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'Then you draft pass rushers until the cows come home.'

Coach Mason : 4/20/2016 9:19 pm
And:

'We like to send our pass rushers in waves'

Quotes from Jerry Reese from the last few years.

Last year was very un-Giant like from a pass rush standpoint. This year even with a healing JPP and Hankins, Olivier Vernon is a well rounded DE but hasn't proven he is an elite pass rusher, Snacks is a nice 2 way DT but not an elite pass rushing DT either.

You can bet the farm we are going to go for pass rush in the first couple rounds (at least 1).

Names that we have been linked to or fit the Giant size/speed profile:

At 10:

Floyd


Rd.2/ 3

Bronson Kaufusi (DE size/arm length/strength/triangle # combination Giants love from their DE's- 11 sacks/20 TFLS in 13 games last year)

Ogbah (4.6-4.7 speed at his size?) Fits Giants prototype for size/speed specimen at DE

Nkemdiche  (we were curious enough to bring him in, if he checked out mentally, could be option via round 1 trade down or round 2)


We don't know what Harrison  
section125 : 4/20/2016 9:21 pm : link
can do. He wasn't asked to rush for the Jets.
Chances he has elite pass rush ability  
Coach Mason : 4/20/2016 9:25 pm : link
Without the Jets figuring that out are small. Not to say he can't at all just that he's likely not a top tier one either
RE: Chances he has elite pass rush ability  
Johnny5 : 4/20/2016 9:39 pm : link
In comment 12912819 Coach Mason said:
Quote:
Without the Jets figuring that out are small. Not to say he can't at all just that he's likely not a top tier one either

I thought he actually rushed really well for a 3-4 NT on the Jets. I think on a 4 man DL he definitely collapses the pocket which will help a lot, and I wouldn't be surprised to see him getting after a good bit. And at any rate he helps those around him to rush that passer.
And we have not made one move  
Doomster : 4/20/2016 9:42 pm : link
to upgrade the offense yet....and we will continue go defense early in the draft?
Gil Bradt  
area junc : 4/20/2016 9:45 pm : link
says Nkemdiche has Warren Sapp-like ability
I know he's projected to go 15-20 range  
rasbutant : 4/20/2016 9:46 pm : link
but I really like Shaq Lawson.

I see a mix of Strahan, Reggie White, and Nikita Whitlock in him.
Well  
mrvax : 4/20/2016 9:49 pm : link
Jay Bromley is supposed to be what Marvin Austin never was at DT. We know that Owamagbe Odighizuwa is a very good DE against the run but we have no idea how he is rushing the passer. We need to find put this year.

They haven't been ignoring the pass rush. Hopefully the 2 guys I mentioned pan out. If the Giants draft Floyd, I think the pass rush becomes a legit threat. Reese probably has a woody for the guy.

I hated it last year when QBs had a LOT of time back there. It seemed like the Giants were only rushing 2.
RE: Gil Bradt  
mrvax : 4/20/2016 9:50 pm : link
In comment 12912866 area junc said:
Quote:
says Nkemdiche has Warren Sapp-like ability


Huh. Big fat mouth? Constantly elected to the pro bowl years after he retired? J/K :>)
ability.  
area junc : 4/20/2016 9:51 pm : link
not personality
Ogbah  
Glover : 4/20/2016 9:52 pm : link
over Kafusi in the second. Would not be mad if they took Nkemdiche.
Giants need a real run on QBs in the top 10 to hopefully get Buckner. Highly unlikely, but not impossible.
Would rather take Hargreaves than a T.
Take T in the second.
So many needs. Jerry needs a little luck this draft, cuz his skill aint getting it done as far as drafting depth goes.
DE, CB, S, WR, T, LB, DT, G, did I forget anything?
RB, TE they have already but can always upgrade. Maybe in the first if Elliott falls, but I think it's more likely Buckner falls than Elliott does.
RE: Well  
LauderdaleMatty : 4/20/2016 9:58 pm : link
In comment 12912873 mrvax said:
Quote:
Jay Bromley is supposed to be what Marvin Austin never was at DT. We know that Owamagbe Odighizuwa is a very good DE against the run but we have no idea how he is rushing the passer. We need to find put this year.

They haven't been ignoring the pass rush. Hopefully the 2 guys I mentioned pan out. If the Giants draft Floyd, I think the pass rush becomes a legit threat. Reese probably has a woody for the guy.

I hated it last year when QBs had a LOT of time back there. It seemed like the Giants were only rushing 2.


Bromley has show absolutely nothing to indicate he's anything near a starter. He's depth since he's a 3rd round pick. Super deep draft at DT and Hankins is going to want to get paid. Wonder if they grab a DT but Bromley hasn't shown he's on a path to be a starter. And w Harrison signed now w Hankins this he's not getting a ton of snaps IMO
RE: ability.  
mrvax : 4/20/2016 9:58 pm : link
In comment 12912880 area junc said:
Quote:
not personality


Just looking at Nkemdiche'd highlight reel I can see why he'd be perfect for the Giants. Huge powerful man. 300lbs and moves like a tiger. He can hit people like a freight train. I'd really like to draft him too.

