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Georgia's Floyd is the defensive player the Giants crave, and they're just hoping the 49ers, Browns or Bucs don't snake him away before they can snag him. If they did, they likely could console themselves with Florida cornerback Vernon Hargreaves (whom they'd have to consider taking anyway if he and Floyd were both there). But they've spent a good amount of time imagining Floyd all over their blitz packages, and they'd like to pick him. |
Why?
Why?
They get Clint Sintim flashbacks.
If Floyd is there I think we are taking him over a tradedown or anything else.
The knock on Floyd is lack of physicality.
But he's a freak of an athlete. I can't recall a player built like him who moves like him.
Why?
In today's NFL thats extremely valuable if utilized correctly .
The knock on Floyd is lack of physicality.
But he's a freak of an athlete. I can't recall a player built like him who moves like him.
I'm with you. He has incredible range, the ability to blanket RBs and TEs, and is possibly the best pure pass rusher in the draft.
I'd be more excited if he was turning 21 instead of 24, but that doesn't seem to bother JR at all.
Are you serious? This draft is severely lacking in pass rushers. Please provide names if you are gonna make a statement like that.
Why?
Because he tackles like a weak CB. Lacks physicality. Too much of a tweener in Spags system.
He definitely has athleticism but so do the NFL players he'd be facing on Sunday's.
sounds like a nickel LB, but is he worth anything vs. the run in the NFL?
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For all the Floyd detractors, and I am very much one of them, is for someone else to get duped into drafting Floyd. I'm of the belief that our 2 of our first 3 picks should include an OL and a WR. This is a deep defensive draft in the front 7. If JR is a good GM, he should be able to get an edge rusher in the 2nd or 3rd round. I don't think you can say that for OL, at least not at OT.
Are you serious? This draft is severely lacking in pass rushers. Please provide names if you are gonna make a statement like that.
There will an opportunity at 40 to get an edge rusher, be it at LB or DE. Check out any draft site's value board and see what should be there after #30. That being said, I think it's a moot point as Reese is gonna draft Floyd, unfortunately
We can only hope. This "Floyd to the NYG" stuff is almost at the level of Accorsi's infatuation with Jeremy Shockey.
Not physical-enough at point of attack to hold up in NFL.
The same happened with Flowers last year; he was a "reach", and not many felt he was a real target until just before the draft.
From the outside it looks like Floyd and Treadwell to me.
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People on this site don't seem to like him. I've seen him mocked as high as 5
Why?
They get Clint Sintim flashbacks.
and a 6'6 string bean version of him too.
Even if Myles is all that they say I still question whether the LB adverse GMen would take him. Safest bet is one of those DL or OL guys.
Don't need a runner in the 1st round like ron Dayne or Wilson.Find them late.
Last time Giants took a DT in the !st round was in the 80's. @nd round is usually when they draft DT
No DE worth taking at 10 will fall to the GMen unless one thinks Lawson is their guy which hopefully he's not
The tools here are obvious. You can make the argument that Floyd has a rare combination of skills and tools. I don’t think he is simply an edge rusher at all. As a matter off fact I think he would be best off in a 4-3 SAM role. This can flip his hips and cover with the best TEs in the game right now. For teams looking for a LB that can match up with the big, athletic pass catchers, Floyd can be there man. Throw in what he is capable of doing off the edge as a blitzer and you can understand why a lot of teams have top 15 grades on him.
Floyd has been getting a TON of attention over the past few months. He wasn’t exactly a stand out producer in college but the potential here is through the roof if he can bulk up a bit and increase his power presence. I still think Floyd will be the NYG pick at #10 overall. They’ve tried filling the hybrid LB/DE role multiple times over the years and it hasn’t worked yet. Floyd has more talent than all of them.
sjnyfan : 3/22/2016 3:09 pm : link
In fact it should be a flat out no. He's not a 4-3 player, not on the line or at LB. This isn't Von Miller or Anthony Barr. He's a 3-4 rush LB with height and straight line speed. He won't hold up against the run at his weight against NFL lineman and he doesn't have the quickness to cover. His ability to bend around the edge is overrated to me. He had 4.5 sacks last year with 1 in his last 5 games. Nearly half (5 out of 10.5) of his TFL's came against La.-Monroe, Southern U and Georgia Southern. He reminds me way too much of Barkevious Mingo who went 6th in the draft in '13 and has a total of 7 sacks in the 3 seasons.
