gone after this year.)
If you're a base 4-3 D taking a LB at 10, it had better be a guy who's BEST THING IS LINEBACKING -- like Jack (if he slid), or Smith if he were healthy.
Floyd has the athleticism to "go sideline to sideline," but there isn't much evidence showing him do that on the highlights. I have seen NO FOOTAGE OF FLOYD COVERING ANYONE. And his run stopping looks adequate, not special.
the link has him in coverage on a few plays. and he is right with the man he is covering, TE or WR or RB...
Has got a non stop motor and is versatile and hits with some meanness
And has great bend and body lean oh also I believe 4.6 speed ( that qualifies as pretty good sideline to sideline speed I think ..... Have to
Start thinking outside the box this guy is perfect for today's pass happy NFL
We can hide a little deficiency at CB but we have to upgrade at LB
I agree with the scouts this guy has got 4-3 OLB written all over him.
And if it was me I'd find a way to use him like LT
Has got a non stop motor and is versatile and hits with some meanness
And has great bend and body lean oh also I believe 4.6 speed ( that qualifies as pretty good sideline to sideline speed I think ..... Have to
Start thinking outside the box this guy is perfect for today's pass happy NFL
We can hide a little deficiency at CB but we have to upgrade at LB
I agree with the scouts this guy has got 4-3 OLB written all over him.
And if it was me I'd find a way to use him like LT
The comparisons to Sintim and Kiwi are ludicrous
Fans need to stop living in the past !!!!
Posters have a tendency to take a guy who left a foul taste in their mouth and project future results based on the concept rather than the talent of the player executing that particular role.
The problem with Kiwi and Sintim in the role they tried to use them was they were not in the same stratosphere in terms of fluidity and short area quickness as Floyd. Secondly neither had a rep as being particularly adept in space/coverage in college. Floyd aside from potentially being slightly on the light side (Leonte David/Boley/Armistead etc) has shown tremendous ability to play the Kiwi /Sintim role.
His injury is still too much an unknown in terms of healing. This is not a standard AOL injury he sustained where today's success rates in full recovery are high.
Risk is still too high at 10 even for his level of talent for this team and its number of needs.
He did not belong dropping into coverage routinely. He was just lost at DE because of the other DEs and he had the best speed so he became a hybrid LB. 11 best players on the field nonsense.
We never really got to see Sintim because of the injury, but he should have been a DE only and should not have been picked at all.
Floyd is a LB with DE potential. Completely different animal than Kiwi or Sintim. He does seem to get eaten up inside, but looks like a handful outside.
My issue is WHAT IS THE ROLE? I'm perfectly willing say "I don't know." "I don't see it. " Maybe they would intend to build the D around his skill set. Or at least packages of it. To maximize his impact -- the way certain star players have been allowed to freelance.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
The standard can't be "he has to be able to contain a hall of famer
Is that a 10th overall pick should be "special" at the fundamental aspects of the position he'll be asked to play. I use being able to cover a TE as an example for the SAM position. Is it not fair to suggest that a "top 10 SAM" be able to win a reasonable share of plays against the top TEs in the league? I realize you don't shut him down completely. He will not be blitzing off the edge EVERY play, or even every passing play. As such, he needs to be able to do the BASICS at a very high level to warrant the pick (IMO).
My issue is WHAT IS THE ROLE? I'm perfectly willing say "I don't know." "I don't see it. " Maybe they would intend to build the D around his skill set. Or at least packages of it. To maximize his impact -- the way certain star players have been allowed to freelance.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
Good comments David. If you watch some of Floyd's cut-ups you'll see him able to cover slot receivers as a 6'5 LB . Now is he the level of a 5'10 shutdown Cb on a slot receiver? Of course not. But the fact that he can even do that adequately is an indicator of freakish athleticism from the LB spot. Put him on a RB or TE, he is likely to do quite well at the pro level. Also his ability in zone coverage looked pretty good. His problems were mainly playing in traffic at MLB. From what I saw, He was Ok but not great at it. The role he'd play at SAM (or even WILL) is some combination of blitzing, zone coverage,man to man (on TE or RB), and maybe even iso/spy a mobile Qb. All things he has shown a propensity to do exceedingly well.
