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Graziano: "Floyd Is The Defensive Player The Giants Crave"

Jon in NYC : 4/23/2016 9:28 am
Quote:
Georgia's Floyd is the defensive player the Giants crave, and they're just hoping the 49ers, Browns or Bucs don't snake him away before they can snag him. If they did, they likely could console themselves with Florida cornerback Vernon Hargreaves (whom they'd have to consider taking anyway if he and Floyd were both there). But they've spent a good amount of time imagining Floyd all over their blitz packages, and they'd like to pick him.

Link - ( New Window )
Floyd or Hargreaves  
jeff57 : 4/23/2016 9:29 am : link
I've been saying that for a couple of weeks.
Whatever his warts,  
Big Blue '56 : 4/23/2016 9:31 am : link
if he can be used by Spags to whatever his playmaking strengths are, he should be taken by us..We need playmakers who actually cause some concern for DCs. Who might actually make that key 3rd down play
What's the knock on him  
Joey from GlenCove : 4/23/2016 9:33 am : link
People on this site don't seem to like him. I've seen him mocked as high as 5

Why?
RE: What's the knock on him  
Jon in NYC : 4/23/2016 9:33 am : link
In comment 12917099 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
People on this site don't seem to like him. I've seen him mocked as high as 5

Why?


They get Clint Sintim flashbacks.
One of the first things Spags mentioned to the team  
Coach Mason : 4/23/2016 9:39 am : link
When he came on board is something along the lines of he wanted 'to bring the heat from everywhere'. Giants likely want to give Spags the weapons to execute his vision for the team. Last year's pass rush was abysmal and quite un-Giant like over the last decade. I think they want to reestablish the pass rush first and foremost and are salivating at the dynamic a guy like Floyd could add.

If Floyd is there I think we are taking him over a tradedown or anything else.
Jon  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 4/23/2016 9:40 am : link
I keep seeing the Sintim comparison...those two players are NOTHING alike.

The knock on Floyd is lack of physicality.

But he's a freak of an athlete. I can't recall a player built like him who moves like him.
RE: What's the knock on him  
Randy in CT : 4/23/2016 9:40 am : link
In comment 12917099 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
People on this site don't seem to like him. I've seen him mocked as high as 5

Why?
Watch his highlights. They look like low lights except for some speed rushes. His age speaks to him being done growing but he's light in the pants.
*compared to the last decade  
Coach Mason : 4/23/2016 9:41 am : link
...
I don't think he'll ever be a violent player  
Coach Mason : 4/23/2016 9:45 am : link
But he adds a very unique speed,blitz and cover dimension from the LB level.

In today's NFL thats extremely valuable if utilized correctly .
RE: Jon  
Jon in NYC : 4/23/2016 9:45 am : link
In comment 12917115 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
I keep seeing the Sintim comparison...those two players are NOTHING alike.

The knock on Floyd is lack of physicality.

But he's a freak of an athlete. I can't recall a player built like him who moves like him.


I'm with you. He has incredible range, the ability to blanket RBs and TEs, and is possibly the best pure pass rusher in the draft.

I'd be more excited if he was turning 21 instead of 24, but that doesn't seem to bother JR at all.
It isn't just the teams in front of the Giants  
robbieballs2003 : 4/23/2016 9:51 am : link
Supposedly Chicago really likes him too. They could jump up to 9 and take him. So, really there are 4 teams that could take him over us.
Turning 24  
Phil in LA : 4/23/2016 9:54 am : link
can't tackle, can't use his hands and arms keep blockers off of him. Overruns plays too often. If he doesn't win with speed, he doesn't win.
So the hope here is  
The_Boss : 4/23/2016 9:55 am : link
For all the Floyd detractors, and I am very much one of them, is for someone else to get duped into drafting Floyd. I'm of the belief that our 2 of our first 3 picks should include an OL and a WR. This is a deep defensive draft in the front 7. If JR is a good GM, he should be able to get an edge rusher in the 2nd or 3rd round. I don't think you can say that for OL, at least not at OT.
RE: So the hope here is  
robbieballs2003 : 4/23/2016 9:59 am : link
In comment 12917139 The_Boss said:
Quote:
For all the Floyd detractors, and I am very much one of them, is for someone else to get duped into drafting Floyd. I'm of the belief that our 2 of our first 3 picks should include an OL and a WR. This is a deep defensive draft in the front 7. If JR is a good GM, he should be able to get an edge rusher in the 2nd or 3rd round. I don't think you can say that for OL, at least not at OT.


Are you serious? This draft is severely lacking in pass rushers. Please provide names if you are gonna make a statement like that.
RE: What's the knock on him  
JohnVB : 4/23/2016 9:59 am : link
In comment 12917099 Joey from GlenCove said:
Quote:
People on this site don't seem to like him. I've seen him mocked as high as 5

Why?


Because he tackles like a weak CB. Lacks physicality. Too much of a tweener in Spags system.

He definitely has athleticism but so do the NFL players he'd be facing on Sunday's.
I definitely don't want  
Mike B from JC : 4/23/2016 10:05 am : link
2 offensive players in the first 3 picks. A wr yes, oline no. The giants still need defense, even after all the money spent. Olb,fs and cb are big needs. Those were the biggest issues last year.
The blanket RBs and TEs  
Glover : 4/23/2016 10:08 am : link
is pretty big. Fast on blitz, also big, but not a staple of Spags defense. I think more of a mix of corner and LB blitzes and not regularly sending this guy as a pass rusher. So, he has a hard time taking on/shedding blocks, but he is good in coverage and rushing the passer.
sounds like a nickel LB, but is he worth anything vs. the run in the NFL?
RE: RE: So the hope here is  
The_Boss : 4/23/2016 10:09 am : link
In comment 12917143 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 12917139 The_Boss said:


Quote:


For all the Floyd detractors, and I am very much one of them, is for someone else to get duped into drafting Floyd. I'm of the belief that our 2 of our first 3 picks should include an OL and a WR. This is a deep defensive draft in the front 7. If JR is a good GM, he should be able to get an edge rusher in the 2nd or 3rd round. I don't think you can say that for OL, at least not at OT.