Not to mention he hasn't lifted yet
On the other hand most recently Dion Jordan was almost a doppelganger from both an athletic/production standpoint and he's been a total bust. Is production the ultimate telltale sign of whether a guy pans out or busts? Probably not but it's a very fair criticism of Leonard Floyd's overall resume (and likely why people like Mayock are having a hard time evaluating him despite seeing the obvious upside). Last year 2 players were very similar to Floyd athletically and they went in the 2nd and 3rd round respectively - Eli Harold and Danielle Hunter (who actually looked like a stud last year). I'd love to add Floyd to this roster but picking him at #10 seems very risky.
No Treadwell No Floyd no Hargreaves
The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.
It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.
If Floyd was a boxer he would be called s "slapper". He couldn't crack an egg on a sidewalk.
The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.
It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.
That's would go against all the patterns we've seen under Reese to date. The interest seems very real.
If Floyd was a boxer he would be called s "slapper". He couldn't crack an egg on a sidewalk.
The arm tackling may have been a result of dealing with nagging shoulder injuries.
Hargreaves is a football player and tough SOB. Floyd is a softy who looks good in shorts and drills.
Naturally this braintrust prefers the latter and then wonders why they keep having injuries and losing seasons.
In comment 12917204 Big Blue '56 said:
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The tools here are obvious. You can make the argument that Floyd has a rare combination of skills and tools. I don’t think he is simply an edge rusher at all. As a matter off fact I think he would be best off in a 4-3 SAM role. This can flip his hips and cover with the best TEs in the game right now. For teams looking for a LB that can match up with the big, athletic pass catchers, Floyd can be there man. Throw in what he is capable of doing off the edge as a blitzer and you can understand why a lot of teams have top 15 grades on him.
Floyd has been getting a TON of attention over the past few months. He wasn’t exactly a stand out producer in college but the potential here is through the roof if he can bulk up a bit and increase his power presence. I still think Floyd will be the NYG pick at #10 overall. They’ve tried filling the hybrid LB/DE role multiple times over the years and it hasn’t worked yet. Floyd has more talent than all of them.
The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.
It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.
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I tend to agree!
I think the Floyd talk has been a smoke screen as well as all of the chirping about Flowers as the permanent Left Tackle.
I think -- given the players "expected" to be available at 10, Reese will want to select Stanley or -- if he's not there -- Conklin.
I don't think you know the meaning of accurate
Has the requisite burst to surge past tackles as a speed rusher with underrated strength. He is surprisingly powerful at the point of attack, flashing dynamite in his hands with an effective hand slap to knock away blockers attempting to gain control.
His first-step burst and acceleration get him into the backfield quickly off the edge or knifing inside. Excellent movement skills for his tall, lengthy frame. Relentless nature and speed to collapse the pocket or chase down plays from behind. Because of his agility and closing speed, could move to a more traditional linebacker.
The two major knocks on Floyd are weight and durability. Has lean bone structure with twig limbs, thin torso and scouts have concerns about how much weight he can add - looks like A.J. Green in his Georgia uniform, which isn't a positive comparison for a pass rusher. Below-average functional strength.
Struggles to generate movement at the point of attack or convert speed to power. Too easily controlled on the edges. Can be eliminated by blockers when he doesn't effectively use his length. Compares to Barkevious Mingo, Cleveland Browns.
Please stop comparing him to Mingo, Dion Jordan & Manny Lawson. They aren't similar at all.
If anything his NFL comparison would be a Jamie Collins.
