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NFT: Mets talk 4/28

ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 9:16 am
Mets off day today.

Harvey was back last night. MUCH BETTER.

Mets have won 6 in a row.

Cespedes expected back tomorrow against the Giants.

Mets one back of the Nats.
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RE: RE: It was reported our current rotation  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 11:25 am : link
In comment 12927092 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 12927072 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


is worth a BILLION dollars. With a B.



What in the world does the value of the Mets rotation have to do with keeping Neil Walker? Matz and Syndergaard won't even be FA until post-Neil Walker even likely being RETIRED let alone still making big money.


You are seriously the worst. lol. You seriously think keeping and replacing every single player we have(Granderson) wont impact our payroll by a significant amount over the next 5 years ?? (Walker 4 year deal assume) WOW.
I'm  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 11:26 am : link
done with this discussion. You have successfully bored me.
Been done.  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 11:29 am : link
The day we actually argue about anything intelligent will be its first. Always over nitpicky BS. Our overall are views are mostly aligned which is the sad part.
Wilmer  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 11:30 am : link
Flores is now 2-24. Sort of sucks he is out of options because he may prove to be a guy who needs consistent ab's to play well. He may be valuable if Wright goes down but he's been downright awful so far. Perfect example of being careful with options.
Fully  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 11:31 am : link
acknowledge 24 ab's is nothing but he's looked really out of sorts. Kind of sucks for him.
.  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 11:35 am : link
D.J. Short ‏@djshort 4m4 minutes ago
The Braves have a .579 OPS as a team so far this season. Cubs pitchers have a .591 OPS.
Repeating the obvious from the offseason  
Shecky : 4/28/2016 11:37 am : link
Walker was intended as a stop gap. Buys time for the team to see if Herrera will be ready next year vs forcing him in this year. Same with the SS convertible prospects to 2B.

Best case scenario is Herrera forces the issue, and Walker makes it a tough decision due to a great year (increasing odds of a draft pick as comp). Worst case scenario is Walker struggles in NY and Herrera isn't ready.

This was a move 100% about 2016 team. But with an eye equally on 2017 plus. Literally the perfect move. It's a very repeatable move, if necessary. Next year they will make a similar decision, all about 2017 but with an eye on these following year. "Payroll and roster flexibility". It's here...
Walker isnt a must resign  
Deej : 4/28/2016 11:38 am : link
TBH we have a ton of options at second. Herrera, Flores, any of the SS prospects. And 2Bs are gettable in trade unlike the premium positions.

I'll take the same position I took with Cespedes. You dont HAVE to resign Walker. I'll be furious if we dont resign him just because there isnt money. But that is seeming like less and less of a concern. If they just think money is better deployed elsewhere, I say cool. We will not be without talented options at 2B that dont require potentially ruinous commitments.
RE: .  
Jay on the Island : 4/28/2016 11:38 am : link
In comment 12927149 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
D.J. Short ‏@djshort 4m4 minutes ago
The Braves have a .579 OPS as a team so far this season. Cubs pitchers have a .591 OPS.

Yeah they are pathetic. Help is on the way though Albies and Swanson are raking in the minors. Albies is hitting .351/.412/.494 in AA despite being the youngest player in the league by more than a full year.
RE: RE: .  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 11:42 am : link
In comment 12927158 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 12927149 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


D.J. Short ‏@djshort 4m4 minutes ago
The Braves have a .579 OPS as a team so far this season. Cubs pitchers have a .591 OPS.


Yeah they are pathetic. Help is on the way though Albies and Swanson are raking in the minors. Albies is hitting .351/.412/.494 in AA despite being the youngest player in the league by more than a full year.


People are comparing it to the Sixers but I disagree. Baseball allows you to load up on a bunch of "lottery tickets" at the same time and with no salary cap you can buy yourself players pretty easily. The Braves over the next 5 years scare me more than the Marlins or Nats to be honest with you (obviously for today the Nats are my biggest concern).
RE: Repeating the obvious from the offseason  
arcarsenal : 4/28/2016 11:43 am : link
In comment 12927151 Shecky said:
Quote:
Walker was intended as a stop gap. Buys time for the team to see if Herrera will be ready next year vs forcing him in this year. Same with the SS convertible prospects to 2B.