Are you serious? This draft is severely lacking in pass rushers. Please provide names if you are gonna make a statement like that.


There will an opportunity at 40 to get an edge rusher, be it at LB or DE. Check out any draft site's value board and see what should be there after #30. That being said, I think it's a moot point as Reese is gonna draft Floyd, unfortunately
Just because there are OLBs or DEs available in the 2nd or 3rd  
robbieballs2003 : 4/23/2016 10:15 am : link
Doesn't make them valuable pass rushers. There is a reason that Noah Spence is talked about as a first round talent and that reason is there is a lack of pass rushers in this draft. Dodd, Lawson, and Ogbah are DEs but that doesn't mean they are "pass rushers". They are either more complete DEs (nothing wrong with that) or more run stoppers, but not necessarily are they guys that are going to have an offense change their protection schemes. To me, that is what a pass rusher is. If a team has to scheme to block you then you are having an impact on the game even if you don't get to the QB. I am not saying Floyd is that guy or not. That is the Giants job to do that. I am just saying there are very few players like that in this draft.
We're hearing so much about Floyd through the media -  
Ira : 4/23/2016 10:15 am : link
specifically Raanan and Graziano that I'm starting to wonder if the Giants are setting a smokescreen and they really want to go in a different direction.
RE: We're hearing so much about Floyd through the media -  
The_Boss : 4/23/2016 10:19 am : link
In comment 12917160 Ira said:
Quote:
specifically Raanan and Graziano that I'm starting to wonder if the Giants are setting a smokescreen and they really want to go in a different direction.


We can only hope. This "Floyd to the NYG" stuff is almost at the level of Accorsi's infatuation with Jeremy Shockey.
I agree. I dont think the Giants are much of a smokescreen team  
robbieballs2003 : 4/23/2016 10:21 am : link
But the nonstop talk about Floyd is worrisome if it is true. Why is it constantly being leaked?
As much as I yell that Giants need to draft LBs  
Jimmy Googs : 4/23/2016 10:21 am : link
Floyd would not be my choice.

Not physical-enough at point of attack to hold up in NFL.
If the Giants draft Floyd  
Andy in Boston : 4/23/2016 10:29 am : link
I would I'm imagine his future could be at DE as he gains weight and gets stronger? Maybe JPP's successor as I'm guessing JPP may not be affordable given the other contracts.
The Giants  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 4/23/2016 10:30 am : link
are paying a lot of attention to Treadwell, perhaps even more than Floyd yet nobody is taking it seriously.

The same happened with Flowers last year; he was a "reach", and not many felt he was a real target until just before the draft.

From the outside it looks like Floyd and Treadwell to me.
RE: RE: What's the knock on him  
Giants2012 : 4/23/2016 10:40 am : link
In comment 12917104 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
In comment 12917099 Joey from GlenCove said:


Quote:


People on this site don't seem to like him. I've seen him mocked as high as 5

Why?



They get Clint Sintim flashbacks.


and a 6'6 string bean version of him too.
you know an OT as a consolation might not be such a bad thing  
gtt350 : 4/23/2016 10:45 am : link
.
Phil in L.A.  
Marty866b : 4/23/2016 10:45 am : link
With the most accurate scouting report of Floyd.
Floyd  
Dragon : 4/23/2016 10:49 am : link
Is finished he will not get much bigger and for sure he lacks strength he would not even lift what does that say? He has nice length but lacks the real physical or destructive nature required to invest a top ten pick he is an athlete much more than a football player. The talk about him being a great edge rusher is just that where are the sack numbers to prove that statement?
Floyd and his toothpick ballerina legs at 24 is a no no  
xman : 4/23/2016 10:53 am : link
Treadway might be the best of a sad sack year for the group of receivers . So its either MYles if the knee scares off teams but not the Giants or some OL DL personel.

Even if Myles is all that they say I still question whether the LB adverse GMen would take him. Safest bet is one of those DL or OL guys.

Don't need a runner in the 1st round like ron Dayne or Wilson.Find them late.

Last time Giants took a DT in the !st round was in the 80's. @nd round is usually when they draft DT

No DE worth taking at 10 will fall to the GMen unless one thinks Lawson is their guy which hopefully he's not

I'm more interested in what scouts, like Sy think  
Big Blue '56 : 4/23/2016 10:57 am : link
In part:


Quote:


The tools here are obvious. You can make the argument that Floyd has a rare combination of skills and tools. I don’t think he is simply an edge rusher at all. As a matter off fact I think he would be best off in a 4-3 SAM role. This can flip his hips and cover with the best TEs in the game right now. For teams looking for a LB that can match up with the big, athletic pass catchers, Floyd can be there man. Throw in what he is capable of doing off the edge as a blitzer and you can understand why a lot of teams have top 15 grades on him.

Floyd has been getting a TON of attention over the past few months. He wasn’t exactly a stand out producer in college but the potential here is through the roof if he can bulk up a bit and increase his power presence. I still think Floyd will be the NYG pick at #10 overall. They’ve tried filling the hybrid LB/DE role multiple times over the years and it hasn’t worked yet. Floyd has more talent than all of them.