The tape you are watching is of a guy who played between 222-228. Floyd is now 248 pounds. It isn't fat that he gained. It's muscle. I'm sure he is much stronger now then what he was in college.
Floyd is a hard worker who really likes football. HUGE difference between the prospects.
Jordan failure as an NFL prospect should have no impact on how you view Floyd.
Floyd is a low risk pick. The pass rush skills are legit. It will work in the NFL and it will add instant value to any team.
KWALL - you know who I see in Floyd -- I see an upgraded Osi Umenyiora - more intelligent, more agile, and speedier
Then...you can also move him around. Stand up outside next to JPP or Vernon. Stunts inside. Blitz from all over and get to the QB much faster than Moore in this role.
I just don't see any risk with the player. At worst, he'll help you a lot with the pass rush. And you may have something special as a 3 down versatile player that you move all over.
Another thing is the help he will bring vs mobile QBs. He will prevent big plays from these QBs and prevent the extended plays that have killed us.
He's not a huge hitter but I think this stuff about not being able to tackle are overblown.
Same allies to Floyd. The Giants know how to use players. How often does a guy leave the Giants and do better elsewhere? It nearly never happens and even a guy like Bennett didn't really improve at all.
If Floyd can play at the next he can play and the Giants will use him wisely. This is not a place where gifted pass rushers and defenders go to die. This is where they flourish.
Explain how he's one dimensional. Every draft profile talks about his versatility and his ability to bring pass rush and provide coverage against TE's and RB's.
I've heard some names but I am going to reach out to my source one more time on Tuesday to see what the story is and report back what I heard.
One of the things that I did hear through the grapevine is that other GM's started paying attention to which pro days Reese personally attended and that was a competitive advantage for them so this year the Floyd thing could be a big smokescreen.
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specifically Raanan and Graziano that I'm starting to wonder if the Giants are setting a smokescreen and they really want to go in a different direction.
We can only hope. This "Floyd to the NYG" stuff is almost at the level of Accorsi's infatuation with Jeremy Shockey.
Could be. I have said before that I am OK with Floyd because of his speed off the edge, and ability to cover. But I think we can do better. He won’t do well against the run, even in the open field. His age means that his frame may well be maxed out. So get bigger and stronger may not be possible for him, at least not without sacrificing his freakish athletic ability.
Please stop comparing him to Mingo, Dion Jordan & Manny Lawson. They aren't similar at all.
If anything his NFL comparison would be a Jamie Collins.
Big Rick I respect your analysis more than most here but I couldn't disagree more. Collins was a 210 lb freshman DB that grew into a LB. He outweighed Floyd at his combine and he's 2" shorter. He has way more explosion than Floyd which was evident when he broke the combine record for broad jump and he's stronger at the point of attack. And yet he still went at the end of the 2nd rd.
We're talking about Floyd at #10 and he has no consistency on tape that proves it. There are analysts that give Kevin Dodd, who will also be 24 at the start of the season a 2nd rd grade. They say his 5 TFL performance against Alabama was overrated because he did it against their weak link at RT. Leonard Floyd went up against the same guy and had zero. In fact he had less total tackles (2 solo, 2 assisted) than Dodd's TFLs and those were chase tackles if I recall. I'll argue with anyone here to look at both Floyd and Dodd against Alabama and still come back to me and say Floyd is the better player. But that's the guy we take at 10 and Dodd possibly reaches 40? A guy who nearly matched Floyd's career production in one season, weighs 40 pounds more and almost as quick at the snap? I am blown away at this love affair with a guy that didn't produce. You show me one positive play by Floyd and I can point to ten negative ones. That's not a player you take at 10 overall.
If you want a wiry, tall edge rusher go with Alex McCallister from Florida. Nearly the same dimensions in height and weight but he was more productive in the same conference. McCallister had more sacks and one less TFL and did so in 4 less games than Floyd. We can get him on Day 3. Admittedly part of that was character concerns but he was never rated as high as Floyd. He never had the same TV analyst love.