Best case scenario is Herrera forces the issue, and Walker makes it a tough decision due to a great year (increasing odds of a draft pick as comp). Worst case scenario is Walker struggles in NY and Herrera isn't ready.

This was a move 100% about 2016 team. But with an eye equally on 2017 plus. Literally the perfect move. It's a very repeatable move, if necessary. Next year they will make a similar decision, all about 2017 but with an eye on these following year. "Payroll and roster flexibility". It's here...


So what about the scenario where Walker thrives and has a really good year here and Dilson doesn't quite progress as hoped?
RE: Walker isnt a must resign  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 11:44 am : link
In comment 12927156 Deej said:
Quote:
TBH we have a ton of options at second. Herrera, Flores, any of the SS prospects. And 2Bs are gettable in trade unlike the premium positions.

I'll take the same position I took with Cespedes. You dont HAVE to resign Walker. I'll be furious if we dont resign him just because there isnt money. But that is seeming like less and less of a concern. If they just think money is better deployed elsewhere, I say cool. We will not be without talented options at 2B that dont require potentially ruinous commitments.


Couldn't have said it better.
Arc  
Shecky : 4/28/2016 11:45 am : link
You mean like how it looks today? Lol
Then the front office pats itself on the back for saving the 2016 with the Walker trade.
RE: RE: Repeating the obvious from the offseason  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 11:46 am : link
In comment 12927179 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 12927151 Shecky said:


Quote:


Walker was intended as a stop gap. Buys time for the team to see if Herrera will be ready next year vs forcing him in this year. Same with the SS convertible prospects to 2B.

Best case scenario is Herrera forces the issue, and Walker makes it a tough decision due to a great year (increasing odds of a draft pick as comp). Worst case scenario is Walker struggles in NY and Herrera isn't ready.

This was a move 100% about 2016 team. But with an eye equally on 2017 plus. Literally the perfect move. It's a very repeatable move, if necessary. Next year they will make a similar decision, all about 2017 but with an eye on these following year. "Payroll and roster flexibility". It's here...



So what about the scenario where Walker thrives and has a really good year here and Dilson doesn't quite progress as hoped?


What does Herrera have to do though to show he's ready is my beef. It will never be enough. He's already owned AA, then owned AAA (sore shoulder slow couple weeks this year notwithstanding) and it wasn't enough. He already held his own at the major league level and it wasn't enough. If he hits .500 in AAA with 99 HR is that enough?? People will still just say isn't "proven". Its the same thing every year.
RE: RE: RE: .  
Jay on the Island : 4/28/2016 11:48 am : link
In comment 12927175 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 12927158 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


In comment 12927149 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


D.J. Short ‏@djshort 4m4 minutes ago
The Braves have a .579 OPS as a team so far this season. Cubs pitchers have a .591 OPS.


Yeah they are pathetic. Help is on the way though Albies and Swanson are raking in the minors. Albies is hitting .351/.412/.494 in AA despite being the youngest player in the league by more than a full year.



People are comparing it to the Sixers but I disagree. Baseball allows you to load up on a bunch of "lottery tickets" at the same time and with no salary cap you can buy yourself players pretty easily. The Braves over the next 5 years scare me more than the Marlins or Nats to be honest with you (obviously for today the Nats are my biggest concern).

You are right I think the Braves are going to be the class on the NFC East in 3-4 years. I know that prospects don't always work out but the Braves are loaded with so many pitching prospects that even if only 40% of them work out they are set. Also they have the #3 overall pick in this years draft, likely the #1 overall pick in next years draft and are rumored to have a deal with the top IFA in years in Kevin Maitan. What they lack is power bats but their future infield looks incredible.
I agree with the move 100%  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 11:50 am : link
Considering Herrera was still very young and could have used a little more time in AAA and it increases your chances of success in 2016 with a proven stop-gap and you hope Herrera forces the issue. I am operating on the assumption that Herrera will have a very solid year in Vegas so then what?