My issue is WHAT IS THE ROLE? I'm perfectly willing say "I don't know." "I don't see it. " Maybe they would intend to build the D around his skill set. Or at least packages of it. To maximize his impact -- the way certain star players have been allowed to freelance.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
Good comments David. If you watch some of Floyd's cut-ups you'll see him able to cover slot receivers as a 6'5 LB . Now is he the level of a 5'10 shutdown Cb on a slot receiver? Of course not. But the fact that he can even do that adequately is an indicator of freakish athleticism from the LB spot. Put him on a RB or TE, he is likely to do quite well at the pro level. Also his ability in zone coverage looked pretty good. His problems were mainly playing in traffic at MLB. From what I saw, He was Ok but not great at it. The role he'd play at SAM (or even WILL) is some combination of blitzing, zone coverage,man to man (on TE or RB), and maybe even iso/spy a mobile Qb. All things he has shown a propensity to do exceedingly well.
The only way I can get behind the pick is having him play WILL. He is NOT a SAM.
My issue is WHAT IS THE ROLE? I'm perfectly willing say "I don't know." "I don't see it. " Maybe they would intend to build the D around his skill set. Or at least packages of it. To maximize his impact -- the way certain star players have been allowed to freelance.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
Good comments David. If you watch some of Floyd's cut-ups you'll see him able to cover slot receivers as a 6'5 LB . Now is he the level of a 5'10 shutdown Cb on a slot receiver? Of course not. But the fact that he can even do that adequately is an indicator of freakish athleticism from the LB spot. Put him on a RB or TE, he is likely to do quite well at the pro level. Also his ability in zone coverage looked pretty good. His problems were mainly playing in traffic at MLB. From what I saw, He was Ok but not great at it. The role he'd play at SAM (or even WILL) is some combination of blitzing, zone coverage,man to man (on TE or RB), and maybe even iso/spy a mobile Qb. All things he has shown a propensity to do exceedingly well.
The only way I can get behind the pick is having him play WILL. He is NOT a SAM.
NFL schemes are adjusting to the passing game. The LBers across the board are more mobile than ever before. We brought in JT Thomas and Casillas (smaller ,faster LBs) for Spags defense. Depending on how Spags utilizes him he may be able to play SAM.
Put him on the weakside. I don't get these comparisons to Von Miller, Anthony Barr, and those saying he should play the strong side.
He is a freak athlete who is tall and skinny and hits with no authority, he doesn't play with a lot of physicality. That doesn't sound like a Sam to me.
RE: RE: The last thing I want the Giants to draft...
is if Floyd is the pick at #10, Reese made a very ballsy decision. Really high ceiling, fairly low floor.
I'm thinking of Floyd's floor is him limited to a 3rd down role where the offense has to wonder if he's going to drop into coverage or rush the passer.
is if Floyd is the pick at #10, Reese made a very ballsy decision. Really high ceiling, fairly low floor.
I'm thinking of Floyd's floor is him limited to a 3rd down role where the offense has to wonder if he's going to drop into coverage or rush the passer.
Not a bad floor, methinks.
Maybe not, but certainly not what you want from the tenth pick of the draft.
Why will he get killed playing over the TE? I don't buy that. He can play either OLB spot, LEO, and DE. He'll be on the field all game.
3 down player and instant pass rush force. Perfect player to add to what we have on defense right now. We have problems with pass coverage? Floyd is the best fix for it.
If he struggles early vs the run use him as a situational pass rusher in year one. He'll bring plenty of value just with the pass rush.
Gil Brandt has him as the #12 player in the draft and thinks some teams see him as a DE. I do see Floyd eventually playing DE full time because of his outstanding pass rush.
But his year one floor will be a wildcard role on the Giants while boosting the pass rush.
...everyone sees these prospects through their own lens but to my eye his floor is as a bust. If it could happen to Mingo it can happen to Floyd. There are some similarities between them.
Quote:
for someone who is supposed to be so bad against the run, Auburn sure did run AWAY from floyd often
And why did Georgia play him at ILB so much of the time last year
he is versatile
They moved him all over and he was a vital part of a defense that got crazy pressure on QBs which allowed them to cover up for a very inexperienced set of DBs.
Like Yankee said, when asked to rush from the edge he displayed special skills. Skills that will work in the NFL.
Of all the guys being talked about in the press for the Giants, Floyd is my favorite. It would be an exciting addition (and I believe instant impact player) to the defense.
I don't know if you watched the tape on the Vanderbilt game in that slide show, coach, but that one play when he covers the slot receiver 30 yards downfield is damn impressive
After watching the tape, I'm sold. The only thing is that he seems like a classic 3-4 LB. If the Giants take him, makes you wonder about their plans.
Do they let Hankin walk, make Snacks the NT and switch Bromley to DE in some sort of hybrid 3-4/4-3 or maybe switch to 3-4 altogether?