The year we took David Wilson, I believe he did not meet with any of the brass once. He had no idea we were going to take him.
I know. You would think that. But they have completely telegraphed first round picks in the past. So, I think it is Floyd
The same happened with Flowers last year; he was a "reach", and not many felt he was a real target until just before the draft.
From the outside it looks like Floyd and Treadwell to me.
Tread well in a trade up like they did with Collins. I could see that. But I don't think Treadwell is the pick at 10
Jordan is a knucklehead.
If we go the Floyd route JR better be right or he's going to be fired.
I'd take a player with maybe a little lower 'ceiling' that I was more comfortable with in terms of getting a fair return on investing the the #10 pick.
I've heard some names but I am going to reach out to my source one more time on Tuesday to see what the story is and report back what I heard.
One of the things that I did hear through the grapevine is that other GM's started paying attention to which pro days Reese personally attended and that was a competitive advantage for them so this year the Floyd thing could be a big smokescreen.
Or maybe they are trying to make Floyd like a smokescreen?
This.
The idea that Floyd is a plus pass-rusher is conjecture, and the people saying it the most seem to be the crowd that are determined to give two thumbs up to every move the organization makes. (Note that they've gotten louder as it has become more and more obvious that the Giants are likely to take Floyd).
Floyd has the POTENTIAL to be an effective pass rusher based on his speed, agility, jump. Without a significant increase in strength and ability to win contact, he's just as likely to be 10 yards deep in the backfield every time. Hence why many view him as too risky for #10.
Not exactly a ringing endorsement for a 1st round pick here, Klaatu. If the Giants do pick him, they better have a plan...
Just stop it.
I'm hoping smoke, but the Giants don't really do smoke.
I'm also hoping it isn't as easy as just easy as mapping it to the one guy's pro day Reese shows up for.
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the Giants rumors that have slipped out that they are enamored with Floyd is a complete smoke screen and nothing more. He's a high risk player that could be great or could be nothing more than an athletic phenomenon who can't play at the NFL level. The Giants rarely roll the dice on risk/reward player early in the draft. And of course, Reese is in the hot seat and I doubt he is willing to bet his career and future on a coin flip.
The Giants have made it so clear of they're interest in him that it doesn't make sense. They always hold their cards close to their chest more than any other team so I think the attention is strictly a diversion tactic to throw other teams off their real trail. The fact that thousands of fans suddenly mock Floyd to them is to their benefit and the subterfuge is working as planned.
It's a little too obvious and the Giants don't do obvious when it comes to drafting. They hold secrets better than the CIA and the KGB combined when it comes to the draft.
That's would go against all the patterns we've seen under Reese to date. The interest seems very real.
People like Graziano are good at taking the bait!
Other than Giant news, don't take his 'knowledge' that seriously to be honest. I also don't think he follows college ball that closely, just an educated guess.
Production isn't about sacks. He consistently pressured the QB. That's production.
Read it again.
And again.
Or maybe some have watched him.
Or maybe that % of QB hits, pressure and sacks to pass rush attempts that ranks him very high has something to do with that crazy idea.
Not just the Physicality but I watched an Interview
Not sure what study course he could have passed .
If he holds (physically) up then he will be a a Wild Card
that teams will have to Plan 4
With a Healthy JPP Snacks Big Hank and Vernon
a Healthy Kennard .
Pass Rush make go from worst to first .
The Recent Cruz News has got me amped ..
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The idea that Floyd is a plus pass-rusher is conjecture
Or maybe some have watched him.
Or maybe that % of QB hits, pressure and sacks to pass rush attempts that ranks him very high has something to do with that crazy idea.
That is based on people who actually graded all his games. When he was asked to rush the passer, he was effective in doing so.
A great as LT was.. he is on record as saying that he could not have done the job he was allowed to do as a LB without Carl Banks on the other side.. Banks never had gaudy numbers and will NEVER make it to the Hall of Fame.. however he was extremely valuable and important to that defensive scheme..