I can't keep retyping the same thing so  
sjnyfan : 4/23/2016 10:58 am : link
Quote:
Huge risk
sjnyfan : 3/22/2016 3:09 pm : link
In fact it should be a flat out no. He's not a 4-3 player, not on the line or at LB. This isn't Von Miller or Anthony Barr. He's a 3-4 rush LB with height and straight line speed. He won't hold up against the run at his weight against NFL lineman and he doesn't have the quickness to cover. His ability to bend around the edge is overrated to me. He had 4.5 sacks last year with 1 in his last 5 games. Nearly half (5 out of 10.5) of his TFL's came against La.-Monroe, Southern U and Georgia Southern. He reminds me way too much of Barkevious Mingo who went 6th in the draft in '13 and has a total of 7 sacks in the 3 seasons.


Not to mention he hasn't lifted yet
I go back & forth on Floyd, but those saying there's "nobody like him"  
Eric on Li : 4/23/2016 10:58 am : link
are peddling nonsense. He's a rare athlete but there have been guys like him who have both succeeded and failed. The reason for worry over Floyd is that many of the comparisons people have drawn to him who had successful pro careers had collegiate production that much higher and more commensurate with their rare talents (Anthony Barr, Demarcus Ware, Julian Peterson, Jason Taylor). Each of those guys had the "string bean" body type, rare first step quickness, and weighed in at 250 pounds or less at the combine. They also each had single seasons that matched Floyd's career production of 15 sacks and 20 TFL seasons.

On the other hand most recently Dion Jordan was almost a doppelganger from both an athletic/production standpoint and he's been a total bust. Is production the ultimate telltale sign of whether a guy pans out or busts? Probably not but it's a very fair criticism of Leonard Floyd's overall resume (and likely why people like Mayock are having a hard time evaluating him despite seeing the obvious upside). Last year 2 players were very similar to Floyd athletically and they went in the 2nd and 3rd round respectively - Eli Harold and Danielle Hunter (who actually looked like a stud last year). I'd love to add Floyd to this roster but picking him at #10 seems very risky.
And taking Hargreaves the midget  
xman : 4/23/2016 10:59 am : link
who lacks top end speed is a no no. As badly as the Giants need a CB hes not it. .

No Treadwell No Floyd no Hargreaves
I think that all  
mavric : 4/23/2016 11:13 am : link
the Giants rumors that have slipped out that they are enamored with Floyd is a complete smoke screen and nothing more. He's a high risk player that could be great or could be nothing more than an athletic phenomenon who can't play at the NFL level. The Giants rarely roll the dice on risk/reward player early in the draft. And of course, Reese is in the hot seat and I doubt he is willing to bet his career and future on a coin flip.

The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.

It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.
Carl Banks  
Hot Rod in Florida : 4/23/2016 11:14 am : link
was 6 ft 4 and 235 lbs. If not for LT, he would have garnered a lot more praise and consideration for one of the Giant's best LBs. I think Floyd could be that type.
Floyd can take a college QB down without major effort.  
Emlen'sGremlins : 4/23/2016 11:17 am : link
Can you imagine what would happen if he tries to take down someone like Cam Newton? LOL!

If Floyd was a boxer he would be called s "slapper". He couldn't crack an egg on a sidewalk.
"can't"  
Emlen'sGremlins : 4/23/2016 11:17 am : link
.
RE: I think that all  
Coach Mason : 4/23/2016 11:21 am : link
In comment 12917226 mavric said:
Quote:
the Giants rumors that have slipped out that they are enamored with Floyd is a complete smoke screen and nothing more. He's a high risk player that could be great or could be nothing more than an athletic phenomenon who can't play at the NFL level. The Giants rarely roll the dice on risk/reward player early in the draft. And of course, Reese is in the hot seat and I doubt he is willing to bet his career and future on a coin flip.

The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.

It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.


That's would go against all the patterns we've seen under Reese to date. The interest seems very real.
RE: Floyd can take a college QB down without major effort.  
Coach Mason : 4/23/2016 11:22 am : link
In comment 12917231 Emlen'sGremlins said:
Quote:
Can you imagine what would happen if he tries to take down someone like Cam Newton? LOL!

If Floyd was a boxer he would be called s "slapper". He couldn't crack an egg on a sidewalk.


The arm tackling may have been a result of dealing with nagging shoulder injuries.
no wonder the defense is so terrible  
BigBlueCane : 4/23/2016 11:25 am : link
the Giants fall in love with some of the worst possible players to man it.

Hargreaves is a football player and tough SOB. Floyd is a softy who looks good in shorts and drills.

Naturally this braintrust prefers the latter and then wonders why they keep having injuries and losing seasons.
RE: I'm more interested in what scouts, like Sy think  
Stan in LA : 4/23/2016 11:26 am : link
Yup.

In comment 12917204 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
In part:




Quote:




The tools here are obvious. You can make the argument that Floyd has a rare combination of skills and tools. I don’t think he is simply an edge rusher at all. As a matter off fact I think he would be best off in a 4-3 SAM role. This can flip his hips and cover with the best TEs in the game right now. For teams looking for a LB that can match up with the big, athletic pass catchers, Floyd can be there man. Throw in what he is capable of doing off the edge as a blitzer and you can understand why a lot of teams have top 15 grades on him.

Floyd has been getting a TON of attention over the past few months. He wasn’t exactly a stand out producer in college but the potential here is through the roof if he can bulk up a bit and increase his power presence. I still think Floyd will be the NYG pick at #10 overall. They’ve tried filling the hybrid LB/DE role multiple times over the years and it hasn’t worked yet. Floyd has more talent than all of them.