I hope we get Nkemdiche, Floyd, Jack & Elliott this year. Be a great draft.
Giants pass rushers are DE's  
Giants2012 : 4/20/2016 10:01 pm : link
and they could be one away from overwhelming opponents again. No idea if this tall drink of water hybrid/whatever from GA is the answer.
RE: RE: Well  
mrvax : 4/20/2016 10:02 pm : link
In comment 12912886 LauderdaleMatty said:
Quote:

Bromley has show absolutely nothing to indicate he's anything near a starter. He's depth since he's a 3rd round pick. Super deep draft at DT and Hankins is going to want to get paid. Wonder if they grab a DT but Bromley hasn't shown he's on a path to be a starter. And w Harrison signed now w Hankins this he's not getting a ton of snaps IMO


I agree. If Bromley improves in practice, maybe he can be in on 3rd downs. Hard to believe the Giants had to have their FB play DT on 3rd down last year.
If pass rushers are so critically important  
Reb8thVA : 4/20/2016 10:23 pm : link
In football wouldn't the flip side--build an effective OL to negate your opponents pass rush-- be equally true?
RE: If pass rushers are so critically important  
Giants2012 : 4/20/2016 10:41 pm : link
In comment 12912927 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
In football wouldn't the flip side--build an effective OL to negate your opponents pass rush-- be equally true?


Isn't the game won or lost on the LOS?
Vernon according to PFF  
blueblood : 4/20/2016 11:26 pm : link
led the league in QB hurries last year.. dont just look at the sack numbers.. Its about pressure.. not just sacks..
RE: If pass rushers are so critically important  
blueblood : 4/20/2016 11:27 pm : link
In comment 12912927 Reb8thVA said:
Quote:
In football wouldn't the flip side--build an effective OL to negate your opponents pass rush-- be equally true?


Not just an effective OL.. you actually need to get rid of the ball.. you cant block people forever
Our offense is designed to get rid of the ball quickly  
Coach Mason : 4/21/2016 1:18 am : link
And to pick our spots on the downfield shots.

Also Eli while not fleet of foot, is very good in sensing pressure and stepping up in the pocket and/or getting rid of the ball w/o taking a sack.

wait does this imply that cows don't usually come home  
chris r : 4/21/2016 1:56 am : link
and therefore there are millions of feral cattle out there?
The 'cows' quote was Accorsi.  
Big Blue Blogger : 4/21/2016 4:21 am : link
Quote:
...Accorsi did what legendary personnel man Joe Thomas taught him. He took the pass rusher.

"Joe's whole thing was you have get the quarterback -- and the right quarterback, not just the one that's available in a given year -- and you have to protect him," Accorsi said on Thursday night.

"And then you draft pass rushers until the cows come home."

The other quote might have been Reese; Google can't find it.
Accorsi on cows, pass-rushers, and Joe Thomas. - ( New Window )
The 'cows' quote was Accorsi.  
Big Blue Blogger : 4/21/2016 4:43 am : link
Quote:
...Accorsi did what legendary personnel man Joe Thomas taught him. He took the pass rusher.

"Joe's whole thing was you have get the quarterback -- and the right quarterback, not just the one that's available in a given year -- and you have to protect him," Accorsi said on Thursday night.

"And then you draft pass rushers until the cows come home."

Google can't find the other quote, which suggests that it's not actually a quote.

Anyway, since becoming GM, Jerry Reese has made 18 selections in the first and second rounds of the draft. Exactly one of them was a DE. That's a remarkably low number, considering:
1) The team that runs a 4-3 base D;
2) They've had to replace all of the good DEs Reese inherited;
3) They didn't need a QB.

I guess you could count Sintim and maybe Austin as pass-rusher picks. But it's not as though Reese has obsessively drafted edge rushers since becoming GM.
Accorsi on cows, pass-rushers, and Joe Thomas. - ( New Window )
I agree to a point  
Mike B from JC : 4/21/2016 6:59 am : link
Coach. They have to throw a cb and fs, in there somewhere. Also a wr would be nice.
I like Nkemdiche  
Randy in CT : 4/21/2016 6:59 am : link
a lot. If his mental checks out you decide where to take him and it could be higher than expected. Rather have him than Floyd, for example.
Pass rusher  
joeinpa : 4/21/2016 7:06 am : link
Would be my choice
RE: Vernon according to PFF  
Simms11 : 4/21/2016 8:32 am : link
In comment 12913039 blueblood said:
Quote:
led the league in QB hurries last year.. dont just look at the sack numbers.. Its about pressure.. not just sacks..