So try and stop looking at what the individual players do alone and try to envision how that player will fit into the scheme and THEN try to envision how he will interact with the other players on the defense..
And then try to envision the various schemes that can be employed and then HOW that player can be utilized..
When we people just accept the fact that the Giants reach decisions by consensus and its not just a REESE pick.. Even after seeing an entire 4 part series giving you direct insight into HOW the Giants draft team works.. people STILL hold onto this with a death grip.
The other thing...regarding his coverage. He has zero ball skills and zero awareness for when it's in the air. That's a problem when covering NFL TEs like Witten, Ertz and Reed. He will be right behind them, but they will get their first downs. They will probably shrug off their arm tackles.
People sluff off his lack of physicality, but in the NFL, their are some mean bastards looking to run through a LB and out the back. Their are Guards who will drive block Floyd like he's a cello, and drop him to the turf or block him thru the water table on the sideline. NFL teams can scheme toward a man like this.
Finally, he is not even that great a blitzer. He didn't have Von Miller numbers in college. They weren't horrible, but for the "best pass rusher in the draft", he certainly didn't do much. People keep bringing up his coaches scheme being bad having him at LB. What coach in their right mind would have their best pass rusher playing in a non pass rushing role? Makes no sense to me. I get the feeling they felt like he would break down going up against tackles all game. Also, what else can you teach a 23 y/o pass rusher?
That's why people, like myself, don't like him. I would rather Kevin Dodd at 10. I would rather we finish the line at 10 with a pick like Jack " I just wanna put my fist elbow deep up your butt Conklin". Hargreaves also makes me nervous because of his size, but I like him too. Floyd, I feel like people want us to have a Von Miller, Khalil Mack or a Clay Matthews. Those guys play a violent game. Floyd doesn't. Those guys are linebackers. Floyd is a small forward.
I've heard some names but I am going to reach out to my source one more time on Tuesday to see what the story is and report back what I heard.
One of the things that I did hear through the grapevine is that other GM's started paying attention to which pro days Reese personally attended and that was a competitive advantage for them so this year the Floyd thing could be a big smokescreen.
TLG, thanks. The whole pro day thing is fishy to me. Weren't we a slam dunk for Zack Martin two years ago? There have been others in the past where all our signs pointed to X and we chose Y?
The tape you are watching is of a guy who played between 222-228. Floyd is now 248 pounds. It isn't fat that he gained. It's muscle. I'm sure he is much stronger now then what he was in college.
Please stop assuming that a 23 year old is going to be able to maintain a weight 25 lbs higher than he ever played at just because he was able to add the weight for the combine.
Kwall, taking a player at 10 with all of those question marks is a monumental risk. He is just as much of a risk at 10 as Nkemdiche.
What is also fucking laughabke is your take on a 23 year old gaining weight and the Will/Sam stuff.
Floyd is not "closely linked" to any prior players, that's all in your head. Giant fans that don't like Floyd will "closely link" him to recent busts, but it has no bearing on whether Floyd will succeed or fail in the NFL, none whatsoever. Posters that don't like him will continue to compare him to bums, posters that do like him will compare him to successful NFL players.
Well, we do have two historical examples of the world knowing players the Giants openly coveted: the shockey draft, and the Eli draft.
He's going to do both. He's that good.
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If he's rushing the QB the he's likely weak side yet if you want him to cover the TE he's strong side.
He's going to do both. He's that good.
Remember though, that means the other, Kennard, has to learn two positions too. Ikd
Kwall, taking a player at 10 with all of those question marks is a monumental risk. He is just as much of a risk at 10 as Nkemdiche.
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how is it a competitive for other GMs to know who Reese is picking? I'm trying to think of a real world scenario where it would benefit a GM if Reese announced tomorrow he was picking Floyd.
Well, we do have two historical examples of the world knowing players the Giants openly coveted: the shockey draft, and the Eli draft.
And what changed?