Floyd  
geemanfan : 4/23/2016 11:38 am : link
To me is Kiwi part 2.
RE: I think that all  
M.S. : 4/23/2016 11:47 am : link
In comment 12917226 mavric said:
Quote:
the Giants rumors that have slipped out that they are enamored with Floyd is a complete smoke screen and nothing more. He's a high risk player that could be great or could be nothing more than an athletic phenomenon who can't play at the NFL level. The Giants rarely roll the dice on risk/reward player early in the draft. And of course, Reese is in the hot seat and I doubt he is willing to bet his career and future on a coin flip.

The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.

It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.



******************************************************************************************************************

I tend to agree!

I think the Floyd talk has been a smoke screen as well as all of the chirping about Flowers as the permanent Left Tackle.

I think -- given the players "expected" to be available at 10, Reese will want to select Stanley or -- if he's not there -- Conklin.
RE: Phil in L.A.  
AP in Halfmoon : 4/23/2016 11:51 am : link
In comment 12917187 Marty866b said:
Quote:
With the most accurate scouting report of Floyd.


I don't think you know the meaning of accurate
Please not Floyd!  
dg901 : 4/23/2016 11:54 am : link
To me, Floyd is a toothpick waiting to be broken. I can't imagine him as a top 10 pick or a day 1 starter. This analysis clearly doesn't indicate he is wothy of #10, too risky.
Has the requisite burst to surge past tackles as a speed rusher with underrated strength. He is surprisingly powerful at the point of attack, flashing dynamite in his hands with an effective hand slap to knock away blockers attempting to gain control.

His first-step burst and acceleration get him into the backfield quickly off the edge or knifing inside. Excellent movement skills for his tall, lengthy frame. Relentless nature and speed to collapse the pocket or chase down plays from behind. Because of his agility and closing speed, could move to a more traditional linebacker.
The two major knocks on Floyd are weight and durability. Has lean bone structure with twig limbs, thin torso and scouts have concerns about how much weight he can add - looks like A.J. Green in his Georgia uniform, which isn't a positive comparison for a pass rusher. Below-average functional strength.

Struggles to generate movement at the point of attack or convert speed to power. Too easily controlled on the edges. Can be eliminated by blockers when he doesn't effectively use his length. Compares to Barkevious Mingo, Cleveland Browns.
Mingo  
Big Rick in FL : 4/23/2016 11:57 am : link
No he doesn't compare at all to Mingo. Mingo played mostly DE in college & moved to LB in the NFL. Mingo doesn't have anywhere near the movement that Floyd has.


Please stop comparing him to Mingo, Dion Jordan & Manny Lawson. They aren't similar at all.

If anything his NFL comparison would be a Jamie Collins.
Also please stop  
Big Rick in FL : 4/23/2016 12:04 pm : link
Acting like he isn't going to get stronger in an NFL weight training program. That's just stupid. Every year the weakness for many top NFL LBs are that they aren't strong enough & can't disengage from blockers.

The tape you are watching is of a guy who played between 222-228. Floyd is now 248 pounds. It isn't fat that he gained. It's muscle. I'm sure he is much stronger now then what he was in college.
Speed KILLS.....  
Simms11 : 4/23/2016 12:10 pm : link
If he can bend and the OT can't get a hand on him, he'll be successful. His lack of physicality could be troublesome at times, but I think his speed will help him immensely in this league.
Bucs are  
muhajir : 4/23/2016 12:10 pm : link
waiting to figure out who we want so they can take him. "We got word that the Giants were planning to take him with the very next pick so we were glad to get him..'
You guys miss the point on Floyd.  
Dave on the UWS : 4/23/2016 12:14 pm : link
I'm not a fan either but I don't think they see him JUST as a LB. they see him as a rover that has to be accounted for at all times As a playmaker a difference maker. If utilized that way I can see him as the pick. If not it will cost Reese his job. Big gamble
Physically (size and movement)  
KWALL2 : 4/23/2016 12:40 pm : link
There are a lot of similarities to Dion Jordan (although Floyd is a better mover). But Jordan's failure in the NFL has nothing to do with talent. He showed up injured in year one. Then decided to smoke weed and get suspended several times. He's a bum.

Floyd is a hard worker who really likes football. HUGE difference between the prospects.

Jordan failure as an NFL prospect should have no impact on how you view Floyd.

Floyd is a low risk pick. The pass rush skills are legit. It will work in the NFL and it will add instant value to any team.
The 10th pick shouldn't be a mystery. It needs to be a sure thing.  
RDJR : 4/23/2016 12:47 pm : link
Floyd is far from a sure thing.
It's a sure thing his pass rush  
KWALL2 : 4/23/2016 12:48 pm : link
will help. That's enough. It's a low risk pick.
Understood on the pass rush, but shouldn't we expect  
RDJR : 4/23/2016 12:53 pm : link
more than a one dimensional player at 10. Damontre Moore could rush the passer.
RE: It's a sure thing his pass rush  
gidiefor : Mod : 4/23/2016 12:55 pm : link
In comment 12917326 KWALL2 said:
Quote:
will help. That's enough. It's a low risk pick.


KWALL - you know who I see in Floyd -- I see an upgraded Osi Umenyiora - more intelligent, more agile, and speedier
Moore  
KWALL2 : 4/23/2016 12:58 pm : link
wasn't a very good pass rusher. He was just a guy. Floyd can play DE and explode around the edge on a level Moore couldn't touch. And hes good at taking the OT back inside too.

Then...you can also move him around. Stand up outside next to JPP or Vernon. Stunts inside. Blitz from all over and get to the QB much faster than Moore in this role.