Old BBI thread, some thoughts on Floyd - ( New Window )
They moved him all over and he was a vital part of a defense that got crazy pressure on QBs which allowed them to cover up for a very inexperienced set of DBs.
Like Yankee said, when asked to rush from the edge he displayed special skills. Skills that will work in the NFL.
Of all the guys being talked about in the press for the Giants, Floyd is my favorite. It would be an exciting addition (and I believe instant impact player) to the defense.
I would love to be sold on him. Yes, his athletic ability is eyebrow raising. Yes, I love that he is tall and can run with wideouts if need be (wonder if using him against guy like Dez or AJ Green inside the 10 would happen). But KWALL and others, have you watched him play the run? In that Vandy tape, his lack of aggression and sensing how the play developed was evident to say the least. He was constantly chasing, easily quarantined by blockers, taking bad angles to the runner's path and arm tackling. I just have a very hard time taking a DE/LB like that at 10.
A lot of the attributes I've listed are fine for WILL. But I hate drafting "athletes".
I find myself torn between the idea of Floyd at 10, and trading back for an extra 2nd or 3rd. The two players I like the most by round are Floyd in 1 and vonn bell in 2. I think a decent WR can be had in round 3. I just worry about RT. I don't like the idea of taking an OT in round 1, but if the Giants want a young guy to come in and play, he's probably going to have to be selected before round 4.
I find myself torn between the idea of Floyd at 10, and trading back for an extra 2nd or 3rd. The two players I like the most by round are Floyd in 1 and vonn bell in 2. I think a decent WR can be had in round 3. I just worry about RT. I don't like the idea of taking an OT in round 1, but if the Giants want a young guy to come in and play, he's probably going to have to be selected before round 4.
I like Floyd a lot - he's going to be an impact player for us -- and I think the talent level of the first round drops after the first 10 picks if yo include the 2 QBs -- I think you have to go with an uber talent like him as opposed to trading back - because the players you get in trading back are less likely to have the same kind of impact --- It's a process we are not going to solve all our problems with a snappity snap snap
Quote:
This is the guy for the role they envisioned for Kiwi(and more). Do it all LB, side line to side line paly the run, rush passers-by from multiple angles,play zone and even cover TEs and RBS one on one.
I don't know if you watched the tape on the Vanderbilt game in that slide show, coach, but that one play when he covers the slot receiver 30 yards downfield is damn impressive
After watching the tape, I'm sold. The only thing is that he seems like a classic 3-4 LB. If the Giants take him, makes you wonder about their plans.
Do they let Hankin walk, make Snacks the NT and switch Bromley to DE in some sort of hybrid 3-4/4-3 or maybe switch to 3-4 altogether?
I don't think he's covering slot receivers in the pros but yeah that was a great indicator of this guy's athleticsm and fluidity at 6'5 230+ lbs (now 245)
Get this kid in that Kiwi role and we may finally see the impact a player with freakish talent can make from that position.
Tampa supposedly likes Conklin and Hargreaves quite a bit too.
You're not wrong, he looks pretty avg against fucking Vanderbilt.
I really want to like his potential, but I want a football player first. And he doesn't strike me as being strong enough at the POA.
The author is barely old enough to drink but he did attend U Tennessee and cover SEC football for his career path.
Link - ( New Window )
I think Spags could make up a bunch of ways to maximize Floyd's talent to rush the passer or drop into coverage. I think he'd be best as a WILL.
i think the big problem people are having with him is there isn't an easy comparison. i see a lot of aldon smith in his game although he's obviously no where near as heavy
I hear the critics about him at SLB. He has the physical tools and has good coverage ability, what about him playing WLB? His current lack of power may not be such an issue plus he can use his speed and athleticism in space.
Why not keep Kennard at SLB with Floyd at WLB outside of Vernon.
He is good against the run to the outside. When they ran at him, he made the tackle but usually backed up a yard or two rather than moving up and filling the whole.
He is obviously not an ILB at the next level. Rick brought up that scouts see him as a 4-3 OLB. I just don't see it. He is best at rushing the passer from the outside just off the LOS like Aldon Smith or Demarcus Ware. He actually reminds me of LT in the way he lines up on either side of the LOS and pursues from behind. He obviously does not have LT's strength but he tries to play the game the same way. And he definitely plays to the whistle and does not take plays off. I like him.
So in the course of a game, HOW OFTEN do you send him after the QB from the SAM position? Maybe, if he's really great at it at the NFL level, and it works, it becomes a feature on passing downs. Maybe he becomes a impact player as a specialist. But aren't we talking about the SAME ROLE/Position that made Kiwi just another guy, and Clint Sintim a wasted pick?