JPP also had a lot of pressures when he returned and I think the two of them together could form a formidable duo, we'll see, but adding another pass rusher to the mix would give the Giants the 3rd pass rusher that they like to rotate in to provide that dominant rush. I'm all for adding another Edge Rusher in one of the first two rounds.
If  
ryanmkeane : 4/21/2016 8:51 am : link
Nkemdiche is still there at 40, I think you take him. No chance at 10 though.
RE: I agree to a point  
Coach Mason : 4/21/2016 9:55 am : link
In comment 12913142 Mike B from JC said:
Quote:
Coach. They have to throw a cb and fs, in there somewhere. Also a wr would be nice.


Agreed and if VHIII is the top rated guy there ,according to the asshats and the reporters with inside info, there likely go there in rd 1. But Floyd may even be above him from what we've heard.

You can never say anything in absolute, but knowing this organization, I would expect a pass rusher in the first 2 rounds unless the draft really falls in a way that would strongly dictate otherwise.
RE: If  
Coach Mason : 4/21/2016 9:56 am : link
In comment 12913255 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
Nkemdiche is still there at 40, I think you take him. No chance at 10 though.


No way at 10. But we did bring him in and have shown a past willingness to gamble a little more in round 2 for an elite talent.
think people  
area junc : 4/21/2016 10:08 am : link
are sleeping big time on how good a D-Line we already have. Vernon may not've had sack numbers but he is very disruptive and has a trifecta of rushes - speed rush + bull rush + an inside spin - to make him a complete rusher.
Then you've got JPP on the other side.

If we could add a "Warren Sapp-like" beast up the middle (Nkemdiche) we could be back to having the most feared D-Line in the league. what a dramatic turnaround that would be after the last 3 years

the Giants drafted a pass rusher last year  
djm : 4/21/2016 10:37 am : link
round 3 they took Odi. Over the last two years they have only drafted the one in Odi and they took the DT, Bromley in 2014.

One third rounder devoted to the pass rusher position over the last 2 years. They took Moore in round 3 back in 2013. No one in 2012. Austin 2011....the last real pass rusher the Giants got pumped for was Jpp if you really think about it. It's been a while...they are due to strike early.
I don't think the Giants care one way or the other  
djm : 4/21/2016 10:39 am : link
if the DL they can draft is a DT that can disrupt or the DE that can get after the QB they won't discriminate. Giants love both because both can kill QBs. You'd have to bet that if that highly rated DL is there at 10 the Giants would be hard pressed to pass on that.
RE: think people  
Coach Mason : 4/21/2016 11:17 am : link
In comment 12913411 area junc said:
Quote:
are sleeping big time on how good a D-Line we already have. Vernon may not've had sack numbers but he is very disruptive and has a trifecta of rushes - speed rush + bull rush + an inside spin - to make him a complete rusher.
Then you've got JPP on the other side.

If we could add a "Warren Sapp-like" beast up the middle (Nkemdiche) we could be back to having the most feared D-Line in the league. what a dramatic turnaround that would be after the last 3 years


You could be right. But we had something special with the combinations of Tuck,Umenyiora, Strahan and Robbins over the last decade. Those lines for years we always had 2 or 3 elite pass rush guys.

Does Vernon , a healing JPP with Hank and Snacks come close to that type of pass rush talent? Possible, but alot has to fall the right way.

If we add Floyd who could finally be that elite pass rush guy from the LB level (and possibly off the line on obvious passing downs) it could be a big equalizer in having a really dynamic pass rush like we've had in years past.

Nkemdiche has sky high talent but I worry about his heart for the game. We all get ga-ga over the potential but guys like that bust more often than make it.
This is a pretty good conversation...  
Big Blue Blogger : 4/21/2016 12:37 pm : link
...considering the prevalence of posters debating themselves under multiple handles, plus a thread starter comprised of quotes from Jerry Reese that were really uttered by Ernie Accorsi, or by nobody at all.

One thing to remember about Nkemdiche is that at least half the league has met with him. That's because he's a kid you wouldn't touch with a ten-foot pole unless you had performed thorough diligence. The Giants' interest may be serious, or it may not. I also wonder whether the failed gambles on Marvin Austin and Damontre Moore, plus the rollercoaster ride they have taken with Jason Pierre-Paul, might steer them toward safer options.

Or maybe, in a lean year for pass-rushers, the value simply won't be there. Personally, I think that's the most likely scenario - more likely IMV than the Giants ignoring Kaufusi's age, Ogbah's stiffness or Nkemdiche's eccentricities.

If he's there?  
Mike B from JC : 4/21/2016 2:09 pm : link
I think it will be Floyd, 2 nd Rd pick best wr or fs, depending on who is BPA. 3rd Rd wr or fs whichever is not picked in rd 2. After that oline,de,cb.we can only speculate? Many needs its whomever the giants think is a higher priority?
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