Best move would be to recoup the pick.

OR if Wright is truly retiring (not sure about that) consider him as a #B option.
RE: Arc  
arcarsenal : 4/28/2016 11:53 am : link
In comment 12927192 Shecky said:
Quote:
You mean like how it looks today? Lol
Then the front office pats itself on the back for saving the 2016 with the Walker trade.


LOL, yes. I mean.. if things continue to go this way, how do they approach it down the road? Do they say "well, we have a known quality here and he helps keep our window open, let's make a push to extend him" ? ... do they look for another established player (I don't know who will be available or who they could acquire.. haven't looked at all) to be another stop gap or do they just put Herrera out there and hope for the best?
RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
dep026 : 4/28/2016 11:55 am : link
In comment 12927201 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 12927175 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


In comment 12927158 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


In comment 12927149 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


D.J. Short ‏@djshort 4m4 minutes ago
The Braves have a .579 OPS as a team so far this season. Cubs pitchers have a .591 OPS.


Yeah they are pathetic. Help is on the way though Albies and Swanson are raking in the minors. Albies is hitting .351/.412/.494 in AA despite being the youngest player in the league by more than a full year.



People are comparing it to the Sixers but I disagree. Baseball allows you to load up on a bunch of "lottery tickets" at the same time and with no salary cap you can buy yourself players pretty easily. The Braves over the next 5 years scare me more than the Marlins or Nats to be honest with you (obviously for today the Nats are my biggest concern).


You are right I think the Braves are going to be the class on the NFC East in 3-4 years. I know that prospects don't always work out but the Braves are loaded with so many pitching prospects that even if only 40% of them work out they are set. Also they have the #3 overall pick in this years draft, likely the #1 overall pick in next years draft and are rumored to have a deal with the top IFA in years in Kevin Maitan. What they lack is power bats but their future infield looks incredible.


You are discounting what is going on in Philly....
RE: RE: RE: Repeating the obvious from the offseason  
arcarsenal : 4/28/2016 11:55 am : link
In comment 12927195 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
In comment 12927179 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


In comment 12927151 Shecky said:


Quote:


Walker was intended as a stop gap. Buys time for the team to see if Herrera will be ready next year vs forcing him in this year. Same with the SS convertible prospects to 2B.

Best case scenario is Herrera forces the issue, and Walker makes it a tough decision due to a great year (increasing odds of a draft pick as comp). Worst case scenario is Walker struggles in NY and Herrera isn't ready.

This was a move 100% about 2016 team. But with an eye equally on 2017 plus. Literally the perfect move. It's a very repeatable move, if necessary. Next year they will make a similar decision, all about 2017 but with an eye on these following year. "Payroll and roster flexibility". It's here...



So what about the scenario where Walker thrives and has a really good year here and Dilson doesn't quite progress as hoped?



What does Herrera have to do though to show he's ready is my beef. It will never be enough. He's already owned AA, then owned AAA (sore shoulder slow couple weeks this year notwithstanding) and it wasn't enough. He already held his own at the major league level and it wasn't enough. If he hits .500 in AAA with 99 HR is that enough?? People will still just say isn't "proven". Its the same thing every year.


I don't think that's true. If he posts a really solid year in Vegas and looks like there's nothing left for him to do there, that's fine. He's struggled a bit out of the gates though.. it's not like it's a forgone conclusion he's going to wind up having a great year. He could.. but who knows. What if he doesn't?
If Herrera is "ready"  
Shecky : 4/28/2016 11:55 am : link
It's not the stats, but you just have to trust the front office with knowing when someone is ready or not. Past few years, who has been called up prematurely? Yet how many fan favorites haven't been called up? (Smoker, Alvarez, etc) to fill a hole.