If the Giants base D was a 3-4, I think Floyd would be a great fit. But it isn't. And frankly, if you're taking a guy who's best thing is rushing, I'd rather have a Shaq Lawson or Kevin Dodd. Guys who would play a 4-down, DL role as part of the rotation, or be effective as the yearly attrition takes out the starters. (I also keep saying, there's a better than 50-50 chance JPP is gone after this year.)
If you're a base 4-3 D taking a LB at 10, it had better be a guy who's BEST THING IS LINEBACKING -- like Jack (if he slid), or Smith if he were healthy.
Floyd has the athleticism to "go sideline to sideline," but there isn't much evidence showing him do that on the highlights. I have seen NO FOOTAGE OF FLOYD COVERING ANYONE. And his run stopping looks adequate, not special.
So in the course of a game, HOW OFTEN do you send him after the QB from the SAM position? Maybe, if he's really great at it at the NFL level, and it works, it becomes a feature on passing downs. Maybe he becomes a impact player as a specialist. But aren't we talking about the SAME ROLE/Position that made Kiwi just another guy, and Clint Sintim a wasted pick?
If the Giants base D was a 3-4, I think Floyd would be a great fit. But it isn't. And frankly, if you're taking a guy who's best thing is rushing, I'd rather have a Shaq Lawson or Kevin Dodd. Guys who would play a 4-down, DL role as part of the rotation, or be effective as the yearly attrition takes out the starters. (I also keep saying, there's a better than 50-50 chance JPP is gone after this year.)
If you're a base 4-3 D taking a LB at 10, it had better be a guy who's BEST THING IS LINEBACKING -- like Jack (if he slid), or Smith if he were healthy.
Floyd has the athleticism to "go sideline to sideline," but there isn't much evidence showing him do that on the highlights. I have seen NO FOOTAGE OF FLOYD COVERING ANYONE. And his run stopping looks adequate, not special.
the link has him in coverage on a few plays. and he is right with the man he is covering, TE or WR or RB...
And has great bend and body lean oh also I believe 4.6 speed ( that qualifies as pretty good sideline to sideline speed I think ..... Have to
Start thinking outside the box this guy is perfect for today's pass happy NFL
We can hide a little deficiency at CB but we have to upgrade at LB
I agree with the scouts this guy has got 4-3 OLB written all over him.
And if it was me I'd find a way to use him like LT
The comparisons to Sintim and Kiwi are ludicrous
Fans need to stop living in the past !!!!
And has great bend and body lean oh also I believe 4.6 speed ( that qualifies as pretty good sideline to sideline speed I think ..... Have to
Start thinking outside the box this guy is perfect for today's pass happy NFL
We can hide a little deficiency at CB but we have to upgrade at LB
I agree with the scouts this guy has got 4-3 OLB written all over him.
And if it was me I'd find a way to use him like LT
The comparisons to Sintim and Kiwi are ludicrous
Fans need to stop living in the past !!!!
Posters have a tendency to take a guy who left a foul taste in their mouth and project future results based on the concept rather than the talent of the player executing that particular role.
The problem with Kiwi and Sintim in the role they tried to use them was they were not in the same stratosphere in terms of fluidity and short area quickness as Floyd. Secondly neither had a rep as being particularly adept in space/coverage in college. Floyd aside from potentially being slightly on the light side (Leonte David/Boley/Armistead etc) has shown tremendous ability to play the Kiwi /Sintim role.
Risk is still too high at 10 even for his level of talent for this team and its number of needs.
We never really got to see Sintim because of the injury, but he should have been a DE only and should not have been picked at all.
Floyd is a LB with DE potential. Completely different animal than Kiwi or Sintim. He does seem to get eaten up inside, but looks like a handful outside.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
It's unfair. You wouldn't pick or not pick a cornerback based on his ability to cover Jerry Rice or not.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
Good comments David. If you watch some of Floyd's cut-ups you'll see him able to cover slot receivers as a 6'5 LB . Now is he the level of a 5'10 shutdown Cb on a slot receiver? Of course not. But the fact that he can even do that adequately is an indicator of freakish athleticism from the LB spot. Put him on a RB or TE, he is likely to do quite well at the pro level. Also his ability in zone coverage looked pretty good. His problems were mainly playing in traffic at MLB. From what I saw, He was Ok but not great at it. The role he'd play at SAM (or even WILL) is some combination of blitzing, zone coverage,man to man (on TE or RB), and maybe even iso/spy a mobile Qb. All things he has shown a propensity to do exceedingly well.