I just don't see any risk with the player. At worst, he'll help you a lot with the pass rush. And you may have something special as a 3 down versatile player that you move all over.
Right gidie  
KWALL2 : 4/23/2016 12:59 pm : link
And he's also much better in space.

Another thing is the help he will bring vs mobile QBs. He will prevent big plays from these QBs and prevent the extended plays that have killed us.
I don't understand all of the "can't tackle" knocks.  
arcarsenal : 4/23/2016 1:02 pm : link
You don't get to the level he did if you're unable to tackle and you don't get talked about as a potential top 10 pick.

He's not a huge hitter but I think this stuff about not being able to tackle are overblown.
Please stop making excuses for guys like simtim  
djm : 4/23/2016 1:03 pm : link
Attributing his failures to lack of fit or poor scheme is just that, an excuse. Sintim didn't fail because of the bad fit. He failed because he wasn't a good football player.

Same allies to Floyd. The Giants know how to use players. How often does a guy leave the Giants and do better elsewhere? It nearly never happens and even a guy like Bennett didn't really improve at all.

If Floyd can play at the next he can play and the Giants will use him wisely. This is not a place where gifted pass rushers and defenders go to die. This is where they flourish.
I watch a lot of SEC football (live in Florida) and Floyd rarely  
RDJR : 4/23/2016 1:04 pm : link
jumped off the screen. He has the measureables, but football plays are what matters. If we pick him, I hope I'm wrong.
RE: Understood on the pass rush, but shouldn't we expect  
David in LA : 4/23/2016 1:07 pm : link
In comment 12917335 RDJR said:
Quote:
more than a one dimensional player at 10. Damontre Moore could rush the passer.


Explain how he's one dimensional. Every draft profile talks about his versatility and his ability to bring pass rush and provide coverage against TE's and RB's.
They aren't drafting  
Rflairr : 4/23/2016 1:24 pm : link
That old ass man
I see the Giants are going into another draft with Teams knowing  
ZogZerg : 4/23/2016 1:38 pm : link
who they want to draft with their first round pick. A lot of loose lips floating around the facility.
Not so sure  
ThatLimerickGuy : 4/23/2016 1:44 pm : link
The premise of this post is true.

I've heard some names but I am going to reach out to my source one more time on Tuesday to see what the story is and report back what I heard.

One of the things that I did hear through the grapevine is that other GM's started paying attention to which pro days Reese personally attended and that was a competitive advantage for them so this year the Floyd thing could be a big smokescreen.
RE: RE: We're hearing so much about Floyd through the media -  
AcidTest : 4/23/2016 1:48 pm : link
In comment 12917163 The_Boss said:
Quote:
In comment 12917160 Ira said:


Quote:


specifically Raanan and Graziano that I'm starting to wonder if the Giants are setting a smokescreen and they really want to go in a different direction.



We can only hope. This "Floyd to the NYG" stuff is almost at the level of Accorsi's infatuation with Jeremy Shockey.


Could be. I have said before that I am OK with Floyd because of his speed off the edge, and ability to cover. But I think we can do better. He won’t do well against the run, even in the open field. His age means that his frame may well be maxed out. So get bigger and stronger may not be possible for him, at least not without sacrificing his freakish athletic ability.
RE: Mingo  
sjnyfan : 4/23/2016 2:01 pm : link
In comment 12917278 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
No he doesn't compare at all to Mingo. Mingo played mostly DE in college & moved to LB in the NFL. Mingo doesn't have anywhere near the movement that Floyd has.


Please stop comparing him to Mingo, Dion Jordan & Manny Lawson. They aren't similar at all.

If anything his NFL comparison would be a Jamie Collins.


Big Rick I respect your analysis more than most here but I couldn't disagree more. Collins was a 210 lb freshman DB that grew into a LB. He outweighed Floyd at his combine and he's 2" shorter. He has way more explosion than Floyd which was evident when he broke the combine record for broad jump and he's stronger at the point of attack. And yet he still went at the end of the 2nd rd.

We're talking about Floyd at #10 and he has no consistency on tape that proves it. There are analysts that give Kevin Dodd, who will also be 24 at the start of the season a 2nd rd grade. They say his 5 TFL performance against Alabama was overrated because he did it against their weak link at RT. Leonard Floyd went up against the same guy and had zero. In fact he had less total tackles (2 solo, 2 assisted) than Dodd's TFLs and those were chase tackles if I recall. I'll argue with anyone here to look at both Floyd and Dodd against Alabama and still come back to me and say Floyd is the better player. But that's the guy we take at 10 and Dodd possibly reaches 40? A guy who nearly matched Floyd's career production in one season, weighs 40 pounds more and almost as quick at the snap? I am blown away at this love affair with a guy that didn't produce. You show me one positive play by Floyd and I can point to ten negative ones. That's not a player you take at 10 overall.

If you want a wiry, tall edge rusher go with Alex McCallister from Florida. Nearly the same dimensions in height and weight but he was more productive in the same conference. McCallister had more sacks and one less TFL and did so in 4 less games than Floyd. We can get him on Day 3. Admittedly part of that was character concerns but he was never rated as high as Floyd. He never had the same TV analyst love.
Can hardly wait  
mrvax : 4/23/2016 2:18 pm : link
to see what teams will try to do with Floyd, JPP and Vernon all headed for the passer at the same time. Who to double? Who to chip?
RE: I see the Giants are going into another draft with Teams knowing  
David in LA : 4/23/2016 2:21 pm : link
In comment 12917380 ZogZerg said:
Quote:
who they want to draft with their first round pick. A lot of loose lips floating around the facility.