If he's ready, you pray you get a pick for Walker. But the rest of the roster will certainly have much less question marks on it (Wrgiht, TDA, Legares, Duda).
RE: RE: Arc  
Shecky : 4/28/2016 11:59 am : link
In comment 12927223 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 12927192 Shecky said:


Quote:


You mean like how it looks today? Lol
Then the front office pats itself on the back for saving the 2016 with the Walker trade.



LOL, yes. I mean.. if things continue to go this way, how do they approach it down the road? Do they say "well, we have a known quality here and he helps keep our window open, let's make a push to extend him" ? ... do they look for another established player (I don't know who will be available or who they could acquire.. haven't looked at all) to be another stop gap or do they just put Herrera out there and hope for the best?


Missed this but part of my previous post would answer it. If Herrera is starting, they have a very good plan B in place (vet, positional flexibility, other ready prospect etc) they also will have less uncertainty on the roster if he is starting, softening the blow if he isn't ready and his success is less vital.

In a perfect world it works. And your future is brighter. More payroll, and adding another top prospect with a pick. Not hurting the current while pumping up the window.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Repeating the obvious from the offseason  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 11:59 am : link
In comment 12927229 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 12927195 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


In comment 12927179 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


In comment 12927151 Shecky said:


Quote:


Walker was intended as a stop gap. Buys time for the team to see if Herrera will be ready next year vs forcing him in this year. Same with the SS convertible prospects to 2B.

Best case scenario is Herrera forces the issue, and Walker makes it a tough decision due to a great year (increasing odds of a draft pick as comp). Worst case scenario is Walker struggles in NY and Herrera isn't ready.

This was a move 100% about 2016 team. But with an eye equally on 2017 plus. Literally the perfect move. It's a very repeatable move, if necessary. Next year they will make a similar decision, all about 2017 but with an eye on these following year. "Payroll and roster flexibility". It's here...



So what about the scenario where Walker thrives and has a really good year here and Dilson doesn't quite progress as hoped?



What does Herrera have to do though to show he's ready is my beef. It will never be enough. He's already owned AA, then owned AAA (sore shoulder slow couple weeks this year notwithstanding) and it wasn't enough. He already held his own at the major league level and it wasn't enough. If he hits .500 in AAA with 99 HR is that enough?? People will still just say isn't "proven". Its the same thing every year.



I don't think that's true. If he posts a really solid year in Vegas and looks like there's nothing left for him to do there, that's fine. He's struggled a bit out of the gates though.. it's not like it's a forgone conclusion he's going to wind up having a great year. He could.. but who knows. What if he doesn't?


Ok well that's a completely different argument. Herrera has owned every level for years now and put up video games numbers in the minors. I didn't know people were alarmed and upset over Herrera's cold first two weeks to the season. If they think that's what Herrera will do all year? Then I totally get needing or wanting to sign Walker. I just didn't even know that thought existed. I assume Herrera will go right back to mashing in Vegas any day now.
Ces was mentioned earlier  
Shecky : 4/28/2016 12:01 pm : link
I hope we all assume he is as good as gone next year?
And Shecky  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 12:01 pm : link
that's literally exactly what I was trying to say. Thank you.
RE: Ces was mentioned earlier  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 12:04 pm : link
In comment 12927260 Shecky said:
Quote:
I hope we all assume he is as good as gone next year?


He's opting out. I know that. Today the Mets likely let him walk. I was envisioning a perfect world where things might change between now and then (like last year) and Cespedes has a huge year, plays CF better than expected possibly, carries the Mets to the postseason, he's wants to come back to the Mets(at a cost of course) and there might be another possible reunion. I know that likely isn't the view now but I could see things changing.
.  
arcarsenal : 4/28/2016 12:07 pm : link
I'd love to see Herrera excel and be the answer, it would give us more flexibility and be best case scenario. I agree with you guys there.