Quote:
My issue is WHAT IS THE ROLE? I'm perfectly willing say "I don't know." "I don't see it. " Maybe they would intend to build the D around his skill set. Or at least packages of it. To maximize his impact -- the way certain star players have been allowed to freelance.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
Good comments David. If you watch some of Floyd's cut-ups you'll see him able to cover slot receivers as a 6'5 LB . Now is he the level of a 5'10 shutdown Cb on a slot receiver? Of course not. But the fact that he can even do that adequately is an indicator of freakish athleticism from the LB spot. Put him on a RB or TE, he is likely to do quite well at the pro level. Also his ability in zone coverage looked pretty good. His problems were mainly playing in traffic at MLB. From what I saw, He was Ok but not great at it. The role he'd play at SAM (or even WILL) is some combination of blitzing, zone coverage,man to man (on TE or RB), and maybe even iso/spy a mobile Qb. All things he has shown a propensity to do exceedingly well.
The only way I can get behind the pick is having him play WILL. He is NOT a SAM.
Quote:
In comment 12907202 David B. said:
Quote:
My issue is WHAT IS THE ROLE? I'm perfectly willing say "I don't know." "I don't see it. " Maybe they would intend to build the D around his skill set. Or at least packages of it. To maximize his impact -- the way certain star players have been allowed to freelance.
Here's my issue(s) with that. Fine if it works. But if it doesn't, how does Floyd look in the standard SAM role? Does he do all the other stuff a SAM does at the level of a 10th overall pick? I don't know. Seems to me, for a 10th overall pick, a guy in this role better be able to negate Witten (and similar TEs) on a fair percentage of plays twice a year. Can he do that? No one else on the Giants has. Ever. Very few in the league have. It's a lot to put on anyone, but you're hoping to get a "special" player at 10.
Next. Suppose you invest time and work in all these packages for him, and he turns out to be injury prone, and you don't get to use those packages. How badly does that effect the rest of the defense? How much can you afford to rely on it? Again, I don't know.
So I could be completely wrong, and it could work out great. But my gut tells me there are a lot of ifs. And there are likely safer picks and better fits.
Good comments David. If you watch some of Floyd's cut-ups you'll see him able to cover slot receivers as a 6'5 LB . Now is he the level of a 5'10 shutdown Cb on a slot receiver? Of course not. But the fact that he can even do that adequately is an indicator of freakish athleticism from the LB spot. Put him on a RB or TE, he is likely to do quite well at the pro level. Also his ability in zone coverage looked pretty good. His problems were mainly playing in traffic at MLB. From what I saw, He was Ok but not great at it. The role he'd play at SAM (or even WILL) is some combination of blitzing, zone coverage,man to man (on TE or RB), and maybe even iso/spy a mobile Qb. All things he has shown a propensity to do exceedingly well.
The only way I can get behind the pick is having him play WILL. He is NOT a SAM.
NFL schemes are adjusting to the passing game. The LBers across the board are more mobile than ever before. We brought in JT Thomas and Casillas (smaller ,faster LBs) for Spags defense. Depending on how Spags utilizes him he may be able to play SAM.
Floyd has excelled at multiple roles in Georgia's defense. From what it seems, his impact is not where the stat sheet tells the whole story.
He is a freak athlete who is tall and skinny and hits with no authority, he doesn't play with a lot of physicality. That doesn't sound like a Sam to me.
Quote:
Is another "freakish athlete." I'd rather draft a football player.
Floyd has excelled at multiple roles in Georgia's defense. From what it seems, his impact is not where the stat sheet tells the whole story.
No, but it tells part of the story, and that part ain't pretty.
I'm thinking of Floyd's floor is him limited to a 3rd down role where the offense has to wonder if he's going to drop into coverage or rush the passer.
Not a bad floor, methinks.
I'm thinking of Floyd's floor is him limited to a 3rd down role where the offense has to wonder if he's going to drop into coverage or rush the passer.
Not a bad floor, methinks.
Maybe not, but certainly not what you want from the tenth pick of the draft.
3 down player and instant pass rush force. Perfect player to add to what we have on defense right now. We have problems with pass coverage? Floyd is the best fix for it.
If he struggles early vs the run use him as a situational pass rusher in year one. He'll bring plenty of value just with the pass rush.
Gil Brandt has him as the #12 player in the draft and thinks some teams see him as a DE. I do see Floyd eventually playing DE full time because of his outstanding pass rush.
But his year one floor will be a wildcard role on the Giants while boosting the pass rush.