The year we took David Wilson, I believe he did not meet with any of the brass once. He had no idea we were going to take him.
RE: We're hearing so much about Floyd through the media -  
Vanzetti : 4/23/2016 2:29 pm : link
In comment 12917160 Ira said:
Quote:
specifically Raanan and Graziano that I'm starting to wonder if the Giants are setting a smokescreen and they really want to go in a different direction.


I know. You would think that. But they have completely telegraphed first round picks in the past. So, I think it is Floyd
RE: The Giants  
Vanzetti : 4/23/2016 2:30 pm : link
In comment 12917172 LakeGeorgeGiant said:
Quote:
are paying a lot of attention to Treadwell, perhaps even more than Floyd yet nobody is taking it seriously.

The same happened with Flowers last year; he was a "reach", and not many felt he was a real target until just before the draft.

From the outside it looks like Floyd and Treadwell to me.


Tread well in a trade up like they did with Collins. I could see that. But I don't think Treadwell is the pick at 10
I love how  
Peppers : 4/23/2016 2:34 pm : link
the Floyd detractors continuously compare Floyd to Jordan and think they're making a great case for why we shouldn't draft him.

Jordan is a knucklehead.


'Floyd Is The Defensive Player The Giants Crave'...  
Torrag : 4/23/2016 2:40 pm : link
...if true it's a risky choice. The upside is an impact edge rushing OLB that can cover TE's and RB's when asked too. The risk comes into the equation when you watch his games and realize his 'floor' is a Barkevious Mingo type bust.

If we go the Floyd route JR better be right or he's going to be fired.

I'd take a player with maybe a little lower 'ceiling' that I was more comfortable with in terms of getting a fair return on investing the the #10 pick.
For all the talk about what an incredible pass rusher he is  
Greg from LI : 4/23/2016 2:43 pm : link
Where's the production? I get wary when guys have elite athleticism without elite production.
RE: Not so sure  
Vanzetti : 4/23/2016 2:57 pm : link
In comment 12917388 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
The premise of this post is true.

I've heard some names but I am going to reach out to my source one more time on Tuesday to see what the story is and report back what I heard.

One of the things that I did hear through the grapevine is that other GM's started paying attention to which pro days Reese personally attended and that was a competitive advantage for them so this year the Floyd thing could be a big smokescreen.


Or maybe they are trying to make Floyd like a smokescreen?
RE: For all the talk about what an incredible pass rusher he is  
bigbluehoya : 4/23/2016 3:03 pm : link
In comment 12917470 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
Where's the production? I get wary when guys have elite athleticism without elite production.


This.

The idea that Floyd is a plus pass-rusher is conjecture, and the people saying it the most seem to be the crowd that are determined to give two thumbs up to every move the organization makes. (Note that they've gotten louder as it has become more and more obvious that the Giants are likely to take Floyd).

Floyd has the POTENTIAL to be an effective pass rusher based on his speed, agility, jump. Without a significant increase in strength and ability to win contact, he's just as likely to be 10 yards deep in the backfield every time. Hence why many view him as too risky for #10.
Floyd wasn't used as a full time pass rusher  
BSIMatt : 4/23/2016 3:30 pm : link
His time was spread out over MLB, covering slot, and then lined up on the egde. His pass rush attempts were lower than a DE type, but his success rate when he did rush was higher than a guy like Bosa, who was rushing the passer 98-100% of the time. In other words, he was effective when used in that role, but his gross pass rushing productivity was lower because Georgia was using him in multiple roles.
I think Stephen White at SB Nation summed up Floyd perfectly:  
Klaatu : 4/23/2016 3:47 pm : link
"Jack of all trades, master of none."
RE: I think Stephen White at SB Nation summed up Floyd perfectly:  
mrvax : 4/23/2016 4:13 pm : link
In comment 12917568 Klaatu said:
Quote:
"Jack of all trades, master of none."


Not exactly a ringing endorsement for a 1st round pick here, Klaatu. If the Giants do pick him, they better have a plan...
This "doesn't hit hard"  
Modus Operandi : 4/23/2016 6:24 pm : link
Knock has now become so ridiculous, you have people who've never watched him play make ridiculous hyperbolic statements like, "couldn't an egg on a sidewalk.

Just stop it.
Is it a smoke screen  
David B. : 4/23/2016 6:33 pm : link
Or is it Ron Dayne, where everyone and their family knew he was the pick.

I'm hoping smoke, but the Giants don't really do smoke.

I'm also hoping it isn't as easy as just easy as mapping it to the one guy's pro day Reese shows up for.
RE: RE: I think that all  
Carson53 : 4/23/2016 6:33 pm : link
In comment 12917238 Coach Mason said:
Quote:
In comment 12917226 mavric said:


Quote:


the Giants rumors that have slipped out that they are enamored with Floyd is a complete smoke screen and nothing more. He's a high risk player that could be great or could be nothing more than an athletic phenomenon who can't play at the NFL level. The Giants rarely roll the dice on risk/reward player early in the draft. And of course, Reese is in the hot seat and I doubt he is willing to bet his career and future on a coin flip.

The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.

It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.



That's would go against all the patterns we've seen under Reese to date. The interest seems very real.


People like Graziano are good at taking the bait!
Other than Giant news, don't take his 'knowledge' that seriously to be honest. I also don't think he follows college ball that closely, just an educated guess.
"Where's the production?" This!  
KWALL2 : 4/23/2016 6:39 pm : link
It's been explained many times.

Production isn't about sacks. He consistently pressured the QB. That's production.

Read it again.

And again.
And one more thing  
KWALL2 : 4/23/2016 6:43 pm : link
Quote:
The idea that Floyd is a plus pass-rusher is conjecture


Or maybe some have watched him.