I would just hope that we'd be willing to take another route if there was doubt within the org. that he was the answer going forward.
Yeah if they truly doubt Herrera  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 12:10 pm : link
that's a game changer. All I've heard is that they are extremely high on him though.

Also I like Walker a lot. Really happy we have him. I just view it as every season will have its story. Last year it was Murphy. Hopefully this year Walker is a big part of this group. Next year who knows. Its all good though. The Mets have done nothing but make the correct decisions in regards to just about everything.
Anyone think that we would be in a position to trade Grandy  
Deej : 4/28/2016 12:28 pm : link
in the offseason, to make room for Ces as a RF (notwithstanding his thoughts about that position)? Grandy will be owed 15 million for his final season. Not a bad bet for a team that needs a hitter and doesnt want to delve into the ultra expensive UFA market.
RE: Anyone think that we would be in a position to trade Grandy  
Jay on the Island : 4/28/2016 12:47 pm : link
In comment 12927371 Deej said:
Quote:
in the offseason, to make room for Ces as a RF (notwithstanding his thoughts about that position)? Grandy will be owed 15 million for his final season. Not a bad bet for a team that needs a hitter and doesnt want to delve into the ultra expensive UFA market.

I don't think it will be worth it. I doubt they would get fair value for a 36 year old OF. Also if Cespedes and Walker leave via free agency the Mets will need to hope that Granderson doesn't fall apart next season too which at his age is somewhat likely.
King  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 12:50 pm : link
Wally has Nimmo, Cecchini, Herrera, Reynolds, TJ Rivera Montero, Goeddel, Gilmartin, Lugo. Sewald, Smoker, Ynoa etc... and an 8-10 last place club in LV
RE: RE: Anyone think that we would be in a position to trade Grandy  
Deej : 4/28/2016 1:11 pm : link
In comment 12927459 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 12927371 Deej said:


Quote:


in the offseason, to make room for Ces as a RF (notwithstanding his thoughts about that position)? Grandy will be owed 15 million for his final season. Not a bad bet for a team that needs a hitter and doesnt want to delve into the ultra expensive UFA market.


I don't think it will be worth it. I doubt they would get fair value for a 36 year old OF. Also if Cespedes and Walker leave via free agency the Mets will need to hope that Granderson doesn't fall apart next season too which at his age is somewhat likely.


Well the point of a Grandy trade is to open a corner OF slot to resign Ces. You dont trade Grandy without Ces signing on. And I dont know that they'd sign both and risk sitting one or playing one in CF next year.
I just think assuming we actually could or would want  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 1:22 pm : link
to sign Cespedes next year you just let Granderson's contract play out. If The Mets really want Cespedes I assume he played 2016 at a very high level and handled himself decently in CF. Just keep it the same for one more year and say farewell to Grandy at the end of his contract. Then in a year move Cespedes or Conforto to RF. Keep in mind Cespedes will be 32 then. Conforto might actually be the better option in RF. Who knows. Then I guess work on a CF upgrade.
Mets BP has been really good, like #1 fwar good  
sshin05 : 4/28/2016 2:25 pm : link
Brian P. Mangan @brianpmangan

Hansel: 13.50 K/9, 1.80 ERA

Bastardo: 14.46 K/9, 2.89 ERA

Reed: 11.25 K/9, 2.25 ERA

Hendo: 14.09 K/9, 1.17 ERA

Brian P. Mangan @brianpmangan
Highest FIP is Bastardo at 2.25, lowest FIP is Robles at 1.01 (!!)

The lowest swinging strike rate is 14.1% (league average RP is 13.0%).
RE: Mets BP has been really good, like #1 fwar good  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 2:31 pm : link
In comment 12927731 sshin05 said:
Quote:
Brian P. Mangan @brianpmangan

Hansel: 13.50 K/9, 1.80 ERA

Bastardo: 14.46 K/9, 2.89 ERA

Reed: 11.25 K/9, 2.25 ERA

Hendo: 14.09 K/9, 1.17 ERA

Brian P. Mangan @brianpmangan
Highest FIP is Bastardo at 2.25, lowest FIP is Robles at 1.01 (!!)