Or maybe that % of QB hits, pressure and sacks to pass rush attempts that ranks him very high has something to do with that crazy idea.
I know nothing about the player  
arniefez : 4/23/2016 6:56 pm : link
But I do know that the Giants have not done a good job keeping secrets about their first rounders. If the media is reporting the Giants love this guy. The Giants probably love this guy.
Is it just me, or does Graziano come out each day with a different  
PatersonPlank : 4/23/2016 7:24 pm : link
player the Giants want to get? I guess eventually he will list the top 15 and then say he was right.
Reece can't blow this pick  
Bluesbreaker : 4/23/2016 8:18 pm : link
If we take him fine ...
Not just the Physicality but I watched an Interview
Not sure what study course he could have passed .
If he holds (physically) up then he will be a a Wild Card
that teams will have to Plan 4
With a Healthy JPP Snacks Big Hank and Vernon
a Healthy Kennard .
Pass Rush make go from worst to first .
The Recent Cruz News has got me amped ..
AP in halfmoon  
Marty866b : 4/23/2016 10:08 pm : link
You know what an asshole looks like? Look in the mirror.
RE: And one more thing  
BSIMatt : 4/23/2016 10:45 pm : link
In comment 12917845 KWALL2 said:
Quote:


Quote:


The idea that Floyd is a plus pass-rusher is conjecture



Or maybe some have watched him.

Or maybe that % of QB hits, pressure and sacks to pass rush attempts that ranks him very high has something to do with that crazy idea.


Quote:
While his pressure totals suffered some because he dropped into coverage more than 40 percent of his snaps the past two seasons, he generated pressure on 17.8 percent of his pass rushes. By comparison, Joey Bosa, our top edge defender each of the last two years, generated pressure on 16.8 percent of his rushes the past two seasons


That is based on people who actually graded all his games. When he was asked to rush the passer, he was effective in doing so.
One trick pony?  
Marty866b : 4/23/2016 10:51 pm : link
Seems there a many scouting reports that say if Floyd doesn't beat his man with speed, he's done for the play. I realize that the Giants may pick this guy and I am trying to sell myself into believing he is the best pick for where they select but I can't get passed how frail he looks with such skinny legs. I guess we'll see next week and time will tell who has been right or wrong on this player. If the Giants select him, I will be ecstatic to eat some crow on this one.
I can see this happening, it's a Reese pick..  
prdave73 : 4/24/2016 12:41 am : link
I can see Reese picking this guy in the 1st especially since the LB position has been a need for awhile. Let's hope he doesn't go this route and continue with his bad history of drafts. Imo there are too many prospects at the 10th pick that are much better..
People need to understand this  
blueblood : 4/24/2016 12:51 am : link
You have to build a defensive scheme and a philosophy and then have players that help you to execute that. Its not just about the ONE player.. Its about how the players you assemble form a unit..

A great as LT was.. he is on record as saying that he could not have done the job he was allowed to do as a LB without Carl Banks on the other side.. Banks never had gaudy numbers and will NEVER make it to the Hall of Fame.. however he was extremely valuable and important to that defensive scheme..

So try and stop looking at what the individual players do alone and try to envision how that player will fit into the scheme and THEN try to envision how he will interact with the other players on the defense..

And then try to envision the various schemes that can be employed and then HOW that player can be utilized..
RE: I can see this happening, it's a Reese pick..  
blueblood : 4/24/2016 12:52 am : link
In comment 12918102 prdave73 said:
Quote:
I can see Reese picking this guy in the 1st especially since the LB position has been a need for awhile. Let's hope he doesn't go this route and continue with his bad history of drafts. Imo there are too many prospects at the 10th pick that are much better..


When we people just accept the fact that the Giants reach decisions by consensus and its not just a REESE pick.. Even after seeing an entire 4 part series giving you direct insight into HOW the Giants draft team works.. people STILL hold onto this with a death grip.
As a WILL  
chopperhatch : 4/24/2016 4:06 am : link
He is somewhat intriguing. But a lot of thethe guys on here calling him a spot rusher on 3rd and a SAM seem to not know what the position calls for.

The other thing...regarding his coverage. He has zero ball skills and zero awareness for when it's in the air. That's a problem when covering NFL TEs like Witten, Ertz and Reed. He will be right behind them, but they will get their first downs. They will probably shrug off their arm tackles.

People sluff off his lack of physicality, but in the NFL, their are some mean bastards looking to run through a LB and out the back. Their are Guards who will drive block Floyd like he's a cello, and drop him to the turf or block him thru the water table on the sideline. NFL teams can scheme toward a man like this.

Finally, he is not even that great a blitzer. He didn't have Von Miller numbers in college. They weren't horrible, but for the "best pass rusher in the draft", he certainly didn't do much. People keep bringing up his coaches scheme being bad having him at LB. What coach in their right mind would have their best pass rusher playing in a non pass rushing role? Makes no sense to me. I get the feeling they felt like he would break down going up against tackles all game. Also, what else can you teach a 23 y/o pass rusher?

That's why people, like myself, don't like him. I would rather Kevin Dodd at 10. I would rather we finish the line at 10 with a pick like Jack " I just wanna put my fist elbow deep up your butt Conklin". Hargreaves also makes me nervous because of his size, but I like him too. Floyd, I feel like people want us to have a Von Miller, Khalil Mack or a Clay Matthews. Those guys play a violent game. Floyd doesn't. Those guys are linebackers. Floyd is a small forward.
RE: Not so sure  
chopperhatch : 4/24/2016 4:11 am : link
In comment 12917388 ThatLimerickGuy said:
Quote:
The premise of this post is true.

I've heard some names but I am going to reach out to my source one more time on Tuesday to see what the story is and report back what I heard.

One of the things that I did hear through the grapevine is that other GM's started paying attention to which pro days Reese personally attended and that was a competitive advantage for them so this year the Floyd thing could be a big smokescreen.


TLG, thanks. The whole pro day thing is fishy to me. Weren't we a slam dunk for Zack Martin two years ago? There have been others in the past where all our signs pointed to X and we chose Y?
of course the usual suspects are defending  
chris r : 4/24/2016 6:04 am : link
this preemptively because it seems like the guy the Giants want. Heaven forbid you form your own opinion!
RE: Also please stop  
chris r : 4/24/2016 6:06 am : link
In comment 12917289 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
Acting like he isn't going to get stronger in an NFL weight training program. That's just stupid. Every year the weakness for many top NFL LBs are that they aren't strong enough & can't disengage from blockers.

The tape you are watching is of a guy who played between 222-228. Floyd is now 248 pounds. It isn't fat that he gained. It's muscle. I'm sure he is much stronger now then what he was in college.


Please stop assuming that a 23 year old is going to be able to maintain a weight 25 lbs higher than he ever played at just because he was able to add the weight for the combine.
Consensus  
BSIMatt : 4/24/2016 11:00 am : link
is that he played at around 230 during the season, which may be true..just wondering where this was reported.
I think Chopperhatch  
prdave73 : 4/24/2016 1:41 pm : link
pretty much nail it. enough said.
The idea that he is a low risk  
chopperhatch : 4/24/2016 2:02 pm : link
Pick is fucking laughable. The player to whom he is most closely linked, turned out to be a bum. His body frame is extremely slight. He does not play like a traditional linebacker.

Kwall, taking a player at 10 with all of those question marks is a monumental risk. He is just as much of a risk at 10 as Nkemdiche.
chopperhatch  
AP in Halfmoon : 4/24/2016 6:29 pm : link
how is it a competitive for other GMs to know who Reese is picking? I'm trying to think of a real world scenario where it would benefit a GM if Reese announced tomorrow he was picking Floyd.
It's fucking laughabke  
KWALL2 : 4/24/2016 6:43 pm : link
That you find it fucking laughable.

What is also fucking laughabke is your take on a 23 year old gaining weight and the Will/Sam stuff.
NM  
BSIMatt : 4/24/2016 8:27 pm : link
Quote:
The player to whom he is most closely linked, turned out to be a bum


Floyd is not "closely linked" to any prior players, that's all in your head. Giant fans that don't like Floyd will "closely link" him to recent busts, but it has no bearing on whether Floyd will succeed or fail in the NFL, none whatsoever. Posters that don't like him will continue to compare him to bums, posters that do like him will compare him to successful NFL players.
RE: chopperhatch  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/24/2016 11:50 pm : link
In comment 12918792 AP in Halfmoon said:
Quote:
how is it a competitive for other GMs to know who Reese is picking? I'm trying to think of a real world scenario where it would benefit a GM if Reese announced tomorrow he was picking Floyd.


Well, we do have two historical examples of the world knowing players the Giants openly coveted: the shockey draft, and the Eli draft.
Smoke Screens  
Hot Rod in Florida : 4/25/2016 8:47 am : link
The Giants may covet a LB, but maybe they like Darron Lee a lot more than they are showing. He's faster and a better cover guy than Floyd. Every team values pass rushers, and Floyd is listed as the second best pass rusher. If you're the Giants, why not leak information out that would seem to make sense and let some team move up to take Floyd, so they are more likely to get the guy they want? It really makes no sense to purposely leak information to the press that you are dead set on one or two guys (Floyd and Hargreaves) unless you are really interested in someone else. Perhaps it is Lee or perhaps they are hoping someone else like Elliott or Jack miraculously fall to them.
Is Floyd Strong side or weak side?  
Giants2012 : 4/25/2016 8:50 am : link
If he's rushing the QB the he's likely weak side yet if you want him to cover the TE he's strong side.
RE: Is Floyd Strong side or weak side?  
Klaatu : 4/25/2016 8:53 am : link
In comment 12919335 Giants2012 said:
Quote:
If he's rushing the QB the he's likely weak side yet if you want him to cover the TE he's strong side.


He's going to do both. He's that good.
RE: RE: Is Floyd Strong side or weak side?  
Giants2012 : 4/25/2016 8:55 am : link
In comment 12919339 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 12919335 Giants2012 said:


Quote:


If he's rushing the QB the he's likely weak side yet if you want him to cover the TE he's strong side.



He's going to do both. He's that good.


Remember though, that means the other, Kennard, has to learn two positions too. Ikd
RE: The idea that he is a low risk  
Randy in CT : 4/25/2016 9:40 am : link
In comment 12918498 chopperhatch said:
Quote:
Pick is fucking laughable. The player to whom he is most closely linked, turned out to be a bum. His body frame is extremely slight. He does not play like a traditional linebacker.

Kwall, taking a player at 10 with all of those question marks is a monumental risk. He is just as much of a risk at 10 as Nkemdiche.
. Personally, if he passed a Giants' interview, I'd take Nkemdiche all damned day long over Floyd.
RE: RE: chopperhatch  
AP in Halfmoon : 4/25/2016 10:21 am : link
In comment 12919143 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 12918792 AP in Halfmoon said:


Quote:


how is it a competitive for other GMs to know who Reese is picking? I'm trying to think of a real world scenario where it would benefit a GM if Reese announced tomorrow he was picking Floyd.



Well, we do have two historical examples of the world knowing players the Giants openly coveted: the shockey draft, and the Eli draft.


And what changed?
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