The lowest swinging strike rate is 14.1% (league average RP is 13.0%).


Unless I'm missing something, Familia actually has the highest FIP (2.57)
RE: Mets BP has been really good, like #1 fwar good  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 3:02 pm : link
In comment 12927731 sshin05 said:
Quote:
Brian P. Mangan @brianpmangan

Hansel: 13.50 K/9, 1.80 ERA

Bastardo: 14.46 K/9, 2.89 ERA

Reed: 11.25 K/9, 2.25 ERA

Hendo: 14.09 K/9, 1.17 ERA

Brian P. Mangan @brianpmangan
Highest FIP is Bastardo at 2.25, lowest FIP is Robles at 1.01 (!!)

The lowest swinging strike rate is 14.1% (league average RP is 13.0%).


Been saying it for weeks. Those peripherals are through the roof. Outstanding.
And now the love..  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 3:53 pm : link
.
Link - ( New Window )
yo  
sshin05 : 4/28/2016 4:00 pm : link
Michael Mayer 8m
Yoenis Cespedes since being traded to the Mets last July: .290/.345/.621 with 23 home runs and 61 RBI over 316 PA's
Nats had some help  
sshin05 : 4/28/2016 4:05 pm : link
mets coming up on them
Link - ( New Window )
RE: Nats had some help  
PhiPsi125 : 4/28/2016 4:22 pm : link
In comment 12928138 sshin05 said:
Quote:
mets coming up on them Link - ( New Window )


PREACH!!!
On the flipside  
sshin05 : 4/28/2016 4:23 pm : link
the Mets schedule wasnt that much harder.

Also the Yanks are in trouble and the brave are bound to get better.
Carlos Gomez since the  
ZGiants98 : 4/28/2016 4:34 pm : link
Trade.227/.268/.338

Awful. So glad we didn't trade for that loser.
...  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 4:36 pm : link
Rich Hill is the best story since @RADickey43. 36 years old, last 120 innings pitched 79 hits 155 k's OOF, BEAST

Seriously, other than Dickey I can't recall a guy at this age turning into such an animal.
dickey  
sshin05 : 4/28/2016 4:38 pm : link
having another poor start to the season
Drop dickey from rotation? - ( New Window )
RE: dickey  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 4:41 pm : link
In comment 12928251 sshin05 said:
Quote:
having another poor start to the season Drop dickey from rotation? - ( New Window )


I'd actually love to see Dickey in our bullpen. I feel like he'd be absolutely nuts coming in after Thor + a nice bow at the end of the Thor/TDA deal.
RE: Carlos Gomez since the  
Shecky : 4/28/2016 4:45 pm : link
In comment 12928231 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Trade.227/.268/.338

Awful. So glad we didn't trade for that loser.


It's official. Mets franchise has turned it around :)
Instead of the breaks going against them, they finally seem to be getting some. Acquiring Gomez and then him tanking is such a "Met thing to do" until now.
Imagine  
DanMetroMan : 4/28/2016 4:46 pm : link
Thor to Dickey to Familia? Hitters wouldn't be very happy lol
ahem  
dep026 : 4/28/2016 7:41 pm : link
....
RE: ...  
jpkmets : 4/28/2016 7:44 pm : link
In comment 12928241 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Rich Hill is the best story since @RADickey43. 36 years old, last 120 innings pitched 79 hits 155 k's OOF, BEAST

Seriously, other than Dickey I can't recall a guy at this age turning into such an animal.


My favorite ODOAT (old dude on another team) is Ross Ohlendorf. His Satchel Paige windup is the greatest thing I've seen in ever.
Nats lose again  
jpkmets : 4/28/2016 7:49 pm : link
love those Phils, Dep!

even in the loss column now.
Wow, Nats swept by the Phillies  
PhiPsi125 : 4/28/2016 8:21 pm : link
Did not see that one coming. That's weird.
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